Shaping a Sweater Yoke for Better Fit with Short Rows
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- Опубликовано: 22 авг 2024
- Shaping a Sweater Yoke for Better Fit with Short Rows. Any questions? Feel free to ask! Post your comments or questions here, or to get questions answered, interact with other knitters and find more free stuff, join my students group: / knittingclasses
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i LOVE the way you explain things. rather than giving directions, you actually explain the LOGIC of the thing. that is, undoubtedly, the mark of a great teacher.
+the nAyisha Thank you for your nice comment and encouragement!
I´ve been fighting with sweater knitting for 2 months on a neck down raglan sweater. No one has been able to explain to me what the short rows are doing and how they work. This was extremely helpful! Thank you! Now I get it!!!
You're very welcome! I'm glad this tutorial helped you. Short rows are such a useful technique :-)
Cheers,
Maria
You are wonderful, this is the first time someone explained properly what is a short row does and how to apply it. Thank you.
Thank you for the encouraging comment; I really appreciate it!
Thank you so much. Short rows used to be such a confusing concept to grasp much less to apply. I can’t wait to start knitting a sweater now.
You're very welcome! I'm glad you found this video helpful. I'd love to see the sweater you're going to make :-)
This is beyond excellent. I have put short rows in my tops. But I never began in the front area. I will have to do this. I also like how many times I need to do short rows. I would do 3 times and divide them up. I did not realize you did it all in one row and I usually do DK weight yarn and would need to do 5 times. WOW I learned a lot. Thank you so much
+Karen Bochinski You are very welcome! Thank you for the nice comment. I struggled with short rows until I realized that what they actually do is create height in the shape of wedges, or crescents, depending on where you decide to turn, and that extra height would be useful in areas other than just the back neck. When that little nugget lit up in my brain I understood that the number of short rows depend on how much height I want to add - so now, I can stick them into any pattern; and, I do, to accommodate my wide shoulders and beefier upper arms, which used to make the yoke of almost all sweaters too tight for me.
Thank you so much for this really clear video on how to shape the back for longer length! It's just what I needed, as I was trying to figure out how to modify a bottom-up sweater knit in the round with a yoke pattern. Thanks again for sharing your expertise!
You're very welcome; I'm glad the video was helpful. I'd love to see what you knit!
I've watched this a half dozen times, so far. I have my own page of drawings as close as I can do them to yours. As soon as I get the money saved up to get the yarn...❤️
Thanks for watching and I'm glad the video is helpful. I'd love to see what you end up knitting!
Thank you for having taken the time and effort to share your knowledge and talent💟. Your tutorials are awesome!!!😊
Thank you so much for the encouraging comment, I really appreciate it!
This is so helpful!!!! I wanted to make a sweater pattern in Interweave Knits magazine for 2015 but it incorporated short rows and I was so confused by that. This really helped me understand why they would do that. Thank you so much!!! extremely helpful
You're welcome! Short rows are such a great technique to have in your tool kit; I'm glad you found my video helpful!
This helped me understand and visualize the pattern I’m working. Thank you!
You're welcome; I'm glad the video is helpful!
Thank you so much, that was an excellent way to explain how useful sort rows are in better shaping a sweater!!! I am knitting a top down raglan sweater and i had that exact problem that you so nicely explained with the front and the back yoke and i didn't know how to solve it! It didn't look so nice when i tried on.. Thank you!!
76capslock You're welcome, I'm happy to share what I've learned!
Thank you so much for a great explanation and display. It makes sense to me finally!
You're very welcome, I'm glad I could help!
Cheers,
Maria
You can also make a provincial cast on at the neckline. This is for a top down sweater.Knit your sweater as is Or how the pattern requires you to knit it. Pick up your switches in the cast on and add your short road at the neckline. Add an extra inch in the back of the neck but do what she says. But just do it at the top after you knitted your sweater. There are so many ways to do this. She’s a great teacher. I like the way she explains to do it at the bottom of the yoke. Smart!
My husband likes his sweaters tight at the collar. So I don’t really get a chance to do this so much and less I’m getting myself a sweater. Unfortunately that’s a rare occasion. I’m always needing for other people and not for myself. I keep giving away all my works of hats and other things to other people. It makes me feel good that people wearing my work.
