Hot take what if havoc allowed you to earn small amounts of aquilas. Not enough where people can just easily bang out a full store cosmetic in an afternoon, but enough to make it possible to save up for something. It'd REALLY get people actually playing the mode, essentially forever
I think the funniest part of last night streamer, there was a level 40 clear ogryn on the party match finder who couldn’t find a lobby and you even joked about inviting him for your teammate to say nonono
@@MisterEtideI’m super hoping havoc highlights what ogryn is needing And maybe the changes make ogryn super easy up to damnation and auric… but is that bad if the class is balanced and fun at the higher difficulties? Might actually see some big guys around, or remove the stigma
I think Havoc 40 still needs to be played like a WOW dungeon/raid though. Also, not everyone has friends to play with, some of us still have to deal with what we can find on the party finder.
Yeah i forget if i said that in the video, but the main issue havoc will have is its barrier to entry with party finder, and not really being interesting enough to want to put in that extra effort
Couple of havoc 40 as an ogryn and you learn how things work. It’s not hard just tedious and needlessly hard for annoying sake. Problem now is going back to auric maelstrom and realizing how soft mode it is. I don’t know if I learned anything but it’s a night and day experience back in auric.
Healthgating was a design feature to combat a design issue. To be honest, I find it weird to turn it into a modifier that creates the issue again. Because it's not like it affects balance. It affects design.
Havoc is a part of the game that I’m perfectly fine never engaging with. I’ll just fuck around with stuff I think is fun in regular Aurics, thank you very much.
I thought the same. Then I played it havoc is pretty fun. from like 22-30 is the sweat spot I enjoy playing. It still requires teamwork and a challenge for normal players. Without it being absolutely insane hard.
The real challenge is getting 40 with pub players That’s the real rng gate challenge either you get completely legendary players who don’t know what going down is or people who struggle in regular damnation and somehow ended up in +30 havoc and before you say only have completed 30+ havocs in your lobby. No I’ve had them consistently fail within the first 2 minutes of the mission.
This is my experience, I'm running book and flamer, people are still running around my themselves, not sticking together, but pulling back to choke points, etc. To be sure I'm not the good and cannot carry. So basically the hard part is getting good players with good builds. Mm already seemed dead, at least last night. If I could get the cosmetics and tags I would be done with the mode.
I hit 33 and have little motivation to grind more, i wanna skip to 40 and just get it done. The mode is draining in the worst ways, the difficulty is one thing but the janky ass useless systems around actually STARTING a game, on top of people just jumping into game with shit builds, which I cannot check beforehand without mods, and I then cannot KICK them from MY STRIKE TEAM THAT I STARTED, on top of there being like 4 playstyles that actually work well enough to let me carry these sandbags that join me- im tired boss. This mode genuinely sucks as an overall experience. It is intense and hype and fun to get a good team and pull off these locked in coordinated pushes, its absolutely cathartic seeing teammates routinely saving each other and backing each other up in bad situations- issue is, unless I have the time and availability to get a premade, 90% of games dont go this way. John Darktide Lv31 joins me as an Executioners Vet and doesn't speak and oh wow, we died, crazy. Remove the weekly ranks completely, and LET ME KICK PEOPLE WHO EXPECT A CARRY OR REFUSE TO COLLABORATE WITH THE OTHER 3 WHO ACTUALLY WANT TO WIN. tldr Havoc trash in current state. There are 2 ways to have fun with it and I rarely get to do either. I think the mode would be exponentially more fun if the modifiers weren't stupid "higher number as difficulty" shit. All the conditions just make trash mobs annoying, there is NOTHING that remixes core DT gameplay, nothing interesting like "all specials are [x]" or anything resembling what Maelstroms do. Its literally number go up. It gets old.
honestly can't notice a difference in difficulty between havoc 30 and 40. As i vet main, pus hardened skin modifier making ranged weapons practically worthless outside of ones that apply DOT is annoying
I just don’t understand how they(obese fish) watched everyone praise how they did difficulty, while condemning space marines simple number changing. Then they decided “let’s do the thing everyone hated!” Not to mention it seems they didn’t actually know what they wanted to do with this mode like you said. Havoc starts in MALICE difficulty. Frankly, when they dropped the dev blog and said the requirement was just completing any maelstrom I realized they didn’t have a clear vision. Similar to chaos wastes, but the twitch mode for Vermintide was a great example of “fun” difficulty. ATM I would’ve just preferred if they added “super auric” where the tension mechanic was removed. At least that way I could quickplay and have similar difficulty, but infinitely more fun Also IK the easiest option is to simply add more ranks, but I’d like them to revisit the first 30 and try to scale them better too.
