Wood Turning Avoid Those Nasty Carbide Catches
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- Опубликовано: 29 сен 2024
- I show how I avoid the nasty catches using carbide cutters.
Carbide cutters are basically scrapers. What is important is the position of the tool based on the center of the turning.
I also show some of my old pattern making turning tools and some very large turnings.
Tools used: Carbide turning tools and negative rake scraper
Finish used: Zinsser Seal Coat Acks Abrasive Acks Polish/Restoring Paste
If you found this video entertaining
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The video is for entertainment purposes only
You are watching how I do things and not suggesting others should do it the way I do.
You need to know your machines and how to use them. Follow how the manufacture says to use them safely.
Look up other turnings I have done:
Dizzy Twister Turnings Segmented Turnings
Feature Rings Staves
20 minute bowl
Great gift or a craft show sales
Star bowl Block bowl
Tumbling bowls Emerging Bowls Black Locust Vase
Droop Bowl Offset Bowl Barrel of Blocks Star Bowl Bowl in a Bowl
Droop Bowl Lathe modifications Lacquer Shellac Friction Polish
Abrasive Paste Polishing Paste Wipe on Poly Black Locust Hollow Form
Multi Axis Square Bowl Siberian Elm Hollow Form
Dodecahedron Soccer Ball Sphere Olive Wood Turnings Illusions Segmented Vase
Tangent Stave Turning
Thanks Gary
Extremely informative video....
Thanks always enjoy your projects...the knotty pieces of wood with edge bark and lots of inclusions is my favorite projects to turn
Ian
Edmonton Canada
It's cold here also
Thanks for watching Ian and I like those types of pieces as well. Working one right now.
I am sure it is a lot colder up where you are at.
Take care,
Gary
Thanks, Gary! I use carbide fairly frequently, so getting your take on the technique is golden.
Thank you Michael. It works for me. Hope it works out for you as well.
Thanks for watching,
Gary
Thanks so much, I had trouble with catch’s on the inside of bowls now I know why, thanks again
Thank you Gary. Happy it helped and have fun.
Gary
That was a great lesson, thanks Gary.
Thank you Stewart and thanks for watching.
Thanks for your drawing illustrations they definitely helped me understand how and why the tool catches in the wood. I tried turning my first bowl last week and I had several catches I now have an understanding of what I was doing wrong and have the confidence to give it another try thanks Carl Prudhomme
Thank you Carl. Just take it nice and slow till you find out what works good for you. And above all things have fun turning.
Take care and best of luck.
Gary
Very well done, professor! This helps me a lot! Now, how 'bout the same info for HSS gouges and scrapers! How 'bout we all just meet at your place for a class lecture? I'll bring the Pringles! 😊😋🤣
Phil
Thank you Phil. Scrapers would work just like the carbides as far as catches go. As you know those gouges have a mind of their own.
You decide to let the wing touch wall on the inside and the gouges lets you know that is a big NO NO!
Pringles sounds good! But I would say bring your own HEAT..right now it says 34 degrees. And not sure what I will turn next but it is going to have to be a quickie!
Stay warm buddy!
Gary
wow u managed to turn 6ft bowl that's Hugh.
It was bowl shaped for awhile but then it became a mold for a fiberglass spa.
@@ThePapa1947 o wow that's cool. couldn't understand why such a big wooden bowl. now I know. thank u. good man.
Brand new turner, tried my first bowl today. It went awful, catch after catch. Google brought me here, and you got me sorted out real quick! Understand what I was doing wrong, thank you for a great explanation. I was doing the opposite with regards to tool rest height. Thanks again!
Hi Mike and welcome to the world of wood turning. Understanding the geometry of what is going on is a good way to see what causes those catches. May your wood turning be catch free. But having them be rare is the best we can ask for. The wood it self can contribute to a catch no matter what.
Have fun,
Gary
Been getting catches inside my bowl with the carbide (brand new turner). Makes complete sense, thank you!!
Thank you for watching and letting me know.
Best of luck.
Gary
Hello my friend,
Congrats on the project and smart way of working that hides great experiences. Thank you for this useful information. The design you translated that huge years ago was magnificent and impressive. I was also impressed by the shop you served in your apprenticeship. Details were beautiful. See you. Big greetings.
Thanks so much my friend. It was a great shop to learn in. Being a small shop I started building patterns from day one. A big shop it is a few years before they turned you loose on your own project. I worked there for 11 or 12 years then moved to the largest shop in town. Lots of equipment and much better. But I am grateful for learning in the small shop with the machines we had.
Thanks for watching,
Gary
Good info GARY, they can be dangerous, 2 years ago I had a carbide catch and it kicked back and up so hard, it cracked 2 of my ribs, no fun.
Thank you Tom. For sure they can be dangerous and scary. If someone got a catch the whole shop would hear it and look over toward the lathe.
Take care,
Gary
So that’s what I’ve been doing wrong. Everything! 😃😃😃 Great tutorial, Gary. That really clears up a lot of questions for a lot of us turners. Thanks for sharing your expertise. As always, you da man! Stay well, my friend.
…..Gord
Thank you Gord. I was ask about this a few years ago and then again last week. So that and the fact for us 23 degrees is cold I figured this would be quick and hopefully helpful.
Oh and I have not seen you do anything wrong yet my friend!
Take care,
Gary
The woodturning world is blessed to have people like you in it. Thank you for this.
Thank you very Jeremy I appreciate you watching and commenting,
Gary
The king of common sense! Anyone either just starting out or a very seasoned turner will quickly
understand what catches are and, by your instructions, avoid them. Thanks.
Thank you. And for sure. Catches are common when first starting out. I think some might give up before figuring it out.
