This channel does a much better job of giving the Subaru a fighting chance at these comparisons. Realistic scenarios with truly objective points of view. I love this channel. I think Subaru hit a home run with this vehicle. A vehicle that can handle some tough stuff but yet doesn't compromise with the majority of everyday tasks like navigating a supermarket parking lot or driving to work with fuel efficiency.
I would on compare the two with the same tires. 4r had the advantage of more appropriate tires in this terrain. Subaru would have been my purchase due to $$ difference. I have a 2017 Forester that I like due to economy and comfort,
@John Dough depends on the use of the vehicle. I have no plans of climbing a mountain or severe off roading. I need 4x4 for snow, and back roads in my National forest. I'll take the comforts of the Wilderness.
I believe some folks were missing the reason for the comparison. The Toyota was a benchmark to base the capabilities of the Wilderness Edition, not to see which one is a better off roader. My next vehicle will be the Outback Wilderness Edition. I love Jeeps, but I am a city slicker, and have no real reason to own one for the driving that I do. The Outback is made for softroading, road trips and grocery getting. If money were not an object, I certainly would get a Jeep with the EcoDiesel, but I would also not live in my tiny condo, and go offroading as much as I could in my spare time. Such as it is, the Subaru is great for my needs.
So are you saying you prefer being in your tiny condo than go outside? Maybe you were never really going to be a jeep owner? But I have one and have to say its not as bad a grocery duties nowadays
@@googleleavemynamealone9145 I haven't a clue as to what you are trying to convey. I now own the Outback Wilderness Edition and am quite pleased with my purchase and its capabilities. If I lived in the country, like I used to, then my old Kaiser Jeep M-715 would have been a great back up vehicle to have for harsher or challenging obstacles. As it is, the Subaru is great for my needs.
I have owned 4 Wranglers, and now own a Subaru. Wranglers are great if you are going to be off-roading a lot because they make so many off-road accessories for them and you can really build them up. I live in a really remote area that requires four wheel drive to get to the majority of the time. So I bought Jeep Wranglers for several years. However, I had numerous problems with them including major problems with the lifters and cam in the 3.6 engines. These problems combined (total cost for all 4 vehicles to get repaired by a dealership were $21,876.34 luckily I bought extended warranties on all but one) with not so great fuel mileage, made me change over to a Subaru. Once I got past the fact I was driving a Subaru, I fell in love with it. It has gotten me through some rough snow storms and rain washed muddy roads. They are very efficient and reliable vehicles. Go check out what the locals drive in the ski towns and you will be surprised.
The wife and I picked up a 2022 Outback Wilderness last weekend. Its a badass suv. Looks amazing inside and out and its super comfortable. We live in FL and its super flat here but driving on the sandy beaches and getting out the trenches is easy work for the Outback without sacrificing all the comfy amenities. We like camping and hiking and there isnt a place we cant go with the Outback here in FL. Only complaint is the 6 speaker audio system. It just plain sucks. First upgrade is the audio.
I live in Australia and did a recent trip out to Alice Springs in the desert with my FJ Cruiser. My friend had a Subaru Forester. The Subaru could handle all but one of the official tracks of the East and West MacDonnell ranges. These tracks were mainly rocks and sand. You can do a lot more with the Subaru than you think!
Imagine how much better they would have done with the new Wilderness edition! Unfortunately, I checked with Subaru and they don't think they're bringing the Wilderness in to the country :(
Well, you could. But if they'd use a good transmission you could more than once every decade. I love Subaru and want a Crosstrek with the new bigger engine IF they'd put a real transmission back in with a slower first gear. Or if they're design their own CVT that's way stronger for towing (as in a small trailer with an ATV or something if needed), more reliable, and offered high and low range. Always wondered, if ATV'S have low in CVT why not a Subaru?
@@jackle842000 because regardless of how you want to slice it the biggest customer based they have is middle aged women. The cars are functional in ice and snow which is why they buy them. If you want it on your Subaru you'll have to modify it and explaining why the low range is crawling to a woman who won't care is wasting money. IF Subaru ever did that it would cost $8000 more for the package. The wilderness is a joke btw.
I've rented 4Runners often while traveling and never fully enjoyed the driving experience or ergonomics. Nice room for extra people and camera gear but not exciting to drive. Bought my son a Crosstrek Sport and was thoroughly impressed with the attention to detail and driving experience. Whether driving canyon roads to the beach or going skiing the Subaru is a very fun and comfortable car to drive.
I had a 4x4 Tacoma a few years ago for work and it was not exactly fun. The seating position was uncompromising and road noise was bad. I definitely respect their pedigree and reliability but man, it’s hard to like one after using it for awhile
No doubt, suburbs drive well. then again, one is a car, one is a body on frame truck, so to be expected, especially given the weight difference. The other thing to consider is the 5th gen 4 runner reviewed here was last redesigned in 2011. Pretty crazy it’s a 10 year old model that has only had the most minor changes.
The 4 runner is king except for mpg but the Subaru did better than expected. Put the same all terrains on the Subaru and you got perhaps the best adventure all arounder
@@Rodisflawless yeah. I own a car with a CVT. It is awesome on the road and whatnot. I have no real complaints. But slow driving or any driving that would involve working the tranny....yeah, not a good choice
As much as I like this channel, you shouldn't watch it to get a fair comparison between cars, because you won't get it. They have cars they like, and they really don't make it a secret that they're helping a certain car to win. Such as the 4runner in this case...they didn't like the OEM tires on it, so they put pretty decent A/T tires on it. They didn't think the OEM tires on the Subaru were that great, but they left them on and compared them as equals. Plus they just don't always use built in traction features and such correctly or at all, giving the advantage to whatever car they're favoring. tl;dr, cool channel, the car they want to come out on top will but at least they aren't super secret about being shady.
@@WaruiKoohii favored or not, the 4Runner would win every time. CVT doesn’t compare to a standard automatic, and add in Toyota’s superior drive modes, 4 Low, locking differentials, and the Subie is at a distinct disadvantage. No need to complain, the Toyota is made to be a better off road vehicle. And it costs a lot more too.
@@WaruiKoohii the Subaru was on loan, that's why they babied it more. I'd reckon that's also why they didn't upgrade the tires. The Toyota is their's to modify and they went with a tire that is more capable than stock. With limited budgets/resources they can't line up every test to be as fair as possible. Maybe once they get more income from the channel, that can improve.
