These letters from Mike and Matt are horrendous. These men have no business being on the board of a non-profit designed to help their actual victims escape Scientology. It’s a twisted turn of events.
Mike, Mark, & Matt violated the new rules they just created to kick Aaron out…so by the Aftermath own rules they must step down. Until this happened with Aaron nobody really thought about the power members had had affecting people coming forward. That was a mistake. But when this happened with Miriam all lines were crossed.. everyone on board showed us who they still are, I believe them. Pls aftermath board resign.
Matt like Mike an Mark keep saying there's still deep dark info about AAron. He called them on it and told them post any of my info you want I've already owned everything and then some . That's true , he told us stuff about his private life that we didnt feel was our buisness but for the sake of transparency he confessed all .That took gigantic Brass Balls , i respect him for that
Yes I imagine having to listen to people flopping around about Aaron was inconvenient and time consuming for Mike. Just like Aaron giving Mike a job when he moved to Florida without a pot to piss in or a window to throw it out of was likely inconvenient and time consuming for Aaron. Oh the things SOME OF US do for the people we call friends.
I could not agree with you more, Graham. I’ve been saying this for days now. I have no ill will toward MMC, nor anyone else on the AF board…but their remaining is a disservice to the Foundation and hinders its ability to fulfill its mission 💐
You hit the nail on the head! The best part is that you are a third party that watched this unfold on your own . The people who are really taking the high road and focusing on what the true cause is like Aaron are not wasting their time mud slinging. The genuine people have gravitated towards each other and are supporting each other and working like hell to try to help reach others especially after the damage the aftermath board has done. Who the hell are they to pass judgement on others and getting involved in Aaron's personal life? I don't trust the board and I would never suggest to anyone to seek help from them. No one is talking about Leah and how she is not defending what is right. I am losing respect for her everyday. It seems to be Leah's and the foundation's dog and pony show!!!!!!
I can’t imagine that anything MMC could be threatening Aaron with could even come close to the evil that Mike and Claire have committed. The current AF Board needs to go.
One of the reasons I think former church executives should not be on the board is that they learned management from Scientology. It's the only way they know how to manage, so they've just replaced the "Church of Scientology" with "The Aftermath Foundation" and doing all the things to "protect" the foundation that they would have done in years past to protect the Church.
There have been a couple videos that I have seen that are backing the AF board. However both of the people work for the Foundation. Thank you for your perspective, it is a valuable one & I agree.😊😊
I have my political opinions like everyone else, but when it comes to Scientology, I don't really care what your politics are. If we can agree on this, that's enough.
If captain davie hadn't turned on rinder he'd still be there destroying people's lives. He didn't suddenly realize that what he was doing was wrong and illegal. He had it done to him and didn't like it so he left.
This happens every single time ex-Scientologists try band together to do something outside the church. Solution: Ex-Scientologists may not be on the board, because you can take the Scientologist out of Scientology but you can't take Scientology out of the Scientologist. Those old habits don't go away easily. An ex-Scientologist working together with never-ins seems to work fine though.
Katherine Olson….ummm Aaron and Luis started the Aftermath foundation. The others joined it. Thus your statement is incorrect. And if you listened to this stream/video you will see why the the foundation needs to change its members. The stakeholders are the donators not the board, they do not own it - it is not theirs. They are just administrators (not really knowledgeable ones) to decide who are allotted the funds.
Well A-Aron will be a board member on the new foundation, but it will be mixed with members that have never been in Scientology. He said it will be very diverse and NO COUPLES.
Thankfully, AAron is close to announcing a far better foundation with a balanced board of directors. He says there are all types of community representatives and essential never-in members on the board. I expect the Aftermath Foundation will become defunct and disappear.☺️
Kelli has a very sad story of being declared as a suppressive person since age 6 and she is amazing! You are correct about trust in the Aftermath Foundation. And the more the show their vindictiveness the less trust there will be. Subscribed to your channel@
Too much time has passed for those that are still in to remember Mike, Claire and the others. I think the main issues are between those who left years ago and are now coming to grips with what they all went through. Mike has a hate on for Aaron (who knows the real reason) and I believe this is what is stirring the pot. Mike has so much influence on the others. They will not go against him. I still find it sad that they were willing to destroy relationships over a Foundation. It makes no sense. In the name of helping others they are willing to destroy themselves. As Aaron said, they are the foundation.
I don't think Mike Rinder actually has influence, he hides behind Leah Remini who has the most influence and perhaps Leah should reign him in. Because if one had to compare what Mike has done in the past compare to Aaron, I think Aaron is in a better place than Mike.
I think the main issue is seeing the way Miriam was treated. BUT Mike, Mark, & Matt violated rule they just created. It says a board member may not talk negative about anyone in the movement or associated with someone or something of benefit to the movement. They created and used that rule to kick Aaron off. Seems only right.
