I've never understood this. The focus should be on the gameplay, level design, writing and art design. The gender of the character should be irrelevant. The gender of the character has never, ever, been a factor in my enjoyment.
To me in games, and ONLY games (specifically RPGs) I have to feel like I am the character otherwise I can't immerse myself. Doing that with such a fleshed out character as Geralt for example was hard but I still could. Can't really do that with Ciri even though I love her.
@@brachialplexus100 that's a shame, but totally fair. I think it's kind of the opposite for me. Having a fleshed out character makes me actually roleplay that character and "lose" myself in the world. With fully customizable characters I often just end up making decisions as myself, as the person playing a video game, and it can take me out of the immersion.
@@damned0wl Yup, that's me. Blank slate characters, with no personalities, make it very clear that I'm playing a video game rather than an active part of a narrative. Commander Shepard and Geralt have easily been the best RPG characters I've played, where I could also make decisions based off their personalities and attitudes.
Gearlt is a fine protagonist but I wouldn't really call him fleshed out especially in the games. He's basically the players character who's good at everything and doesn't have many flaws.
Witcher Remake will come out, which will basically be a whole new game, they will just take the plot of Witcher 1 and expand it, and obviously we will play as Geralt so people will get the Geralt game they want
It will be a whole new woke game. They will remove all the fun parts like sex cards. And Witcher 1 doesn't need expansion in story elements, it has a great story. It needs graphic and gameplay enhancement. Everything else is perfect.
As long as the story of the game is good. That's all that matters. Also at the end of the day, gaming is a hobby, no matter who you are. It's a hobby FIRST. Yes somebody can turn it into a job, but it's entertainment at the end of the day. It doesn't control the person's life.
This is one of the reasons I love this channel! The nuance. No culture war bs! I definitely understand wanting to play as your own gender. Theres no shame in admitting that. I tend to only play games with CaC or gender options for that reason. The issue comes when you expect every game in a franchise to cater to only you or your percieved “majority.” Gaming is a space for everyone. Its a simple fact that male stories are overwhelmingly represented. Creators should be able to experiment with different takes and perspectives as they see fit. With a series like the Witcher, I can see why some maybe had certain expectations but overall Ciri was the next logical choice for an MC. I don’t think half of the critiscm has been very fair but I guess theres always going to be some people you can’t please
Sometimes I wonder if its a comfort thing, I've been playing TTRPG's for decades and I know and have some friends who only play the same character every campaign that is run, no matter the system, they will find a way to play that character. Its a safe bet for them. While I have a preference to not only play something nothing like me, but to try and make my characters as different as diverse as possible, the more variety in the experiences I have the better, and for me that extends to video games too. Gender, race, politics, faith aren't an issue for me as long as they are done well and can give me a new perspective on things. I find myself genuinely curious of those things, I'm not a man of faith, but I find people who are endlessly fascinating and sometimes games and movies are the only way I can engage with that in a meaningful way. Point being, getting out of your comfort zone to experience something you normally wouldn't can be a fantastic, sometimes profound and sometimes life changing experience. But I understand the fear of the unknown.
I’m a guy and usually prefer playing games where the lead is a woman. Depending on the genre, it can make the story/experience more interesting and engaging. That’s just my opinion though. Someone doesn’t have to look like you in order for you to relate to them. If that’s what determines how relatable something is for you, you’re missing out on a lot of good stories and characters
I've only ever played opposite sex characters if that's an option. I've never _not_ played a game if it's gender bound. But if there's an option, I always choose the opposite. I like to role play as someone else.
@@garywood97 i thought she lost most of her elder blood powers when she full filled the prophesy and defeated the white frost, since thats what the elder blood powers whole purpose was , kind of a sacrifice for a greater good thing
@@JaineSlayerr well, it's unclear for now... I do think her Elder Blood abilities will be suppressed in the beginning (either from defeating the White Frost, or the mutations), but not having them in the game at all would be a strange move. Teleporting is fun :)
I use to find it hard to play as a women but I’m over it now I just want the game to be good and The Witcher 4 is my second most anticipated game only after gta 6
If you can't feel empathy for another human being, not even one you directly control, I think the problem would be that player, maybe he's a psychopath.
