Read and watch the links before commenting please. How to Sharpen Metal Files - ruclips.net/video/rRakH7TrE2E/видео.html woodworking.stackexchange.com/questions/3566/how-to-restore-old-files www.wonkeedonkeetools.co.uk/files/how-to-sharpen-a-file/
THANK YOU FOR POSTING! MY Dad used to work with another fellow, back during WW2, reclaiming files. Factories would use files till they just were worthless. They would save them for him and Dad. Then, Dad said, they would use a wire wheel on a crank, (clamp-on), grinder and remove all dirt and metals from the grooves. Then rinse them off and roll them in a towel. They would roll the towel around one file, then on the outside of the towel, they'd put a file on each side and wrap it around one more time and a file on each side, till they ran out of towel. They'd leave the bundles in the sun for 30 minutes and then un-wind them. They were perfectly clean and dry. Then they would lay the files in a glass vat, suspended on little 1/2" x 1/2" wooden pieces the tips and tangs, up off the floor of the vat, and made layers with a little space in between the files. Then they would gently pour in battery acid diluted with water. (I don't remember...seems like 3 to 1, water to acid). Naturally they used their PPE, (aprons, goggles, & gloves). He said you had to take one out and rinse it off and put it in a vat of water and baking soda, to kill the acid, then rinse that off and test it. If it was satisfactory, the whole batch was ready. He said you had to play with the timing, because you could never get exactly the same acid ratio because if the quality of the acid that you dumped it out of a battery. What it does, is etch all surfaces. The file is thinner and less wide, than it was to begin with, but sharper than it was when it was new. After you take them out, and neutralize the acid on them and dry them, you wrap them in newspaper, with 2 thicknesses of paper between each file as you roll them up and twist the ends. This keeps them dry. He said not to introduce oil to them. Leave them pristine. When they re-sold them, each bundle had 10 of the same sized file in them. They were ready to use, right out of the paper. I have tried it and got some awesome files. I hope this helps you.
Golf ball handle....I've done this for years....not only safe but it keeps the surface of the file off surfaces. Forget the nut....just drill smaller hole (about the size of the tang at mid-way)....bang it on. As for "sharpening"....I suspect all the acid does is clean gunk out of grooves....makes edges "proud" so they can grip the filed material.
I learnt the vinegar trick from another utube site; works a treat! I avoided using sulphuric acid due to it's high cost at the local hardware shop.(A$55 for one litre!!!)
Allan Wells I had no idea it was that expensive , good thing I tried this out.You can drop a link to the other video if you would like I wouldn't mind seeing it myself I didn't know anyone else had tried this.Thank you for watching and I appreciate the comment!
With respect, I've been using files for over 60 years and not once in that time have I ever seen, or heard of a resharpen of a file. To preserve the edge on any file is to 1) use a card brush immediately after and between filing. 2) Store it on the flat separately so as to avoid contact with other files. 3) Always keep it clean and minimise exposure to workshop atmosphere (moisture). The anatomy of a file (rasp/file section) is lines/edges/teeth. The space between teeth get clogged, the card brush is effective to remove the crap between the milled edges. It will feel that it has sharpened after the process you describe, but that's because it's clean, and is temporary! The hand craft Motto was: use it, clean it, store it, wear it, bin it.
No.1 is wrong. The first thing I was taught as an apprentice about files was to throw the file card away and use a piece of softer metal ( aluminium or copper)to clean the
@@rogerallen5191 That works well for 'pegs' and 'pins'. For routine cleaning while the file is in use, I use a brass suede brush. This has way thinner wire and really gets down to the bottom of the grooves
As a bonus, you can use the browned vinegar for staining most hardwoods, as long as you figure out how to get rid of the smell. Try it, oak gets all black, a lot of woods become deep brown. Depends on the wood, not the amount you use.
Thats a very interesting thought, I didnt even begin to wonder what I could do with the used vinegar other than pour it out. Thanks for the comment and the idea.
Cnt_Drive_16 I have a ten-year old batch of vinegar-dissolved steel wool sitting in a jar. The colour is yellowish at first, then turns green, then deep rusty red, and eventually over very long time, inky black. If you dissolve a lot of steel at a time, make sure the container leaks a little: for what I've heard, the pressure buildup can result in a glass container splitting
After soaking in the vinegar it's important to rinse in a baking soda and water mixture. It neutralizes the acid and prevents you from getting all the black stuff all over yourself.
I liked the video, but really wanted to pile on for the "acid" thing. It's just the way I'm built... Thanks for putting this up - I had no idea files could be restored this way. I'm not totally sure they are "sharpened", but the key point is they're useful again!
I can agree, I think ill change the title a little bit. If I can start making videos again i think i may do a new video on this topic and make it better. Thank you for the comment!
I will try this on some of my older files. The physics of the way acid disolves metal makes sense. It will eat away at the peaks and valleys at close to the same rate. And S it does this it will remove the damage from the sharp edges leaving close to the original geometry. I still believe the best way is to use a file card and piece if copper during and right after use then store them in something like a wrench roll. But this should help to bring some usefulness back to my old dull files.
I've done this more than once. Hadn't noticed any actual sharpening. The vinegar does remove rust, so folks may be attributing the sharpening to removing rust within the stitching. FWIW, I use files almost every day.
