🍐 I would highly recommend DaftPina’s video he made with the animator Tim Tom. They discuss his past bad behavior, his apologies to people, as well as the review he made of Tim Tom's channel: ruclips.net/video/R1TMtdGsCoc/видео.html 🍐 I don't want to pressure you to forgive or trust the critics I criticized. I just want you to know that the people featured in this video are not frozen in time. Some of them are changing their content or have quit doing commentary on people. A couple have quit RUclips altogether. 🍐 While we will see these arguments again from new people, hopefully we'll all become better critics as time goes on. 🤞 Update: 10/11/2019
Rus ) I'm pretty sure I can describe that feeling with poetry.. Why does that sound familiar... Anyways, *"The Soul would have no rainbow, if the eyes no tears."*
Very true, one should not forget that people, even bad critics, can and do change their opinions, and can get better, the comunity shouldn´t copy their bad behaviours and bury them in hate, they can get better, they are humans too, as are the animators and rest of, well, youtubers
@@futurestoryteller as people, we all have problems and in one way or another, we may annoy somebody ourselves either intentionally or unintentionally. So I second your statement.
The “what would her professor think” line really grinds my gears. As someone who actually went to college for animation the need to observe trends and be willing to change as the market and taste does was a HUGE part of what my instructors taught us, you have to adapt or you die. Also funny how they go into the history of animation but omit that in the earliest days animation was highly detailed but took a very long time and that’s what lead to characters like Micky Mouse and the “rubber hose” style of animation. They were designs built on simple shapes so any animator could draw them and it would cut time to produce shorts. The same thing that you see in RUclips story times. When your taught by people whom art is their job you learn you can communicate a great deal with very little, and you need to know where to focus your time and effort because they are finite resources.
Honestly to me the really bad part is right before that when the dude accused her of changing style to match other youtubers which is patently false. Dudes basically saying that cause other people have a similar style that hers is invalid.
"i dont like her style of animation so therefore its bad. I am authority right?? because i have a critic youtube channel?? Im obviously superior. I'm on the same level as her art professor probably, he'd hate this too." its so self entitled and rude. everyone working on animation storytime videos does a great job because at the end they made something. these guys just think they're hot shit by using the same format but being mean to people about it.
What's more is that there's a good chance her professor would love her animation style, considering that in a video Rebecca made, she stated that her main inspiration for the whole no mouths aspect of her animation was because of her professors love of characters like Gromit from Wallace and Gromit. Theidea of a character with no mouth having to use their brow to show expression and personality. That whole "what would her professor think"question clearly shows that they don't pay attention or look deeper into things. Even possibly just bandwagoning on the idea that the animation community is bad.
I'm an introvert, and I have bad (like REALLY bad) voice/volume control, hearing and anger management/emotional stability, I can be happy as a hazel but I can become annoyed, irritated, absolutely pissed off the next, then I'm back to normal in just a few moments and sometimes instead of getting pissy I start to instantly cry. Fyi, I am physically incapable of crying on command, I genuinely thought I was incapable of crying for a time because I didn't cry for three years straight. During those years my response to negative situations were that I either shut down, got angry or just sad without tears. And, just for clarification, I doubt it's bipolar, I've gotten diagnosed and they said it was just depression and me being impulsive all the way down both in actions and emotions.
What these critics don't realise, is that people actually LIKE hearing other's relatable life stories. It can actually, I don't know, make you feel that you're not alone? Make you laugh because you relate? Nah, that's not how people work!
I think these critic's audience kinda like making mountains out of mole hills and calling people phony (at length). It's just kinda lame that they pick targets who can be kind of vulnerable. It would seem a lot less mean spirited if they focused their cynicism on some more lofty and untouchable targets (celebrities, writers abd artists with successful careers in the industry and so forth) rather than DIY youtube channels that live and die by the same algorithms as everybody else.
Levi Doneson that they’re scowling brunettes? Haha, jk, anyways stereotypes feel accurate, even when they’re not, because we like patterns. In this case, we agree with them because they feel accurate if we see enough of them, even if they’re not actually that accurate.
One thing that stuck out to me was around the 19 minute mark, on genres. I've been an animator since 2012, and one thing I've always said was that storytime animations aren't the same as the animations I do. Like you said, they're a different genre, one that I've never really felt like I competed with. I've had peers who have had hostile feelings to storytime animators and I've never understood them, beyond them being more mad at RUclips's changes and that anger being taken out on the new genres. The only thing that ever has bugged me on the topic is when ST animators are credited for 'saving' animation on youtube--which, that isn't their fault at all, such claims always comes from fans, and isn't really true. Original story-driven animation is still a huge amount of effort to get off the ground and isn't friendly with the algorithm by its design. But again, storytimes are (or were) something new, accessible, and adaptive, and that's still an accomplishment. And even then, Storytime animators are still at least helping to cultivate that part of the ecosystem. And I think the existence of ST Animators is largely a positive impact--animation might not be 'saved,' but its decline has slowed a bit. Overall, the concept of 'critiquing critiques' and refining critique to get it across better is a topic that I've talked about myself and care a lot about (especially the concept of "who is this critique for? the artist in question, or for your audience?") I haven't finished watching the vid but it's been great so far.
I agree it does seem like the original animators and their fans hate them because of the algorithm , but STAs are harmless youtubers ,They aren’t doing anything wrong
Damn that was perceptive. Normally I don't like psycho-analysing but i'm pretty sure you nailed that. Points for encouraging the ones who decided to walk it back too. As, yknow, opposed to rubbing it in their face.
I’m loud around my boyfriend but quiet in public. I’m an introvert and also have social anxiety. I’m also opinionated online. Introversion is not a “shy” stereotype!
I find the funniest part about RUclips "critics" is that surprisingly most of them cant take the type of criticism they dole out on a daily basis. Really makes you think huh.
I'd probably be unable to take criticism if someone was bashing something I loved doing and earned me money. Or maybe I'd be a saint and ignore it all. Not sure, never had the problems these guys do. And I suppose that's my point: You can't take the morale high ground if you can't even reach it in the first place, or been at the high ground and seen the negative comments batter away like artillery.
I know, people can follow you all they want, but when it comes down to you it should only be you who decides who you want to associate online with. I absolutely hate the “I’m following you now, so follow me back” comments. I have heard it far to many times and it makes me want to scream.
Every time I read Turkey Tom I have to google to remind myself who he is. I've seen some of his videos but he's easily one of the most boring commentary RUclipsrs.
13:18 Dude I felt that. I make whole-ass animated music videos, and even _I've_ been told before that what I do isn't "real" animation. All because I _dare_ to sometimes use panning and tweening like the talentless hack that I am. For shame. Seriously though, this is a great analysis and you really can't blame storytime animators for the hustle. They still work hard for what they do, and they're people like anyone else. Obviously there's nothing wrong with improving your craft and taking constructive criticism. But like you said, when it's someone's job and they've already got a system that works, there's really no reason to take certain criticisms to heart. _"I don't like your genre, change it"_ really hits the nail on the head. Hopefully they do have a long and bountiful future ahead of them, though I'd be lying if I said I didn't wish the algorithm was more accommodating to other types of animation, too. :P Nothing lasts forever, and hopefully they don't have to deal with too much of this drama bullshit while the spark is still there.
Uhh. But you don't do real animation tho? Like I'm not hating and I'm not saying that you don't have talent or good ideas cause you do from what I've seen and I'm not saying that what you do doesn't take hard work or take a long time or that you don't deserve the cred you have for your style of entertainment but even your most recent videos that have the best production you've had so far isn't "real" animation, like by definition what you do isn't truly animation and that's fine I don't get why people have to hate and talk shit just because "ugh this isn't real animation which means it sucks no matter what you're trying to convey or do with your artistic talent" I've always stayed away from people like that cause they'll just bring you down. I say just keep doing what you enjoy doing man and fuck the people that wanna hate on your creations just because they're losers who see someone else doing what they could be doing but they have no drive or ambition to do anything worth a damn in their lives cause they're pathetic little adult-children projecting how they feel about themselves onto someone who's actually going for what they wanna do. So just remember that anyone who talks shit like that for basically no reason at all is just some loser who wishes they could be doing what you're doing and they STILL CAN do it but they either don't believe in themselves enough or they know they have no real talent and nothing worth a damn to say or do so that makes them sad cause they see you doing it in a way thats easy and affective for you and see that even tho you're limited in your resources you're still putting out some quality content and they realize that you're better than them and that makes them angry and lash out instead of doing something about it like trying to make their own shit. Don't pay any kind to people like that man they're not worth even thinking about unless they're actually being CONSTRUCTIVELY criticizing and not just spewing idiotic nonsense out their mouths haha. Good luck to you and your future projects and I hope you can make a career out of it so that you too may escape the way the world/"people in charge" tells us as human beings how we're supposed to make it in this world and live as people as if they know what's best for an individual's spiritual and mental condition; being placed in this confusing and strange reality unwillingly and just trying to figure out what we're here for as an individual person is every man and woman's greatest trial in this existence. We're all lost and confused and only here for a very short time. But it's also the greatest triumph and mentally freeing state of every man and woman's life for those whom can figure that answer out for themselves and live their life in understanding and wisdom and able to feel as they once did when we were all children, internally content, happy and completely whole again as the human they were always meant to be. That's what we all strive for knowingly or unknowingly, to feel whole again as people is all we truly desire. To transcend the mortal coil we must be aware of these things and just do whatever you think will truly make you happy in life no matter what others may or may not say about us or our soul filled work and art, as long as your work and art are real to you and filled with your real artistic feelings and connections, then it's "real" art and something of value to this experience we call life. And I can tell that you're well on your way so no matter what, don't ever let any asshole's misunderstanding of what you're trying to do get in the way of your happiness or drive and ambition to create. You're already far more human than any of those kinds of people so never let them make you fall in any way. I love you sister human being. Stay creating, stay learning, stay evolving in any and every way, stay alive. And then you'll transcend everything, and exist forever in a way that's completely unperceivable to us in the life we live now. There is so much more, an infinite amount more that lies in wait for those of us who know these secrets to what life does and is and choose to live it in happiness and wholeness and peace in heart and mind. So very much more my friend.
@@Captain_Calcium Yeah, the rambling isn't an issue. The lack of formatting is. You just put 5 paragraphs worth of text in one big block with no pacing and no line breaks. I have well above a college reading level, and I found this difficult to read. Next time, break your text up into sections with no more than about 7 or 8 sentences each if they're on the shorter side, and no more than 5 or 6 if they're longer.
"If I was 22 and my art looked like this, I would just quit." Have fun never earning new skills then. You don't start good at something, and you shouldn't stop gaining skills just because your completed a quarter of your life. lol, what a knob
I’m an INFJ too!!! :D I’m currently at 31:38 but I’m diggin this video. I for one am new to RUclips, my rise happened too fast for me to know the ins and outs of everything, (heck I’ll find new crit channels and vids every now and then and my buddies will go ‘how have you not seen this??’) aaaand boy I hope me writing this comment doesn’t become part of someone’s crit video for one point or another when I say this. The inevitable crit video about any kind of channel, at least as I’ve seen it, doesn’t stir feelings of “oh hey, someone who understands ‘animation’ on youtube has some insightful and interesting points, I can’t wait to receive some true feedback from a deep diver instead of digging through my comment section for something besides ‘notice me senpai’.” Instead it stirs feelings of, oh I better make sure there isn’t a raid in my discord server following this, I know their intention isn’t wrong but their fan base can go forth any way they want, ah this means all the other crit channels are gonna parrot these same topics (as you’ve illustrated in your video) for the next month or so, everything I respond to will just fuel the fire and perhaps generate them a part 2 of crit, you’re damned if you do damned if you don’t respond, (edit, I am now at 58:21 and dang you hit the nail on the head here) and for me personally, I worry crit channels will bring up a personal aspect or opinion regarding my most popular content, a story about an emotionally and sexually abusive relationship. (But hey! It’s my fault for talking about it in the first place huh? Shouldn’t I be open to critique?) That said, the reputation of crit channels isn’t lovely, and that’s what it comes down to. That’s not to say some are realizing lately where some things crossed the line (Daft taking down one of the Jaiden videos, talking to TimTom and squaring things away, focusing on actual targets deserving of takedowns like a frickin child predator, hell yeah to that!) but it still stands - the reputation is there, (edit again, whomp there it is 1:04:58) and I hope this is where videos like yours can hold up a mirror to these channels. Frankly, shouldn’t a channel who prides themself in constructive criticism appreciate a healthy dose of critique on their own content?
Yee, I'm a big fan of your videos so I lit up like a Christmas tree when I saw you had commented. lol So far they do seem receptive at least publicly. Daftpina actually tweeted out a link of my video on his twitter. My video was more meant to analyze the situation and not necessarily to teach them, but it does seem like they manged to draw something out of it independently and none of them have yelled at me or insulted me publicly for it. I don't think they would ever use your personal trauma against you, I think even they know how that would look. I think it's only after they have a resentment of a RUclipsr that they feel comfortable saying they are only discussing traumatic life events for attention instead of expression or education.
Curio Omg! 🎄 Well I’m enjoying your content a ton so far, and I’m excited to see what else you plan on doing! Hey that’s awesome he shared it! Ah yeah, sorry for my assumptions on the teachable moments here. Nevertheless, it’s a great video as you explained it at the end- good context for those watching everything, both the animation channels and critique channels. This provides a lot of context, and you gave credit where credit was due for sure :) True there. The resentment is what gets me. Even if whatever critique is valid, there’s always some kind of personal qualm glaze over the critique turkey. Like, “okay it’s a little spicy there BUT ITS STILL GOOD,” and like... no. My journalism teacher in HS used the cockroach metaphor: it doesn’t matter how good the sandwich was if, right before the last bite, you’d just bitten into a cockroach that had infested the sandwich. I hope people start to see that in these flawed “reviews.”
Saying that every “bad” animator should just hire a team of animators for them is like saying that you can’t write music unless you’re classically trained. 99 percent of the most critically acclaimed modern day musicians don’t have the best “chops” but they can write a good ass song, and that’s all that matters.
This really doesn't make any sense at all. You like to draw, but you ain't 'good enough', which means you should hire people to draw for you. But then... what's the point?
Spoctor even made a video like this called " "Critique" is Just Insulting People Now" and yeah I feel like the critics don't understand the difference between helpful and harmful.
Because these so called "critiques" are completely entitled to their opinion over something. It's not a fucking restaurant to need a critique over what they deliver for being considered good. They're like you entitled estrict parent, makes fun and harass you all around, and then says that they're proud and take credit from your own self improvement. I've seen critics that they understand how, even if it hurts, critique can actually help as long as you are open mind about it, and even I've seen one that recommend _and_ supported a small artist and even said that it wasn't necessary to them tl change a whole comic page over a critique, but if they feel like doing so, and if that helped, he's okay with it. Sorry if i wrote too much.
those types of channel are the evolved form of cyberbulling with a side of profit and attention that learned from the last generation of youtube mistakes as a way to project themselves as the truth seekers when it reality is way to bring down others
The things Daft said in his video on Jaiden's face reveal make me incredibly angry. Mostly because he is not a licensed therapist or phycologist and has absolutely no legal or ethical right to provide a diagnosis
Y'Know..Bullying someone because they're "Introverted" Or they have had problems in their lives isn't really what I would call "Constructive Critique" but alright..
That's one of the most annoying parts. Once you actually step back and look at what these videos are, you realise how ridiculous it is to jump from "you should add smear frames" to "you probably faked your personality and personal history for views". You get whiplash seeing such weird flip flops from people who pride themselves on "objectivity".
