Honestly, this is the thing that I dread the most. Game announcements then the multi YEAR wait for them to release and that's if they actually release. I'm gonna be dead before another GOOD mmo ever comes out.
Yeah, I mean... that's great. But I could be dead in 5 years. Unless an MMORPG is about 5 *weeks* away, it's very hard for me to care. Too many of these things die on the vine. *Edit* Also, doesn't Ghostcrawler have a reputation as being kind of a giant pretentious asshole?
I mean. The promise rarely meets up with expectation. Some games deserve the early support of adoption but most do not. I no longer buy in early it but wait a year after to see if anything meaningful comes out of it
I think that is a unique trait for us in the MMO market in particular. We were just burned too many times by people/companies/brands using the same buzzwords and then doing the exact same mistakes over and over again.
@@korniestpatchPax DEI had fun alpha and their next alpha is coming out really soon, and this alpha will now focus on combat and exploration and crafting If you expect the first alpha to be something else than what it was meant to then that's your fault
Honestly,at this point, I don’t even know if ashes of creation will deliver. And that’s been the only MMO I’ve been excited for for the past four or five years.
Studies conducted suggest this is the case for most people. Players like to play solo with other players around also playing solo with the occasional group experience.
To me the social focus of old mmos is less about "chatting for hours" and more about needing other people. Classes having their own buffs to offer, etc. That is lost in todays mmo landscape of everyone does everything and CC is removed.
6:41 if it is done like in GW2 it doesn't really matter. GW2 zones feel huge and immersive enough, so even if they're basically instanced it's barely noticable
The industry tought me to get excited about indie devs and prepare for the worst from AAA devs. Joking aside, way to early to talk about. We need to stop talking about games this early and hear about them the first time when they are close to dev complete through a dazzling none scripted gameplay trailer.
One of my favorite MMO experiences was during the original The Division Beta I got ganked by Force in the Dark Zone and he was open mic’ing and I’m like “I know that voice!”
They got bought up.. have to wonder if these guys don’t have or didn’t get some of it somehow or whatever. As it was described almost exactly like crowfsll
The next huge MMO will break the mold...It'll be a massive world that makes Azeroth look small, hardcore leveling, no handholding, grindy and difficult but rewarding, completely not p2w that evolves on the features we know from the genre but at the same time adding new concepts. It'll have deep and complex, crafting, customization and specialization options. You will create your own builds, talents and itemize your character to how you see fit unconfined by class. It will be a min-maxer's dream. Wil this game ever come to us? Probably not.
Agreed. Im tired of MMOs that every warrior is a clone of every other warrior. There is no uniqueness. Its like everyone is on the developer leash. Instead of being able to pick and choose skills that suit your playstyle. Unlimited POSSIBILITIES but LIMITED choice. This idea that "you are THE hero and can learn/do everything" is bullshit. And it ruins the idea of a community. Why talk to another player when i can do everything myself? My only hope is Raph Kosters playable worlds. But he may fuck it up so who knows
A game like that will never be "huge" as most of the oldschool playerbase that would enjoy it do not have the time required to invest in it, meanwhile most younger players who have the time to spend, do not like such complexity. It's a nice dream, but impossible to achieve right now.
WoW managed to have a community before discord or other social hubs were a thing, its not a community issue, gamers are more social and connected than ever now thnx to discord alone, its 100% a game issue
@@BrutalFelix82 So basically you're saying its a community issue despite coming to the opposite conclusion... Let me explain myself. Players don't need WoW social aspect today like they needed it back in 2004 when they weren't connected to anyone easily outside of the game structure. I remember playing only writing in game chat with my friends back in 2006. Now, who would do that in 2024 ? I remember spending in-game time just to chat with guild mates. Or randoms along my adventures. Because players are "more socials and connected than ever", you're not really needing that aspect in your game. Not the way you used to anyway. You're overly solicited outside of thegame. Be it on a social level (discord or social network) or just by the mere fact you got hundred's of new games you can potentially play every week. So as far as i'm concerned, social aspect of mmo's are less and less important to the vast majority of consumers. Gamers evolved. Games evolved. And that endless hunt to reconnect to the "social aspect of mmo's" is truly just a mirage. A mirage that tends to make us say "it's a game issue". When its just a "us" issue. If it's an issue at all : for me it just isn't. We don't play in arcades with pocket money anymore cause you can easily buy a console or pc. We don't "socialize" in games as we used to because we have dozens of other means to do it outside of mmo's. Life goes on.
🔥 Open world mmo Masters of the universe needs to be Created released for Consoles and PC in near future with Vehicle's mechanics and Beast Creature mounts to traverse Open World experience
Remember Ashes of Creation, Star Citizen, Blue Protocol, Throne and Liberty, Dark Age of Camelot 2, project BBQ, and many others have all past their original projected release dates. Some by a year or so and a couple by almost a decade now. So don't get too excited.
Same with the riot MMO, same with ashes of creation, and it’ll be the same with this. Minimum 8 year development time. To have a fully, fleshed out experience. So we’ll come back to this around 2032.
I liked the lack of loading screens, but I never felt like WoW was cohesive. Going from Stranglethorn to Duskwood, for example, was jarring AF. It was a complete tonal change in only a few steps. Most other zones were the same. You could literally see where the texture sets swapped a lot of times.
Definitely agree about the semi-seamless, open world of WoW. I have some more linear MMO's that I have put more time in then WoW, yet I prefer a large open world with a large player count. Some come close to those to criteria, but few. I just wish there was an MMO that checked those boxes with newer graphics and not WoW (great game, but over it).