For all the people who think this can be done only in friends group etc, i want to tell u its very posible to do in pub games with randoms and with no coms ,im not part of top 0.1% skilled players but i managed to do it with randoms by hosting from lvl16 to lvl 40,and from lvl30 to 40 with no loses at all,and after that i hosted and completed true survivor title aswell with randoms with minimal coms like ,fall back when 2 boses + horde spawns .so dont lose hope u can do it 👍
They could just steal a whole bunch from chaos wastes. More fun negative modifiers and they could even make skins you get for hitting 40 every week as a reward
The constant horde idea of 40 is the only reason it was harder than the others, it just feels like a slightly cranked up auric overall with worse modifiers. It needs the differentiation that auric had compared to normal gameplay. Also who was that vet in the gameplay, he seemed real good 😏
Thing is Fatshark advertised that when Havok was a thing, they outright said you don’t need to beat the hardest Havok to get the rewards most care about. The Cosmetics, you get the pants at Havok 25 completion, Beat 50 Total Havoks for the chest and finally help people’s Havoks 50 times for the helmet. Those are the special draws, cooler reskin cosmetics that don’t need a couple thousand penance point for. Only the truly hard core will go for the Titles and 20 Havok Reward Chest Penance.
Your first comments threw me on a ride. I was thinking. . . this is not my experience with havoc 40. And I don't consider myself an "elite" gamer. I will say, if they nerf gold toughness. Havoc will be significantly harder. Maybe not in a fun way.
“Havoc word be harder maybe not in a fun way” and this is the exact problem with the game mode. It’s not even that much harder than an auric maelstrom. Except things like emperors fading light absolutely neuter any sense of fun
It’s really a shame that a specific team comp almost completely negates the difficulty. But if you don’t take that team it’s 100% sweat and may even be impossible with certain builds. I’d honestly be in favor of nerfing the difficulty a tad if it meant a team that isn’t bubble, chorus, and shout wasn’t an agonizing slog
The mode is hard, but it's really really boring in the long run. I expected much crazy fun modifiers, like twitch mode in Vermintide, Tzeentchian Twins and more. And they have to do something with the abilities, cause right now players are more carried by the spammy and busted abilites rather than their skill, and that drains my fun quite fast.
Went havoc 20 -> 21 -> 31 -> 36 -> 40 by joining random lobbies in a week. Had a lot of fun "completing" havoc as a shredder spam & 100% crit rate combat blade / revolver veteran ! At first I was confused about my ammo pick ups, but later on learned about the hidden modifiers
I cleared 40 with a random party. What made it feel like an accomplishment was the fact that we were a random group of players. I agree though, it was hard but not too bad. Level 40-50 is a good idea as well, as is allowing people to earn aquillas. I would really like to see some more meta shifting weapons added and improvements to ogryn and less used skills. I beat it with DS/plasma vet. Been playing since game release.
I've completed havoc 36 couple days ago and what I can say is you gotta have the right team and communication. The rest was actually not to bad, definitely could have done havoc 40
I wonder how you would react if they'd nerf knifes and dueling swords, along with bolters and plasma guns, but along the way "fixed" broken toughness bracing momentum (rather brought it back) and evened-out Veteran and Zealot abilities with their other (remove golden toughness). Could that be solution to that "I want level 50 Havoc difficulty level"?
It will if no maintenance. You get lvl 40, you get those rewards and its no longer worth playing. The sad thing is that finding a 30+ group is really hard and at this point, I will just solo queue Maelstrom. There's not enough modifiers to be diverse.
The tox gas modifier is trash, I agree. Feels super unfair. We need to be able to earn currency for the store. It feels lame that we have a new game mode and 1 set and that’s it. Especially when the store has all this cool stuff.
