Hard work and love was put into its creation.. Even if it's a badly designed level, it still deserves that fame, or infamy.. Plus, if the criticism is good, other level creators can glean some good criticism from it too~
The point where we made too many extreme demons was felt for me back all the way in 2019-2020. Man the hardest levels used to be so special. So many bland extreme demons exist now and it’s so sad.
Lots of projects that have been in the works for years are coming soon, we got Heliopolis, APT, AtH, Tidal Wave and more to come, some of them like RUTHLESS, Limbo, EoD or KOCMOC are already out. I feel like after Acheron, the era of bland levels started dying out and a lot of original levels are starting to come out, so my hopes are up for the future of the demonlist
Thats what happen when you get no update while the player is very competitive, making everything frame perfect while back then its a speed of adapting to new content like new gamemode or new trigger and you cant cap the skill because the next update would be releasing new content again
the reason i added fixed hitboxes is because of the layering of the level i couldn’t be bothered to actually select each individual spike and move it up let alone all the structuring for said spike so i just added fixed hitboxes (i also love fixed hitboxes they are so funny)
The version electro gave me to verify was really fun, so disappointing to see a potentially great level ruined because some guy wanted his name on a top 1
@@randomidiot_0 I don't think zoink fucked it up on purpose just so it could be a top 1. there's only so much buffing you can do to make an easier level a top 1, and it seems like he was instructed to do it by the hosts
@@NobodyEverExisted Well, it probably would've been way too much work to actually move the structures closer together to make tighter gaps. As seen in the video, plenty of the parts are entirely on one layer.
IMO, the problems we see with the GD community and what gets popular versus what doesn't is really just reflective of the ENTIRE art and internet worlds as a whole. In general, the types of art that get the most popular are the most formulaic and generic, because the most influential art promoters are trying to make an income from their promotions and thus must cater to what will capture the largest audience, which will (obviously) tend to be art that appeals to the most people, which is almost always the most mainstream stuff. A very clear example of this is music; over the past decades, the pop genre has become increasingly samey and boiled down, because its entire shtick is being _popular,_ and pop consistently dominates the charts. The same thing can be seen on RUclips as a whole. What rises to the top is what brings in the largest audience, which is why seemingly everyone is copying MrBeast nowadays, because his video style gets a shit load of clicks. With Geometry Dash, the same exact problem is what causes mind-numbing shorts, trash top one layouts, and generally formulaic levels to be the most prevalent on showcase channels. Good video, I enjoyed it quite a bit! Just wanted to say that I think these problems we see with our community are reflective of a much, _much_ larger trend.
Hey guys! i wanted to use this pinned comment to talk about the last community post I made and the future of the channel since I seemed to scare a few people about me quitting which I'll explain here. To start, No I'm not quitting. I posted the community post during a pretty shit time because I was really demotivated with RUclips, I recently started school again and this year has been hard for me. Harder classes along with driving school taking up nearly all of my time during the day are to blame for the community post that I made because I was not in a good state of mind to focus on RUclips. But I don't think I'll ever go to the extent of quitting, making RUclips videos is pretty much the only hobby of mine that is productive and I've been doing for so long that I think it would be pretty hard for me just to up and quit without a big goodbye video or anything. I'm going to make RUclips videos until I die most likely so don't worry about me quitting or anything. But with the future of the channel in mind, I do think I might want to slow down. School is shit, I have some of the hardest classes in school and the highest expectations to meet from my parents so most of my time is still going to school. I'll still be able to make videos but maybe not at the pace I once was. I don't want videos to take two months (like this one did) but I also don't know if videos could come out every month like I've intended for a while now. Still IDK about the future till it's the present. I plan to do a stream next week if I have the time but other than that idrk about a whole lot of what's going to happen. Still I am so thankful for your support and will try not to disappoint. Love you all.
Damn, just read all that… I know how it feels to be pressured from very high expectations by everyone, especially from teachers and family. Seeing how well-formed your recent videos are, I see that you do your very best to satisfy others’ expectations. Just know that we’re very satisfied with what you make on YT, and if you need to take a break to focus on IRL stuff, we understand, we support you!! Your videos are amazing, and I don’t want you feeling burned out from everyone while making these videos. I don’t mind whatever decisions you make to help you feel better, so take good care of yourself, k?
@@thatsguy1111 true like the spider challenge video was actually kind of enjoyable and the bloodbath vid was also good. He just became unoriginal really fast sad.
imo even after getting 79 atm my enjoyment rating is a 9/10 most fixed hitboxes from an outside perspective may seem really bad but they really (take this from someone who has 79) dont make that big of a difference. this is just my opinion i think avernus is a really good level even tho the creation process was scuffed and wasnt properly done
Ye I see people complaining how the fixed hitboxes would make it annoying and unnatural to play but it doesn't really matter when you're playing the hardest demon in the game, you'd have already found a way to get consistentat those parts.
First video I saw from you, definitely won't be the last. I know that there are a lot of "dissing avernus videos", but yours expanded past just the level itself, and instead talked more about the community as a whole. I gotta say man, this was a W video. :)
sheesh kai 19:44 i think being passionate about anything is a thousand times better than being "business oriented" or just being obsessed with the money
The biggest failure as a community is the pressure on Rob to rate levels just because they're difficult. Maybe we would have another layer of quality control for gameplay and decoration/optimization if Rob actually looked at the level like he would look at any other level instead of "oooooh, new top 10 extreme demon". Sadly, I think this is something Rob used to do with levels like Wcropolix, Crimson Planet, and Thinking Space but I think the backlash Rob got for not rating Crimson Planet when it was a top 1 has made it so that he rates nearly any new extreme demon verification. Sakupen Circles and Silent Clubstep are objectively bad levels but they didn't have any trouble getting rated like they might have used to.
I really agree and I love it when these really true videos come to me. It's a fact that is very sad for all creators that the only thing this community wants is just the same copies of the levels keep uploading everyday, It's common for creators to feel the pressure of trying to do something unique and end up giving in to that community pressure and failing miserably because of it. It's a shame, that even entire servers can hate you just for being or creating something different, not because you want difficulty, or want the best decoration of all. But, just making for your own, promotes creativity and the art of expressing yourself and expressing something you like. But the community isn't like that, it hates you for being different, and until you stop it it won't stop chasing you until the end. But don't give in to them, Don't stop for them, because unfortunately, listening to this part of the community unfortunately becomes a failure, a really bad failure. The only thing we can do is depend on ourselves, because wanting attention from this community will lead you to failure and being ridiculed as the creator of Avernus.