Thanks for the great tips, Stepanie!
you are very helpful more so than the person who put the pattern i was following
thanks again if i don't get it i will rewatch your tutorial again and do the short row along with you
You're very welcome! I'm glad the video is helpful.
I am working on a crochet sweater and couldn’t understand how the short row works. I got it now thanks 🙏🏿🙏🏿🙏🏿
You're welcome. I'm glad the video is helpful. Short rows work for crochet fabric too but I don't know that they're often used. I'd love to see what you made!
Wonderful vid. Really helps to solve the problem of sweaters that ride up in the back on a man. Will definitely try. Thanks so much for making the explanation so complete
You're welcome Robyn! I really like the practicality of traditionally constructed sweaters, but, unfortunately since these sweaters are mostly worked in one piece the yoke doesn't fit well without modifications. Hooray for short rows :-)
~Maria
Thank you so much for your educational tutorials. Glad to have found you and subscribe
Thank you for your nice comment! If you haven't, already, please join my knitting group on Facebook at:
facebook.com/groups/knittingclasses/
I have a lot more planned, including some "learn-a-long" series which will be like virtual classes.
Cheers, Maria
+Yael Shany Thank you for the nice comment and for your encouragement! I'm looking forward to making more videos and tutorials in the near future :-)
I never tried this because the first time I looked at them and saw all those markers. .. I said whoa. That's nuts. Even more markers. Can't always believe what you see. Going to try these now 😊thanks for the video.
+Joy Tucker Lol, I love markers! Although, I do have several students that hate them and manage to work without using them. I myself can't knit without them ;-)
Hi, thanks again for sharing your knitting knowledge to everyone!
You're welcome and thank you for watching!
Had no idea about that... now my knitting will make sense. Thanks a lot.
You're welcome; thanks for watching!
This is the best video for me to knitted my cardigan.
I'm glad you found it helpful! Thank you for the nice comment!
Thank you so much for this tutorial! Very, very helpful. I am knitting my first top down raglan cardigan. I didn't do the short rows because I haven't thought about it although I should; it makes so much sense. I knitted a Riddary sweater before and there were no short rows in the pattern and I ended up adding a few short rows close to the neck part. I guess I am lucky that I chose to make a V neck shaped one and it solves the mistake this time. I will remember next time. So far my work looks good. Thanks! ~Catalina
You're welcome; and thank you for watching. I'd love to see what you're knitting.
Thank you! This was a very helpful tutorial and just what I was looking for. I'm going to incorporate this technique in my current project.
You're welcome! Let me know how your project works out.
Cheers,
Maria
Great tutorial. This is discussed a lot in knitting, but not many tutorials. Thank you.
You're welcome! Issues with fit are discussed a lot in knitting, and addressed often in regards to garments worked in pieces. Top-down garments worked in 1 piece, not so much. It's likely that fit in garments worked in 1 piece isn't addressed as much because 1 piece knitting has just recently (comparatively speaking - only in the last 15 - 20 years) become more popular. Also, most modern knits are less fitted than in the past. Whereas highly structured garments were popular in the 1940's and 50's and those knit garments were all worked in pieces (with very few exceptions).
MariaXuxena I hadn't bothered to think why! You're probably right. 🤓
Thank you so much for that clear explanation for how this works ❤️
You're welcome; thank you for watching!
This is a excellent tutorial and help me very much, I wish I could sit and learn to knit from this lady, she explains things very well!! I want to knit a sweater so bad but I am afraid I will get stuck and not be able to figure out my prob,!
Thank you for your nice comment! Please join my knitting group on Facebook at: facebook.com/groups/knittingclasses/
I have a lot more planned, including some "learn-a-long" series which will be like virtual classes.
Cheers,
Maria
Thank you, thank you, thank you! I have been wracking my brain trying to figure this out.
You're very welcome! I'm glad the video is helpful!
first time I manage to understand short rows ''how to'' knew the method but never understood it up to now...by the way shadow wraps is another cool method
Short rows are such a useful technique for so many different applications. My current favorite is the German short row (aka: yo yo) but I definitely advocate for having as many different ways as possible to accomplish the same result because depending on gauge, fiber, stitch pattern, etc... there is no such thing as one technique fits all applications.
~Maria
I love this video, and include a link to it in patterns of mine that use this technique. Thank you!