Thats why handicapping the player is often more difficult and fun, than introducing more buffs to the enemies, especially if those buffs are more health, more damage, more enemy... because you know, where do you even take this further? Like how do you realistically make it actually harder? Mutators are actually much more fun i think, they honestly hit the spot for me and the lower ranks of 20-30s. Player debuffs would be essentially handicaps like, less toughness on dodge, a limit on powerslides, constant ticking corruption, cant block multiple attacks, ETC. And a really fun way to make it is to give small buffs next to it that are almost worthless, but so its essentially a really bad tradeoff.
making a havoc 50 would be a waste of time with the current dismal state of balance in this game, all increasing the difficulty further would do is force even the best players into the incredibly rigid meta of shout plasma vet, bubble purg psyker, charge flamer zealot and chorus beacon zealot what they need to do is nerf/remove CDR, remove gold toughness, massively nerf mobility, and redesign the difficulty of the game around this new balance. doing this would do more for the game than doubling the amount of havoc levels, weapons and maps
Havoc is Meh, I was glad when I got to 40 so I didn't have a reason to play it anymore. The gunners are the same buff they gave guns some months ago for like a patch, so it didn't bother me. The only thing I really noticed in Havoc was being annoyed by the artificial difficulty like the toughness reduction, increased break points, and the bile melee zoning mechanic but all those mechanics did was succeed in making me bored with it.
also thought havoc is going to be NUTS because I had poxgas + pox bombers at 24 or so. Havoc 30 is unironically easier than this combinations with randos
worst thing is to find a team to learn with, especially if all your friends not playing DT as much as you and i think most of the people wont be able to pass game mode because they struggle to find consistant party, even if you find compitent teammate they usually leave after 1or 2 games :\
My highest havoc so far was 26 and it was a lucky run with 2 level 1500+ psykers i definitely belong to the 99% of people that will never complete 40 Besides the fact that i hate the matchmaking mechanic it requires and the no resources for doing other people’s missions im just gonna grind below level 20 havocs to get the cosmetics and then return to normal auric missions havoc is just not worth it
Dude every time I get a pox gas map. the difficulty goes up exponentially. I think I beat pox gas once and it was a lvl 17 havoc. Otherwise, I just abandon it now at this point. I think pox gas is fun if you have a good leader and team. Requires alot of comms. But damn it's just next lvl hard.
Honestly, instead of taking ideas from chaos wastes and applying them to havoc time spent developing should have went into darktide equivalent of chaos wastes and darktide equivalent of Cataclysm difficulty or you know, just more missions lol
Nobody really gives a shit buba. This is not fun gameplay. Or built for the casual gamer. I want to be able too play this offline. With more adventure or story. And free mod use. This meta crap, elitist bullshit is so bad it smells.
Glad I got all the hardest stuff done with havoc a week ago, playing this on console with the crashes has broken my soul but don't worry next year they "might" fix it I doubt seeing its been happening for 7 months.
![Felix "Unfair" | [Stray Kids : SKZ-PLAYER]](http://i.ytimg.com/vi/Oswujxm2Ag0/mqdefault.jpg)
Hot take
what if havoc allowed you to earn small amounts of aquilas. Not enough where people can just easily bang out a full store cosmetic in an afternoon, but enough to make it possible to save up for something. It'd REALLY get people actually playing the mode, essentially forever
Hey thats my idea youre stealing it
Yeah and even if the amount it gave us was tiny, it still beats getting nothing at all. So I don’t think there’d be anyone who would be against this
@@MisterEtide Sorry Mister E, I patented it this morning and my Nintendo lawyers are on their way to your house right now
@@yrovas9277 what you mean? you get the toxic friends along the way.
I'm completely against this, because people wouldn't play the other modes and it would simply drag those who aren't ready into the mode.
I think the funniest part of last night streamer, there was a level 40 clear ogryn on the party match finder who couldn’t find a lobby and you even joked about inviting him for your teammate to say nonono
i was serious, ogryns can do it just fine, its just hard mode for them
@@MisterEtideI’m super hoping havoc highlights what ogryn is needing
And maybe the changes make ogryn super easy up to damnation and auric… but is that bad if the class is balanced and fun at the higher difficulties? Might actually see some big guys around, or remove the stigma
I think Havoc 40 still needs to be played like a WOW dungeon/raid though. Also, not everyone has friends to play with, some of us still have to deal with what we can find on the party finder.