Anything involving netease is an instant no. They are known for their hands on approach when it comes to monetisation, they are behind diablo immortal for example. So I have no hope whatsoever that this will be an mmo that you can play without shwiping.
It's really refreshing to hear the plan of this project is to bring back social elements. I know it won't be out for quite a while, but it's nice to see more and more MMOs focus on social elements. I am exhausted of the lack of communities in MMOs. Hoping the combat will be good as well.
I do remember this Dev. He is personally responsible for the MMR based matchmaking system in StarCraft, League of Legends, Hots, wow arena, and really every other blizzard and Riot game with matchmaking. It was a horrible system at blizzard, he then leveraged that he created it to bring it to Riot and ruined matchmaking there. He is a prime example of how people have failed upward in the development world by creating systems that don't work then leveraging a really good bullet point on a resume that gaslights the next company into hiring him and then ruining their project. If this new project is good, awesome, i am a gamer and love to play good games. The issue is that he has been personally responsible for many of the "bad" systems in todays matchmaking games and beyond. I can appreciate that people like to feel that Devs communicate with them, i am just at the point where i am results based and not into the cult of personalities. Also the absolute ego of doing a photo shoot with your team sitting in gold thrones in a cathedral like background tells me this project is about personal ego and not about creating a good game. I will be happily surprised and wrong if this project goes well.
Those posts used to drive me crazy, pretty much all of them said "We want to achieve X, so we're making changes that will achieve the exact opposite of X" Along with all the weird acting as if the numbers had a life of their own and they couldn't just y'know...change them.
@@yashA.456 Hidden MMR matchmaking, although in starcraft i don't believe the MMR isn't hidden and instead displayed. I think they started hiding it because people hate the system, it works much better in starcraft when you are 1 v 1. In games where you have a team the personal MMR is averaged among all the team players which is taken into account for the game. This means that you can have, and often do, one player with a very large MMR and then four other players with very low MMR creating a situation where the one player has to play 6x times better than any other team mate in order to win the game. The game says it is a balanced match because the total MMR between all players on both sides is equal but the individual skill is not. But, i am not a Dev, i just know Ghost Crawler is personally responsible for creating the system and was what got him hired at riot. He is the godfather of the MMR system.
I love action combat the most simply because I enjoy aiming directly at a target or even having to lead the target to hit them.. I just like the fact that it builds your skills further in aiming. With tab and soft lock, you literally just aim in the direction and click which person is boring to me but I can still do hybrid soft lock like guild wars 2, even though I would absolutely prefer if they had an action mode and a tab mode instead of hybrid.. it would give an advantage to people who use tab or soft lock targeting cause they always hit.. that in itself is the problem to me because it takes no skill to actually hit something or someone. Also they rarely have dodge mechanics and even if they don't actually hit you you still take damage as if they did up close. I think that's ridiculous but if it's all I've got to work with like guild wars 2 then I will, but action is more fun in my opinion and yes it takes more skill but that's what makes it more fun to me. The personal opinion and I know others don't agree with it, but that's okay because to each their own. I'll still probably play it either way lol..
A lot of people's problem with Greg Street at the time came from the overall fact that WoW was becoming more and more hardcore. I very much doubt Greg had a hand in starting that vision but he definitely perpetrated it. There is also the normal animosity from specific specs not liking how they are being balanced. Even if he had nothing to do with it. He became the face of the game at the time. So he was blamed for a wide range of things that wasn't really his fault. It didn't help that he was already working on a controversial expansion just from the jump. In retrospect, most people highly praise him for all the best parts of MoP and he is largely the reason why people look on MoP fondly now. People also really liked how open he was about changes and direction. Which is very similar to how the current SoD devs. They aren't perfect and people might not like what they are doing but at least they are honest about it. Only downside is they really need to let the guy just talk on the forums lol. It's very odd to hear about class balance changes from someone's twitter replies.
Social Aspects in MMOS shouldn't be about chatting for hours, it should be what benefit you bring to the MMO you joined. Like a world buff you do for everyone etc
Solo play in MMO's is better in many ways. - no commitment - no harassment - no drama - no waiting - no burden from logistics etc. But it being a MMO means - you're around other people - the world feels more alive (where applicable) - multiplay options are available etc.
For me, the reason why I don't do as much social activites in mmos anymore or atleast not as much as back in the day is simple: I don't have nor want to spend hours upon hours just trying to get something going. I remember spending hours trying to get a group together to do dungeons/raids, or other content that required a group of people. I would spend upwards of 8 or more hours a day "playing" the game where as a chunk of that playing time was standing around in chat saying things like, "Lfm Healer" Or Lfg dps" waiting until it was full and then hoping, praying it goes smoothly and we don't wipe endlessly. Now and days, I just don't want to do that.
I really wonder if we will ever get a hit-MMORPG like WoW or FF14 again. I mean, obviously it can not be EXACTLY like it was all those years ago (in WoW terms), but maybe at some time an excellent mmorpg comes along that is not just a cash grab or is simply bad by design. a man can dream.
I keep wishing that someone would build an MMO that the world is and characters are, all based around a Steampunk game. One where mages use guns to fire spells, and warriors that maybe use exoskeletons or maybe a full mech suit. But a world that’s built something like that. Tera had absolutely the best action combat.