Thanks for watching,
Gayr
Thank You Gary...Very much appreciated, very informative. What you do automatically, perhaps without thinking. It is nice to hear your simple breakdown of the do's & don'ts of turning. .. At 9:37 you mentioned the large casting was Titanium, WOW...Impressive piece to say the least. I shared this one with a machinist friend that lives near by you.... TM
Thanks Tuffy! I wanted to put a picture of the huge pump body I made but I did not do any turning on it. But I am standing by it and it stands as tall as me.
Thanks for watching,
Gary
We are often told that it is the burr on a negative rake scraper that does the work... and after a few seconds the burr is gone and it's time to regrind to get a new burr. However..... Carbide does not create a burr. So how do carbide negative rake scrapers work so well? Is it just tool geometry? Last.... Do you build your own carbide tools? Favorite source for replacement cutters?
Thanks.... I worked as "Pattern Boy" right out of college (Industrial Arts-1981) and have the utmost respect for that trade. It has certainly changed in the last 30 years. I learned ton in my stint there.... From working with mammoth machines and their upkeep, to fine, precision skills to ensure accuracy. I told my students a story the other day about an emergency modification I had to do on a pattern. The foundry guys were in my shop b/c they needed the change right away. We painted our patterns with Freeman Pattern Paint--the lacquer based stuff. As soon as I painted the changed part they lit the paint on fire to burn off the solvent and dry the paint. By the time they walked back to the foundry area they were ready to ram up the modified pattern. Good times!
Thank you Dave! All HHS scrapers cut using a burr. And I think they cut better than any carbide cutter. The advantage to the carbide is they stay sharper longer. And the fact there is not burr I do not think they cut as good as the HSS scrapers. You can hone the flat ones and it does help but if you get a burr it is on the wrong side to help you.
The negative rake carbides help to not get catches for the same reason the HSS ones do, But no burr so do not cut like the HSS ones do.
I remember the stories of the old time pattern makers lighting the paint to get it to dry. But they were using Shellac and it flashed off and that was it. I heard about an apprentice in a different shop lighting up lacquer and just about burned the pattern up before they could get the fire out.
We used lots of Freeman products as well.
So when you say Pattern Boy is that an apprentice or a helper?
Yes it was good times for me as well. I remember taking a trip to one of the foundries to do a design change on how some cores fit together. The mold was so big I could climb down inside and look at the fit of the cores and then go back to the shop and adjust the core box. That was one big pattern I made and one big sand mold.
Thanks for watching and your stories. Good Times
Gary
I got the job in a pattern shop a few weeks before my college graduation-- I was not sure if I wanted to become a shop teacher, or go into industry. The actual pattern maker only worked 3 days a week, so he would show me what to do on the days in between when I was alone. The plant foreman was there all five days, as well, so I was not completely alone on those days. By August I was offered a teaching job, so I did not stay in that field.... I was only a Pattern Boy-- not even an apprentice.... But it was really great work. The patternshop was at one end of the building, a complete machine shop in the middle, and a foundry at the far end. But it was a skeleton crew-- 1981 was the beginning of the end for many old industries in Trenton, NJ. This is my 41st year as a shop teacher and I still fondly remember those months I spent in that pattern shop.
I think being a shop teacher would be a great job. I had 3 teachers that inspired me. First was in grade school. He was strict if you goofed off but I loved the class and never goofed off. The other two in high school were great as well. Both the wood shop and the metal shop teachers. Also took architectural drawing and the metal shop teacher taught that.
Oh, I'm so disappointed. I saw the link to the video and it showed a broken bowl and I thought, "He's one of us! Even Papa1947 has broken a bowl." I guess I was wrong. Cheers!
Sorry Josh! I even cringed when I knew it was going to explode. I stood way off to the side with face shield and flak jacket on LOL.
Thanks for watching,
Gary
Very interesting .. I would like to hear more about your pattern-turning-days ..
Thank you Jeff. Here is a video I did at the my beginning of making videos. No talking but some cool pictures.
ruclips.net/video/lil3zwgc3Ok/видео.html&ab_channel=ThePapa1947
That laurel bowl was turned from my start to your finish, completely with carbide edges! As you may recall, Gary, that's all I've ever used. Had to teach myself how to turn and carbide was my choice. Your methods and mine differ, somewhat-- one to try is the square bit for most extererior cuts except the curve to that base. I've found it cuts smoother and I have better control of the cut. Also, carbide bits can be sharpened! Using diamond card files from 600 to 1,000 grit, sharpen *only* the face by lightly pressing the bit to the card with a fingertip and move it rapidly in small circles, working up through the grits. When the screw will no longer tighten it down to the shaft, toss it away and replace. It'll be quite awhile before it gets to that point. In 5 years, I have tossed only one that wouldn't tighten; others get tossed when they meet the chuck.😳 Cheers!
Well Dave I knew there was a good reason to finish that bowl in this video. I would have used bowl gouges had I done it on its own. So this was meant to be.
I plan on making another holder that puts the point straight out. I think this would make a great cutting tool. Just like my larger scraper. It is very controllable on light and heavy cuts.
I sharpen them on a diamond card as well. But unlike a HSS scraper you are not putting a burr on it. That is why I feel the scraper cuts better but dulls faster.
Take care,
Gary
@@ThePapa1947 EasyWood now makes neg rake bits for all their full-size handles. I grabbed 'em for the round and square shafts. They do work nicely, but I haven't yet figured out how to sharpen them when they get too dull.
Gray I learned alot about how to use carbide tools from this video. Thank you. One other question I have is what is the upper and lower angles on your negative rake scraper that you prefer? And thank you for your lesson on carbide turning.
Thank you Dean. I grind both sides of the negative rake scraper at 40 degrees. They do not have to be the same but my grinders platform pretty much stays at 40 and it works good.
Thanks for watching,
Gary
Perfect! It is the 3” wedges I am attempting, I will make angular adjustments as you recommend. thanks for your help.