I’m really glad we’re seeing a shift in the popularity of GD levels. Gone are the days of Bloodbath and Sonic Wave where the hardest levels get all the attention. Some of the most hype I’ve seen for levels recently have been for impressive non-list levels like Abel, Change of Scene, Floating Outskirts, and most recently Spu7nix’s What. Seriously, if there’s any level that makes me go “…What?” It’s What.
I was away from this community for years and I came back coincidentally when avernus was getting beaten up by the community. My first thought seeing the level with the song and theme is that 'Oh a sequel to GgB0y's infernal abyss' not the golden lmao
I personally think the Avernus Situation is kinda like the reverse of Xanii's Silent Circles situation, where instead of the level becoming too easy to live up to the original's legacy and get rated to place in the Demonlist top 10, the level became too annoyingly hard (not just hard, that would technically make Zodiac hated) to the point of being unfun. (Xanii isn't the host of SiCi, i just don't want to mention the actual host and cause drama)
@@AustynLZodiac is mostly appreciated, especially since it was the last top 1 before the hell/edgy themed top 1's took over, gameplay wise it's veeeery split, some people like it and some people hate it
@@imarandomperson761i feel the song is kinda too boring to be put in the level like the vibe doesn’t suit the difficulty not saying the song sucks bc it sounds great but for a top 1 probably not a song to put in
@@staringcorgi6475 Well it's not as intense as other songs we had in top 1's but it does the job imo, the build up to the last drop starts at ~65% so that's where the intensity settles in, and since the level is over 3 minutes long it's still over a minute of gameplay left
Really amazing video! I like the fact that you went into so much detail elaborating how Avernus was lazy and unfun rather than just outright stating it and ending the video.
i thought this was going to be another video just putting down and bashing in avernus for being bad, but the end of the video really opened my eyes to how the gd community functions and how it needs to change. great video!
peak demon list (imo) was either with Zodiac as top 1 or with the top 4 being Tartarus, The Golden, Zodiac, Kenos, Crimson Planet. There's something so iconic about those versions of the list and i cant quite put my finger on what it is
The hitboes are pockewindfish's fault. Zoink was forced to buff the level, but everything is on the same layer. insead of ruining the decoration, and preserved it and buffed it by fixing the hitboxes.
"the list was made for levels, now levels are made for the list" is very insightful and really sums up how the community has started putting too much value on difficulty. good vid
I hate how demons throw any kind of fun out the window just to be difficult. This doesn't make any sense too, at the core, you still play games for fun and extreme demons are not fun. The only extra rewards they give you are demon list points which have no use in-game. You can play any other fun demon and get the same rewards.
@@DJOverturned If you're skilled enough, the difficulty wouldn't affect your enjoyment. You can have a very difficult level that is fun for someone at the right skill level. Also I'm sure the extreme demon slayers want to have some fun when playing their 'new hardest level'.
"Extreme demons are not fun". Oh, so being good at the game and challenging yourself to the limits isn't fun? I think the reality is that you are just bas at gd. Why do people strive for the extreme challenges if it isn't "fun"?
At this point i take back anything I may have said about zoink and I hold my head in shame. It wasnt his fault, he was INSTRUCTED TO MAKE IT INTO A BAD LEVEL. Also doesnt matter if you have an RTX 4090 or a GTX 1050 2GB, they will run GD the same, unless the CPU's single core is better (13700K is about 2x faster performance per watt over my old 8700K @95W max)
I feel ever since slaughter house or spaceuk confessing, the extreme demon list has just deteriorated. I feel like the only people who can revive it now is Riot and all the og creators. Imagine, a level with riot, dorabae, Cody, darned and zobros. It would be sooo iconic.
Can I just say how well editted this video is. It has perfect consistency with its subjects, makes good points, and overall has amazing editting. You earned a sub!
Amazing video, i really enjoyed watching this, i totally agree that a level should be something that you enjoy making and that you make for the sake of yourself and the community, not something you make as a chore. just to get some popularity. I think that avernus should have just stayed as a top 20 and shouldnt have been horribly buffed, the level woul have been probably liked a lot more. (Also, TroyPM Fun Times)
your rant on how the community doesnt like unique stuff honestly kinda hits becuase in a way i feel like all my ideas for levels are very derivative, the 2 levels ive spent the most time on are an old slaughterhouse remake and a sonic wave inspired level, both 1.9 styled. it really says something about my creativity that my 2 favorite types of levels are hell levels and circles levels
If you want attention in the gd community, go in another list. Memory levels. 2p levels. Impossible levels. You can change the Geometry dash community!
if the fact of the fixed hitboxes is a problem, then the REAL problem is how INCONSISTENT THE FIXED HITBOXES ARE. like some of them are shifted , making them harder than other spikes! utter cancer
Just separate the demon list into 3 different columns. Hardest , most enjoyable/fun , and best looking/atmosphere, this way players/creators can vote on each aspect of a demon separately. To take it a step further , you could add a 4th column that takes into account of all 3 rankings, ideally putting more weight on the enjoyment/look on a level instead of its difficulty, giving it a general overview for anyone that wants to play it
Avernus would be 2 in difficulty but will most likely not even crack top 150 on the other 2 columns , thus not even sniffing the top 150 of the overall rating of the level. This way the list is fixed and the community would get an easier overview of which levels they want to play/talk about
@@Conorator not necessarily, some people enjoy the challenge and get some fun out of it , but some levels have atrocious gameplay making it harder than it has to be.
To think a level like this would represent the GD community as a whole. Thanks so much for making this video. Not only is the effort awesome, but I finally held a full grasp about my personal view on the GD community in general thanks to the many points you created throughout the video! Honestly, I’m even more motivated to keep going as a GD player because of this. Thanks!!! :D
i expected this to be another rant video that i click off in 2 minutes, but this was actually such a high quality video! the pacing is great, the parts all felt necessary, the history was interesting and felt well-researched, didn't feel extremely biased, overall a fantastic vid
Speaking genuinely, this is such a well made video, highlighting everything wrong with a level and explaining i proper detail how it came to be. Looking forward to your future videos.