Mike and Mat made a terrible mistake by coming after ( super popular ) Aaron. Like Omar said on “The Wire”, “You come for the king, you best not miss.”
Thankfully there are so many never-ins. We can all keep an eye on the creators, and hopefully, point out behaviors that still "LRH script driven". Thinking you are "cured" is the first step towards a big old relapse.
We have to remember that all these people were in a cult for 20-30-40yrs, despite leaving there is trauma, behaviour patterns etc that would influence their questionable behaviour. It would make sense for The aftermath Foundation to have a cult expert psychologist or other mental health and cult rehab specialist on the board. Mike and gang could be the figure heads, but being an authority doesn’t appear ideal for their healing or those who they want to help. I don’t believe Mike is malicious. I suspect that he has some ways to go before he is sufficiently recovered from brainwashing, let alone the guilt he must feel for the physical and psychological trauma he himself committed on others, before he is in a role of such authority. IMO.
I do think Mike is malicious, vindictive and paranoid. He has shown us who he is. His past is littered with ruined lives and he is continuing destroy. We were willing to forgive him when we thought he was truly repentant. His recent actions and behavior have shown us he is still who he has always been.
Please learn Kelli Copter’s story. She was declared a SP at 6 years old. She also has produced content for members of the AF because she has amazing editing and production skills. The AF had her working on a documentary and lied to her about the contents. She walked away. She is one amazing woman ❤
I totally agree that's it's inappropriate for the board to be governed by ex sea org executives and henchmen. And that's never been more obvious than now as we see the efforts the board has made to silence and marginalize the people they say they are serving. I'm also uncomfortable with the highly moralistic basis at the core of their criticism of Aaron Smith-Levin and think those judgements should not be a factor in governing a non-profit. This is not a church. I don't think we need to assume what the deep inner motivations of the Rinders and Headleys are, but focus on how the organization should be restructured from this point on. And while doing that continue to listen (and NEVER try to silence) survivors of abuse from cos. I'm a neverin, but I've worked with both perpetrators and survivors of child sa, and I recognize the hallmarks. I don't think the current board has much insight into any of this, and that's a problem.
Great video! I agree w/you, and I've served on a nonprofit board before. Your feedback to them under normal circumstances would be considered great constructive critique.
I have to come to Graham to get some clarification on wtf is going on I had to stop watching some of these folks, some of my previously fav channels. Thanks for the clarification
My biggest beef with the SPTV channels is that the stuff they put up on YT tends to be really long live streams. (To be fair, it's not just SPTV - it's a thing with a lot of what I guess you could call "current events" type channels). It can be kind of pain to sift through 90 minutes of stuff to find the 8 minutes you're interested in.
@@grahamokeefe9406 ya I’m having the same issue. I’m just too busy to get to enough of them. Plus some of it has been such a turnoff. I love that you are around 10 mins or less, and you get right down to it. People forget that people who want to stay “in”, also have constitutionally protected rights.
WRONG !!! Former members are an important part of the foundation. Just not couples. If u feel you can’t take the Scientology out of an ex member why u here ?
He said former members are good on the board. He said former Executives are probably NOT good on the board. They represent the scariest part of Scientology abuse and surely wouldn’t be safe-feeling to people trying to get out.
Get monetized. Your opinion is as valid as everyone else’s. Doesn’t every fricken white straight couple from the board have a monetized RUclips channel? Like are they the only ones that can share their opinion?
These letters from Mike and Matt are horrendous. These men have no business being on the board of a non-profit designed to help their actual victims escape Scientology. It’s a twisted turn of events.
And Marc Headley
Good points bringing up that policy they fired Aaron over and the hypocrisy of remaining board members. Thank you
💯
Mike, Mark, & Matt violated the new rules they just created to kick Aaron out…so by the Aftermath own rules they must step down. Until this happened with Aaron nobody really thought about the power members had had affecting people coming forward. That was a mistake. But when this happened with Miriam all lines were crossed.. everyone on board showed us who they still are, I believe them. Pls aftermath board resign.
Matt like Mike an Mark keep saying there's still deep dark info about AAron. He called them on it and told them post any of my info you want I've already owned everything and then some . That's true , he told us stuff about his private life that we didnt feel was our buisness but for the sake of transparency he confessed all .That took gigantic Brass Balls , i respect him for that
Mike Rinder posted Mirriams police report with out certain information being removed! He gave it right to hands of OSA
AAron Founded the AF with His Heart But Mike Stole it with his EGO
Yes I imagine having to listen to people flopping around about Aaron was inconvenient and time consuming for Mike. Just like Aaron giving Mike a job when he moved to Florida without a pot to piss in or a window to throw it out of was likely inconvenient and time consuming for Aaron. Oh the things SOME OF US do for the people we call friends.