Offroading is a valid test, but not enough emphasis in reviews about how well Subaru handles slippery roads. The amount of control I have is crazy. Big open parking lot in the middle of winter, making sharp sudden turns, never losing control. Almost boring. Any of my other vehicles and the backend is trying to slide out or understeering. The 4x4s are clawing their ways out of the ditch while the Subarus never get in the ditch in the first place.
and for that reason, it will still be successful. wildly so in the PNW. I could see people having one Outback Wilderness as a daily and maybe a vastly customized rock crawling Wrangler, or just one 4Runner. and i think going either route is perfectly valid.
It's not about people, it's about uses. I wouldn't want the 4Runner for a 125-mile commute in "mountain driving" conditions (i.e. anything is possible), but I also can't imagine the Subaru on anything more than an easy dirt road. The CVT is a PITA in the best conditions and it doesn't have any low gearing. Subaru claims 8.5" of ground clearance, but that is the clearance of the entire underbody. The stock 4Runner is 9" (ish?) minimum ground clearance -- i.e. a single low point. Further, approach, break over and departure angles are what you would expect in a car. One is a truck that drives fine on road, one is a car that can be driven in dirt. If you have a long daily commute and expect to travel extensively off pavement, you need both.
I’m loving this battle. But the Subaru still made it ;) And can we just talk about that turning radius? If there were dirt roads to my office , I would so be in the 4Runner camp. Maybe I should change jobs. I love both vehicles!
I was just laying here on the couch selling an outback to my wife.... when in the first 30 seconds, I recognize the spot where we cur our christmas tree! Then proceed to notice the trail system they're using is in our back yard! Great video, great review!
I'm watching you from Germany. I'm so jealous of the cool cars you have in the USA. We don't have any 4Runners and the Outback is only a standard model without a turbo engine. Your videos are wonderful! Thank you so much for that!
In America, we do get some pretty cool 'adventure' oriented rides. There are lots of places to have fun around here and millions of people live on dirt roads out in the country.
I have an Outback and 4Runner... the Outback is an unbeatable road car especially in snow country. The 4Runner is a great off-road machine. The Outback is not a serious off-road machine. The Outback can handle light off-road situations just fine, but that CVT transmission will burn up if you aren't careful. Don't get an Outback and try to follow Jeeps and 4Runners. You will burn and bash it up pretty fast...
Agreed that Outback is unbeatable road car with off road capability. I've had a 2010 for years and a 2019 replacement with no CVT issues whatsoever while towing a boat with the 2010 for years on end. That said the 4Runner is more truck like and it shows off road.
Impressive performance by the Wilderness. But hey, if you're serious about off-roading, come on, the 4Runner is very tough to beat. If your definition of off-roading is a wide track made of gravel, the Wilderness model seems to be very adequate.
I bought a new 4Runner Sport V8 back in 2004. Little did I know that I would still be driving it every day in 2021. Over 200,000 miles with zero problems - and I'm taking it on a 2,000-mile cross-country trip next month. The biggest issue with my 4Runner is that I really want to get a new vehicle soon - but I can't find a good reason to buy one. My best advice to anyone who is thinking of getting a 4Runner is to make sure and get all the options you want, and get the right color because you are probably going to live with it for decades.
@@zzanatos2001 guess gas is cheap enough in the US that going for something more efficient like the Outback isn't really necessary. $4.90USD/gallon (3.78L) here in Vancouver BC. Makes gas guzzlers pretty painful. You are definitely getting your dollars' worth out of your 4runner, which is awesome.
@@bradcomis1066 that about what prices are like here in california. i just paid over 5/gallon the other day for premium. lots of the country is still pretty cheap in the 3 dollar range though. all depends where ya live
We can realistically expect gas prices of over $6 in the near future with Sippy Cup Sleepy Joe skuttling the newly gained energy independence of the United States in favor of buying the same amount of fuel from competitors overseas. Databyter
Impressed by the subie! If i would be going for a full off-road adventure/project i'd choose the toyota of course. But If i'd just be an off-road&camping adventure amateur i'd go for the subie for sure.
Yeah my only beef with the outback wilderness is it really expensive for The fact that it’s still doesn’t have a normal automatic transmission, no real four-wheel-drive. Subarus thing is being cheap but capable enough, the outback is capable but not cheap.
@@jpc3984 Yes and honestly those CVT's scare me. I don't think I'm ready to trust my $40k on something that might hand grenade and leave me stranded 1000 miles away from home.
@@frankish5314 The Wilderness Drivetrain is warrantied for 6 years or 60,000 miles. Subaru is standing behind their new CVT. This is the CVT used in the Ascent which is tow rated for 5,000 lbs. If your gonna have CVT problems for your usage, chances are you will have them within that Warranty period. That is huge and worth 40K in my opinion. Databyter
Ryan thank you for taking the Wilderness on a little adventure. I was impressed with its ability to direct power to the wheels that weren't spinning. I have watched the regular Outbacks and the like spin their wheels - going nowhere. Excellent job on the editing and Karleen adds to the episode.
I have a 2022 Outback Wilderness and a 2015 4Runner so theses challenges were particularly fun to watch. I think they are both excellent vehicles with their own individual attributes. I would never be doing that level of off-roading. More mud , loose rock and lots of snow where both are very capable. Great videos!
You guys are the best! Thank you so much for this video!!! So well done. Excellent editing and production! As a Subaru sales rep and future Wilderness owner, I value this. I’ve owned a 4Runner and loved it... but for the value and performance....Outback all the way always!🙂
I’m going outback all day. They both handle the terrain and the fuel economy it’s much more realistic on the outback for a daily driver. The reality is, most people who buys these vehicles are not driving through that type of terrain.
No thanks. There's a reason most offroad Aussies stick with Nissan Patrols, Land cruisers Hiluxes etc. No bash plates that's a bad day CVT off roading is asking for premature death that's why Toyota won't budge for the Truck class anyone that knows there grit of actual offroading and not trail driving knows there's a minimum requirement for ground clearance and Subarus don't have that
@@Tallnerdyguy i think more people get them for the bulletproof factor and resell value. Subarus lose there value pretty quick conpared to a 4 runner or tacoma
I don’t even own a Toyota but I do like the wheels 😊. I would totally put em on an older Hilux diesel if I had one, should have bought a JDM ‘runner while they were cheap here in British Columbia, oh well.
