Intel CPU Failure, It's NOT JUST your Gaming PC.
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- Опубликовано: 4 авг 2024
- The Intel i9-13900k and 14900k have fundamental flaws and Level 1 Techs' Wendell has recently broken down a video describing what is actually happening ( • Intel has a Pretty Big... )
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#Intel #GamingPC #Winning 
Хобби
"AMD Inconsistent Performance from a Glued-together CPU" -Intel 2017
This aged like fine milk!
😂
never forget that they now want to copy amd glue, they still use x86 64 thanks to amd, intel is really a joke
Yummy!
considering they had already glued together some pentiums a decade prior
It hasn't aged like fine milk, fanboy comment to me. Judging 2024 Intel by taking statements from 2017 when their chips were entirely different and were a mile faster and more consistent than AMD. Just start leaving reasonable comments aleady lol.
@@HeartOfAdel That's exactly the definition of aged like milk. AMD still had their "glued together CPUs" and are now way more stable than Intel CPUs right now. I also included that it was from 2017.
Intel is desperate for this to not become a recall and that may make it worse for them in the long run.
Class Action Lawsuit is usually the end to the situations like this, and definitely damage to reputation
I'm really happy I went to AMD from Intel on my last build in December.
You missed the great years of AM4, a platform that offered the best value to performance opportunities ever seen in the history of the industry.
@@bodasactra True, but it's time to move on. I've gotten myself a 2700X Special edition, 5700X3D and got my 5800X3D out of RMA; 5900X still offsite, all other chips I have are either very slow by today's standards, already sold or partially broken (such as bent pins on 5500 or dead memory channel on 3600).
My start has been rocky though: bought a 1700 that could only do 3.725 GHz max at insane voltages, so it was effectively a locked chip outside of extreme cooling. Thought "it couldn't be my fault" and literally on the same board another sample did 3.9 GHz easily as well as a 2400G which even did almost 4.1.
@bodasactra Yeah, I already had a pc then and didn't need go upgrade until last December. I remember being jealous lol
@@bodasactra ?
Imagine buying AM4 when 9900k, 10900k etc. existed.
@@griffin1366 lul
Intel CPU failure, Windows and drivers being buggy. Why do we have this kind of problems in 2024??
Big tech not having to care, too big to fail is how they feel.
You guys weren't around during the Windows Vista Era. These companies always sucked.
Managers and HR are more important than actual tech people.
@@ksolo614 just thinking about vista gives me nightmares again...
I kinda forgot how sucks Vista was. All I can remember was some printers and scanners didn't work. That's all.
If you ever question a company like AMD or nvidia wondering why they would hold back from releasing the 100% power version of their latest tech, this is why - So they don't end up where Intel did, over-extended and completely out of options to gain performance for a product cycle. You always want to have something extra on reserve, and solid engineering ready for your next move before you make your current move.
That's why I thought why amd didn't launch a 600 watts 7900xtx
Intel's domination coming home to roost, people now expect them to be the expensive and highest performance chip on the market so they have to push the limits.
AMD don't have to live up to those standards. Nvidia are doing what Intel should have done, instead of releasing a new chip every year with 5% performance, keep selling old chips that are still good and focus on engineering something with a leap of performance.
Actually, that is what Intel did in their IGPUs; they kept using UHD series sh*t while they had Iris XE and Arc.
There's a myriad of reasons and AMD unironically started it but pulled back as they saw the problems.
- Tech Reviewers only slot the CPU, press run on Cinebench Multi and Single.
- AMD began doing single core boost (1.45V etc.) for single core benchmarks.
- Intel retaliated by adding a single core boost with 11th gen which in some cases went up to 1.6V on Gigabyte motherboards. Nobody really bought 11th gen so it was never talked about.
- Then they tacked on eCores to compete with multi-core Cinebench.
- Pushing 1.5V+ into the CPU for 1-2 cores to boost has degraded these CPU's
- A group of 250 enthusiasts with 13900K, 13900KS, 14900K etc. have had zero problems as day 1 they set an all-core overclock. Data centres undervolting and setting power limits didn't turn off the per-core boost which would still push high voltages even under power limits as 1-2 cores isn't going to hit 125W.
Entirely Intels fault ofcourse but the consumer gets mucked over sadly.
@@AbbasDalal1000 apparently AMD had a version planned likely to be called 7950 XTX and it could trade blows with the 4090 in raster, but it'd consume loads of power and all it'd do is just make sure Nvidia released a 4090 Ti and regain the crown so it was pointless and they scrapped the SKU.
The resale value of 13th and 14th gen cpus is gonna take a hit
Happy I'm stable on 12th but you are correct.
Maybe, but probably not. Most people see "i7" and "i9" and are ready to shell out hte big bucks, even for a 12 year old part.
More like no ones gonna buy one unless its dirt cheap. But then youll probably have to run it with a hard undervolt underclock so the damn chip doesnt warp.
What do you mean, the chips are already failing at rates of 10-25% already after not even a year, they should recall them. No one is going to buy them unless Intel fixes this except fanboys. At this point you would have to be an uninformed person or just dumb if buying 13/14 gen Intel. Channels like Gamers Nexus have said, they won't recommend anyone buy Intel for the new launch until they address or fix this issue.
Except Intel will probably remain quiet so they can save billions in recalls. To me this kills Intel on consumer markets altogether. Sadly it is also destroy their reputation in enterprise right. They better figure it out because their GPU division cannot carry the company if their CPU division fails. Then again we don't know how good the GPUs are going to be perhaps Intel is just about to die. Their silence is alarming.
It has gone wide and every tech channel has covered it now in detail. I mean it does reward gen 12 I guess because their resale value is going to climb if Intel cannot fix this or the new launch is effected. Sadly Intel probably won't say or do anything so good luck buying the new CPU.
