It's certainly hard to beat OEM Motorcraft air filters. The seal is excellent. Has pre-filter for larger particles. Thick filter media etc. WIX is also very good no doubt. Always change mine @12k mis /1yr . This has served me well in my Ford trucks & SUVs w/ Gen2 GTDI engines. -Ohio
Was running a WIX for years on my "03 F150, recently switched to the Motorcraft....woke that 2v 5.4 up right away. HUGE IMPROVEMENT...only mod is the PVC Gott fender intake. Still gets fresh air from fender, just got rid of stock snorkel
Thanks for your time & effort to help others make a decision. For me it's not about a little more power but catching as much dirt & dust as possible so I'm sticking with wix as of now.
EXACTLY 💯. It's well proven that OEM Motorcraft makes excellent air & oil filters. Most important of all is proper change intervals! That's where many ppl go wrong i think. WIX or Motorcraft air filters is all i ever use in my newer Ford trucks & SUVs w/ Gen2 GTDI engines. -Ohio
@Davido50 yes I agree with you on that. I try to get Wix but if not Wix then most definitely Motor craft, I'm actually running Motor Craft at the moment.
Good test. I did a similar test on a vehicle using a vacuum gauge. With all of the factory intake parts installed and a clean factory filter, it would pull 3-4" of vacuum at high rpm, full throttle accelerations. Disconnecting the airbox entirely resulted in a vacuum reading of about 2-3". After running multiple combinations of components, it turns out that the inlet snorkel was the restriction, similar to this test. Opening up the snorkel and keeping all of the other components stock held the vacuum at 2-3". Can't say that I can feel any power improvements, but the data doesn't lie. Bigger isn't better if the engine doesn't need it. Low restriction and maximum velocity at the maximum engine requirement is ideal.
Can defiantly hear the fact that the restrictor is meant to reduce noise. It's noticeable. Had an '01 P71 that absolutely ripped. It had a horn (similar to that restrictor) on the clean side in the airbox meant to increase the velocity of airflow across the MAF and reduce intake noise. More effective than the cold air horn on later models, IMO. Also serves as a power restrictor, as this was a very popular fleet vehicle platform between the P71 and rental fleets at the time.
What it comes down to is the engine's airflow demands. As long as the demand is under the curve of available airflow, it's a big/well-flowing enough airbox. This is part of the reason most aftermarket so-called cold air intakes dont work. All that said, we all yanked the air silencer out of our fox bodies back in the day ;)
you can actually test the filter on the car if you install a pressure sensor or MAP and data log it. switch filters and see which gives you higher pressure, under identical conditions, say full load, 80-90% rpm (max power). anyway you need a good filter to retain particles that can wear the engine faster.
It’s interesting to see the differences in air flow. I’m not sure it correlates to power gains or losses, unless it keep the engine from getting the air it needs. Maybe a good test would be measuring vacuum, or lack of, in the intake ducting between the throttle body and air filter. If there is a measurable restriction the vacuum numbers it created would vary.
Definitely sticking with K&N. Some will say it filters less, but HOW MUCH filtering do we really need? We can't act like because it filters less, that it will not be enough filtering. I think K&N is the better option. It let's your engine breathe better while still being useful. Some people act like oh man, that K&N isn't filtering anything. WRONG.
Actually most of the sentiment doesn't actually come from that mindset that you're talkin about right now When it comes from his people prepping the filters improperly and s*** talk on the internet when most of it's not even true oh, is it a good filter sure it is does it filter as good as a factory one... no it doesn't Does it work for performance obviously it does it does flow someone better it's all a personal preference thing
I live in the desert and go off-road. We have seen dirt in the intake using K&N. If we need more flow we adapt a higher flow Donaldson 2 stage (think heavy equipment) I have the housing and filter from an Isuzu truck on my Jeep and Donaldson on my Can Am SxS. No K&N.
@@FordBossMe remember that K&N filters also need to be oiled up before installation so essentially it will filter equal to or even better than other filters due to the oil
Great stuff here as usual. One way to improve this test would be to grab an electrical connector for the MAF meter and use it to apply the correct voltage to the heater and use it to measure your flow. No need to convert it, just use the raw change in resistance or make a small circuit to give an output voltage proportionate to flow just like the ECM. This way the only flow resistance would be the actual MAF meter that is used in this application.
I would agree if I had the time to sit and do this as my only job but seeing as I do have a full-time job and I'm doing RUclips full time I don't have time to get them to the Nitty Nitty Nitty Gritty of stuff
@@FordBossMe No worries and this wasn't a complaint! I appreciate the great work you're doing here. I had been feeling guilty about throwing a Fram air filter in my Lightning but not anymore.
OEM are usually pretty decent, Wix is also good, I might actually give the edge to Purolator (from other videos I've watched). I absolutely would NOT run K&N other than maybe temporary for a drag race, or dyno run or something if the air was really clean. - They have been shown by more than a few people to not filter well.
Something here that people may be overlooking. I have run factory, wix, Fram and k&n in my cars over the years. Never had a performance drop with factory or the Fram and with. However I have with k&n. The problem seems to be the oil in the k&n collecting on the market sensor. It does require maintenance to keep the sensor. The effect is progressive over time and somewhat infrequent but it is there. I just run factory until it needs to be changed then I go with wix. I know I will get flamed for this comment but that's ok. I am just being honest about my experiences.
Yeah I've heard it a thousand times with the oil thing and I just find honestly people don't put the oil in the filter correctly 99.9% of the time and if you actually read what the manufacturer says it's a moisture absorbing mat so just a little tiny tiny bit ends up spreading across a large surface but people get to spraying away
@@FordBossMe yep the bigger the glob the better the job as a wise man once said but that wise man had also said just a dab will do. Sometimes less is more to go fast you must first slow down.
Wow this is pretty neat. I've personally never seen a test done like this, so it's some cool little insight as to how the various anatomy of an air intake can take affect.
Shows you cannot go wrong w/OEM Motorcraft or WIX air filters! *Not worth slight increase in air flow w/K&N vs filtering losses you get* . I'm sticking w/Motorcraft myself. -NY
You may be a mechanic but, the scientist and engineer is coming out. Wish the industry when training mechanics would show this side of things. I have known many who knew motors, trannys, etc... but, know next to nothing about motor oil, fluids, and filters. I think this would be a great training aid in auto tech.
