Some of these people are so giddy about this invite they are like teenagers getting asked on a first date. It is kind of embarrassing. For a corporation it is an incredibly cheap way of buying people.
Bankers of the coast also has inertia going for them. Every time I've offered to run an alternative RPG session I have to explain that Rifts, Earthdawn or Forbidden Lands I have to explain "No, It Does Not Use 5E Rules."
Fortunately, I have no interest in returning to WotC ever. Their hiring practices are politically motivated. Their game design capabilities are non existent. The quality of their products continues to degrade by the day. Even without the OGL nonsense, I was already moving away, the only reason I'd dipped back because 5E was basically what everyone wanted to play, but once I got them to go 'damn, you're a good DM' and they kept falling in love with the house rules, it was easier to convince the players to do something new. From there, it's been a touch bumpy, but overall fairly easy transition into Castles and Crusades, and I'm not looking back. Instead it's turned into grabbing and converting AD&D content for added benefit.
From the horse's mouth. If you look at who is running the ship over at Hasbro and WotC it becomes very clear what they are about. I so, so, so wish this hadn't happened to our hobby.
D&D didn't end. WOTC just lost control of it. Castles & Crusades is a worthy spiritual successor to D&D. There are a score of games I consider "real" D&D. Of course... None of them were published by Wizards of the Coast.
You said it just right, Grog! It is what it is. For my part, I wish to the GODS they'd actually include content creators. But I have the feeling they're not interested in artists and their tendency to have those pesky "opinions" and bit of "artistic integrity". Like you said, this is PR, nothing more.
If "What-See" wants the sheep....take them. I'm an elitist and proudly wear the title. The crowd they are looking to buy aren't the sort I care to game with anyway.
Its just a corporation doing what a corporation does... It'll be interesting to see how the "invited" content creators and influencers' post-summit content addresses the issue of potentially biased reporting following an "all-expenses-paid" junket promoting corporate interests. Maybe they'll surprise us, but my hopes aren't high that they possess the self-awareness to know when they're being (legitimately) played...
Don't forget "per diem." But AFAIC, it doesn't really matter how they respond, because the response is compromised. Even if the attendees are critical of WotC, their criticism will be tempered. Even if they are not influenced by the money, they will be meeting and getting friendly with the WotC workers. This will put them in the position of not wanting to harm people they like. These marketing junkets have been honed to a science and once you attend one, you're not going to be able to remain objective. This is why the FTC treats them as gifts and often outright forbids them. This is why Journalists are expected to refuse them.
The creators' followers are invested in their "content", and everyone wants to believe that the information they choose to receive is legit, and that they're not being taken for fools. So any suggestion that influencers that followers are invested in may be any less than inviolate in their views, may be perceived as a personal attack, so I think there will be a depressingly significant amount of reflexive defence of whatever is reported from this summit. Ultimately, corporations are smart and well-funded. All they want to do is ensure positive hype for their product, and if providing a "financial inducement" for content creators achieves that end, of course they'll do it.
Sure. A very wise man once said, and forgive me if I paraphrase, "It's much easier to fool a man than it is to persuade him that he's been made a fool."
An amazing video as usual. One thing I wish you had mentioned but didn't is simply this: WoTC conveniently chose people that are in far too deep with 5E. What do I mean? Well their audience is comprised of 5E blowhards. They're there because 5E is the only game they know, the only one they play, and projectile vomit at the thought of even playing anything else. Imagine what would happen to their subscriber count if they just, all of a sudden quit covering it? They'd take a hit that they wouldn't be able to recover from. For any 5E blowhards that disagree with me I submit to you Treantmonk. He said the above himself. But yeah, it's obvious WoTC is being slimy as usual, and people don't care because they don't actually care about the TTRPG hobby. They're here because its "the cool thing to do" even though the majority of people that play D&D now are the type of people to bully someone for playing it back in the 80's. Just because back then it WASN'T the cool thing to do.
Yes. This. A hugely important part of running a successful marketing junket ID is choosing people who will play ball, and WotC seems to have done a pretty expert job of that.
I do very much agree that WOTC let the mask slip, revealed what they really are, and no amount of makeup will change whats beneath. However unless it requires signing an nda, saying no to free stuff is a bad idea, however I presume you would need to accept not being invited next year as you say. I do however often underestimate how forgetful the general public is.