Intel taking shortcuts for cost and trying to beat AMD. I have two current AMD CPU/GPU systems, 7800X3D and 7945 mobile, both are 100% stable and never any crashes or lockups.
I have 3 older systems. a 3600, 5600 and a 3900x as my main.
As someone that owns both a 13900K and a Kia Stinger, I am in 100% agreement with this video. In terms of the 13900K, I am super concerned about degradation now. It was super concerning when Wendell at L1 Tech indicated they essentially noticed issues even at Intel Spec settings. Heavily thinking about switching to the Ryzen 9000 series.
I have a 7700x I got near release back in 2022. I have had zero issues. I do update my bios and I did see boot speeds radically improve over time but it really was stable and snappy from day one.
Am on a 5800X3D and thinking on going for s 9800X3D or 9950X3D.
Still got good Performance out of my 5800X3D+7900XT+X570S (4 NVME 2TB SSDs) and great reliability, zero issues with it, so why Update?
I run mostly heavily CPU bound games like DCS world, Arma3, Star Citizen, various Race sims like ACC, AMS 2, newly iracing but also develop my photos on my PC.
(Recently bailed out of Adobe Lightroom, fuck Adobe and their TOS!)
That's why I'm considering the 9950X3D, as I could use the extra cores for my photo development and Star Citizen scales well with above 8 cores from What I've heard, and DCS is really popping off with multicore.
Does your CPU work ok? If so don't worry about it.
@@sergeantbricks9763 you bought a KIA! I'm making enough money to retire early off swapping kia engines! They are an ATM more than cars. 🤣💩
Maybe a Intel 4-core is now a way to go to make your computer live longer
this is AMD's opportunity
to also get away with one major fk up
Or raising prices again. :(
CPUs are cheap these days, I remember paying over $500 for a single core decades ago. @@seylaw
amd never misses an opportunity to miss an opportunity
@@auritro3903
But this time, I'm sure it'll be Epic!
Or Epyc?
The SOC voltage and temp fiasco on AM5 was their fuck up that let Intel have a fuck up. 🤣
Intel CPU problems is a 4/10, Intel being untrustworthy is a 8/10
Ironically, Intel is known for how trustable their product are and also reliability. Before red come.
@@Ryuken2721 Real easy to be reliable when you release the same CPU for 10 years.
All it takes is a little googling on the scummy business practices of Intel and Nvidia and one will have plenty of good reasons to never buy from either again :)
@@Azureskies01 14nm was introduced with Broadwell/5th and stuck around until RocketLake/11th, so you could call it 14nm++++++ and would technically be correct. Other than that their first Quadcore for a mainstream platform released in 2006… around 11 years before the 8700[k/f]. Damn
@@thefilmdirector1 Man all corporations are scummy. Its literally their job. We can't continue to be shocked every time they do something bad when its literally their reason for existing. Corporations owe their shareholders returns, THATS IT.
Its a f'd system all around.
If 10th gen had full PCIE Gen 4 support, the entire lineup wouldve been amazing even today.
Me being a 10th gen user only thing missing is pcie 4 other than that the cpus were really good and value for money atleast where i am from at the time of purchase
@@ashirtk2442 ikr, im currently using in i5 4th gen, but used my friends i5 10400 pc sometimes and one thing i see often is how snappy and fast the pc is at normal windows tasks, its feels faster than my other friends r7 7835hs laptop in daily tasks and idk why
Ive been looking into building a 10th/11th gen intel pc mostly because ive been wanting to switch back to intel from amd but i dont like the idea of using any of the 12th gen+ cpu's.
@@T.Lspitz 11th gen got a lot of hate at release but it is a solid cpu lineup.
@@GameArmorGameplay i think 11th grn has similar latency issues as 12th, 10th might be last with good latency and snappiness
I didn’t realize Intel chips were soo shity
Usually they aren't just this 13th and 14th generation. The crazy thing is the radio silence by Intel for months and months.
@@transformerstuff7029 honestly Intel lga 1200 platform is designed poorly with latency and reliability problems. This is not a small thing and blaming motherboard manufacturers or pretending that nothing happening won’t cut it this time. Intel ignored this for months. Damage is done and AMD got good product. This will stay with them for long.
im using 12600k, they did right the 12th gen I think!was about to upgrade my cpu to 13600k but going to get the 12700k instead!
also credits to BZ who tested the crap out of Intel IMC RAM stability, too bad that intel has been openly blaming others for their own mistake
Their lawsuit track records from decades should already trigger that they are not a saint of a corporation.
"Mobo makers default settings"
"Gamers over clocking too much"
"Game devs being lazy"
Seems like it's everyone's fault but Intel's for some reason. And they're all avoiding issues with AMD. Hmm....
@@John.Philip.Tan876 at least AMD not blaming others
"Intel just works"
Aged like milk 😂
They've pushed those cpus beyond their limit in order to sell and now the people who bought them have to deal with problems.
That's it.
it seems like even with conservative server settings they still fail.
lol do you not understand the root cause? It isn't "pushing it too hard" it's simply an architectural design flaw. Like actually watch the video...pay attention or something
@@austinmcbride7139 It's like trying to play chess with a pigeon-it knocks the pieces over, craps on the board, and flies back to its flock to claim victory.”
even with new power settings problems are same
@@austinmcbride7139 Yeah that's what I said, like actually understand what you read.
They've pushed the cpus from the beginning way too much in order to look great for the benchmarks so they can sell and now the cpus are starting to fail since they can't handle the frequencies that they were set from the factory. The "design" flaw is that the cpus were running at a much higher frequency than they should've.
Maybe next time when you read something don't instantly go for the attack.
They shoulda bought used Xeons swimming in multipurpose spray.