That's going way too far. There's a difference between feeling empathy for a character and identifying with one. And even not feeling empathy for a fictional character doesn't make someone a psychopath, not even close.
CDPR never really have done create a characters. Yeah you could customise V in Cyberpunk but they were still a pre-defined character much like Commander Shephard in Mass Effect. Ciri was the next logical contender to take over, she's trained by Geralt from the age of 10 in the books, she was playable in parts of the Witcher 3 - they haven't plucked a female protagonist out of thin air and this shouldn't even be controversial to anyone who played the Witcher games. The issue is (anti-woke) people have melted their brains on culture war propaganda and are pre-disposed to react emotionally to this stuff without any care for context. People can have their preferences in games with customisable character options, but I really many gamers would grow a pair of balls and get out of their comfort zone. That doesn't mean every player character is automatically well written but you should make an effort to engage with player characters who are opposite sex.
Ive played new vegas, and other rpgs hundreds of times but only played as a female a handful of times. But if a single player story has a female protagonist that is a good character in a good story, it doesnt make a difference
I'm the same way, I'd rather play either a male character or be given the chance to create my own character . I can do without, as I did with Horizon zero dawn or Nier automata, but overall my preference is for male heroes.
Media should never be twisted to fit into boxes to add more representation for the sake of it, it should always feel natural. But that goes for games with female characters just as much as for male ones. The reason there's no male option for Witcher 4 is as simple as the devs believing Ciri is the best, most natural pick with the most storytelling potential. Just as the Witcher 1-3 were about a pre-defined character in Geralt, 4 will be one for Ciri. They're just not twisting the mainline games to add more representation. In this case it's just cutting the other way. I think having a preference for playing same-sex characters is totally understandable and fine, I just draw the line at tarring or coming at the devs for their choice. Not saying everyone is doing that, I'm just saying those are the only people I have an issue with. Just, think about it this way: like Luke said, some female gamers feel this way about male characters, and imo fair is fair.
i'm like your wife. Frankly, i find it hard to relate to a game if i'm playing as a female character, that's why in pretty much every game that has a character creator, i always make the same dude. I hoped this new Witcher game would be time to introduce a character creator to the series, maybe have Ciri as our partner/mentor. I'll play it regardless because it's The Witcher but i'd have preferred to make my own character.
I really, really, do not get this especially in games with predetermined characters like The Witcher. I actively want to experience as many different types of characters in games.
Agreed. I think it's totally fair with blank slate characters, but I don't get the upset over pre-existing, defined characters like Geralt and Ciri. I mean, this is literally just Geralt, except it happens to be cutting the other way with a female rather than a male. I just wish people would be a bit more honest with their reasoning or justifications.
How many people who have trouble playing as opposite-sex characters have no problem with non-human playable characters? Legitimately I have trouble with how that works psychologically. Non-humans are my problem. In Outer Wilds you're a thing with four eyes. That actually turned me off at first. Similar with the idea of Dwarf Fortress, I'm not a fantasy nerd and I don't care about dwarves, is what I told myself before it clicked
I don't really have trouble with either, but I think gender is a factor more often than non-human characters. I mean, most people who play fantasy games probably like fantasy :)
I find it odd that people can't play something that isn't like them. Glad I don't experience this immersion stuff cuz it just sounds limiting and annoying. Play the game if you think youll like it, skip if dont.
I think it depends how you approach role playing: do you see yourself as the character OR, as I like to do it, do you see yourself like an author telling a story through that character. I like to see myself as an author and invent a personality for my character and try to make decisions not as I would make them myself, but as I imagine the character to make them. And I think this also includes physical appearance. I'm a dude, but I always create female characters, because for me the point isn't for me to identify with the character, I'm not the character, we're 2 different people with different values and personalities.
99% of the situations will have nothing to do with the characters gender....like can no men related to the woman who is about to be sacrificed out of traditions feelings because she is a woman....the whole idea just seems absurd...i get it, there might be some situations where this applies, but most situations are just human feelings
Honestly it is dealers choice, for me one of my main criteria for what games I'll play does depend on whether or not I have the option for a feminine character and if I'm locked into only playing a masculine character and their gender has absolutely nothing to do with the plot (ie roleplay value that makes their gender absolutely essential) then there is a higher likelihood I won't play it for lack of a feminine protagonist. Honestly if the gender is non-essential then I don't see why the can't pull a Cyberpunk or a Mass Effect and just get multiple voice actors to record the same lines and then everyone can be happy.