When a ton of people just make "Oh i'm introverted" their personality it gets boring fast, and in my opinion, seems to be used to add a relatability sting to their channel, not saying that the people aren't introverted, but expanding on your personality other than "I'm introverted" is very refreshing, that's why I love that jaiden seems to be a lunch club regular now, she's expanded from just being awkward and introverted and now seems like a genuinely real person.
I wouldn’t say they beat them up and said it’s criticism I’d say that they beat them up and said and then said they were helping them figure what to do if they get beat up again
Also, Didn't Rebecca's professor actually email her to tell her how proud they were? I love LS Mark now but I'm sooooo glad he ate his words about that.
26:32 I found this one to be funny, because in one of Rebecca Videos she literally says that the reason she changed her art style was because her art professor always enjoyed Russel and Gromit, because she always found it fascinating how you could tell what a character was feeling/thinking without the need of a mouth. That’s why she chose the art style, not because it was easier or to “fit in” but because it’s what her art professor would have Wanted. The irony is hilarious.
lets not forget daftpina tried to blame jaiden animation for having a community that made pornography of her character like??? she can't control who draws her why are you trying to blame her for creeps making porn of her persona what the hell is wrong with you. honestly after that video i kinda just stopped watching those guys because they seriously give me just bad vibes especially with how overtly vitriolic they can get with their "criticism".
maybe i'm reaching, but i feel like all these men who "criticized" her are kind of misogynistic? they're so insecure that a girl who's open abt her mental health and vulnerability are getting many subscriber and attention on the internet.
@@Charadoesthatgaming im not really sure myself but if im correct daftpina made a video about jaiden animations rule 34 art (apparently he deleted the video but there's a reupload if you wanna watch) and then blamed jaiden for encouraging her community to make nsfw art of her even though she did not say anything about rule 34 in the first place to put it in a nutshell it's just daftpina harassing jaiden for no reason
I used to love daft pina, but after the “you should just quit” or the “if I was 22 and my art looked like that I would just quit” and the whole “jaiden faked the eating disorder for views” thing, it’s hard to view it as *constructive* criticism
He said that Footofaferret should change his titles and add in sources in the description. And that's good with me that Ryde the Ferret should change his titles and add in sources.
Citrus Friend i always wondered why i didn’t like the critic a lot and justified i didn’t like it because it was negative(which was weird because i don’t mind it) but know i realize it was just most of them being bully’s. i didn’t fucking realize that i knew they were dicks. i
Well, mine were usually men, but what I _always_ found amusing is how infrequently things escalated if you just took on the same tone they approach you with. Kind of like the conflicting narratives about dealing with bullies. Sure, if you punch back then it might just be a fight, but we have to acknowledge, it _is_ often just as likely - if not moreso, to end the bullying. Then again it depends on how they perceive you in relation to them.
Bruh this was so God damn GOOD. Not only was the commentary excellent... I think you may have convinced me to play slime rancher too hahahahaha Subscribed, keen to see where you go from here!! If you have a discord account, would be up to chat as well B)
@@QuinnCurio This is a very well thought out and made video. The video play is a great and easy way to visually entertain while getting your message out(while the editing must have taken you forever)
@The AMaazing Congratulations, you threw the line out to attract some female attention and on line company and it work! (this is rare). I am glad for you
I remember that in the past, i thought, that theodd1isout's animation is "lazy". But then, I started working on animation by my own, and ohhhhhh boi. I was a stupid child.
As an introvert I can personally explain why all of them are so good at making a cool personality: These critics have simply underestimated our ability to plan out conversations that never happen!
@@hystericallover5989 Well see, it was a joke about how, as an introvert, I tend to have a lot of time on my hands to plan out possible interactions rather than actually engage in said interactions with other people. Emphasis on the " *it was a joke* " part.
@@hystericallover5989 Ah, sorry about that. I did just ask a few people and they said it did but if you couldn't see it I'm willing to believe that they just said that cause they thought it was what I wanted to hear.
And then they turn their entire community against you because you’re a crybaby that can’t take criticism because you blocked them on Twitter because you found them annoying
I am very invested in art community, and I enjoy making art myself. And one thing that troubled me for a while is: why making videos on RUclips has to be a constant race for improvement? For me, growing as an artist is a wonderful thing, but it’s not a necessity. I don’t have to grow as an artist to enjoy the things I do for fun. FUN. Why do people HAVE to improve? Why do they HAVE to chase that improvement, instead of allowing it to come naturally? Story time RUclipsrs have lives of their own in real world. Sure, RUclips can be a cool side gig, rarely a source of actual income, but for many it’s just a hobby. It’s not a cutthroat industry, and I don’t understand people who treat it as such. Some person likes to draw and makes little animations? Cool. They shared it with people, and people liked it? Sweet. Why do all these people approach those independent creators in the same manner you would approach a professionally trained director/animator/writer? Its ridiculous. And I hate the rhetoric that these people don’t deserve to be loved or appreciated because they are not professional enough or not good enough. I hate “critics” that shame people for their popularity. As if they don’t deserve to be famous. Like? Shut up? Someone made a silly cartoon and told an engaging story, posted it on a platform accessible to millions of people, and those people just happened to see the work and like it. Where’s the sin? Where’s the crime? Why not just be happy that some kids with a complex, time-consuming hobby are having fun? Since when is the support of many that infuriating? I feel that the root of all evil is this ridiculous expectation put on literal amateurs to be ever-evolving art machines who have to prove their worth before receiving any sort of credit. I hate this attitude, I despise this abysmal pressure that is being put on people who are not even trying to pursue a professional career. They. Are. Just. Having. Fun. Thank you for coming to my TED talk, oof, this was in my mind forever
I agree! I legit enjoy watching art videos and I enjoy it even more when the artist is having fun! it sucks society now thinks being a bunch of miserable cows is way better than being chilled and having fun, being happy... I think not! enjoy yourselves, Jaiden, James and every artist of any kind out there, as long as it isnt hurting anybody, it's all good! :)
Nowadays Jaiden Animations has basically fully animated and lip synced videos with a team making them and if the critics wanted to they could be like “see! She gave in to criticism and we were right all along!” When she had been increasing fully animated segments slowly for a long time and being a big channel that brings in tons of views can actually afford to do this stuff.
"This is like shouting false gods at a mall santa" was such a perfect way to describe the cognitive dissonance these people seem to have. I used to watch a lot of daftpina and their video on Jaiden literally made me stop in the middle and unsubscribe. I think it was around where he mentioned that it was exploitative that her video was so long when his was thirty fucking minutes long. The fact that these people are such leeches yet act holier than though is the worst part.
Channels you've subscribed to mostly because they have much to say on the topic. If you don’t feel the same, hey, that’s fine, but the point of most of the stacks of words normally are to prove their point.
Oh god, that DaftPina thing where he tries to diagnose Jaiden for a different mental illness than the one she says she has is the slimiest thing I’ve seen a youtuber do on camera Ugh
Royal Nugget a mistake is when you makes like a factual error or slur your speech or some shit, not deliberately making a video attempting to call out someone’s mental health diagnoses like an internet psychologist with PhD in being a little bitch I think it’s funny you’re calling me a simp tho seeing as you love the DaftPina dude enough to come in and try and defend his slime ass, he’s not going to fuck you dude so you should save your energy
Royal Nugget initially I wasn’t even commenting on whether or not he had apologised or been forgiven or even what kind of person he is, I don’t know the guy and I don’t care I’m just amazed/disgusted at his actions and how he filmed, edited and posted a video like that without reconsidering what he was doing So no, I wouldn’t care if the Pope personally forgave him at the Vatican for his actions, I’m still dumbfounded over how he thought they were okay in the first place
Royal Nugget I’m not annoyed, I’d be annoyed if everyone didn’t already point out how shitty it was but that’s not the case. I’m disgusted and bewildered over how someone thought that was an okay thing to do in the first place, it’s like wow someone was actually that much of a dick online what the fuck
I agree wholeheartedly with this video. Speaking more on Daftpina being "calm" in his videos, I hate the notion that as soon as someone who cares about a topic gets emotional, they are suddenly inadequate or weak, and the points that they are making are automatically irrelevant. I am someone who cries when I get angry, it sucks, but I can't help it. So when I'm arguing with someone about something I'm passionate about and my face starts to feel hot or I can feel my voice start to crack I hate it because I know that they are going to automatically dismiss what I'm about to say. Just being able to be deadpan doesn't mean that the person is right, it just means that they have a good poker face. They can still say cruel things or have bad takes, but as long as they say it in a collected way people will go crazy for it. I know multiple people like DaftPina, and what they all have in common is they like to think that their takes are edgy and different, when in reality they're just bullies wrapped in fancy packaging. They're mean as fuck, but if you take offense to any of what they're saying, you're just sensitive.
These are the kind of people that will go on a rant about how you have no skills in photography while you're showing your vacation photos to your family.
Also isn’t exaggeration the 10th principle of animation? I’m pretty sure Rebecca even pointed it out in one of her videos that she exaggerates her animation for comedic and dramatic effect
A youtuber once said this and i've never forgotten it, it was something a long the line of "people feel so entitled over their free content." I don't think that you shouldn't criticize because you're getting the thing for free, but when you put things in perspective they do sound a whole lot more... well entitled.
Quendi555 i found this video a couple of days ago and I've rewatched it 3 times already. Her way of speaking and the points she presents are so well constructed. I also realised that she did the Ron Weasley video and I remember rewatching that video multiple times last, year, I had no idea she was the same person!
Gosh this is the video I've DREAMED about making for months and months now, but never had the guts or steady tongue to do it. Thank you, thank you for making this video and putting so much time, thought, and care into your arguments. This seriously needs to make its rounds in the Bad Faith Criticism community, because it sheds a light on so many things that people take issue with but maybe couldn't put their finger on (or didn't want to for risk of being the subject of another one sided rant). Thank you.
You've dreamed about making these kinds of videos? Well I'm kind of sick of making videos on these topics so I could just script some videos and you can put them on your channel if you want cuz there's a lot more shit.
Smart Alec plus I've noticed these critics never target these types of videos, if they want to "reply" to the arguments against them they target ones by younger sounding, more hesitant people with less strongly communicated arguments and my God I would not want their community angrily on my front door
@@tomo4977 I've been trying to get the community at my front door, but I'm one of the few videos that they haven't responded to because I'm thourough as fuck and even predicted every kind of comment LS Mark would type to dismiss my video. But yeah their arguments suck and they make themselves look good by going after strawmen
Daft Pina is such a foul person, I’m genuinely disgusted. Accusing someone of faking a mental health issue and then telling her to get help for issues he diagnosed her with is just… nasty. Nasty beyond words. I know I’m using strong words but I truly think he embodies them, nasty, foul, and disgusting. And his “apology” only cements how I feel about him.
Agree 100%. Nasty, Foul, and Disgusting is what he is. In fact, you're very generous with those decriptions. I could use much worse words for this guy off the top of my head.
I think the backlash he got from that helped him change his content for the better. At least from of his more recent stuff, he seems to be moving away from his past style of presentation. Am I saying that you should change your opinion on him? No.
If they just criticized their animation and stories, I'd be fine with them. But, the fact that these critics then go on to call these people annoying and belittle their personalities and problems when they have no right to is just downright mean. Then, when the animators don't listen to them because they, for a lack of a better term, bully them, the critics get angry. Well, no shit the animators weren't going to listen to you, you just called them annoying shams, why would they ever want to listen to you?
So if my friend is being a dickhead and I tell him "hey you're being a dickhead" i'm in the wrong? Or if my friend is annoying me and I tell him "dude you're annoying me" i'm still in the wrong? And yes the part of "Friend" may make it seem less severe cause we're friends but the point is, if someone is annoying, you should tell them it, or you're just letting them go around and annoy people, which only makes peoples opinion of that person worsen, now if you're going overboard like "DUDE YOU'RE SO FUCKING ANNOYING WILL YOU JUST LEAVE EVERYONE ALONE AND COME BACK WHEN YOU'VE FIXED YOUR PERSONALITY" then yeah you're in the wrong, but giving criticism on how someone acts is ok, it's justified when you want to help them act in a way that doesn't make people dislike them. Therapy for example, while not a good example for this specific situation, therapy is basically telling someone what's wrong with their personality and trying to help fix the issue.
@@uncleearl1886 How the hell did you ever get to "is it wrong to tell my dick friend that they're a dick?" Who said this? When? How does this relate to the initial point? No one's saying an animator can't be critiqued for being a legitimate prick. What's wrong is to belittle and pick apart their personalities so as to demean and insult them. Not when they're mean, not when they're causing problems. Just the bare and unneeded, "this is in fact your personality, and I don't like it. It's actually quite rude to tell random people you don't like aspects of their character at default.
Jesus christ, seriously?? I thought TurkeyTom was bad for calling Spechie fat and then acting like the victim when she blocked him. That’s seriously fucked up.
@@prettybigpengushe also still didn't take down his video about jaiden's song which surprise surprise is the same as the face reveal video which is mentioned in the video
I feel like Turkey Tom is the new Keemstar; a youtuber who almost everyone agrees is detestable and makes bad content, yet is inexplicably popular with an insular group of edgy teenagers. He's also always claiming that he's spreading "the truth" when it's usually just misinformation about people he doesn't like.
Turkey tom is nothing, I've knew about RUclips critics like I HATE EVERYTHING, Nortalgia Critic or "The Right" Opinion, he's just a narcissist jerk who just a dozen of dorks with no self-love barely follow him. And I don't say because I hate him, cause i barely know him, i say it because a toxic opinologist or critic, never goes as far as a talented artist, or musician, or any kind of talented people, but he gets as what he is, a jerk in front of every people who is a bit smarter than him.
Honestly, if I was Jaiden and if someone said that I was faking my disorder I talked about in a heartfelt video, I’d be literally crushed - catch me sobbing on the floor crushed. Like what? What did she do to be villanized like that?
Why are they bullying the new artists? Why? I feel so bad for them. Becoming an artist is hard enough and you are constantly questioning yourself and feeling bad about your skills as it is! LEAVE THEM ALONE Deeeep inhale Im fine. Im fine im fine im fine
Neiasaurus Creations That’s a straw mans Argument. Your argument has no foundation therefore it collapses. You give your so called “fact” without proofing it. How do you expect people to believe you if you have no proof? Or are you just responding people to start an argument? Go join a mock trail and debate club and learn how to debate someone. Because you look like a douche bag.
i dont understand why people are surprised that a lot of artists are introverted, like you said in the video, its a hobby that you do inside and by yourself. that sort of thing attracts people who dont like being around others. wild.
also, i think (with no scientific backing, just my own experience) that most people period are introverted. once in psychology class the teacher asked us if we thought we were in general/usually introverted or extroverted, and most raised their hand for "introverted". i think the fact it's two words trick people into thinking the populace is split 50/50 between the categories; when in reality, it might maybe lean somewhere like 70/30. then again, i live in sweden, so it may just be a nordic thing.
Jaiden's video about her ed is heartbreaking; it is so clearly honest and comes from a very painful place, I have no idea how someone could claim it seems disingenuous. It must have taken a lot of courage for her to make it and share such a personal pain and instead of people allowing it to be a catharsis and supporting her, they decide to accuse her of faking?? I can't anymore
lets not forget their chracters for their channel just...dont have good character design- like ngl they remind me of the 2013 deviant art characters where the colors and everything are just eh-
The most annoying thing to me is when they tell these artists to "just quit". I abosultey hate that, it doesn't matter how old someone is or what thier art is, telling them to just give up and quit is gross.
gosh this comment section is bringing back my faith in humanity after being exposed to all that "constructive criticism" thank goodness people are also upset about the complete lack of boundaries these people had
True, I'm so tired to see so much hate in peoples comment sections. I mean, there is some hate here, but it's directed at the right people. EDIT: Btw I am not endorcing hate against anyone and every comment I've seen here so far just states facts or calmly discusses the subject. I was just trying to point out that this comment section isn't all happy. It's just so hard to explain things over the internet :( Final statement is I agree with you.