Techtubers nowadays: baby their pc parts, scared to overclock, use only isopropyl alcohol and a soft summer breeze to clean parts; Parts fail
The Yes Man- Soaks PC parts in brake cleaner, uses a brush, ultasonic cleaners, Overclocks sky high on the cheapest cooler on aliexpress : Parts work flawlessly
@@frostmafia1380that the power of techyeslovin
Before spray : Xeon
After spray : Xeoff
Hey he mentioned you happy?
@@AbbasDalal1000 What are you talking about? lol
Just gave up on my 14900k after 6 months and got 7950x3d, 3 flagship intel builds in 8 years, never again
legit switched from 14900k back to 12900k because of the stability issues
I'm still running my 14900K with no issue's after reigning in PL1 and PL2. I'm still hanging onto my 12900K also, just in case my 14th gen i9 goes Tango Uniform.
Fun Fact 12900K/KF e.t.c. have been developing issues since the bio's changes to address the 13900/14900K /KF issues. Thankfully its lagg based not full on crashes at this stage.
missed opportunity to buy a decent CPU like a Zen 4 offering.
bout to switch to 12700k
It's Intel, using an old cpu is not gonna solve the problem, AMD is better. 😮
Intel's 4 cores forever, made me decide to go Amd last upgrade after Sandy Bridge. And Intel's handling so far on this issue, will probably make me go Amd next upgrade again. Get with the program Intel, take care of your customers
If 50% of CPUs are failing one way or another but the other 50% running perfectly fine I would closely look at the production starting even from the silicon provider and its quality.
Its either a bad design that overloads the IO die or its a faulty clean room where they make the IO die. Either way I dont think they can fix this with a bios update.
@@geoffreystraw5268 If this would be bad design then 100% of CPUs would have problems. For me, it looks like a production/assembly/materials problem.
I think some of it is related to thermal cycling. The boosting behaviour is too aggressive and hitting 100'C back to 30'C thousands of times, over and over will cause micro cracking as the die shrinks.
@@Berserkism Then all CPUs would be affected and not just 50%. Not to mention that in data centers temps are way lower.
This! I think there is a problem with the base silicon, the fact only half are affected, that they work fine in the beginning, the inconsistency, it all points to someone "fing up the Tuesday batch" of silicon
The race to win big on Cinebench benchmarks at the expense of stability and increased degradation has been heating up for some time now.
Someone may have posted both videos in the comments of the Level 1 Techs Video yesterday.
I eagerly await what Gamers Nexus and Level 1 Techs have up their sleeves, as hinted at in their collaboration follow up video.
I think you missed the point, Intel made a major architecture change to the 13th-14th high end I/O removing the direct to CPU connection. Servers use far less power demanding boards and they are having the same issues. That is the smoking gun Wendell found in the server side data, its the Intel hardware design and not the aggressive retail side power demands. They may have to replace most of these CPUs, retail and commercial.
@@bodasactra they already did this change to 12gen , whitch already some people had issues with lags but no crashes , then with 13/14gen they pushed the architecture too much and now we see a lot of stability issues and degradation ...
@@Pieteros21 What else changed in 13th gen? Faster PCIe, memory controller, etc. Being that the errors vary across the I/O it may be the I/O lag became an issue with faster hardware on the CPU.
@@Pieteros21Never experienced lag on my 12700K.
I also debunked the latency thing on this channel because you always have to unpark the cores for the lowest latency.
@@bodasactra Wendell did say it's probably a bit of everything causing issues since the issues are widespread and random.
Some pont to IO issues and others point to general degradation.
Thankfully my 13700k and 12700k havent had any of these issues. Keeping my fingers crossed. Personally I was never going to buy either the 13900k or the 14900k. They seemed like Intel was pushing them out too fast and a bit too far for my taste.
I hope for everyones sake they can find a resolution to this.
Well according to the data a 12th gen won't have the issue because it doesn't have the hardware hack that is causing the issues in the 13/14th gen. Your 13th might be problems iirc YesMan worked around it by going back to windows 10/disabling e-cores.
13700k also got this problem...
Yep. Have these weird issues on my 13700kf as well. Been running it at only 5.2ghz also since the start. @@marcinkarpiuk7797
Even my 13600k has experienced these crashes so I don't know, man.
@@Dhruv-qw7jf I think starting from 13600k they are real 13th gen, cpus below the 13600k are just 12th gen rebranded.
I had a 13900k in my hand at Best Buy. Decided to get a 7800x3d no issues at all
I used to be an i7 snob but I went Ryzen and haven't looked back
Good points. Its like going to the supermarket and scanning and packing your own goceries. A job they used to do but no price drops , just profits for them.
You are documenting your experience, anyone that hate on videos like that are just crazy. I believe the community still have not realized what you said last year, they are just focusing on the failures, but even when the CPU is "working fine" there is lag as you showed.
I really appreciate all of your detailed coverage on this topic. When I first experienced my latency issues, I would have believed I had a faulty chip if it weren’t for your videos. I was disappointed to see this is a wide spread issue. But I’m happy to see it’s not just me and I am not crazy. What’s really unfortunate is this was my first big dive into Intel. This was not a good way to have a first flagship experience with Intel. It really left a bad taste in my mouth. I switched back to the 7800X3D and so far my system is a lot better all around. Thank you for the support and advice and keep up the amazing work over here at Tech Yes City!
You've always been looking out for the regular guy, thanks for your continued service !
4:50 I can ATTEST to the SNAP! Can I GET AN ATTESTIFY!
But, but, but, but ....
People want a snappier processor
Great coverage as always. I made my old video public again, even after all the backlash. I wish it were 2023 when people listened, but at least they are listening now.
I will continue to mention you were one of the first to find out/cover this issue.
Again...
Mind blown it's gone this long.
Interesting you brought up your fast editing skills - I noticed that you (and tiny tom logan) were releasing videos from the recent show sooner than other channels i watch. It was one of the reasons i subscribed. Good work! 👍
Thanks for the update Brian.