But because the gender IS essential here, you don't have an issue, right? Cause Ciri is a pre-defined character, same as Geralt, and the devs felt she was the most natural choice with the most storytelling and thematic potential.
@@scirrhia_kruden Honestly I have no issue with Ciri being the main as for myself the only Witcher game I own is 3 because I knew Ciri was partially playable in the game, that and the reputation of the game. I didn't finish the game partially because I wasn't able to jump into playing Ciri from an earlier point and to be honest didn't feel any real connection with Geralt so the rp was flawed for me. For me Geralt lives too much in some of the negative role aspects of masculinity, personally, I wanted more emotional availability and internal dialogue from him (would have helped to flesh out the story and ground the character as someone I can relate with).
@@quietdistance8594 Part of the point is that he's imperfect, some of the complaints you mentioned are things he works through throughout the game. spoilers: it specifically ties into how and why he settles down on his Vineyard with Yennefer at the end.
@@quietdistance8594 oh, and I just wanted to say that I wanted to clarify because you never know here (in Luke's fandom, and also more generally). I've seen people saying there's no real reason for Ciri to be the protagonist, so ending on that last part of your comment left things ambiguous imo
This is something that I've always felt and I never really have any discourse about it because this type of cultural environment is very hostile. But I for one desperately seek immersion in the RPGs that I play. Whenever I play a video game that is not just mindless action, I care a lot about immersing myself into a character and the world that I am playing into. And as a guy, I can never really immerse myself if I'm playing a female character. It is the furthest away from all other possible iterations. Hell, even if I'm playing a male orc, I can somewhat fill the space of the fiction in my head and make it make some type of sense. But flipping genders is so significantly hyperbolic that I can never quite make that work. With that said, I accept that I'm not the only demographic and just as I enjoy being immersed, I'm sure other female players also would love to be immersed by playing female lead roles. Therefore, I accept that some games will simply not be for me. It is a shame when it is a sequel to a game that I very much love and enjoy and would love to continue to be immersed in, but that's just life.
It is genuinely a shame that some people won't be able to continue enjoying the games because of this. If I couldn't play as characters of the opposite gender, I would've missed out on the first three Witcher games and Disco Elysium, and I hate to imagine that
no thats no the problem. The problem is almost all games and movies now days focus on a female lead. I would like more variation, i have no problem playing as female.
It's definitely a different experience, although not a deal breaker. Areas like romance are weird though. I can never get into the romance sub-plots if the main character is a woman.
Out of curiosity, is it specifically playing as a woman in a romance, or romancing male characters that is the issue? Both are understandable, but the latter shouldn't be a problem with Ciri, since she's (heavily implied to be) bi
I have no problem playing as a women as long as the story is good the problem is I have a problem with making female characters ugly on purpose also I do have a problem with them changing the lore of the ip in lore women physically cant be witchers they couldn’t survive the trials of grasses plus the ability to do the trails is gone so thier can’t be new witchers. Also yeniffer would never allow Ciri to be a Witcher she would t allow her to give up the ability to bear children due to yen’s. Painfully past involving that
It's fine to have a preference, the issue comes when people start demanding that every game should cater to their preference.
Their sales will go down tho
@@Rocket7Thighly doubt that, W4 will be my and some of my friends’ first Witcher game as a direct result of Ciri being the lead.
@ that’s just sad
@@Rocket7T not as sad as people jumping ship for that reason
Wdym demanding? Because people collectively say they won’t play - they’re demanding?
I've never understood this. The focus should be on the gameplay, level design, writing and art design. The gender of the character should be irrelevant. The gender of the character has never, ever, been a factor in my enjoyment.
To me in games, and ONLY games (specifically RPGs) I have to feel like I am the character otherwise I can't immerse myself. Doing that with such a fleshed out character as Geralt for example was hard but I still could. Can't really do that with Ciri even though I love her.
@@brachialplexus100 that's a shame, but totally fair.
