I would suggest you remove the brass plate and insert shim material either towards the blade or towards the base end. I have two Stanley’s like this, one 10 inch and one six once, and used shim stock for one and a snippet of soda can aluminum for the other. Worked perfectly without filing, peining, or other method which requires the removal of metal or wood. Also, make sure none of the screws in the brass plate protrude at all! Either tighten it down or dress it down with a file. Be sure and not remove the screw slot while filing if the screw protrudes too much!
Great info James, thank you. I wish I had known when I was first starting out that a square isn't necessarily square. It would have saved me a bunch of frustration!
Great info! Looked at squares in the store today and most didn't match up even coming from the same company and being a more expensive brand. Didn't know which was correct so left without getting one. Now I can get whatever and true it myself. Thanks!
Bro, “Plywood doesn’t warp or bend” is a patently false statement. U have to know that. Go to HD or L box stores the way they store their plywood leads to it’s warping and bending.
After initial filing, I would suggest running those edges lengthwise against a dead-flat diamond stone sharpening plate to make sure there are no valleys or hills left from your filing process.
The practice of using ever lengthening strokes is a great step. But you still want to confirm with a known straight edge that your newly filed edge is not only square but also straight. So to get both straight AND square you need to do a little back and forth checking for square as you did and also offering up your filed edge to a good straight edge with a light behind to check for gaps. A mid price steel machinist's ruler would be easily close for this test on a wood working square. If I may I'd suggest that favoring the ends somewhat and checking the close and far end on the plywood for square and deliberately leaving a slight hump in the middle is the way to go. That would allow one to then felt pen the edge and work down the slight hump and blend it all straight with the two ends. This would be favorable to a hollow through the mid section and having to take down the two ends and have to re-check for squareness.. That would be too much like evening up the legs on a table by eye.... and we all know how THAT goes :D. A slight extra complication but I'd suggest that it's a fairly important one. Especially if you'll ever use the blade of that square to check surfaces to see if they are flattening up nicely from the plane.
is it possible to use trigonometry to tell if the square is true? Such as, 1 inch in one direction and 1 inch in the other, the hypotenuse that makes is square root 2? Maybe easier measurements would be 3, 4, 5 right triangle? I don't know if that's an accurate way to do things or not because then you would need something that is very accurate to measure with right?
+Jared Fuller the problem with that is acuricy. On bigger squares (2' or more) it works well. But the other thing it does not do is tell you if the edge is flat and strait. Drawing the line makes that easy to see when you flip it over.
If you have to file a square to make it square, then you likely shouldn’t have bothered with it in the first place. So many better options on which to spend your money.
In school we were taught how to true up a square by gently peening the blade as close to the stock as possible on the side with the acute angle. This has the effect of lengthening that side and pushing the blade in the opposite direction. Technically, this is introducing a slight curve to the blade, but when you do it as close to the stock as possible, the short side of the curve will be miniscule. We were doing it with machinist's squares where 0.0001" curvature or out of true would have been unacceptable, so I think it's more than acceptable tolerance for woodworking. I've used the technique myself on framing squares, try squares, machinist squares, etc. with no problem. One of the advantaged of doing it this way is that you do not change the dimensions of the blade, width wise, or have to worry about throwing off the parallelism of the two blade edges.
You're method seems a little more daunting to me, a newb to woodworking and it's metal tools. I have a lot of inherited tools that I need to test out, refurbish and fix, so probably I have a chance to try peening a square eventually.
Вот это МАСТЕР! Нужен правильный угольник - взял и сделал. А бесконечное нытьё на много страниц о том, что невозможно купить хороший угольник надоело всем!
I have a square like this that’s loose; there’s a bit of wobble back and forth. Is that something that can be fixed? All the brass fasteners seem to be tight, so hammering them hasn’t helped
Nice video, I really didn't know how to compare my squares and check the accurate. I always trust my combination square (because looks more solid), recently I buy a cheap woodman square and comparing them I believe that my new cheap square was a fraud. But doing this test I really notice than my cheap square is almost perfect (I see no difference in both lines), but my trusty (and more expensive) combination square was wrong (by most of 3mm). Now is time to fix it. Thank you.
None of my cheapie square is true. Thanks for the greate fixing method you shared! Do not forget to check if the edge keeps straite after filing. I have another idea that whether a shooting board and a sand block could do the same job either.
cool I have the exact same old square and also got it at a garage sale with the same amount of out of alignment. I thought there was no way to fix it and I really wanted to because its a great old square. Thanks
I wish I had done that in this one. I do talk about that in another video but it would have been good to put it in this one too. Things we learn over the years.
Its ok to make mistakes, we learn from them. At least you are doing helpful things. I have learned so much from yours and a couple of other vids I watch regularly. A wealth of knowledge and its always good to get someone elses take on an issue. Keep up the good work. Its so hard to learn some of these skils and tools.