"I know people who went to this school and they say it wasn't as bad as Speechie described it to be" You mean different people can have different opinions on the same thing? Well, shit, don't that just beat all?
That also ignores that some people get treated better then others let's face. Some people have teachers or students who they just don't get along with. There can be many reasons like being an introvert, autistic, race, religion, who your parents are or a bad first impression can get you singled out. Just because a few people had a decent time at a school doesn't mean your bad experience is invalid.
Your point is valid and correct. However in the interest of playing the other side, it could be possible that the point that is trying to be made, is that Speechie is being disingenuous and exaggerating how bad school was for him/her (don't know who Speechie, I came from TRO video)
@@peoplesoft2784You didn't really present the other side or oppose my argument, you literally just regurgitated his... I was going to say argument, but really it's nothing more than an assertion. "she could be being disingenuous" She could be, but where is the evidence for that? It sure as hell is not sufficient to talk about someone else's experience there because, and try to get your head around this, because it gets complicated, their experience will be different from speechie's because, again, try to keep up, they are not speechie. On top of that, how do we know the people he spoke to aren't being disingenuous? How can we be sure that he's not being disingenuous and if these people even EXIST? Do you see the issue with this way of thinking yet? YOU could be being disingenuous. I could be being disingenuous. Anyone could always be disingenuous. Merely pointing out the possibility of someone being disingenuous is NOT an argument that they are. You need to actually present evidence. "I came from a TRO video" I have literally no idea why you told me that. I couldn't care less where you came from or who you watch. It's irrelevant to your... Again, argument is too strong a word...
The amount of time they spend arguing that someone's content is terrible because they call their videos animations when, "iTs acTualLY AN AnImATIc" Is so stupid. Who gives a shit if they put animation or animatic in their damn title, it does. not. matter.
Look. If all of these story time animators animated all of their videos as if they were a professional production meant to be released publicly in theatres/streaming sites. Then guess what? Theyd lose their minds. Animation is so hard. And I doubt any of these people who make these “criticisms” have EVER animated themselves. Because if they have they would NEVER make these complaints and whine. Their so pathetic I swear.
This video is kind of a breath of fresh air with many people trying to deliver their "criticism" thinking that they are actually "helping", (I'm talking more-so about Foster, omgitsjames, turkeytom, crizon). I'm not really going to type out a long ass paragraph of what I think about the video, because there are just way too many points to address. I think the video itself was pretty satisfactory, there might of been some mistakes (some things taken out of context, or a simple misunderstanding), but I really learned a lot from this video (Even though I'm not a critic). I think one of the main things to take away from this video is to criticize the critic. I've always had my suspicions about the various opinions of the critics of A.S.T (animated story teller/time) community, especially Daft. And in all honesty, you've explained those suspicions way better than I ever could. Soooo, yeah. Good job!
There are so many lines in this video that are just *chef's kiss*. Like saying these kids "need more time in the microwave" or the critics "get to report on how tall the fire gets when they pour fuel on it."
Wow imagine insulting someone and invalidating all their traumatic experiences, using arguments based solely on unsubstantiated speculation, and then asking why they don't take your "criticism" seriously That's why I hate the community of critics and their fans. They insult them, invalidate their points and expect you to thank them and then you intend to take the credit for their improvement and for some reason they are immune to criticism, as if they themselves had no failures Good video by the way
@@doubleE24 maybe we are fed up of people saying we should give up or that they are no good because we know, we know we aren't good but that doesn't mean we don't want to improve it takes time especially for art, this is not like programming or gaming where everyone has similar or the same goals, art has different levels of mastery and we don't know were we will end up. Then someone we have never heard of and was never interested in anything we were doing telling us we are wrong and we should do it there way because it's 'better' im afraid there not because it's not what we want it's what they want. Anyway it 4:52 feel free to pick apart everything i said and hiw i should improve.
Honestly. His art is pretty bad.I love how jayden’s and James’s and rebbeca’s art styles look because their simple and easy to communicate with. Their eyes and faces are simple so you can relate more with them. And simpler character designs make it so you can immerse yourself more with the stories. This dude just feels like a huge narcissist and he should get a life and stop wasting it being a terrible person. You only get one life. Why would you use it to make other people’s only chance at it miserable?
They think artists should thank them for telling them they don’t like their art. There’s nothing useful in that statement and even then maybe they want you to change so much it’s not worth it. Imagine you have 5 million people who love your art, and your videos, and then there five who want you to change. You’re not gonna cater to the five, your main audience likes the old stuff.
"you're 12, therefore your struggles are invalid, and YOU should listen to and do whatever i say, because I'm an adult and you're a child! and children cant be more mature than some adults because I'm too stupid to consider the fact that some adults are fucking retards because maybe if i weren't such a dimwit i would've known! and I'm sOoOOoOo narcissistic that i think you should look up to me despite me being a fucking terrible person! I'm an adult, so therefore I'm modifier of all earth , reality, and logic! man up, kid! im too airheaded to consider that you're human too!'
I come back to this video 4 years later and I must say this: thank you so much for making this. I was in my early teen stages when I first watched this (and when I first found the "animation critics" channels) and this had genuinely opened my mind. Hearing those same people now makes me realize how pathetic some of them sound, with their attitude and all that superiority complex... But younger me used to look at them and think they were right because of that attitude. Gross. Hearing someone calling that out helped SO MUCH Again, thank you so much for this
I write fanfiction as a hobby. It's a labor of love, and I genuinely try to improve my writing overtime and surround myself with other writers so we can encourage and challenge each other. But if a bunch of writers I didn't know suddenly dogpiled on me with their followers, obsessed over the semantics of what counted as "real writing", insulted both my creativity and my character, and gave unwanted writing advice without trying to understand my style or intentions, all under the veil of "it's just constructive criticism!", I'd feel pretty discouraged from ever sharing my writing ever again. It would seem like their actual intention was to make me go away.
For reall!!! As an illustrator id be devestated. These forms of art are expression of oneself, handling it with such disrespect and disregard any emotions tied to it is fucked up.
The fact that The Right Opinion said that Turkey Tom's history won't affect his career aged like milk after the whole Pyrocynical thing. People brought up his untruthful history and now he's officially one of the jerks of RUclips like Antoons.
@E . A Read what I wrote. I said that it says a lot about YT when they only turned on Tom after falsely accusing le funni meme YTer of something. Not him being a borderline Nazi who's attacked smaller channels
I like how they argue that they don't have good animation, while at the same time they're "animation" is someone else's drawing being dragged around in photoshop for 30 minutes.
But don't you see? They're allowed to have shit art, because they're "rebels" who "make their art intentionally lazy to mimic the RUclipsr they're criticizing", you wouldn't understand it man.
@@asmolpieceofapplepie8465 Modern art actually has effort behind it, lazy RUclips critics don't put effort into their content because they don't need to. Leafy made his views bullying little kids with CSGO footage, it doesn't take much effort to be a RUclips critic.
Anett Oja well I would like to argue that the thing that made storytime animator popular is the commentary and dialogue, not the merits of the animation. For story time animators to use a drawn format to present their stories is to allow for visual communication. Not many people like to just sit and listen, and the stories they tell would be much less interesting with visuals.
Breaking news: local critic believes that temper regulates vocal cords. In all seriousness, I can be the most over-the-top loud dumbass around close friends and family members, but I can’t answer the phone if I don’t recognize the number. My dude doesn’t seem to understand that fucking around in front of a mic and actually interacting with people are different things
"If you can't do full animation yourself, you can just... pay someone to do it for you" has the same energy as "let them eat cake" for me. Like, gee, I bet these people would *love* to pay for supporting artists/animators for their personal projects, I would too. But we only got so much money, and the notion that this is just a simple fix is pretty laughable to me.
it's kinda funny how some of these "critics" can't take criticism themselves, and claim that anyone who dissagrees with them are "snowflakes". People do not have to take your criticism, you're not that special, and it's not like they are comitting a crime by not animating the way you want them to
Bruh when Daftpina said that Jaiden fakes anorexia and Daidus is only a tracer that doesn’t cred the artists when he only traces famous memes, it made me so disgusted about him.
I used to watch DaftPina until I discovered that he accused Jaiden Animations of faking her mental illnesses. I know he apologized but that was extremely messed up to say. And as someone who struggles with mental illness as well. I find that extremely disgusting
@@thetweefirebug Honestly, it just goes to show the type of person he is. Which is really rich considering he and the rest of his community are trying really hard to make it seem like the story time animators are the evil ones. I've never seen the animators do ANYTHING like that. It's disgusting.
@@seanking520 1: I was merely sharing my opinion that it was an asshole thing to do. 2: I know people lie, everyone has at some point. 3: What's with the random bulk letters? Edit: oh, and I forgot this one 4: Back at you
I know this isn't even a point in the video but that passing part of where one dude tried to prove that Spechie was lying because "she said her highschool was bad but this person said it wasn't" is such bull believe it or not people have different feelings and experiences in school and such hold different perspectives on such. Them trying to invalidate spechie's feelings about school is just so annoying
The lengths that petty, talentless dweebs on the internet will go to, to rag on those more successful and ambitious than they are is truly astounding. Idk how you can build a platform on putting nothing into the world creatively but telling creatives they suck cause you have a God complex lmao
The notion that someone could experience the same thing as me but have different feelings about it is existentially terrifying, please stop. Only my perspective is valid.
"I either said things that are true or because she doesn't want to break character for her subscribers and fans" Or she doesn't have to because you criticized her _mental health struggles,_ which is disgusting
A lot of these guys are complete narcissists doing this for the attention. In which case, they best pray to every known god from HISTORY their future employers have never watched them, 'cause said gods KNOW they can't do this RUclips-gig forever. Then again, they'd more likely than not pin the blame on Tiny Tim than take responsibility for their own actions, sooooooo...
or because you're nobody. you're not relevant and you're trying to insert yourself into a narrative you *don't exist in* and no one has to indulge that shit. go get your validation from your mom and therapist. like bro, these people have no idea wtf is actually a relevant argument and suffer from such massive bouts of protagonist syndrome it's just sad. i'd feel bad for them if they weren't shitting on other people's mental health.
I've got to say, this is one of my favorite videos on the whole site. Criticism is rarely criticized at all, and you manage to do it without falling into the same traps a lot of RUclips critics do (cruelty in place of jokes/critique, failing to differentiate between lack of skill and poor ethics, etc.). This video manages to be very informative without being inflammatory. Excellent work.
"You need to recognise that people you find annoying can have real problems, too." That's something that I could've told my younger self, Quinn. You put together a masterpiece with many important messages. Thank you.
18:36 Rebecca Perham, known for her channel Let Me Explain Studios, does not do lip syncing. In fact, her characters don't even have any mouths. In a Q&A video, she addresses that this was an intentional choice for two reasons. 1) She liked the appeal of it considering she liked characters like Gromit and Bill Cipher, and 2) because not drawing a mouth allowed her to focus more on her drawings to create better exaggerations and even smoother animations at certain points.
Rebecca have probably the smoothest animation in all of the community, that is exactly what all the critics wanted. Yet, they still think is not good? It doesn't add up
Yeah, I feel like “it’s a style choice” is actually valid reasoning, especially when the person being criticized has shown that they can do the thing that they’re being criticized for. Rebecca’s older videos show that she can animate mouths , the fact that her newer ones lack mouths demonstrate that it’s a style choice
@@mimsilvernote and it’s not like she’s not aware of it...some of her newest videos had her making jokes about how her characters don’t have mouths. Heck there’s a joke she did where she had to take about the time she broke her teeth, and she intentionally put stick-it notes with drawings of mouth because “how can I talk about a mouth accident if I don’t have a mouth?”
Creative professional here, stumbling across this randomly through the magic of algorithms... Yeah... I know these folks. Not these /specific/ people (I know nothing about this particular youtube subgenre or the folks involved) but 'critics' who have /none/ of the attributes related to actual, useful, relevant criticism... like having any of the related skill/knowledge/background/etc. I've literally paid people to perform that service because it's a useful service... people who actually knew what they're talking about and knows how to present information usefully. These folks... they're not critics, they're ranters. Trolls. All kinds of sub-types, but in all cases listening to them (at least beyond the level of being aware of doxxing type insanity) is a trap. Don't feed the trolls, but also don't let them feed you...
Oh my goodness I came across these channels a few years ago and it infuriated me to no end. As someone who studied art and animation in university this kind of criticism would not hold in an academic setting, and yet they act like they’re the end all be all of ‘critique’. Makes my blood boil. Thanks for the video!
There's a lot of people who believe themselves holder's of truth. THEIR truth is the truest truth. If you ignore them, you're a blind sheep. But, despite your willing ignorance, he tried his best to save you, but you were just too far gone.
Seaweed Senpai I think a lot of them can but if the critics suck where is the criticism and I don’t just mean animation critics I mean people like jelloapocalypse or dunkey who have one way of thinking about things and that’s it you aren’t allowed to disagree
Imagine having people say to quit because “You’re drawing is dumb,” and you don’t know how to animate. Don’t listen, that’s just bullying, you start out like terrible but that’s okay, you just get better, and if you listen to criticism like that, it’s basically like being called a loser
no baby is born to know everything and do everything 100% on first try with whatever experience they do, that includes artists! as long as the artist is having fun and no one is hurt, it shouldnt be a big deal :)
I agree. I've had people pick on me because of how I draw back in the day. It lowered my self esteem. Nobody is gonna get drawing and animation right off the bat. It takes a lot of work.
Criticism is fine. People have opinions but some people aren’t doing something. Being constructive. You should tell them about the goods of the channel but also lightly tell them how they could improve, not tell them they’re bad at this straight away.
They say that TimTom was a guy who just copied Odd1sout because he was popular, and got popular after it. Bro, they were friends back when Tim had 15 subs, and James endorsed his channel because of them being friends and because of James enjoying his content, That's how he got the kickstart, in NO way did TimTom get big because he followed a trend.
Y'know DOMICS and SWOOZIE? The main two who practically freakin' *INVENTED* RUclips ANIMATION?! People say their both TheOdd1sOut copies. Hell, people are called copies of James who've been doing their same animation for almost FIVE YEARS before he even made his first RUclips video.
@@pollall2793 Yes that's true, but you can't be a COPY of someone who did the same thing AFTER you: If I got a green apple, and you saw me with it, and you got a green apple, did I copy you?
Cartoon Master Not the same thing, it’s like someone getting a green apple, than I get a mango, than everyone else decided they also want mangos, true Domics sort of started the trend, but Odd popularized it.
1:11:06 that quote made me cry, its exactly what im going thru as an artist. My perfectionism makes me feel like im never good enough, so i get frustrated and exhausted easily when i draw. The guilt i feel for not pursuing my passion as much as i used to is overwhelming, and im rll scared i wont be able to overcome this struggle, which sucks cause i love creating art with all my heart and i couldnt imagine my life not doing it.
Can't believe DaftPina ran out of things to criticize Jayden for so he complained she put an award on the carpet to record. Talk about grasping at straws.
@@mrpip1179 that's a shit save mate You messed up on your spelling and tried to play it off as a joke. Go back to simping on Daftpina man And clearly my grammar is better than yours so... 10 points bud.