I love this video. It has amazing editing, great pacing, and was the first time I learned about the history of this level (Pockewindfish is an alt account? It was made by half the same creators as “The Golden”?) It doesn’t feel good to be part of a community that allows such problems to persist, but we need to self-reflect to solve them.
17:56 We both like Emplemon's editing style huh. (I know the rest of the video has it's own editing style I just liked this moment. I think it was the simpsons, the song, the text popping up to the song, and the light on the individual simpson character)
No matter what you say, I still like avernus. It has pretty good decoration. Sure, the gameplay is sort of trash, but so are a lot of levels on the list. IMO, it's better than the golden because it does what it sets out to achieve as a level and achieves it. The golden wasn't even gold, LOL.
You forgot to mension that another reason that avernus is hated is because of Pockewindfish, he has been very controversial because of him insulting and threatening people that dislike the level or saying that it is easier than acheron. Anyway, good video
ive tried my hardest to like this level for what it is but you just proved to me that Avernus is objectively bad. also really agree with your stance on the community, things really need to change. also you’re a very underrated creator, i was surprised with the level of quality and editing! keep making videos like this man
It feels like the community is splitting. One side is going to kaiguy’s argument, which has a lot of children, and the other to fnm04’s argument. Passion projects like anathema, hbfs, white space, requiem, etc. still exist and are arguably growing, but also people who just want to make quick profit of stats, money, or whatever, like that yunhaseo guy or kaiguy are too. Its just now the divide is growing stronger, so people are finally beginning to comment on it.
I’ve never agreed with a video more lol. I understand every point made in this video and agree with all of them. The gd community is very flawed in many ways and you described most flaws really well.
About the lags - GPU doesn't really affect the game. If you have an i5-13900 and like some geforce 210, it will most likely be enough for you to run something around Limbo objects count just fine. The GPU is just not used by the game, all calculations are done by one thread of CPU. That's why people say about poor game optimization.
you made so many good points in this video, precisely explaining why the demon list is failing and why avernus failed. this video is going in my favorites for sure.
you are one of the most articulate, reasonable, passionate speakers i've ever seen in this game's community. i'm a veteran player, i've been playing since i first downloaded the game on my ipod touch in late 1.9. i've watched this game grow from a place where creativity was valued to a place where constantly-inflating rate standards and an increasingly toxic, entitled community have condensed this game from a beautiful, fun, artistic community into "iSpyWithMyLittleEye VS Change Of Scene 5 LEVELS OF DIFFICULTY $10000 #shorts". in fact, i recently conducted an experiment to see if a shitpost youtube short could get attention immediately just by featuring GD, and it did. avernus is simply a benchmark of a deep poison within this playerbase, and here's hoping that 2.2 will return us to our wide-eyed curiosity and awkward implementations of new update features like back in 2.0
this video has my thoughts exactly, especially the stuff about how people like kaiguy and creators of all these extreme demons made to be impossibly hard are just doing it for attention and its making the community worse as a whole
I honestly think the best idea would be to update Avernus to get rid of the fixed hit boxes And perhaps some gameplay adjustments to make the level more fun
"the list was made for levels,now the levels are made for the list" WHAT DID Y'ALL EXPECT? People push the limits, that's why levels are made for the list.
I used to be part of the gd community, the obsession with top one's and challenges just got boring, also the gatekeeping too, people think if your hardest isn't top 100 or something, you're bad.
damn... kaiguy's tweet hit me hard, like i know there are a lot of people who don't give a fuck about the game's integrity (specially after the spaceuk scandal), but actually seeing someone express it and CONTINUING to be part of the community... it was hard to read, and its not even his fault for becoming popular, its the community's for being filled with children
Honestly, Yatagarasu is my favorite top 1. It really was at the peak of my interest of the game and was something I personally remember the best. The whole lead up to it was insane when I was 10 years old.
Great video for me avernus the only reason why it is rated because it was hyped and popular by youtube kids atm it is very important all creators who can make showcase for u I tried kinda smth with my collab "Henken" ig gameplay is balanced also consistent and optimized after one year it still looks better than avernus my level is still not rated because it is nothing special also only neiro made a showcase.
@@lukecarroll19 ok there is a lot of nice levels but good example is tidal wave why People like it for me it looks like a normal level without feature thats why for me the Best upcoming demon will be ATH almost everything there for now is looking good also with specific theme about gp I am not Player but for me it looks balanced also I Played layout
Good stuff! Really accurate and entertainig video. I just want to say some things: The demonlist doesn't really deserve any bit of hate, their job is just ranking the thardest rated demons in the servers, no matter quality, no matter how bad, unfair dogshit is, if it was legit verified and rated, it would be placed. About of the Avernus deco, i don't think is that bad, even if i don't like it that much i think it's really good, it's just really risky. Take in mind this is a HELL THEMED LEVEL, it looks unique aff taking in mind Avernus theme. It's really atmospheric and as a The Golden's antagonist, is really well executed. Keep up the good work! :]
crazy is a rlly interesting level,it isn't on pointercrate but it was considered a hard level back in 2013,that level's deco is absolutly disgusting even for 1.2 and it has bad use of mirror portals and the level's dificulty is carried by blind jumps,idk which one is worse i cant decide. if you are seeing this plss reply what you think you dont need to like this comment.
I love that people call this level bland and constantly call to mind the fixed hitboxes.. Does that not describe Tartarus? There are so many top demons that were lazily made, little to no effort. I think the level looks good. The hate it receives is truly unjust in my opinion. I don't understand what everyone has against it.
i cant say anything about avernus, but tartarus doesnt have any sections that are made less fun because of the fixed hitboxes. Also its in like three spots, the entire predrop on avernus is fixed.
Honestly, if you want to play Avernus for the theme and experience, just play Infernal Abyss which is a much better level even in spite of its flaws. Avernus really has nothing to offer and that's just a big turn off to me. Its a hell themed version of The Golden which is just layers of generic stacked on top of each other. Also, great job on the video.
Tidal wave is basically what happened with avernus but worse, so bad that the level didn't even get rated. I don't know what happened but I truly love that level, seems like the community doesn't.