This is exactly the test I was waiting, those are the only modern cars I am interested in, otherwise I'd have to go for an '05 pajero sport, and both outback wildernerness and 4runner trd pro are US-exclusive. Since I am from Europe, well done motor companies, you f us once again
Same here...wish I could get me a 4runner TRD Offroad over here in Germany - so far my 2018 Forester is holding up well tho when it comes to some more "serious" offroading...hoping to be able to upgrade sometime rather sooner than later
4runner I can live without, a Hilux or Isuzu with a bit of is a good alternative, but that we cannot get the newer turbo engined Subarus here in Norway /EU is just a shame..
we may have a few more offroad vehicles in north america but you guys in europe have us beat in terms of sports cars and wagons, y'all have so many of them and so much choice in general it's not even funny
Seeing someone put the outback wilderness through its paces outside of a subaru press course was great. Excellent production quality and I hope subaru will loan you out more offroad vehicles in the future for these kinds of tests, far more capable than it looks
@@javar2r3ra Did we watch the same video? It doesnt have a dedicated super low gear, that's the only thing holding it back. I own one and take it anywhere my jeep can go.
@@ozzyakiro4734 yes we watched the same video. All you Subaru guys are the same, "if only it had" excuses. Like I said, it's a station wagon with all wheel drive, and you guys think it's a real 4wd. 🤣
The Subaru: more comfortable, better mileage, cheaper, easier to park, cheaper to insure And it hangs with a trd 4runner on trails that most of it's owners will never endeavor to take on .. And on the tires it came with! Big win in my books. Guaranteed that 4runner gets even worse mileage with that wheel/tire package...
That 4 Runner has a bullet proof rep not to mention you hardly lose any money when you sell it might even make a profit these days...if the Subaru reliability is close to the Toyota it should be a no brainer for most...
I went back and forth for a few months between Outback and 4 runner. I bought the Outback XT and very happy I did. I live in Nevada and go off on trails for hiking and mountain biking. Longs drives are more enjoyable with the Outback vs my SUV I had.
This just proves that a subaru does pretty much all you would ever need. If you do anything more than that you should just be getting a dedicated off roader at that point
You mean everything you would ever need. My last camping spot needing 4WD I would have never made it out with a Subaru. 0 percent chance. And yes I’ve owned an Outback recently.
@@veganpotterthevegan all I'm saying is it's better than your average outback. Hell no it won't do hardcore off roading, but it's still pretty darn impressive. Throw some KO2s on it and it would do even better. You'd have to be a little off in the head to believe its on the same level as a true 4x4.
I'm actually really impressed with the Subaru. I knew the 4Runner would handle all these with ease, also great choice on the new tires and wheels, I love that color combo. But I did not think the Subaru would do as well as it did. Really, unless you're regularly doing trails this difficult or harder, the Subaru is a great choice, because it (probably) does literally everything else better than the 4Runner, and is much easier, comfortable, and economical to live with. (I have a 5th gen 4Runner with all terrains, BTW, and I drive with a light foot and do mostly highway at 70 mph or under, and I typically get about 20.5 MPG with it) That said, I wouldn't buy a Subaru, because I don't like their engines, and I'm still not sold on the CVT. If they ever get around to updating their engines and putting in say an 8 or 10 speed auto, I'd be a potential customer.
The engines and the CVT keeps me away from Subaru as well....or at least if they'd offer a manual transmission they might get my interest but the CVT in itself keeps me away. They're cars are capable in certain models like the Outback Wilderness, its not 4x4 rock crawling vehicle of course but for most of us who just drive down some gravel and dirt backroads to a camping spot occasionally, the Subaru would be a great fit for those duties, as well as snow/ice.
@@somethingelse9535 Nothing wrong with them other than the fact they still have the same power outputs they've had for what 20+ years...although good for snow/ice as they don't have as much power to just sit there and spin the wheels like today's high horsepower/torque crossovers do. They had issues with overheating and cylinder head warping did they fix those problems in the newer models? I think those were issues in the early to mid-2000's? They've come quite a ways with their CVT's as shown in some recent videos with the Wilderness models.
@@wildbill23c The only real issue with them were the 2.5L NA motors from 2002 to around 2005 with head gaskets. Which at worst was a gradual thing, not a leave you stranded fault. (the fix is to use the gasket from the Turbo model). Otherwise Subarus are extremely reliable. If you want a modern car with old used forever motor designs, try Toyota. There's a reason Toyota and Subaru stick with a design.
@@somethingelse9535 I've been eying the new Subaru Outback Wilderness lately. I wanted a Ford Maverick AWD Fx4 but they're so backed up with orders, and I'm not all that fond of a turbo replacing a larger displacement engine LOL. So the Outback Wilderness might find itself in the driveway in the next year or so.
I just bought my daughter a 2022 Outback Wilderness, she loves it. I paid just over 49,000 with an added hitch, a little bumpier tire, plus the trade in of my daughters older Subaru. Subies rock!
I have a 2022 Outback Wilderness. I would not trade it in for anything. Good fuel economy, turbo, and pretty capable AWD. I have taken my Subaru to gnarlier places than in this video. No sweat. Almost 3ft of snow, deep mud and severe grades. Love this channel, great content.
I'm a former Rubicon owner (loved it), current 4runner owner (love more) but may move to the Subaru. Throw some BFG ATs on and that vehicle will really shine. With much better gas milage than my last and current vehicle (though little less cargo space than 4runner).
In these tests the Subaru kept up with the 4-runner and did quite well and I thought the challenges were very difficult. It’s still not as capable obviously but it seems like it’s a significantly better than a basic outback or forester. Very impressive.
My Forester Touring with a 2 inch lift from Ironman 4X4 and the Falken Wildpeaks can do as much as a Forester Wilderness. Sadly you can no longer get skid plates from Subaru. Ralitek had the best skid plates on the market, (my opinion). But for any serious off roading (if you don’t have a Wilderness trim), you’ll need to install an additional engine and transmission cooler. My wife will Not let me take her Outback on anything more than light off roading (like her parents’ 3 mile long driveway in MT), but she’s ok when I do a bit more in my Forester. For serious off roading, we take our 4X4 pickup.
Just bought a 2021 Crosstrek Sport. I immediately lifted it 2" and put on a set of Toyo ATIII's and a skid plate. It handled Moab without a problem but I stayed off the more aggressive trails. All this in a much more agile and fuel friendly vehicle .. been averaging 30 mpg.