Yes on a standard car it does not pay to change the air filter, if u have a wrx for example with larger turbo or big power and the stock boost pressure is 14psi and then your running 30psi the stock filter vs k&n filter will show massive difference in power
I read a while ago that the biggest issue with reusable oiled filters is that people always over oil the filters, and the excess oil ends up on the mass air flow sensor, messing it up. I could be wrong.
I don't mind a little restriction if it will keep dirt out of the engine. Dirt is my number one. I'm just driving to work most of the time. THANKS COOL!
If you're racing then use the K&N for increased airflow. If you're just driving and care more about engine longevity use one with better filtration. Simple choice depending on your agenda.
very interesting.im NOT being critical here whatsoever.but theoretically speaking, i believe the differences in flow rates between them would probably be more visible near the upper limits of there flow capacities.but for normal everyday driving 200 cfm is plenty of flow for your testing purposes.nice job bud.you been workin your ass off lately,just dont burn yourself out.
200 cubic feet per minute is about 2000 RPM and for the normal person they're never going to see those numbers honestly on normal driving so that's what my focus is not the upper limits its normal driving I have been it'd exhausting
Are you testing the "silencer" box, Ford put on it's engines years ago for less noise, or the little tube extension that reaches the cooler air at the fender opening?
for high volume you can do a setup using a vacuum cleaner and a fine pressure sensor then read the pressure drop. Even an analog pressure gauge should work, but you need to be careful what scale and to read “negative” (lower than atmospheric) pressure your setup looks interesting though maybe better:)
oiled KN also dirties up the maf sensor. You have to clean it. Someone did this experiment with the maf sensor and a set RPM on a forum many years ago.
I have had a MAF code thrown at least twice in ~150,000 miles with a K&N in my '03 Sierra. Yes cleaning the oil off the wires cleared it, and ran better. No, it was not over oiled
@@182QKFTW even very slight oil will cause the code. I remember reading something (this was late 90s) some shop replaced a guys engine over codes and how bad the car ran from the dirty MAF. Codes don't always point to the MAF, you can get P0171/0174. I think they replaced his O2 sensors, problem was still there. There wasn't common knowledge then like now. He sued KN but somehow they were not found liable.
I've never had a problem with K&N and Maf sensors and I'm just going to be blatantly honest and tell you I think people don't treat the filters properly and that's the problem
In 10 years, I've probably saved over $300 using reusable K&N air filters on both my cars - and it works great. And haven't heard or read any engine damage caused by K&N supposed fine particle thing. Engines are perfectly capable of ingesting micron size dust particles without any problems.
Exactly! As long as they keep out hard, solid, large objects you are fine. Rocks, pebbles, wood, road salt, beach sand. Microscopic sawdust type stuff isn't going to scratch metal piston walls
Okay so I basically specified that and this is what people Miss whenever I put out videos I specified the restrictor was there to reduce noise and it actually goes through the light so in essence sure it would get somewhat cooler here but there's a huge restriction there so how much are you actually going to offset any increase it's not worth it to me
I also specified that it would be beneficial to go to the p71 box or actually take your Inlet and modify one to fit that so it goes back where the factory one was
@@FordBossMe First, i find your videos very informative and interesting. There`s no intention from my side to step on anybody`s toes. Maybe i even formulated my comment wrong. In these modern times, mentioning I am a Norwegian to get any excuse for lacking the English language skills may be out of reach. Anyways… I am often quite curious of the engineering aspect of machines and might question things and get answered by skilled peoples, like yourself. Scenario: The demand of air is 9m^3/min and filtration capacity is 12m^3/min (after some contamination between services) and reduce the capacity to 10m^3/min adding the “snorkel” tube to access more dense and cooler air. Has the designer increased or decreased the engine performance by doing this? Looking forward to more uploads from your channel. Kind regards. Alex
Given the same filter media and same construction other than pleat count, the more pleats (surface area) the LESS restrictive so long as the pleats are not so crowded together that their surfaces touch each other. The greater the surface area, the more "pores" available to pass the air.
Just keep in mind that without the snorkel on your air box chances are you will be sucking in hotter air from under the hood behind the radiator which is less dense with oxygen which isn’t ideal for burning. The snorkel usually extended ahead of the radiation or into the fender where it can drawn in cooler, denser air which will burn better. Kinda like how turbocharged cars have an intercooler to cool the incoming air from the turbo before it goes into the engine.
Do you think that the round or canister type Ford filters have a major difference between them and the flat ones? Also this has in spired me to improve my intake. No ima not gonna put the “cold air pipe” in my van , I do want better performance for like zero dollars !
@@FordBossMe my manifold is made from fiber reinforced nylon composite . 😐 however the Sasquatch turd that Ford designed in the 80’s is still being used for the E cabs. In some places it shrinks down to 1-5/8 and gets as big as 4-1/4 . Not ever staying consistent in path size or even direction ! All new intake is being planned so …… 🤔🧐
Yeah everybody comes here all the time and talks about project Farm I get that I even have a video explaining why I don't go to other RUclips creators channels and watch their videos and take their ideas I 100% get that somebody else may have done some kind of test somewhere but they haven't done it like me I'm my own own unique person and I really don't honestly care what somebody else has done I give them all the respect in the world but this is how I do things I'm sorry but to be honest with you I don't really care what project Farm did he's a great guy but I don't go over there watch his stuff, as a master technician in the field working for a dealership I think I'm capable of doing this just fine
@@FordBossMe I'm VERY SURPRISED by your answer, you can learn something from anybody. I'm sure YOU CAN DO " JUST FINE " but EVERYBODY IS A UNIQUE PERSON & I learned a long time ago, IT DOESN'T HURT TO LISTEN, YA MIGHT JUST LEARN SOMETHING, SIR. HELL I LEARNED NOT TO DRINK OUT OF THE TOILET FROM MY DOG GETTING SICK, LOL.
@@NoWr2Run I don't go to other people's channels Don't be surprised by my answers just accept my answers and if you don't like them then you know what to do
Those snake oil reusable performance filters (K&N style) let dust particles through. Do you really want to use an air filter in dusty conditions that you can light through?