FYI I do not use a knife when checking square as it is hard for me to see sometimes depending on the wood. I use a freshly sharpened 2B pencil. Works just as well I think. Fortunately all my squares are Starretts now so I use those to check other squares. My supposedly high end Stanley was out 3 degrees. Ok for carpentry but not good enough for cabinetry. Its in someone elses tool box now.
Having bought several squares recently that were not square from the factories this video is exactly suited for me, I didn't find any useful advice on squaring squares and didn't want to just attack them with a file but now I know that is how you square your squares I will do the same to my unsquare squares. If a square is not square can you still call it a square or should we call it an unsquare?
Great video, James! Now, I am going to show my ignorance here... is this style square designed to check the inside of a corner? If so, would you just remove wood from the back side of the handle to make the back true to the blade that you just made true to the inside of the handle?
Gonna say, I don't know exactly about "frustrations"... BUT by being able to fix the thing, you've started saving me money. Yeah, I've run into that "this square ain't square" situation before... Usually got disgusted and threw the thing as far and hard as I could throw it... no sense keeping a "dead" square, and I wouldn't wish that on someone else, so no sale... (lolz) aside from scrap maybe. Man... think of the money I could've saved by now. ;o)
01:10 me, me, me.. *start all over* ha,ha.. 03:37 Good old eye balling, and my angle grinder.. okay - since it happens to be no high end laser technology, I guess it takes a fair amount of practice squaring it up. Good video, thanks.
Very useful info, thanks James. One problem I'm having is getting my straight edges dead straight without a dead flat reference to check them on; hard to tell if the sole of your plane is flat if your straight edge is bowed.
easy fix. draw a line on a board with it. just like on this square, then flip it over so the other side of the straight edge is down. then hold it up to that line. that will show you where your high spots are.
And here I am fiddling with three straight edges trying to cross reference them to each other! Thanks for the simple and easy fix! I suppose it's a good idea to use a knife line for the accuracy over a pencil line..
Ok.... interesting, but I would assume the metal blade is parallel and if that is the case it would seem illogical to file down 2 sides of the metal blade when you could focus on filing the brass portion. I'd even go as far as to say use a sharpie on the area that to are wanting to reduce
You can do that. But in this case it would take much longer to work on the brass as it is over 10 times thicker. Also there is only a little bit of the brass. But is is possible
I’ve wanted and passed up many of those beauty’s for cheap! I’ve fixed many-a-framing square with a punch and hammer...but always thought the rosewood and brass squares were unsalable. 😭 if I’d seen this video 4 years ago I would have one of every size by now...for dirt cheap. I won’t pass one up again!!, thanks so much !! Those thangs to me are simply beautiful!, even if I’m late,glad to know they are usable. Thanks a lot!!!
I recently bought a square just like the one you were "re-squaring". The problem with my is the metal can wiggle back and forth slightly, It moves about a 16th of an inch. I'm not sure how I can tighten it up. It's held in the wood with brass pins just like yours. Should I glue it, or peen the ends of the pins again?
I would start with trying to peen the pins, but it may be that the wood inside is too loose. you might be able to drive the pins out of one side to take off one brass cap then glue inside then put the cap back on, but you may also destroy the square in doing so. in the end it is about the only way to fix that.
As Chuck Berry would say, Old try square, why can’t you be true? Oh old try square, why can’t you be true? You’ve started back doing the things you used to do.
For some reason I've never been confident enough to do this, but now I've seen you do it successfully I'll sort all my squares this way, as none of them are dead-on square! I thought of passing the edges (once squared) over sandpaper glued to a sheet of glass to ensure absolute straightness : )
As long as you take it little by little by little it comes out relay easily. also flipping the square over will show you if the edge is not strait. and if it is not one or two quick passes with he file in line with the blade will fix that.
You do realize that you actually just posted a metal working video to your channel eh? This does qualify as metal working... :P So, in effect you are using a Square to round out your shop content...
you could but that would mean relying on marks made for each of the corners. It is difficult to be accurate enough on that small a triangle. not to mention if I bring up math then people start to get confused! LOL thanks man!
@@WoodByWright the blade of the square has a curve to the side, so when placed against a flat surface like how you did against the ply it will curl towards or away from the surface.
Great information. I recently saw an article about making a square and am going to buy some brass stock. I was wondering how to correct it if it wasn't square. Spot on !
I'd love to see someone make a traditional style square but replace the stock with aluminium faced with brass both sides, thus eliminating the risk of warping
Thanks so much for making this. I had to file a bit (1/16 or so) from the vacuum hose attachment on my router, and seeing this gave me the confidence to go at it with a file. Now, on to the squares!
Wouldn't you want to join the edge with the file once you've removed the material to make it square? I'm not sure how much taking away the material to make it square would make it not a straight edge. Just wondering if that is negligible or if it's noticeable.