Problems with Intel LGA 1700 socket desktop CPUs -
1. cpu bending in socket, causing thermal problems
2. extreme power consumption & thermals at stock config causing stability & longevity problems
3. e-cores significantly reduce gaming performance
4. sub-optimal I/O hub implementation
All of that is BS or overblown:
1. My 12700K is 67 degrees on cinebench and it has the massive Deepcool Assassin 3 on top of it.
2. Iddles at 8 watts and 150 watts max, i built a music production PC with it because AMD had nothing at the time that matched those perfomance per watt numbers, or thread director.
3. When running Switch emulation e-cores game me more fps or stable fps. Turning off the e-cores make the CPU feel like a slog.
4. Don't extrapolate 13th gen- 14th gen i9 issues to other LGA1700 chips.
Just like i don't extrapolate the 7700X (the i9-11900K of Zen 4) to other AM5 chips for now.
No bending here. 1.5 years on a 13900KS at 6Ghz. No contact plate etc. Just stock.
8W at idle and 22-35C at idle depending on ambient is lower than AMD...
Incorrect
Never had an issue.
@@saricubra2867 The BS you tell yourself, XD maybe some day you will have convinced yourself.
There is nothing wrong with the 7700x, and it's especially not a 11900k in essence.
@@saricubra2867 lol stupid fanboy. 7700x isnt 11900 zen 4. LIAR. Zen3=11th intel.5700x=11900k. 5900x has better MP perfomance.
@griffin1366 ah yes idle. Amd cpu also consume the same wattage as Intel when both of them are turned off. Also don't worry I have heard about 13700k randomly showing up errors, the issue isn't about whether you got away lucky with a good chip, it's about when your good chip becomes like any other.
I have an I9-14900K that is faulty, thought it was the PSU, so replaced that, no luck then the Motherboard, still no luck its the CPU, inconsistant problems that never end Intel seems to not care when you spend nearly $ 1000.00 AUD, it seems not Intel shame on you Best Regards Andrew from downunder
I hear ya, sorry you have issues 😢. Good luck!
You probably have recourse, if they won't honor the warranty you should take them to small claims for your costs.
my wallet is having bad time, so I use 11700f by default not by design. but re-hearing something like this makes my envy dies faster lol
I find it a bit silly how many people comment like this as if a 9th+ gen i7 is a poor man's, poorly performing chip or something. It's a solid CPU, sold my 11th i7 cause I had a 12th gen but the 11th and the 10th gen i7 my brother is still using have zero issues with anything we do. The difference in day to day use between a 9th and 14th gen i7 is none and the difference in gaming with the same video card isn't huge and where it is it's meaningless (they all get 300+ fps).
@@bdhale34 i buy it for 100 usd....
@@bdhale34 well I got it for 50 bucks ....
@@chibonchibon3967 legit? how did you manage to find that bargain
@@chibonchibon3967 For 50 bucks it's a good CPU - but the 11th gen was a mistake on Intel's part in many ways -- trying to fit a design meant for 10/7nM on 14++nM. Hell, the 10700K was actually faster in several workloads.
I have a 7900XTX & 7800X3D in my System and my Buddy has the 4090 paired with an 13th gen i9. Only one of us is having fun with his system and its not him😅
He chose... poorly
It has been an excellent combo. Running the same setup without an issue.
AMD is dog shit though
@@PAIN-ot4cj working fine for me and the 7800X3D is proven to be thr best cpu for gaming while costing half of what intel wants for their cpu
@@PAIN-ot4cj also I see you are an intel fanboy, which is fine. Keep in mind that without amd intel would still sell cpus like the 7700K because noone would force them to make better chips.
I saw a comment before saying they buy Intel and Nvidia because they always work and stable. Funny how you got the unstable cpus and burning gpu connectors that still persist, none of which happened to amd, at least roght now
TBF, the Ryzen 7000X3D chips had also experienced the CPU core burning/breaking. Good thing I didn't experience that with my 7950X3D and 7800X3D since by the time I got them, BIOS updates had already fixed the issue.
@@cheesyvoid3143 That was a motherboard manufacturer problem, specifically asus (and another one I can't remember right now) overvolting the 7000's soc, not an amd problem.
@@pf100andahalf What I meant is that it still happened. It was still an AMD problem since they still had to provide manufacturers the correct voltage specs to mitigate the issue. Had they communicated with the board manufacturers before release, those affected users wouldn't have had their CPUs explode. Remember, the issue occurred even at the latest BIOS version at that time, and Asus and the other manufacturers had to delete those BIOS versions from their websites, while they coordinated with AMD for a solution.
@@pf100andahalfThat is same excuse that Intel makes for their chips. No, AMD and Intel have to do quality control for their motherboards as well.
I had all athlon x3 and 4 ryzen CPUs They always work stable
I work for a hardware and software vendor. It’s all about pushing units to keep the share price up. That’s been the biggest push. QA has fallen off a cliff
"and who knows what else is going through my system, going to all these parties"
A real australian. I love you king
Definitively did not edit out himself saying "coked out"
As these videos by other techtubers started coming back all I could think of was your nearly two yr old vid talking about you reverse pivoting from the new chips for the previous gen due to similar errors and sluggishness that are being talked about currently
My 13600k w/ 7200mhz ddr5 completely hangs occasionally. Just dead freezes the whole system for several seconds. Sometimes happens during gaming I think correlated with system run time
But no crashing on my system. Which i did experience from overclocking my 8700k
that could also be related to the os and storage, not just the cpu, but after haring so much problems, i would keep a plan b at hand
happens to me too.
Not being a gamer, I tend to live on the budget end of cpus. So what I am really interested in is whether or not these issues extend into the i3 and i5 range of products.
That said, this reminds me of back in the early 1990s and the floating point issues that the first Pentium processors had. Shiz happens.