So you did sharpen them with acid in fact. BTW, you can convert the weak acetic acid in vinegar to the much stronger hydrochloric acid by adding common salt (sodium chloride). This makes the acid that is already there more reactive & therefore make the job faster. It does not increase the concentration of acid though, so it will still only treat the same amount of rust before it's completely used up, it just does it much faster. Keeping the acid warm makes it react faster as well. From memory, you add about 2g salt to 100 ml vinegar, probably best to google that though.
You could even tell by the sound it was sharper. May be take a little more time at the start to better clean the file before sharpening. Good to know vinegar works well also
That is a fantastic question and to be completely honest...I don't know. In my opinion I would say that would round the edges off of the file instead of cleaning it and sharpening it. I could be completely wrong though. Thank you for the comment!!
you dont need the nut in the golf ball. just drill a hole a little bigger than the end of the tang (about 1/4" dia), go a little more than half way through the ball and stick it on the end of file. tap working end of file against your work bench a couple good times and that's a wrap. all that rubber stuff inside the ball will grip the corners of the tang and tighten their grip as tang gets wider.
Cnt_Drive_16 yup. did it to most of my files. I would like to get my hands on a bucket of those pee-wee golf, golf balls , the ones that are all different colors so I could better identify, at a glance , at least the type of file or something like that that can be classified by the basic color coding those kinds of balls would offer. but yea, 1/4" ø hole, no nut. ..maybe 3/16"ø, depending on the tang thickness. when you tap the working end straight down on your work bench, with file in vertical position, you know, that will seat the the ball and form around the tang as ball rides up tang. I dont think ive had any trouble with ball coming off while in use. they're way more secure than most wooden handles I've ever used . way, way better than those compression twist on handles our shop teachers used to make us use.. I just had a thought.. I wonder what would happen if this method of file cleaning was combined with the electrolysis style of rust removal I saw on here somewhere. it was either the jeep guy or ford guy, maybe both? ..using a battery charger , bucket of base solution and sacrificial anode.
Now your talking my speed! lol I'm not sure if electrolysis will work with vinegar but if i had to guess i would say no. Electrolysis works great on cast iron pans though. I like the golf ball being round and at the very end i don't want the tang to go thru at all. I don't want it to be dis formed at all but i do love the colored idea, I only have a few so i don't need that feature just yet lol.
Cnt_Drive_16 nothing happens to any of the outter dimensions of the ball. its the round hole that's drilled in it that takes on the shape of the tang. it doesn't misshapen the hole so much that you can't drill it out to glue a nut in and go with how you you have it now.. Its just easier and faster this way and I hang my files from the friction fitted golf ball. as for electrolysis rust removal, it works on all rusty metal. as long as you have a big enough vessel to soak it in without any of it contacting the sacrificial anode, it will work. the negative clamps the rusty metal you're cleaning. positive clamps the anode (hunk of rebar) have them submerged in the same body of base liquid (water and a table spoon or 2 of WASHING soda , not baking soda) plug in charger walk away for a few hours , come back. done.
Oh yea I like electrolysis its easy and a pretty cool show. Just be sure your dog don,t drink out of it while the thing is on! I wouldn't mind trying the way of mounting the golf ball your talking about, If i don,t forget ill do it next time.
do not use a steel wire brush. you already lost some of your sharpness you achieved with acid. use a brass brush or a brass wire wheel and then coat your files with a light spray lubricant. do your vinegar again but clean with brass brush and check the same files and they will be sharper.
J Davidson that's a good point but I don't have a large brass brush I have a tiny one lol I don't think it would make much difference to be honest just because it's bristles and they are not hardened,the file is. I spray mine with wd-40 every so often and especially after the vinegar bath, i do clean mine after every use.
i added some electrolyte to my vinegar made the process much better. ideal solution is 10% acid from my research. get battery acid from advance auto by powersports batteries. getting a wire brush brass wheel that fits in your drill and clean with direction of teeth cut. my files have never been sharp as they are now.all mine were used from garage sales and flea markets.
J Davidson I agree that would definitely work I just didn't want to use conventional acid. I'm the same way I would rather get something from a garage sale do a little work to it and it be good as new.
From a chemistry standpoint, all aqueous acids (acetic acid, sulfuric acid, nitric acid, citric acid) are the same in how they work. They donate a proton to other molecules which, in the case of metals, strips the electrons away from the metal. The electron taken from the metal bonds with the proton because opposites attract, just like poles on magnets. Losing the electron though, is what causes the metal to degrade. The more surface area exposed, the more electrons can be ripped away which is why this trick works on files. Long story short: Doesn't matter what kind of acid you use, as long as its not so concentrated that it eats the file too quickly.
Fit handle on file......insert file into handle and with file end pointing upward tap handle on vise anvil.The weight of file tang will drop into handle firmly...😊
Nice experiment. Your title is a little confusing. As you read on the label of the apple cider vinegar, it contains 5% acetic acid. In the US cooking vinegar contains 5% and if the batch is a little shy they add some or water it down to get it to 5% acetic acid. Even with that bit of confusion you did succeed in sharpening your files. Congratulations. Good job well done. Some suggestions: 1. Use apple cider vinegar for the process. The distilled white vinegar may seem like a better deal but it gets rancid. That's the strong smell. Apple cider vinegar doesn't spoil as fast. It also doesn't stink. I've been able to get 3 or 4 loads of rusty parts through it before it slows down too much to use. 2. Make up a bath container from a piece of PVC pipe and a couple caps. I have a playlist showing the steps. ruclips.net/p/PLXlq5qGw1pepNSS5f6sy8TaSfDYvkxMK2 3. If you want to go a little faster you can use cleaning vinegar. It has 10% acetic acid and will work a bit faster. It is also white vinegar and will have the stink issues. 4. If you want to improve the process use battery acid. It is a mix of sulfuric acid and water. Right out of the battery it will work quite well. 5. I use sulfuric acid based drain cleaner. Not Draino. Draino will remove paint and organics but it won't sharpen the file. 6. Use baking soda as a rinse. It will kill the acid and prevent the files from rusting immediately after drying. Here's a link to my video on sharpening files. ruclips.net/video/4yLSkW5BwbM/видео.html I like the golf ball handle that you patterned after Cody's. It looks like it works well.