E
Thank you E. Just know you can take a piece or two out to help the joints close up. The angle becomes a compound angle whey you tilt the pieces.
Gary
Definitely want to get one of those overgrown negative rake scrapers! Still need to learn how to hollow the base for narrower aperture bowls/vases.
I love that big scraper. Almost feels like cheating...but I am fine with that.
Take care,
Gary
thank you so much for this video. I have switched to carbide as traditional catches have scared the crap out of me with catches such as the scew chisel (aka widow maker). I am so excited to turn my Lathe back on and make shavings!
Thank you Glen. For sure it is hard to get comfortable on the lathe if you have a fear of a tool.
I seldom use a skew for the type of turning I do.
Have fun using the tools you are comfortable with.
Gary
Ah that explains that catch on the inside... Too Big of a bite... Great Info Thanks Gary.. So now I know.. time to put it to use on that Burl I'm working on when I get home...
Thank you Timothy and have fun turning the Burl.
Take care,
Gary
BTW, I have a set of bowl debris on my workroom shelf to remind me to slow down. Mine was decidedly NOT intentional.
Oh I have put reminders of a few things myself. When I was an apprentice wood pattern maker I got in a hurry to finish something and did not check the work with the template I made. Boss was not hard on me but I never forgot and I hung that template on my bench up to the point I move to another shop. I wouldn't doubt if I still have it somewhere. Sometimes if I get in a hurry I remember something else he told me and say it to myself. Actually good memories because I learned so much from him.
Take care,
Gary
I really appreciate this explanation. Although I disagree with the reasoning, it showed me something I had not considered. I think the reason for catches is not how much is above, although that makes sense but the bigger reason is the angle of attack causes the wood to pull the tool into the workpiece. This is a vector analysis problem.
You are right with what you are talking about. But carbides are meant to be held flat with no tilt so below the center line on the out side is going to be a catch. If you tilt the tool things change. I did turnings in the 6-8 foot diameter range and you wanted that cutting edge in the right spot. If you get a catch on something that size it will wake you up. Also we kept the tools flat to make accurate cuts to match drawings we were using.
But you are right that you can tilt the tool and get good cuts. A bowl does not care if you are .030 inches off the dimension.
Thanks for watching,
Gary
Hi, a very good explanation that, once explained, help you to appreciate the obvious. That's what good explanations do. I don't use carbides much, when I do it's likely to be for hollowing, particularly hollowing at depth or when there's a shoulder that you want to get behind. It is at these times that the frequency with which i get catches increases - seldom get a catch externally. I guess it's probably because I'm veering above centre. One of the things I haven't yet grapsed = in the sense of understood albeit i use - is why a tool - carbide or scraper - should cut better when at 45 degrees. So much so that some manfacturers produce square shafts with a cutter set at 45 degrees to the flat held on the tool rest. Is it simply a matter of less cutting edge at the point of contact or is it more a matter of a greater slicing or planing action. I feel that i should understand this but I don't. I guess I very occasionally use my smoothing plane at something approaching a 45 degree angle when planing is tough. Of course one is presenting less of the cutting edge than if it was square on, e.g. a three inch blade presented at 45 degrees provides a cut of approx 2 1/8" . The obvious is sometimes not so obvious!
Thank you Ray. I think you pretty much understand the cutter on a 45 degree. It is slicing rather than scrapping.
I used hand planes a lot at work and I never held it square to the work. Always had them on and angle, My favorite is the Stanley #60 block plane. I have 3 of those. One was for work and the other for home plus a spare.
Gotten rid of most of my collection but still have the No.1
thanks for watching,
Gary
A smoothing plane is a good example. If you took the blade out and support it at 45 degrees, the cutting angle. And without moving the blade measure the angle across the blade related to the direction that you might be planing with the plane skewed for difficult grain you will see that the 45deg blade is actually slicing at a much lower angle, just twist your protractor across the blade in the cut direction. You could be slicing as low as 15-20 degrees although the blade is still in the plane at 45 degrees. Same with a turning scraper. Hold it level to the job and flat and it’s 100% scraping but start to turn it anticlockwise and it will start to not scrape so much and start to slice more and more the further you turn until it is fully vertical and stops cutting. Richard Raffan calls it shear scraping. He has about 20 great videos recently made worth a look. Re carbide, carbide is hard but can not be sharpened to a keen edge like HSS high speed steel so it may be of some use on difficult woods that are hard on the tools but for general turning HSS scrapers and tools will always give a better cut and finish with less sanding if sharp and maintained than carbide ever will. Hope this explains it and helps you out.
@@ThePapa1947 Thanks Gary. I guess the manufacturers are just trying to replicate shear scraping with a bowl gouge. Easy on the outside of a bowl, impossible on the inside without a preset angle. Keep up the good work, Gary
@@cooperken11 Sorry Ken, I didn't see this until after i had replied to Gary. I'll look up the RR videos. it's good advice on HSS vs carbide. I've also heard that carbon steel will take a very sharp edge but will not hold it for long. I have some very old tools that I occasionally use and if you think about what the old time pros did with little else than carbon steel tools and a lathe and very little sanding then you have to admire their finishing. Ah! You have helped me to make another connection - dumb that I am - "with the plane skewed for difficult grain" which leads us onto the skew!
Completely agree with you about carbide but they have their place, just as Gary indicates.
I got a bad catch yesterday using a round carbide cutter on the inside of a bowl which threw my hand into the natural edge. Youser that hurt and I have some major scrapes and bruising to show for it. Thankfully no broken bones. Wish I had seen your video beforehand. Thanks for your insight.
Sorry to hear about your catch. It does sound like you could have a sore hand.
I hope you are catch free from here out.