Thanks Ryan for a great review!! I’ve been waiting for The Wilderness and you just demonstrated that it has more capabilities than I’ll ever need. Subaru has hit a home run with this.
Interesting comparo. I was expecting the 4Runner to trounce, but the Subie did quite well (and I own an Outback). For "heavy lifting," I'd still pick the 4Runner, but for more moderate adventures combined with daily driving, the Subaru looks to be a fine choice as well.
I love this channel. One of my favorites for sure. Having owned a 4Runner TRD OR in the past, I wasn't surprised that it tackled everything without issues. However the Subie did surprise me. I didn't think it could make it. Awesome job
Much respect for the subaru's but let be honest that 4Runner is made for strictly off-roading and it was not even driven to its full potential. Toyota for the win.
Subaru is a comfortable safe AWD vehicle. However that outback with the same kind of tires as on the 4 runner may perform a little better for the intended test. We know. Subaru hasn't built a real 4x4 suv yet. Up to now It's an excellent AWD.
@@housco11 your right is it a good vehicle nothing taken but... it is still not a full 4x4 meaning that in a tight situation would you take a Subaru out in the wild country hunting probably not. Most will have a truck or real 4x4 they just have different suspensions longer travel better shocks etc.. I'd take the Subaru to the beach though... they actually nice... just like the toyotas better
@@Adrian-jh5cr I agree with you in some points, and I think one of the weak points of the Outback is low travel due to independent suspension front and back, but the Subi with better tires a lift and suspension has a lot to offer. Having said that, more often than not, the driver makes a lot of difference, as seen in the video on the following link ruclips.net/video/_RafVwMjOKY/видео.html I own a 2004 Legacy but I wouldn't buy an Outback to do off road (for overlanding perhaps) I own an old Jeep for off road and a 426 Unimog for mix off road and some work.
@@Adrian-jh5cr Yeah properly equipped they can do a lot, considering they are AWD and have independent suspension, there's a guy here on RUclips that travels around on a lifted forester with Ko2s and it does pretty well.
Great review!. I would say the deciding factor for getting an AWD over a 4x4 is usually MPG. The wilderness edition was definitely impressive and I think it did great!. The biggest issue that isn't shown in the video is heat. Here in the California desert that CVT will overheat very quickly when pushed up climbs. Dealing with that much wheel spin and climbing over an extended period of time has proven to overheat the Subaru CVT in our experiences. I do not doubt that wilderness will do a 40% grade... the real question is... for how long!
Exactly right. Great vehicles, but unfortunate they used a CVT. Even automatics without dedicated coolers can overheat in sand and snow. Having 4lo helps that significantly. The CVT just cannot provide the torque to overcome the braking force on the spinning wheel. The whole X mode system is fighting itself braking the slipping wheel to simulate a diff lock and the whole time it’s putting more heat into the CVT. If you did this often you would run into problems for sure. Heat is the killer of any automatic or CVT.
I live in the high mountains of Colorado and there are jeep roads of varying difficulty everywhere. If your goal is off-roading, it’s a no brainer, get the 4-Runner. However, if your goal is to get to hiking trailheads or reach some interesting campsites, get the Outback Wilderness. For me, I spend 90% of my time driving on the highway and the last 10% on jeep roads getting to hiking trailheads. Most of these jeep roads are only moderately difficult. Consequently, I am purchasing the Outback Wilderness. Thanks Ryan for making my choice an easy one.
You definitely showed at the end of the video that driving skill and experience has as much to do with off roading as the vehicle. So yes crawl control is a cool trick.
Agreed. It was the first thing I changed on my 4R. Toyota really should be selling these with more capable off road tires, but that might cut into sales of the Pro version.
Subaru has had me thoroughly impressed as of late. Their attention to detail and everyday focusing is great. I'm bummed they didn't put the turbo in the Forester Wilderness, or bring back the XT, but I'm sure it's on the horizon now that Foresters have taken over as the top sales vehicle for them.
@@javar2r3ra I wouldn’t call it “pathetic”. All things considered, the Outback is a car posing as an SUV. So with stock tires and a CVT that cripples it due to its lack of a low-range gear. Getting up that corse was pretty gnarly. There’s some CUVs that can’t do that.
It’s very impressive. It only needed 1 quart of oil to top it off this time. And the cvt went out on his way back home instead of on the trail. Very impressive indeed.
Actually this model uses smaller rims and taller tires designed to hold more air, that can be aired down, which makes a TREMENDOUS DIFFERENCE when going over rocks and stumps. The tire deforms over the obstacle and grabs it like a glove. I get why reviewers don't air down, but people going over challenging roads do, and carry either a small air tank or an electric pump with them to re-air at the highway. It really makes a big difference and most serious AT or AT light tires are designed to be aired down with less chance of slipping a bead. Databyter
I just found out this amazing channel a few days ago and I have already watched so many of your videos and I seriously love them you guys are doing amazing job .
That 4Runner is definitely the benchmark. I can’t believe how well that Subaru did. I just picked up a 2018 outback with the 3.6R. It’s really a great vehicle
What kind of fuel economy do you get in the outback? Looking to replace my wife's Legacy, and weighing economy vs power for occasional trips to Utah and Colorado.
@@forkthepork I get between 23.7 and 24mpg combined. It’s a pretty big vehicle with a pretty powerful flat six. So it’s actually not too bad. The lack of high mpg is definitely worth that extra power
I think one thing people are forgetting is also that the subaru is sort of pushing its limits to do this kind of stuff. Yes you CAN do this with the Subie, and its great that it can handle this kind of stuff from time to time, but... If you did this regularly with your outback it would definitely pop some rivets. Where as the 4Runner is made for this and is not pushing any limits at all.
Great video as always Ryan. I greatly appreciate your work in taking these vehicles in real life situations that many of us use them in. Far more informative than the reviewers that never venture off the pavement.
Great review. I had a 2011 Outback that I loved. Great fuel economy, and light off-road capability, excellent awd system for driving in the snow (one of the best out there). I am glad to see the Wilderness version is living up to the hype. I am impressed that the Outback could handle (not with ease) those rough trails. The 4-Runner did as expected. You can’t go wrong with the Toyota, but the Outback smokes it on economy and handling. Really, I wouldn’t be trying to decide between the two vehicles. The 4-Runner is a truck, super rugged, and compares best to a Jeep or a Bronco. For the crossovers, I think Subaru wins against all the other unibody vehicles. Well, maybe the RAV4 Adventure it’s it’s arch rival (But Jeep Cherokee Trailhawk is King). That trail test would be more applicable than this, but is great to see the Wilderness can almost keep up with the 4-Runner. The Outback is like a Swiss Army knife. It’s just does almost everything you need it to do.