I didn't know they made cleaning vinegar where do you get it? The container I used worked fine but if you where going to do all longer objects I would defiantly make a pvc container. I don't like using any kind of acid, after I got a few burns I wanted to try something else. The golf ball handle is actually working really good but I did have to use 2 part epoxy to get the nut to stay in the golf ball. Thank you for all the info! I really appreciate it! Ill go take a look at your video for sure.
Cnt_Drive_16 Any kind of acid deserves respect. Even vinegar. I don't know what kind of stores you have locally but the 10% cleaning vinegar is usually available at the grocery store. When I was a kid the lady I use to do odd jobs for had me wash her windows with vinegar water and newspapers. Paper towels weren't as popular as they are now and the paper use to be delivered every day. It does a good job on hard water stains too.
I'll defiantly have to take a look and see if I can find some just to be curious. Vinegar is great for a lot of stuff I was even thinking about doing a video on some stuff you could use it for but I'm sure you can find other videos already out there.
Cnt_Drive_16 I have found that even if there is are more than one video on a topic there is enough difference between the viewpoints of the creators that there is something to learn. You have an analytical approach that is rare on RUclips. It would be interesting to see what you came up with.
Interesting. I had never heard of sharpening files with acid. I'd have guessed that acid would have a "leveling" effect on the sharp projections -- which have greater surface area -- and actually make the file smoother. I'll give this a try some time and see how it works. It would be fun to rehab some garage sale castoffs and give them new life. Thanks for making the video.
Your welcome! I had no idea that acid was the key either, much less house hold vinegar. To my surprise it worked very well and I've been using the file and keeping it clean ever since. Thank you for the comment.
Yeah. But if I'd made a video titled "How to cut a water melon without a kitchen knife" and then proceed to cut it with a butcher's knife, i don't think anyone smart would buy that. Don't you think?
Xysix thank you very much! I really appreciate it! I actually have not made a video I quite a while but as soon as I can I plan on making more. I love making videos.
Just had a thought, would love some input from anyone; what about potassium alum? I’m sure you’d have to be careful to not let it soak too long, but if you’ve ever used it to dissolve a drill bit broken off in aluminum, it definitely eats away steel. Again, just a thought.
You are still using an ACID just a safer milder one ! just not sulfuric acid. All Acid dose is it diminishes the radius of the angle of a dull edge by removing metal. So the stronger the acid, as well as the time the file is left in acid, will affect the result.
Hey a wire brush just dulls files if u think bout it steel cuts steel so it will dull it too. A horse hair or swine hair boot brush is actually better if you keep on top of cleaning the trash out of files
I wouldn't leave them in there for a week. Otherwise you'd be making some vinegaroon (a liquid that turns leather black, thoroughly, permanently). It's usually made with steel wool so it dissolves quicka.
Why do we still use the tired old " Arsenio Hall" greeting? SSUP YYYtub as though your actually talking to someone. Get to your point and get it done fast.
It really doesn't sharpen the file it just cleans the muck out which in turn will make it file better. Anyone that uses files alot should keep them clean with either straight muriatic acid or hydrocloric acid that cleans pretty fast thats what i use or like he done it here in the video it takes longer to clean but not as effective...
One of the most common forms of file abuse is to keep on trying to file a piece of hardened steel while ignoring the inevitable skating. That will very quickly knock the tips off the teeth of even the best files. If you are not sure how hard the stuff you are filing is, use an old file to 'test the water' before hitting the job with your best files. Acid is a waste of time. All you are doing is turning a file into a piece of metal 'sandpaper' that will grind metal rather than cutting it. Buy good quality files and look after them.
why are you calling this sharpening, your just cleaning the debris between the teeth . the biggest no no for files is to try cutting on the back stroke, the teeth only cut one way !
dan westerberg the process is called etching, acid eats away the metal and makes it sharper. You would normally use sulphuric acid but I wanted to try with vinegar, I would say it defiantly helped. I am now aware your not suppose to use a file on the back stroke, I guess I may had in this video but do not anymore. Thank you for the comment!
it is 'sharper' than before you clean it out. but compare it to a brand new one.........check the teeth with a magnifying glass and you will see what I mean..............but your method sure does save lots of files from the scrap bin .thanks
dan westerberg I defiantly agree with that for sure. It's an older video to, I've learned a lot more about it since then. It would be interesting to see the comparison between sulfuric acid and vinegar.
Being a skeptic and a retired toolmaker I have grave doubts : very grave doubts !that this method would work . Do a examination of before and after under microscope and prove me wrong . I suspect the minimum you are doing are rounding off the sharp cutting edge and Vinegar is such a weak acid you can drink it .Eager to be proved wrong down here in Australia .