You're welcome and thank you for watching!
Thank you - I've been going nuts trying to read a pattern with short rows.
You’re welcome 😊
Omg so informative. Only one question: where to I put the marker for the increase round?
Finally I understand!!! Thankyou so much!!! Now it.s very clear!!!
You're welcome; I'm glad the video is helpful!
thank you thank you thank you thank you!!!! I finally understand what my pattern was saying. Excellent explanation, Thank you again ;-)))))
You're very welcome; thank you for watching and I'm glad you found the video helpful!
Superb explanation, THANK YOU!,,,
You're very welcome; I'm glad the video is helpful, and thanks for watching!
Exellently explained, thank you very much.
You're very welcome; thank you for watching and for the encouraging comment, I really appreciate it!
so late to the party but just wanted to thank you for this pictorial, it has been a game changer for understanding short rows! not sure if you’re still answering questions but in case you are, I was wondering 1) for a basic top down raglan, do I start short rows right after the neck band or before sleeve separation? I’m doing plain old stockinette and 2) do I still work the increases on the right side rounds of the short rows?
Hi Avril, sorry for the late reply - I'm still answering questions ;-)
You can put the short rows where ever the added fabric improves the fit of the sweater for you. I have fairly large upper arms (not freakishly large, but meaty enough, lol) so I add the short rows just before separating for the sleeves. I do also work the raglan increases at the same time as the short rows.
Thank you very helpful video !!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!! LOVE THE WAY YOU EXPLAIN in details xx
You're very welcome; and, thank you for the encouraging comment, I really appreciate it!
thank you for this video! It makes so much sense now!
You're welcome; thank you for watching!
Thank you so much for this very interesting video. I love how you explain things in clear, straight-to-the-point manner. I have a question for you. In many patterns, the number of short rows for back-neck shaping increases as the sizes go up. Therefore, the bigger the size, the more short rows you work. Is there a ratio for this? How does one determine the number short rows for a given size? Thank you so much for your help!
The number of short rows will depend on your row gauge and how much height you want to add. For example if your row gauge is 6 rows = 1 inch, and you want to add 2 inches of height you would need a total of 12 rows - keeping in mind that the short rows would be worked in pairs (knit across, purl back = 1 short row) so you would need 6 short rows to get the 2 inches of additional height. I hope this makes sense.
Very helpful, thank you for this video!
You're so welcome; thank you for watching!
you're enriching. I love to watch your videos. can u please give a hint how to devide the top when knitting from top down? I always guess. Also, how can you knit a pattern in a round when you have to add stitches?
Thank u so much5
+Yael Shany One way to work a round yoke is to follow Elizabeth Zimmermann’s foolproof technique for shaping a traditional round yoke. Following her percentage system from Knitting Workshop (Schoolhouse Press, 1981), or Meg Swansen’s variation shown in The Opinionated Knitter (Schoolhouse Press, 2005). Making a gauge swatch is critical for this process as well as having good measurements of the intended wearer of the sweater. Once you’ve determined the body circumference, you use that number as a key number to calculate the taper of the yoke with a few well-placed increase rounds. You cast on 40% of the body stitches for the neck. In the percentage system, the depth of the yoke is 25% of the circumference of the body. You work two or three more evenly spaced increase rounds, increasing about a third of the stitches by Make 1, k1 around each time, and then about halfway down the yoke you work the last round, again, increasing about a third of the stitches by Make 1, k1 around. Then you’re ready to divide for the sleeves. To divide the sleeves and body, you would have to calculate how many stitches you need for each sleeve, again based on a percentage of the body stitches; For the upper arm the standard is 33% and the underarm is 8%; So if the body stitches is 200 stitches you would need 33 stitches for each arm - total 66 stitches. That would leave you 134 stitches for the body and you would put 8 of these stitches for each under arm on holders (these are grafted to the sleeves). I recommend checking for fit based on gauge. For example, if the gauge for this sweater is 4 stitches to the inch, the circumference of the sweater would be 33.5 inches and each sleeve circumference would be 8.25 inches at the upper arm. Elizabeth describes this method working from the bottom up, not from the top down; But, the percentage method works both ways. I will probably do a video on this in the future :-)
This is so helpful video, so good thank you.
You're very welcome, thank you for watching!