It's only the XX900K models as the single-core boost wants 1.5V+
It's mostly (as far as we know) affecting i9's and i7's. Some really crappy i5 might also be affected, but given the numbers and the numbers of failures - it seems that you would need to have extreme potato of an i5 to have this issue.
Though personally I would stay away from 13th and 14th gen Intel CPU's at least until we get a FULL explanation.
@@griffin1366 We don't know the exact issue. It could be boosting voltage - but you will find i7's that require as much voltage as i9's - depending on binning.
@@jannegrey593 XX700K isn't pulling above 1.4V
@@griffin1366 And some 900K's that failed also pulled a bit below 1.4 V. And there are i7's that do pull a bit above 1.4V. Yes, it's much smaller percentage, but it isn't impossible.
There is I think on Tom's Hardware the list of CPU's and the spread of how much voltage they pull.
From my personal experience, 12th gen has got issues too, i had a i7 12700f with 32 gb 6000 mhz cl30, kingston KC3000 pcie 4.0 boot drive and all the CPU power savings disabled from the bios, windows 11 optimized, with core parking disabled through parkcontrol yet the system felt sluggish. I got weird lag spikes with the mouse, during browsing in pausing youtube videos or closing tabs, after opening a photo from a file with other photos in it, the left and right pointer to go to the next photo would appear after 5 or 6 seconds. I tried windows 10 also and it was a little better but far from perfect. I sold it and never looked back. I have a spare old system with an ivy bridge xeon e3 1230 v2 with 16 gb of ram and i swear it feels way snappier at times.
Alderlake cpu have some circuits Logic moved from to cpu to mb causing lag when moving mouse etc. Look it up. Had I known this I would not be running a 12100 today
@Tech YES City can you please include a link to the video you reffer to from a year ago where you first mentioned this issue? Thanks
Glad I went for a 13600k instead of an i9. No problems so far thankfully.
This one is also in the list!
@@AthosRac is the i5 13500 on the list?
When it came time for me to build a new gaming rig, I went with the advice of my favorite Techtuber, and got myself a I7 10700K and it works perfect, anytime, every time! He even had a few videos showing the big difference the 10th gen had over the newer CPU's, THANKS TYC! You kept me from spending a boat load on disappointment. All the love brother, keep up the great work!
Is the issues specifically from the 13900K and 14900K?
I have a 13700K since launch and haven't noticed any problems yet.
My 13700kf has issues. I have been running it undervolted and 5.2ghz only since launch. Have not pushed it to any limits.
@@alvar891 Interesting. What are the issues you are facing, and what workloads do you use it for?
@@Krenisphia Same kind of random delays to show content in folders like Brian shows even on nvme drives. Also random usb disconnecting sounds and sluggish behaviour. When i use my front usb more than 1 then it sometimes errors out. i dont put a lot of load on the system. mainly gaming. Also get audio glitches at times.
At my work place we have a system with a 13700k and experiencing some issues related to I/O same as you experiencing with file browser being slow. NVME SSD and 32GB RAM not overheating issues.
Really appreciate your candid reviews and opinions. Many tech youtubers seem too hesitant to stray too far from mainstream opinions in fear of backlash.
Wendell's video was certainly interesting.
His review of server platforms using conservative power and thermal profiles really eliminates a lot of Intel's gaslighting about overclocking causing degradation.
Based on his log reviews, Intel should really just start supplying 12900K CPUs again - 4 errors on 12th gen vs tens of thousands on 13/14 gen is pretty damning.
At the same time even with lowered power, datacenters generally have more data going through practically 24/7 whereas usage from regular users is far lower and less frequent.
So not really a great comparison, even if the failure rate is too high.
@@cakenbake844 Well, if you take the numbers "relatively" and compare: 4 failures on 12th Gen. 4 failures on AMD. 1400+ failures on 13th and 14th Gen CPU's. All of them are used 24/7/365. So it is actually decent comparison.
@@jannegrey593 If there's any hardware problems, this becomes far more evident with higher usage patterns. A datacenter pushes through more data within a single week than the average person does in weeks/months time.
If it fails after a year of use in a datacenter and it only starts failing for me after 4 years of personal use, that's quite a difference.
The same happened with the burning GPU's in New World, these GPU's might have worked fine for years at normal usages, but because of the unoptimized benchmark main menu of that game at launch they failed prematurely.
I typically build a new computer every 3-5 years and give away my old PC to family members. So if this CPU fails after 3-5 years of usage it would suck in terms of giving the PC away but not a huge problem for me personally.
Not saying it's good that the failure rate is this high, but perspective is important.
@@cakenbake844 Nobody is comparing datacenter errors vs. non-datacenter errors. The implicit comparison is datacenter errors with these CPUs vs. other CPUs in the same timespan, and 50% is absolutely unheard of. That's why the service fees for AMD CPUs are 1/10th of those for Intel CPUs right now. The providers have to factor in how many CPUs they'll have to replace.
So my i9-9900K System just increased in value?
yepp
No
The 5700x is faster and under 175$ new
I'm still running an i7-8700, on a Asus Z390-P MB. Planing on upgrading to an i9-9900K.
@@curtis.albrecht.79 you really shouldn't do that. Am5 cpus are just a lot more efficient than these old platform and pricing will probably get really good when zen 5 realeases this summer. Not only that but the ipc beetween 8 and 9 gen is identical and pricing on used intel i7 / I9 is really high compare to what should be their value based on performance
Would really love to see the YESman make another cheap aliexpress xeon build, I've been mulling over whether if it's worth the jump from the x79 one I have over to the x99 with avx2 support. Also really enjoying the Japan parts hunts 😇
I also had such an i9 14900k. Intel replaced it and the new one does not crash anymore. My old 13900k is also stable since launch so it is not every i9. It might also be a problem with the Cache as it was increased from 12th to 13th gen because the core desing is basically the same otherwise. Also the IO-Die I think stayed the same. I never tried it with my i9 as I did not think of it at the time but I would love to try and set the max cache ratio way down and see what happens as on 12gen the cache ratio was very low compared to 13/14 gen.
if happen at 100% of i7, i9 cpu it would have been a disaster for intel..... at moment seems 15%-25% of the cpu are affected, which is a lot, it mean 80% have not problems but if it's a silicon degradation the number will go up with time
Intel has a bigger problem than 13th and 14th gen... Think, who has balls to buy next gen from Intel? Even if Intel comes clear about the problem and promises to fix it by the next gen, people will avoid it like a plague.