However, acids work on an atomic scale, the thinnest part of teeth would erode faster than the thicker base of the teeth. I sharpened a dull bastard file that was rusty and second hand but brought back to life. It's definitely not factory sharp, but if a file is on its last legs, what's the harm? Worst that can happen is it's shaper or garbage anyway, cheers from Canada
It is a bit of a misnomer to say you are Sharpening your files. In actuality you are deep cleaning your files. If it helps great. But you cannot sharpen files to my knowledge. You can make new files if you are very adept in the art as high quality files are hand made, like the industrial quality of the German made Pferd machinist files, but the price can be as much as $300 dollars for a hand cut random tooth cabinet file. I assume Wal-Mart does not sell those, might have to go to Harbor Fright; no I did not misspell 🙄🔫. God save the queen and decent tool companies.
sorry I was mistaken in my last comment, the term is actually de-fouling here's a guy who teaches metal working to back me up ruclips.net/video/rD3ajQMfB2Q/видео.html , sorry bout the last comment, it was deleted no need for that vulgarness on your channel have a good one, keep up the good vids
Carl4193 yea I Agree but vinegar is not what you would normally grab as acid for this plus it's non toxic compared to actual acid. I understand the wording is a little off I apologize. Thank you for your comment!
I would rather watch my knipex pliers get slowly split in half by a hypertough angle grinder than have the smell of vinegar linger on anything near me for more than a microsecond.
lmao that's an extra creative idea. I really think someone would do that without a second thought however, they are the same files and this method works quite well. I would imagine that sulfuric acid may work better and obviously faster.
Thank you for the comment.I have to say at first I wasn't to sure how well this would work but I've got to be honest, I actually ENJOY using my files now because they work so good!I highly recommend using this method because it works so good and its natural.After using them for a while I can say without a doubt this method works very well and I'm testing it on a wooden file.
I have no doubt the correct acid works better. This is only 5% acid and a different type of acid, however it will work if you can't get your hands on the correct acid.
SOOOOOO, fortunate, to possess, enough DECADES, of O. T. J. MACHINIST EXPERIENCE, PLUS!!, , A COLLEGE DEGREE in machine tool technology/ metallurgy, to, readily, identify, this, sensationalized,, , SPECIOUS, EXCREMENT, as the, TEDIOUS, MENDACIOUS, 'SCREWTUBE', , SPEW,that it is!!!!!!HEY, LITTLE BOY, a dull file.,,, IS SCRAP METAL,,, GO BUY A NEW ONE!!!!!!!!
You need to go buy yourself a trophy for all those accomplishments. Too bad nobody gives a shit. Im willing to bet that your coworkers think your a total douche bag.
![COLOMBIA vs. CHILE [4-0] | RESUMEN | ELIMINATORIAS SUDAMERICANAS | FECHA 10](http://i.ytimg.com/vi/TDjN4W3yy1k/mqdefault.jpg)
![ARGENTINA vs. BOLIVIA [6-0] | RESUMEN | ELIMINATORIAS SUDAMERICANAS | FECHA 10](http://i.ytimg.com/vi/C3wPtKNbAOA/mqdefault.jpg)
Read and watch the links before commenting please.
How to Sharpen Metal Files - ruclips.net/video/rRakH7TrE2E/видео.html
woodworking.stackexchange.com/questions/3566/how-to-restore-old-files
www.wonkeedonkeetools.co.uk/files/how-to-sharpen-a-file/
THANK YOU FOR POSTING!
MY Dad used to work with another fellow, back during WW2, reclaiming files. Factories would use files till they just were worthless. They would save them for him and Dad. Then, Dad said, they would use a wire wheel on a crank, (clamp-on), grinder and remove all dirt and metals from the grooves. Then rinse them off and roll them in a towel. They would roll the towel around one file, then on the outside of the towel, they'd put a file on each side and wrap it around one more time and a file on each side, till they ran out of towel. They'd leave the bundles in the sun for 30 minutes and then un-wind them. They were perfectly clean and dry. Then they would lay the files in a glass vat, suspended on little 1/2" x 1/2" wooden pieces the tips and tangs, up off the floor of the vat, and made layers with a little space in between the files. Then they would gently pour in battery acid diluted with water. (I don't remember...seems like 3 to 1, water to acid). Naturally they used their PPE, (aprons, goggles, & gloves). He said you had to take one out and rinse it off and put it in a vat of water and baking soda, to kill the acid, then rinse that off and test it. If it was satisfactory, the whole batch was ready. He said you had to play with the timing, because you could never get exactly the same acid ratio because if the quality of the acid that you dumped it out of a battery.
What it does, is etch all surfaces. The file is thinner and less wide, than it was to begin with, but sharper than it was when it was new. After you take them out, and neutralize the acid on them and dry them, you wrap them in newspaper, with 2 thicknesses of paper between each file as you roll them up and twist the ends. This keeps them dry. He said not to introduce oil to them. Leave them pristine. When they re-sold them, each bundle had 10 of the same sized file in them. They were ready to use, right out of the paper.
I have tried it and got some awesome files. I hope this helps you.
That is pretty cool. Thanks for sharing.
Very cool story!
Golf ball handle....I've done this for years....not only safe but it keeps the surface of the file off surfaces. Forget the nut....just drill smaller hole (about the size of the tang at mid-way)....bang it on.
As for "sharpening"....I suspect all the acid does is clean gunk out of grooves....makes edges "proud" so they can grip the filed material.