Thanks for confirming my decision that I still want to trade in my 2" spacer lifted 2018 Outback 3.6 for a 6th gen 4Runner when they finally come out. Toyota fanboy here. The Outback certainly has done a better than expected job on trails but I just want that 4Runner, can't afford the gas on the current one.
Nice, thanks for the insightful tips. Just bought a 2023 Wilderness and I am incredibly satisfied with it "out of the box". And FYI, I'm a 25 year veteran of the Old Dale District running over that terrain with 3 generations of Toyotas!
On 12/11/22 I bought a 19 Forester Touring from Carter Subaru in Shoreline WA. My “new” Subie had only 4,700 miles. I was so impressed with the staff at Carter, that the 3 hour drive was worth it. My Forester is a Certified Subaru. We get 5-6 feet of snow every winter so I was looking for a low mileage Forester for myself at a good price and light colored exterior. Mine is Sephia Bronze with Saddle Brown interior. It’s a beautiful Forester. The previous owner put on Michelin Cross Climate tires. I’m very impressed with the traction from the tires. The only reason why I bought my Forester is because of how well my wife’s 19 Outback handles all road conditions. My wife’s Outback still has factory tires (her Outback only has 21K miles), so we’ll be driving my Forester to MT for a mini family reunion over New Years. It’ll be interesting to see how it compares with our Outback for our MT road trip. I hate the Stop Start function and the Drivers distraction on my Forester so I have to disable it every time. But I love everything else about my Subie. This spring I’ll be adding a Ironman 4X4 2” lift and skid plates from Ralitek . I’ve already added a K&N intake, mud flaps, WeatherTech window vents, bug shield, and full floor mats (in brown). When it gets warmer I’ll have it pinstriped. I will also be adding a FlowMaster exhaust. I’ve got a dashboard cover on back order.
I have a 2020 Forester and I love it. I don’t do a lot of off roading but I do wish to do it more. My pick is the Outback since I’ll probably use it more as a daily/ family car than an off roader. But I must say 4runner has been my dream to have and honestly I’m rooting for it but the fuel economy is going to be a big deal for me.
Outback huge interior quiet ride and safety features including near autonomous driving I used in traffic daily it’s a no brainer. It’s the only car I don’t get tired after 10 hrs. Audi Q7, xc90 in comparison. 4 runner is a truck, period. I’ll get one if I off-road more than 50 percent. Check the spec of outback rear leg room and head space vs ANY VEHICLE!
@@edwardlaw797 Absolutely 100% correct. As someone who purchased an Outback Onyx edition last year I considered the 4runner but ultimately gas mileage, and 4runners lack of blind spot monitoring did it for me.
Really, it showed that subaru is a joke off road. Now imagine it loaded with gear , along with your family that 4runners and jeeps tend to haul.. This thing was loaded and had problems. They just need to get rid of cvt or make more Manual transmission. If they are concerned about gas, then make a more efficient engine. But honestly I did harder stuff than that this weekend in my gladiator ecodiesel, and it gets better mpg than both , has more torqe, more room, and latest tech and comfort., ps, I pulled one out of sand at Lopez lake sunday.lol.
@@taraaaron1242 Jeeps are basically purpose-built for off-roading. Subarus are made for every-day driving with off-road capabilities. Not everyone likes the utilitarian styling of the Jeep, and that's fine. The Jeep is also a lot more expensive, so that's a consideration. My Forester Sport has done an amazing job with everything I've thrown at it, including driving in snow up to the bumpers. I will agree that the CVT is a weak-point, but as far as CVT's go, it's actually pretty good.
I really wish Subaru would've spent their time developing an auto transmission instead of throwing their CVT into everything. The CVT was the biggest reason why I got rid of my Crosstrek (that and it's horrible power out put). Got into a WRX and it's great, but when it's time to grow up and get a family car, it's probably going to be a Toyota.
Agree but offer this counterpoint: I just sold my Outback 3.6R due to concerns with frequent towing and the CVT (had one replaced under warranty). Bought a 4Runner and took it on a trip last week with the camper. The five-speed AT was hunting constantly so I had to use manual select mode. It was still a compromise and loud getting over Sonora Pass in 2nd and 3rd gear. The gearing was truly annoying compared to the CVT. Never thought I'd say this about the CVT. Still glad to not have the mechanical hassles of our Subaru though.
The CVT is horrible on the crosstreks especially the 1st gen. That and the gutless 2.0 is the reason why I'm selling mine soon. The only good thing about these cars is that they hold their value extremely well especially in the north east.
Crosstrek is great for doordashing. You know, potholes, paved asphalt street hills and the ocassional gps mapping thru an unpaved rural road on a long dried up lake bed with rain divots.
The Wilderness seems like a great value at 39K while the prices on 4Runner is crazy high, for long term purchase the 4Runner still reins due to resale value. I'm sure Subaru will make changes every year/other year so the re sales won't be nearly as high long term.
It isn't just resale value, it is also reliability. The Toyota and pretty much every one in their family has a life span of about 400K and beyond for many. And that is with regular maintenance and very few major repairs.
@@gabrielreyes8476 Exaggerate much? Real stats have been analyzed on the topic, only about 4% of 4Runners make it to 200k miles. About 5% of Chevy Suburbans make it to 200k miles, by comparison. Normal people don't keep cars much beyond 100k miles, but almost every manufacturer has examples of cars that make it to a million miles, or darn near it, including Subaru.
@@mechmat12345 Could care less about your "stats" and I never exaggerate; I'm speaking from real world experience. I have an uncle who still drives his 1986 Corolla. Currently, almost 780k miles on it. Never a major repair. My sister's 1992 4Runner SR5, 520k on the clock. Never any major repairs and still runs flawlessly. My neighbor's 2001 Avalon, over 600k on the clock. Never a major repair. Currently a garage queen, but still runs flawlessly. I'd like to know what you consider "normal". Yes, every manufacturer has examples, but in the real world, not on paper, Toyota's and Honda's are proven to last outrageous lengths of time. Subi's included.