Back when Ghostcrawler "left" Riot I had the strong feeling after reading about it he didn't really leave for personal reasons as he said, it was more a case Riot allowed him to leave on his own terms to save face since his vision for the Riot MMO was just the same old MMO with a Riot coat of paint. Basically WoW in Runeterra. Greg may have been ok at his job with Blizzard, although I disagree with Force a little about him being well liked by the community (he was very divisive), but that doesn't mean a systems designer can be lead dev for an entire MMO. I think Riot felt he wasn't the right guy and, love em or hate em, Riot doesn't do things half-ass or lazily. They want to push the genre forward and really make a splash like WoW did in 2004 and they DO NOT want to rehash MMO tropes. They want to innovate and that's why they let him leave instead of straight up firing him. Basically I'll keep an open mind about this MMO but the Netease association gives me pause and Greg's history as well. Also "bringing back the social aspects of MMOs" has been a common refrain by the older generation of devs and gamers, of which I am one, but those days I think are gone. It's not 1999 or even 2004 anymore where being online and chatting to people in a game isn't a novel thing anymore. I think you should try to add as much natural and organic player interaction without trying to cling to things that worked 20 yrs ago.
As nice as it is to socialize, there's better places for such an activity. Personally I don't play games to talk about matters not related to the game in question. Not too fussed about MMOs. In the past I've had mixed experience with them. My two worst experience with them being locked out of content because I couldn't be part of a group big enough, or skilled enough to accomplish that, or being locked out of content because I never get the gear that would make it possible to even parttake in such content. Some incredibley dumb features include time gated events so my personal life had to revolve around the game's timing schedule, inability to co-op all content, excessive grinding same content for gear, wild changes to classes, and forced PvP. With the given thing that companies love to do, I think it's smarter to wait and see what others have to say, and show about the game. At most, drop it onto my watch list, and come back to it a few months after it's been fully released. 6:29 WoW never felt cohesive to me. geologically speaking it made no sense as to how each zone was a different weathered/temperature biome. It was very much unnatural.
I think I might just be done chasing the dragon, man. No MMO has ever recreated that original experience I had with vanilla WoW/TBC. What I've discovered in my years is that there's only one game in any specific genre that blows my mind and then nothing ever comes close ever again. I end up spiraling, trying every game in said genre only for nothing to ever hit the same. Ever. Ocarina of Time was that game for Action-Adventure. WoW was that game for MMO's. Halo CE was that game for FPS games. The Last of Us was that game for narrative based survival-horror. RUST was that game for survival-crafting.
I love chatting in games, but it really depends on the community. I've had some fun talks in FFXIV during fishing, hanging in the cities and even raids. In WoW though it's a much bigger mixed bag, which also includes some very toxic people. If they want to bring back the 'social' in MMOs they really need to encourage positivity in the community first and foremost I think.
Most of the games revolve around time limits of everything. In games need to have more Nostalgic questing rewards or finding an Epic in Caches like Last Epoch with exalted pieces more Potent stats or Fusing Legendary stats either Stamina/Int. Or Spellpower. World of Warcraft truly just needs Remade merged with Conquest classes but I'm sure they are close and keep it's Vanilla roots but better daily rewards.
this has been in development since before Overwatch, and this was formerly the MMO Riot was working on, which we had a bit of info on about 6 months to a year ago.
Considering I am playing City of Heroes and Dark age of Camelot rn instead of any "modern" MMO's, I think says a lot. The problem is that with modern MMO's you don't really need other players the same way and servers are so large that people are pretty much anonymous. In old MMO's you basically got to know most of the active player base, because the servers weren't massive. This means that if you get known as an asshat, you can kiss that character goodbye, because you will not be allowed into any groups with people who know you are indeed an asshat. Modern MMO's are just too filled with toxic kids.
It's certainly going to be interesting to follow how they plan to resocialize MMOs in a manner that doesn't come across as cumbersome in todays MMO market.
Game development used to be about making good games, now it seems to be how long can we string people along and keep the game in endless development. The games either get canceled or bomb on release, and then everyone scatters to find a new studio to repeat the cycle. The last decent MMO I played was Black Desert in like 2016.
Hmmm...yeah I'll get interested when people outside the studio get their hands on it. I just find it hard to get excited about "yet another MMO release" these days because so many of them just get delayed until the end of time or just canceled. Blue Protocol has taken SO long to come out I dunno if I even care about it anymore tbh. Rather just wait for more Granblue Fantasy Relink content.
I always love how you find games I have never heard of! I will definitely wait until something is officially announced! I will wait to buy the game not until it is fully released & not in a pre-alpha or beta version! Thank you of the vid! Well done, keep up the good work!
12:20 Regarding the combat system, next MMO should have something like in ER/MH combat. So it is quite skill based and you can build your favorite playstyle around single weapon and all weapons (hundreds of them like in ER) are viable. Easy to learn, difficult to master game. We should know that years we spend in that game translate to our skill improvement and not just level and new set of clothes. Ah, and like in ER, you can lock or not, up to you.
I'm always glad new ambitious mmo's are in development cause it means the dream is still alive. But at the same time, hearing about it now doesn't really mean much of anything. Remind me once an official open beta is coming.
I think the way people MMO is different these days. We used to play give all our time to 1 game, but now players all their time to many different games.
EVERY developer says they are going to bring the 'social element' back to MMOs, but there's a reason that none of them do it: people don't want that anymore. The MMO genre we grew up with and love is gone, and we need to just accept that and move on.
its cuz they use the old framework and do it top down. Mmo's should focus on second to second gameplay instead of the endless endgame raid player housing promise type beat.
Ppl don't want MMO's. They want amazing SP games with a strong social/community aspect attached to it. Look at Dragon's Dogma 2. The game is SP, but because of the Pawn system, we all feel connected with eachother without suffering the bottlenecks of an MMO.