Cheers,
Maria
Hello, again, Maria! I have a couple of questions about this technique. I'm knitting a raglan pullover sweater with a patterned yoke in-the-round, from the bottom up, with aran yarn, how many rounds should I work after the "union round" (where I join the body and sleeves), before starting the short rows? Is there a formula for this, depending on the circumference and/or yarn weight, or is it just a general number that works for all such patterns and sizes?
Also, you mentioned in the video that, when using a worsted, aran, or bulky yarn, you would knit 3 pairs of short rows (6 rows, 3 turns on each side), spacing them 5 stitches apart, with all the turns just inside the front raglan sleeve "seams." Is this a general rule for any size sweater, or is there a formula to figure out the number of short rows and the stitch spacing that takes into account the circumference, at that point, of the particular sweater one is knitting?
Finally, in your video, after you completed the last short row, you turned and continued on to the front vertical edge of the cardigan, picking up the wraps (or "not wraps," depending on the short row technique used) you encountered along the way, then turned at the front edge of the cardigan and worked the next row, picking up the remaining wraps. That was for a cardigan knit back and forth. However, if you were working in-the-round, would you have instead continued past the round marker and picked up the left side wraps on the next round, rather than turning at the round marker and working in the opposite direction to pick up the remaining wraps?
Thanks for your helpful video, and any advice you can offer!
Hi Allison,
You can work as few or as many rounds as you like that won’t interfere with the yoke patterning. If the patterned section is very deep you might need to work just 2 or 3 short rows immediately after joining. If the patterned section is not as deep (or closer to the neck and upper shoulder area) you will have more room to decide where you want to place the short rows. Since there generally is shaping involved in the patterned yoke on a bottom up sweater I don’t like to also add the additional work of keeping track of the short rows and how they affect the patterning so I keep them separate.
Placement of the short rows depends on the patterning in the yoke, if any and where you prefer to add extra height. I like to place my short rows at the point that would fall mid point between the arm pit and upper shoulder because my upper arms are rather matronly and the extra fabric in that area makes the yoke fit me without stretching across the shoulders.
You can calculate the number of short rows you will need if you know how much height you want to add. You just work the number of short rows that will give the added height you want based on your row gauge. The spacing of 5 stitches apart works for almost every stitch gauge and keeping the turning points close to the raglan sleeve “seams” will keep the additional height in the back of the sweater where we want it.
Yes, when working in the round you would pick up the second set of wraps on the next round.
I hope this make sense!
Thanks for your detailed answer, Maria! I think I have a grasp of short row shaping for the shoulder area now. :) And thanks for approving my request to join your student Facebook page. I look forward to keeping up with the tips and instruction there. Thanks, again!
You're very welcome!
What a great video. Thank you
You're welcome; thank you for the encouraging comment and for watching!
Thank you very much for explaining this!
You're welcome! Thank you for watching my videos!
This is really helpful. Thank you!
+Michelle Rolader You're welcome! I am glad the video is helpful :-)
Thank you so mach, i was beginning student, That is so useful for me! :)
You are very welcome! I'm glad to help. If you like, please join my students fb group at facebook.com/groups/knittingclasses/ where you can post questions and get help with your projects.
Thank you soooooo much!! This is super helpful!!
You're welcome and thank you for watching!
Really good explanation. I really don't like jumpers that are as low at the back as at the front.
I feel the same way. In my opinion jumpers hang weirdly on the body when they are exactly the same back and front.
this is best in the you tube!
Thank you! I'm glad you found it helpful!
Oh now I get it! Thanks so much for your great explanation
You're welcome; thanks for watching!
Thanks
You're welcome; thanks for watching!
This is very informative! But, how do I know where to put my three turning points?
Multiply 5 by one less than the number ofshort rows (or, turns) you want. For example, for 3 sets it would be 10, and for 5 sets it would be 20. In the case of 3 sets, work into the body 10 sts past the sleeve, turn, work back to 10 sts past the sleeve on the other side, turn, work to 5 stitches past the sleeve, turn, work to 5 sts past the sleeve on the other side turn, work to the end of the sleeve, turn, work to the sleeve on the other side, turn and resume knitting full rows. I hope this makes sense!
very enlighting! This is a very important information!
Thank you for your nice comment!