I tested it but it was just too nasty it was in such a beat-up box I didn't really feel like it was a fair chance looks like it's been sitting on a shelf for 20 years
one thing to remember is that slight jump at only 23 cfm in is like 1/10th of what that engine pulls at WOT so the differential gains of almost 1cfm could be like another 10cfm or more.
Dyno tests on performance engines show the K&N to allow the most HP. I use it in my classic performance car.. but use a wix in my daily driver.. just decide what you want.. its never a hard problem.
I have a mobile Blackstone lab analysis running the k&n air filter at the same time and the amount of particle they let in silica wise was more than double what the max would be
I'm at my 2nd oil change at 6k miles on my 2022 f15 5.0 (full synthetic)... I was thinking of also changing my air filter at 6k miles. I live in Los Angeles CA. What do you think Boss man? Should I also change my air filter at 6k?
I have seen the lab tests for the K&N and they are a lot less restrictive than OEM filters, but this is a clear example of the real measurements for an especific application. Too late watched your video after I burned 50 bucks on mine... how about a custom exhaust? Performance wise what would be the benefits of having a custom exhaust and a the least restrictive filter? I know is nowhere near to what the manufacturers claim but dies it benefit anything? I have a '12 Fusion with a K&N filter and a Magnaflow custom exhaust and seems to me my fuel efficiency went down like 1 mpg.
Honestly there is no real benefit to a custom exhaust unless you're doing it from like the catalytic converters back really manifolds and all should have to be done
@@FordBossMe I hope manufacturers were more honest about the real results on their products, I do it for the sound and the filter for the economy of washing and re-using the filter. But good to know what you mentioned! Thanks!
I would pull the restrictor out and then put a little piece in the end of the air box like custom make something for yourself to go through the front of the vehicle so It can suck fresh air cold air You do get this naturally better without the restrictor in it but I cannot tell you that you know it equals with out the restrictor the p71 airbox I mean this is the best I can do
for a gas engine a KAN (may) be slightly beater,, but for a diesel i run a WIX ,, i learned my lesson from some one else how ran a KAN on there 7.3 diesel. the fine dust tore the leading edge off of the fins on the turbo.
I get that everybody's got a story about why they would do this or why they would do that I'm just showing people exactly what's going on in this static state with slightly Dynamic testing
I would imagine the air pump is roughly engine idle speed and an increase in airflow/engine RPM, you would see a more exponential difference in airflow in between these filters.
The theme always seems to be if you are going to the track use the KN. If you are in a store buying a filter for every day use and have a limited choice of brands and versions, you didn't look up comparisons before you went to the store, you can be sure you will get a quality product from Motorcraft, Purolator, Wix no matter what you grab even if you can't remember the differences. If you look at the Fram line you wind up getting caught in their word salad naming of Xtra Guard, Super Duty Really Tough Guard, Long Lasting guard, So So Guard or however they label them. You run the risk of picking up one of their lesser filters due to the confusion they created. A couple of bucks more is nothing over the vehicle life to avoid engine overhauls.
I clearly know what your saying about the cold air you are preaching to the choir BUT If I can increase mass vs restricted volume I've increased power even if it's more dense
At the shop I used to work in we would recommend if you must run a k&n then at least service your filter every time you change your oil. This was for motorcycles at 3k mile intervals. They would work decent if you kept on top of cleaning them but for the people that went longer you could see the slight dust build up on the inside. It wasn't very much but still I want the amount of dust going into my engine as close to 0 as possible.
Good video rich, I agree that k&n isn’t worth the money for the incredibly futile increase in flow and loss of filtration. Motorcraft isn’t the best because it’s only designed to filter according to Fords standards whatever they may be. I only use WIX filters for oil, fuel, air and cabin air because honestly I believe them to be the best filtration by giving up extremely minimal flow. Insert keyboard commando arguments here!!!!!! Other brands like STP, parts store brands puralator, AC Delco, FRAM etc are a win some loose some argument. WIX seems to usually if not most of the time be the best flow for the extra filtration making WIX the best bang for the buck regardless if the filtration is air, fuel or oil WIX just seems to win a cross the board. The compromise is flow vs filtration, WIX has the best filtration with better than OEM flow.
The K&N being a completely different filter media, I don't know that it is a valid assessment to state that it filters less because of fewer pleats. It's a cotton and oil based filter versus a paper filter.
@@FordBossMe awesome! Thanks! Ive just always used it because they always have it at walmart or amazon for $12-$15. I only average about 9k-10k miles a year so i just replace it every july and figure im good to go. Got a new one sitting in my garage right now. Gonna change it out tomorrow when i do an oil change.
It simply doest work like that . There's an intake resonance that you cannot recreate this way. It works a bit like a subwoofer. If you remove the bellmouth for a bigger hole it won't be nearly as loud. Counter intuitive, I know.
I'm going to keep doing it the way I'm doing it but that it has been shown to be true from start to finish on anything that I've shown people so far so I'll keep doing me you keep doing you
Ford's been doing snorkel intake restrictions for a while. On the '90's EFI 351's & 460's in the F series pickup trucks that had the dual inlet throttle body, the had a similar "snorkel" necked down restriction to reduce inlet air noise. I guess the "suit types" don't appreciate "intake air noise" under throttle like the rest of us do. Also, the civilian panthers are supposed to have an insert in the zip tube to reduce inlet air noise that maybe you could confirm? I had a '67 Caddy Hearse when I was younger. '67 was the first year GM used the Quadrajet on the Caddy 429. I put a tall open element 14" air cleaner on it. One day I was running late for work and really got into on the freeway. I didn't know it, but I passed up a guy I worked with on his Harley. He told me later, you have no idea what that sounds like coming up from behind :)
Who wouldn't like that throaty sound on wide open throttle?! That's crazy! Like, IT was the entire reason we used to flip the air cleaner lid upside down, right?! So you could hear the 4 barrels open up!
The K&N's do actually filter better as they trap a bit of dirt in the cotton weave. Also, if you filter down to a certain point, the dirt is so tiny that it is no longer a meaningful wear product. It winds up getting held in suspension in the oil if it gets past the rings. Frequent oil changes eliminate that soon enough. I use a K&N and just clean and service it every Fall as I only drive about 7k miles a year. OIl & filter 2x a year. Good to know the factory part does do such a good job!