11:40 happy you say this Force 👌 It is true, if combat is borring nothing els matters, people will quit, the only reason BDO still have a large player base is because of the action combat its really amazing, dont do old tab targeting slow poke turn based combat, only reason i think Ashes of Creation will fail is because they choose wows slow borring tab targeting combat, no one wants that, its outdated. Edit: Why is no one taking the best part of BDO and put into their games?? The combat in BDO is amazing 😍
Early concepts of this game are more interesting than the 90% mmotrash that is here or comming out. I really do love the combat in wow and gw1 and 2, so i like more tab targeting than action combat.
Yeah. The problem is that it's the only real way to get the word out and build hype which also helps motivate talent and investors to join the project.
your stand on how you play MMO is the same as mine, LOL, after more than a decade of playing MMO, i shifted to survival games i can play solo or coop, and when i play MMO on rare occasions, i dislike socializing too much or getting stucked with players who would like to wait for their friends to come online for hours on end. i appreciate random matching and fast runs , hard grind and log out for the day . o geez age is really catching up, it's unlike the olden days when we still have so much time to go idle online and spend time chatting or getting killed on dungeon runs for chatting and bickering like crazy LOL
I will play it if it has controller support. 33 years old and 15 years in the Army, my body can't handle being hunched over a mouse and keyboard anymore 😅
how can anyone still be excited with anything Greg Street makes? everything the guys touches dies, i am so confused how he STILL has a career in this industry, it is absolutely baffling
i am physically unable to be excited anymore for these games that never release, get cancelled or the release after lots of years is nowhere near what you expected...
I started MMOs with Ultima Online back in '99. I was a closed beta tester for DAOC and WoW. In DAOC and WoW I very rarely grouped with more than 1 or 2 friends. I mainly solo' d my WoW 'toon to 60 and even helped found the first lv60 guild on my server. Then, as soon as the raiding in big groups started I quit. It was less fun than a root canal. Now I'm older I dislike people even more than I did back then so any MMO that wants to bring back thd community side is a hard nope from me 😂
Holy crap, it's good to know he's still kicking around! Yeah I'm definitely one of the 'collaborate out in open world' gang too. I have too much on my plate to deal with guild politics and trying to run organised raids these days... Way, WAY too busy for that nonsense. I've been burned by too many guilds, I'm just not interested. I LOVE running with randoms, or cool people I've bumped into in random map events for a finder style dungeon though. FFXIV did the social aspect well - especially with the situational companions if you *can't* find someone to run with.
Seems like a great idea but essentially building 3 MMO's into 1 game will be too ambitious is my guess. They should focus on 1 shard at a time and release the others later. I'd rather have a well polished blue shard than 3 sharts
The 'basic' idea of the game and what they want to do seems like a big stretch. They basically want to do everything, going from themepark mmo to assassination type gameplay. Sounds like a huge scope to me, and a huge hassle to get somewhat balanced.
Be sure to check back in 5 years for updates on the Beta.
Honestly, this is the thing that I dread the most. Game announcements then the multi YEAR wait for them to release and that's if they actually release. I'm gonna be dead before another GOOD mmo ever comes out.
Ghost of a chance! ;)
😂
Yeah, I mean... that's great. But I could be dead in 5 years. Unless an MMORPG is about 5 *weeks* away, it's very hard for me to care. Too many of these things die on the vine.
*Edit* Also, doesn't Ghostcrawler have a reputation as being kind of a giant pretentious asshole?
There is a chance that we will play new Eldar Scroll by then 😂
Don’t get excited till practically release day.
for any AAA ever
True
WE GETTING PTSD WITH THIS ONE 🔥🔥🔥🔥
3-4 days after once you can actually login
I mean. The promise rarely meets up with expectation. Some games deserve the early support of adoption but most do not. I no longer buy in early it but wait a year after to see if anything meaningful comes out of it
Truly strange times, when hearing about AAA game makes you rather skeptical instead of excited.
I think that is a unique trait for us in the MMO market in particular.
We were just burned too many times by people/companies/brands using the same buzzwords and then doing the exact same mistakes over and over again.
People have been saying this for ages nothing new
Remember when Blue Protocol and Throne and Liberty were the new MMOs to be excited for?
And pax dei 🤣 and quinfall
Man i was in love with Blue Protocol this shit makes me sad
Yeah where the hell they go
@@korniestpatchPax DEI had fun alpha and their next alpha is coming out really soon, and this alpha will now focus on combat and exploration and crafting
If you expect the first alpha to be something else than what it was meant to then that's your fault
Honestly,at this point, I don’t even know if ashes of creation will deliver. And that’s been the only MMO I’ve been excited for for the past four or five years.
"Triple AAA" doesnt mean anything rn until release
"AAAA" is the new shit on the block
I'm already working on AAAAA game, stay tuned
Triple AAA seems to refer to price, rather than quality.
If anything with how bad AAA games have been it's a disadvantage to have the AAA badge applied to your game now lol
They should call them "Aaahhhhhhhh!" games, cause that's what you wanna scream when they come out 😂
Six months from now; *NEW MMO Ghost Is A Broken Mess Even Before Release!*
😂😢
More like 5 years from now, but ya. This is the way.
But aren't all games supposed to be broken before release?
I play mmos to be solo. I like seeing everyone and their gear. I like to randomly help someone in the open fields or get help.
Studies conducted suggest this is the case for most people. Players like to play solo with other players around also playing solo with the occasional group experience.
To me the social focus of old mmos is less about "chatting for hours" and more about needing other people. Classes having their own buffs to offer, etc. That is lost in todays mmo landscape of everyone does everything and CC is removed.