That CVT is why I’m a “bitter clinger” when it comes to my 2013 Forester. As a great patriot once said, _”From time to time, the Tree of Liberty must be watered with the transmission fluid of CVT-equipped Subies.”_
I own 2 vehicles. A 5th Gen 4Runner and and a 2020 Outback XT Onyx. This was a satisfying video knowing both can perform well. My 4Runner is my tow vehicle and offroader, and the Outback is a great road tripper for everything else. Really two different tools for two different purposes. I enjoy driving the Outback on roads and gravel roads more, and 4Runner makes easy work on the harder stuff with a locker and 4LO.
I'd take the Subaru because I know that it is more than capable for the kind of trails that I would be on. Also, the fact that the vast majority of my driving would be on paved roads makes it an easy choice.
The Outback IMO is a weekend warrior’s “soft” off-road vehicle. Comparing it to a legendary 4Runner (body on frame) wasn’t fair, maybe the new Ford Timberline would have been a better head-to-head comparison. I’ll pick the 4Runner if I am doing serious off-road or overlanding. ✌️🇨🇦
@@forza388 Come on. It’s a lifted grocery hauler posing as an “off-road” vehicle. And have you ever wonder why none of the 4WD vehicles have CVT transmission? Because their engineers know that it wouldn’t stand a chance in real off-road adventures. ✌️🇨🇦
@@mariog5062 I disagree, everyone has his opinion! Sure this car is not a Rubicon or 4 runner! It's not an extreme offroader! But it is very capable for what it is! And in the city ots much better! Very well rounded!
@@mariog5062 How many people do you know, even Wrangler owners who really use the full potential of its trail capability? The Subaru is what most people need and doesn't sell itself as the most capable rock crawler. I just don't understand why people don't understand that. Show me anywhere in the marketing where they claim to be the end all of off-roaders and tackling the ultimate rock crawling course. For 90%of the camping, outdoorsy population this wilderness will be sufficient. Plus they can still use if as a daily driver that won't kill them on gas. Did I mention blindspot monitoring is standard?
Having owned 4 Runners, Land Cruisers, and Subarus, the Outbacks are far more comfortable and economical to drive over long distances than the 4Runner. The 4Runner is more capable when things get really nasty, but that usually represents a very small amount of driving over the life of the vehicle. Land Cruisers are the best overall, but very costly to purchase and operate. The Outbacks drive more like cars with really good trail handling characteristics and the Wilderness only improves that. I'd get the 4Runner for towing and heavy trail use, but I'd get a Wilderness for everything else. It's a better all around package for touring and easy to medium off road use.
On road, in normal life, if you own a certain size trailer, then, well, only the Toyota is “capable”. No matter if you never go off road or do that every day.
@@JeepCherokeeful Most of the Subaru crowd won't pull anything larger than a small trailer or a teardrop. Roof tents are super popular with them as well as the roof is rated for the weight. Even 4Runners and Jeeps aren't great for towing. That's what a Tundra or a F-250 or F-350 trucks is for, and diesels models are even better. There's no such thing as one universal all around vehicle and it's best to weigh your needs and buy accordingly.
I'm sure the 4runner is the superior performer but it really invalidates any comparison when the tires on the 4runner are significantly better. Why bother if you're not keeping things equal where you can?
@@javar2r3ra Would you like to play basketball in High heels vs playing in Basketball shoes? Put snow tires on the Outback, and Off Road tires on the 4Runner and then lets do a street run on 6 inches of snow and see which one handles better?
Idk why but Subaru never gets a Fair game. Always needs to stand up against 4x4s or clearly more off-road capable cars... Subaru should get compared to Audi quattro,Volvo Cross country and so on.
@@marcymcsheehan3579 dude you literally could put fucking highway tires and steelies on the 4runner and it would still walk over the subiewooo in mud or rocks
Just bought a 2021 TRD Off-Road Premium. Loving it so far. Need to find some winter tires and wheels for our deep snow in the snow belt where 20" over night is not that uncommon.
Jim, Toyo Open Country ATIII are incredible. I had them on my 4runner and so do several other friends. I would drive 1200 mile trips with them , no noise either.
Only Ryan and Carlina make Subaru offroad videos like this, there’s literally no competition (because the other comparable channel doesn’t get them 😃). I’m sure I speak for most of the internet when I say “I love you ❤️ “. Good results with the Outback Wilderness. I can honestly say from my experiences with a 2015 Forester XT, the Outback wilderness is a lot more capable. My Subaru would have stalled out on the rutted climb with the speed you approached it at. That’s one major complaint with the CVT Subarus, people say the CVT cuts power, but it’s always seemed to be simply transmission stall. The other complaint is overheating. I recently went on a Utah trip with my friend that has an Ascent. We climbed Croton road near the Alstrom Point/ Brand Bench area and we had to do a sustained climb up and over the mountains. This road would easily make a Crosstrek overheat, but the Ascent stayed cool. Transmission temps were monitored via Scangauge II, and the Ascent never went higher than 217F (I’ve seen Crosstreks hit 270F, triggering the CVT temp light). The Outback wilderness is said to have the same gearing as the Ascent, sounds like there may be even more improvements. Edit** it’s not just the gear ratio, Subaru must have done something with the cooling system, because a 14.3:1 crawl ratio isn’t enough to keep a transmission cool.***. With a smaller package and less weight, I’d be interested to see a climbing stress test compared to an 2021/2022 Outback 2.5. We know the wilderness will do better, but I’d be curious to see how much better.
@@KamenKachev I’m sure that would make a lot of people happy! One of the reasons Subaru doesn’t go with a 9 speed automatic is because the current offerings just wouldn’t fit the design. Dual range gear box they can DEFINITELY Do! Right?
As someone that off-roads his subaru a lot in Utah, it's not really keeping up. It definitely could on these trails though. I'm disappointed they picked Geolander tires for the car.
@@veganpotterthevegan Tires can completely change the characteristics of nearly any vehicle. Sometimes with my WJ, I wish I had bought a set of MTs before I ever lifted it and just drove the heck out of it. Now I have a small lift and 31" MTs and I can go way more places than I ever imagined. 33s here I come!
