Inverter failure is the risk with a Powerwall 3, lose the inverter and lose your PV, your storage, your back up. The inverter working all day and all night. Bold move trusting this new hybrid inverter. Will the Pwerwall 3 run independently if installing two or more units and one fails?
you are incorrect about the Enphase IQ6 & IQ7’s, they are compatible with the 5P batteries and System Controller 3, they just don’t support “daylight backup”, and the Rapid Shutdown switch doesn’t work with them, but isn’t needed as the standard solar outdoor disconnect works fine. You didn’t mention the 5P batteries and system controller 3/3G now use a hardwired connection for control, that plugs into the combiner with an adapter (or just buy a new combiner, as it comes with the adapter and 4G modem for backup, plus the warranty on the combiner is only 5 years, so you get a new 5 year warranty as well, it’s small $$$ for the combiner anyway, compared to the cost of multiple 5P batteries and the system controller 3/3G.. I like the enphase system, because I don’t need extra batteries, for summer to run the AC, can add a fairly inexpensive 22KW generator ($5K, like one 5P battery) and it will run when needed, recharging batteries based on SOC settings.. and the next day the sun comes out again and tops of the batteries/powers the home.. also good for extended winter storms, with fewer daylight hours to recharge batteries, basiclly run the house forever even in lower daylight hours, or heavy usage (generator kicks in)
I am in NorCal. Just got a quote from Tesla for 2 PW3. I just saw your video how batteries won't save money by shifting off peak vs peak. I bought a house 3 years ago with 10 panel solar and am on NEM 2.0. My goal is to save and pay off by savings. If I add solar now I will be switched to NEM 3.0. Is it worth it to add solar panels still? My whole system will be switched to NEM 3 right?
Thanks, I have an Enphase PV system with IQ8A Inverters and thought they were compatible with the PW3, my local installer just notified me they are not. So I'm going back to the 5Ps, but as you said it's going to cost me MORE for LESS given my local utility gives a $300 CASH REBATE so for my budget I'll be leaving some of that on the table as I can only afford 4 5Ps with 20 kWh vs 27 kWh with 2 PWs. But I like the reliance on the 5P with a single point of failure.
It is compatible with the pw3 but if you have the Enphase system, I prefer the Enphase batteries given you have the space on the wall for all the hardware
@@Superiorsolarconsulting Hey Julian. Thank for all the amazing content. I'm looking at a proposal now with a Tesla Power 3 as an inverter paired with 2 Enphase P5s for a 8.4 kw system. Does this make sense? Given that 5ps are only compatible with IQ8s?
Do you know if it’s possible to add more strings of solar later in time with the PW3? I currently don’t have any system at all, but I do have a Tesla car. Thanks😊
What's confusing about kW vs kWh is that with other measurements we're used to the labeling quite the opposite. For example, if we talk about flow-rate, we'd say gallons per minute (GPM). If we say something has a flow-rate of 5 GPM, we can obviously conclude that after a minute, a 5 gallon bucket would fill. With energy, instead of the "bucket" of energy being called "5 kW"... that's actually a reference to the flow-rate. The "bucket" of energy would be 5 kWh, assuming 5 kW of energy flowed into it for one hour.
Yes, but 1 W = 1 J/s (Joule per second), where J is the standard unit of energy. So we effectively are taking energy per second, and then multiplying by number of seconds in one hour (3600). Thus 1 kWh = 1000 W x 3600 s = 3.6 million Ws = 3.6 million J
I have a sunrun solar system, I purchased it with the house. Now I'm looking to add a battery to it. I've got a bid from sunova and Tesla. And you're right they want $30,000. Just for a battery and this property is in adelanto
A (potential) workaround to the generator issue is a DC converter such as the EG4 ChargeVerter - this would give an adjustable (0-100amp) 5kw max DC @48v which can connect to DC solar inputs. So basically spoofing a solar array. I may end up with this if I go w Tesla but leaning towards Franklin.
Enphase 5p isn't only compatible with IQ8 inverters. IQ6 and IQ7 series are supported. As well as older M215 and M250. However, there are some differences in functionality and configuration requirements. IQ8 is optimal.
Correct me if I'm wrong, but I don't recall any mention of Tesla PW3 disqualifying California residents from their grandfathered NEM 2.0. Would the other two batteries also disqualify NEM 2.0?
I think this is only if you move to DC connections and ditch your micros. In that event, you need to re-permit and PGE would see the increase in inverter capacity.