Man, this video is so well made! You really feel like the Emplemon of GD (I realised at 17:56 lmao), because you take a popular topic and put an interesting spin on it that ends up meaning more than the sum of its parts. Keep it up man, you could easily be one of the greats!
just randomly found this video on my recommended page and thought it was gonna be the same thing the other 50 "why avernus sucks" videos already said, but it actually said some valid points. nice video man! keep it up!
I have no idea why people judge top ones by gameplay when they aren't even getting past the first click,good decoration matters more and avernus's decoration is good enough. the demon list is a list of the hardest demons not the best.
There's a difference between hard but fair gameplay, and gameplay that's hard and just unfair. People aren't going to like a level full of gameplay that is generally unfair
@@divyanshsingh9369 The issue is Avernus just isn't a good level in general. Top 1 aside, it's got, as mentioned, unfair gameplay and a bunch of fixed hotboxes. It's just not a good level, and that's the general issue with a lot of these top demons. They're so focused on being plain difficult that they often ignore the part about actually being a fun to play level with unique aesthetics. That's the issue with the demon list really. Instead of focusing on making really good and unique levels that have gameplay hard enough for the top, these top demons usually ignore that for the sake of just being a top 1 demon
@@superior_nobody07 the demon list is made for the hardest levels. Told ya already, judging a top 1 on gameplay is stupid when most people aren't getting past the first click. Decoration and song matter way more and avernus has good decoration and a good song.
@@superior_nobody07Diamond's enjoyment Rating "7,5/10". Zoink's enjoyment Rating is also something like "10/7,5". Fixed Hitboxes do not matter whatsoever, nobody cares, well people who actually play the level don't. Avernus's optimization is the worst I've ever seen in this game, and also everything is on 1 layer which is the reaosn why Zoink buffed it with Fixed Hitboxes.
now its top one lol
Ya lmao
"Avernus might possibly be(it is) the worst top 1 we've had in this game's nearly 10 year history"
Well there had to be at least one more nuke dropped on the community before 2.2 comes out I guess
which is an oof
What a plot twist, indeed.
The fact that it's been 6 months and only one person has even got halfway through this level is just insane lol
why’d you tweet my video lol
@@TroyPM That line goes crazy hard, its the perfect explanation of modern GD
Oh mah gawd it's vortrox
I thought it best 😊
When did I tyoe this
5th reply lol
ironically, it was a good antagonist to the golden. the golden was a popular, natural, and fun experience. avernus is the opposite in all of that
it is popular but in a bad way
I guess that is the reason why they decided to call it "antagonist" than sequel later
LMAO FACTS
Genius
how is the golden considered good?
You unironically gave avernus a reputation and identity
Hard work and love was put into its creation.. Even if it's a badly designed level, it still deserves that fame, or infamy.. Plus, if the criticism is good, other level creators can glean some good criticism from it too~
@@snowarmth gonna have to go with infamy on that one
@@snowarmth the host is most likely 5 years old
@@petrikhorr wouldnt they be wondering why the moon follow them and play with paper airplanes?
@@snowarmth waffling
The point where we made too many extreme demons was felt for me back all the way in 2019-2020. Man the hardest levels used to be so special. So many bland extreme demons exist now and it’s so sad.
so true, i also feel that way right now!
Thats true, but I feel like for every 10 bland list demons, there's one or two that just blow me away in terms of quality.
Lots of projects that have been in the works for years are coming soon, we got Heliopolis, APT, AtH, Tidal Wave and more to come, some of them like RUTHLESS, Limbo, EoD or KOCMOC are already out. I feel like after Acheron, the era of bland levels started dying out and a lot of original levels are starting to come out, so my hopes are up for the future of the demonlist
Thats what happen when you get no update while the player is very competitive, making everything frame perfect while back then its a speed of adapting to new content like new gamemode or new trigger and you cant cap the skill because the next update would be releasing new content again
yeah, and before, almost every level was original and blew ppl away, idiot@@camacakegd3714
the reason i added fixed hitboxes is because of the layering of the level i couldn’t be bothered to actually select each individual spike and move it up let alone all the structuring for said spike so i just added fixed hitboxes (i also love fixed hitboxes they are so funny)
zoink, why did you ruin avernus with the horrible horrible gameplay?? ruining muscle memory smh..
ehehe, fixed hitboxes silly :3
The level sucked already lol it didn’t do that much to ruin it more than it already was
I think it's funny zoink is just a funny Goober gd man
He knew it would be hard for anyone else to beat it which i think is the main reason he did it
Yeah this video sucks why do people expect a level harder than silent club step and potentially Acheron to be fun?
The version electro gave me to verify was really fun, so disappointing to see a potentially great level ruined because some guy wanted his name on a top 1
Well his name is already on a top 1, and it’s going to also be on the next top 1 as well, so his name is actually going to be on the entire top 3
@@smallxplosion9546 I think he meant pockewindfish or the other hosts
@@randomidiot_0 I don't think zoink fucked it up on purpose just so it could be a top 1. there's only so much buffing you can do to make an easier level a top 1, and it seems like he was instructed to do it by the hosts
@@YaBoiSneedManThe only problem is he botched it. The fixed Hitboxes were not that good
@@NobodyEverExisted Well, it probably would've been way too much work to actually move the structures closer together to make tighter gaps. As seen in the video, plenty of the parts are entirely on one layer.
IMO, the problems we see with the GD community and what gets popular versus what doesn't is really just reflective of the ENTIRE art and internet worlds as a whole. In general, the types of art that get the most popular are the most formulaic and generic, because the most influential art promoters are trying to make an income from their promotions and thus must cater to what will capture the largest audience, which will (obviously) tend to be art that appeals to the most people, which is almost always the most mainstream stuff. A very clear example of this is music; over the past decades, the pop genre has become increasingly samey and boiled down, because its entire shtick is being _popular,_ and pop consistently dominates the charts. The same thing can be seen on RUclips as a whole. What rises to the top is what brings in the largest audience, which is why seemingly everyone is copying MrBeast nowadays, because his video style gets a shit load of clicks. With Geometry Dash, the same exact problem is what causes mind-numbing shorts, trash top one layouts, and generally formulaic levels to be the most prevalent on showcase channels. Good video, I enjoyed it quite a bit! Just wanted to say that I think these problems we see with our community are reflective of a much, _much_ larger trend.