I had higher silica count way outside of the normal range with a K&N I'm not going to use it anymore you can pick that up on your oil analysis it will show silica in excessive amount in your oil and that's not good it creates excessive engine wear
Yeah I'm working on all that I've already thought of that I've already spoke of that before I've got it I'm going to do all that people just hang tight it'll come up I promise
If you've ever torn down engines that live off pavement and run through air filters.... the the piston rings are what will tell the story. they can become beveled and it can really destroy the piston seal.
@@JT-qf4it Stop with your crap. The military doesn't trust multi billion dollar equipment to cheap marketing. You're just upset because you messed up something and can't follow simple instructions on how to clean the filter.
@@JT-qf4it Nice to be called stupid by someone that doesn't understand the fact that aircraft, particularly the aircraft of WW2, were in some of the dustiest and dirtiest environments to ever exist. Including in the air. Apparently gun powder and shrapnel are clean and safe for piston powered aircraft. And forgive me, I forgot Afghanistan and Iraq are super clean, no dust or dirt to clog those Blackhawk engines either. Man, why do they even bother with a filter??? Such clean operating conditions. Check yourself buddy. You've done nothing but make yourself look ignorant and give people every reason to want to use these filters. They're great for military equipment in far worse conditions than your little car will ever see. Guess we best not use military grade filtration. It's a marketing scam for a lesser quality filter.
As the unfiltered air flows upward into the filter, large particles can fall back down to the bottom of the airbox. Not so with the K&N, the oil will hold those particles becoming more restrictive than the factory filter
K&N is fine for performance but terrible at filtering. Holes are holes people. And the K&N i pulled out of my Cummins was loaded with holes. It never went back in.
You can have higher air flow and less filtration or more filtration and less air flow. You can’t have both. There’s a fine medium but you won’t notice a difference in power. Air filtration is not the place to skimp on to gain negligible power.
@@rainmakr9 I agree with you but I can tell you no air filter will give you enough power increase to feel it behind the wheel. I’ve seen this done as a bet more than once at the track and it never works out for the ones that say they can tell.
We would have to find another way of monitoring it wish I could probably drop dirt on the filter somehow suck it into the box and then see what passes through
@@FordBossMe I would try replacing the MAF sensor to a particle monitor. The dirt can be place in a pipe which connect to the air box. The siphon effect should do the job. Sand maybe too heavy, but I don't think there's any filter will allow sand to pass.
@@FordBossMe if you drop the dirt directly on the filter, basically the gravity is helping to pull the dirt into the filter. It's very different to actual operating condition.
You would get more airflow it would be a little bit more responsive on the throttle but I would suggest trying to come up with some kind of homemade adapter that you can put on there or do what I did and find a p71 lower box and modify it
@@jamesself2409 I've only had one F-150 so far with an issue from 2021 and it was because the oil life dropped less than 20% and it lost more than one quart of oil which disables the PCM and then the dealer has to unlock everything and reset the system
I bought the k&n air filter cause it's rewash able tired of spending 20$ on the higher end not reuseable air filter after 2 filters u spend just as much or not more then a k&n
I think I will stick with my factory Ford filters. Thank you for all you go through to put this info out there for us.
Yes, myself included. You just cannot go wrong w/build quality & engineering of OEM Motorcraft air & oil filters.. overall. -NY #F150Tremor #EdgeSEL
It's certainly hard to beat OEM Motorcraft air filters. The seal is excellent. Has pre-filter for larger particles. Thick filter media etc. WIX is also very good no doubt. Always change mine @12k mis /1yr . This has served me well in my Ford trucks & SUVs w/ Gen2 GTDI engines. -Ohio
Was running a WIX for years on my "03 F150, recently switched to the Motorcraft....woke that 2v 5.4 up right away. HUGE IMPROVEMENT...only mod is the PVC Gott fender intake. Still gets fresh air from fender, just got rid of stock snorkel
Thanks for your time & effort to help others make a decision. For me it's not about a little more power but catching as much dirt & dust as possible so I'm sticking with wix as of now.
EXACTLY 💯. It's well proven that OEM Motorcraft makes excellent air & oil filters. Most important of all is proper change intervals! That's where many ppl go wrong i think. WIX or Motorcraft air filters is all i ever use in my newer Ford trucks & SUVs w/ Gen2 GTDI engines. -Ohio
@Davido50 yes I agree with you on that. I try to get Wix but if not Wix then most definitely Motor craft, I'm actually running Motor Craft at the moment.
Good test. I did a similar test on a vehicle using a vacuum gauge. With all of the factory intake parts installed and a clean factory filter, it would pull 3-4" of vacuum at high rpm, full throttle accelerations. Disconnecting the airbox entirely resulted in a vacuum reading of about 2-3". After running multiple combinations of components, it turns out that the inlet snorkel was the restriction, similar to this test. Opening up the snorkel and keeping all of the other components stock held the vacuum at 2-3". Can't say that I can feel any power improvements, but the data doesn't lie. Bigger isn't better if the engine doesn't need it. Low restriction and maximum velocity at the maximum engine requirement is ideal.
Can defiantly hear the fact that the restrictor is meant to reduce noise. It's noticeable. Had an '01 P71 that absolutely ripped. It had a horn (similar to that restrictor) on the clean side in the airbox meant to increase the velocity of airflow across the MAF and reduce intake noise. More effective than the cold air horn on later models, IMO. Also serves as a power restrictor, as this was a very popular fleet vehicle platform between the P71 and rental fleets at the time.
What it comes down to is the engine's airflow demands. As long as the demand is under the curve of available airflow, it's a big/well-flowing enough airbox. This is part of the reason most aftermarket so-called cold air intakes dont work. All that said, we all yanked the air silencer out of our fox bodies back in the day ;)
The screen too if you know now you know.
you can actually test the filter on the car if you install a pressure sensor or MAP and data log it. switch filters and see which gives you higher pressure, under identical conditions, say full load, 80-90% rpm (max power). anyway you need a good filter to retain particles that can wear the engine faster.
It’s interesting to see the differences in air flow. I’m not sure it correlates to power gains or losses, unless it keep the engine from getting the air it needs.
Maybe a good test would be measuring vacuum, or lack of, in the intake ducting between the throttle body and air filter. If there is a measurable restriction the vacuum numbers it created would vary.