I think it's kind of the opposite for me. Having a fleshed out character makes me actually roleplay that character and "lose" myself in the world. With fully customizable characters I often just end up making decisions as myself, as the person playing a video game, and it can take me out of the immersion.
@damned0wl super fair, and honestly more logical.
@@damned0wl Yup, that's me. Blank slate characters, with no personalities, make it very clear that I'm playing a video game rather than an active part of a narrative. Commander Shepard and Geralt have easily been the best RPG characters I've played, where I could also make decisions based off their personalities and attitudes.
Gearlt is a fine protagonist but I wouldn't really call him fleshed out especially in the games. He's basically the players character who's good at everything and doesn't have many flaws.
Witcher Remake will come out, which will basically be a whole new game, they will just take the plot of Witcher 1 and expand it, and obviously we will play as Geralt so people will get the Geralt game they want
@iliasVoolgaris should have female option
Well, many of those people will boycott anyway cause, woke company, or because random employee said some stupid things on the internet.
@@iuliuslovin37 Its wouldn't make sense if there was
I love Witcher 1, it definitely deserves and needs a remake. I hope they do it justice
It will be a whole new woke game. They will remove all the fun parts like sex cards. And Witcher 1 doesn't need expansion in story elements, it has a great story. It needs graphic and gameplay enhancement. Everything else is perfect.
As long as the story of the game is good. That's all that matters. Also at the end of the day, gaming is a hobby, no matter who you are. It's a hobby FIRST. Yes somebody can turn it into a job, but it's entertainment at the end of the day. It doesn't control the person's life.
This is one of the reasons I love this channel! The nuance. No culture war bs! I definitely understand wanting to play as your own gender. Theres no shame in admitting that. I tend to only play games with CaC or gender options for that reason. The issue comes when you expect every game in a franchise to cater to only you or your percieved “majority.” Gaming is a space for everyone. Its a simple fact that male stories are overwhelmingly represented. Creators should be able to experiment with different takes and perspectives as they see fit. With a series like the Witcher, I can see why some maybe had certain expectations but overall Ciri was the next logical choice for an MC. I don’t think half of the critiscm has been very fair but I guess theres always going to be some people you can’t please
I doubt the majority of players care to the point of refusing to buy because of female MC tbh.
I guess we'll see come release day.
I just don’t like Witcher games either way. I won’t be buying because it’s an IP I don’t care about
Sometimes I wonder if its a comfort thing, I've been playing TTRPG's for decades and I know and have some friends who only play the same character every campaign that is run, no matter the system, they will find a way to play that character. Its a safe bet for them. While I have a preference to not only play something nothing like me, but to try and make my characters as different as diverse as possible, the more variety in the experiences I have the better, and for me that extends to video games too. Gender, race, politics, faith aren't an issue for me as long as they are done well and can give me a new perspective on things. I find myself genuinely curious of those things, I'm not a man of faith, but I find people who are endlessly fascinating and sometimes games and movies are the only way I can engage with that in a meaningful way. Point being, getting out of your comfort zone to experience something you normally wouldn't can be a fantastic, sometimes profound and sometimes life changing experience. But I understand the fear of the unknown.
I’m a guy and usually prefer playing games where the lead is a woman. Depending on the genre, it can make the story/experience more interesting and engaging. That’s just my opinion though. Someone doesn’t have to look like you in order for you to relate to them. If that’s what determines how relatable something is for you, you’re missing out on a lot of good stories and characters
Adding the RUclips end screen really added to the gag
I've only ever played opposite sex characters if that's an option. I've never _not_ played a game if it's gender bound. But if there's an option, I always choose the opposite. I like to role play as someone else.
All I know is I am excited to experience TW4 story and see what fun abilities ciri has now. We already know its gonna be fun with the blink dash.
I think they had suggested she would have to lose her elder blood abilities in order to become a witcher.
@@garywood97 Like I told the people that were crying about her looks... Don't worry there will be a Shrek or cj mod within the first week 😂
@@garywood97 i thought she lost most of her elder blood powers when she full filled the prophesy and defeated the white frost, since thats what the elder blood powers whole purpose was , kind of a sacrifice for a greater good thing
@@JaineSlayerr well, it's unclear for now... I do think her Elder Blood abilities will be suppressed in the beginning (either from defeating the White Frost, or the mutations), but not having them in the game at all would be a strange move. Teleporting is fun :)
I use to find it hard to play as a women but I’m over it now I just want the game to be good and The Witcher 4 is my second most anticipated game only after gta 6
If you can't feel empathy for another human being, not even one you directly control, I think the problem would be that player, maybe he's a psychopath.