I learnt the vinegar trick from another utube site; works a treat! I avoided using sulphuric acid due to it's high cost at the local hardware shop.(A$55 for one litre!!!)
Allan Wells I had no idea it was that expensive , good thing I tried this out.You can drop a link to the other video if you would like I wouldn't mind seeing it myself I didn't know anyone else had tried this.Thank you for watching and I appreciate the comment!
That is expensive. Must be reagent grade. I get plumbers grade 98% for $10 a quart. Great for cleaning toilets once diluted 10:1 water:H2 SO4
Coles now sells an 8% vinegar
You can get sulfuric acid as liquid fire (brand name drain cleaner), it's roughly 99%
With respect, I've been using files for over 60 years and not once in that time have I ever seen, or heard of a resharpen of a file. To preserve the edge on any file is to 1) use a card brush immediately after and between filing. 2) Store it on the flat separately so as to avoid contact with other files. 3) Always keep it clean and minimise exposure to workshop atmosphere (moisture). The anatomy of a file (rasp/file section) is lines/edges/teeth. The space between teeth get clogged, the card brush is effective to remove the crap between the milled edges. It will feel that it has sharpened after the process you describe, but that's because it's clean, and is temporary! The hand craft Motto was: use it, clean it, store it, wear it, bin it.
nifty1940 thank you for the awesome comment and information!
No.1 is wrong. The first thing I was taught as an apprentice about files was to throw the file card away and use a piece of softer metal ( aluminium or copper)to clean the
No.1 is wrong, use aluminium or copper to clean the teeth. The file card should be thrown in the bin as it will dull the file.
@@rogerallen5191
That works well for 'pegs' and 'pins'. For routine cleaning while the file is in use, I use a brass suede brush. This has way thinner wire and really gets down to the bottom of the grooves
The title should read How to clean your files without sulfuric acid.
As a bonus, you can use the browned vinegar for staining most hardwoods, as long as you figure out how to get rid of the smell. Try it, oak gets all black, a lot of woods become deep brown. Depends on the wood, not the amount you use.
Thats a very interesting thought, I didnt even begin to wonder what I could do with the used vinegar other than pour it out. Thanks for the comment and the idea.
Cnt_Drive_16 I have a ten-year old batch of vinegar-dissolved steel wool sitting in a jar. The colour is yellowish at first, then turns green, then deep rusty red, and eventually over very long time, inky black. If you dissolve a lot of steel at a time, make sure the container leaks a little: for what I've heard, the pressure buildup can result in a glass container splitting
So can you use it at the red or green stage to stain wood?
After soaking in the vinegar it's important to rinse in a baking soda and water mixture. It neutralizes the acid and prevents you from getting all the black stuff all over yourself.
Looking back I would agree!
Thank you for the comment!!
I liked the video, but really wanted to pile on for the "acid" thing. It's just the way I'm built...
Thanks for putting this up - I had no idea files could be restored this way. I'm not totally sure they are "sharpened", but the key point is they're useful again!
I can agree, I think ill change the title a little bit.
If I can start making videos again i think i may do a new video on this topic and make it better.
Thank you for the comment!
They’re not sharpened. They’re cleaned.
I will try this on some of my older files. The physics of the way acid disolves metal makes sense. It will eat away at the peaks and valleys at close to the same rate. And S it does this it will remove the damage from the sharp edges leaving close to the original geometry. I still believe the best way is to use a file card and piece if copper during and right after use then store them in something like a wrench roll. But this should help to bring some usefulness back to my old dull files.
I've done this more than once. Hadn't noticed any actual sharpening. The vinegar does remove rust, so folks may be attributing the sharpening to removing rust within the stitching. FWIW, I use files almost every day.
You can't sharpen a dull knife just by dipping it in acid either
So you did sharpen them with acid in fact. BTW, you can convert the weak acetic acid in vinegar to the much stronger hydrochloric acid by adding common salt (sodium chloride). This makes the acid that is already there more reactive & therefore make the job faster. It does not increase the concentration of acid though, so it will still only treat the same amount of rust before it's completely used up, it just does it much faster. Keeping the acid warm makes it react faster as well.
From memory, you add about 2g salt to 100 ml vinegar, probably best to google that though.
Love the information!!! Thank you for the comment!!!
If you use vinegar you should use water saturated with baking sofa to stop the chemical reaction , then oil.
Bandit Dad that's definitely something I'll have to try next time.
Jasco metal etch works way faster and way better. Have used it many times.
You could even tell by the sound it was sharper. May be take a little more time at the start to better clean the file before sharpening. Good to know vinegar works well also
Will it hurt them if I cleaned them in a blast cabinet?
That is a fantastic question and to be completely honest...I don't know.
In my opinion I would say that would round the edges off of the file instead of cleaning it and sharpening it.
I could be completely wrong though.
Thank you for the comment!!
you dont need the nut in the golf ball. just drill a hole a little bigger than the end of the tang (about 1/4" dia), go a little more than half way through the ball and stick it on the end of file. tap working end of file against your work bench a couple good times and that's a wrap. all that rubber stuff inside the ball will grip the corners of the tang and tighten their grip as tang gets wider.
Have you done that?