Does it make a difference if you place the short rows in a top down sweater before of after dividing for the sleeves for the end result?
It depends on what your end goal is. Keep in mind that when you're working short rows the center part of the short rows is adding height to the fabric. If you're trying to raise the back neck it's better to place the short rows closer to the neck area. If you're trying to add height to accommodate a larger bus then it's better to place the short rows in the bust area. The same goes if you want to accommodate a rotund belly then you would add your short rows for the additional height in the belly area.
Oh, one more question I meant to ask. You mentioned in the video that you wanted to keep your front-side raglan "seams" at 25% of the chest circumference of the sweater. Is this, too, a general rule, regardless of pattern, or is it particular to the pattern you were working in the video? Wouldn't that percentage vary depending on how high or low the neck falls (how large or small the neck opening is)?
The 25% is a general “rule” and is based on the percentage method used for round yoke style sweaters. The standards for the circumference are: Body = 100% (constant) Wrist = 20% Upper arm = 33% Shoulders = 133% Neck = 40% Yoke depth = 25%
For example, a 48” chest circumference with a gauge of 5 stitches to the inch would give you 240 as your “body” or constant. 25% yoke depth of that is 60 (rows) and with a row gauge of 7 rows to the inch the depth would be about 8.5 inches. But if your row gauge is 6 rows to the inch the depth of the yoke would be closer to 10 inches (I’d say a much better fit than 8.5” for ME). So, it would be a good idea to calculate out what the 25% percent represents in actual knitting based on your gauge and then deciding if you need to adjust. In this example, if my row gauge was 7 rows to the inch I would adjust the yoke depth to 30% so I would get close to a 10” depth which would be a better fit for my body.
Ah, I see! Thanks for explaining the percentage method. :)
Can I also do this with a v-neck top-down sweater? Thank you
I generally use this technique to raise the back of the neck and on a v-neck you don't really need to do that because there is already shaping for the front of the sweater. But, there might be other reasons that you may need additional height in the back even for a v-neck. So, yes, you could use short rows to raise the back higher or even to do all of the shoulder shaping.
When should I do the short rows if I'm knitting just plain knit ? And do the sort rows go right after the sleeve marker
Placement of the short rows depends on where you prefer to add extra height. I like to place my short rows at the point that would fall mid-point between the armpit and upper shoulder because my upper arms are rather matronly and the extra fabric in that area makes the yoke fit me without stretching across the shoulders.
The number of short rows will depend on your row gauge and how much height you want to add. For example, if your row gauge is 6 rows = 1 inch, and you want to add 2 inches of height you would need a total of 12 rows - keeping in mind that the short rows would be worked in pairs (knit across, purl back = 1 short row) so you would need 6 short rows to get the 2 inches of additional height. The spacing of 5 stitches apart works for almost every stitch gauge and keeping the turning points close to the raglan sleeve “seams” will keep the additional height in the back of the sweater where we want it.
@@MariaXuxenaKnittingTutorials thank you
I didn't even think the turning points would need to be spaced out
Glad I asked
Thank you
You're very welcome!
Do we increase in the corners when we work the short rows?
Yes, you should still continue to increase at raglan "seam" while you're also working the short rows.
How do you balance short rows for the longer length needed in the back for the shoulders with the extra length needed in front for the bust? Is it mainly a question of placement?
If you need additional length for the bust a second set of short rows to create a bust dart would be needed which would be worked across the front of the garment.
Thank you so much 💐
You're welcome! Thanks for watching!
How far apart are those short row markers supposed to be?
Spacing the turning point markers around 5 stitches apart works for almost every stitch gauge and keeping the turning points close to the raglan sleeve “seams” will keep the additional height in the back of the sweater where we want it.
How do you decide where to start the short Row shaping?
Deciding where to put the short rows depends on how much height or width you want to add. You can put them pretty much anywhere! For a sweater circular yoke that has patterning, I usually put the short rows after the patterning (top-down) or before (bottom up) so I get the extra ease around the shoulder area in addition to adding height because I have pretty wide shoulders. If I had narrower shoulders I might opt to put the short rows nearer the neck. I try to avoid incorporating the short rows with any patterning (doable but requires more focus than I'm usually willing to give, lol).