@@mrpip1179 That's bullshit. It was just a spelling mistake, and within the context, looks nothing like a joke. So you can stop saying shit about that because nobody here believes you. 30 points, dickwad.
@Kendale Allen I don't know if you are serious about the crumpet thing because I don't see Mr.pip comments (either because someone or he deleted them or I just don't see them) and I feel I need his comments to see if you were being sarcastic However, crumpets are the best fucking snack foods I have tasted in my life and you not knowing about them is a sin
I don't think any of these critics are right when they say these RUclipsrs haven't evolved. Sure, their core art styles may not have changed or evolved all that much, but their content has. Jaiden started making videos when she was going through a really dark place in her life, and during her channel's growth, she overcame that. She went through therapy to help her eating disorder and has worked a lot on her self image. Looking at her content now, all of this is completely evident, even in the way she speaks. James has also gone through an evolution. With each passing year, he showed more personality in each video, going from somewhat timid videos with occasional jokes to entire, off the cuff movie reviews of The Dark Crystal and it's intellectual properties.
jaiden also did an ENTIRE livestream, mostly her face! shes come a long way! i know this doesnt change her view and you probably dont care, but im proud of her!
@@Network-yp8de bruh I get that a significant amount of people on the internet default to "fuck off", but you made a positive contribution to a positive discussion, so I have no idea why you thought a genuinely nice and productive response to a discussion would be met with "fuck off" lmao
The weird thing is people make whole channels about reading reddit stories. People clearly like to hear stories from other people even if they are exaggerated or even made up. I watch "story time" videos for the stories and the addition of amusing pictures that go with them only adds to it. I never really cared about these animation community critics because the flaws they pointed out were not things I honestly paid attention to. I just like to hear other people's expediences. One of my favorite channels right now looks like it was done in MS paint and the stories are clearly overly exaggerated but it's funny as hell. I'd argue it would take away from the humor if they were better drawn. I was tempted to try my hand at animation or a even story time style but this whole thing turned me off of it.
This bad faith critique that they do, where they very obviously incite harassment of someone they don't like, then feign innocence by claiming that it's "just constructive criticism," is exactly what is happening to the Minecraft RUclipsr Jellybean. If you don't like her content, don't watch it. What the rant community is doing to this Jellybean kid is unacceptable. And if you point out that what they're doing to her is borderline cyberbullying, they'll just laugh and say "I'm just giving my opinion." Seeing what's been happening to her makes me sick.
I don't know if turkey tom really grew up tbh I think he's kinda trying to be like leafy tbh.i do appreciate him calling out people like pedos and zoophilia Wich is good.just don't really enjoy him as a person and his fanbase
I think LSD Mark and Chicken Chad talked about this, with the argument being that they don't say they are animators. Okay, fair, but if we take it a step further they're essentially just saying that their own critique isn't really relevant and is just a semantics battle. The difference between an animatic and an animation isn't an argument or critique worth paying attention to. I wonder why they even bring it up, it's such a nitpicky thing to do
Not to mention - a LOT of these critiquers are amateur artists themselves, or NOT ARTISTS AT ALL in some cases. But they feel the need to still google like 3 "how to animation" wikihows and then criticize people for not following every single possible animation rule
Because it’s not “criticism” It’s pure hate, just like you said You can’t just say “ur content is bad u fake disorder arent i great” that’s hate. Criticism is c o n s t r u c t I v e
I was always angry about TRO because of one thing: Prior bias in his videos. What I mean by this is how he frames James/Odds1Out as a villain, shoving words he never intended down his throat to show he wasn't being a good person. When in his review of YandereDev and YandereSimulator, he has the gall to take a neutral stance to the piece of garbage who already had so many videos on him showing he was a horrible human being
"Their animation is lazy" "I don't feel like doing work so here's money, draw some pictures for my youtube videos about how lazy youtube animators are" The irony of this is only outweighed by the laziness of the critic community.
@@thomas2390 still stupid. Even if a professional athlete came last in the Olympics. it would still be stupid to call them unathletic while you lay on your couch with a triple chin.
"But they apologised after insulting people" bleat their fans. Yeah, and then they KEPT INSULTING PEOPLE An apology is meaningless unless you actually try to change. Whether they actually meant the apologies (and I see not a shred of evidence they did) is besides the point.
@Pisisixef 1. If they are so utterly talentless that they need to resort to weak insults in the hopes of getting fingertips on being entertaining, then maybe they should think about whether or not they should be on RUclips. 2. So they want to be entertaining. Fine. So what? The comment you're replying to was about whether their apologies were genuine. Congratulations on your complete non sequitur. Tl:Dr - you have revealed both yourself and the shitstains you are defending for the complete and total failures that they are. Have a nice day.
@Pisisixef 'mhm contradicted yourself huh' Nope. When did I say I was trying to entertain anybody? I'm also not a content creator on RUclips. Keep trying sweetheart.
"These people should feel bad that they got more popular with less effort, exploiting the algorithm!" Maybe the problem is with the algorithm and not the people then??
@MR Shedan I think he's saying, just because you have the opportunity to exploit something, doesn't mean you should. As in this case, he states it would be morally wrong.
![Jack Harlow - Hello Miss Johnson [Official Music Video]](http://i.ytimg.com/vi/Q86_nlRoIGw/mqdefault.jpg)
🍐 I would highly recommend DaftPina’s video he made with the animator Tim Tom. They discuss his past bad behavior, his apologies to people, as well as the review he made of Tim Tom's channel: ruclips.net/video/R1TMtdGsCoc/видео.html
🍐 I don't want to pressure you to forgive or trust the critics I criticized. I just want you to know that the people featured in this video are not frozen in time. Some of them are changing their content or have quit doing commentary on people. A couple have quit RUclips altogether.
🍐 While we will see these arguments again from new people, hopefully we'll all become better critics as time goes on. 🤞
Update: 10/11/2019
I just wish we didn't have to be in this entire situation at all :(
Rus )
I'm pretty sure I can describe that feeling with poetry..
Why does that sound familiar...
Anyways, *"The Soul would have no rainbow, if the eyes no tears."*
Very true, one should not forget that people, even bad critics, can and do change their opinions, and can get better, the comunity shouldn´t copy their bad behaviours and bury them in hate, they can get better, they are humans too, as are the animators and rest of, well, youtubers
Are you still planning on uploading.
Don't wanna pressure you just wanting to know.
@@niklaskraus1030 Of course, I just don't upload often, but I'm not gone forever.
"You need to accept that people you find annoying can have real problems."
I usually assume the people who annoy me have problems... Probably not the right tone for me to take in this context, yeah? Ah well - it's true.
@@futurestoryteller as people, we all have problems and in one way or another, we may annoy somebody ourselves either intentionally or unintentionally. So I second your statement.
the 300 like is me and, ummmmmmmmmm.......lets-lets just end the comment here ok? ok
@ElephantsLover the video is over an hour long it's not hard to assume someone missed it
NububuChan I made ur like count 690. You’re welcome
The “what would her professor think” line really grinds my gears. As someone who actually went to college for animation the need to observe trends and be willing to change as the market and taste does was a HUGE part of what my instructors taught us, you have to adapt or you die. Also funny how they go into the history of animation but omit that in the earliest days animation was highly detailed but took a very long time and that’s what lead to characters like Micky Mouse and the “rubber hose” style of animation. They were designs built on simple shapes so any animator could draw them and it would cut time to produce shorts. The same thing that you see in RUclips story times. When your taught by people whom art is their job you learn you can communicate a great deal with very little, and you need to know where to focus your time and effort because they are finite resources.
I like Rebbeca's oldstyle so it didn't grind my gear it just bugs me to this day by the fact that she changed her style
Honestly to me the really bad part is right before that when the dude accused her of changing style to match other youtubers which is patently false. Dudes basically saying that cause other people have a similar style that hers is invalid.
"i dont like her style of animation so therefore its bad. I am authority right?? because i have a critic youtube channel?? Im obviously superior. I'm on the same level as her art professor probably, he'd hate this too." its so self entitled and rude. everyone working on animation storytime videos does a great job because at the end they made something. these guys just think they're hot shit by using the same format but being mean to people about it.
@@thepretzalspicer5831 Yeah it happens. :(
What's more is that there's a good chance her professor would love her animation style, considering that in a video Rebecca made, she stated that her main inspiration for the whole no mouths aspect of her animation was because of her professors love of characters like Gromit from Wallace and Gromit. Theidea of a character with no mouth having to use their brow to show expression and personality. That whole "what would her professor think"question clearly shows that they don't pay attention or look deeper into things. Even possibly just bandwagoning on the idea that the animation community is bad.
"If you yell you're not an introvert."
I had a stroke
who said that?
*Me screaming in the distant*
@John Doe Eh, that was his content before. I think he has improved. His content is good
I'm an introvert, and I have bad (like REALLY bad) voice/volume control, hearing and anger management/emotional stability, I can be happy as a hazel but I can become annoyed, irritated, absolutely pissed off the next, then I'm back to normal in just a few moments and sometimes instead of getting pissy I start to instantly cry. Fyi, I am physically incapable of crying on command, I genuinely thought I was incapable of crying for a time because I didn't cry for three years straight. During those years my response to negative situations were that I either shut down, got angry or just sad without tears.
And, just for clarification, I doubt it's bipolar, I've gotten diagnosed and they said it was just depression and me being impulsive all the way down both in actions and emotions.
He actually responded to that an explained he was wrong in a follow up video
What these critics don't realise, is that people actually LIKE hearing other's relatable life stories. It can actually, I don't know, make you feel that you're not alone? Make you laugh because you relate? Nah, that's not how people work!
They focus more on the animation rather than the stories, We don't care if it runs 5 frames per pose as long as they tell interesting stories
Exactly, if these stories are so "boring" - why is it that not everyone wants to hear about celebrity stories 24/7
I think these critic's audience kinda like making mountains out of mole hills and calling people phony (at length).
It's just kinda lame that they pick targets who can be kind of vulnerable. It would seem a lot less mean spirited if they focused their cynicism on some more lofty and untouchable targets (celebrities, writers abd artists with successful careers in the industry and so forth) rather than DIY youtube channels that live and die by the same algorithms as everybody else.
It doesn't work for me, but I know It does work for others
“They were all blending together into the same scowling brunette.” *I’m crying why is that so accurate*
levi doneson May you reiterate that please?
Levi Doneson that they’re scowling brunettes?
Haha, jk, anyways stereotypes feel accurate, even when they’re not, because we like patterns. In this case, we agree with them because they feel accurate if we see enough of them, even if they’re not actually that accurate.
One thing that stuck out to me was around the 19 minute mark, on genres.
I've been an animator since 2012, and one thing I've always said was that storytime animations aren't the same as the animations I do. Like you said, they're a different genre, one that I've never really felt like I competed with. I've had peers who have had hostile feelings to storytime animators and I've never understood them, beyond them being more mad at RUclips's changes and that anger being taken out on the new genres.
The only thing that ever has bugged me on the topic is when ST animators are credited for 'saving' animation on youtube--which, that isn't their fault at all, such claims always comes from fans, and isn't really true. Original story-driven animation is still a huge amount of effort to get off the ground and isn't friendly with the algorithm by its design. But again, storytimes are (or were) something new, accessible, and adaptive, and that's still an accomplishment.
And even then, Storytime animators are still at least helping to cultivate that part of the ecosystem. And I think the existence of ST Animators is largely a positive impact--animation might not be 'saved,' but its decline has slowed a bit.
Overall, the concept of 'critiquing critiques' and refining critique to get it across better is a topic that I've talked about myself and care a lot about (especially the concept of "who is this critique for? the artist in question, or for your audience?") I haven't finished watching the vid but it's been great so far.
Didn't expect to see you here!
If nothing else, ST gives potential Animators a playground to learn the visual aspect of the field before adding the original story part.
@DooDoo_Burd /Illustrator :0
I agree it does seem like the original animators and their fans hate them because of the algorithm , but STAs are harmless youtubers ,They aren’t doing anything wrong
Hey zedrin
Damn that was perceptive. Normally I don't like psycho-analysing but i'm pretty sure you nailed that.
Points for encouraging the ones who decided to walk it back too. As, yknow, opposed to rubbing it in their face.
I was just coming back to find one of the comment chains I was involved in on this video didn’t expect to se you, I love your content
I love paycho-analyzing so much, but only if the other person doesn't mind!
Ma I found a dinosaur
:)
Oh hey!!
"If you yell you aren't an introvert" wow my social ainxiety just miraculously disappeared because i was loud
I’m loud around my boyfriend but quiet in public. I’m an introvert and also have social anxiety. I’m also opinionated online. Introversion is not a “shy” stereotype!
Ikr? I'm a loud person but I'm still incredibly introverted.
@@matt6157 i’m just talking about my personal situation where my introversion is a product of my social anxiety. sorry if it came off wrong!
Social anxiety dont make you introverted either
@@atanaZion read my reply right above yours, it explains what i meant
I find the funniest part about RUclips "critics" is that surprisingly most of them cant take the type of criticism they dole out on a daily basis. Really makes you think huh.
@shoobagoo Exactly! They're like that talking scale from the Garfield comics!
THE DOGE.
Their pussies is what they are; hiding behind screens while they insult others who don’t need criticism and only give or give more anxiety
I'd probably be unable to take criticism if someone was bashing something I loved doing and earned me money. Or maybe I'd be a saint and ignore it all. Not sure, never had the problems these guys do. And I suppose that's my point: You can't take the morale high ground if you can't even reach it in the first place, or been at the high ground and seen the negative comments batter away like artillery.
It's more of a no-duh, they don't exactly come off as a stable character.
I don't get why they were so pissed that odd1sout wouldn't follow Turkey Tom back, people are allowed to choose who they associate with?
I wouldn't wanna asccosiate with someone who tried accusing someone of pedophilia with a Google doc
I know, people can follow you all they want, but when it comes down to you it should only be you who decides who you want to associate online with. I absolutely hate the “I’m following you now, so follow me back” comments. I have heard it far to many times and it makes me want to scream.
@Justine Yan Lok Cheung you must hate twomad
Your profile picture looks like it would taste like a saltine
Every time I read Turkey Tom I have to google to remind myself who he is. I've seen some of his videos but he's easily one of the most boring commentary RUclipsrs.
13:18 Dude I felt that. I make whole-ass animated music videos, and even _I've_ been told before that what I do isn't "real" animation. All because I _dare_ to sometimes use panning and tweening like the talentless hack that I am. For shame.
Seriously though, this is a great analysis and you really can't blame storytime animators for the hustle. They still work hard for what they do, and they're people like anyone else. Obviously there's nothing wrong with improving your craft and taking constructive criticism. But like you said, when it's someone's job and they've already got a system that works, there's really no reason to take certain criticisms to heart. _"I don't like your genre, change it"_ really hits the nail on the head.
Hopefully they do have a long and bountiful future ahead of them, though I'd be lying if I said I didn't wish the algorithm was more accommodating to other types of animation, too. :P Nothing lasts forever, and hopefully they don't have to deal with too much of this drama bullshit while the spark is still there.
ShadowLeggy your content looks like it’s good
but I gotta watch slime rancher
@@randomlittleidot 😆 I don't blame you! I didn't even think this comment would still be visible after all this time, but I appreciate it.