I think If Intel didnt compensate their 13 14th gen buyer, those people will not buy 15th 16th 17th gen. No matter what BS intel write in their marketing
This looks to be another Nvidia Bumpgate folks. For those that do not remember you won't find any working Nvidia 7xxx and most of the 8xxx cards in the wild, that is because Nvidia used a new kind of solder for the bumps to connect the chips to the board and the chips would fail as the solder melted and crossed pads.
Like Intel Nvidia just added downclock patches and tried to make it go away but IIRC they ended up being sued and had to offer refunds or Bumpgate free cards. This is much worse than that as only a handful of models used the bad solder, from the looks of this it's the entire line of 13th and 14th gen chips that are doomed.
It was the 8000 series which had bad packaging, not the bga that nvidia messed up. That's also why it was their fault as the bga likely would have been considered a failure of the board makers. The problem wasn't limited to any select chip, but it tended to impact the smaller 8600 and laptop chips the worst. Famously Apple sued nvidia to get them to cover the cost of repair but then instead of replacing the broken chips on their customers macbooks, they stuck a rubber pad on the back of the chip to hope that would prevent it from falling apart (this unsurprisingly didn't work). I believe the de-clocked 7900 in the ps3 did have some issues with the BGA, but that was a common problem at the time as sony was trying to use the cheapest PCB possible while using still relatively new leadfree solder and a massive chip.
I'm hoping these issues are resolved soon. Bad enough that I worry about my 4090, now it's my 13900k that makes me hesitant to build a new system. I have a 12700k and a 3080Ti waiting for a build, so I'll probably do that one first. At least my 6700k and 1080Ti is still running well. Best to all.
Yeah, me too! I have an i9 13900ks and a rtx 3090.
I am considering switching to ryzen for my next upgrade in 5 years.
I've stayed with an i7-10nth gen and sometimes feel it's running a little bogged down, but then applied a lot of the tweaks I used in the past with early pentiums and the issues went away. Only issue I have left is I need to disable the Intel Bluetooth in device manager to let my Bluetooth headphones actually work properly with old drivers that function fine.
The main question for me is why Intel's QA did not pick up a 50% failure rate for a week's 24/7 testing. Things like that should definitely be caught in the release testing.
QA has definitely taken a hit since the Pandemic in the whole tech industry
Intel is hoping that the problem just goes away but obviously it's not.
Ever since the FDIV bug they have had months-long testing rigs doing release testing, not to mention the testing during development. The chips we buy now had their R&D finish well over a year ago. How something like this can slip through, I have no idea...
Guess the 11900k I got for cheap was the last decent intel gaming cpu. Super low system latency and 8 strong cores are still more than you need for 99% of games. Even hit the chip lottery and it can hold a stable all core 5.3 oc after an undervolt under heavy gaming loads.
I remember people saying an 11900k would be a massive bottleneck on some reddit thread and tried to argue back with me when it was a 7800XT or something gpu I remember
@@WayStedYou Dont listen to those idiots they arent real enthusiasts, those are also the same people that tell you to only buy new and bend over and spread 'em to nvidia or else you're a peasant
There is no reported issues with 12th gen Intel
I have a B560 mobo, so no overclocking, but basically 5.0 - 5.1 GHz all the time when gaming. And the price is good :).
Although I'm currently moving to AMD, it looks to me like the 12400 was decent no e-cores no nonsense.
Thx for producing this, very informative.
Sitting pretty on AM4. Should be interesting to see how this unfolds.
In my view, Intel probably already knew that the 13900K/KS & 14900K/KS were already prone to failure early on even before release in their testing labs. They probably said to their engineers "Shh..no one has to know. That's classified information". So, its the consumers that get screwed in the end🤔😱😡
You think? Intel and Apple come from the same tree.. make money even if if means the customer gets screwed
The CPU does have a 3 year warranty. If you live outside the U.S. or Canada, it may not be honored.
@@TheCompbuzz it is honored in 150-ish countries
Then Intel needs to do a recall. Before anyone else says it's not that easy, this happens to companies all the time. It might cost them more in the end, but they are fleecing people at this point. Even a discount on current products would be a step in the right direction. If I'm right, it's only affecting 13th and 14th gen I-7 and I-9 parts. Those should at least be priced accordingly to the performance. They don't even need to worry about I-5 and down. So, yes it will cost them, but the longer they let the problem fester, the more it grows. I'm glad I switched to AMD.
K, ks, and kf varients
@@aerynsunsrustchannel1783 Totally, but it depends on what's being affected the most. If the plain jane I7 and I9 CPUs are fine, then it's just on anything with the K and KF.
It will cost them *less* than losing server markets.
It’s deeper than the input hub. The 12900k doesn’t have premature degradation and has the removed hub. Could be the IMC or problem with the ring interconnect
No, Bryan's point was that the 12900k has stuttering on the desktop because of the removed hub, not that it's actually a defective cpu.
Salude! I have a question, though..., That I'm not sure if it would be attributed to I/O? I just don't know how that works..., but...!
When people first started having issues with the Intel CPUs, I suspected that it was due to manufacturing lag during the covid era. Producing being halted, faulty or inferior components, lack of workers, and so on. There were a lot of components burning up, exploding, or getting fried, like PSs, and other PC parts. Manufacturers were rushing to get products out and using inferior substances, etc, in order to meet demands. Could this be attributed to faulty I/O?