Totes honest, if I was in a position to take the bribe, I would - but just once - mostly just to document the experience. Truth is, I'd never be able to "pass" whatever conditions WotC would have for someone to be invited, anyways - if only because I neither buy nor cover their products.
Almost everybody goes to their first marketing junket parroting a very similar sentiment. Very few follow through. Easy for me to say, though. Even if I wasn't a small fry, people as unequivocally critical as I am don't get invited to events like this.
Seems to there are some that are looking at all their options to keep their love of 5e intact - this is standard entertainment industry (heck all over as you've said) practice really. Doesn't mean it's above critique - this is brand management chicanery, plain and simple. WOTC trying to rebuild clout for sure. A transparent hail mary pass that is obvious - pathetic really - no true full creatives in the industry, no 3pps, artists, designers not being invited says it all. None of this will have me embracing OneDND as anything other than a player in friends' games to just stay connected to the rules only. NO buying more products.
Few things are more ridiculous than being a poorly compensated or even worse an unwitting shill. I actually think WotC is going to survive if Hasbro has the cash flow and can get One D&D VTT rolling. It's going to find its fanbase because the newer younger players have grown up on Pokémon, WoW, anime cartoons, Harry Potter and not Howard, Lovecraft, Leiber, Moorcock, 70s and 80s Swords and Sorcery movies, most of which is now seen as "problematic" and promoting a "colonialist mindset", and that's when they are not just outright calling it xenopobic white supremacist right wing recruitment material, there are no more sacred cows when it comes to the fantasy genre or your own imagination, even Tolkiens properties are getting watered down and prepared to be thrown in a dumpster. So these new players are coming to the hobby with a whole bunch of completely different angles and perspectives out of what they want from an interactive fantasy game.. I think if WotC can manage to create a VTT that works they will bite, which is why they want the older player base gone asap because we are not buying into it and WotC has probably also seen a major decrease in sales from the older demographic over the past decade as those players moved over to OSR or never bought into the newer editions, but they sure still do like to make their voices loudly heard concerning the IP and that's killing Hasbros marketing narrative. They see the older fanbase now as a liability to their VTT plans going forward and they are probably correct in this assumption so yeah telling us "Old white guys can't get out of the hobby fast enough" I mean you don't get anymore direct than that, what do some people need to get it? a crowbar to the kneecaps? 😆 I don't care, I'm tuning WotC out so hard I'm just completely ignoring them going forward and making sure my hobby dollars don't go their way and that's that.. no games, no movies, no promotion, no nostalgic sweet nothings, no recommendations to others, and occasionally I'll still take a giant dump all over Wotc tea party when others bring it up and I can't avoid it because we'll F☆☆k Hasbro, everything they do is garbage anyway.
I support your views on WotC and enjoy your videos as an old school BX dnd player. Where do you draw the line between what Wizards are doing and a RUclipsr offering a free book if they get to 1k subscribers? All power to you, peace. ✌
This is literally an off the Wall Question. Since I see a copy of the 1981 TSR Fiend Folio book behind you, do you ever wonder why it has funny smelling paper? The copy I had and every other copy I picked up had this weird pulp mill smell. Do you have any idea what it's made out of that gives it that fragrance or odor (depending on preference)?
We don't really need one, but I'll wager someone was mad enough to compile one. In the end, though, the Content Creators junket was a complete flop. The participants were still angry about WotC coming after their livelihoods and gave them a seriously hard time. I was told that Ginny Di walked out in the middle of the event. I don't think we'll see a second annual Content Creators Summit. If WotC was planning to be even remotely responsive to the community they might benefit from one, but I think we all understand now that 6E is going to be a shitty mobile app, and no amount of sugar coating is going to make the 5E kiddies get on board with that nonsense.
That seems a bit extreme, unless they are also either defending Hasbro, or doing 5E stuff exclusively. ... Some 3rd party 5E publishers had no hesitation in criticizing WotC, even before the OGL stuff made it obvious to even normys, how much Hasbro really hates its fans.
@@agsilverradio2225 Perhaps a bit extreme, but I don't feel comfortable supporting an ecosystem that nourishes a lying, corrupt, power-hungry WotC. WotC should pay a steep price for their shenanigans.