Uhh. But you don't do real animation tho? Like I'm not hating and I'm not saying that you don't have talent or good ideas cause you do from what I've seen and I'm not saying that what you do doesn't take hard work or take a long time or that you don't deserve the cred you have for your style of entertainment but even your most recent videos that have the best production you've had so far isn't "real" animation, like by definition what you do isn't truly animation and that's fine I don't get why people have to hate and talk shit just because "ugh this isn't real animation which means it sucks no matter what you're trying to convey or do with your artistic talent" I've always stayed away from people like that cause they'll just bring you down. I say just keep doing what you enjoy doing man and fuck the people that wanna hate on your creations just because they're losers who see someone else doing what they could be doing but they have no drive or ambition to do anything worth a damn in their lives cause they're pathetic little adult-children projecting how they feel about themselves onto someone who's actually going for what they wanna do. So just remember that anyone who talks shit like that for basically no reason at all is just some loser who wishes they could be doing what you're doing and they STILL CAN do it but they either don't believe in themselves enough or they know they have no real talent and nothing worth a damn to say or do so that makes them sad cause they see you doing it in a way thats easy and affective for you and see that even tho you're limited in your resources you're still putting out some quality content and they realize that you're better than them and that makes them angry and lash out instead of doing something about it like trying to make their own shit. Don't pay any kind to people like that man they're not worth even thinking about unless they're actually being CONSTRUCTIVELY criticizing and not just spewing idiotic nonsense out their mouths haha. Good luck to you and your future projects and I hope you can make a career out of it so that you too may escape the way the world/"people in charge" tells us as human beings how we're supposed to make it in this world and live as people as if they know what's best for an individual's spiritual and mental condition; being placed in this confusing and strange reality unwillingly and just trying to figure out what we're here for as an individual person is every man and woman's greatest trial in this existence. We're all lost and confused and only here for a very short time. But it's also the greatest triumph and mentally freeing state of every man and woman's life for those whom can figure that answer out for themselves and live their life in understanding and wisdom and able to feel as they once did when we were all children, internally content, happy and completely whole again as the human they were always meant to be. That's what we all strive for knowingly or unknowingly, to feel whole again as people is all we truly desire. To transcend the mortal coil we must be aware of these things and just do whatever you think will truly make you happy in life no matter what others may or may not say about us or our soul filled work and art, as long as your work and art are real to you and filled with your real artistic feelings and connections, then it's "real" art and something of value to this experience we call life. And I can tell that you're well on your way so no matter what, don't ever let any asshole's misunderstanding of what you're trying to do get in the way of your happiness or drive and ambition to create. You're already far more human than any of those kinds of people so never let them make you fall in any way. I love you sister human being. Stay creating, stay learning, stay evolving in any and every way, stay alive. And then you'll transcend everything, and exist forever in a way that's completely unperceivable to us in the life we live now. There is so much more, an infinite amount more that lies in wait for those of us who know these secrets to what life does and is and choose to live it in happiness and wholeness and peace in heart and mind. So very much more my friend.
Also yes. I know. I ramble, alot lmao 😂
@@Captain_Calcium Yeah, the rambling isn't an issue. The lack of formatting is. You just put 5 paragraphs worth of text in one big block with no pacing and no line breaks. I have well above a college reading level, and I found this difficult to read.
Next time, break your text up into sections with no more than about 7 or 8 sentences each if they're on the shorter side, and no more than 5 or 6 if they're longer.
"If I was 22 and my art looked like this, I would just quit." Have fun never earning new skills then. You don't start good at something, and you shouldn't stop gaining skills just because your completed a quarter of your life. lol, what a knob
if people judged and say if it looks awful than movies like the first spiderman (2002) and evil dead movies would be despised
He's clearly not talented or skilled in anything, he should just give up already. I would just quit if was him.
Right? Like you didn't have to out yourself as a lazy failure like that mr youtube critic
@@imanidiotforreplyingbut7465 There's no such thing as talent in art, it's all practice and creativity.
Exactly. You don’t start being good. Don’t expect to sound like Eddie Van Halen at the beginning.
I’m an INFJ too!!! :D
I’m currently at 31:38 but I’m diggin this video. I for one am new to RUclips, my rise happened too fast for me to know the ins and outs of everything, (heck I’ll find new crit channels and vids every now and then and my buddies will go ‘how have you not seen this??’) aaaand boy I hope me writing this comment doesn’t become part of someone’s crit video for one point or another when I say this. The inevitable crit video about any kind of channel, at least as I’ve seen it, doesn’t stir feelings of “oh hey, someone who understands ‘animation’ on youtube has some insightful and interesting points, I can’t wait to receive some true feedback from a deep diver instead of digging through my comment section for something besides ‘notice me senpai’.” Instead it stirs feelings of, oh I better make sure there isn’t a raid in my discord server following this, I know their intention isn’t wrong but their fan base can go forth any way they want, ah this means all the other crit channels are gonna parrot these same topics (as you’ve illustrated in your video) for the next month or so, everything I respond to will just fuel the fire and perhaps generate them a part 2 of crit, you’re damned if you do damned if you don’t respond, (edit, I am now at 58:21 and dang you hit the nail on the head here) and for me personally, I worry crit channels will bring up a personal aspect or opinion regarding my most popular content, a story about an emotionally and sexually abusive relationship. (But hey! It’s my fault for talking about it in the first place huh? Shouldn’t I be open to critique?)
That said, the reputation of crit channels isn’t lovely, and that’s what it comes down to. That’s not to say some are realizing lately where some things crossed the line (Daft taking down one of the Jaiden videos, talking to TimTom and squaring things away, focusing on actual targets deserving of takedowns like a frickin child predator, hell yeah to that!) but it still stands - the reputation is there, (edit again, whomp there it is 1:04:58) and I hope this is where videos like yours can hold up a mirror to these channels. Frankly, shouldn’t a channel who prides themself in constructive criticism appreciate a healthy dose of critique on their own content?
Yee, I'm a big fan of your videos so I lit up like a Christmas tree when I saw you had commented. lol So far they do seem receptive at least publicly. Daftpina actually tweeted out a link of my video on his twitter. My video was more meant to analyze the situation and not necessarily to teach them, but it does seem like they manged to draw something out of it independently and none of them have yelled at me or insulted me publicly for it.
I don't think they would ever use your personal trauma against you, I think even they know how that would look. I think it's only after they have a resentment of a RUclipsr that they feel comfortable saying they are only discussing traumatic life events for attention instead of expression or education.
Curio Omg! 🎄 Well I’m enjoying your content a ton so far, and I’m excited to see what else you plan on doing!
Hey that’s awesome he shared it! Ah yeah, sorry for my assumptions on the teachable moments here. Nevertheless, it’s a great video as you explained it at the end- good context for those watching everything, both the animation channels and critique channels. This provides a lot of context, and you gave credit where credit was due for sure :)
True there. The resentment is what gets me. Even if whatever critique is valid, there’s always some kind of personal qualm glaze over the critique turkey. Like, “okay it’s a little spicy there BUT ITS STILL GOOD,” and like... no. My journalism teacher in HS used the cockroach metaphor: it doesn’t matter how good the sandwich was if, right before the last bite, you’d just bitten into a cockroach that had infested the sandwich. I hope people start to see that in these flawed “reviews.”
TWO COMMENTS you deserve more
@@illymation I mean honestly it's clear that you clearly dislike the critics and act like their all bad
illymation I smell a collab 👀
Saying that every “bad” animator should just hire a team of animators for them is like saying that you can’t write music unless you’re classically trained. 99 percent of the most critically acclaimed modern day musicians don’t have the best “chops” but they can write a good ass song, and that’s all that matters.
This really doesn't make any sense at all. You like to draw, but you ain't 'good enough', which means you should hire people to draw for you. But then... what's the point?
@@DeathKitta exactly
@@DeathKitta ikr, the critic community is making me lose braincells. There's a thing called improvising, jesus....
Most modern day musicians use autotune
Michael Jackson didn't even know how to play an instrument, he bit boxed every tune he made
Spoctor even made a video like this called " "Critique" is Just Insulting People Now" and yeah I feel like the critics don't understand the difference between helpful and harmful.
Because these so called "critiques" are completely entitled to their opinion over something. It's not a fucking restaurant to need a critique over what they deliver for being considered good.
They're like you entitled estrict parent, makes fun and harass you all around, and then says that they're proud and take credit from your own self improvement.
I've seen critics that they understand how, even if it hurts, critique can actually help as long as you are open mind about it, and even I've seen one that recommend _and_ supported a small artist and even said that it wasn't necessary to them tl change a whole comic page over a critique, but if they feel like doing so, and if that helped, he's okay with it.
Sorry if i wrote too much.
Spoctor has changed, kinda.
@@jevilright4630 for good at least. He's cuter now i guess.
It's just an excuse to spiteful at their targets. These people don't care about helping people improve.
those types of channel are the evolved form of cyberbulling with a side of profit and attention that learned from the last generation of youtube mistakes as a way to project themselves as the truth seekers when it reality is way to bring down others
The things Daft said in his video on Jaiden's face reveal make me incredibly angry. Mostly because he is not a licensed therapist or phycologist and has absolutely no legal or ethical right to provide a diagnosis
And yet people still defend him in his comments...
Luminity For Life
He could have picked any. Other. Video. BUT HE CHOSE THAT ONE. I’m sorry but it’s so TERRIBLE
Y'Know..Bullying someone because they're "Introverted" Or they have had problems in their lives isn't really what I would call "Constructive Critique" but alright..
PartyPlayz Butch Hartman dislikes this coment
That's one of the most annoying parts. Once you actually step back and look at what these videos are, you realise how ridiculous it is to jump from "you should add smear frames" to "you probably faked your personality and personal history for views". You get whiplash seeing such weird flip flops from people who pride themselves on "objectivity".
I know right
When a ton of people just make "Oh i'm introverted" their personality it gets boring fast, and in my opinion, seems to be used to add a relatability sting to their channel, not saying that the people aren't introverted, but expanding on your personality other than "I'm introverted" is very refreshing, that's why I love that jaiden seems to be a lunch club regular now, she's expanded from just being awkward and introverted and now seems like a genuinely real person.
I wouldn’t say they beat them up and said it’s criticism I’d say that they beat them up and said and then said they were helping them figure what to do if they get beat up again
Also, Didn't Rebecca's professor actually email her to tell her how proud they were? I love LS Mark now but I'm sooooo glad he ate his words about that.
Crossing arms won't save him now
Power move.
@@TheSynthPunk which videos
@@backhander8710 I don't think she explicitly mentioned it in her videos, but she did tweet about it I think.
@@DunkleCobro ohhh ok thx
26:32 I found this one to be funny, because in one of Rebecca Videos she literally says that the reason she changed her art style was because her art professor always enjoyed Russel and Gromit, because she always found it fascinating how you could tell what a character was feeling/thinking without the need of a mouth.
That’s why she chose the art style, not because it was easier or to “fit in” but because it’s what her art professor would have Wanted. The irony is hilarious.
what is her channel's name? I'm trying to find more animation channels.
@@notafish7206 Let Me Explain Studios
@@notafish7206
The channels name is “Let me explain studios” I also recommend you check out the 12 steps of animation.
This is a bit off topic but is Russel what Wallace is called outside of the UK? If so, I learned something.
@@quendi5557 It’s definitely still Wallace and Gromit in America anyway
lets not forget daftpina tried to blame jaiden animation for having a community that made pornography of her character like??? she can't control who draws her why are you trying to blame her for creeps making porn of her persona what the hell is wrong with you. honestly after that video i kinda just stopped watching those guys because they seriously give me just bad vibes especially with how overtly vitriolic they can get with their "criticism".
maybe i'm reaching, but i feel like all these men who "criticized" her are kind of misogynistic? they're so insecure that a girl who's open abt her mental health and vulnerability are getting many subscriber and attention on the internet.
and now with this lewd fanart situation too. Blaming the victim and shit... idk maybe i'm just overthinking this
@@Mandombb honestly same a lot of blaming jaiden gave me some incel vibes ngl
Wait that happened?
@@Charadoesthatgaming im not really sure myself but if im correct daftpina made a video about jaiden animations rule 34 art (apparently he deleted the video but there's a reupload if you wanna watch) and then blamed jaiden for encouraging her community to make nsfw art of her even though she did not say anything about rule 34 in the first place to put it in a nutshell it's just daftpina harassing jaiden for no reason
I used to love daft pina, but after the “you should just quit” or the “if I was 22 and my art looked like that I would just quit” and the whole “jaiden faked the eating disorder for views” thing, it’s hard to view it as *constructive* criticism
He said that Footofaferret should change his titles and add in sources in the description. And that's good with me that Ryde the Ferret should change his titles and add in sources.
I like DaftPina, but I don't like his older videos.
Also his Fox Goodman video is beating a dead horse. It's so obvious that he is a clone so why should you even talk about it.
@@priestshrek3738 I wished that Mark could reupload his FGTeev and GG Video.
Citrus Friend i always wondered why i didn’t like the critic a lot and justified i didn’t like it because it was negative(which was weird because i don’t mind it) but know i realize it was just most of them being bully’s. i didn’t fucking realize that i knew they were dicks. i
These people remind me of the “can I speak to your manager” ladies that get mad when they’re prevented from abusing an employee.
Well, mine were usually men, but what I _always_ found amusing is how infrequently things escalated if you just took on the same tone they approach you with. Kind of like the conflicting narratives about dealing with bullies. Sure, if you punch back then it might just be a fight, but we have to acknowledge, it _is_ often just as likely - if not moreso, to end the bullying. Then again it depends on how they perceive you in relation to them.
Karen is that you?
I finally stole your house and Insurance Karen
You took my kids so I stole your house now it's mine
"Can I speak to your smear-frames?"
dead meme
Chang Siah Lim
That was 5 months ago...
Bruh this was so God damn GOOD. Not only was the commentary excellent... I think you may have convinced me to play slime rancher too hahahahaha
Subscribed, keen to see where you go from here!! If you have a discord account, would be up to chat as well B)
Thanks buddy, super encouraging. I joined your discord . 👍
@Durv • yes, it was 8 months ago, there were probably still some dinosaurs around back then cut them some slack
You are very Nintendo thank you for being a part of the RUclips community
@@QuinnCurio
This is a very well thought out and made video. The video play is a great and easy way to visually entertain while getting your message out(while the editing must have taken you forever)
@The AMaazing
Congratulations, you threw the line out to attract some female attention and on line company and it work! (this is rare). I am glad for you
I remember that in the past, i thought, that theodd1isout's animation is "lazy".
But then, I started working on animation by my own, and ohhhhhh boi.
I was a stupid child.
Lmao
Especially when you want to smoothen things up
Animation may look easy. But it's actually hard. And I don't even animate.
@@aliennot27 this is a mood lmao
True inhabe not animated but edited it is really hard so having to draw and edit just no just no
As an introvert I can personally explain why all of them are so good at making a cool personality:
These critics have simply underestimated our ability to plan out conversations that never happen!
what does you being introverted have to do with anything you said
@@hystericallover5989 Well see, it was a joke about how, as an introvert, I tend to have a lot of time on my hands to plan out possible interactions rather than actually engage in said interactions with other people.
Emphasis on the " *it was a joke* " part.
Juniper Rockhopper
i just reread your comment, now i understand
but it didnt sound like a joke
@@hystericallover5989 Ah, sorry about that. I did just ask a few people and they said it did but if you couldn't see it I'm willing to believe that they just said that cause they thought it was what I wanted to hear.
@@juniperrodley9843 tbh it was funny even i as an extro/intro plan out convos lmaoo
To put it simple, these “critics” is basically kicking you in the face, insult you, then telling you it just criticism
Not like a normal kick, like how gohan SPIN kicked cell from dbz kakorot
@@livesathome2475
Not all of them though
and then once your face heals, they expect to be thanked that you improved
And then they turn their entire community against you because you’re a crybaby that can’t take criticism because you blocked them on Twitter because you found them annoying
Oh so it's a spinoff of " iTs JuST a PrANk BrO."