Yeah i forget if i said that in the video, but the main issue havoc will have is its barrier to entry with party finder, and not really being interesting enough to want to put in that extra effort
Don’t romanticize the past. Blood Tornadoes were Pox Gas-level butthole cancer. “How would you like the same level, but 30% longer? SUCH CHALLENGE!”
3:13 Wait holy shit pushing a boss off with chorus is genius
Couple of havoc 40 as an ogryn and you learn how things work. It’s not hard just tedious and needlessly hard for annoying sake. Problem now is going back to auric maelstrom and realizing how soft mode it is. I don’t know if I learned anything but it’s a night and day experience back in auric.
Healthgating was a design feature to combat a design issue. To be honest, I find it weird to turn it into a modifier that creates the issue again. Because it's not like it affects balance. It affects design.
True
Havoc is a part of the game that I’m perfectly fine never engaging with. I’ll just fuck around with stuff I think is fun in regular Aurics, thank you very much.
I thought the same. Then I played it havoc is pretty fun. from like 22-30 is the sweat spot I enjoy playing. It still requires teamwork and a challenge for normal players. Without it being absolutely insane hard.
The real challenge is getting 40 with pub players
That’s the real rng gate
challenge either you get completely legendary players who don’t know what going down is or people who struggle in regular damnation and somehow ended up in +30 havoc and before you say only have completed 30+ havocs in your lobby. No I’ve had them consistently fail within the first 2 minutes of the mission.
This is my experience, I'm running book and flamer, people are still running around my themselves, not sticking together, but pulling back to choke points, etc. To be sure I'm not the good and cannot carry. So basically the hard part is getting good players with good builds. Mm already seemed dead, at least last night. If I could get the cosmetics and tags I would be done with the mode.
I hit 33 and have little motivation to grind more, i wanna skip to 40 and just get it done. The mode is draining in the worst ways, the difficulty is one thing but the janky ass useless systems around actually STARTING a game, on top of people just jumping into game with shit builds, which I cannot check beforehand without mods, and I then cannot KICK them from MY STRIKE TEAM THAT I STARTED, on top of there being like 4 playstyles that actually work well enough to let me carry these sandbags that join me- im tired boss. This mode genuinely sucks as an overall experience. It is intense and hype and fun to get a good team and pull off these locked in coordinated pushes, its absolutely cathartic seeing teammates routinely saving each other and backing each other up in bad situations- issue is, unless I have the time and availability to get a premade, 90% of games dont go this way. John Darktide Lv31 joins me as an Executioners Vet and doesn't speak and oh wow, we died, crazy.
Remove the weekly ranks completely, and LET ME KICK PEOPLE WHO EXPECT A CARRY OR REFUSE TO COLLABORATE WITH THE OTHER 3 WHO ACTUALLY WANT TO WIN.
tldr Havoc trash in current state. There are 2 ways to have fun with it and I rarely get to do either. I think the mode would be exponentially more fun if the modifiers weren't stupid "higher number as difficulty" shit. All the conditions just make trash mobs annoying, there is NOTHING that remixes core DT gameplay, nothing interesting like "all specials are [x]" or anything resembling what Maelstroms do. Its literally number go up. It gets old.
honestly can't notice a difference in difficulty between havoc 30 and 40. As i vet main, pus hardened skin modifier making ranged weapons practically worthless outside of ones that apply DOT is annoying
I just don’t understand how they(obese fish) watched everyone praise how they did difficulty, while condemning space marines simple number changing. Then they decided “let’s do the thing everyone hated!”
Not to mention it seems they didn’t actually know what they wanted to do with this mode like you said. Havoc starts in MALICE difficulty. Frankly, when they dropped the dev blog and said the requirement was just completing any maelstrom I realized they didn’t have a clear vision.
Similar to chaos wastes, but the twitch mode for Vermintide was a great example of “fun” difficulty.
ATM I would’ve just preferred if they added “super auric” where the tension mechanic was removed. At least that way I could quickplay and have similar difficulty, but infinitely more fun
Also IK the easiest option is to simply add more ranks, but I’d like them to revisit the first 30 and try to scale them better too.