Jeremy Long that's what I was thinking. Also to help you could use a marking gauge to get it parallel with the other side. Assuming of course that one side is indeed square and true. Oh and check for twist. Though it's minute usually it can throw it off.
Just make sure that the "blade" is also perfectly straight. It's easy to make it curve when filing it. So also check it against something you know is perfectly straight!
That's why you flip it over to check its line against itself. That way if there's any deviation in the edge it becomes twice as apparent. it's even more accurate than checking it against a straight edge.
@@WoodByWright Thanks, good to know. This would have been helpful to explain in the video, as many of us obviously had questions about whether the filed edge would be straight. I came to the comments here with that same question.
+JoshL if it were just wood that would be faster, but with the brass strip I would end up taking off so much brass there would not be much left. Plus it ts faster to work on the thin steel then the wider brass plate.
You would be amazed how many squares purchased brand new are out of square. Even the high-end expensive companies are off and out of whack. Never trust. Always verify
I'm curious... why take off metal, when it is already parallel, and is the linger and harder portion, and not the wood? Wouldn't it be easier and just as accurate?
Thank you for the return of the pun, really appreciate it ;). You could use the pythagorean theorem (the square of the hypotenuse is equal to the sum of the squares of the other two sides.) to see if your square is square.. 3/4/5 is the easiest way to find ( 3x3"9"+4x4"16"= 5x5"25") Thank you for your vids !
very true I have a video on that one too. I just find it inaccurate on small items due to the limitations of tape measures. I use that for squares with sides longer than 18"
It seems to me that sides of the metal blade may not be truly straight. It's sort of like planing the edge of a 1-foot board with a plane that has a 1-inch sole and expecting the board to be straight. . Does this make any sense?
yup but that is wat drawing the line on the board and flipping it over will tell you if it is straight or not. if you do it correctly it will stay straight, but some like to joint it when done.
Oh!!, and one more thing please: I recently completed my plane collection “3-9”consecutive! I was SO proud...I did something I’ve never done before.... I wiped them all down with 3in1 oil before sticking them back in the chest... I move my shop from the basement to the sunroom “back porch with salvaged glass” two weeks later Pull em out to decide on a fancy display like yours and BAM!!!!! 😭😲😱 RUST! ...rust dots everywhere !!! I’ll never oil em again...once I thoroughly clean them back up... 🙄 AGAIN. Any idea on how this happened ? I figured you guys probably oil y’alls tools regularly...but alas! I do live in the humid humid south. Maybe it was being shut up in the chest immediately with no time to dry?
I use paste wax as it tends to fill the Poor's in the steel better. I just make it by boiling together bees wax and 3in1 oil. Works like a charm as long as you stay on top of reallying it when you put them away. And once every 6 months if not used.
Wood By Wright I’ll try that I have pre-made paste wax that I’ve been wondering what to do with... I asked a guy at work today about what happened to the planes and he said : “that’s why they say not to use 3n1 on guns ” 🤷♂️ I had no idea...I did not wipe it off very well,had no idea it could CAUSE rust especially not in two weeks time... learn something new everyday.
The other test is the back side of the square by placing a straight edge on board and pressing square against it and repeating your measurements. At this stage you now have all the information understanding whats actually out of square
If it were machinist Square then you would check both sides of the beam as well as both sides of the arm but the beam tends to be thick enough and solid metal that it does not move over time.
Hi, you missed out a key step here my friend. In order to be accurately square you must first ensure that the brass face of the stock is flat and true. This is commonly bowed to some extent due to wood movement and failures in the fixing to the wood. Addressing this fault will often bring the square back into true without the need to file the steel blade. Done one just like that a few days back and turned a 30 cent investment into a lovely and accurate tool to use and cherish. I put in additional brass screws [filed flush to remove slot] and trued up the brass with filing and a hard steel bearing scraper, testing for true with a straight edge.
A contractors’ square is made to be adjustable by way of its metallic structure. If the ends of the square are too far apart, take a punch, place the point about ⅛” in from the outside corner and give it a tap/whack. This will force the ends back towards each other. Likewise, if the ends of the square are too close to each other, place the point of the punch near where they meet on the inside corner. A tap/whack there will force the ends apart. I’ve used this method dozens of times on all makes and make-ups of contractors’ square for the last 55 years and it works perfectly. Even on the cheap aluminum ones that you shouldn’t have to tap very strongly. My father, grandfather, and several uncles showed me this at different time circa 1961.
I should have read to the bottom of the comments! My above remark is about doing the job by gently peening instead of using a punch. It's doing close to the same thing, only a bit more gradually, for when you're dealing with machinist's tolerances, and often with blades that have been hardened and ground.
yup. I use it when the legs are longer than 18" or so at that size the inconsistencies of where you measure too and from becoming less of a problem. you can also use it to lay out a large right angle on the plywood as long as you trust the front edge to be straight.