One of the best GD related comments ive ever seen
This was a very insightful comment
Ayyyy 69 likes
Not reading allat
nerd
Hey guys! i wanted to use this pinned comment to talk about the last community post I made and the future of the channel since I seemed to scare a few people about me quitting which I'll explain here. To start, No I'm not quitting. I posted the community post during a pretty shit time because I was really demotivated with RUclips, I recently started school again and this year has been hard for me. Harder classes along with driving school taking up nearly all of my time during the day are to blame for the community post that I made because I was not in a good state of mind to focus on RUclips. But I don't think I'll ever go to the extent of quitting, making RUclips videos is pretty much the only hobby of mine that is productive and I've been doing for so long that I think it would be pretty hard for me just to up and quit without a big goodbye video or anything. I'm going to make RUclips videos until I die most likely so don't worry about me quitting or anything. But with the future of the channel in mind, I do think I might want to slow down. School is shit, I have some of the hardest classes in school and the highest expectations to meet from my parents so most of my time is still going to school. I'll still be able to make videos but maybe not at the pace I once was. I don't want videos to take two months (like this one did) but I also don't know if videos could come out every month like I've intended for a while now. Still IDK about the future till it's the present. I plan to do a stream next week if I have the time but other than that idrk about a whole lot of what's going to happen. Still I am so thankful for your support and will try not to disappoint. Love you all.
I feel ya ( i don't make youtube video but damn it's hard sometimes)
the tl;dr is he is demotivated and school is stressful and he won’t be quitting, you’re welcome.
Damn, just read all that… I know how it feels to be pressured from very high expectations by everyone, especially from teachers and family. Seeing how well-formed your recent videos are, I see that you do your very best to satisfy others’ expectations. Just know that we’re very satisfied with what you make on YT, and if you need to take a break to focus on IRL stuff, we understand, we support you!! Your videos are amazing, and I don’t want you feeling burned out from everyone while making these videos. I don’t mind whatever decisions you make to help you feel better, so take good care of yourself, k?
Ik this has nothing to do with the vid 😂 but Der Eisendrache better
@@addressingrandomperson4150 the tl;dr is above
Kaiguy having more subs then Nexus is disgusting
True tbh
WHY???????
@@Obama3ryk because his "content" is just bad
@@asbfgh
Its really sad cause from what I remember, his old content was actually somewhat enjoyable. Now it’s just unoriginal slop.
@@thatsguy1111 true like the spider challenge video was actually kind of enjoyable and the bloodbath vid was also good. He just became unoriginal really fast sad.
imo even after getting 79 atm my enjoyment rating is a 9/10
most fixed hitboxes from an outside perspective may seem really bad but they really (take this from someone who has 79) dont make that big of a difference.
this is just my opinion i think avernus is a really good level even tho the creation process was scuffed and wasnt properly done
Ye I see people complaining how the fixed hitboxes would make it annoying and unnatural to play but it doesn't really matter when you're playing the hardest demon in the game, you'd have already found a way to get consistentat those parts.
Atleast we have "Tidal Wave" now that isnt hell theme and its little bit different. I mean its wave based level but deco is unique.
Its still mid
i’m very doubtful that a level with 200k objects is gonna get rated any time soon
Ametrys please save us
First video I saw from you, definitely won't be the last. I know that there are a lot of "dissing avernus videos", but yours expanded past just the level itself, and instead talked more about the community as a whole. I gotta say man, this was a W video. :)
Definitely a W video from TroyPM!
sheesh kai 19:44 i think being passionate about anything is a thousand times better than being "business oriented" or just being obsessed with the money
Update: TDiamond (1st victor) and Trick (2nd victor) have beaten Avernus, both in 2024.
It sucks because I remember watching the early previews of Avernus, and looking back it's crazy how good it could have been
Exactly lol its so disappointing
The biggest failure as a community is the pressure on Rob to rate levels just because they're difficult. Maybe we would have another layer of quality control for gameplay and decoration/optimization if Rob actually looked at the level like he would look at any other level instead of "oooooh, new top 10 extreme demon". Sadly, I think this is something Rob used to do with levels like Wcropolix, Crimson Planet, and Thinking Space but I think the backlash Rob got for not rating Crimson Planet when it was a top 1 has made it so that he rates nearly any new extreme demon verification. Sakupen Circles and Silent Clubstep are objectively bad levels but they didn't have any trouble getting rated like they might have used to.
11:48 sounds like tf2 engineer saying nope
I was dumbfounded when you said the parts were all on a singular layer.
I really agree and I love it when these really true videos come to me. It's a fact that is very sad for all creators that the only thing this community wants is just the same copies of the levels keep uploading everyday, It's common for creators to feel the pressure of trying to do something unique and end up giving in to that community pressure and failing miserably because of it. It's a shame, that even entire servers can hate you just for being or creating something different, not because you want difficulty, or want the best decoration of all. But, just making for your own, promotes creativity and the art of expressing yourself and expressing something you like. But the community isn't like that, it hates you for being different, and until you stop it it won't stop chasing you until the end. But don't give in to them, Don't stop for them, because unfortunately, listening to this part of the community unfortunately becomes a failure, a really bad failure. The only thing we can do is depend on ourselves, because wanting attention from this community will lead you to failure and being ridiculed as the creator of Avernus.
Falou tudo miga (brincadeira)
Facts.
I’m really glad we’re seeing a shift in the popularity of GD levels. Gone are the days of Bloodbath and Sonic Wave where the hardest levels get all the attention. Some of the most hype I’ve seen for levels recently have been for impressive non-list levels like Abel, Change of Scene, Floating Outskirts, and most recently Spu7nix’s What. Seriously, if there’s any level that makes me go “…What?” It’s What.