For all the people who think this can be done only in friends group etc, i want to tell u its very posible to do in pub games with randoms and with no coms ,im not part of top 0.1% skilled players but i managed to do it with randoms by hosting from lvl16 to lvl 40,and from lvl30 to 40 with no loses at all,and after that i hosted and completed true survivor title aswell with randoms with minimal coms like ,fall back when 2 boses + horde spawns .so dont lose hope u can do it 👍
Key is to beg the good randoms to stick around, they're a hot commodity
@@spencerclark6113 well i did not have to beg nobody :) they where happy to be invited and complete lvl40 and true survivor.
I dont really hink that Fatshark should mainly focus on 0.5% of the Player base if it comes to new content.
They could just steal a whole bunch from chaos wastes. More fun negative modifiers and they could even make skins you get for hitting 40 every week as a reward
The constant horde idea of 40 is the only reason it was harder than the others, it just feels like a slightly cranked up auric overall with worse modifiers. It needs the differentiation that auric had compared to normal gameplay.
Also who was that vet in the gameplay, he seemed real good 😏
You are really good, it was always you and i left alive when shit went bad
Thing is Fatshark advertised that when Havok was a thing, they outright said you don’t need to beat the hardest Havok to get the rewards most care about. The Cosmetics, you get the pants at Havok 25 completion, Beat 50 Total Havoks for the chest and finally help people’s Havoks 50 times for the helmet. Those are the special draws, cooler reskin cosmetics that don’t need a couple thousand penance point for. Only the truly hard core will go for the Titles and 20 Havok Reward Chest Penance.
Your first comments threw me on a ride. I was thinking. . . this is not my experience with havoc 40. And I don't consider myself an "elite" gamer.
I will say, if they nerf gold toughness. Havoc will be significantly harder. Maybe not in a fun way.
“Havoc word be harder maybe not in a fun way” and this is the exact problem with the game mode. It’s not even that much harder than an auric maelstrom. Except things like emperors fading light absolutely neuter any sense of fun
haha gotcha
My goal is to reach H40 for cosmetics and be done with the game until new big update
Two bubbles a chorus and a shout. Just stay as a 4, go slow and backtrack to favourable ground whenever a horde/boss spawns.
It’s really a shame that a specific team comp almost completely negates the difficulty. But if you don’t take that team it’s 100% sweat and may even be impossible with certain builds. I’d honestly be in favor of nerfing the difficulty a tad if it meant a team that isn’t bubble, chorus, and shout wasn’t an agonizing slog
also ADD MATCHMAKING TO HAVOC. The party finder is already dying
The mode is hard, but it's really really boring in the long run. I expected much crazy fun modifiers, like twitch mode in Vermintide, Tzeentchian Twins and more. And they have to do something with the abilities, cause right now players are more carried by the spammy and busted abilites rather than their skill, and that drains my fun quite fast.
11:19 tysm, I was looking for this mod forever but never used the correct buzzwords to find it 👏
Had a lot of fun testing weapons in the mode. Tac axe with agripinaa has been very solid when faced with forced chorus & purity picks
Went havoc 20 -> 21 -> 31 -> 36 -> 40 by joining random lobbies in a week.
Had a lot of fun "completing" havoc as a shredder spam & 100% crit rate combat blade / revolver veteran !
At first I was confused about my ammo pick ups, but later on learned about the hidden modifiers
the shooters is the only thing that kills me :(
I cleared 40 with a random party. What made it feel like an accomplishment was the fact that we were a random group of players. I agree though, it was hard but not too bad. Level 40-50 is a good idea as well, as is allowing people to earn aquillas. I would really like to see some more meta shifting weapons added and improvements to ogryn and less used skills. I beat it with DS/plasma vet. Been playing since game release.
I've completed havoc 36 couple days ago and what I can say is you gotta have the right team and communication. The rest was actually not to bad, definitely could have done havoc 40
I'd like to see monstrous specialists in havoc.
Can someone tell me what mod at 4:50 says "Saved by PsyberPunk"?
I wonder how you would react if they'd nerf knifes and dueling swords, along with bolters and plasma guns, but along the way "fixed" broken toughness bracing momentum (rather brought it back) and evened-out Veteran and Zealot abilities with their other (remove golden toughness). Could that be solution to that "I want level 50 Havoc difficulty level"?
They could also add seasonal enemy designs for elites/specials - just for Havoc.
"Oh sure, that Pox Burster looking like a Pinhata makes sense."