Thanks for watching,
Gary
Good job brother👍🏽. yes I love my carbide tools. LOL now I know where the experience cutting coming from my friend ☺️. And we are in 80° temperature in LA 😂
Thank you very much! Oh gee thanks it is 80 in LA..way to rub it in! .And I thought you were a pretty good guy LOL Well it has warmed up some here but that is because we are now having rain.
But that is Oregon for you. Up here we don't tan we RUST!
Take care my friend,
Gary
I'm turning wet aspen outside no problem ..inside square carbon or round won't cut using new blades
Strange. Are you cutting on center on the inside?
was hoping to learn the wide and narrow sided radius measurements on the center plug used in the twisted tangent stave bowl.
Thanks, Elliott
I have made two of those videos. Which one are you talking about and I will give you a dimension that will work.
If it is the smaller one I started with 3" on the top and 1" on the bottom. I made adjustments to it while checking how the staves closed up.
That is directly connected to the size of the staves.
Hope that helps and if not leave a comment in the video you are talking about and it might help me explain better.
Gary
What angle do you have the round negative rake scraper ground to? I have a Sorby I want to make into one similar.
I have it ground at 40 degrees on both sides.
Thankyou for this video.
I'll remember it by thinking of the summer temperatures when the air conditioner is on. Outside - high, inside - low
Great idea!
Very interesting a d helpful Thans Gary.Terry downunder
Thanks you Terry and thanks for watching,
Gary
I have a chance to buy a new lathe with stand and extensions( Rockler) it is belt driven for $518 +tax. It will be my first purchase if I do it. ( beginner in turning) is this a good decision, deal , for a lathe. This will be my one n only purchase I’m sure of. I’m just unsure on having to adjust belt back n forth. If you can answer this for me, I would greatly appreciate it. Thank you.
The one I see at Rockler has electronic speed control which I recommend. It is possible it may have belt settings for more power on heavy pieces but that is done done a lot.
Let me know if this is the one and if not give me a link to what you are talking about.
But I would try to avoid one with only belt changes for speed changes.
Even my full sized lathe has two pulleys but the smaller one is for very big heavy pieces so I hardly every change it.
www.rockler.com/rockler-vs-12-24-variable-speed-midi-lathe?country=US&sid=V91117&promo=shopping&PL&gad_source=1&gclid=Cj0KCQjwzZmwBhD8ARIsAH4v1gWA_9hcmLKH1eXEl9v7ZpXndZYoh-Y-gPrd4vnMC0Zh-HSnmgfLvcUaAg98EALw_wcB
@@ThePapa1947 yessir, sorry, forgot to add that. That is the exact one. Manager called it unboxed. $518 with lathe extension, stand and stand extension. Only way he can sell it to me for that price is with the extras. He gonna hold it till Tuesday or unless I call n say I’ll be there Wednesday as I have to go back that way for dr appointment. Regular price for that whole setup would be $1000. I feel like it’s a good deal, just thought I could ask someone who knows more about them than I do. Thank you sir for your help. Your work is amazing by the way. Awesome n enjoy learning from you.
Gary, I wish I had seen this before I tried bowl turning, after doing only pen turning, with my Easy Wood Tools carbide tools. I had to learn it the hard way. I learned you can get some pretty spectacular catches doing it the wrong way, and if you’re doing it really wrong, it’s surprising how far a bowl can go when your catch breaks it out of the chuck. 😉 Thanks for the video, I hopes it saves somebody else from trying the “Trial and Error” method. Cheers, Tom
Thanks Tom and they say learning by experience is a good way to do it. NOT WHEN YOU JUMP OUT OF YOUR BOOTS!
I know plenty have just given up after that missile gets launched and goes through a window, I have a window right in the flight path behind. I worry about some of the big pieces of bark that decide to learn to fly LOL.
Thanks for watching,
Gary
Thanks Gary what a great teacher you are. I don't have any carbide tools yet I use my bowl gouges and scrapers figured if I learn with traditional tools I can get a couple of carbide
Very good thinking Jane, thats the way to go about it!!
Thank you Jane. You are doing it the right way. Gouges are my choice but carbides can come in handy, Also your scrapers will act just like the carbides unless they are negative rake.
Thanks for watching,
Gary
This is very helpful, thank you
Thanks Bill, happy it helped.
Gary
Good video. Do you make your own carbide turning tools or buy them? If so what do you use for the shank portion of the tool? Mild steel or something hardenable? If not, what tool brand do you recommend? Thanks and keep up the great videos.
Thank you Mark and I make the shafts out of 1/X1/2 mild steel. Works fine. The inserts I buy in bulk which gives you about 10 for the price of the "store" brand.
I find it hard to recommend any of the ones sold because the price is very high compared to making them. But I do have the tools to make them.
I do not think it matters that much which shank you use if you do buy it and you can still buy replacement cutters on Amazon or Ebay for a much less price.
Hope that helps,
Gary
Thanks Gary. I have a pretty well equipped shop. Woodworking and metal working tools. In your reply you said that the tool shanks were 1" x 1/2". In the video they look square. Is that supposed to be 1/2" x 1/2"? That is the size I was thinking of using to make my own tools. I agree with you, they are very expensive to buy.
Thank you for the info, this was a really great video!
Thanks so much Salvatore. Happy you enjoyed it.
Take care,
Gary
My first carbide tools showed up today and I watched the lesson video. They sit with them, but yours has been a lot more informative and helpful. Thank you very much.
Thank you Lynda. Just how I learned how to use them. Have never seen a lesson on them. Which kind did you get?
Thanks for watching,
Gary
@@ThePapa1947 it was a very short video showing a bowl being turned. I did learn the differences between the round carbide and the square carbide but they did not show proper holding technique as yours did. I think, knowing the proper tool to use, and how to hold a position them are all very important lessons not just showing what they do which is basically all the video did. Like I said, yours was a lot more helpful to me at least.