thanks for feature
my first level (extreme demon) soon
honestly really excited for my first level, hope it comes out soon 🙏🙏🙏
I was away from this community for years and I came back coincidentally when avernus was getting beaten up by the community. My first thought seeing the level with the song and theme is that 'Oh a sequel to GgB0y's infernal abyss' not the golden lmao
I personally think the Avernus Situation is kinda like the reverse of Xanii's Silent Circles situation, where instead of the level becoming too easy to live up to the original's legacy and get rated to place in the Demonlist top 10, the level became too annoyingly hard (not just hard, that would technically make Zodiac hated) to the point of being unfun. (Xanii isn't the host of SiCi, i just don't want to mention the actual host and cause drama)
i thought zodiac was hated
@@AustynLZodiac is mostly appreciated, especially since it was the last top 1 before the hell/edgy themed top 1's took over, gameplay wise it's veeeery split, some people like it and some people hate it
@@imarandomperson761i feel the song is kinda too boring to be put in the level like the vibe doesn’t suit the difficulty not saying the song sucks bc it sounds great but for a top 1 probably not a song to put in
@@staringcorgi6475 Well it's not as intense as other songs we had in top 1's but it does the job imo, the build up to the last drop starts at ~65% so that's where the intensity settles in, and since the level is over 3 minutes long it's still over a minute of gameplay left
Who tf is the host, also which silent circles, there's a billion versions and i cant remember which you're even talking about
Really amazing video! I like the fact that you went into so much detail elaborating how Avernus was lazy and unfun rather than just outright stating it and ending the video.
i thought this was going to be another video just putting down and bashing in avernus for being bad, but the end of the video really opened my eyes to how the gd community functions and how it needs to change. great video!
It doesnt "need" to change. 2.2 is coming out that will change everything and bring attention away from demons.
@@milanek1527when will 2.2 coming out again?
@@retouru8345 october
@@retouru8345 this month
4 days ago
nice chroma key advanced at 0:08
Yo wsp waboo
Nahh 2 likes 💀
how does this have only 9 likes and 2 other comments
@@waboo is the 84th tip of “83 building hacks” or something fixed hitboxes?
peak demon list (imo) was either with Zodiac as top 1 or with the top 4 being Tartarus, The Golden, Zodiac, Kenos, Crimson Planet. There's something so iconic about those versions of the list and i cant quite put my finger on what it is
Crimson Planet, Bloodlust, and Zodiac for me
I feel so lucky for finding a video as good as this one. Huge props for literally everything you did here
He nailed it
The hitboes are pockewindfish's fault. Zoink was forced to buff the level, but everything is on the same layer. insead of ruining the decoration, and preserved it and buffed it by fixing the hitboxes.
*Avernus and Acheron have swapped, with Avernus now sitting above at #1.*
Jtard lol
@@mylesjt Gtard lol
bro had to bold his comment 😭😭🙏🙏🙏🙏
@@flamingzucchini7843 the change log message was also bold?
love the EmpLemon vibes I got from this video (especially the music at 17:55), very well done
"the list was made for levels, now levels are made for the list" is very insightful and really sums up how the community has started putting too much value on difficulty. good vid
man explains why people should stop getting angry about the square game, then gets angry about the square game
fr
?
I hate how demons throw any kind of fun out the window just to be difficult. This doesn't make any sense too, at the core, you still play games for fun and extreme demons are not fun. The only extra rewards they give you are demon list points which have no use in-game. You can play any other fun demon and get the same rewards.
Then just don't play extreme demons? They are meant to be hard not cater to the community's enjoyment
@@DJOverturned If you're skilled enough, the difficulty wouldn't affect your enjoyment. You can have a very difficult level that is fun for someone at the right skill level. Also I'm sure the extreme demon slayers want to have some fun when playing their 'new hardest level'.
"Extreme demons are not fun". Oh, so being good at the game and challenging yourself to the limits isn't fun? I think the reality is that you are just bas at gd. Why do people strive for the extreme challenges if it isn't "fun"?
The average enjoyment pf people who have beat it is actually really high.
yeah and these people still feel like they have the say on this, actually pathetic
At this point i take back anything I may have said about zoink and I hold my head in shame. It wasnt his fault, he was INSTRUCTED TO MAKE IT INTO A BAD LEVEL.
Also doesnt matter if you have an RTX 4090 or a GTX 1050 2GB, they will run GD the same, unless the CPU's single core is better (13700K is about 2x faster performance per watt over my old 8700K @95W max)
I feel ever since slaughter house or spaceuk confessing, the extreme demon list has just deteriorated. I feel like the only people who can revive it now is Riot and all the og creators. Imagine, a level with riot, dorabae, Cody, darned and zobros. It would be sooo iconic.
Can I just say how well editted this video is. It has perfect consistency with its subjects, makes good points, and overall has amazing editting. You earned a sub!
Already know today's gonna be great when TroyPM uploads! Your videos are always incredible man!
6:59 “Even after all this time, it never ended up becoming the top 1 that it always strived to be” About that…
a correction: they did use the creator contest part but not the winner, they used the second place
what
why
@@apastelnerd because it fits more with the rest of the level and looks better
Amazing video, i really enjoyed watching this, i totally agree that a level should be something that you enjoy making and that you make for the sake of yourself and the community, not something you make as a chore. just to get some popularity. I think that avernus should have just stayed as a top 20 and shouldnt have been horribly buffed, the level woul have been probably liked a lot more.
(Also, TroyPM Fun Times)
your rant on how the community doesnt like unique stuff honestly kinda hits becuase in a way i feel like all my ideas for levels are very derivative, the 2 levels ive spent the most time on are an old slaughterhouse remake and a sonic wave inspired level, both 1.9 styled. it really says something about my creativity that my 2 favorite types of levels are hell levels and circles levels
I never knew Avernus' layout was first showcased on my birthday lmao
lol
lol
Lol
lol
lol
The demonlist is like the clout-route for players
If you want attention in the gd community, go in another list. Memory levels. 2p levels. Impossible levels. You can change the Geometry dash community!
if the fact of the fixed hitboxes is a problem, then the REAL problem is how INCONSISTENT THE FIXED HITBOXES ARE. like some of them are shifted , making them harder than other spikes! utter cancer
1000 languages and this dude decided to speak facts. Incredible video, very well spoken. I don’t think I disagree with a single point here.
Just separate the demon list into 3 different columns. Hardest , most enjoyable/fun , and best looking/atmosphere, this way players/creators can vote on each aspect of a demon separately. To take it a step further , you could add a 4th column that takes into account of all 3 rankings, ideally putting more weight on the enjoyment/look on a level instead of its difficulty, giving it a general overview for anyone that wants to play it
Avernus would be 2 in difficulty but will most likely not even crack top 150 on the other 2 columns , thus not even sniffing the top 150 of the overall rating of the level. This way the list is fixed and the community would get an easier overview of which levels they want to play/talk about
Most enjoyable/fun would most likely just be filled with the easiest levels, because they would have the most victors with a positive experience.