Cnt_Drive_16 yup. did it to most of my files. I would like to get my hands on a bucket of those pee-wee golf, golf balls , the ones that are all different colors so I could better identify, at a glance , at least the type of file or something like that that can be classified by the basic color coding those kinds of balls would offer. but yea, 1/4" ø hole, no nut. ..maybe 3/16"ø, depending on the tang thickness. when you tap the working end straight down on your work bench, with file in vertical position, you know, that will seat the the ball and form around the tang as ball rides up tang. I dont think ive had any trouble with ball coming off while in use. they're way more secure than most wooden handles I've ever used . way, way better than those compression twist on handles our shop teachers used to make us use.. I just had a thought.. I wonder what would happen if this method of file cleaning was combined with the electrolysis style of rust removal I saw on here somewhere. it was either the jeep guy or ford guy, maybe both? ..using a battery charger , bucket of base solution and sacrificial anode.
Now your talking my speed! lol I'm not sure if electrolysis will work with vinegar but if i had to guess i would say no. Electrolysis works great on cast iron pans though. I like the golf ball being round and at the very end i don't want the tang to go thru at all. I don't want it to be dis formed at all but i do love the colored idea, I only have a few so i don't need that feature just yet lol.
Cnt_Drive_16 nothing happens to any of the outter dimensions of the ball. its the round hole that's drilled in it that takes on the shape of the tang. it doesn't misshapen the hole so much that you can't drill it out to glue a nut in and go with how you you have it now.. Its just easier and faster this way and I hang my files from the friction fitted golf ball. as for electrolysis rust removal, it works on all rusty metal. as long as you have a big enough vessel to soak it in without any of it contacting the sacrificial anode, it will work. the negative clamps the rusty metal you're cleaning. positive clamps the anode (hunk of rebar) have them submerged in the same body of base liquid (water and a table spoon or 2 of WASHING soda , not baking soda) plug in charger walk away for a few hours , come back. done.
Oh yea I like electrolysis its easy and a pretty cool show. Just be sure your dog don,t drink out of it while the thing is on! I wouldn't mind trying the way of mounting the golf ball your talking about, If i don,t forget ill do it next time.
do not use a steel wire brush. you already lost some of your sharpness you achieved with acid. use a brass brush or a brass wire wheel and then coat your files with a light spray lubricant. do your vinegar again but clean with brass brush and check the same files and they will be sharper.
J Davidson that's a good point but I don't have a large brass brush I have a tiny one lol
I don't think it would make much difference to be honest just because it's bristles and they are not hardened,the file is. I spray mine with wd-40 every so often and especially after the vinegar bath, i do clean mine after every use.
i added some electrolyte to my vinegar made the process much better. ideal solution is 10% acid from my research. get battery acid from advance auto by powersports batteries. getting a wire brush brass wheel that fits in your drill and clean with direction of teeth cut. my files have never been sharp as they are now.all mine were used from garage sales and flea markets.
J Davidson I agree that would definitely work I just didn't want to use conventional acid. I'm the same way I would rather get something from a garage sale do a little work to it and it be good as new.
J Davidson nn
From a chemistry standpoint, all aqueous acids (acetic acid, sulfuric acid, nitric acid, citric acid) are the same in how they work. They donate a proton to other molecules which, in the case of metals, strips the electrons away from the metal. The electron taken from the metal bonds with the proton because opposites attract, just like poles on magnets. Losing the electron though, is what causes the metal to degrade. The more surface area exposed, the more electrons can be ripped away which is why this trick works on files.
Long story short: Doesn't matter what kind of acid you use, as long as its not so concentrated that it eats the file too quickly.
Fit handle on file......insert file into handle and with file end pointing upward tap handle on vise anvil.The weight of file tang will drop into handle firmly...😊
Nice experiment.
Your title is a little confusing. As you read on the label of the apple cider vinegar, it contains 5% acetic acid. In the US cooking vinegar contains 5% and if the batch is a little shy they add some or water it down to get it to 5% acetic acid.
Even with that bit of confusion you did succeed in sharpening your files. Congratulations. Good job well done.
Some suggestions:
1. Use apple cider vinegar for the process. The distilled white vinegar may seem like a better deal but it gets rancid. That's the strong smell. Apple cider vinegar doesn't spoil as fast. It also doesn't stink. I've been able to get 3 or 4 loads of rusty parts through it before it slows down too much to use.
2. Make up a bath container from a piece of PVC pipe and a couple caps. I have a playlist showing the steps. ruclips.net/p/PLXlq5qGw1pepNSS5f6sy8TaSfDYvkxMK2
3. If you want to go a little faster you can use cleaning vinegar. It has 10% acetic acid and will work a bit faster. It is also white vinegar and will have the stink issues.
4. If you want to improve the process use battery acid. It is a mix of sulfuric acid and water. Right out of the battery it will work quite well.
5. I use sulfuric acid based drain cleaner. Not Draino. Draino will remove paint and organics but it won't sharpen the file.
6. Use baking soda as a rinse. It will kill the acid and prevent the files from rusting immediately after drying.
Here's a link to my video on sharpening files. ruclips.net/video/4yLSkW5BwbM/видео.html
I like the golf ball handle that you patterned after Cody's. It looks like it works well.
I didn't know they made cleaning vinegar where do you get it? The container I used worked fine but if you where going to do all longer objects I would defiantly make a pvc container. I don't like using any kind of acid, after I got a few burns I wanted to try something else. The golf ball handle is actually working really good but I did have to use 2 part epoxy to get the nut to stay in the golf ball. Thank you for all the info! I really appreciate it! Ill go take a look at your video for sure.