I bought a brand new Subaru Outback in 2012. It was the 2.5L model. The Outback now has over 410,000km on it (255,000mi) and is ready to retire. It took my family to so many places, adventures and towed our ATV, dirt bike, Sea-Doo and pop-up camper. All I did was regular oil/filter changes, kept it nice and clean and rust-proofed it every fall (we live in southern Ontario, so snow and salt roads are the norm). The money it saved us by having the 2.5L engine with the CVT was great. My parents both have the 2010 Outback but with the 3.6R, so I see a big difference when it comes to mileage. I usually drove it to around 700km on a full ~60L tank (around 430mi on 16 gallons). I really like the 4Runner, but I think that given our Outback's performance, capability and value, we might go with another one, one day.
The Outback impressed me with its capability, however, the 4Runner accomplished the same feats with less effort and in a more controlled manner. Both have their strengths and compromises but in this case, the 4Runner is still clearly the superior off-roader. That said the Outback should still be capable enough to meet most SUV buyer's needs.
It definitely meets my needs, I just want to hit some beginner to intermediate trails on the weekends. Nothing too crazy, but enough to have some fun. If I really wanted more obviously the 4runner is king, but as a daily driver I see the subaru being more comfortable.
@@Stancedude1 bro I just got my 4 runner off road Premium and it was 47 they are just 10 grand more than the $38,000 wilderness I work at the subaru plant and most of the car is made with cheap materials every year. The Outback wilderness is probably the best car and the crosstrek Don't get the Ascent it's more expensive for a 4 cylinder boxer engine
I've had 7 Subaru's and can say I was not impressed when the CVT came about. But have racked on 366xxxkms on the last couple and never had one issue and I use them off road all the time also. The 4 runner is definitely the better grunt for extreme off road , but for the lower price , better milage , better highway driving and all-around great overlander, I'll stick with the Outback.. I've also upgraded to the Falken Wildpeak AT3w and they are a great tire also have the 2" lift whick helps alot off road ..i wish when the do these comparisons that they would outfit both vehicles with the same tires rather than just upgrading one
I watched this video about 2 months ago when I first started looking for a new car to replace my 2011 Outback 2.5i Limited. I had narrowed it down to these two models after watching a ton of videos and lots of forum threads. The engine in my Outback shit the bed 3 weeks ago. It was finally time to make a decision, so I went and test drove both vehicles. Ending up going with a 2022 4Runner Off Road Premium with the TRD wheels option. I choose it over the Subaru for a few reasons: The climate/heated seat controls are built into the screen on the Subie (this is super annoying!!), I preferred the styling, much more capable in off road scenarios, but mainly it came down to the build quality and reliability of the 4Runner. A well maintained Toyota can easily last +200k without any major repairs and they retain their value. Subaru makes great cars but mine was too unreliable, and it cost me $4k in repairs over the 3.5 years that I owned it. Only downside to the 4Runner is the gas mileage(I can get about 22mpg on the highway but usually stay around 18 around town) but otherwise no regrets. Hopefully this can help someone else with deciding which car to get.
Now that the video is over... I am glad I got to watch it... Here for the channel first and foremost... But, Carlena, Ryan, Subie and the Mighty 4Runner, make it way more enjoyable... Oh and yeah... I'd still take the 4Runner!!!!
Love the video, I'm so excited for my Wilderness, it's coming in the next few weeks. I haven't decided if I'm going to get the two extra skid plates for the differentials, did you find that they came in handy during this? Did they prevent any scraping?
It's only $600 for a vehicle that costs 40K. I would personally do it because I WILL and HAVE taken my Subarus off the beaten path and always have to be super careful. And even with skid plates you will still have to be careful, but it should help a lot and give you advance warning of problems in your line. Databyter
I was looking to buy a 4Runner but found a used 2018 Outback Limited for $20k with low miles and clean title. Currently waiting on Toyo at3 tires and 2” lift kit on it 🤷🏽♂️.
Toyota hasn’t put a Limited in the fleet for a long time. Mechanically, it has the same diff setup as the Lexus GX, so that would be another place to look for videos.
In a nutshell: the Outback gives you up to ~90% off-road capability while dedicated off-roaders sacrifice alot to get you that next 10%. Expanded version: the Outback is not a "rock crawler", it simply cannot produce low end torque delivered via a locking diff. But what it does do is give amazing off-road and deteriorated conditions capability via full-time AWD that's symmetrical, with minimal compromise to everyday use, in a very reliable package that's far more efficient than a truck/Wrangler.
The Subaru did this with much less aggressive tyres, ideally you want the same tread on both vehicles or it’s more a battle of tyres, it’d do a lot better with the more aggressive ATs. Also if you’re doing this type of thing in either vehicle you should have a deflator and a pump. Both vehicles are running at highway tyre pressure, they would both do this a lot easier with more appropriate off-road pressure.
I have a 2016 outback and I followed a bunch of friends in lifted trucks out way on a farm and they told me to leave my car behind because it wouldn't make it.. I made it no problem... they were all very impressed.
![I.N "HALLUCINATION" | [Stray Kids : SKZ-PLAYER]](http://i.ytimg.com/vi/n5B5q1Hwt_U/mqdefault.jpg)
This channel does a much better job of giving the Subaru a fighting chance at these comparisons. Realistic scenarios with truly objective points of view. I love this channel. I think Subaru hit a home run with this vehicle. A vehicle that can handle some tough stuff but yet doesn't compromise with the majority of everyday tasks like navigating a supermarket parking lot or driving to work with fuel efficiency.
For Subaru content, this channel is my favorite.
Best bang for the buck in safety, practicality and resell value.
I would on compare the two with the same tires. 4r had the advantage of more appropriate tires in this terrain. Subaru would have been my purchase due to $$ difference. I have a 2017 Forester that I like due to economy and comfort,
@Alan Contreras 4Runners from over a decade ago are still going for north of $25000....
@John Dough depends on the use of the vehicle. I have no plans of climbing a mountain or severe off roading. I need 4x4 for snow, and back roads in my National forest. I'll take the comforts of the Wilderness.
I believe some folks were missing the reason for the comparison. The Toyota was a benchmark to base the capabilities of the Wilderness Edition, not to see which one is a better off roader.
My next vehicle will be the Outback Wilderness Edition. I love Jeeps, but I am a city slicker, and have no real reason to own one for the driving that I do. The Outback is made for softroading, road trips and grocery getting. If money were not an object, I certainly would get a Jeep with the EcoDiesel, but I would also not live in my tiny condo, and go offroading as much as I could in my spare time. Such as it is, the Subaru is great for my needs.