@@Conorator not necessarily, some people enjoy the challenge and get some fun out of it , but some levels have atrocious gameplay making it harder than it has to be.
@@okaydt8713 I'm saying that easier levels would have more victors *overall,* meaning that they would have more people saying they're fun.
@@Conorator ahhh i got you , i feel like that’s perfectly fine tho
Bro's upload made my day 10x better
I could easily write a whole essay on why comments like these are ruining RUclips and why people should start noticing this issue more.
@@averagelizard2489 honestly im extremely curious to why you think comments like mine is ruining youtube
To think a level like this would represent the GD community as a whole. Thanks so much for making this video. Not only is the effort awesome, but I finally held a full grasp about my personal view on the GD community in general thanks to the many points you created throughout the video! Honestly, I’m even more motivated to keep going as a GD player because of this. Thanks!!! :D
i expected this to be another rant video that i click off in 2 minutes, but this was actually such a high quality video! the pacing is great, the parts all felt necessary, the history was interesting and felt well-researched, didn't feel extremely biased, overall a fantastic vid
I really do appreciate the ending of the video, we need more commentary videos that helps on a happy note like that
Speaking genuinely, this is such a well made video, highlighting everything wrong with a level and explaining i proper detail how it came to be. Looking forward to your future videos.
dude, your editing is very unique, it demostrates the passion that you have with the game and cinematography too, praise to you!!!
I love this video. It has amazing editing, great pacing, and was the first time I learned about the history of this level (Pockewindfish is an alt account? It was made by half the same creators as “The Golden”?) It doesn’t feel good to be part of a community that allows such problems to persist, but we need to self-reflect to solve them.
Diamond just became the first Avernus victor!!!
I found it hilarious that Zoink didnt even want it at #1 lmao
Also this is a pretty funny video on avernus lol
Bro fr said: nah u don’t deserve it 😂
Its funny how in between then and now, there was a month long period where avernus ended up back at #1
I play on mobile so literally every level made in the past 5 years is too laggy for me
what phone do u have?
@@minipehkka samsung galaxy s10
17:56
We both like Emplemon's editing style huh. (I know the rest of the video has it's own editing style I just liked this moment. I think it was the simpsons, the song, the text popping up to the song, and the light on the individual simpson character)
No matter what you say, I still like avernus. It has pretty good decoration. Sure, the gameplay is sort of trash, but so are a lot of levels on the list. IMO, it's better than the golden because it does what it sets out to achieve as a level and achieves it. The golden wasn't even gold, LOL.
actually gameplay isn't even trash, all the victors agreed it was just kind of mid
this feels like the numptaloid video about abyss of darkness, and in case you don’t know I bloody love that video, great video mate
It really does lmfao
You forgot to mension that another reason that avernus is hated is because of Pockewindfish, he has been very controversial because of him insulting and threatening people that dislike the level or saying that it is easier than acheron. Anyway, good video
I think bro is so mad abt the deco and the editor layer on avernus that he decided to actually put giygas theme in, im fucking scared
He started so calm and then he went crazy mad lol.
ive tried my hardest to like this level for what it is but you just proved to me that Avernus is objectively bad. also really agree with your stance on the community, things really need to change.
also you’re a very underrated creator, i was surprised with the level of quality and editing! keep making videos like this man
It feels like the community is splitting. One side is going to kaiguy’s argument, which has a lot of children, and the other to fnm04’s argument. Passion projects like anathema, hbfs, white space, requiem, etc. still exist and are arguably growing, but also people who just want to make quick profit of stats, money, or whatever, like that yunhaseo guy or kaiguy are too. Its just now the divide is growing stronger, so people are finally beginning to comment on it.
troy you are one of the few gd youtubers that actually puts in effort in their content
ong
funny because its true
Funny because it's false
@@lukecarroll19 🤡
name 3 popular gd youtubers who don't put effort into their content
I love the fact that you dont talk about just the level itself but the problems this comunity has
I’ve never agreed with a video more lol. I understand every point made in this video and agree with all of them. The gd community is very flawed in many ways and you described most flaws really well.
About the lags - GPU doesn't really affect the game. If you have an i5-13900 and like some geforce 210, it will most likely be enough for you to run something around Limbo objects count just fine. The GPU is just not used by the game, all calculations are done by one thread of CPU. That's why people say about poor game optimization.
My favorite part about the demons is when you can't play it because it's an epileptic hazard, just for the layout to be on xStep level of difficulty
This comment was made before WANNACRY was released, I believe. *THE GIFT OF PROPHECY*
you made so many good points in this video, precisely explaining why the demon list is failing and why avernus failed. this video is going in my favorites for sure.
im really honored to have this video as my 1000th liked, really love unpopular and objective takes like this one
MattTacc, Stallion, TroyPM and Numptaloid video in the same day. Amazing day.
Bro facts
Bro facts
DON'T FORGET NUMPTALOID
@@Eagleleadsmc wait fr? my fave youtuber
@@MattTacc hi MattTacc
LETS GO! YOU PASSED ME IN SUBS! I remember you had almost 2k, and now you have almost 4k! Keep it up man, you're doing amazing
you are one of the most articulate, reasonable, passionate speakers i've ever seen in this game's community. i'm a veteran player, i've been playing since i first downloaded the game on my ipod touch in late 1.9. i've watched this game grow from a place where creativity was valued to a place where constantly-inflating rate standards and an increasingly toxic, entitled community have condensed this game from a beautiful, fun, artistic community into "iSpyWithMyLittleEye VS Change Of Scene 5 LEVELS OF DIFFICULTY $10000 #shorts". in fact, i recently conducted an experiment to see if a shitpost youtube short could get attention immediately just by featuring GD, and it did. avernus is simply a benchmark of a deep poison within this playerbase, and here's hoping that 2.2 will return us to our wide-eyed curiosity and awkward implementations of new update features like back in 2.0
this video has my thoughts exactly, especially the stuff about how people like kaiguy and creators of all these extreme demons made to be impossibly hard are just doing it for attention and its making the community worse as a whole
I honestly think the best idea would be to update Avernus to get rid of the fixed hit boxes
And perhaps some gameplay adjustments to make the level more fun
It will fall down in the list which was not the purpose of the level
@prince_bk yes but then atlest it would be playable
I know what you mean tho
@@JmDw_GD I also want ur thought to happen...