Cnt_Drive_16 Any kind of acid deserves respect. Even vinegar.
I don't know what kind of stores you have locally but the 10% cleaning vinegar is usually available at the grocery store.
When I was a kid the lady I use to do odd jobs for had me wash her windows with vinegar water and newspapers. Paper towels weren't as popular as they are now and the paper use to be delivered every day.
It does a good job on hard water stains too.
I'll defiantly have to take a look and see if I can find some just to be curious. Vinegar is great for a lot of stuff I was even thinking about doing a video on some stuff you could use it for but I'm sure you can find other videos already out there.
Cnt_Drive_16 I have found that even if there is are more than one video on a topic there is enough difference between the viewpoints of the creators that there is something to learn. You have an analytical approach that is rare on RUclips. It would be interesting to see what you came up with.
Old Sneelock's Workshop Thank you very much for all the help and advice I really appreciate it a bunch. Thank you to for the complement!
Interesting. I had never heard of sharpening files with acid. I'd have guessed that acid would have a "leveling" effect on the sharp projections -- which have greater surface area -- and actually make the file smoother. I'll give this a try some time and see how it works. It would be fun to rehab some garage sale castoffs and give them new life. Thanks for making the video.
Your welcome! I had no idea that acid was the key either, much less house hold vinegar. To my surprise it worked very well and I've been using the file and keeping it clean ever since. Thank you for the comment.
White vinegar for all rust removal, works 100%< the longer you leave it, the stronger it works
Add salt to the vinegar
I'm definitely going to try that.
Some wire brushes are high carbon steel. If you use them on a regular bases it will wear on them.
Friend, vinegar is 5% acetic acid....you're still using acid.
Vinegar contains acetic acid not sulfuric acid.
Yeah. But if I'd made a video titled "How to cut a water melon without a kitchen knife" and then proceed to cut it with a butcher's knife, i don't think anyone smart would buy that. Don't you think?
How's that experiment going for you - guessing about what someone smart might buy???
@@cnt_drive_1670 You stated verbally in the video that it was without acid......
Vinegar is still acid, in most cases 24-48 hours is plenty of time. I fire brush before to remove non metallic debris.
The sound of the file tells the story
ron peck absolutely does!
Love your stuff. I subbed and rang your bell. Keep those videos coming.
Xysix thank you very much! I really appreciate it!
I actually have not made a video I quite a while but as soon as I can I plan on making more.
I love making videos.
You know that vinegar is acetic acid, right?
Yes.
I think you're blunting it with that harsh wire brush. Use a nylon brush like the pros.
Rub blackboard chalk onto the teeth of the cleaned file before you start filing , this keeps the teeth from becoming clogged for much longer
I need to get some I've had quite a few people tell me that.
Just had a thought, would love some input from anyone; what about potassium alum? I’m sure you’d have to be careful to not let it soak too long, but if you’ve ever used it to dissolve a drill bit broken off in aluminum, it definitely eats away steel. Again, just a thought.
You are still using an ACID just a safer milder one ! just not sulfuric acid. All Acid dose is it diminishes the radius of the angle of a dull edge by removing metal. So the stronger the acid, as well as the time the file is left in acid, will affect the result.
Rather than a steel wire brush, it would probably be better to use something softer like a brass brush.
The real test for a file is will it cut brass.
That is a wonderful question, one that I wish I could answer.
Hey a wire brush just dulls files if u think bout it steel cuts steel so it will dull it too. A horse hair or swine hair boot brush is actually better if you keep on top of cleaning the trash out of files
I've heard brass is really good to.
Brass file card.
I wouldn't leave them in there for a week. Otherwise you'd be making some vinegaroon (a liquid that turns leather black, thoroughly, permanently). It's usually made with steel wool so it dissolves quicka.
It defiantly don't smell very good I can tell you that , but it does get the job done quite well.
Easy off and a file card rinse oil then file some chalk to prevent future clogging.
alejandro thank you for the advice!
Why do we still use the tired old " Arsenio Hall" greeting? SSUP YYYtub as though your actually talking to someone. Get to your point and get it done fast.
It really doesn't sharpen the file it just cleans the muck out which in turn will make it file better. Anyone that uses files alot should keep them clean with either straight muriatic acid or hydrocloric acid that cleans pretty fast thats what i use or like he done it here in the video it takes longer to clean but not as effective...
One of the most common forms of file abuse is to keep on trying to file a piece of hardened steel while ignoring the inevitable skating. That will very quickly knock the tips off the teeth of even the best files. If you are not sure how hard the stuff you are filing is, use an old file to 'test the water' before hitting the job with your best files.
Acid is a waste of time. All you are doing is turning a file into a piece of metal 'sandpaper' that will grind metal rather than cutting it. Buy good quality files and look after them.
Me who bought a gallon of acid to restore my files: 😬
why are you calling this sharpening, your just cleaning the debris between the teeth . the biggest no no for files is to try cutting on the back stroke, the teeth only cut one way !
dan westerberg the process is called etching, acid eats away the metal and makes it sharper. You would normally use sulphuric acid but I wanted to try with vinegar, I would say it defiantly helped.
I am now aware your not suppose to use a file on the back stroke, I guess I may had in this video but do not anymore.
Thank you for the comment!
it is 'sharper' than before you clean it out. but compare it to a brand new one.........check the teeth with a magnifying glass and you will see what I mean..............but your method sure does save lots of files from the scrap bin .thanks
dan westerberg I defiantly agree with that for sure. It's an older video to, I've learned a lot more about it since then. It would be interesting to see the comparison between sulfuric acid and vinegar.