Definitely sticking with K&N. Some will say it filters less, but HOW MUCH filtering do we really need? We can't act like because it filters less, that it will not be enough filtering. I think K&N is the better option. It let's your engine breathe better while still being useful. Some people act like oh man, that K&N isn't filtering anything. WRONG.
Actually most of the sentiment doesn't actually come from that mindset that you're talkin about right now
When it comes from his people prepping the filters improperly and s*** talk on the internet when most of it's not even true oh, is it a good filter sure it is does it filter as good as a factory one... no it doesn't
Does it work for performance obviously it does it does flow someone better it's all a personal preference thing
I live in the desert and go off-road. We have seen dirt in the intake using K&N.
If we need more flow we adapt a higher flow Donaldson 2 stage (think heavy equipment)
I have the housing and filter from an Isuzu truck on my Jeep and Donaldson on my Can Am SxS. No K&N.
@@FordBossMe remember that K&N filters also need to be oiled up before installation so essentially it will filter equal to or even better than other filters due to the oil
In my experience, I used a drop in k&n and I had nothing but trouble with MAS sensor thanks to the oil and dirt on regular roads.
Great stuff here as usual. One way to improve this test would be to grab an electrical connector for the MAF meter and use it to apply the correct voltage to the heater and use it to measure your flow. No need to convert it, just use the raw change in resistance or make a small circuit to give an output voltage proportionate to flow just like the ECM. This way the only flow resistance would be the actual MAF meter that is used in this application.
I would agree if I had the time to sit and do this as my only job but seeing as I do have a full-time job and I'm doing RUclips full time I don't have time to get them to the Nitty Nitty Nitty Gritty of stuff
@@FordBossMe No worries and this wasn't a complaint! I appreciate the great work you're doing here. I had been feeling guilty about throwing a Fram air filter in my Lightning but not anymore.
@@randyduncan795 they are perfectly fine
K&N has been my only filter to use on all my vehicles since 1977...
Its bad, they dont keep things like at size of insects... its dangerous.
Looks like the Ford filter did pretty good , hard to beat for the price !
OEM are usually pretty decent, Wix is also good, I might actually give the edge to Purolator (from other videos I've watched). I absolutely would NOT run K&N other than maybe temporary for a drag race, or dyno run or something if the air was really clean. - They have been shown by more than a few people to not filter well.
Something here that people may be overlooking. I have run factory, wix, Fram and k&n in my cars over the years. Never had a performance drop with factory or the Fram and with. However I have with k&n. The problem seems to be the oil in the k&n collecting on the market sensor. It does require maintenance to keep the sensor. The effect is progressive over time and somewhat infrequent but it is there. I just run factory until it needs to be changed then I go with wix. I know I will get flamed for this comment but that's ok. I am just being honest about my experiences.
Some will blame over oiling when cleaning a k&n. But I have personally seen a maf get fouled by a factory oiled k&n. It happens
Yeah I've heard it a thousand times with the oil thing and I just find honestly people don't put the oil in the filter correctly 99.9% of the time and if you actually read what the manufacturer says it's a moisture absorbing mat so just a little tiny tiny bit ends up spreading across a large surface but people get to spraying away
@@FordBossMe yep the bigger the glob the better the job as a wise man once said but that wise man had also said just a dab will do. Sometimes less is more to go fast you must first slow down.
Honesty, I came to the conclusion i shouldn't run K&N because I had a long dusty dirt road. Wasn't worth the very small flow improvement.
Wow this is pretty neat. I've personally never seen a test done like this, so it's some cool little insight as to how the various anatomy of an air intake can take affect.
Shows you cannot go wrong w/OEM Motorcraft or WIX air filters! *Not worth slight increase in air flow w/K&N vs filtering losses you get* . I'm sticking w/Motorcraft myself. -NY
I think I will stick with the Ford filters
You may be a mechanic but, the scientist and engineer is coming out. Wish the industry when training mechanics would show this side of things. I have known many who knew motors, trannys, etc... but, know next to nothing about motor oil, fluids, and filters. I think this would be a great training aid in auto tech.
Yes on a standard car it does not pay to change the air filter, if u have a wrx for example with larger turbo or big power and the stock boost pressure is 14psi and then your running 30psi the stock filter vs k&n filter will show massive difference in power
I like the K&N because it is reusable and you dont just trash it. Hate throwing things away. Great test
I read a while ago that the biggest issue with reusable oiled filters is that people always over oil the filters, and the excess oil ends up on the mass air flow sensor, messing it up. I could be wrong.
I've been running wix air filters in my car's and will definitely continue with the wix.
I don't mind a little restriction if it will keep dirt out of the engine. Dirt is my number one.
I'm just driving to work most of the time.
THANKS COOL!
If you're racing then use the K&N for increased airflow. If you're just driving and care more about engine longevity use one with better filtration. Simple choice depending on your agenda.
very interesting.im NOT being critical here whatsoever.but theoretically speaking, i believe the differences in flow rates between them would probably be more visible near the upper limits of there flow capacities.but for normal everyday driving 200 cfm is plenty of flow for your testing purposes.nice job bud.you been workin your ass off lately,just dont burn yourself out.
200 cubic feet per minute is about 2000 RPM and for the normal person they're never going to see those numbers honestly on normal driving so that's what my focus is not the upper limits its normal driving
I have been it'd exhausting
This is a great video. Wix also makes a police filter that flows 130 or 150 more CFM . WIX Part # 46814 .
What are your thoughts on the Kn and n Cabin filter?
Are you testing the "silencer" box, Ford put on it's engines years ago for less noise, or the little tube extension that reaches the cooler air at the fender opening?
for high volume you can do a setup using a vacuum cleaner and a fine pressure sensor then read the pressure drop. Even an analog pressure gauge should work, but you need to be careful what scale and to read “negative” (lower than atmospheric) pressure
your setup looks interesting though maybe better:)
oiled KN also dirties up the maf sensor. You have to clean it. Someone did this experiment with the maf sensor and a set RPM on a forum many years ago.
I have had a MAF code thrown at least twice in ~150,000 miles with a K&N in my '03 Sierra. Yes cleaning the oil off the wires cleared it, and ran better. No, it was not over oiled
@@182QKFTW even very slight oil will cause the code. I remember reading something (this was late 90s) some shop replaced a guys engine over codes and how bad the car ran from the dirty MAF. Codes don't always point to the MAF, you can get P0171/0174. I think they replaced his O2 sensors, problem was still there.