Can you imagine being a CRIMINAL, while pretending to help victims and still having such a big ego?
I could not agree with you more, Graham. I’ve been saying this for days now.
I have no ill will toward MMC, nor anyone else on the AF board…but their remaining is a disservice to the Foundation and hinders its ability to fulfill its mission 💐
You hit the nail on the head! The best part is that you are a third party that watched this unfold on your own . The people who are really taking the high road and focusing on what the true cause is like Aaron are not wasting their time mud slinging. The genuine people have gravitated towards each other and are supporting each other and working like hell to try to help reach others especially after the damage the aftermath board has done. Who the hell are they to pass judgement on others and getting involved in Aaron's personal life? I don't trust the board and I would never suggest to anyone to seek help from them. No one is talking about Leah and how she is not defending what is right. I am losing respect for her everyday. It seems to be Leah's and the foundation's dog and pony show!!!!!!
I can’t imagine that anything MMC could be threatening Aaron with could even come close to the evil that Mike and Claire have committed. The current AF Board needs to go.
It is awful what has happened the goal is to take down the Scientology organization not to traumatize victims over and over!
One of the reasons I think former church executives should not be on the board is that they learned management from Scientology. It's the only way they know how to manage, so they've just replaced the "Church of Scientology" with "The Aftermath Foundation" and doing all the things to "protect" the foundation that they would have done in years past to protect the Church.
They all should step down. What a disaster it’s been.
There have been a couple videos that I have seen that are backing the AF board. However both of the people work for the Foundation.
Thank you for your perspective, it is a valuable one & I agree.😊😊
Thank you for your objectivity, and support of our whole community - sans politics. 💜
I have my political opinions like everyone else, but when it comes to Scientology, I don't really care what your politics are. If we can agree on this, that's enough.
If captain davie hadn't turned on rinder he'd still be there destroying people's lives. He didn't suddenly realize that what he was doing was wrong and illegal. He had it done to him and didn't like it so he left.
DISSOLVE THE AF!!!!
This happens every single time ex-Scientologists try band together to do something outside the church.
Solution: Ex-Scientologists may not be on the board, because you can take the Scientologist out of Scientology but you can't take Scientology out of the Scientologist. Those old habits don't go away easily.
An ex-Scientologist working together with never-ins seems to work fine though.
It's not for you to say whose on the board or not. It's their foundation. Not yours.
@@Katherine_Olson he is expressing a valid opinion, why would you want to deny him his 1st. Ammendment rights?
Katherine Olson….ummm Aaron and Luis started the Aftermath foundation. The others joined it. Thus your statement is incorrect. And if you listened to this stream/video you will see why the the foundation needs to change its members. The stakeholders are the donators not the board, they do not own it - it is not theirs. They are just administrators (not really knowledgeable ones) to decide who are allotted the funds.
@@Fire_n_Ice_canada Well said!
Well A-Aron will be a board member on the new foundation, but it will be mixed with members that have never been in Scientology. He said it will be very diverse and NO COUPLES.
Thankfully, AAron is close to announcing a far better foundation with a balanced board of directors. He says there are all types of community representatives and essential never-in members on the board.
I expect the Aftermath Foundation will become defunct and disappear.☺️
AS they pocket a quarter of a million dollars in the trust ...
Kelli has a very sad story of being declared as a suppressive person since age 6 and she is amazing! You are correct about trust in the Aftermath Foundation. And the more the show their vindictiveness the less trust there will be. Subscribed to your channel@
Thanks for the sub! Glad you're here!
Too much time has passed for those that are still in to remember Mike, Claire and the others. I think the main issues are between those who left years ago and are now coming to grips with what they all went through. Mike has a hate on for Aaron (who knows the real reason) and I believe this is what is stirring the pot. Mike has so much influence on the others. They will not go against him. I still find it sad that they were willing to destroy relationships over a Foundation. It makes no sense. In the name of helping others they are willing to destroy themselves. As Aaron said, they are the foundation.
I don't think Mike Rinder actually has influence, he hides behind Leah Remini who has the most influence and perhaps Leah should reign him in. Because if one had to compare what Mike has done in the past compare to Aaron, I think Aaron is in a better place than Mike.
I agree with @cherryskye1 and I think that Mike R is insanely jealous or A-aron.
I think the main issue is seeing the way Miriam was treated. BUT Mike, Mark, & Matt violated rule they just created. It says a board member may not talk negative about anyone in the movement or associated with someone or something of benefit to the movement. They created and used that rule to kick Aaron off. Seems only right.
Thanks Graham! Well said. Your graphic is excellent in your intro, I must say!
Thanks!