@@kevinkingmaker7395 Fair enough. Do what you think is right. ... I totally would unsub from anyone who goes to the summit thoguh; unless *maybe* they were specificly going as some sort of undercover investigative reporter. ... I already unsubbed from Tovok the Barbrarian for defending Hasbro trying to revolk the OGL.
Once you accept a bribe, you're not a commentator, anymore. Your show is just an ad. I really don't like anyone on RUclips enough to subscribe to their ad channel.
Shocked? Nah. I started playing OSRIC and Basic Fantasy years ago, and AFAIC the only REAL modern version of D&D is Castles & Crusades. Angry? Yes. I am always angry when corporations use their vast wealth and power to influence public sentiment and, by extension, policy. Corporate influence is a cancer on western culture.
Some of these people are so giddy about this invite they are like teenagers getting asked on a first date. It is kind of embarrassing. For a corporation it is an incredibly cheap way of buying people.
I know, right? Real Jim Carey "They love me" vibe.
I have a feeling nobody who I currently follow will be invited to this.
Bankers of the coast also has inertia going for them.
Every time I've offered to run an alternative RPG session I have to explain that Rifts, Earthdawn or Forbidden Lands I have to explain "No, It Does Not Use 5E Rules."
Fortunately, I have no interest in returning to WotC ever. Their hiring practices are politically motivated. Their game design capabilities are non existent. The quality of their products continues to degrade by the day. Even without the OGL nonsense, I was already moving away, the only reason I'd dipped back because 5E was basically what everyone wanted to play, but once I got them to go 'damn, you're a good DM' and they kept falling in love with the house rules, it was easier to convince the players to do something new. From there, it's been a touch bumpy, but overall fairly easy transition into Castles and Crusades, and I'm not looking back. Instead it's turned into grabbing and converting AD&D content for added benefit.
From the horse's mouth.
If you look at who is running the ship over at Hasbro and WotC it becomes very clear what they are about. I so, so, so wish this hadn't happened to our hobby.
D&D ended with 3.5
"4th" is Hasbro & Dragons 1st, and 5th is H&D 2nd Ed.
D&D didn't end. WOTC just lost control of it. Castles & Crusades is a worthy spiritual successor to D&D. There are a score of games I consider "real" D&D. Of course... None of them were published by Wizards of the Coast.
You said it just right, Grog! It is what it is.
For my part, I wish to the GODS they'd actually include content creators. But I have the feeling they're not interested in artists and their tendency to have those pesky "opinions" and bit of "artistic integrity". Like you said, this is PR, nothing more.
Amazon did this too and they didn't fare so well either.
Which online influencers have accepted WotC's bribe? If you could make a list, that would be helpful so I know who to unsubscribe from.
Bob The Worldbuilder accepted in a video he did. Not sure who else did yet - I am sure we will all know soon enough.
@@erc1971erc1971 Nerd Immersion accepted the invite too.
@@PlanetOfTheApes999 Thanks for letting me know.
We won't know for sure who-all is going until the event April 3.
!00% correct, this is WotC offering the 30 pieces of silver to those that will take it.
I will say the same I said to Bob World Builder: "Siren song..." and you are right. They invite "influencers".
If "What-See" wants the sheep....take them. I'm an elitist and proudly wear the title. The crowd they are looking to buy aren't the sort I care to game with anyway.
I can certainly understand that.
Its just a corporation doing what a corporation does... It'll be interesting to see how the "invited" content creators and influencers' post-summit content addresses the issue of potentially biased reporting following an "all-expenses-paid" junket promoting corporate interests. Maybe they'll surprise us, but my hopes aren't high that they possess the self-awareness to know when they're being (legitimately) played...
Don't forget "per diem."
But AFAIC, it doesn't really matter how they respond, because the response is compromised. Even if the attendees are critical of WotC, their criticism will be tempered. Even if they are not influenced by the money, they will be meeting and getting friendly with the WotC workers. This will put them in the position of not wanting to harm people they like.
These marketing junkets have been honed to a science and once you attend one, you're not going to be able to remain objective. This is why the FTC treats them as gifts and often outright forbids them. This is why Journalists are expected to refuse them.