I am very invested in art community, and I enjoy making art myself. And one thing that troubled me for a while is: why making videos on RUclips has to be a constant race for improvement? For me, growing as an artist is a wonderful thing, but it’s not a necessity. I don’t have to grow as an artist to enjoy the things I do for fun. FUN. Why do people HAVE to improve? Why do they HAVE to chase that improvement, instead of allowing it to come naturally? Story time RUclipsrs have lives of their own in real world. Sure, RUclips can be a cool side gig, rarely a source of actual income, but for many it’s just a hobby. It’s not a cutthroat industry, and I don’t understand people who treat it as such. Some person likes to draw and makes little animations? Cool. They shared it with people, and people liked it? Sweet.
Why do all these people approach those independent creators in the same manner you would approach a professionally trained director/animator/writer? Its ridiculous. And I hate the rhetoric that these people don’t deserve to be loved or appreciated because they are not professional enough or not good enough. I hate “critics” that shame people for their popularity. As if they don’t deserve to be famous. Like? Shut up? Someone made a silly cartoon and told an engaging story, posted it on a platform accessible to millions of people, and those people just happened to see the work and like it. Where’s the sin? Where’s the crime? Why not just be happy that some kids with a complex, time-consuming hobby are having fun? Since when is the support of many that infuriating?
I feel that the root of all evil is this ridiculous expectation put on literal amateurs to be ever-evolving art machines who have to prove their worth before receiving any sort of credit. I hate this attitude, I despise this abysmal pressure that is being put on people who are not even trying to pursue a professional career. They. Are. Just. Having. Fun.
Thank you for coming to my TED talk, oof, this was in my mind forever
That's a good wisdom.
Tldnr
I was thinking of something along the lines of this. I was just waiting for someone to put it in words.
I agree! I legit enjoy watching art videos and I enjoy it even more when the artist is having fun! it sucks society now thinks being a bunch of miserable cows is way better than being chilled and having fun, being happy... I think not! enjoy yourselves, Jaiden, James and every artist of any kind out there, as long as it isnt hurting anybody, it's all good! :)
I 100% stan your TED talk.
Nowadays Jaiden Animations has basically fully animated and lip synced videos with a team making them and if the critics wanted to they could be like “see! She gave in to criticism and we were right all along!” When she had been increasing fully animated segments slowly for a long time and being a big channel that brings in tons of views can actually afford to do this stuff.
They are just DESPERATE to claim responsibility for the changes like the snowflakes they are.
"This is like shouting false gods at a mall santa" was such a perfect way to describe the cognitive dissonance these people seem to have. I used to watch a lot of daftpina and their video on Jaiden literally made me stop in the middle and unsubscribe. I think it was around where he mentioned that it was exploitative that her video was so long when his was thirty fucking minutes long. The fact that these people are such leeches yet act holier than though is the worst part.
anime.
why do people write such long sentences and paragraphs in videos similar to this?
Channels you've subscribed to mostly because they have much to say on the topic. If you don’t feel the same, hey, that’s fine, but the point of most of the stacks of words normally are to prove their point.
@@ohno3730 it is 4 normal length sentences....
@@imevil974 Be gentle, his brains a bit smooth
I didn't even realize there was so much drama behind animation channels wtf i thought it was just wholesome fun
When something wholesome comes the anti wholesome you know the party poopers
@@NoName-st2jl Couldn't have said it better myself
@@NoName-st2jl this is so right it hurts
Welcome to the nasty side of the internet. It's best to ignore it where possible.
Nothing is just that
Oh god, that DaftPina thing where he tries to diagnose Jaiden for a different mental illness than the one she says she has is the slimiest thing I’ve seen a youtuber do on camera
Ugh
What else can be expected from a guy who sits on a throne with the same energy as the Queen of Hearts?
Royal Nugget a mistake is when you makes like a factual error or slur your speech or some shit, not deliberately making a video attempting to call out someone’s mental health diagnoses like an internet psychologist with PhD in being a little bitch
I think it’s funny you’re calling me a simp tho seeing as you love the DaftPina dude enough to come in and try and defend his slime ass, he’s not going to fuck you dude so you should save your energy
Royal Nugget initially I wasn’t even commenting on whether or not he had apologised or been forgiven or even what kind of person he is, I don’t know the guy and I don’t care
I’m just amazed/disgusted at his actions and how he filmed, edited and posted a video like that without reconsidering what he was doing
So no, I wouldn’t care if the Pope personally forgave him at the Vatican for his actions, I’m still dumbfounded over how he thought they were okay in the first place
Royal Nugget I’m not annoyed, I’d be annoyed if everyone didn’t already point out how shitty it was but that’s not the case.
I’m disgusted and bewildered over how someone thought that was an okay thing to do in the first place, it’s like wow someone was actually that much of a dick online what the fuck
DaftPina apologized for it and is making much better videos now, i really enjoyed the "tracer" video
I agree wholeheartedly with this video. Speaking more on Daftpina being "calm" in his videos, I hate the notion that as soon as someone who cares about a topic gets emotional, they are suddenly inadequate or weak, and the points that they are making are automatically irrelevant. I am someone who cries when I get angry, it sucks, but I can't help it. So when I'm arguing with someone about something I'm passionate about and my face starts to feel hot or I can feel my voice start to crack I hate it because I know that they are going to automatically dismiss what I'm about to say. Just being able to be deadpan doesn't mean that the person is right, it just means that they have a good poker face. They can still say cruel things or have bad takes, but as long as they say it in a collected way people will go crazy for it. I know multiple people like DaftPina, and what they all have in common is they like to think that their takes are edgy and different, when in reality they're just bullies wrapped in fancy packaging. They're mean as fuck, but if you take offense to any of what they're saying, you're just sensitive.
“These kids aren’t done yet. They need more time in the microwave”
No right that’s it I’m subbing.
I love how it's in the microwave and not an oven.
They can't even go in an oven it has to be a cheap microwave
HALF LIFE?
AHAH
GORDON.
@@drawnwithlove3499 the cheapest microwave
Just press the reheat button about 5 times and it’ll be warm enough
These are the kind of people that will go on a rant about how you have no skills in photography while you're showing your vacation photos to your family.
DAMN. YOU’RE NOT WRONG.
It's rare to see an IHE parody nowadays
F B i What are you even on about?
@@Gingersnaps_the_pumpkin_kitty Go for it.
Problem is, IHE is great cause it’s about movies and it comes off as less bullying and more just having a good laugh
Exaggerating personal events for comedic purposes....... Do these critics ever heard of stand up comedians, that been doing that stuff for decades
Also, hyperbole, it's part of poetry and literature
Also isn’t exaggeration the 10th principle of animation? I’m pretty sure Rebecca even pointed it out in one of her videos that she exaggerates her animation for comedic and dramatic effect
@the hevy I know, it still applies
Who hasn't exaggerated something to make it funnier? You don't have to be a comedian to want to make people laugh. Don't be a buzz kill kids.
Maybe they’re just practicing, as they seem to have gotten the clown part down.
"but I wear a hoody and she doesn't" lol that kid is either very wholesome or has an awesome sense of humor... Or maybe both.
Both, both is good.
Do you know who it is/was? That single clip made me interested in their channel
Timestamp, please?
@@Omnihilo I will FIND THEE TIMESTAMB
@@Omnihilo 25:53 I FOND IT
A youtuber once said this and i've never forgotten it, it was something a long the line of "people feel so entitled over their free content." I don't think that you shouldn't criticize because you're getting the thing for free, but when you put things in perspective they do sound a whole lot more... well entitled.
👏🏾👏🏾
👏🏻👏🏻
Sounds like something ADoseOfBuckley or Jim Sterling would say.
@@KTSpeedruns i think it was probably buckley, but i could be wrong.
She dragged them for a straight hour and eleven minutes. The read of the century.
And I wasn't bored for a second
i remember falling asleep to this video it was so calming lol
Still one of my favourite videos to rewatch.
Quendi555 i found this video a couple of days ago and I've rewatched it 3 times already. Her way of speaking and the points she presents are so well constructed. I also realised that she did the Ron Weasley video and I remember rewatching that video multiple times last, year, I had no idea she was the same person!
@@MrChannelforwatching I did the same thing when I first watched it.
Gosh this is the video I've DREAMED about making for months and months now, but never had the guts or steady tongue to do it. Thank you, thank you for making this video and putting so much time, thought, and care into your arguments. This seriously needs to make its rounds in the Bad Faith Criticism community, because it sheds a light on so many things that people take issue with but maybe couldn't put their finger on (or didn't want to for risk of being the subject of another one sided rant). Thank you.
You've dreamed about making these kinds of videos? Well I'm kind of sick of making videos on these topics so I could just script some videos and you can put them on your channel if you want cuz there's a lot more shit.
Smart Alec plus I've noticed these critics never target these types of videos, if they want to "reply" to the arguments against them they target ones by younger sounding, more hesitant people with less strongly communicated arguments and my God I would not want their community angrily on my front door
@@tomo4977 I've been trying to get the community at my front door, but I'm one of the few videos that they haven't responded to because I'm thourough as fuck and even predicted every kind of comment LS Mark would type to dismiss my video. But yeah their arguments suck and they make themselves look good by going after strawmen
Daft Pina is such a foul person, I’m genuinely disgusted. Accusing someone of faking a mental health issue and then telling her to get help for issues he diagnosed her with is just… nasty. Nasty beyond words. I know I’m using strong words but I truly think he embodies them, nasty, foul, and disgusting. And his “apology” only cements how I feel about him.
What?
Fr its horrible
Agree 100%. Nasty, Foul, and Disgusting is what he is. In fact, you're very generous with those decriptions. I could use much worse words for this guy off the top of my head.
Fuck daftpina
All my homies hate daftpina
I think the backlash he got from that helped him change his content for the better.
At least from of his more recent stuff, he seems to be moving away from his past style of presentation.
Am I saying that you should change your opinion on him? No.
If they just criticized their animation and stories, I'd be fine with them. But, the fact that these critics then go on to call these people annoying and belittle their personalities and problems when they have no right to is just downright mean. Then, when the animators don't listen to them because they, for a lack of a better term, bully them, the critics get angry. Well, no shit the animators weren't going to listen to you, you just called them annoying shams, why would they ever want to listen to you?
So if my friend is being a dickhead and I tell him "hey you're being a dickhead" i'm in the wrong?
Or if my friend is annoying me and I tell him "dude you're annoying me" i'm still in the wrong?
And yes the part of "Friend" may make it seem less severe cause we're friends but the point is, if someone is annoying, you should tell them it, or you're just letting them go around and annoy people, which only makes peoples opinion of that person worsen, now if you're going overboard like "DUDE YOU'RE SO FUCKING ANNOYING WILL YOU JUST LEAVE EVERYONE ALONE AND COME BACK WHEN YOU'VE FIXED YOUR PERSONALITY" then yeah you're in the wrong, but giving criticism on how someone acts is ok, it's justified when you want to help them act in a way that doesn't make people dislike them. Therapy for example, while not a good example for this specific situation, therapy is basically telling someone what's wrong with their personality and trying to help fix the issue.
@@uncleearl1886 How the hell did you ever get to "is it wrong to tell my dick friend that they're a dick?" Who said this? When? How does this relate to the initial point? No one's saying an animator can't be critiqued for being a legitimate prick. What's wrong is to belittle and pick apart their personalities so as to demean and insult them. Not when they're mean, not when they're causing problems. Just the bare and unneeded, "this is in fact your personality, and I don't like it. It's actually quite rude to tell random people you don't like aspects of their character at default.
@Foxglove Damn you’re getting ratioed hard
@FoxgloveLMFAOOO KID GO BACK TO SCHOOL
@@uncleearl1886 it's okay when you tell them in person and not make a dumb video where the person probably won't watch
Remember when Daft claimed Jaiden was faking her ED for attention? Yeah, me too.
Jesus christ, seriously??
I thought TurkeyTom was bad for calling Spechie fat and then acting like the victim when she blocked him.
That’s seriously fucked up.
I remember completely
Good thing is that he apologized and took it down
@@prettybigpengus 1:06:54
Then this will seriously piss you off. I know it pissed me off.
@@Source-Z-rer I just passed by it. Now I'm pissed off
@@prettybigpengushe also still didn't take down his video about jaiden's song which surprise surprise is the same as the face reveal video which is mentioned in the video
It’s so funny how James said the things you say will affect you, and then turkey tom got called out for being racist.
Karma: "I'm about to wreck this man's whole career"
@adsaa But they got Him back (Like what happened to James Gunn)
Hes not racist
Tnt Anawo b u t h e I s
adsaa “harmless edgy jokes” is not racism my dude.
I feel like Turkey Tom is the new Keemstar; a youtuber who almost everyone agrees is detestable and makes bad content, yet is inexplicably popular with an insular group of edgy teenagers. He's also always claiming that he's spreading "the truth" when it's usually just misinformation about people he doesn't like.
So Turkey Tom is the new member of the 'Cockroaches who can't be killed' youtube community.
@@NAME-yg8sl essentially, yeah. Every time his fanbase grows out of that phase, new members come in to replace them.
@VanillaSoft the worst of both worlds
Well he's friends with Nicholas De Orio, Another "Tough guy" it does make sense
Turkey tom is nothing, I've knew about RUclips critics like I HATE EVERYTHING, Nortalgia Critic or "The Right" Opinion, he's just a narcissist jerk who just a dozen of dorks with no self-love barely follow him.
And I don't say because I hate him, cause i barely know him, i say it because a toxic opinologist or critic, never goes as far as a talented artist, or musician, or any kind of talented people, but he gets as what he is, a jerk in front of every people who is a bit smarter than him.
Honestly, if I was Jaiden and if someone said that I was faking my disorder I talked about in a heartfelt video, I’d be literally crushed - catch me sobbing on the floor crushed.
Like what? What did she do to be villanized like that?
And that ladies gents and those in between is why gatekeeping is my biggest pet peeve!
Being too nice and spotlighted while a bunch of drama experts traumatized by the shitstorm that was 2016 are running around
She reminds them of the women who have rejected them
She was popular, that’s all
SS - 08PM - Sunny View MS (1439) *sarcasm*
Why are they bullying the new artists? Why? I feel so bad for them. Becoming an artist is hard enough and you are constantly questioning yourself and feeling bad about your skills as it is! LEAVE THEM ALONE
Deeeep inhale
Im fine. Im fine im fine im fine
You have the assassin's creed logo as your icon
@@Seft2_ And you have a pride logo on your pfp
@@Seft2_ And I like… Whatever this is
imagine insulting someone over whether or not they follow you on social media
like imagine having to go that low to insult someone
@@NeiasaurusCreations Imagine taking her words out of context
@@NeiasaurusCreations can ypu give me tje mark
@@NeiasaurusCreations _if you cant prove your argument then why are you arguing_
_at least have some basis on what you're saying_
Neiasaurus Creations That’s a straw mans Argument. Your argument has no foundation therefore it collapses. You give your so called “fact” without proofing it. How do you expect people to believe you if you have no proof? Or are you just responding people to start an argument? Go join a mock trail and debate club and learn how to debate someone. Because you look like a douche bag.
Neiasaurus Creations lol thanks for proving my point. You have no argument.
i dont understand why people are surprised that a lot of artists are introverted, like you said in the video, its a hobby that you do inside and by yourself. that sort of thing attracts people who dont like being around others. wild.
also, i think (with no scientific backing, just my own experience) that most people period are introverted. once in psychology class the teacher asked us if we thought we were in general/usually introverted or extroverted, and most raised their hand for "introverted".
i think the fact it's two words trick people into thinking the populace is split 50/50 between the categories; when in reality, it might maybe lean somewhere like 70/30.
then again, i live in sweden, so it may just be a nordic thing.