I had some severe catches that burnt out my motor ( SOB!). I'm thinking that setting up on ctr is best so I don't have to move the tool rest when going from inside to out or vice versa, What I want to do is somehow mark the post so I have a visual aid as to the height , I'm even thinking that a hose clamp around the post would make it simpler and repetitive! Any suggestions???
or even a score line in the post, then I'd have a visual.
Being right on center should work fine.
For my bowl from a board tool post I use a hose clamp. It is the only thing I use this post for so it is always setup correctly.
For what you are doing you would want all the tools to be the same thickness.
That must have been a serious catch to burn your motor up.
Hope you got it fixed,
Gary
That will work as well!
@@ThePapa1947 couldn't find anyone who repairs motors,I think it's a short in the insulation, I ended up buying another from someone, got a PNR 17-250 which is 3 speed with variable speed knob, do u know anyone who fixes electric motors here in southern NH ????
Gary…. My carbide scrapper tool shaft is round and not square. I have had bad catches with this tool and have no confidence in using it. Does the round shaft make a difference? Bill
Hi Bill, I myself would choose a square over round shaft. If you are using it for general turning
I think the round is going to rotate on you and cause a catch.
The only reason to use a round shaft is if you where shear scraping with mostly the round carbide inserts.
Hope that helps,
Gary
@@ThePapa1947 I agree with your comments… that is why I don’t use it…. No confidence in the tool. Appreciate your feedback. Bill
I'm a beginner and since I don't know what I'm doing this is very helpful. I've not had trouble with catching on the outside but terrible on the inside. Thank you 😊👍
Thank you very much. The geometry of the inside vs. the outside is totally different when it comes to tool placement.
Happy it has helped.
Gary
Thanks for your response. I used all 30 wedges, maybe my jig was 11.85 deg because the plug is 3” tapered to 1” as instructed and the joints are outstanding. Can’t wait to spin it. You are an inspiration, bravo!
Happy it all worked out for you.
Thanks for letting me know.
Gary
Muito obrigado pelas dicas. Foi muito proveitoso. Abraços
Obrigado Carlos! Eu aprecio você assistindo e comentando.
Gary
THANK u gary good sound advice on tools.
Thank you Manjit I appreciate you watching.
Gary
Thanks the information was helpful
Thank you Joann! Happy you enjoyed the video.
Take care,
Gary
This video helped me so much! I made a beautiful bowl with your advice. Thanks so much for posting this, it’s a lifesaver!
Thank you very much. Happy it helped.
Thanks for letting me know and watching.
Gary
Excelente explicación, muchas gracias.
Thank you so much. Happy you enjoyed the video.
Gary
I seem to very rarely get a catch with a carbide tool. I get catches a lot trying to use a bowl gouge on the inside of a piece. Anyone have advice on what I may be doing wrong there?
When cutting on the inside with a gouge make sure you do not let the wing touch the side if it is not supported. Other wise if the bevel of the wing is not in contact with the wood. So you may have the tool rest to high.
Thanks for watching,
Gary
Thanks Gary I really appreciate your feedback
Great information Gary. Really appreciate all the stuff I have learned since I started watching your channel.
Thank you Doug and thanks for watching.
Gary
l am a begined l lean alot watch you thank you
Thank you very much Delbert and thanks for watching,
Gary
Thank you, Gary. I'm a fairly new turner and am trying to figure out angles and positioning of the tools. This helps a lot.
Thank you Michael. Happy you found it helpful.
Take care,
Gary
Great information in here. Thank you.
Thank you Rick and thanks for watching,
Gary
Thank you Sir for the great info.
Thank you Clinton. I appreciate you watching and commenting.
Gary
Thanks Gary - very informative ... the large, exaggerated drawing made it simple and clear why and how catches can occur - nice way of showing this. Loved seeing some of the workplace photos and getting a little glimpse into your turning experience/background.
BTW - it's been about three years since you got the Laguna lathe - a nice follow-up video (review) would be nice. There are a number of "got this lathe and here is what I like/think" videos but not very many of what a good turner thinks a few years after using one thinks of the lathe.
As usual, looking forward to your next video.
Thank you very much. I was not sure how clear I could show how I do it and then thought maybe a drawing would help. I did one in CAD but I think the chalk board was better.
I may have to do a follow up on the lathe. A good fill in for one of the cold days we have been having.
But I will say I have been happy with the lathe.
Take care,
Gary
Thank you Gary for the carbide positioning, it will especially be important turning hollow forms. The small #1 carbides seem nice but I haven’t gotten to practice with it much, i.e., it is difficult to get a smooth cut without little ridges.
Thank you Lee! So my favorite size is the #1 and it is the only one I have not been able to find in bulk. You can buy these in a negative rake style as well. But harder to sharpen. Although I think I will make a fixture for sharpening them.
Thanks for watching,
Gary
Where do you buy your carbide cutters?
I got mine on Amazon. I got 10 for the price of one with the fancy name.
Is it different between carbide and traditional tools? This is the exact opposite from what the wood store told me about tool rest height.
Yes it is different with a traditional tool because with tools like a bowl gouge we drop the handle and run the bevel against the turning. Which is referred to as riding the bevel.
Not sure what the person at the wood store told you or their knowledge but if you are holding the carbide flat to the bed of the lathe and below center on the outside you are going to get a catch.
What I do is from years of experience turning patterns as large as 8 foot in diameter with tools that have the same shape as the carbide cutters.
What I am saying is how I did it at work and if you turned below center on the outside on a 8 foot diameter piece that tool could get ripped out of your hands in a blink.
Not knowing everything the wood store told you I can only go off of what the manufacture of carbide tools says.