@@Superiorsolarconsulting Thanks for clarifying. I did not think adding a battery would disqualify NEM 2.0, but I don't think I read the "What to Expect for Powerwall 3" page clearly the first time through. I went back and reread it and it confirms what you're saying.
If you’re buying batteries anyways, the point of nem2.0 savings is irrelevant since the point was to not have to invest in batteries with nem2.0. I’d say drop that system and install a much newer and better system than the 10T. There are problems with it. Give me a call 760-473-5878
Or see if you can drop the batteries from the proposal entirely. There are certain adjustments that can be made to the plan while being able to retain your NEM 2.0 agreement... like you can go down a bit in size, but I don't think you can go up. So perhaps you could drop the battery? But you'll have to either comb through the rules or trust your contractor has if they claim to know it would be a valid option.
What would you recommend to overcome the Franklin limitation in backup mode where the battery will turn PV off until PV production is less than the 5 kW power rating of a single battery? I have a 9 kW system and was told I need two batteries (out of my price range) to ensure extended outage protection since the power rating of the two batteries (10 kW) is greater than PV output (9 kW)
A lot of batteries have similar problems to this. Luckily it’s not too often that the grid is actually down so when it’s just normal nightly battery usage, this should not be an issue
So this is a known thing? We produced over 40 kWh a day so a single battery wouldn’t have cover half a day and we have outages that last far longer than that here in Northern California. I’m not sure how Franklin can be recommended as a great retrofit option if it can’t even cover a whole day outage
@@Steven-ty2yi any battery has backup capabilities. It’s understanding how to size everything. Most people setting themselves with blackouts are not thinking in terms of a week. They’re thinking a day at the most
@@Superiorsolarconsulting I completely understand all of that. But I admittedly have a hard time understanding your perspective and why you are OK recommending a Franklin with this known limitation. When I went solar over five years ago, outages weren't an issue in my area now they not only happen often but for long periods of time. I'm sure all homeowners like myself would prefer a battery that could cover a long outage in the chance it happens over a situation where I lose power because my battery is empty My installer is coming out next week to look at enrolling me in SolarEdge's upgrade program where I get a new, free inverter with 25 year warranty for adding a battery. What do you think of their battery product? They said the SolarEdge battery system operates similarly to the Powerwall 3 including providing protection for a long outage with the same backup power but can provide more energy since its not a string inverter
@@Steven-ty2yi each SolarEdge battery can only discharge at 5kW regardless of inverter size so it’s the same situation. You can’t always get what the Inverter’s max rating is in the real world. For most people, in an outage scenario, 5kW of continuous power is fine. For backing up AC’s 10kW of continuous is more recommended when handling that as well as the other loads
@@Superiorsolarconsulting I understand, it’s just that I’m thinking the Enphase battery will make the most sense for me because the whole rest of my system is Enphase - panels, micro inverters, controller etc.
@@maddeusdoggeus1 I don’t have proof but I’ve heard through a few sources there’s tons of people in Northern California who bought and installed these and can’t turn them on
Inverter failure is the risk with a Powerwall 3, lose the inverter and lose your PV, your storage, your back up. The inverter working all day and all night. Bold move trusting this new hybrid inverter. Will the Pwerwall 3 run independently if installing two or more units and one fails?
Yes I agree and an a bit nervous but the price point is so good it’s difficult to not give it a shot to really see
I see lots of ads for Anker - not their rolling modular units, but wall mounted Solix units. Any experience with these?
you are incorrect about the Enphase IQ6 & IQ7’s, they are compatible with the 5P batteries and System Controller 3, they just don’t support “daylight backup”, and the Rapid Shutdown switch doesn’t work with them, but isn’t needed as the standard solar outdoor disconnect works fine. You didn’t mention the 5P batteries and system controller 3/3G now use a hardwired connection for control, that plugs into the combiner with an adapter (or just buy a new combiner, as it comes with the adapter and 4G modem for backup, plus the warranty on the combiner is only 5 years, so you get a new 5 year warranty as well, it’s small $$$ for the combiner anyway, compared to the cost of multiple 5P batteries and the system controller 3/3G.. I like the enphase system, because I don’t need extra batteries, for summer to run the AC, can add a fairly inexpensive 22KW generator ($5K, like one 5P battery) and it will run when needed, recharging batteries based on SOC settings.. and the next day the sun comes out again and tops of the batteries/powers the home.. also good for extended winter storms, with fewer daylight hours to recharge batteries, basiclly run the house forever even in lower daylight hours, or heavy usage (generator kicks in)
I am in NorCal. Just got a quote from Tesla for 2 PW3. I just saw your video how batteries won't save money by shifting off peak vs peak. I bought a house 3 years ago with 10 panel solar and am on NEM 2.0. My goal is to save and pay off by savings. If I add solar now I will be switched to NEM 3.0. Is it worth it to add solar panels still? My whole system will be switched to NEM 3 right?