That's going way too far. There's a difference between feeling empathy for a character and identifying with one. And even not feeling empathy for a fictional character doesn't make someone a psychopath, not even close.
CDPR never really have done create a characters. Yeah you could customise V in Cyberpunk but they were still a pre-defined character much like Commander Shephard in Mass Effect.
Ciri was the next logical contender to take over, she's trained by Geralt from the age of 10 in the books, she was playable in parts of the Witcher 3 - they haven't plucked a female protagonist out of thin air and this shouldn't even be controversial to anyone who played the Witcher games. The issue is (anti-woke) people have melted their brains on culture war propaganda and are pre-disposed to react emotionally to this stuff without any care for context.
People can have their preferences in games with customisable character options, but I really many gamers would grow a pair of balls and get out of their comfort zone. That doesn't mean every player character is automatically well written but you should make an effort to engage with player characters who are opposite sex.
Ive played new vegas, and other rpgs hundreds of times but only played as a female a handful of times. But if a single player story has a female protagonist that is a good character in a good story, it doesnt make a difference
Well much of the Witcher book series is in the perspective of Ciri. I have no qualms
I'm the same way, I'd rather play either a male character or be given the chance to create my own character .
I can do without, as I did with Horizon zero dawn or Nier automata, but overall my preference is for male heroes.
Media should never be twisted to fit into boxes to add more representation for the sake of it, it should always feel natural. But that goes for games with female characters just as much as for male ones. The reason there's no male option for Witcher 4 is as simple as the devs believing Ciri is the best, most natural pick with the most storytelling potential. Just as the Witcher 1-3 were about a pre-defined character in Geralt, 4 will be one for Ciri. They're just not twisting the mainline games to add more representation. In this case it's just cutting the other way.
I think having a preference for playing same-sex characters is totally understandable and fine, I just draw the line at tarring or coming at the devs for their choice. Not saying everyone is doing that, I'm just saying those are the only people I have an issue with. Just, think about it this way: like Luke said, some female gamers feel this way about male characters, and imo fair is fair.
I don’t get immersed in games so I never have this issue
i'm like your wife. Frankly, i find it hard to relate to a game if i'm playing as a female character, that's why in pretty much every game that has a character creator, i always make the same dude. I hoped this new Witcher game would be time to introduce a character creator to the series, maybe have Ciri as our partner/mentor. I'll play it regardless because it's The Witcher but i'd have preferred to make my own character.
I really, really, do not get this especially in games with predetermined characters like The Witcher. I actively want to experience as many different types of characters in games.
Agreed. I think it's totally fair with blank slate characters, but I don't get the upset over pre-existing, defined characters like Geralt and Ciri. I mean, this is literally just Geralt, except it happens to be cutting the other way with a female rather than a male. I just wish people would be a bit more honest with their reasoning or justifications.
How many people who have trouble playing as opposite-sex characters have no problem with non-human playable characters? Legitimately I have trouble with how that works psychologically.
Non-humans are my problem. In Outer Wilds you're a thing with four eyes. That actually turned me off at first. Similar with the idea of Dwarf Fortress, I'm not a fantasy nerd and I don't care about dwarves, is what I told myself before it clicked
I don't really have trouble with either, but I think gender is a factor more often than non-human characters. I mean, most people who play fantasy games probably like fantasy :)
I find it odd that people can't play something that isn't like them. Glad I don't experience this immersion stuff cuz it just sounds limiting and annoying. Play the game if you think youll like it, skip if dont.
I think it depends how you approach role playing: do you see yourself as the character OR, as I like to do it, do you see yourself like an author telling a story through that character. I like to see myself as an author and invent a personality for my character and try to make decisions not as I would make them myself, but as I imagine the character to make them. And I think this also includes physical appearance. I'm a dude, but I always create female characters, because for me the point isn't for me to identify with the character, I'm not the character, we're 2 different people with different values and personalities.
How you doing Luke?