The creators' followers are invested in their "content", and everyone wants to believe that the information they choose to receive is legit, and that they're not being taken for fools. So any suggestion that influencers that followers are invested in may be any less than inviolate in their views, may be perceived as a personal attack, so I think there will be a depressingly significant amount of reflexive defence of whatever is reported from this summit. Ultimately, corporations are smart and well-funded. All they want to do is ensure positive hype for their product, and if providing a "financial inducement" for content creators achieves that end, of course they'll do it.
Sure. A very wise man once said, and forgive me if I paraphrase, "It's much easier to fool a man than it is to persuade him that he's been made a fool."
It seems many went then started asking questions and WotC was surprised their attendees weren't playing by the unspoken rules.
The herd mentality is real, it only takes a few silver tongued influencers to turn the sheep right back around to their complacency.
An amazing video as usual.
One thing I wish you had mentioned but didn't is simply this:
WoTC conveniently chose people that are in far too deep with 5E. What do I mean? Well their audience is comprised of 5E blowhards. They're there because 5E is the only game they know, the only one they play, and projectile vomit at the thought of even playing anything else.
Imagine what would happen to their subscriber count if they just, all of a sudden quit covering it? They'd take a hit that they wouldn't be able to recover from.
For any 5E blowhards that disagree with me I submit to you Treantmonk. He said the above himself.
But yeah, it's obvious WoTC is being slimy as usual, and people don't care because they don't actually care about the TTRPG hobby. They're here because its "the cool thing to do" even though the majority of people that play D&D now are the type of people to bully someone for playing it back in the 80's. Just because back then it WASN'T the cool thing to do.
Yes. This.
A hugely important part of running a successful marketing junket ID is choosing people who will play ball, and WotC seems to have done a pretty expert job of that.
I do very much agree that WOTC let the mask slip, revealed what they really are, and no amount of makeup will change whats beneath.
However unless it requires signing an nda, saying no to free stuff is a bad idea, however I presume you would need to accept not being invited next year as you say.
I do however often underestimate how forgetful the general public is.
General pub is like a goldfish or worse a fruit fly
Totes honest, if I was in a position to take the bribe, I would - but just once - mostly just to document the experience. Truth is, I'd never be able to "pass" whatever conditions WotC would have for someone to be invited, anyways - if only because I neither buy nor cover their products.
Almost everybody goes to their first marketing junket parroting a very similar sentiment. Very few follow through.
Easy for me to say, though. Even if I wasn't a small fry, people as unequivocally critical as I am don't get invited to events like this.
IDK, my "problem" is that I'm too honest, so even if I was popular, I wouldn't be invited - and I'm fine with that.
Seems to there are some that are looking at all their options to keep their love of 5e intact - this is standard entertainment industry (heck all over as you've said) practice really. Doesn't mean it's above critique - this is brand management chicanery, plain and simple. WOTC trying to rebuild clout for sure. A transparent hail mary pass that is obvious - pathetic really - no true full creatives in the industry, no 3pps, artists, designers not being invited says it all. None of this will have me embracing OneDND as anything other than a player in friends' games to just stay connected to the rules only. NO buying more products.
Let's be honest anyone accepting an invite to this Shills Convention immediately loses all credibility
Would it be possible to have the list of the content creators who went to that meeting? Just for the sake of knowledge, you know.
Not yet. The event hasn't occurred, yet. It's slated for April 3.