Just be careful and practice on smaller diameter pieces till you find what works for you.
Best of luck,
Gary
This is straight from the Easy Wood Tool site:
Unlike high-speed steel tools, you don't need to hold Easy Wood Tools® at any particular angle. Our square bar makes sure that you hold the tool flat on the rest and parallel to the floor, which helps eliminate catches and blow outs.
Thanks for the reply, I can see what you are saying and follow the diagrams you showed. I can see both points of view. The woodshop here said that on the outside if you are below center (slightly) if it catches, the tool will drop away from the wood and not make a huge gouge. On the inside of a bowl if you are slightly above center and the tool catches, it will drop away from the curve of the wood also. Im just not sure now if that advice was for traditional or carbide, or if makes a difference. @@ThePapa1947
I do not want top put down anything they said but if you are below on the outside that tool can be grabbed and give you and damage the tool or worse.
That is called leverage.
This is if the tool is flat to the world.
Just go slow and find what works for you.
I have no idea of his experience but the wood store around here that has Rock in it's name had a big switch over a few years ago and hired people that did not know all that much. Was a bit frustrated till they hired the old manager back.
The other one with Craft in the name was worse.
Do you sell your work online maybe?
No I do not but thanks for your interest.
Gary
Is it possible to use the carbide cutter upside down? My thought is that it might give a more gentle/smoothing cut after the rough.
I doubt you could get it to cut at all. They do make negative rake carbide inserts. They are ground on both sides. They cut much smoother for finishing.
@@ThePapa1947 I actually tried it right after writing this comment. It definitely cuts, and cuts less aggressive than the right way. I do not know if it is similar to a negative rake. I never used a negative rake before.
@@ImprovisedSurvival it would work very similar to the negative rake. Will not cut as much for sure.
I had to learn this the hard way'
Thank you very much. Out of town so sorry about the short response. Thanks for watching.
Gary
Nice simple bowl that looks very nice n thanx for the info buddy.
Thank you and thanks for watching.
Gary
@@ThePapa1947 n that 6'er you turned was awesome.where did you work n do that stuff.
@@exotictones1054 both those pictures were taken in the pattern shops I worked in. I worked in 2. One I served my apprenticeship in and the other I worked in till I retired almost 10 years ago. Both in Portland Oregon.
Very useful - thank you
Thank you Bob and thanks for watching.
Gary
Good info indeed! Easy Wood Tools (carbide) has a vid on use and recommend to cut at centerline or a bit above.
Thank you Robert. For sure at center and a little above is good. Explaining why is more important and seeing the geometry of what is taking place. I have yet to hear anyone speak of the inside because a little above makes no sense to me.
Thanks for watching,
Gary
Gary, yes you are 100% correct. Carbide tools do not cut like traditional bowl gouges but rather scrape thus removing material. They are a breed unto themselves. Me being a retired engineer, I fully understand the geometry of the tool to the material. Thanks for presenting a clear and concise explanation.
Thank you Robert. On the other hand a scraper will actually cut up to the point the burr wears down. That diamond pointed scraper I showed is a cutting fool for a few minutes. You will not get long curly shavings but about everything I used it on was segmented. That was much more stable for the patterns.
For sure you would understand the geometry in doing this. I can appreciate that.
Gary
Very much the video.
Thank you Mike, I appreciate you watching and commenting.
Gary
Thank you it will help a lot
Thank you Dennis and thanks for watching,
Gary
Great informative video
Thank you Vern!
Good info. I've been turning for years with conventional tools. About a month ago, I decided to give "the dark side" a spin (pun not intended) with a Simple Shear Cutting Finisher Tool. I'm not yet convinced that it is "better", but I'm trying to give it a fair shake. I have to admit that I've seen some really nice pieces done with carbide tools. Cheers!
Thank you very much Michael.
When I learned to turn all we really used were scrapers. I learned as an apprentice wood patternmaker.
The scrapers we used were the best way to be able to turn to dimensions on a drawing that had to be exact.
Plus bowl gouges were not a very common thing back then.
The carbide tools are just scrapers on a smaller scale than what I used.
I think there is a place for them for sure and I just call them another tool that I have access to.
Happy turning my friend,
Gary
I have been pen turning for 4 years now using carbide tools only, and i still get catches especially on acrylics, so this information is going to come in really handy for me, Thank you so much, liked and subscribed. best wishes from Nova Scotia.
Thanks Malcolm. Happy it helps
Gary
Thanks for the tutorial on the carbide Gary! I’ve not been using the carbide very long and I’ve been getting catches using them and I’m happy to learn what ya shared, those catches are like 😬, does give some adrenaline rush, but I couldn’t imagine the rush of that Giant piece you showed! Wow!!! That was one heck of a piece! That definitely would give a rush if having a catch on that piece that makes me cringe just thinking about it! That was Awesome to see what ya used to work on, I just couldn’t imagine standing in front of something that size, that took some nerves of steel! Nice job to on the bowl Dave sent ya to finish up, That was a very nice piece also, Enjoyed the video!👍
Thank you Kimsey. It seems strange with that much wood passing by the tool. A lot of power there but I enjoyed it. And those turnings took forever to stop when you shut the machine off to check dimensions. We had long board that well used as a break. You put it against the base of the lathe and then hold it against the wood face plate. That still took awhile and the friction would turn the board black from getting really hot.
I got my share of the large ones. Actually I think I got all the really big ones.
Take care,
Gary
@@ThePapa1947 Kinda like a train trying to stop sounds like! Don’t think I could stand in front of something that large spinning, that took some nerves, getting a catch on a piece like that would be pretty scary for sure 😬😵💫
Well when the boss gives you a drawing and says Make This there is not much choice. But they knew I did not mind and I could do it. I actually loved doing it.
The battens on the back of the large wood face plates were a bit creepy with all the wind and noise coming off them.