There wasn't common knowledge then like now. He sued KN but somehow they were not found liable.
I've never had a problem with K&N and Maf sensors and I'm just going to be blatantly honest and tell you I think people don't treat the filters properly and that's the problem
I'm not a huge fan of them because I don't actually see the benefit in having one unless you're going to be racing
In 10 years, I've probably saved over $300 using reusable K&N air filters on both my cars - and it works great. And haven't heard or read any engine damage caused by K&N supposed fine particle thing. Engines are perfectly capable of ingesting micron size dust particles without any problems.
Exactly! As long as they keep out hard, solid, large objects you are fine. Rocks, pebbles, wood, road salt, beach sand.
Microscopic sawdust type stuff isn't going to scratch metal piston walls
Is the inlet pipe/ the restrictor there to access cold air from outside the enginebay? If so, the lack of flow may be compensated with more dense air.
Okay so I basically specified that and this is what people Miss whenever I put out videos I specified the restrictor was there to reduce noise and it actually goes through the light so in essence sure it would get somewhat cooler here but there's a huge restriction there so how much are you actually going to offset any increase it's not worth it to me
I also specified that it would be beneficial to go to the p71 box or actually take your Inlet and modify one to fit that so it goes back where the factory one was
@@FordBossMe First, i find your videos very informative and interesting. There`s no intention from my side to step on anybody`s toes. Maybe i even formulated my comment wrong. In these modern times, mentioning I am a Norwegian to get any excuse for lacking the English language skills may be out of reach. Anyways…
I am often quite curious of the engineering aspect of machines and might question things and get answered by skilled peoples, like yourself.
Scenario: The demand of air is 9m^3/min and filtration capacity is 12m^3/min (after some contamination between services) and reduce the capacity to 10m^3/min adding the “snorkel” tube to access more dense and cooler air. Has the designer increased or decreased the engine performance by doing this?
Looking forward to more uploads from your channel.
Kind regards.
Alex
Given the same filter media and same construction other than pleat count, the more pleats (surface area) the LESS restrictive so long as the pleats are not so crowded together that their surfaces touch each other. The greater the surface area, the more "pores" available to pass the air.
Wow that restrictor really restricts the air...that would be the first thing to go for me. Never even knew that was a thing to quiet it down.
Just keep in mind that without the snorkel on your air box chances are you will be sucking in hotter air from under the hood behind the radiator which is less dense with oxygen which isn’t ideal for burning. The snorkel usually extended ahead of the radiation or into the fender where it can drawn in cooler, denser air which will burn better. Kinda like how turbocharged cars have an intercooler to cool the incoming air from the turbo before it goes into the engine.
Do you think that the round or canister type Ford filters have a major difference between them and the flat ones? Also this has in spired me to improve my intake. No ima not gonna put the “cold air pipe” in my van , I do want better performance for like zero dollars !
You could wrap your intake in exhaust manifold header wrap
@@FordBossMe my manifold is made from fiber reinforced nylon composite . 😐 however the Sasquatch turd that Ford designed in the 80’s is still being used for the E cabs. In some places it shrinks down to 1-5/8 and gets as big as 4-1/4 . Not ever staying consistent in path size or even direction ! All new intake is being planned so …… 🤔🧐
Project Farm did a great comprehensive air filter tests on many different brands loading them up with particulates.
Yeah everybody comes here all the time and talks about project Farm I get that I even have a video explaining why I don't go to other RUclips creators channels and watch their videos and take their ideas
I 100% get that somebody else may have done some kind of test somewhere but they haven't done it like me
I'm my own own unique person and I really don't honestly care what somebody else has done
I give them all the respect in the world but this is how I do things I'm sorry but to be honest with you I don't really care what project Farm did
he's a great guy but I don't go over there watch his stuff, as a master technician in the field working for a dealership I think I'm capable of doing this just fine
@@FordBossMe I'm VERY SURPRISED by your answer, you can learn something from anybody. I'm sure YOU CAN DO " JUST FINE " but EVERYBODY IS A UNIQUE PERSON & I learned a long time ago, IT DOESN'T HURT TO LISTEN, YA MIGHT JUST LEARN SOMETHING, SIR. HELL I LEARNED NOT TO DRINK OUT OF THE TOILET FROM MY DOG GETTING SICK, LOL.
@@NoWr2Run I don't go to other people's channels
Don't be surprised by my answers just accept my answers and if you don't like them then you know what to do
@@FordBossMe I KNOW " WHAT TO DO " ? What's that ?
In the mid west, I run a K&N just because it wakes my truck up at wide open.
I'd go Ford the optimum flow vs filtering.
Those snake oil reusable performance filters (K&N style) let dust particles through. Do you really want to use an air filter in dusty conditions that you can light through?
Hi, was the Champ air filter ever tested? I searched your videos but couldn't find it. Thank you.
I tested it but it was just too nasty it was in such a beat-up box I didn't really feel like it was a fair chance looks like it's been sitting on a shelf for 20 years
I wonder if you included a partical counter if that would tell you the filtering capability of each filter.
Thanks for the in depth analysis, very helpful. I will stick with the paper filter. I don't know what all the hype is with K&N.
mine came with an aFe dry filter. I don't know that it helps much with air flow, but I've not noticed anything in the intake tubes, still clean.
one thing to remember is that slight jump at only 23 cfm in is like 1/10th of what that engine pulls at WOT so the differential gains of almost 1cfm could be like another 10cfm or more.
Dyno tests on performance engines show the K&N to allow the most HP.
I use it in my classic performance car.. but use a wix in my daily driver..
just decide what you want.. its never a hard problem.
I have a mobile Blackstone lab analysis running the k&n air filter at the same time and the amount of particle they let in silica wise was more than double what the max would be
Does the restrictor run through the fender opening on the panther platform ?
It runs behind the light or next to it I should say
I Got a bunch of those blowers some set up with thermostats kicking on and exhausting heat. Damn blowers keep going and going
Like, venting an attic space or something?
I'm at my 2nd oil change at 6k miles on my 2022 f15 5.0 (full synthetic)... I was thinking of also changing my air filter at 6k miles. I live in Los Angeles CA.
What do you think Boss man? Should I also change my air filter at 6k?