0:05 That is a straight ODD take my dude.
You clearly know the tech influencer community takes sponsors from Intel and sell them to their viewers.
Thanks for the update. I see a class action law suit against Intel coming real soon because of this problem.
Hi there, just a thought I had, would it be possible to re-create the potential intel IO issue by using the same.sysyem but using one of the few games with direct storage, this would negate the CPU using the IO to send info such as textures to the GPU directly using direct storage bypassing the CPU and to repeat the test turn off direct storage meaning the CPU is then used for IO game streaming data
Just a thought
Cheers
I think I dodged a bullet by getting a previous year gen-powered notebook a couple of years ago, the 11800h isn't suffering from such issues.
im so happy i went amd...
My 9900K still runs like a champ.
I'm still running an i7-8700, on a Asus Z390-P MB. Planing on upgrading to an i9-9900K.
Yup seeing people saying they are too broke to "upgrade" their 10th+ gen chip like it's bad, I've had/used extensively 9th 10th 11th and 12th gen i7 chips gave the 9th/2060 to my buddy cause his system was aging and kept being a butt and needing attention to work properly constantly, my brother has a 10th gen with a 2060 super, I had a 11th gen with a 2070 then a couple of years ago I landed a 12th with a 3060 12g. None of them are even close to slow or unresponsive and are all super usable and capable still. If any system with even a 7th gen or newer chip is acting slow it's probably suffering some kind of software malfunction. I have a 1st gen 875k that is still usable for daily use and light to medium gaming it's not as speedy as the newer chips but it still gets the job done except with the apps that need instructions it can't do.
Heck yea, got mine day 1. Used in my gaming box for a year then swapped over to my plex server over the past several years with no issues to this day.
i have a 9700k but i am just gonna go amd for my next computer
@@TRaKLLC I have 8700k and probably will move to 9900X or 9950X for my next build.
greatzzz from holland keep up the goodwork
I switched from Intel to AMD back around 10th-11th gen due to the seeming slow progress and power demands climbing up (didn't like the excess heat).
Feel quite good about my 5950X which is still a fantastic CPU after years of use.
Do allot of video transcoding and some developement with it.
I didn't want to upgrade to 7000 series because of the increase in power demand, and will think long and hard if I even want to bother with 9000 series as an upgrade.
My 13900k died 14 months after I bought it, ran it at defaults, tweaked the voltages, kept it in the low 80c.
Just one day my video card drivers failed to install or even detect my 4090, couldn't unzip files, underclocking the e-core to 3Ghz managed to keep the "stable".
Swapped it out for a 14600k as a test all the issues instantly went away.
Intel did RMA my 13900k, took about a3 days to get to the Gold Coast, so I got a new one, but how long is this one going to last, I've completely gimped it to be safe.
But even with this replacement I'm getting all the exact same random hitching opening windows, using Foobar2000, my wife's 10900k is way more snappier than my 13900k.
I dodged bullet Happy user AMD Ryzen 5 7600 stock boost to 5,15Ghz CPU-Z bench ST 725 MT 5984 cost me 165 Euros a year ago
sounds like you need a plan b asap
isn't that 14600k going to have the same problems in a bit?
@@transformerstuff7029 It was a brand new out of the box CPU I picked up for testing, so no degradation.
But yes it can happen to that CPU too..
Ooo another spicy one let’s goo ❤❤❤❤❤
I did a review on a laptop with a 13620h with an rtx 4070 in it a few months back. I felt the same way, it did not feel snappy, it was slow and sluggish to respond to any input. I found that forcing windows 11 into high performance power mode helped, but it still didn't seem right. I just bought another laptop with a 13900hx and 4080 and had the same problem. Now this information comes out. Sending this thing back, selling off my old laptop and getting a ryzen based laptop.
I've been multi boxing eq2 with 5 standard windows hyperv VMs and a standard client just fine for months but now I can't even run 3 VMs without the pc bluescreening, so I had to stop playing that sadly. Regular games are fine but excessive load makes my 13900k crash even with an Arctic freezer iii 420. It will sometimes crash when running alot of programs too, which is equally frustrating.
They said 12900ks was fine on servers
It same design but wonder why they didnt have issues with those cpus?
It's a different architecture and the 12900KS was not running such high clockspeeds and voltages.
4:48 Can we get a Snap Yes City parody video when April 1st rolls around?
Anyone have an issue with monitors just randomly turning off and on and resetting audio settings after upgrading?
I have a 13900KS but I have not experienced anything that we are hearing about. I'm wondering if there is there any test I can do to see if my chip is effected? So far everything for me has been normal. Only thing I have done so far is run Cinebench R23 and it also did not have any crashes. If there is another better test or if there is some I/O test I can run please let me know.
render 10 4k video's a week
Intel: Hot Dogsht Inside! 🤣
Everyone's on this topic.
now but not at launch.
I've not been able to play any games without some form of stuttering, performance issues and crashes. Overall operations on my PC also feels sluggish. Opening apps and programs can take longer then expected.
I9 13900k, RTX 4090, 64GB DDR5 Ram@ 6400Mhz, Windows 11 and 1300W Platinum PSU.
Hey Brian , one of those 57x3d's off ali express i ordered arrived dead on arrival :(
so, are lower tier cpu's ok? like the 12600 i just bought.
lol i just bought 12600 yesterday and a 12100 for my parents . i think it should be ok as theyre saying this only affects 13/14 generation. i think we have dodged a bullet. i got ddr4 ram tho , that's supposed to make it even more reliable
@@Animal_lives_matter i'm building tomorrow, i will use my older gen ddr4, hope it works.
@@AnthondeVries
what mobo did you get?