It was fun stuff but I am happy being retire LOL.
Very nice discussion on how to use carbide scrapers, Gary. I'm still on the fence regarding them for wood bowls but do use them almost exclusively when I'm doing cast or hybrid blanks. I know you don't do a lot of spindle turning, but how would you position a carbide on a spindle like a pen blank o bottle opener handle?
Thank you Tom. On a spindle I would be right on center or just a little above. Same theory applies.
Thanks for watching,
Gary
Great explanation & the diagram really made it hit home. We use a mix of traditional tools & carbide tools & the more we (wife & I) turn the better we get. Then bam - a catch. Most of the Easy Wood Tool (carbide) information guides indicate tool placement as “slightly” above center. But now I see on the inside, slightly below center is needed & why. Thanks for the good demo. Nice little bowl too.
Thank you Mark. Yes all I have ever seen was on center of slightly above. The geometry tells me is should be slightly below on the inside.
Have fun turning,
Gary
Very good info Papa maybe that diminished SOME of f my fear of them. Still more to lose though. I’d rather fight a bear than stick carbide into spinning wood lol.
Thank you Bobby. You made me laugh on that one. Reminded me of the joke where the guy says...Ok now where is that bear you want me to wrestle...or something like that.
Take care,
Gary
Use carbide tools almost all the time. And had my share of catches and broken bowls due to catches. They are scary and dangerous. This video helps me a lot. Thanks!!! Question. Is the finish you use food safe?
Thank you very much. The only thing they seem to promote it you hold the tool flat which is true. But the geometry of where the tool should be placed in height is very important.
Yes the Acks finish is food safe.
Thanks for the information on how to position the carbide tools, that's what i'm learning with carbide. Just the job thanks Gary. All the best from Lincolnshire UK
Thank you very much Gary. Hope it helps. Nothing wrong using them either. I have never had anyone I gave a bowl to ask me if I used a gouge or a carbide cutter.
Take care,
Gary
Great instruction
Thank you Brad. Happy you enjoyed it.
Take care,
Gary
Great video! I'm glad you did this video because I bought a swanneck carbide tool to do hollow forms. I kept getting catches and couldn't figure out why. So thank you very much for sharing this! Take care and GOD BLESS 🙏!
Thank you Stephen. The swan neck tool is tricky to begin with and if you are off a little it can be nearly impossible.
God bless and take care my friend,
Gary
Very clear explanation. Thanks. There is a place for both traditional and carbide tools. I’ve found carbide works really well for resin and hybrid turning.
Thank you Mark, I do not turn resin but I do see most people use carbides for that. When turning the inside of Black Locust end grain I find it helpful as well. I did one once where I had to stop and go buy one of the small round negative rake carbide cutters to finish it.
Thanks for watching,
Gary
I am a beginning turner and I have a pretty good collection of both traditional and carbide tools. I thought that I could do everything using carbides but I found out very quickly that that wasn't going to work for a lot of things. So I went out and bought a relatively complete set of traditional tools, one at a time. I then discovered that traditional tools have some advantages but I then had to invest as much money and time in sharpening equipment as I have in the lathe and I still am learning a year later. So now, there are days where depending on the wood, the project type, what type of turning it is, and my mental state, one type of tool will work and another just will not. Sometimes I go through 4 or 5 tools to find one that gets done what I want to do at the time. Finally, carbide tools require a certain amount of finesse if one wants a decent finish. So a certain amount of practice is necessary to really get the most out that type of tool. Most of the people in my club are hard core traditional tool type large bowl turners and that is that period. So I am out in the weeds most of the time with these people. I follow your channel and am glad you have some open mindedness about tools and how they are used. Thanks,
Thank you very much. I probably do not fit in that elite group of turners who only use gouges and almost seem like snobs when it comes to carbide. I will use what ever gets the job done and does a good job at the same time.
If you do not have a negative rake scraper I would say get one or convert a standard scraper.
I was told one time that I should not be showing my negative rake scraper and that what I was doing could be done with a bowl gouge if only I knew how to use one. Maybe so but I do not feel it is cheating to use what you have that works.
That said I prefer to do what I can with a gouge.
Thanks for watching and commenting.
Gary
Grumpy, I have been turning for years and I just bought a couple carbide tools and they do have a place. Every tool has its advantages and disadvantages and they all require a certain level of skill to use properly. Wood turning should be an enjoyable hobby so dont let the opinions of others take away that joy. Use what you are comfortable with and then when you feel adventurous, grab a tool that you still struggle with and spend some time just practicing on a piece of wood that doesnt matter. Oh and regards to your comment about spending more on accessories than you spent on the lathe….. well that happens to us all….lol. Best Regards.
By far the easiest way to avoid nasty carbide catches is to buy, practise with, and use traditional tools. Nobody needs carbide tools, they are nothing more than a sales gimmick. Don't be fooled into buying them.
This video was for the people who use carbides to help them not get catches.
Carbides are no different than the scrapers that we used for years. They are just smaller.
As a wood patternmaker scrapers were the tool of choice. For turning to intricate drawings it was the best tool for accuracy.
Thanks, this was really helpful to this newbie. I’m using all carbide in 3 profiles.❤
Thank you for watching and commenting Rand. Have a great time at your lathe. I sure enjoy it.
Take care,
Gary
You explained that really good Gary. The only carbide I use are my scrapers, both round and square.
Preferring the classic tools though, with carbide I don't have a bevel. 😎
Thank you Leo. Most people move on to traditional tools but some stick with carbides. I use the carbides for a few things.
Thanks for watching,
Gary
hello friends greetings healthy and successful always. thank you for sharing knowledge and always faithfully watching your latest stuff I like your ideas amazing knife
Thanks so much and thanks for watching.