Take it out look at it see if it's dirty if it doesn't look too bad leave it in and change it at the next Oil Change
@@FordBossMeThank you so much Boss!! You are the best 💯
I have seen the lab tests for the K&N and they are a lot less restrictive than OEM filters, but this is a clear example of the real measurements for an especific application. Too late watched your video after I burned 50 bucks on mine... how about a custom exhaust? Performance wise what would be the benefits of having a custom exhaust and a the least restrictive filter? I know is nowhere near to what the manufacturers claim but dies it benefit anything? I have a '12 Fusion with a K&N filter and a Magnaflow custom exhaust and seems to me my fuel efficiency went down like 1 mpg.
Honestly there is no real benefit to a custom exhaust unless you're doing it from like the catalytic converters back really manifolds and all should have to be done
@@FordBossMe I hope manufacturers were more honest about the real results on their products, I do it for the sound and the filter for the economy of washing and re-using the filter. But good to know what you mentioned! Thanks!
Yep that inlet is designed to cut down on NVH while providing adequate flow for the application.
Just bought a wix I didn’t know my k&N didn’t filter as good and I was on a farm changing it tomorrow had order a wix filter
So would the Lincoln air box (without the restrictior) be near same as the p71s?
I would pull the restrictor out and then put a little piece in the end of the air box like custom make something for yourself to go through the front of the vehicle so It can suck fresh air cold air
You do get this naturally better without the restrictor in it but I cannot tell you that you know it equals with out the restrictor the p71 airbox I mean this is the best I can do
Was the K&N oiled before testing?
Yeah it was I don't even really put any kind of effort into these tests anymore to be honest with you because I started finding flaws in them
I run Wix air, oil & fuel on my 4200 Atlas motor 2005 Trailblazer 👍🏿
I'm just here to watch you diss all the keyboard haters B)
The factory Ford Motorcraft filter looks like the pleats are taller than the Wix. That would reduce the restriction.
for a gas engine a KAN (may) be slightly beater,, but for a diesel i run a WIX ,, i learned my lesson from some one else how ran a KAN on there 7.3 diesel. the fine dust tore the leading edge off of the fins on the turbo.
I get that everybody's got a story about why they would do this or why they would do that I'm just showing people exactly what's going on in this static state with slightly Dynamic testing
Tried the K&N drop in..
More intake noise yet lost torque vs. factory paper filter
I would imagine the air pump is roughly engine idle speed and an increase in airflow/engine RPM, you would see a more exponential difference in airflow in between these filters.
For me I would stick with factory once better at least I know the performance of it
The theme always seems to be if you are going to the track use the KN. If you are in a store buying a filter for every day use and have a limited choice of brands and versions, you didn't look up comparisons before you went to the store, you can be sure you will get a quality product from Motorcraft, Purolator, Wix no matter what you grab even if you can't remember the differences. If you look at the Fram line you wind up getting caught in their word salad naming of Xtra Guard, Super Duty Really Tough Guard, Long Lasting guard, So So Guard or however they label them. You run the risk of picking up one of their lesser filters due to the confusion they created. A couple of bucks more is nothing over the vehicle life to avoid engine overhauls.
The "restrictor" also grabs air from the inner fender which is supposed to be cooler than under hood air.
Reduction of air even though it's colder doesn't equal anything close to volume available
I clearly know what your saying about the cold air you are preaching to the choir BUT
If I can increase mass vs restricted volume I've increased power even if it's more dense
@@FordBossMe Having both would be ideal. I know you can DO IT!!! FTW!
On my K n N CAI, I have a custom dust cover on it. BTW I believe some of the ecoboosts have more than one MAP senor.
Wix keeps the powerband in the lower rpm range. Low end torque and good filtration is what I like.
Yeah that's just speculation there's no fact to that though
At the shop I used to work in we would recommend if you must run a k&n then at least service your filter every time you change your oil. This was for motorcycles at 3k mile intervals. They would work decent if you kept on top of cleaning them but for the people that went longer you could see the slight dust build up on the inside. It wasn't very much but still I want the amount of dust going into my engine as close to 0 as possible.
Good video rich, I agree that k&n isn’t worth the money for the incredibly futile increase in flow and loss of filtration. Motorcraft isn’t the best because it’s only designed to filter according to Fords standards whatever they may be. I only use WIX filters for oil, fuel, air and cabin air because honestly I believe them to be the best filtration by giving up extremely minimal flow. Insert keyboard commando arguments here!!!!!!
Other brands like STP, parts store brands puralator, AC Delco, FRAM etc are a win some loose some argument. WIX seems to usually if not most of the time be the best flow for the extra filtration making WIX the best bang for the buck regardless if the filtration is air, fuel or oil WIX just seems to win a cross the board. The compromise is flow vs filtration, WIX has the best filtration with better than OEM flow.
Cool gizmo and interesting test to see it like this!
You should do a fuel filter video with different brands
Would u recommend remove it???? The small piece..
I did and it acts better more peppy on throttle
Wix for me
The K&N being a completely different filter media, I don't know that it is a valid assessment to state that it filters less because of fewer pleats. It's a cotton and oil based filter versus a paper filter.
That's not the only reason why it was specified that it may filter less
@@FordBossMe I understand the fine particle thing was mentioned, that is why I am interested in seeing the test you do to check this.
Can you do a fram xtraguard? Ive always run them in my truck. Wonder how it does air flow wise.
I have one and will eventually test it and a fram ULTRA
Let me just tell you right now it filters really good and it flows really good I've already kind of did a preliminary on some of them
@@FordBossMe awesome! Thanks! Ive just always used it because they always have it at walmart or amazon for $12-$15. I only average about 9k-10k miles a year so i just replace it every july and figure im good to go. Got a new one sitting in my garage right now. Gonna change it out tomorrow when i do an oil change.
Garage54 had some nice oil filters. Lol I feel like I’ve seen them before.
K&N because it's reusable maintenance.
No K&N is junk
It simply doest work like that .
There's an intake resonance that you cannot recreate this way.
It works a bit like a subwoofer. If you remove the bellmouth for a bigger hole it won't be nearly as loud.
Counter intuitive, I know.