Jaiden's video about her ed is heartbreaking; it is so clearly honest and comes from a very painful place, I have no idea how someone could claim it seems disingenuous. It must have taken a lot of courage for her to make it and share such a personal pain and instead of people allowing it to be a catharsis and supporting her, they decide to accuse her of faking?? I can't anymore
It made me cry really hard, considering I had a friend who died from an ED, I literally was so mad when Daft said that Jaiden was faking it.
@@cupio-stardust ikr. They act like its impossible for people who are succesfull to have mental illnesses its fucked
@@feap0d It’s absolutely disgusting.
Yeah especially because I went through something like that, so when I see people doing stuff like this. It makes me sick on a personal level.
What's Ed. The only thing that comes to mind is Erectile Dysfunction but I'm certain that's not what you're referring to.
honestly telling somebody 'if i was 22 and was drawing like this,i would quit' is "CRITICISM" then bullies are critics now
Thomas Jefferson when I heard that after just watching a bunch of Chillys videos I was like “bish wah”
These asshats on RUclips just want attention. They don't care about the artist.
Dumb fucking logic. Stop.
@@KhayJayArt Says the Asshats seeking the attention
Wise words from Thomas Jefferson.
"their 'animation' is lazy" they say as their cartoon character moves in the same 3 positions
lets not forget their chracters for their channel just...dont have good character design- like ngl they remind me of the 2013 deviant art characters where the colors and everything are just eh-
@Poky if you’re not an animator wtf would you know about animation and what information would you be able to provide
@@thecheshire5762 animatic and animation are different so these people are animatics but lazier
Imagine comparing animators to commenters, then making an argument that animators animate better lol
Ok I do admit my point is a bit bad, but still the character designs are bad, and uninspired.
The most annoying thing to me is when they tell these artists to "just quit".
I abosultey hate that, it doesn't matter how old someone is or what thier art is, telling them to just give up and quit is gross.
Yeah, if someone quits - it should be on their own terms
Telling someone to quit is not how criticism work.
gosh this comment section is bringing back my faith in humanity after being exposed to all that "constructive criticism" thank goodness people are also upset about the complete lack of boundaries these people had
True, I'm so tired to see so much hate in peoples comment sections. I mean, there is some hate here, but it's directed at the right people.
EDIT: Btw I am not endorcing hate against anyone and every comment I've seen here so far just states facts or calmly discusses the subject. I was just trying to point out that this comment section isn't all happy. It's just so hard to explain things over the internet :( Final statement is I agree with you.
@@ailemasvegaholy shit you took the word right outta my mouth
"I know people who went to this school and they say it wasn't as bad as Speechie described it to be"
You mean different people can have different opinions on the same thing?
Well, shit, don't that just beat all?
"I don't know what the black dude was talking about, but I met some people who thought that KKK rally was a'ight."
That also ignores that some people get treated better then others let's face. Some people have teachers or students who they just don't get along with. There can be many reasons like being an introvert, autistic, race, religion, who your parents are or a bad first impression can get you singled out. Just because a few people had a decent time at a school doesn't mean your bad experience is invalid.
The only comment on this video that made me audibly laugh.
Your point is valid and correct. However in the interest of playing the other side, it could be possible that the point that is trying to be made, is that Speechie is being disingenuous and exaggerating how bad school was for him/her (don't know who Speechie, I came from TRO video)
@@peoplesoft2784You didn't really present the other side or oppose my argument, you literally just regurgitated his... I was going to say argument, but really it's nothing more than an assertion.
"she could be being disingenuous"
She could be, but where is the evidence for that? It sure as hell is not sufficient to talk about someone else's experience there because, and try to get your head around this, because it gets complicated, their experience will be different from speechie's because, again, try to keep up, they are not speechie.
On top of that, how do we know the people he spoke to aren't being disingenuous? How can we be sure that he's not being disingenuous and if these people even EXIST?
Do you see the issue with this way of thinking yet?
YOU could be being disingenuous.
I could be being disingenuous.
Anyone could always be disingenuous. Merely pointing out the possibility of someone being disingenuous is NOT an argument that they are. You need to actually present evidence.
"I came from a TRO video"
I have literally no idea why you told me that. I couldn't care less where you came from or who you watch. It's irrelevant to your... Again, argument is too strong a word...
"My art teacher had her favorites----and I wasn't one of them. But she never told anyone NOT TO DRAW."
---TheOdd1sOut, My Teachers
The amount of time they spend arguing that someone's content is terrible because they call their videos animations when, "iTs acTualLY AN AnImATIc" Is so stupid. Who gives a shit if they put animation or animatic in their damn title, it does. not. matter.
They clickbait plenty, too.
I mean it's not relevant right? The focus in which people watch these videos are the stories
most of the cooments go on about this too, just like, who cares?
Look. If all of these story time animators animated all of their videos as if they were a professional production meant to be released publicly in theatres/streaming sites. Then guess what? Theyd lose their minds. Animation is so hard. And I doubt any of these people who make these “criticisms” have EVER animated themselves. Because if they have they would NEVER make these complaints and whine. Their so pathetic I swear.
This video is kind of a breath of fresh air with many people trying to deliver their "criticism" thinking that they are actually "helping", (I'm talking more-so about Foster, omgitsjames, turkeytom, crizon). I'm not really going to type out a long ass paragraph of what I think about the video, because there are just way too many points to address. I think the video itself was pretty satisfactory, there might of been some mistakes (some things taken out of context, or a simple misunderstanding), but I really learned a lot from this video (Even though I'm not a critic). I think one of the main things to take away from this video is to criticize the critic. I've always had my suspicions about the various opinions of the critics of A.S.T (animated story teller/time) community, especially Daft. And in all honesty, you've explained those suspicions way better than I ever could. Soooo, yeah. Good job!
“I’m not going make a long paragraph”
@@orange7032 Would you like it longer? It could be.
@@moodyflowers8740 Yes :) I love reading
There are so many lines in this video that are just *chef's kiss*. Like saying these kids "need more time in the microwave" or the critics "get to report on how tall the fire gets when they pour fuel on it."
Peristeronic or yelling: "NO FALSE GODS!!!", at a mall santa.
Wow imagine insulting someone and invalidating all their traumatic experiences, using arguments based solely on unsubstantiated speculation, and then asking why they don't take your "criticism" seriously That's why I hate the community of critics and their fans. They insult them, invalidate their points and expect you to thank them and then you intend to take the credit for their improvement and for some reason they are immune to criticism, as if they themselves had no failures
Good video by the way
@@doubleE24 maybe we are fed up of people saying we should give up or that they are no good because we know, we know we aren't good but that doesn't mean we don't want to improve it takes time especially for art, this is not like programming or gaming where everyone has similar or the same goals, art has different levels of mastery and we don't know were we will end up. Then someone we have never heard of and was never interested in anything we were doing telling us we are wrong and we should do it there way because it's 'better' im afraid there not because it's not what we want it's what they want.
Anyway it 4:52 feel free to pick apart everything i said and hiw i should improve.
@@doubleE24 every fandom has them including these "critics"
@@ovenb5549 Exactly, it's no sides fault. All fandoms have their bad parts and there's no justification for it.
they just don't care about criticism, them, most likely.
and besides actual criticism on youtube will be met with death threats upsettingly
Oh no the windegoes, windigoose?🦄
“Her art is just bad, if I was 22 I would quit drawing” by that logic anything new you try has to be perfect forever
It is just such shit. We all would be nothing and do nothing if we all just quit when we couldn’t do things.
Honestly. His art is pretty bad.I love how jayden’s and James’s and rebbeca’s art styles look because their simple and easy to communicate with. Their eyes and faces are simple so you can relate more with them. And simpler character designs make it so you can immerse yourself more with the stories. This dude just feels like a huge narcissist and he should get a life and stop wasting it being a terrible person. You only get one life. Why would you use it to make other people’s only chance at it miserable?
By that logic he should quit trying to be a critic.
@@libertyprime3827 Oooooooooo, buuuuuuuuuuuurn! 🔥
“See i had to make a video about criticism before i got criticized because if i do it after everyone would call me a bitter blueberry”
A power move
*Outstanding move*
“I hate your art” is not critiscm not sensitive it’s just not critiscm tell me why it’s bad and then it’s a critic
An opinion isn't criticism.
@@andrewbaggins7093 yep that's true.
They think artists should thank them for telling them they don’t like their art. There’s nothing useful in that statement and even then maybe they want you to change so much it’s not worth it. Imagine you have 5 million people who love your art, and your videos, and then there five who want you to change. You’re not gonna cater to the five, your main audience likes the old stuff.
I hate your art
Now let’s give everyone a nice little lay out of what it should be
I don’t like ___ in your art because ____
Thank you,the statement "I hate your art" won't help you improve your art at all. All it will probably do is to make you feel bad about your art
"you're 13 and that's basically 14 which just takes 4 years to be 18 which isn't a lot of time so act like an adult"
"you're 12, therefore your struggles are invalid, and YOU should listen to and do whatever i say, because I'm an adult and you're a child! and children cant be more mature than some adults because I'm too stupid to consider the fact that some adults are fucking retards because maybe if i weren't such a dimwit i would've known! and I'm sOoOOoOo narcissistic that i think you should look up to me despite me being a fucking terrible person! I'm an adult, so therefore I'm modifier of all earth , reality, and logic! man up, kid! im too airheaded to consider that you're human too!'
@@benmemon looks like someone's salty
@@tysonevarard968 Bruh moment
@@atanaZion for sure
I come back to this video 4 years later and I must say this: thank you so much for making this. I was in my early teen stages when I first watched this (and when I first found the "animation critics" channels) and this had genuinely opened my mind. Hearing those same people now makes me realize how pathetic some of them sound, with their attitude and all that superiority complex... But younger me used to look at them and think they were right because of that attitude. Gross. Hearing someone calling that out helped SO MUCH
Again, thank you so much for this
It's so cool that you've changed your mind like this, truly admirable.
I write fanfiction as a hobby. It's a labor of love, and I genuinely try to improve my writing overtime and surround myself with other writers so we can encourage and challenge each other. But if a bunch of writers I didn't know suddenly dogpiled on me with their followers, obsessed over the semantics of what counted as "real writing", insulted both my creativity and my character, and gave unwanted writing advice without trying to understand my style or intentions, all under the veil of "it's just constructive criticism!", I'd feel pretty discouraged from ever sharing my writing ever again. It would seem like their actual intention was to make me go away.
For reall!!! As an illustrator id be devestated. These forms of art are expression of oneself, handling it with such disrespect and disregard any emotions tied to it is fucked up.
was thinking exactly this, specially being a hobby I started when I was a teen.
@@feap0d Yup.
"Being alive is a fad" - Quinn Curio 2018
Wait I have an actual joke
"It's not just a phase mum! I'm gonna live forever!"
Death is mainstream #money
It is. And honestly I'm over it sis, death come take me
“NO, DONT TAKE CARE OF YOURSELF! CATER TO ME, THE PERSON WHO HATES YOU!”
It’s sad because it’s true
God u put it perfectly
The fact that The Right Opinion said that Turkey Tom's history won't affect his career aged like milk after the whole Pyrocynical thing. People brought up his untruthful history and now he's officially one of the jerks of RUclips like Antoons.
I unsubbed to him after the whole D'angelo Wallace situation. So the whole pyrocynical thing just doubly confirmed my suspicions
Really age like milk
It's kinda sad that's it took and not calling people pedophiles or associating with Neo-Nazis
@E . A Read what I wrote. I said that it says a lot about YT when they only turned on Tom after falsely accusing le funni meme YTer of something. Not him being a borderline Nazi who's attacked smaller channels
@@ChangedMyNameFinally69 Mentioning the USS Liberty incident and a few edgy jokes about Jews being rich doesn't make you a Nazi.
I like how they argue that they don't have good animation, while at the same time they're "animation" is someone else's drawing being dragged around in photoshop for 30 minutes.
But don't you see? They're allowed to have shit art, because they're "rebels" who "make their art intentionally lazy to mimic the RUclipsr they're criticizing", you wouldn't understand it man.
Devon Molina Man you are right. its just like modern art. it’s not shit, you just don’t understand it.
@@asmolpieceofapplepie8465 Modern art actually has effort behind it, lazy RUclips critics don't put effort into their content because they don't need to. Leafy made his views bullying little kids with CSGO footage, it doesn't take much effort to be a RUclips critic.
Well you don't have to be a animator to tell how bad animation is. I am not defending them, tho-
Anett Oja well I would like to argue that the thing that made storytime animator popular is the commentary and dialogue, not the merits of the animation. For story time animators to use a drawn format to present their stories is to allow for visual communication. Not many people like to just sit and listen, and the stories they tell would be much less interesting with visuals.
"THEY CAN'T BE INTROVERTED BECAUSE THEY YELL"
*ughhhhhhhhhhhh*
The Latiator I know right, Fluttershy is so overeated.🦄
Breaking news: local critic believes that temper regulates vocal cords.
In all seriousness, I can be the most over-the-top loud dumbass around close friends and family members, but I can’t answer the phone if I don’t recognize the number. My dude doesn’t seem to understand that fucking around in front of a mic and actually interacting with people are different things
*Yells into cat*
I'm allergic to yelling, my throat closes when my voice rises above 6db.
The Latiator I’m the loudest person on the planet and I’m an introvert...
"there not DONE yet they need more time in the MICROWAVE"
thats going to the "one of the best things I've ever heard" list™
reply #1
striki reply #2
Third reply in numerical form
IV
@TheBlackDiamond//MTBD *T W E L V E*
"If you can't do full animation yourself, you can just... pay someone to do it for you" has the same energy as "let them eat cake" for me.
Like, gee, I bet these people would *love* to pay for supporting artists/animators for their personal projects, I would too. But we only got so much money, and the notion that this is just a simple fix is pretty laughable to me.
At least "Let them eat cake" was fake and probably not something a real person said.
"this is like shouting "NO FALSE GODS" at a *mall santa*
probably the best damn thing ive ever heard
Also a massive prediction of what I am gonna do this Christmas
@@TheKaydenMonroe I. LOVE IT. SO MUCH.
It’s a great mental image
Is it bad this is one of the things I’m for sure taking away from this video other than the very obvious things I will also take away.
it's kinda funny how some of these "critics" can't take criticism themselves, and claim that anyone who dissagrees with them are "snowflakes". People do not have to take your criticism, you're not that special, and it's not like they are comitting a crime by not animating the way you want them to
Ferist
It’s so ironic it cured my iron deficiency
Ferist Even constructive criticism.
I feel like these critics think that they are gods/are entitled to everything/can control other people’s actions
Sharkcraft Yeah, if you don’t listen to them, you’re doing something wrong.
@MrMarmalad maybe not all of them
but some definitely do
Bruh when Daftpina said that Jaiden fakes anorexia and Daidus is only a tracer that doesn’t cred the artists when he only traces famous memes, it made me so disgusted about him.
I used to watch DaftPina until I discovered that he accused Jaiden Animations of faking her mental illnesses. I know he apologized but that was extremely messed up to say. And as someone who struggles with mental illness as well. I find that extremely disgusting
@Hate fueled I don't remember hearing that. More the reason to hate him ig
What really got me was when daft pina accused Jaiden of faking an eating disorder.
Yeah, that was an asshole thing to do. It takes a lot of bullshit to make me angry, but that fucking did it.