Sadly I think the game mode might end up dying.
It will if no maintenance. You get lvl 40, you get those rewards and its no longer worth playing. The sad thing is that finding a 30+ group is really hard and at this point, I will just solo queue Maelstrom. There's not enough modifiers to be diverse.
The tox gas modifier is trash, I agree. Feels super unfair. We need to be able to earn currency for the store. It feels lame that we have a new game mode and 1 set and that’s it. Especially when the store has all this cool stuff.
Havoc mutator idea: Patrolling daemonhosts, like that one mission from left 4 dead 2
I think before they do any changes to gameplay modifiers they need to fix/beef up their servers! They are pretty ass atm.🤢
Thats why handicapping the player is often more difficult and fun, than introducing more buffs to the enemies, especially if those buffs are more health, more damage, more enemy... because you know, where do you even take this further? Like how do you realistically make it actually harder? Mutators are actually much more fun i think, they honestly hit the spot for me and the lower ranks of 20-30s.
Player debuffs would be essentially handicaps like, less toughness on dodge, a limit on powerslides, constant ticking corruption, cant block multiple attacks, ETC. And a really fun way to make it is to give small buffs next to it that are almost worthless, but so its essentially a really bad tradeoff.
making a havoc 50 would be a waste of time with the current dismal state of balance in this game, all increasing the difficulty further would do is force even the best players into the incredibly rigid meta of shout plasma vet, bubble purg psyker, charge flamer zealot and chorus beacon zealot
what they need to do is nerf/remove CDR, remove gold toughness, massively nerf mobility, and redesign the difficulty of the game around this new balance. doing this would do more for the game than doubling the amount of havoc levels, weapons and maps
Havoc is Meh, I was glad when I got to 40 so I didn't have a reason to play it anymore. The gunners are the same buff they gave guns some months ago for like a patch, so it didn't bother me. The only thing I really noticed in Havoc was being annoyed by the artificial difficulty like the toughness reduction, increased break points, and the bile melee zoning mechanic but all those mechanics did was succeed in making me bored with it.
Does two of the same aura’s stack?
No, so youll want diversity for maximum benefit in havoc
*Fatshark
Replaces every enemy with elites
*Darktide
Out of memory...
😂
Yep, it was created with at least effort as possible.
also thought havoc is going to be NUTS because I had poxgas + pox bombers at 24 or so. Havoc 30 is unironically easier than this combinations with randos
Got that tox nightmare modifier at havoc 25.
Your teammates, and whether or not you give a damn about them, determine the difficulty of the match every single time.
worst thing is to find a team to learn with, especially if all your friends not playing DT as much as you and i think most of the people wont be able to pass game mode because they struggle to find consistant party, even if you find compitent teammate they usually leave after 1or 2 games :\
My highest havoc so far was 26 and it was a lucky run with 2 level 1500+ psykers i definitely belong to the 99% of people that will never complete 40
Besides the fact that i hate the matchmaking mechanic it requires and the no resources for doing other people’s missions im just gonna grind below level 20 havocs to get the cosmetics and then return to normal auric missions havoc is just not worth it
Dude every time I get a pox gas map. the difficulty goes up exponentially. I think I beat pox gas once and it was a lvl 17 havoc. Otherwise, I just abandon it now at this point. I think pox gas is fun if you have a good leader and team. Requires alot of comms. But damn it's just next lvl hard.
i feel like 20s are very rough in pugs rn, all the good players already pushed forward in first week and ur left with first timers mostly
Did you get hats on 25 lvl in the box?
No hats lol
Honestly, instead of taking ideas from chaos wastes and applying them to havoc
time spent developing should have went into darktide equivalent of chaos wastes and darktide equivalent of Cataclysm difficulty
or you know, just more missions lol
Nobody really gives a shit buba.
This is not fun gameplay. Or built for the casual gamer.
I want to be able too play this offline. With more adventure or story. And free mod use.
This meta crap, elitist bullshit is so bad it smells.
Really disappointed with the rewards. I feel no motivation to grind it for reskinned cosmetics and packs of resources we can get everywhere else.
Glad I got all the hardest stuff done with havoc a week ago, playing this on console with the crashes has broken my soul but don't worry next year they "might" fix it I doubt seeing its been happening for 7 months.
Mr E, the dual sword master. 👏