99% of the situations will have nothing to do with the characters gender....like can no men related to the woman who is about to be sacrificed out of traditions feelings because she is a woman....the whole idea just seems absurd...i get it, there might be some situations where this applies, but most situations are just human feelings
Honestly it is dealers choice, for me one of my main criteria for what games I'll play does depend on whether or not I have the option for a feminine character and if I'm locked into only playing a masculine character and their gender has absolutely nothing to do with the plot (ie roleplay value that makes their gender absolutely essential) then there is a higher likelihood I won't play it for lack of a feminine protagonist. Honestly if the gender is non-essential then I don't see why the can't pull a Cyberpunk or a Mass Effect and just get multiple voice actors to record the same lines and then everyone can be happy.
nice cope XD
But because the gender IS essential here, you don't have an issue, right? Cause Ciri is a pre-defined character, same as Geralt, and the devs felt she was the most natural choice with the most storytelling and thematic potential.
@@scirrhia_kruden Honestly I have no issue with Ciri being the main as for myself the only Witcher game I own is 3 because I knew Ciri was partially playable in the game, that and the reputation of the game. I didn't finish the game partially because I wasn't able to jump into playing Ciri from an earlier point and to be honest didn't feel any real connection with Geralt so the rp was flawed for me. For me Geralt lives too much in some of the negative role aspects of masculinity, personally, I wanted more emotional availability and internal dialogue from him (would have helped to flesh out the story and ground the character as someone I can relate with).
@@quietdistance8594 Part of the point is that he's imperfect, some of the complaints you mentioned are things he works through throughout the game. spoilers:
it specifically ties into how and why he settles down on his Vineyard with Yennefer at the end.
@@quietdistance8594 oh, and I just wanted to say that I wanted to clarify because you never know here (in Luke's fandom, and also more generally). I've seen people saying there's no real reason for Ciri to be the protagonist, so ending on that last part of your comment left things ambiguous imo
This is something that I've always felt and I never really have any discourse about it because this type of cultural environment is very hostile. But I for one desperately seek immersion in the RPGs that I play. Whenever I play a video game that is not just mindless action, I care a lot about immersing myself into a character and the world that I am playing into. And as a guy, I can never really immerse myself if I'm playing a female character. It is the furthest away from all other possible iterations. Hell, even if I'm playing a male orc, I can somewhat fill the space of the fiction in my head and make it make some type of sense. But flipping genders is so significantly hyperbolic that I can never quite make that work.
With that said, I accept that I'm not the only demographic and just as I enjoy being immersed, I'm sure other female players also would love to be immersed by playing female lead roles. Therefore, I accept that some games will simply not be for me. It is a shame when it is a sequel to a game that I very much love and enjoy and would love to continue to be immersed in, but that's just life.
I agree 100% on everything.
It is genuinely a shame that some people won't be able to continue enjoying the games because of this. If I couldn't play as characters of the opposite gender, I would've missed out on the first three Witcher games and Disco Elysium, and I hate to imagine that
Much ado about nothing 😂
Fragile masculinity that's the problem ❤
no thats no the problem. The problem is almost all games and movies now days focus on a female lead. I would like more variation, i have no problem playing as female.
Hopefully we can use ai in the future to create what we want
It's definitely a different experience, although not a deal breaker. Areas like romance are weird though. I can never get into the romance sub-plots if the main character is a woman.
Out of curiosity, is it specifically playing as a woman in a romance, or romancing male characters that is the issue? Both are understandable, but the latter shouldn't be a problem with Ciri, since she's (heavily implied to be) bi
I have no problem playing as a women as long as the story is good the problem is I have a problem with making female characters ugly on purpose also I do have a problem with them changing the lore of the ip in lore women physically cant be witchers they couldn’t survive the trials of grasses plus the ability to do the trails is gone so thier can’t be new witchers. Also yeniffer would never allow Ciri to be a Witcher she would t allow her to give up the ability to bear children due to yen’s. Painfully past involving that
I'm male and I don't want to play a trash garbage male characters, I don't immerse myself in games, I just see from the third perspective
I am biased. Only if she is likeable. If the character is a dude I don't care if he is likable or not.
Going full on alt right now luke
Lmao, you be like " disagree with me is alt right. "