You’ll want to do something called a non-export tarrif add on. Give me a call and I can explain it. 760-473-5878
Can you compare the EP CUBE vs the Tesla and Franklin? My solar comp is suggesting these (Florida)
Reach out to me and we can give you a consultation/proposal. 760-473-5878.
Thanks, I have an Enphase PV system with IQ8A Inverters and thought they were compatible with the PW3, my local installer just notified me they are not. So I'm going back to the 5Ps, but as you said it's going to cost me MORE for LESS given my local utility gives a $300 CASH REBATE so for my budget I'll be leaving some of that on the table as I can only afford 4 5Ps with 20 kWh vs 27 kWh with 2 PWs. But I like the reliance on the 5P with a single point of failure.
It is compatible with the pw3 but if you have the Enphase system, I prefer the Enphase batteries given you have the space on the wall for all the hardware
@@Superiorsolarconsulting Hey Julian. Thank for all the amazing content. I'm looking at a proposal now with a Tesla Power 3 as an inverter paired with 2 Enphase P5s for a 8.4 kw system. Does this make sense? Given that 5ps are only compatible with IQ8s?
@@joe423 this makes no sense. The Powerwall 3 is the battery.
Do you know if it’s possible to add more strings of solar later in time with the PW3? I currently don’t have any system at all, but I do have a Tesla car. Thanks😊
Yes you can add more solar later. There are 6 strings, or MPPTs in each Powerwall 3. Text me for a quote if you’re in the market. 760-473-5878
Julian, I believe the Tesla PW3 is now compatible with the meter collar, correct?
Great content, sure learned a lot!
The meter collar was pushed through by Tesla and us currently only compatible with the pw3 when it’s DC coupled and only in certain utilities
What's confusing about kW vs kWh is that with other measurements we're used to the labeling quite the opposite. For example, if we talk about flow-rate, we'd say gallons per minute (GPM). If we say something has a flow-rate of 5 GPM, we can obviously conclude that after a minute, a 5 gallon bucket would fill. With energy, instead of the "bucket" of energy being called "5 kW"... that's actually a reference to the flow-rate. The "bucket" of energy would be 5 kWh, assuming 5 kW of energy flowed into it for one hour.
So true!
@adamgent3889 working on some more interactive whiteboard techniques to show more drawings in real time. You’re on the right track. Thank you
@adamgent3889 I don’t think speed or horsepower matter as much and knowing how the individual drives and knowing their EV’s efficiency
Yes, but 1 W = 1 J/s (Joule per second), where J is the standard unit of energy. So we effectively are taking energy per second, and then multiplying by number of seconds in one hour (3600). Thus 1 kWh = 1000 W x 3600 s = 3.6 million Ws = 3.6 million J
I have a sunrun solar system, I purchased it with the house. Now I'm looking to add a battery to it. I've got a bid from sunova and Tesla. And you're right they want $30,000. Just for a battery and this property is in adelanto
Yepppp.
A (potential) workaround to the generator issue is a DC converter such as the EG4 ChargeVerter - this would give an adjustable (0-100amp) 5kw max DC @48v which can connect to DC solar inputs. So basically spoofing a solar array. I may end up with this if I go w Tesla but leaning towards Franklin.
Enphase 5p isn't only compatible with IQ8 inverters. IQ6 and IQ7 series are supported. As well as older M215 and M250. However, there are some differences in functionality and configuration requirements. IQ8 is optimal.
Yeah just have to do a few things to the existing system. Having the iq8’s really are key with instantaneous throttling
What about the Anker Solarix X1?
Correct me if I'm wrong, but I don't recall any mention of Tesla PW3 disqualifying California residents from their grandfathered NEM 2.0. Would the other two batteries also disqualify NEM 2.0?