6:41 if it is done like in GW2 it doesn't really matter. GW2 zones feel huge and immersive enough, so even if they're basically instanced it's barely noticable
Sounds interesting, can't wait to play it in about 10 years!
Can't wait to hear it's scrapped and they're changing direction in 6 years
Yeah in 10 years maybe you'll play another video of them showing how the alpha content WILL be
ey in 10 years we might have a closed beta for ashes of creation too , big times !
@@Cocoyasui Funny, Star Citizen announced some time ago that they are "almost" ready to go out from pre-alpha testing... xD
Can't wait for videos to come out saying how it all went wrong.
The industry tought me to get excited about indie devs and prepare for the worst from AAA devs.
Joking aside, way to early to talk about. We need to stop talking about games this early and hear about them the first time when they are close to dev complete through a dazzling none scripted gameplay trailer.
One of my favorite MMO experiences was during the original The Division Beta I got ganked by Force in the Dark Zone and he was open mic’ing and I’m like “I know that voice!”
This just sounds like Crowfall, and I remember how that bombed
They got bought up.. have to wonder if these guys don’t have or didn’t get some of it somehow or whatever. As it was described almost exactly like crowfsll
dont get excited people, dont be dumb
bring on the playable crab races, we all know everything eventually evolves into a crab.
That'd be based
Crab people.... Crab people
Me playing Crab Game on Steam late at night: 🗿 🗿
@@JayBigDadyCy all voiced by John Rhys-Davies
Ghost: A new mmo to be played for a week
“Shards” are just instanced areas.
I sharded
Ok, so check back in in 7 years
The next huge MMO will break the mold...It'll be a massive world that makes Azeroth look small, hardcore leveling, no handholding, grindy and difficult but rewarding, completely not p2w that evolves on the features we know from the genre but at the same time adding new concepts. It'll have deep and complex, crafting, customization and specialization options. You will create your own builds, talents and itemize your character to how you see fit unconfined by class. It will be a min-maxer's dream. Wil this game ever come to us? Probably not.
Agreed. Im tired of MMOs that every warrior is a clone of every other warrior. There is no uniqueness. Its like everyone is on the developer leash. Instead of being able to pick and choose skills that suit your playstyle. Unlimited POSSIBILITIES but LIMITED choice. This idea that "you are THE hero and can learn/do everything" is bullshit. And it ruins the idea of a community. Why talk to another player when i can do everything myself?
My only hope is Raph Kosters playable worlds. But he may fuck it up so who knows
A game like that will never be "huge" as most of the oldschool playerbase that would enjoy it do not have the time required to invest in it, meanwhile most younger players who have the time to spend, do not like such complexity. It's a nice dream, but impossible to achieve right now.
I loved Wildstar combat. S tier
DDO is the one MMo that has great community
Alrighty, see you in 2030 for the beta
Honestly I kinda feel the lack of good social construct in mmo's isn't really a game issue and is more of a community issue
WoW managed to have a community before discord or other social hubs were a thing, its not a community issue, gamers are more social and connected than ever now thnx to discord alone, its 100% a game issue
@@BrutalFelix82 So basically you're saying its a community issue despite coming to the opposite conclusion... Let me explain myself.
Players don't need WoW social aspect today like they needed it back in 2004 when they weren't connected to anyone easily outside of the game structure. I remember playing only writing in game chat with my friends back in 2006. Now, who would do that in 2024 ? I remember spending in-game time just to chat with guild mates. Or randoms along my adventures.
Because players are "more socials and connected than ever", you're not really needing that aspect in your game. Not the way you used to anyway. You're overly solicited outside of thegame. Be it on a social level (discord or social network) or just by the mere fact you got hundred's of new games you can potentially play every week. So as far as i'm concerned, social aspect of mmo's are less and less important to the vast majority of consumers. Gamers evolved. Games evolved. And that endless hunt to reconnect to the "social aspect of mmo's" is truly just a mirage.
A mirage that tends to make us say "it's a game issue". When its just a "us" issue. If it's an issue at all : for me it just isn't. We don't play in arcades with pocket money anymore cause you can easily buy a console or pc. We don't "socialize" in games as we used to because we have dozens of other means to do it outside of mmo's.
Life goes on.
🔥 Open world mmo Masters of the universe needs to be Created released for Consoles and PC in near future with Vehicle's mechanics and Beast Creature mounts to traverse Open World experience
Remember Ashes of Creation, Star Citizen, Blue Protocol, Throne and Liberty, Dark Age of Camelot 2, project BBQ, and many others have all past their original projected release dates. Some by a year or so and a couple by almost a decade now. So don't get too excited.
Same with the riot MMO, same with ashes of creation, and it’ll be the same with this. Minimum 8 year development time. To have a fully, fleshed out experience. So we’ll come back to this around 2032.
Any game studio with Fantastic in the name, makes me terrified.
I liked the lack of loading screens, but I never felt like WoW was cohesive. Going from Stranglethorn to Duskwood, for example, was jarring AF. It was a complete tonal change in only a few steps. Most other zones were the same. You could literally see where the texture sets swapped a lot of times.
Definitely agree about the semi-seamless, open world of WoW. I have some more linear MMO's that I have put more time in then WoW, yet I prefer a large open world with a large player count. Some come close to those to criteria, but few. I just wish there was an MMO that checked those boxes with newer graphics and not WoW (great game, but over it).
If i had a dollar for every mmo i should be excited for, and never ended up releasing or was a shitshow, id have like, 100 dollars
Anything involving netease is an instant no. They are known for their hands on approach when it comes to monetisation, they are behind diablo immortal for example. So I have no hope whatsoever that this will be an mmo that you can play without shwiping.