Gary
I thoroughly enjoy your videos Gary and I thank you for sharing. Another night when I go to bed less stupid. You asked me to let you know how I got on with the oak plank turned into a bowl: let’s just say it wasn’t a total failure. The glue lines show too much and I think my two year old glue is past its use by date. I have only been turning for two years and your teaching has helped me so much. If had had your name, my numbers would be 1949 🌞
Thank you Ray. Well I bet when you get some new glue and give it another shot you will do much better.
Oh yeah I remember 1949 very well LOL. Actually we were in the 1948 Vanport Oregon flood and the house floated down the river. I only have stories of it and my brother(13 years older)
caring me out. We used to kid about that. We lost him last year but I like passing that story on.
Thanks for watching,
Gary
Im so glad I found this video when I was in high school my shop teacher had me visit the local Pattern shop Ipswich Pattern was the name of it and l almost went to Fitchburg college to learn Pattern making but it didn't happen I chose to be a mechanic instead but never lost my love for woodworking! Seeing that you were a Pattern maker brought back many memories of that shop I became good friends with the owner Jack Sweeney he taught me so much and let me use his WONDERFUL SHOP! on weekends and evenings sadly Jack passed away from cancer I'm so grateful to have him for a friend end his knowledge I also turned a 6 foot tabletop in his shop what a great experience now at 70 I'm still turning mostly live edge bowls and vases thank you for bringing back those memories Happy turning to you Gary from Happy Wood Turnings here in Ducklake Maine!👍
Thank you very much Jon for an absolute wonderful story.
I lived behind a pattern shop as a kid and did not know what they were doing but when I found out I decided I was going to be a pattern maker.
Uncle Sam decided he wanted me for 2 years abut after that I followed my dream.
Thanks for watching,
Gary
I can certainly agree with what you are saying. I was turning a cherry cremation urn and on the inside if I did not have my round carbide cutter absolutely in the right place I would get a catch. And on the outside, as well. So I kept checking where the cutting edge either above or below, or dead center, and with regular gouges as well. Great video. I am hoping to obtain a better scraper eventually. Stay safe!
Thank you Harry. It is good to hear you figured out what was not working. Some just blade the carbide or scrapers.
Thanks for watching,
Gary
Thanks Gary, You showed me something that I have had problems with now I know! I will be trying this in the future.
Thank you Tim. I hope it works great for you. I only go a little past center and showed it as a long way just to make it easier to see.
Thanks for watching,
Gary
Thanks for explaining the way to use the carbide tools. I got some and tried them but was struggling with catches. Ince it warms up here in WY. I'm going to give it a try.
Thank you Suzette! I am sure it is colder there than it is here in Oregon. I think this is a short cold spell we are going to have.
Take care,
Gary
hello and thank you. Just bought my first set of carbide tools. which one do Use to rough wood out,, round, square??
Hi Elizabeth,
I do not use the carbides much but on a real hard wood I will use the round one to do the inside of the turning.
The outside you could use either the round or the square.
The square will rough it out faster
Hope that helps.
Gary
i REALLY like your videos. I learn something or am reminded of good practices from virtually every one of them
Glad you like them Arley and I appreciate you taking time to comment.
Happy New Year,
Gary
Gary, this video is fantastic for me as far as information is concerned on carbide not that I use them much but still invaluable information, I get a few catches with traditional tools so does the same principles apply.
Alan
Thank you Alan. Well to a small degree I would say yes. But we hold the handles lower when using a bowl gouge so the wood passing by is somewhat tangent to the cutting edge. Chances of being below the center line of the bowl seems unlikely.
Seems most catches from a bowl gouges is putting the wing of the tool into the wood without being supported.
Thanks for watching,
Gary
Hi Gary, Great explanation on presentation of carbide tools. Lovely little bowl as well. Take care my friend. Hwyl, Huw
Thank you Huw, this was perfect for a cold weather video. It is 26 right now so not sure when I will start the next one. But my heater will keep me warm enough.
Take care,
Gary
Thank you. It seems so obvious now, but I sure wasn't getting it. This explains a lot of the mistakes I have made.
Thank you very much Jeff. Happy you enjoyed the video and thanks for watching.
Gary
Adding to my comment 9 days ago. Your advice on above centre on outside and below centre on the inside has helped my turning immensely. I have turned a couple of bowls and some spindle items since watching your video, thanks very much.
Thank you Gary that is great to hear! I know it can be frustrating when things work and then they don't. Glad it takes some of the mystery out of those catches.
Have fun,
Gary...from Oregon
A very enjoyable and informative video Gary. I also use carbide tools at times. As you say having the tool rest positioned correctly helps to reduce the risk of a nasty catch. I think some turners may be a little too aggressive and have bad experiences. Oh a 6ft bowl!!! My goodness you could fit a couple of me into it lol.
Thank you Joseph and yes there sure are times a carbide will come in handy, Turning a 6 foot diameter can be a bit strange at first but after the first few cuts it is about the same as a 1 foot diameter. Just a lot more wood passing the tool.
Thanks for watching,
Gary
Thanks Gary! I've had a few catches and I'm sure it's due to the fact that I'm a bit sloppy on centering. Your explanation was excellent and will hopefully help me with carbide and traditional tools. Sorry I'm late...I've been on vacation and I'm trying to catch up! Phil is next...he is a master of natural turnings and it's always a surprise. You are an artist...and your math skills are quite good!
Thank you Max and welcome back from the vacation.
Thanks for watching and commenting.
Gary
Thank you for making this video it was a great help
Regards
Steve London UK
Thank you Steve. Happy you found it useful.
Take care,
Gary
Great explanation, thank you for your knowledge. I feel a bit better about using my carbide tools. 👍👍👍
Thank you Simon. Happy it was helpful.
Take care,
Gary