Never oil a file
it just dawned on me that those wire bristles may be very hard wire and might dull the file
commonconservative that's what I have been told, I need to get a file card.
.
... Without using acid... Vinegar is Acetic acid... Just thought that was important
Benjamin Edwards a quick read of the title should clear up your confusion.
Thank you for the comment.
Being a skeptic and a retired toolmaker I have grave doubts : very grave doubts !that this method would work . Do a examination of before and after under microscope and prove me wrong . I suspect the minimum you are doing are rounding off the sharp cutting edge and Vinegar is such a weak acid you can drink it .Eager to be proved wrong down here in Australia .
However, acids work on an atomic scale, the thinnest part of teeth would erode faster than the thicker base of the teeth. I sharpened a dull bastard file that was rusty and second hand but brought back to life. It's definitely not factory sharp, but if a file is on its last legs, what's the harm? Worst that can happen is it's shaper or garbage anyway, cheers from Canada
It is a bit of a misnomer to say you are Sharpening your files. In actuality you are deep cleaning your files. If it helps great. But you cannot sharpen files to my knowledge. You can make new files if you are very adept in the art as high quality files are hand made, like the industrial quality of the German made Pferd machinist files, but the price can be as much as $300 dollars for a hand cut random tooth cabinet file. I assume Wal-Mart does not sell those, might have to go to Harbor Fright; no I did not misspell 🙄🔫. God save the queen and decent tool companies.
It most defiantly helps. In all honesty i would have to agree its more of cleaning than sharpening but that's just the name I chose.
You said that you're not using ACID then show the Vinegar label that states 5% acidity ..DOH ! Vinegar is an acid !
Honda nighthawk , 1986ish?
It is a 1984 nighthawk 650. Hopefully i will be able to have a little series on fixing it up and riding. Nice observation.
had one the same color. would like to find another some day. good luck with your project
deme7063 thank you.
sorry I was mistaken in my last comment, the term is actually de-fouling here's a guy who teaches metal working to back me up ruclips.net/video/rD3ajQMfB2Q/видео.html , sorry bout the last comment, it was deleted no need for that vulgarness on your channel have a good one, keep up the good vids
vinegar is an acid, it just took longer then other acids. think about it .
Carl4193 yea I Agree but vinegar is not what you would normally grab as acid for this plus it's non toxic compared to actual acid. I understand the wording is a little off I apologize.
Thank you for your comment!
If you simmer, not boil vinegar, you can concentrate it to be very much stronger. just saying.
Carl4193 very cool not going to lie I didn't know that,maybe something to consider.
sweet, because you seem to have an open mind, I subscribed. and it is true.
I defiantly try to stay that way. Thank you for the sub man really appreciate it!
That smaller file was wore out in the middle from wear and tear, the camera picked that out straight away when it was wet.
maritimer Man that's true, it didn't help the small file all that much but the lager one worked much better afterwards.
I would rather watch my knipex pliers get slowly split in half by a hypertough angle grinder than have the smell of vinegar linger on anything near me for more than a microsecond.
Vinegar IS acid.
Ruined them didn't you they rusted bad not same file
lmao that's an extra creative idea. I really think someone would do that without a second thought however, they are the same files and this method works quite well. I would imagine that sulfuric acid may work better and obviously faster.
just dip it in vinegar for an hour or two.
Too easy .better and safer then using acid
Thank you for the comment.I have to say at first I wasn't to sure how well this would work but I've got to be honest, I actually ENJOY using my files now because they work so good!I highly recommend using this method because it works so good and its natural.After using them for a while I can say without a doubt this method works very well and I'm testing it on a wooden file.
Ohh gluten free acid.......
Michael Kane yes! Only the premium acid will say gluten free. Pro tip.
Errr vinegar IS acid
acid works better.
I have no doubt the correct acid works better. This is only 5% acid and a different type of acid, however it will work if you can't get your hands on the correct acid.
Buy sum safeway cola ..c what happens.
I'd rather not 😂😂😂
For the money & time put in I would rather buy new files.
The great thing about RUclips is that any nitwit in the world can publish their sad vids
I couldn't agree more! RUclips is a pretty good platform.
Ian Ewers Also, any nitwit can add comments, without contributing positively. Trolls are the perfect example...
Complete waste of time
Dang....I'm sorry you wasted your time. Hopefully you will spend your time better in the future.
NNNNNNNNNN OOOOOOOOO TTTTTTTTTT!!!!!!!!
Etan Kohcz 😂😂😂
SOOOOOO, fortunate, to possess, enough DECADES, of O. T. J. MACHINIST EXPERIENCE, PLUS!!, , A COLLEGE DEGREE in machine tool technology/ metallurgy, to, readily, identify, this, sensationalized,, , SPECIOUS, EXCREMENT, as the, TEDIOUS, MENDACIOUS, 'SCREWTUBE', , SPEW,that it is!!!!!!HEY, LITTLE BOY, a dull file.,,, IS SCRAP METAL,,, GO BUY A NEW ONE!!!!!!!!
I hope that made you feel better, only little children make fun of others and throw fits.
You need to go buy yourself a trophy for all those accomplishments. Too bad nobody gives a shit. Im willing to bet that your coworkers think your a total douche bag.
Accomplishments? I'm sure internet trolls know a lot about those.