It's really refreshing to hear the plan of this project is to bring back social elements. I know it won't be out for quite a while, but it's nice to see more and more MMOs focus on social elements. I am exhausted of the lack of communities in MMOs. Hoping the combat will be good as well.
So Ghost Craweler named an entire project after HIMSELF? I mean c'mon!
The concept sounds cool! I can't wait to ask my grandchildren if the game is actually good or not
I do remember this Dev. He is personally responsible for the MMR based matchmaking system in StarCraft, League of Legends, Hots, wow arena, and really every other blizzard and Riot game with matchmaking. It was a horrible system at blizzard, he then leveraged that he created it to bring it to Riot and ruined matchmaking there. He is a prime example of how people have failed upward in the development world by creating systems that don't work then leveraging a really good bullet point on a resume that gaslights the next company into hiring him and then ruining their project.
If this new project is good, awesome, i am a gamer and love to play good games. The issue is that he has been personally responsible for many of the "bad" systems in todays matchmaking games and beyond. I can appreciate that people like to feel that Devs communicate with them, i am just at the point where i am results based and not into the cult of personalities.
Also the absolute ego of doing a photo shoot with your team sitting in gold thrones in a cathedral like background tells me this project is about personal ego and not about creating a good game. I will be happily surprised and wrong if this project goes well.
💯
Those posts used to drive me crazy, pretty much all of them said "We want to achieve X, so we're making changes that will achieve the exact opposite of X" Along with all the weird acting as if the numbers had a life of their own and they couldn't just y'know...change them.
@@yashA.456 Hidden MMR matchmaking, although in starcraft i don't believe the MMR isn't hidden and instead displayed. I think they started hiding it because people hate the system, it works much better in starcraft when you are 1 v 1. In games where you have a team the personal MMR is averaged among all the team players which is taken into account for the game. This means that you can have, and often do, one player with a very large MMR and then four other players with very low MMR creating a situation where the one player has to play 6x times better than any other team mate in order to win the game. The game says it is a balanced match because the total MMR between all players on both sides is equal but the individual skill is not. But, i am not a Dev, i just know Ghost Crawler is personally responsible for creating the system and was what got him hired at riot. He is the godfather of the MMR system.
I love action combat the most simply because I enjoy aiming directly at a target or even having to lead the target to hit them.. I just like the fact that it builds your skills further in aiming. With tab and soft lock, you literally just aim in the direction and click which person is boring to me but I can still do hybrid soft lock like guild wars 2, even though I would absolutely prefer if they had an action mode and a tab mode instead of hybrid.. it would give an advantage to people who use tab or soft lock targeting cause they always hit.. that in itself is the problem to me because it takes no skill to actually hit something or someone. Also they rarely have dodge mechanics and even if they don't actually hit you you still take damage as if they did up close. I think that's ridiculous but if it's all I've got to work with like guild wars 2 then I will, but action is more fun in my opinion and yes it takes more skill but that's what makes it more fun to me. The personal opinion and I know others don't agree with it, but that's okay because to each their own. I'll still probably play it either way lol..
A lot of people's problem with Greg Street at the time came from the overall fact that WoW was becoming more and more hardcore. I very much doubt Greg had a hand in starting that vision but he definitely perpetrated it. There is also the normal animosity from specific specs not liking how they are being balanced. Even if he had nothing to do with it. He became the face of the game at the time. So he was blamed for a wide range of things that wasn't really his fault. It didn't help that he was already working on a controversial expansion just from the jump.
In retrospect, most people highly praise him for all the best parts of MoP and he is largely the reason why people look on MoP fondly now. People also really liked how open he was about changes and direction. Which is very similar to how the current SoD devs. They aren't perfect and people might not like what they are doing but at least they are honest about it. Only downside is they really need to let the guy just talk on the forums lol. It's very odd to hear about class balance changes from someone's twitter replies.
Social Aspects in MMOS shouldn't be about chatting for hours, it should be what benefit you bring to the MMO you joined. Like a world buff you do for everyone etc
Solo play in MMO's is better in many ways.
- no commitment
- no harassment
- no drama
- no waiting
- no burden from logistics
etc.
But it being a MMO means
- you're around other people
- the world feels more alive (where applicable)
- multiplay options are available
etc.
Recently found studio "fantastic...."
days are ready go beyond
For me, the reason why I don't do as much social activites in mmos anymore or atleast not as much as back in the day is simple: I don't have nor want to spend hours upon hours just trying to get something going. I remember spending hours trying to get a group together to do dungeons/raids, or other content that required a group of people. I would spend upwards of 8 or more hours a day "playing" the game where as a chunk of that playing time was standing around in chat saying things like, "Lfm Healer" Or Lfg dps" waiting until it was full and then hoping, praying it goes smoothly and we don't wipe endlessly.
Now and days, I just don't want to do that.
I really wonder if we will ever get a hit-MMORPG like WoW or FF14 again.
I mean, obviously it can not be EXACTLY like it was all those years ago (in WoW terms), but maybe at some time an excellent mmorpg comes along that is not just a cash grab or is simply bad by design.
a man can dream.
No, as an MMORPG is both a bad MMO and a bad RPG.
Force.. please stop feeding the hype machine, it's destroying gaming.
I keep wishing that someone would build an MMO that the world is and characters are, all based around a Steampunk game. One where mages use guns to fire spells, and warriors that maybe use exoskeletons or maybe a full mech suit. But a world that’s built something like that.
Tera had absolutely the best action combat.