I think this is only if you move to DC connections and ditch your micros. In that event, you need to re-permit and PGE would see the increase in inverter capacity.
Just adding batteries does not disqualify you from your nem2 status.
@@Superiorsolarconsulting Thanks for clarifying. I did not think adding a battery would disqualify NEM 2.0, but I don't think I read the "What to Expect for Powerwall 3" page clearly the first time through. I went back and reread it and it confirms what you're saying.
Did you consider the Sigen whole house system for this comparison and dismiss it ?
What’s their market share?
Can the enphase 5p be used for a complete off grid solar system? A friend told me the need to be connected to the grid to be able to start?
Yes it’s for grid tied usage
I am under contact (delayed install) with a NEM 2.0 agreement with PG&E for 2 old Enphase 10T batteries. Should I avoid these?
If you’re buying batteries anyways, the point of nem2.0 savings is irrelevant since the point was to not have to invest in batteries with nem2.0. I’d say drop that system and install a much newer and better system than the 10T. There are problems with it. Give me a call 760-473-5878
Or see if you can drop the batteries from the proposal entirely. There are certain adjustments that can be made to the plan while being able to retain your NEM 2.0 agreement... like you can go down a bit in size, but I don't think you can go up. So perhaps you could drop the battery? But you'll have to either comb through the rules or trust your contractor has if they claim to know it would be a valid option.
Hey thanks for this
any thoughts about battery make up? Mainly between the enphase and franklin...
As in the chemistry?
Correct @@Superiorsolarconsulting
What would you recommend to overcome the Franklin limitation in backup mode where the battery will turn PV off until PV production is less than the 5 kW power rating of a single battery? I have a 9 kW system and was told I need two batteries (out of my price range) to ensure extended outage protection since the power rating of the two batteries (10 kW) is greater than PV output (9 kW)
A lot of batteries have similar problems to this. Luckily it’s not too often that the grid is actually down so when it’s just normal nightly battery usage, this should not be an issue
So this is a known thing? We produced over 40 kWh a day so a single battery wouldn’t have cover half a day and we have outages that last far longer than that here in Northern California. I’m not sure how Franklin can be recommended as a great retrofit option if it can’t even cover a whole day outage
@@Steven-ty2yi any battery has backup capabilities. It’s understanding how to size everything. Most people setting themselves with blackouts are not thinking in terms of a week. They’re thinking a day at the most
@@Superiorsolarconsulting I completely understand all of that. But I admittedly have a hard time understanding your perspective and why you are OK recommending a Franklin with this known limitation. When I went solar over five years ago, outages weren't an issue in my area now they not only happen often but for long periods of time. I'm sure all homeowners like myself would prefer a battery that could cover a long outage in the chance it happens over a situation where I lose power because my battery is empty
My installer is coming out next week to look at enrolling me in SolarEdge's upgrade program where I get a new, free inverter with 25 year warranty for adding a battery. What do you think of their battery product? They said the SolarEdge battery system operates similarly to the Powerwall 3 including providing protection for a long outage with the same backup power but can provide more energy since its not a string inverter
@@Steven-ty2yi each SolarEdge battery can only discharge at 5kW regardless of inverter size so it’s the same situation. You can’t always get what the Inverter’s max rating is in the real world. For most people, in an outage scenario, 5kW of continuous power is fine. For backing up AC’s 10kW of continuous is more recommended when handling that as well as the other loads
IIRC The Enphase has the longest warranty of these three as well.
15 years but no labor
@@Superiorsolarconsulting
That’s still better than just ten.
@@savagecub it just matters what you care about. Labor is expensive…
@@Superiorsolarconsulting
I understand, it’s just that I’m thinking the Enphase battery will make the most sense for me because the whole rest of my system is Enphase - panels, micro inverters, controller etc.
@@savagecub yes I agree. All one software
Well from the jump you are wrong about enphase. It is compatible with the IQ6 & IQ7. Do more reaearch.
It does just not out of the box
Tesla has recently gone to a closed system. Which means the service is Tesla, not known for service.
The battery, yes
All them batteries suck .eg4 makes a much better 14.3 kwh battery for $3,300
They shouldn’t have falsified their UL listing. They definitely do not have the best battery when the inspection fails.
I totally missed that they missed represented their UL Certification. Thanks for the heads up Julian.
@@maddeusdoggeus1 I don’t have proof but I’ve heard through a few sources there’s tons of people in Northern California who bought and installed these and can’t turn them on