I'm going to keep doing it the way I'm doing it but that it has been shown to be true from start to finish on anything that I've shown people so far so I'll keep doing me you keep doing you
Ford's been doing snorkel intake restrictions for a while. On the '90's EFI 351's & 460's in the F series pickup trucks that had the dual inlet throttle body, the had a similar "snorkel" necked down restriction to reduce inlet air noise. I guess the "suit types" don't appreciate "intake air noise" under throttle like the rest of us do. Also, the civilian panthers are supposed to have an insert in the zip tube to reduce inlet air noise that maybe you could confirm? I had a '67 Caddy Hearse when I was younger. '67 was the first year GM used the Quadrajet on the Caddy 429. I put a tall open element 14" air cleaner on it. One day I was running late for work and really got into on the freeway. I didn't know it, but I passed up a guy I worked with on his Harley. He told me later, you have no idea what that sounds like coming up from behind :)
Who wouldn't like that throaty sound on wide open throttle?! That's crazy!
Like, IT was the entire reason we used to flip the air cleaner lid upside down, right?!
So you could hear the 4 barrels open up!
The K&N's do actually filter better as they trap a bit of dirt in the cotton weave. Also, if you filter down to a certain point, the dirt is so tiny that it is no longer a meaningful wear product. It winds up getting held in suspension in the oil if it gets past the rings. Frequent oil changes eliminate that soon enough. I use a K&N and just clean and service it every Fall as I only drive about 7k miles a year. OIl & filter 2x a year. Good to know the factory part does do such a good job!
I had higher silica count way outside of the normal range with a K&N I'm not going to use it anymore you can pick that up on your oil analysis it will show silica in excessive amount in your oil and that's not good it creates excessive engine wear
@Ford Boss Me I have a 2010 ford crown victoria police interceptor (p7b) with 327 gearing, you suggest Motorcraft or wix filter ?
Can you do a video with the fram and other popular brands please
After initial testing, would be cool to throw some dust in their and see how much gets sucked through
Yeah I'm working on all that I've already thought of that I've already spoke of that before I've got it I'm going to do all that people just hang tight it'll come up I promise
@@FordBossMe glad to hear that! Defintely tuned in and notifications on 🙏
@@FordBossMe you might use a sifter like they use for powdered sugar and flower to sift dirt so you only get the fine powdery dust!
@@FordBossMe I'm on board with this
@@jonkeau5155 No... no... bro! Think big! include leaves, gravel, mice, walnut shells, whatever! Cram it all in!
Perfect testing!!!
Very good video very clear !!
Great video
excellent video! thanks for sharing this!
If you've ever torn down engines that live off pavement and run through air filters.... the the piston rings are what will tell the story. they can become beveled and it can really destroy the piston seal.
I have the same K & N for my Explorer :)
We use K&N air filters on Blackhawk helicopters so something's there
@@JT-qf4it Stop with your crap. The military doesn't trust multi billion dollar equipment to cheap marketing. You're just upset because you messed up something and can't follow simple instructions on how to clean the filter.
@@JT-qf4it Nice to be called stupid by someone that doesn't understand the fact that aircraft, particularly the aircraft of WW2, were in some of the dustiest and dirtiest environments to ever exist. Including in the air. Apparently gun powder and shrapnel are clean and safe for piston powered aircraft. And forgive me, I forgot Afghanistan and Iraq are super clean, no dust or dirt to clog those Blackhawk engines either.
Man, why do they even bother with a filter??? Such clean operating conditions.
Check yourself buddy. You've done nothing but make yourself look ignorant and give people every reason to want to use these filters. They're great for military equipment in far worse conditions than your little car will ever see. Guess we best not use military grade filtration. It's a marketing scam for a lesser quality filter.
Always informative
As the unfiltered air flows upward into the filter, large particles can fall back down to the bottom of the airbox. Not so with the K&N, the oil will hold those particles becoming more restrictive than the factory filter
Clip on airboxes are the best
On my 2003 lincoln town car i can tell a big difference running a k&n than a regular filter
More pleats=more overall surface area=more flow.
K&N is fine for performance but terrible at filtering. Holes are holes people. And the K&N i pulled out of my Cummins was loaded with holes. It never went back in.
Finally after years of spending money on K&N I see the money wasted. Thank you very much
You can have higher air flow and less filtration or more filtration and less air flow. You can’t have both. There’s a fine medium but you won’t notice a difference in power. Air filtration is not the place to skimp on to gain negligible power.
Agreed
You say negligible power increase. But when you can physically feel the difference behind the wheel, that's not negligible.
@@rainmakr9 everybody's got an opinion on things I don't want my comment section to turn into a pissing match because people disagree
@@rainmakr9 I agree with you but I can tell you no air filter will give you enough power increase to feel it behind the wheel. I’ve seen this done as a bet more than once at the track and it never works out for the ones that say they can tell.
Best airflow test that I have seen so far. Is it possible to use this equipment to measure the particles?
We would have to find another way of monitoring it wish I could probably drop dirt on the filter somehow suck it into the box and then see what passes through
@@FordBossMe I would try replacing the MAF sensor to a particle monitor. The dirt can be place in a pipe which connect to the air box. The siphon effect should do the job. Sand maybe too heavy, but I don't think there's any filter will allow sand to pass.
@@FordBossMe if you drop the dirt directly on the filter, basically the gravity is helping to pull the dirt into the filter. It's very different to actual operating condition.
Ash, dirt, sand....pollen
The mass air port won't work its in front of the filter
I need it on the inlet side
Most standard cars there filter is made to flow what the engine needs so just Changing the filter will not show anything
Do you have the Purolator boss
I have a Purolator one I think
wow that restrictor really restricts the air, what would happen if got rid of restrictor?
You would get more airflow it would be a little bit more responsive on the throttle but I would suggest trying to come up with some kind of homemade adapter that you can put on there or do what I did and find a p71 lower box and modify it
If You took it off you'll be fine
F.B.M., you have any issues with 2021 f150 v8 come in yet?
@@jamesself2409 none yet
@@jamesself2409 I've only had one F-150 so far with an issue from 2021 and it was because the oil life dropped less than 20% and it lost more than one quart of oil which disables the PCM and then the dealer has to unlock everything and reset the system
I bought the k&n air filter cause it's rewash able tired of spending 20$ on the higher end not reuseable air filter after 2 filters u spend just as much or not more then a k&n
Do a video on the problems with F150 cooling when towing uphill with loads that are not anywhere approaching max tow rates.
You should try a comparison with a dirty filter
We're going to get there