Shit like this is why I payed lots of money getting my surface plate and layup table graded and trued. Worth every penny. I do more machining than woodworking these days but I was able to make my own VERY accurate measuring tools that I know I can trust for much less than Starret or Mititoyo charge
Testing the square works just as good with a pencil if you don’t have a marking knife Just mark your first line flip the square and line up the square to the bottom of the first mark and start your pencil at the bottom and go to the top, your lines should match exactly if the square is true if not the lines will separate
Great information. Thank you, that saves me forking out big bucks for a precision reference square, Just one thing, I am no safety junkie but watching the filling gave me cold shivers. One slip of concentration and that burred edge of the square will cut right thru your tendons down to the bone. WEAR gloves when filing edges.
I would suggest you remove the brass plate and insert shim material either towards the blade or towards the base end. I have two Stanley’s like this, one 10 inch and one six once, and used shim stock for one and a snippet of soda can aluminum for the other. Worked perfectly without filing, peining, or other method which requires the removal of metal or wood.
Also, make sure none of the screws in the brass plate protrude at all! Either tighten it down or dress it down with a file. Be sure and not remove the screw slot while filing if the screw protrudes too much!
Thanks so much! Just what I needed to know. I have had SO much trouble with un-square squares. Love your channel!
Happy to help!Thanks. I will keep them coming.
Great info James, thank you. I wish I had known when I was first starting out that a square isn't necessarily square. It would have saved me a bunch of frustration!
LOL yup. been there done that! you don't get what you expect but you do get what you inspect.
Great info! Looked at squares in the store today and most didn't match up even coming from the same company and being a more expensive brand. Didn't know which was correct so left without getting one. Now I can get whatever and true it myself. Thanks!
right on. once I get one true I keep the board with the mark and take that to the store to check them.
How many folks out there don't have a square, but have a jointer? Still a pretty useful video though, gotta find something flat in my shop now!
I use a factory edge of plywood.
Bro, “Plywood doesn’t warp or bend” is a patently false statement. U have to know that. Go to HD or L box stores the way they store their plywood leads to it’s warping and bending.
Thank you for another informative video!
thank you. that means a lot!
After initial filing, I would suggest running those edges lengthwise against a dead-flat diamond stone sharpening plate to make sure there are no valleys or hills left from your filing process.
that is what i check when they flip over. the two lines will be wavy if there are any valleys.
muy buen tips para poder corregir las escuadras =)
¡Gracias!
The practice of using ever lengthening strokes is a great step. But you still want to confirm with a known straight edge that your newly filed edge is not only square but also straight. So to get both straight AND square you need to do a little back and forth checking for square as you did and also offering up your filed edge to a good straight edge with a light behind to check for gaps. A mid price steel machinist's ruler would be easily close for this test on a wood working square.
If I may I'd suggest that favoring the ends somewhat and checking the close and far end on the plywood for square and deliberately leaving a slight hump in the middle is the way to go. That would allow one to then felt pen the edge and work down the slight hump and blend it all straight with the two ends. This would be favorable to a hollow through the mid section and having to take down the two ends and have to re-check for squareness.. That would be too much like evening up the legs on a table by eye.... and we all know how THAT goes :D.
A slight extra complication but I'd suggest that it's a fairly important one. Especially if you'll ever use the blade of that square to check surfaces to see if they are flattening up nicely from the plane.
True, I often think those points too obvious to mention, but I have to remember it is a first time for everyone.
is it possible to use trigonometry to tell if the square is true? Such as, 1 inch in one direction and 1 inch in the other, the hypotenuse that makes is square root 2? Maybe easier measurements would be 3, 4, 5 right triangle? I don't know if that's an accurate way to do things or not because then you would need something that is very accurate to measure with right?
+Jared Fuller the problem with that is acuricy. On bigger squares (2' or more) it works well. But the other thing it does not do is tell you if the edge is flat and strait. Drawing the line makes that easy to see when you flip it over.
I'm probably going square shopping this weekend. Any good way to tell whether I'm getting a decent square while I'm in the shop?
bring along a square you trust. or a board with a straight edge. that way you can check them at the store.
Wood By Wright awesome, thanks for the suggestions. I don't own anything but a speed square right now. I will bring a board!
a2+b2=c2
+Don S true. But takes longer and much harder to check on such a small scale.
I wonder how many estate and garage sales that plane has been passed(sold) along since it's origin, lol..cheers...rr
LOL who knows! but now it has a home! thanks Richard!
If you have to file a square to make it square, then you likely shouldn’t have bothered with it in the first place. So many better options on which to spend your money.
LOL there are many other options but this is one of my favorites.
Theme song out of tune
Lol. That is part of the fun of the channel, but you would probably prefer the new one.
@@WoodByWright I'll check it out!