You still wouldnt play it even if he made the changes you suggested, You just want change for the sake of change.
bro only 20 people are actually
gonna play avernus
17:56 Nostalgic Weather Channel Music: “Your current weather condition”
"the list was made for levels,now the levels are made for the list"
WHAT DID Y'ALL EXPECT? People push the limits, that's why levels are made for the list.
I used to be part of the gd community, the obsession with top one's and challenges just got boring, also the gatekeeping too, people think if your hardest isn't top 100 or something, you're bad.
damn... kaiguy's tweet hit me hard, like i know there are a lot of people who don't give a fuck about the game's integrity (specially after the spaceuk scandal), but actually seeing someone express it and CONTINUING to be part of the community... it was hard to read, and its not even his fault for becoming popular, its the community's for being filled with children
Honestly, Yatagarasu is my favorite top 1. It really was at the peak of my interest of the game and was something I personally remember the best. The whole lead up to it was insane when I was 10 years old.
Great video for me avernus the only reason why it is rated because it was hyped and popular by youtube kids atm it is very important all creators who can make showcase for u I tried kinda smth with my collab "Henken" ig gameplay is balanced also consistent and optimized after one year it still looks better than avernus my level is still not rated because it is nothing special also only neiro made a showcase.
Avernus would've been rated even if it wasn't hyped lmao. Go look at the featured tab rn, you'll see that Avernus deco actually looks better.
@@lukecarroll19 ok there is a lot of nice levels but good example is tidal wave why People like it for me it looks like a normal level without feature thats why for me the Best upcoming demon will be ATH almost everything there for now is looking good also with specific theme about gp I am not Player but for me it looks balanced also I Played layout
i was watching the video having a grand old time and EACH PART IS ON A SINGLE EDITOR LAYER???? WHYY???
Good stuff! Really accurate and entertainig video. I just want to say some things:
The demonlist doesn't really deserve any bit of hate, their job is just ranking the thardest rated demons in the servers, no matter quality, no matter how bad, unfair dogshit is, if it was legit verified and rated, it would be placed.
About of the Avernus deco, i don't think is that bad, even if i don't like it that much i think it's really good, it's just really risky. Take in mind this is a HELL THEMED LEVEL, it looks unique aff taking in mind Avernus theme. It's really atmospheric and as a The Golden's antagonist, is really well executed.
Keep up the good work! :]
I liked avernus deco a decent bit, and specially the fireballs and dragon shadow
the demon list put a rate limit on how often legends can be formed, approximately 1 per geological epoch
If you want to know how bad the problem of Identity is on Avernus
I mistaked this as a sequel to Infernal Abyss.
crazy is a rlly interesting level,it isn't on pointercrate but it was considered a hard level back in 2013,that level's deco is absolutly disgusting even for 1.2 and it has bad use of mirror portals and the level's dificulty is carried by blind jumps,idk which one is worse i cant decide. if you are seeing this plss reply what you think you dont need to like this comment.
I love that people call this level bland and constantly call to mind the fixed hitboxes..
Does that not describe Tartarus? There are so many top demons that were lazily made, little to no effort. I think the level looks good. The hate it receives is truly unjust in my opinion. I don't understand what everyone has against it.
People love to bandwagon and hate on something everyone else hates
i cant say anything about avernus, but tartarus doesnt have any sections that are made less fun because of the fixed hitboxes. Also its in like three spots, the entire predrop on avernus is fixed.
@@laarman. womp womp this comment is old
@@cheery0163 um... two weeks old...
@@laarman. old enough to the point where it's no longer relevant to me in my daily life. I'm no longer open to disputes
Honestly, if you want to play Avernus for the theme and experience, just play Infernal Abyss which is a much better level even in spite of its flaws. Avernus really has nothing to offer and that's just a big turn off to me. Its a hell themed version of The Golden which is just layers of generic stacked on top of each other. Also, great job on the video.
17:35 bro predicted tidal wave
Tidal wave is basically what happened with avernus but worse, so bad that the level didn't even get rated. I don't know what happened but I truly love that level, seems like the community doesn't.
17:36 tidal wave reference
I love how other Zoinked levels like KOCMOC and Tunnel of Despair are following the same way; they have really few records submitted.
Man, this video is so well made! You really feel like the Emplemon of GD (I realised at 17:56 lmao), because you take a popular topic and put an interesting spin on it that ends up meaning more than the sum of its parts. Keep it up man, you could easily be one of the greats!
just randomly found this video on my recommended page and thought it was gonna be the same thing the other 50 "why avernus sucks" videos already said, but it actually said some valid points. nice video man! keep it up!
I have no idea why people judge top ones by gameplay when they aren't even getting past the first click,good decoration matters more and avernus's decoration is good enough. the demon list is a list of the hardest demons not the best.
There's a difference between hard but fair gameplay, and gameplay that's hard and just unfair. People aren't going to like a level full of gameplay that is generally unfair
@@superior_nobody07 doesn't change the fact they can't get past 2% so why does the gameplay matter when only 2 people are able to beat the level?
@@divyanshsingh9369 The issue is Avernus just isn't a good level in general. Top 1 aside, it's got, as mentioned, unfair gameplay and a bunch of fixed hotboxes. It's just not a good level, and that's the general issue with a lot of these top demons. They're so focused on being plain difficult that they often ignore the part about actually being a fun to play level with unique aesthetics. That's the issue with the demon list really. Instead of focusing on making really good and unique levels that have gameplay hard enough for the top, these top demons usually ignore that for the sake of just being a top 1 demon
@@superior_nobody07 the demon list is made for the hardest levels.
Told ya already, judging a top 1 on gameplay is stupid when most people aren't getting past the first click. Decoration and song matter way more and avernus has good decoration and a good song.
@@superior_nobody07Diamond's enjoyment Rating "7,5/10". Zoink's enjoyment Rating is also something like "10/7,5". Fixed Hitboxes do not matter whatsoever, nobody cares, well people who actually play the level don't. Avernus's optimization is the worst I've ever seen in this game, and also everything is on 1 layer which is the reaosn why Zoink buffed it with Fixed Hitboxes.
the demon list is everything that's wrong with gd to begin with