Cheers,
Maria
This is such a helpful video. Thank you so much. I want to add short rows to an Icelandic lopi sweater that I haven't started yet. I haven't done a swatch (but will). Since it's bulky yarn with a target gauge of 13 sts x 17 rows = 4x4" would you recommend just 2 short rows? Also, I was thinking of doing each short row 4 sts apart. Any assistance you can provide would be greatly appreciated.
Another question I have is how do I calculate how how many stitches past into the front of the sweater the longest short row should go? I'm assuming there's some formula but I can't seem to find one.
Hi Keith, for heavy/bulky yarn you will need 3 sets of short rows. For medium/fine yarns you will need 5 sets of short rows. The tuning points are spaced 5 stitches apart for both heavy/bulky and medium/fine yarns. The turning points are placed in the front of the sweater close to the "side seams". If your lopi sweater is worked from the bottom up you would do the short rows after you've joined the sleeves and before you start the color patterning. If you're working top down you would do the short rows after the color patterning and just before separating for the sleeves. Top down I usually do 2 or 3 rounds of plain knitting before the short row turns and at least one round after the short rows before separating the body from the sleeves. This placement lowers the front neck line and depending on your row gauge will give you 1 1/2 - 2 inches of additional height for the back neck. 3 sets of short rows adds 6 extra rows and 5 sets adds 10 extra rows. Placing the short rows this way also gives you extra room around the arms which improves the fit if you have broad shoulders. If you have a specially long neck, you can add one or two short rows after the color patterning and just before the neck. That will add 2 to 4 extra rows. I hope this helps.
ps. This is a general guideline and can be changed/modified as you like to perfect the fit for you.
Multiply 5 by one less than the number of turns you want. For example, for 3 sets it would be 10, and for 5 sets it would be 20. In the case of 3 sets, work into the body 10 sts past the sleeve, turn, work back to 10 sts past the sleeve on the other side, turn, work to 5 stitches past the sleeve, turn, work to 5 sts past the sleeve on the other side turn, work to the end of the sleeve, turn, work to the sleeve on the other side, turn and resume knitting full rows. I hope this makes sense!
MariaXuxena, I was reviewing your video again last night and it finally sunk in how far past the arm hole to place the turning points. It was a coincidence that you replied after my ah ha moment :). Thanks for clarifying though how many short rows to do and the spacing for the bulky yarn. I'm going to use the German short row method since they are a lot less 'fiddly'.
If I have 180 st.How many short rows,turns and etc. do I need?.Please, help me
If knitting top-down, are these extra short rows knit plain before raglan increases?
You could knit the short rows plain before the increases, but I usually work the increases at the same time with the short rows.
Hi Maria. Thank you so much for posting this video. You are like me - too shy to show your face - ha ha! One question what about the extra fabric needed to cover the bust? The back needs more, but lower down, doesn't the bust line need more? By the way, where are you located? I would love to do a workshop with you. Thank you !
I'm not photogenic ;-)
If you have a larger bust, then yes, you do need to add extra fabric. Otherwise, the sweater will ride up in the front. Short rows make great horizontal bust darts to add more fabric across the front of the sweater.
I do in person classes in Southern California through the City of Whittier and City of Orange Parks and Recreation departments. I'd love to have you join us if you're local (or visiting for a few weeks!)
Oh my gosh! I am in SoCal - Orange County. I am gonnaknit on Rav!
i'm xuxena on Ravelry. Mixed level classes in Whittier at Parnell Park Community Center are on Wednesdays 6:30 - 7:30 pm (about 30 - 35 minutes North of Orange) and on Saturdays at El Camino Real Park Community Building Saturdays 10 - 11 (beginning) 11 - 12 (mixed levels). Whittier: apm.activecommunities.com/whittierrec/Activity_Search?txtActivitySearch=knitting&applyFiltersDefaultValue=true&cat=Activities and Orange: secure.rec1.com/CA/orange-ca/catalog
Where is the video of this pattern
Thank you
Great info
+Yael Shany You're welcome! I'm glad it was useful!
Explain this in a tutorial
ma perche' non c'e' mai nulla in italiano potresti anche parlare in italiano se non e' una richiesta impossibile grazie
ada panizza Vorrei parlavo italiano. Spero in futuro di avere qualcuno mi aiuti con le traduzioni. (google mi ha aiutato oggi!)
grazie
Thanks
You're welcome!