In school we were taught how to true up a square by gently peening the blade as close to the stock as possible on the side with the acute angle. This has the effect of lengthening that side and pushing the blade in the opposite direction. Technically, this is introducing a slight curve to the blade, but when you do it as close to the stock as possible, the short side of the curve will be miniscule. We were doing it with machinist's squares where 0.0001" curvature or out of true would have been unacceptable, so I think it's more than acceptable tolerance for woodworking. I've used the technique myself on framing squares, try squares, machinist squares, etc. with no problem. One of the advantaged of doing it this way is that you do not change the dimensions of the blade, width wise, or have to worry about throwing off the parallelism of the two blade edges.
+FXM yup I have done that a lot too especially with framing squares. It works great.
You're method seems a little more daunting to me, a newb to woodworking and it's metal tools. I have a lot of inherited tools that I need to test out, refurbish and fix, so probably I have a chance to try peening a square eventually.
Interesting idea
^This, in my experience is the correct answer.
couldn't you make the 50 full?
47 times "square"?! c'mon man!
my OCD is kicking in badly! xD
Вот это МАСТЕР! Нужен правильный угольник - взял и сделал. А бесконечное нытьё на много страниц о том, что невозможно купить хороший угольник надоело всем!
I have a square like this that’s loose; there’s a bit of wobble back and forth. Is that something that can be fixed? All the brass fasteners seem to be tight, so hammering them hasn’t helped
Most of them have rivets that can be driven farther on and peen them over a bit more. But usually at that point it's trash.
This video is going to become a drinking game. A shot every time you say square.
LOL that would be interesting.
CHEERS ! *
I was chasing for square an edge free handing it, I realized that my square I knocked my square out of true.
Oh no fun. I've done that before.
How true or straight is the blade when done filing?
functionally prefect. Within a thousand or less over the length.
Thanks for sharing this information, I now will check all my squares cause I am sure they need some attention.
Thank you Sir.🎉
A 16 i can live with that
You got a cool looking shop! Is that a new one, or a re-model? Great video!
thanks! not sure what you mean by new one or remodel? are you talking shop or square? if shop. it is the same space but with a new wall behind me.
Yes, shop. It looks much different, and better than it did before! :)
yup the last few months I have been moving everything around now that I have more space down in the basement.
How have I never seen this video till now? I've created an entire play list just for tool maintenance and this is invaluable to that. Thank you.
Thanks Matt!
Want to share your playlist. ?
Nice video, I really didn't know how to compare my squares and check the accurate. I always trust my combination square (because looks more solid), recently I buy a cheap woodman square and comparing them I believe that my new cheap square was a fraud. But doing this test I really notice than my cheap square is almost perfect (I see no difference in both lines), but my trusty (and more expensive) combination square was wrong (by most of 3mm). Now is time to fix it. Thank you.
Sadly, combination squares are rarely accurate. There are too many ways to knock them off.
None of my cheapie square is true. Thanks for the greate fixing method you shared! Do not forget to check if the edge keeps straite after filing. I have another idea that whether a shooting board and a sand block could do the same job either.
Thanks, and yes when you draw the line it becomes obvious if the edge is not true.
Comment down below!
Excellent video!
Thank you for this video...quite timely :) As it turns out I just picked up a few of that model :)
cool I have the exact same old square and also got it at a garage sale with the same amount of out of alignment. I thought there was no way to fix it and I really wanted to because its a great old square. Thanks
Nice! I love seeing a great old tool come back to life!
Mathematics
You should mention how to square a framing square with a prick punch.
I wish I had done that in this one. I do talk about that in another video but it would have been good to put it in this one too. Things we learn over the years.
Its ok to make mistakes, we learn from them. At least you are doing helpful things. I have learned so much from yours and a couple of other vids I watch regularly. A wealth of knowledge and its always good to get someone elses take on an issue. Keep up the good work. Its so hard to learn some of these skils and tools.
FYI I do not use a knife when checking square as it is hard for me to see sometimes depending on the wood. I use a freshly sharpened 2B pencil. Works just as well I think. Fortunately all my squares are Starretts now so I use those to check other squares. My supposedly high end Stanley was out 3 degrees. Ok for carpentry but not good enough for cabinetry. Its in someone elses tool box now.
Great video James. Thanks for referencing this from you short.
Having bought several squares recently that were not square from the factories this video is exactly suited for me, I didn't find any useful advice on squaring squares and didn't want to just attack them with a file but now I know that is how you square your squares I will do the same to my unsquare squares. If a square is not square can you still call it a square or should we call it an unsquare?
+Patrick Brett lol thanks. Good thought.
Wow, how simple was that, going to my shed to fix my squares now, thank you
Thank you very much for this very helpful tip !!!! Merci beaucoup !
you are welcome. glad I could help!
Great video, James! Now, I am going to show my ignorance here... is this style square designed to check the inside of a corner? If so, would you just remove wood from the back side of the handle to make the back true to the blade that you just made true to the inside of the handle?
+Frank McCane this one is not ment for that some tri squats are but most just check outside corners.