Back when Ghostcrawler "left" Riot I had the strong feeling after reading about it he didn't really leave for personal reasons as he said, it was more a case Riot allowed him to leave on his own terms to save face since his vision for the Riot MMO was just the same old MMO with a Riot coat of paint. Basically WoW in Runeterra.
Greg may have been ok at his job with Blizzard, although I disagree with Force a little about him being well liked by the community (he was very divisive), but that doesn't mean a systems designer can be lead dev for an entire MMO. I think Riot felt he wasn't the right guy and, love em or hate em, Riot doesn't do things half-ass or lazily. They want to push the genre forward and really make a splash like WoW did in 2004 and they DO NOT want to rehash MMO tropes. They want to innovate and that's why they let him leave instead of straight up firing him.
Basically I'll keep an open mind about this MMO but the Netease association gives me pause and Greg's history as well. Also "bringing back the social aspects of MMOs" has been a common refrain by the older generation of devs and gamers, of which I am one, but those days I think are gone. It's not 1999 or even 2004 anymore where being online and chatting to people in a game isn't a novel thing anymore. I think you should try to add as much natural and organic player interaction without trying to cling to things that worked 20 yrs ago.
Really interesting! Given that we're in sketch and concept art phase though, expect 5-10 years before we'll get our hands on anything.
As nice as it is to socialize, there's better places for such an activity. Personally I don't play games to talk about matters not related to the game in question.
Not too fussed about MMOs. In the past I've had mixed experience with them. My two worst experience with them being locked out of content because I couldn't be part of a group big enough, or skilled enough to accomplish that, or being locked out of content because I never get the gear that would make it possible to even parttake in such content.
Some incredibley dumb features include time gated events so my personal life had to revolve around the game's timing schedule, inability to co-op all content, excessive grinding same content for gear, wild changes to classes, and forced PvP.
With the given thing that companies love to do, I think it's smarter to wait and see what others have to say, and show about the game. At most, drop it onto my watch list, and come back to it a few months after it's been fully released.
6:29 WoW never felt cohesive to me. geologically speaking it made no sense as to how each zone was a different weathered/temperature biome. It was very much unnatural.
I think I might just be done chasing the dragon, man. No MMO has ever recreated that original experience I had with vanilla WoW/TBC.
What I've discovered in my years is that there's only one game in any specific genre that blows my mind and then nothing ever comes close ever again. I end up spiraling, trying every game in said genre only for nothing to ever hit the same. Ever.
Ocarina of Time was that game for Action-Adventure.
WoW was that game for MMO's.
Halo CE was that game for FPS games.
The Last of Us was that game for narrative based survival-horror.
RUST was that game for survival-crafting.
I love chatting in games, but it really depends on the community. I've had some fun talks in FFXIV during fishing, hanging in the cities and even raids. In WoW though it's a much bigger mixed bag, which also includes some very toxic people. If they want to bring back the 'social' in MMOs they really need to encourage positivity in the community first and foremost I think.
Most of the games revolve around time limits of everything. In games need to have more Nostalgic questing rewards or finding an Epic in Caches like Last Epoch with exalted pieces more Potent stats or Fusing Legendary stats either Stamina/Int. Or Spellpower. World of Warcraft truly just needs Remade merged with Conquest classes but I'm sure they are close and keep it's Vanilla roots but better daily rewards.
this has been in development since before Overwatch, and this was formerly the MMO Riot was working on, which we had a bit of info on about 6 months to a year ago.
Promising the moon on a stick and saying it'll be sooner than we'd expect sets off a lot of warning bells.
Considering I am playing City of Heroes and Dark age of Camelot rn instead of any "modern" MMO's, I think says a lot. The problem is that with modern MMO's you don't really need other players the same way and servers are so large that people are pretty much anonymous. In old MMO's you basically got to know most of the active player base, because the servers weren't massive.
This means that if you get known as an asshat, you can kiss that character goodbye, because you will not be allowed into any groups with people who know you are indeed an asshat.
Modern MMO's are just too filled with toxic kids.
This is why I keep playing Guild Wars 2 because you can stay solo but join group events and other things without actually needing to join a group.
It's certainly going to be interesting to follow how they plan to resocialize MMOs in a manner that doesn't come across as cumbersome in todays MMO market.
Game development used to be about making good games, now it seems to be how long can we string people along and keep the game in endless development. The games either get canceled or bomb on release, and then everyone scatters to find a new studio to repeat the cycle. The last decent MMO I played was Black Desert in like 2016.
asking us to get excited pretty much means trying to get our hopes up
Hey, lets bring back the social aspect mmorpg used to have...hey lets fragment the player base into little shard isles for them to explore 🙃
4:10 I agree with you, except if some situation like the good old barrens chat would emerge somehow, man I miss that chat
I can only say that they need to have a huge focus on Lore and make sure the gameplay is solid
Hmmm...yeah I'll get interested when people outside the studio get their hands on it. I just find it hard to get excited about "yet another MMO release" these days because so many of them just get delayed until the end of time or just canceled.
Blue Protocol has taken SO long to come out I dunno if I even care about it anymore tbh. Rather just wait for more Granblue Fantasy Relink content.
Looking forward to see what happens with this game. Great video explaining everything.
I always love how you find games I have never heard of! I will definitely wait until something is officially announced! I will wait to buy the game not until it is fully released & not in a pre-alpha or beta version! Thank you of the vid! Well done, keep up the good work!
12:20 Regarding the combat system, next MMO should have something like in ER/MH combat. So it is quite skill based and you can build your favorite playstyle around single weapon and all weapons (hundreds of them like in ER) are viable. Easy to learn, difficult to master game. We should know that years we spend in that game translate to our skill improvement and not just level and new set of clothes.