@@Animal_lives_matter ASRock B660M-HDV
@@Animal_lives_matter ASRock B660M-HDV
This is great work - thanks for bringing this to light
love your stuff
but intel, amd , soon snapdragon etc
what are we missing?
there are vendors who contact those things (dell, huawei) and ... thats where the support issue comes in right?
I've never been an actual fanboy but I have long favored Intel as a quality product. But now I'm switching to AMD since my patience with Intel's stagnation has peaked. Not going to wait for Arrow Lake and Intel's shady promises anymore. If Arrow Lake is really going to impress, then we can talk again. I'm also a share holder of both companies.
I have waited Intel to bounce back since Coffee Lake and it has not happened. Six years of bad news after bad news with Intel.
I will swap my 14900k for a 7950x3d probably although setting PL1/PL2/ICC to 125/253/307 solved my issues with high cpu usage games like FF XV who was crashing constantly and eliminated the rare blue screens so far.
At this point you could wait a month for zen 5. The 8950X is going to match the 7950X3D in gaming and will be way faster in productivity for the same price.
I highly discourage against buying the 7950x3d. Just buy the 7950x instead.
@@username8644 any reason why?
@@exifs I've heared from the CachyOS devs they had two faulty 7950X3Ds in a row, possibly due to the heavy compile jobs they ran on these and the VCache probably didn't like it that much.
@@exifs I would just avoid any x3d CPU with multiple CCD. If you want more cores then just get the regular chip.
the question is whether arrow lake could be affected by the same things. it does not sound like this is specific to 10nm
I'm having this issue recently, I'm video editor using this 13900k as my work machine, it was always have a BSODs when it comes to rendering or having heavy tasks like Dynamic link between premiere pro and after effects. as I have a tight deadline, I didn't have time to test it one by one to check which component of my PC were having issue, so I decided to replace the Power Supply, SSDs, Mainboard except Processor and VGA. it was the same problem that I had! , and last I changed my processor with core i5 12400f just to test it, everything went smoothly!. didn't have issues at at all!. I have to claim the guarantee for the13900K and once it replaced I'm not sure if i'm going to use it again or not. Maybe I will sell it and replace it with core i7 14700. it's okay for me to have reduced performance little bit as long as it gets the job done.
My 14900k has been perfectly stable after swappping to a new board and ram. Last time I reported I was having stability issues with it. Ever since moving platforms its perfect. I had a z690 hero running 7200cl34 48gb prior. Nor I’m running 32gb 6400cl32. Everything updated on latest bios and drivers. All comp stock profiles. Zero crashes or issues running games anymore. I’m shocked and baffled. The z690 hero even downclocking the ram to 6000 still was crashing in cod with 252w pl1/pl2 levels and trying to run intel baseline profiles and more. Nothing made it stable. Wondering if there’s some really really weird issues where the memory controller is failing to cooperate with certain ram kits or maybe there was a board issue ? If anyone else is having these issues try swapping ram and or board.
If you have to switch boards because the Intel CPU is crashing, you might as well RMA it and switch to AM5.
@@LordApophis100 AMD is dog shit though
@@LordApophis100 These smart arse comments are not helpful mate.
Which brand were these motherboards from?
The answer is given in the video: The CPU should work as intended out of the box in stock settings. No under- or overclocking needed.
I see no reason to upgrade my i7 11700, will last me at least another year or two.
i upgraded from haswell to am5 hoping it will serve me at least 8 years too
I went from i5-4690k that i had been using for 10+ years. Bought a 14700k and expect it to last for another 10 years easily
i have never seen a person voluntarily saying they got a 11th gen cpu
I oversea a few dozen 13900K's and 14900K's that are doing workloads more than the oodle decompression that will run for weeks upon weeks, we are using consumer level parts and all of the motherboards are still an asus z690 with bios defaults and xmp settings. None of them are unstable, its strange that intel is not yet saying what the root cause is. It might just be a massive bad batch or production contamination?
With all then research I've done, it seems to be a problem solved by using Intel baseline specifications. 'No, the CPU cannot be overclocked safely, yes, it will run at the advertised speed'. So nothing special here, and definitely not different from what to expect with AMD in this regard.
"Flagship" or "Flagshit"
Edit: Hyundai and KN Stingers are the same, they are both Hyundais lol
Yep, gonna ride my AM4 into the sunset and only then see which company wants to bend me over the least. And then, perhaps upgrade. 5700x3d still can handle pretty good GPUs I can't even afford baby!
Me wondering if I should buy a 5700X3D when my "biggest" games are Armored Core VI and Tekken 8
games suck so bad right now that I'm not even caring anymore🥴
@@radiantansel202
True! I kept on coming back to FarCry 3, Civ V, and Witcher 3 years after years.
Gonna ride am4 until am6 or 7
It's probably when they expanded the cache size with raptor lake put additional pressure of the I/O along side the additional core count and frequency. The ring or that in tandem with how the P cores are being pushed increasing voltage that feeds the ring as well makes total sense.
I know at x39 ring in a bunch of the texts for x86 memtest at the same exact settings it was very stable it appeared moving inversions and hammer row tests I think specifically game errors though once you pushed it to x40 or higher and that was the only setting that changed. I think that's bit telling to me that the I/O is fickle. I also remember dropping all the P cores down to x53 on 14700K from like x55 and x56 for the 2 boost cores fixed instabilities at stock that I noticed in a few instances at full load for a few workloads like cine-bench.
I think it's interconnected with ring, cache, and cores. I'd say mostly p-cores because those require the highest peak voltage at the frequencies they operate.
So is this something that changed in the raptorlake design from alderlake? Or is it because Intel pushed RL to the limit to keep up?
So who is pre-ordering a 15900K ? This is where we will also see Intel's pain beyond the likely worldwide recall.
I wonder if this will cause a price collapse for everything Intel.
A race to the bottom would benefit consumers.