Gonna say, I don't know exactly about "frustrations"... BUT by being able to fix the thing, you've started saving me money.
Yeah, I've run into that "this square ain't square" situation before... Usually got disgusted and threw the thing as far and hard as I could throw it... no sense keeping a "dead" square, and I wouldn't wish that on someone else, so no sale... (lolz) aside from scrap maybe.
Man... think of the money I could've saved by now. ;o)
glad I could help!
01:10 me, me, me.. *start all over* ha,ha..
03:37 Good old eye balling, and my angle grinder..
okay - since it happens to be no high end laser technology, I guess it takes a fair amount of practice squaring it up. Good video, thanks.
Very useful info, thanks James. One problem I'm having is getting my straight edges dead straight without a dead flat reference to check them on; hard to tell if the sole of your plane is flat if your straight edge is bowed.
easy fix. draw a line on a board with it. just like on this square, then flip it over so the other side of the straight edge is down. then hold it up to that line. that will show you where your high spots are.
And here I am fiddling with three straight edges trying to cross reference them to each other! Thanks for the simple and easy fix! I suppose it's a good idea to use a knife line for the accuracy over a pencil line..
right on. a knife is always best if possible.
Great video, thank you so much!
Hi there from Portugal,
I have a combinations square that has the beam curved but to the side, any ideas to make it flat?
Obrigado (Thanks)
you can bend it back with a peening hammer just like starting a saw plate.
Ok.... interesting, but I would assume the metal blade is parallel and if that is the case it would seem illogical to file down 2 sides of the metal blade when you could focus on filing the brass portion. I'd even go as far as to say use a sharpie on the area that to are wanting to reduce
You can do that. But in this case it would take much longer to work on the brass as it is over 10 times thicker. Also there is only a little bit of the brass. But is is possible
I’ve wanted and passed up many of those beauty’s for cheap!
I’ve fixed many-a-framing square with a punch and hammer...but always thought the rosewood and brass squares were unsalable. 😭 if I’d seen this video 4 years ago I would have one of every size by now...for dirt cheap.
I won’t pass one up again!!, thanks so much !! Those thangs to me are simply beautiful!, even if I’m late,glad to know they are usable. Thanks a lot!!!
You can fix these with the punch methoud too. Though you do not want to do much. That is why I generally prefer this methoud. Thanks.
I recently bought a square just like the one you were "re-squaring". The problem with my is the metal can wiggle back and forth slightly, It moves about a 16th of an inch. I'm not sure how I can tighten it up. It's held in the wood with brass pins just like yours. Should I glue it, or peen the ends of the pins again?
I would start with trying to peen the pins, but it may be that the wood inside is too loose. you might be able to drive the pins out of one side to take off one brass cap then glue inside then put the cap back on, but you may also destroy the square in doing so. in the end it is about the only way to fix that.
As Chuck Berry would say,
Old try square, why can’t you be true?
Oh old try square, why can’t you be true?
You’ve started back doing the things you used to do.
Lol. Love it!
Great video! Thank you!
For some reason I've never been confident enough to do this, but now I've seen you do it successfully I'll sort all my squares this way, as none of them are dead-on square! I thought of passing the edges (once squared) over sandpaper glued to a sheet of glass to ensure absolute straightness : )
As long as you take it little by little by little it comes out relay easily. also flipping the square over will show you if the edge is not strait. and if it is not one or two quick passes with he file in line with the blade will fix that.
@@WoodByWright thanks for the info. Yes, i guess the file will be straight and remove any high spots : )
Very useful video, thanks for sharing it with us 🙏🏼
Forgot to square the bottom side of the square only checked the top of the block what about the bottom
You do the same thing to the bottom.
something ive gone a long time without knowing, now i finally do. nice to see you covering the basics
+shonuffisthemaster thanks.
Great minds or fools James? I shot about the same video a week and a half ago, I think it is scheduled to go live Oct. 18th.
+TrollForge sweet. Looking forward to it.
You do realize that you actually just posted a metal working video to your channel eh? This does qualify as metal working... :P So, in effect you are using a Square to round out your shop content...
LOL yup
Would using Pythagorean be to course a measurement? I was surprised not to hear it mentioned at all.
OH, and by the way very cool video, always good to know more then one way to skin the cat. :-)
you could but that would mean relying on marks made for each of the corners. It is difficult to be accurate enough on that small a triangle. not to mention if I bring up math then people start to get confused! LOL thanks man!
I was just thinking about this particular problem yesterday, it's as if RUclips read my mind. Great video James, thanks!
you caught me! I am a mind reader!
How do I best deal with a sideways bend?
sorry I am not sure what you are asking. feel free to send me an email on my web site and i would be glad to talk it over with you.
@@WoodByWright the blade of the square has a curve to the side, so when placed against a flat surface like how you did against the ply it will curl towards or away from the surface.
In that case you bend it back. Rather in a vice or just by hand depending on the steel.