Mike and Mat made a terrible mistake by coming after ( super popular ) Aaron. Like Omar said on “The Wire”, “You come for the king, you best not miss.”
All need to step down.
Thankfully there are so many never-ins. We can all keep an eye on the creators, and hopefully, point out behaviors that still "LRH script driven". Thinking you are "cured" is the first step towards a big old relapse.
Yes! Excellent points.
We have to remember that all these people were in a cult for 20-30-40yrs, despite leaving there is trauma, behaviour patterns etc that would influence their questionable behaviour. It would make sense for The aftermath Foundation to have a cult expert psychologist or other mental health and cult rehab specialist on the board.
Mike and gang could be the figure heads, but being an authority doesn’t appear ideal for their healing or those who they want to help.
I don’t believe Mike is malicious. I suspect that he has some ways to go before he is sufficiently recovered from brainwashing, let alone the guilt he must feel for the physical and psychological trauma he himself committed on others, before he is in a role of such authority. IMO.
I do think Mike is malicious, vindictive and paranoid. He has shown us who he is. His past is littered with ruined lives and he is continuing destroy. We were willing to forgive him when we thought he was truly repentant. His recent actions and behavior have shown us he is still who he has always been.
@@eagle-eye29- Agree with all you said.
Please learn Kelli Copter’s story. She was declared a SP at 6 years old. She also has produced content for members of the AF because she has amazing editing and production skills. The AF had her working on a documentary and lied to her about the contents. She walked away. She is one amazing woman ❤
I'm aware of bits of it but not the whole thing, which is why I didn't go into detail, but I agree, her production skills are great.
Bring Luis and Aaron back
I totally agree that's it's inappropriate for the board to be governed by ex sea org executives and henchmen. And that's never been more obvious than now as we see the efforts the board has made to silence and marginalize the people they say they are serving. I'm also uncomfortable with the highly moralistic basis at the core of their criticism of Aaron Smith-Levin and think those judgements should not be a factor in governing a non-profit. This is not a church. I don't think we need to assume what the deep inner motivations of the Rinders and Headleys are, but focus on how the organization should be restructured from this point on. And while doing that continue to listen (and NEVER try to silence) survivors of abuse from cos. I'm a neverin, but I've worked with both perpetrators and survivors of child sa, and I recognize the hallmarks. I don't think the current board has much insight into any of this, and that's a problem.
Great video! I agree w/you, and I've served on a nonprofit board before. Your feedback to them under normal circumstances would be considered great constructive critique.
I have to come to Graham to get some clarification on wtf is going on
I had to stop watching some of these folks, some of my previously fav channels.
Thanks for the clarification
My biggest beef with the SPTV channels is that the stuff they put up on YT tends to be really long live streams. (To be fair, it's not just SPTV - it's a thing with a lot of what I guess you could call "current events" type channels). It can be kind of pain to sift through 90 minutes of stuff to find the 8 minutes you're interested in.
@@grahamokeefe9406 ya I’m having the same issue. I’m just too busy to get to enough of them. Plus some of it has been such a turnoff.
I love that you are around 10 mins or less, and you get right down to it.
People forget that people who want to stay “in”, also have constitutionally protected rights.
I use the fast forward button a lot
I watch everything on 1.5 speed 😁
I do too, but those videos are still really long.
Well said
The whole board needs to go. They’re all on an ego trip
Nailed it!
Im thinking rinders daughter actually was onto something when she made the statement on him.
BINGO!
Respectfully, Kelli Copter's looks did not need to be mentioned.
What she looks like isn't important. Also, you didn't mention anyone else's looks..
It was in the context of why her channel blew up so quickly. In any case, feel free to start your own channel if you don't like mine.
Wow Rinder being Rinder, what were the chances that was going to happen??
LOL
WRONG !!! Former members are an important part of the foundation. Just not couples. If u feel you can’t take the Scientology out of an ex member why u here ?
They didn't say they couldn't be involved in the Foundation, just not on the board. And that might actually be a good idea
He said former members are good on the board. He said former Executives are probably NOT good on the board. They represent the scariest part of Scientology abuse and surely wouldn’t be safe-feeling to people trying to get out.
Another one jumping on the bandwagon for likes and views.
To be honest, I couldn't care less about the likes and views. I'm just watching stuff happen and saying what I think
Yes, because sharing a valid viewpoint is a horrible thing. That’s what RUclips is about. If you don’t like it, leave.
Her opinion might make sense if I were monetized or something. I have no ambitions in that direction.
Get monetized. Your opinion is as valid as everyone else’s. Doesn’t every fricken white straight couple from the board have a monetized RUclips channel? Like are they the only ones that can share their opinion?
I appreciate the input. I'm just not sure that YouTubing for money is something I want to do.