@@thetweefirebug Honestly, it just goes to show the type of person he is. Which is really rich considering he and the rest of his community are trying really hard to make it seem like the story time animators are the evil ones. I've never seen the animators do ANYTHING like that. It's disgusting.
@@nekoqueen5524 I thank you for summing most of the "criticism" community.
Devil's Dice *asshole*? They lie sometimes,you think that,but it *can* happen.
@@seanking520
1: I was merely sharing my opinion that it was an asshole thing to do.
2: I know people lie, everyone has at some point.
3: What's with the random bulk letters?
Edit: oh, and I forgot this one
4: Back at you
I know this isn't even a point in the video but that passing part of where one dude tried to prove that Spechie was lying because "she said her highschool was bad but this person said it wasn't" is such bull
believe it or not people have different feelings and experiences in school and such hold different perspectives on such. Them trying to invalidate spechie's feelings about school is just so annoying
THANK YOU!
It was one of the dumbest things I've ever heard
The lengths that petty, talentless dweebs on the internet will go to, to rag on those more successful and ambitious than they are is truly astounding.
Idk how you can build a platform on putting nothing into the world creatively but telling creatives they suck cause you have a God complex lmao
EXACTLY WHAT I THOUGHT AT THAT POINT
The notion that someone could experience the same thing as me but have different feelings about it is existentially terrifying, please stop. Only my perspective is valid.
"I either said things that are true or because she doesn't want to break character for her subscribers and fans"
Or she doesn't have to because you criticized her _mental health struggles,_ which is disgusting
A lot of these guys are complete narcissists doing this for the attention. In which case, they best pray to every known god from HISTORY their future employers have never watched them, 'cause said gods KNOW they can't do this RUclips-gig forever. Then again, they'd more likely than not pin the blame on Tiny Tim than take responsibility for their own actions, sooooooo...
@@mrpip1179 imagine getting mad at someone for talking bad about your e celebs and then talking about not taking criticism XD
@@mrpip1179 why were you so mad?
@@mrpip1179 I've seen your other comments and honestly I take back what I said, gr8 b8 m8
or because you're nobody. you're not relevant and you're trying to insert yourself into a narrative you *don't exist in* and no one has to indulge that shit. go get your validation from your mom and therapist. like bro, these people have no idea wtf is actually a relevant argument and suffer from such massive bouts of protagonist syndrome it's just sad. i'd feel bad for them if they weren't shitting on other people's mental health.
I've got to say, this is one of my favorite videos on the whole site. Criticism is rarely criticized at all, and you manage to do it without falling into the same traps a lot of RUclips critics do (cruelty in place of jokes/critique, failing to differentiate between lack of skill and poor ethics, etc.). This video manages to be very informative without being inflammatory. Excellent work.
"You need to recognise that people you find annoying can have real problems, too."
That's something that I could've told my younger self, Quinn. You put together a masterpiece with many important messages. Thank you.
18:36 Rebecca Perham, known for her channel Let Me Explain Studios, does not do lip syncing. In fact, her characters don't even have any mouths. In a Q&A video, she addresses that this was an intentional choice for two reasons. 1) She liked the appeal of it considering she liked characters like Gromit and Bill Cipher, and 2) because not drawing a mouth allowed her to focus more on her drawings to create better exaggerations and even smoother animations at certain points.
Rebecca have probably the smoothest animation in all of the community, that is exactly what all the critics wanted. Yet, they still think is not good? It doesn't add up
@@isadorakirmayr8876 In the minds of these animation critics, apparently not having smooth lines, lots of details, or mouths qualifies as "bad."
Yeah, I feel like “it’s a style choice” is actually valid reasoning, especially when the person being criticized has shown that they can do the thing that they’re being criticized for. Rebecca’s older videos show that she can animate mouths , the fact that her newer ones lack mouths demonstrate that it’s a style choice
@@mimsilvernote and it’s not like she’s not aware of it...some of her newest videos had her making jokes about how her characters don’t have mouths. Heck there’s a joke she did where she had to take about the time she broke her teeth, and she intentionally put stick-it notes with drawings of mouth because “how can I talk about a mouth accident if I don’t have a mouth?”
Creative professional here, stumbling across this randomly through the magic of algorithms...
Yeah... I know these folks. Not these /specific/ people (I know nothing about this particular youtube subgenre or the folks involved) but 'critics' who have /none/ of the attributes related to actual, useful, relevant criticism... like having any of the related skill/knowledge/background/etc. I've literally paid people to perform that service because it's a useful service... people who actually knew what they're talking about and knows how to present information usefully.
These folks... they're not critics, they're ranters. Trolls. All kinds of sub-types, but in all cases listening to them (at least beyond the level of being aware of doxxing type insanity) is a trap.
Don't feed the trolls, but also don't let them feed you...
FUCK YAS !!!!!
Oh my goodness I came across these channels a few years ago and it infuriated me to no end. As someone who studied art and animation in university this kind of criticism would not hold in an academic setting, and yet they act like they’re the end all be all of ‘critique’. Makes my blood boil. Thanks for the video!
I’m noticing a pattern of critics viewing their criticism as objective and you can’t critique their criticism or else your blind
There's a lot of people who believe themselves holder's of truth. THEIR truth is the truest truth. If you ignore them, you're a blind sheep. But, despite your willing ignorance, he tried his best to save you, but you were just too far gone.
I think it’s both. Animators can’t take criticism, critics can’t give good criticism. You need both if you wanna improve
*You’re
Seaweed Senpai I think a lot of them can but if the critics suck where is the criticism and I don’t just mean animation critics I mean people like jelloapocalypse or dunkey who have one way of thinking about things and that’s it you aren’t allowed to disagree
@@FranK-tg7ou Dunkey's most recent video makes a lot more sense now.
Imagine having people say to quit because “You’re drawing is dumb,” and you don’t know how to animate. Don’t listen, that’s just bullying, you start out like terrible but that’s okay, you just get better, and if you listen to criticism like that, it’s basically like being called a loser
no baby is born to know everything and do everything 100% on first try with whatever experience they do, that includes artists! as long as the artist is having fun and no one is hurt, it shouldnt be a big deal :)
Its one thing to criticise but its awful to discourage them on doing so
Your
I agree. I've had people pick on me because of how I draw back in the day. It lowered my self esteem. Nobody is gonna get drawing and animation right off the bat. It takes a lot of work.
Criticism is fine. People have opinions but some people aren’t doing something. Being constructive. You should tell them about the goods of the channel but also lightly tell them how they could improve, not tell them they’re bad at this straight away.
They say that TimTom was a guy who just copied Odd1sout because he was popular, and got popular after it.
Bro, they were friends back when Tim had 15 subs, and James endorsed his channel because of them being friends and because of James enjoying his content,
That's how he got the kickstart,
in NO way did TimTom get big because he followed a trend.
Y'know DOMICS and SWOOZIE? The main two who practically freakin' *INVENTED* RUclips ANIMATION?! People say their both TheOdd1sOut copies. Hell, people are called copies of James who've been doing their same animation for almost FIVE YEARS before he even made his first RUclips video.
Cartoon Master Not necessary correct, Dom and Swoozie invented the genre true, but Odd modernized and popularized it.
@@pollall2793 Yes that's true, but you can't be a COPY of someone who did the same thing AFTER you:
If I got a green apple, and you saw me with it, and you got a green apple, did I copy you?
Cartoon Master Not the same thing, it’s like someone getting a green apple, than I get a mango, than everyone else decided they also want mangos, true Domics sort of started the trend, but Odd popularized it.
@@pollall2793 But does that mean they copied him?
1:11:06 that quote made me cry, its exactly what im going thru as an artist. My perfectionism makes me feel like im never good enough, so i get frustrated and exhausted easily when i draw. The guilt i feel for not pursuing my passion as much as i used to is overwhelming, and im rll scared i wont be able to overcome this struggle, which sucks cause i love creating art with all my heart and i couldnt imagine my life not doing it.
same here! let’s try to keep going, we can do this
Can't believe DaftPina ran out of things to criticize Jayden for so he complained she put an award on the carpet to record. Talk about grasping at straws.
@@mrpip1179 that's a shit save mate
You messed up on your spelling and tried to play it off as a joke. Go back to simping on Daftpina man
And clearly my grammar is better than yours so... 10 points bud.
@@mrpip1179 That's bullshit. It was just a spelling mistake, and within the context, looks nothing like a joke. So you can stop saying shit about that because nobody here believes you.
30 points, dickwad.
@@mrpip1179 I feel sad you live on the same island.
What do you mean award
@Kendale Allen I don't know if you are serious about the crumpet thing because I don't see Mr.pip comments (either because someone or he deleted them or I just don't see them) and I feel I need his comments to see if you were being sarcastic
However, crumpets are the best fucking snack foods I have tasted in my life and you not knowing about them is a sin
I don't think any of these critics are right when they say these RUclipsrs haven't evolved. Sure, their core art styles may not have changed or evolved all that much, but their content has.
Jaiden started making videos when she was going through a really dark place in her life, and during her channel's growth, she overcame that. She went through therapy to help her eating disorder and has worked a lot on her self image. Looking at her content now, all of this is completely evident, even in the way she speaks.
James has also gone through an evolution. With each passing year, he showed more personality in each video, going from somewhat timid videos with occasional jokes to entire, off the cuff movie reviews of The Dark Crystal and it's intellectual properties.
jaiden also did an ENTIRE livestream, mostly her face! shes come a long way! i know this doesnt change her view and you probably dont care, but im proud of her!
@@Network-yp8de Why would you assume I don't care? My comment was literally about caring about her. That's great!!
@@HyenaFox no i know you wouldnt care about my comment itself i thought you'd tell me to fuck off or something
@@Network-yp8de bruh I get that a significant amount of people on the internet default to "fuck off", but you made a positive contribution to a positive discussion, so I have no idea why you thought a genuinely nice and productive response to a discussion would be met with "fuck off" lmao
The weird thing is people make whole channels about reading reddit stories. People clearly like to hear stories from other people even if they are exaggerated or even made up. I watch "story time" videos for the stories and the addition of amusing pictures that go with them only adds to it. I never really cared about these animation community critics because the flaws they pointed out were not things I honestly paid attention to. I just like to hear other people's expediences. One of my favorite channels right now looks like it was done in MS paint and the stories are clearly overly exaggerated but it's funny as hell. I'd argue it would take away from the humor if they were better drawn. I was tempted to try my hand at animation or a even story time style but this whole thing turned me off of it.
Lol nice profile, i like beastars too :P
This bad faith critique that they do, where they very obviously incite harassment of someone they don't like, then feign innocence by claiming that it's "just constructive criticism," is exactly what is happening to the Minecraft RUclipsr Jellybean. If you don't like her content, don't watch it. What the rant community is doing to this Jellybean kid is unacceptable. And if you point out that what they're doing to her is borderline cyberbullying, they'll just laugh and say "I'm just giving my opinion." Seeing what's been happening to her makes me sick.
I agree with this so much.
I don't know if turkey tom really grew up tbh I think he's kinda trying to be like leafy tbh.i do appreciate him calling out people like pedos and zoophilia Wich is good.just don't really enjoy him as a person and his fanbase
Wanna know what irks me abiut them? They critisize the form of animation and all that when using THE SAME F**KING STYLE OF THE ANIMATORS!
I think LSD Mark and Chicken Chad talked about this, with the argument being that they don't say they are animators. Okay, fair, but if we take it a step further they're essentially just saying that their own critique isn't really relevant and is just a semantics battle. The difference between an animatic and an animation isn't an argument or critique worth paying attention to. I wonder why they even bring it up, it's such a nitpicky thing to do
Dominick Perez Pigeon Pete, the absolute clown, sure had a lot of fun pushing someone into suicide.
They never said that it was animation
@@kb_daydre4m7 We literally just went over why that doesn't matter
Not to mention - a LOT of these critiquers are amateur artists themselves, or NOT ARTISTS AT ALL in some cases. But they feel the need to still google like 3 "how to animation" wikihows and then criticize people for not following every single possible animation rule
their “criticism” always felt hateful
Because it’s not “criticism”
It’s pure hate, just like you said
You can’t just say “ur content is bad u fake disorder arent i great” that’s hate. Criticism is c o n s t r u c t I v e
@@sillygoosetaur that’s why I said it in quotations LOL but my thoughts exactly
And I sense a bit of jealousy in their words.
And then they have the gull to say that the don't hate them
I was always angry about TRO because of one thing:
Prior bias in his videos. What I mean by this is how he frames James/Odds1Out as a villain, shoving words he never intended down his throat to show he wasn't being a good person.
When in his review of YandereDev and YandereSimulator, he has the gall to take a neutral stance to the piece of garbage who already had so many videos on him showing he was a horrible human being
fantastic nuanced video, 10/10
I don't expect you here, but hello , love your content so much ❤️
0/1
@@alphabo2776 huh?
@@alphabo2776 ew
No your wrong 😑 stop throwing out your rude unacceptable opinion
Jk lol 1000000000000000000000/10 comment and video
"Their animation is lazy"
"I don't feel like doing work so here's money, draw some pictures for my youtube videos about how lazy youtube animators are"
The irony of this is only outweighed by the laziness of the critic community.
Are commissions lazy?
@@purpleisdebeste they are when you're shitting on someone else's ability to draw like you're an expert
@@SatanicBarbeque I suppose
Hey Maybe it's Because, They don't Claim That their Animators 🤯
Like My Dude LS Mark Mentioned That Argument in His Video.🙄
@@thomas2390 still stupid. Even if a professional athlete came last in the Olympics. it would still be stupid to call them unathletic while you lay on your couch with a triple chin.
"But they apologised after insulting people" bleat their fans.
Yeah, and then they KEPT INSULTING PEOPLE
An apology is meaningless unless you actually try to change. Whether they actually meant the apologies (and I see not a shred of evidence they did) is besides the point.
Relationship abuser with no attachment necessary, just unilateral abuse, insincere apology and more abuse. It's almost masochistic in its sadism.
I bet their apology video was a full hour with 9 mid roll ads and with 7 boxes of tissues for the dramatic effect.
@Pisisixef
1. If they are so utterly talentless that they need to resort to weak insults in the hopes of getting fingertips on being entertaining, then maybe they should think about whether or not they should be on RUclips.
2. So they want to be entertaining. Fine. So what? The comment you're replying to was about whether their apologies were genuine. Congratulations on your complete non sequitur.
Tl:Dr - you have revealed both yourself and the shitstains you are defending for the complete and total failures that they are.
Have a nice day.
@Pisisixef 'My reply wasn't meant to sequel yours'
Hence why it's a non sequitur, dipshit XD
@Pisisixef 'mhm contradicted yourself huh'
Nope. When did I say I was trying to entertain anybody? I'm also not a content creator on RUclips.
Keep trying sweetheart.
"These people should feel bad that they got more popular with less effort, exploiting the algorithm!"
Maybe the problem is with the algorithm and not the people then??
Dont blame the player. Blame the game
if you exploit lets say a video game online you'll still get banned though. just because their is an exploit doesn't mean you should morally use it.
@MR Shedan
I think he's saying, just because you have the opportunity to exploit something, doesn't mean you should.
As in this case, he states it would be morally wrong.
Pretty sure the problem is that some people are just irritated at the notion of other people liking things they personally don't.
@MR Shedan
*"Well excuuuse me, Princess!"*
All I did was relay his message, don't take it out on me!
This was super good
Wasn't expecting to see you here, lol
heya big joel!! :D
The politics of these critique channels are pretty bad, big Joel video maybe??
Yee biggy boi Joel is here 😁
Joel,if you found a bigger Joel, would you be "Shorter Big Joel"?