Ah, and like in ER, you can lock or not, up to you.
soft lock not bad but when your crosshair isnt even near the body a bow should not hit. I think Full action is the best though.
I would love an MMO with a much larger focus on open world content and less instanced stuff to queue for.
I'm always glad new ambitious mmo's are in development cause it means the dream is still alive. But at the same time, hearing about it now doesn't really mean much of anything.
Remind me once an official open beta is coming.
I hear netease and immediately right it off 🤷♂️
I think the way people MMO is different these days. We used to play give all our time to 1 game, but now players all their time to many different games.
Class with a big ass greatsword, borderline edgy size, holding it on one shoulder and I'm in.
EVERY developer says they are going to bring the 'social element' back to MMOs, but there's a reason that none of them do it: people don't want that anymore.
The MMO genre we grew up with and love is gone, and we need to just accept that and move on.
its cuz they use the old framework and do it top down. Mmo's should focus on second to second gameplay instead of the endless endgame raid player housing promise type beat.
Ppl don't want MMO's. They want amazing SP games with a strong social/community aspect attached to it. Look at Dragon's Dogma 2. The game is SP, but because of the Pawn system, we all feel connected with eachother without suffering the bottlenecks of an MMO.
11:40 happy you say this Force 👌
It is true, if combat is borring nothing els matters, people will quit, the only reason BDO still have a large player base is because of the action combat its really amazing, dont do old tab targeting slow poke turn based combat, only reason i think Ashes of Creation will fail is because they choose wows slow borring tab targeting combat, no one wants that, its outdated.
Edit: Why is no one taking the best part of BDO and put into their games?? The combat in BDO is amazing 😍
So enshrounded world and combat system with a nightingale realm walking shard effect. I'M IN! Lol
Triple AAA isn't the endorsement it should be: these days it usually just means investors/corporate micro management and rushing.
"Reinventing the genre" (by not rethinking almost anything at all). Rarely have I been less excited.
I wish games would just release when they're fully developed with no leaks. Pretty much just how Apex did it.
Early concepts of this game are more interesting than the 90% mmotrash that is here or comming out. I really do love the combat in wow and gw1 and 2, so i like more tab targeting than action combat.
I love you Force but i'm skipping this video, my heart can't take it anymore. I won't look forward to a new MMO until 1 week before release.
I'm beginning to wonder if announcing games years before they're in a playable state is a negative
Yeah. The problem is that it's the only real way to get the word out and build hype which also helps motivate talent and investors to join the project.
your stand on how you play MMO is the same as mine, LOL, after more than a decade of playing MMO, i shifted to survival games i can play solo or coop, and when i play MMO on rare occasions, i dislike socializing too much or getting stucked with players who would like to wait for their friends to come online for hours on end. i appreciate random matching and fast runs , hard grind and log out for the day . o geez age is really catching up, it's unlike the olden days when we still have so much time to go idle online and spend time chatting or getting killed on dungeon runs for chatting and bickering like crazy LOL
I will play it if it has controller support. 33 years old and 15 years in the Army, my body can't handle being hunched over a mouse and keyboard anymore 😅
how can anyone still be excited with anything Greg Street makes? everything the guys touches dies, i am so confused how he STILL has a career in this industry, it is absolutely baffling
For sure will be following this game, definitely has my interest and i look forward to seeing its development
So he’s the one that did the most to harm the community feeling that MMO’s lost in that time frame.
As much as I'm personally excited for it, I'll curb my expectations until we see gameplay and stuff
Imagine building the operations of a game before the artwork 😂 that's crazy..
i am physically unable to be excited anymore for these games that never release, get cancelled or the release after lots of years is nowhere near what you expected...
The description of the game world reminds me of The Oasis in ready Player One ;)
I started MMOs with Ultima Online back in '99. I was a closed beta tester for DAOC and WoW. In DAOC and WoW I very rarely grouped with more than 1 or 2 friends. I mainly solo' d my WoW 'toon to 60 and even helped found the first lv60 guild on my server. Then, as soon as the raiding in big groups started I quit. It was less fun than a root canal. Now I'm older I dislike people even more than I did back then so any MMO that wants to bring back thd community side is a hard nope from me 😂
I find "new triple A MMO" and "recently found studio" kind of funny
Holy crap, it's good to know he's still kicking around!
Yeah I'm definitely one of the 'collaborate out in open world' gang too. I have too much on my plate to deal with guild politics and trying to run organised raids these days... Way, WAY too busy for that nonsense. I've been burned by too many guilds, I'm just not interested.
I LOVE running with randoms, or cool people I've bumped into in random map events for a finder style dungeon though. FFXIV did the social aspect well - especially with the situational companions if you *can't* find someone to run with.
Seems like a great idea but essentially building 3 MMO's into 1 game will be too ambitious is my guess. They should focus on 1 shard at a time and release the others later. I'd rather have a well polished blue shard than 3 sharts
i'm a simple man. I see a force video about a new mmo, i click.
EDIT: What game is 3:57?
That could be Throne and Liberty I think.
I'm not sold on the idea but I won't discard it until I can play it or check people doing so.
At 17:42 it looks like a futuristic game version of top gun lol
The novelty of MMOs was online play, which is common place across genres now. I just don't see new MMOs succeeding going forward.
9:12 "a game for everyone is a game for no one"
The 'basic' idea of the game and what they want to do seems like a big stretch. They basically want to do everything, going from themepark mmo to assassination type gameplay. Sounds like a huge scope to me, and a huge hassle to get somewhat balanced.
I remember when this was first announced, said it was an MMO then went on to explain that it's not really an MMO.