Great information. I recently saw an article about making a square and am going to buy some brass stock. I was wondering how to correct it if it wasn't square. Spot on !
There you go. sounds like a fun project Robert!
I'd love to see someone make a traditional style square but replace the stock with aluminium faced with brass both sides, thus eliminating the risk of warping
Thanks so much for making this. I had to file a bit (1/16 or so) from the vacuum hose attachment on my router, and seeing this gave me the confidence to go at it with a file. Now, on to the squares!
Nice. I love seeing a tool come back to life.
Wouldn't you want to join the edge with the file once you've removed the material to make it square? I'm not sure how much taking away the material to make it square would make it not a straight edge. Just wondering if that is negligible or if it's noticeable.
I forgot to mention check it for strait when done. but when you check it on that line any not strait portion becomes very evident.
I would think a quick pass along the length of it, kind of like jointing a saw, would do the trick, shouldn't take much.
yup. that is what I do if any issue comes up. but that is basically what the last pass does running from one end tot he other.
Jeremy Long that's what I was thinking. Also to help you could use a marking gauge to get it parallel with the other side. Assuming of course that one side is indeed square and true. Oh and check for twist. Though it's minute usually it can throw it off.
you can use a marking gauge, but it would have to be a sharp and finely tightened one to leave such a fine line so close to the edge.
Drinking game idea, take a shot every time he says 'Square'! you'll be dead by the first minute =D
Most would stop before that.
I'm square now lol. Thank You this was awesome information
LOL thaks Thom!
But in straight though
Awesome video James, loved it, I suffered quite some time with a unsquare square, not anymore! Thanks for sharing it!
now fun. thanks man!
Just make sure that the "blade" is also perfectly straight. It's easy to make it curve when filing it.
So also check it against something you know is perfectly straight!
That's why you flip it over to check its line against itself. That way if there's any deviation in the edge it becomes twice as apparent. it's even more accurate than checking it against a straight edge.
@@WoodByWright Thanks, good to know. This would have been helpful to explain in the video, as many of us obviously had questions about whether the filed edge would be straight. I came to the comments here with that same question.
How about for the bottom edge of the square? Would you remove material from the wood?
+JoshL if it were just wood that would be faster, but with the brass strip I would end up taking off so much brass there would not be much left. Plus it ts faster to work on the thin steel then the wider brass plate.
Wood By Wright I meant to square the bottom edge with the steel. For example using the square to square the inside of corners
this tri-square is not meant for inside corners, but yes if they are designed for that then that will do it.
Bought a brand new 18 centimetre Empire Aluminium Speed square today,and its out by half a millimetre ,so its going back to get a refund
You would be amazed how many squares purchased brand new are out of square. Even the high-end expensive companies are off and out of whack. Never trust. Always verify
@@WoodByWright true,great video too by the way,I will check out more of them.
thnaks!
Smart
This video was a little square man.
LOL perfict!
so useful! thanks
i was taught a different way James
Yep. There are a bunch of different ways to do it. That's what makes the sport fun. You can always find the way that works best for you.
I'm curious... why take off metal, when it is already parallel, and is the linger and harder portion, and not the wood?
Wouldn't it be easier and just as accurate?
With the brace face on the wood you do not want to adjust that as there is only so much that can be roved.
was this episode sponsored by squarespace?
LOL that would be a good one!
👍👍👍👏
Thank you for the return of the pun, really appreciate it ;). You could use the pythagorean theorem (the square of the hypotenuse is equal to the sum of the squares of the other two sides.) to see if your square is square.. 3/4/5 is the easiest way to find ( 3x3"9"+4x4"16"= 5x5"25") Thank you for your vids !
very true I have a video on that one too. I just find it inaccurate on small items due to the limitations of tape measures. I use that for squares with sides longer than 18"
easier to remove wood on square than steel
+cj lures that is it
Great demo James very informative.
+Opa's Workshop thanks Opa.
It seems to me that sides of the metal blade may not be truly straight. It's sort of like planing the edge of a 1-foot board with a plane that has a 1-inch sole and expecting the board to be straight. . Does this make any sense?
yup but that is wat drawing the line on the board and flipping it over will tell you if it is straight or not. if you do it correctly it will stay straight, but some like to joint it when done.
Very good video! Thank you.
my pleasure Robert!
Nice thank you
My pleasure.
What reasons do you have for not trying to adjust the wood/brass side? Are you concerned that the metal won't be perfectly straight?
I could grind down the brass plate but I find that to be more work, also it is so thin that there would not be much-left on the brass afterword.
Thats a very helpful tip … thanks! I have to ask though why did you not square up the wooded section instead of the steel side?
Because that had a brass plate on it that was very thin.
Oh!!, and one more thing please:
I recently completed my plane collection “3-9”consecutive!
I was SO proud...I did something I’ve never done before....
I wiped them all down with 3in1 oil before sticking them back in the chest...