Few things are more ridiculous than being a poorly compensated or even worse an unwitting shill. I actually think WotC is going to survive if Hasbro has the cash flow and can get One D&D VTT rolling. It's going to find its fanbase because the newer younger players have grown up on Pokémon, WoW, anime cartoons, Harry Potter and not Howard, Lovecraft, Leiber, Moorcock, 70s and 80s Swords and Sorcery movies, most of which is now seen as "problematic" and promoting a "colonialist mindset", and that's when they are not just outright calling it xenopobic white supremacist right wing recruitment material, there are no more sacred cows when it comes to the fantasy genre or your own imagination, even Tolkiens properties are getting watered down and prepared to be thrown in a dumpster. So these new players are coming to the hobby with a whole bunch of completely different angles and perspectives out of what they want from an interactive fantasy game.. I think if WotC can manage to create a VTT that works they will bite, which is why they want the older player base gone asap because we are not buying into it and WotC has probably also seen a major decrease in sales from the older demographic over the past decade as those players moved over to OSR or never bought into the newer editions, but they sure still do like to make their voices loudly heard concerning the IP and that's killing Hasbros marketing narrative. They see the older fanbase now as a liability to their VTT plans going forward and they are probably correct in this assumption so yeah telling us "Old white guys can't get out of the hobby fast enough" I mean you don't get anymore direct than that, what do some people need to get it? a crowbar to the kneecaps? 😆 I don't care, I'm tuning WotC out so hard I'm just completely ignoring them going forward and making sure my hobby dollars don't go their way and that's that.. no games, no movies, no promotion, no nostalgic sweet nothings, no recommendations to others, and occasionally I'll still take a giant dump all over Wotc tea party when others bring it up and I can't avoid it because we'll F☆☆k Hasbro, everything they do is garbage anyway.
You are a good soul👍
I support your views on WotC and enjoy your videos as an old school BX dnd player. Where do you draw the line between what Wizards are doing and a RUclipsr offering a free book if they get to 1k subscribers? All power to you, peace. ✌
I think the difference is that I offered a giveaway for a subscription, not a review (and certainly not a positive review).
This is literally an off the Wall Question. Since I see a copy of the 1981 TSR Fiend Folio book behind you, do you ever wonder why it has funny smelling paper? The copy I had and every other copy I picked up had this weird pulp mill smell. Do you have any idea what it's made out of that gives it that fragrance or odor (depending on preference)?
I honestly hadn't noticed, but I suspect the paper was cheaper.
Do we have a list of the attendees? I need to lighten my subscription list.
We don't really need one, but I'll wager someone was mad enough to compile one. In the end, though, the Content Creators junket was a complete flop. The participants were still angry about WotC coming after their livelihoods and gave them a seriously hard time. I was told that Ginny Di walked out in the middle of the event.
I don't think we'll see a second annual Content Creators Summit. If WotC was planning to be even remotely responsive to the community they might benefit from one, but I think we all understand now that 6E is going to be a shitty mobile app, and no amount of sugar coating is going to make the 5E kiddies get on board with that nonsense.
I will unsubscribe to any youtuber that continues to post 5e content.
That seems a bit extreme, unless they are also either defending Hasbro, or doing 5E stuff exclusively.
...
Some 3rd party 5E publishers had no hesitation in criticizing WotC, even before the OGL stuff made it obvious to even normys, how much Hasbro really hates its fans.
@@agsilverradio2225 Perhaps a bit extreme, but I don't feel comfortable supporting an ecosystem that nourishes a lying, corrupt, power-hungry WotC. WotC should pay a steep price for their shenanigans.
@@kevinkingmaker7395 Fair enough. Do what you think is right.
...
I totally would unsub from anyone who goes to the summit thoguh; unless *maybe* they were specificly going as some sort of undercover investigative reporter.
...
I already unsubbed from Tovok the Barbrarian for defending Hasbro trying to revolk the OGL.
I will subscribe to any youtuber that posts actual TRPG content and not disposable hot takes.
Once you accept a bribe, you're not a commentator, anymore. Your show is just an ad. I really don't like anyone on RUclips enough to subscribe to their ad channel.
Nice video keep on doing more.
Thank you, I will
Well it remains to be seen if they are paid promptly for there travel expenses? If Wotc screws that up, well it will be at minimum hilarious! 😉
Preach!
Leave your ethics at the door.
If they wanted to do something good for the community they need to apologize on gen con.
Apologies are hot air and wind. I don't honestly see any way WotC can mend fences with me. But I don't think they sincerely want to, anyway.
@@grumpyoldgrognard9561 you are rigth, WotC only care is a profit.
SUBED
Thanks!
We are not the demographic for WOTC anymore get used to it You seem shockedand angry.
Let's all play our OSR games and ignore WOTC.
Shocked? Nah. I started playing OSRIC and Basic Fantasy years ago, and AFAIC the only REAL modern version of D&D is Castles & Crusades.
Angry? Yes. I am always angry when corporations use their vast wealth and power to influence public sentiment and, by extension, policy. Corporate influence is a cancer on western culture.