I move my shop from the basement to the sunroom “back porch with salvaged glass” two weeks later
Pull em out to decide on a fancy display like yours and
BAM!!!!! 😭😲😱
RUST! ...rust dots everywhere !!!
I’ll never oil em again...once I thoroughly clean them back up... 🙄 AGAIN.
Any idea on how this happened ?
I figured you guys probably oil y’alls tools regularly...but alas!
I do live in the humid humid south.
Maybe it was being shut up in the chest immediately with no time to dry?
I use paste wax as it tends to fill the Poor's in the steel better. I just make it by boiling together bees wax and 3in1 oil. Works like a charm as long as you stay on top of reallying it when you put them away. And once every 6 months if not used.
Wood By Wright I’ll try that
I have pre-made paste wax that I’ve been wondering what to do with...
I asked a guy at work today about what happened to the planes and he said : “that’s why they say not to use 3n1 on guns ” 🤷♂️
I had no idea...I did not wipe it off very well,had no idea it could CAUSE rust especially not in two weeks time... learn something new everyday.
You are assuming the square is straight first before the test shown and that needs to be checked because often the are dropped
When you flip it over if it is not straight it becomes apparent as the line will move in and out
Thank you for the tip
my pleasure!
Thanks for the info James! 👍
my pleasure fred!
The other test is the back side of the square by placing a straight edge on board and pressing square against it and repeating your measurements. At this stage you now have all the information understanding whats actually out of square
With a try Square you do not use the back side of the beam. Only on the inside of the beam and the front and back of the arm.
If it were machinist Square then you would check both sides of the beam as well as both sides of the arm but the beam tends to be thick enough and solid metal that it does not move over time.
Could you take the material off of the wooden handle?
you could, but I find it more difficult with it overlapping the steel.
Hi, you missed out a key step here my friend. In order to be accurately square you must first ensure that the brass face of the stock is flat and true. This is commonly bowed to some extent due to wood movement and failures in the fixing to the wood. Addressing this fault will often bring the square back into true without the need to file the steel blade.
Done one just like that a few days back and turned a 30 cent investment into a lovely and accurate tool to use and cherish. I put in additional brass screws [filed flush to remove slot] and trued up the brass with filing and a hard steel bearing scraper, testing for true with a straight edge.
A very good video & instructional.
+Rag Tie thanks.
A contractors’ square is made to be adjustable by way of its metallic structure. If the ends of the square are too far apart, take a punch, place the point about ⅛” in from the outside corner and give it a tap/whack. This will force the ends back towards each other. Likewise, if the ends of the square are too close to each other, place the point of the punch near where they meet on the inside corner. A tap/whack there will force the ends apart. I’ve used this method dozens of times on all makes and make-ups of contractors’ square for the last 55 years and it works perfectly. Even on the cheap aluminum ones that you shouldn’t have to tap very strongly. My father, grandfather, and several uncles showed me this at different time circa 1961.
very true. I have an other video on that method too.
I should have read to the bottom of the comments! My above remark is about doing the job by gently peening instead of using a punch. It's doing close to the same thing, only a bit more gradually, for when you're dealing with machinist's tolerances, and often with blades that have been hardened and ground.
What meow?
Instructables sent you an email.
what?
Wood By Wright 2:55
LOL good eyes. yes I got second place in the box contest.
3+4=5 or 3,4,5
+Pasha Hart true. But very difficult to be that accurate on that small a scale when a line thickness can throw it off by 1/4 degree.
yes and no, I could come up with a dozen or so ways
but I'm a carpenter and worked in the field my whole life.
yup. I use it when the legs are longer than 18" or so at that size the inconsistencies of where you measure too and from becoming less of a problem. you can also use it to lay out a large right angle on the plywood as long as you trust the front edge to be straight.
Just buy another square and don't be such a Square. :oP
Thanks for the video.
Lol nice!
Shit like this is why I payed lots of money getting my surface plate and layup table graded and trued. Worth every penny. I do more machining than woodworking these days but I was able to make my own VERY accurate measuring tools that I know I can trust for much less than Starret or Mititoyo charge
Really useful info. I was wondering how to do this or if it was even possible to true a square. Thanks
Thanks Derrick!
This is all wrong because if it is out in the other direction you cannot get into the inside corner....Hammer and punch is the only way
Ok, so I think the professional term is not “square trueness” but simply “squareness”
Testing the square works just as good with a pencil if you don’t have a marking knife
Just mark your first line flip the square and line up the square to the bottom of the first mark and start your pencil at the bottom and go to the top, your lines should match exactly if the square is true if not the lines will separate
true!
Great information. Thank you, that saves me forking out big bucks for a precision reference square,
Just one thing, I am no safety junkie but watching the filling gave me cold shivers. One slip of concentration and that burred edge of the square will cut right thru your tendons down to the bone. WEAR gloves when filing edges.