So are you saying you prefer being in your tiny condo than go outside? Maybe you were never really going to be a jeep owner? But I have one and have to say its not as bad a grocery duties nowadays
@@googleleavemynamealone9145
I haven't a clue as to what you are trying to convey.
I now own the Outback Wilderness Edition and am quite pleased with my purchase and its capabilities. If I lived in the country, like I used to, then my old Kaiser Jeep M-715 would have been a great back up vehicle to have for harsher or challenging obstacles. As it is, the Subaru is great for my needs.
@@googleleavemynamealone9145 #coolguyclub
I have owned 4 Wranglers, and now own a Subaru. Wranglers are great if you are going to be off-roading a lot because they make so many off-road accessories for them and you can really build them up. I live in a really remote area that requires four wheel drive to get to the majority of the time. So I bought Jeep Wranglers for several years. However, I had numerous problems with them including major problems with the lifters and cam in the 3.6 engines. These problems combined (total cost for all 4 vehicles to get repaired by a dealership were $21,876.34 luckily I bought extended warranties on all but one) with not so great fuel mileage, made me change over to a Subaru. Once I got past the fact I was driving a Subaru, I fell in love with it. It has gotten me through some rough snow storms and rain washed muddy roads. They are very efficient and reliable vehicles. Go check out what the locals drive in the ski towns and you will be surprised.
The wife and I picked up a 2022 Outback Wilderness last weekend. Its a badass suv. Looks amazing inside and out and its super comfortable. We live in FL and its super flat here but driving on the sandy beaches and getting out the trenches is easy work for the Outback without sacrificing all the comfy amenities. We like camping and hiking and there isnt a place we cant go with the Outback here in FL. Only complaint is the 6 speaker audio system. It just plain sucks. First upgrade is the audio.
I live in Australia and did a recent trip out to Alice Springs in the desert with my FJ Cruiser. My friend had a Subaru Forester. The Subaru could handle all but one of the official tracks of the East and West MacDonnell ranges. These tracks were mainly rocks and sand. You can do a lot more with the Subaru than you think!
Imagine how much better they would have done with the new Wilderness edition! Unfortunately, I checked with Subaru and they don't think they're bringing the Wilderness in to the country :(
@@LordSothMajere you can buy a lot of the enhancements yourself.
Bring back the FJ!!
Well, you could. But if they'd use a good transmission you could more than once every decade. I love Subaru and want a Crosstrek with the new bigger engine IF they'd put a real transmission back in with a slower first gear. Or if they're design their own CVT that's way stronger for towing (as in a small trailer with an ATV or something if needed), more reliable, and offered high and low range. Always wondered, if ATV'S have low in CVT why not a Subaru?
@@jackle842000 because regardless of how you want to slice it the biggest customer based they have is middle aged women. The cars are functional in ice and snow which is why they buy them. If you want it on your Subaru you'll have to modify it and explaining why the low range is crawling to a woman who won't care is wasting money. IF Subaru ever did that it would cost $8000 more for the package. The wilderness is a joke btw.
Really impressed with the Subaru!! It had smaller, less aggressive tires with a lower profile sidewall and still did really well!
I've rented 4Runners often while traveling and never fully enjoyed the driving experience or ergonomics. Nice room for extra people and camera gear but not exciting to drive. Bought my son a Crosstrek Sport and was thoroughly impressed with the attention to detail and driving experience. Whether driving canyon roads to the beach or going skiing the Subaru is a very fun and comfortable car to drive.
I had a 4x4 Tacoma a few years ago for work and it was not exactly fun. The seating position was uncompromising and road noise was bad. I definitely respect their pedigree and reliability but man, it’s hard to like one after using it for awhile
4runners are nice if you live on a mountain pass but it's really uncomfortable for longer trips
No doubt, suburbs drive well. then again, one is a car, one is a body on frame truck, so to be expected, especially given the weight difference. The other thing to consider is the 5th gen 4 runner reviewed here was last redesigned in 2011. Pretty crazy it’s a 10 year old model that has only had the most minor changes.
The 4 runner is king except for mpg but the Subaru did better than expected. Put the same all terrains on the Subaru and you got perhaps the best adventure all arounder
Which is why I won’t ever buy a 4Runner until power and efficiencies have been greatly improved. Looking to 2023 for a major redesign
When I bought my 4 runner I went from an SUV that got about 15 MPG combined. So it was no change for me.
As a softroader the Subaru is amazing.
Albeit with a crappy CVT.
@@Rodisflawless yeah. I own a car with a CVT. It is awesome on the road and whatnot. I have no real complaints. But slow driving or any driving that would involve working the tranny....yeah, not a good choice
Symmetrical AWD KING
Don’t you think having the same tire is important for comparisons?
Tony, don't bring your sensibilities to this biased comparison XD I was thinking the same thing!
As much as I like this channel, you shouldn't watch it to get a fair comparison between cars, because you won't get it. They have cars they like, and they really don't make it a secret that they're helping a certain car to win. Such as the 4runner in this case...they didn't like the OEM tires on it, so they put pretty decent A/T tires on it. They didn't think the OEM tires on the Subaru were that great, but they left them on and compared them as equals. Plus they just don't always use built in traction features and such correctly or at all, giving the advantage to whatever car they're favoring.
tl;dr, cool channel, the car they want to come out on top will but at least they aren't super secret about being shady.
@@WaruiKoohii favored or not, the 4Runner would win every time. CVT doesn’t compare to a standard automatic, and add in Toyota’s superior drive modes, 4 Low, locking differentials, and the Subie is at a distinct disadvantage. No need to complain, the Toyota is made to be a better off road vehicle. And it costs a lot more too.
@@WaruiKoohii the Subaru was on loan, that's why they babied it more. I'd reckon that's also why they didn't upgrade the tires. The Toyota is their's to modify and they went with a tire that is more capable than stock. With limited budgets/resources they can't line up every test to be as fair as possible. Maybe once they get more income from the channel, that can improve.
Weird a $50,000 4Runner with aftermarket wheels did better than a $28,000 Subaru with stock wheels….this was a dumb comparison
The Outback is good for 95% of people. The other 5% that push the limits will do better with the 4R.
Offroading is a valid test, but not enough emphasis in reviews about how well Subaru handles slippery roads. The amount of control I have is crazy. Big open parking lot in the middle of winter, making sharp sudden turns, never losing control. Almost boring. Any of my other vehicles and the backend is trying to slide out or understeering. The 4x4s are clawing their ways out of the ditch while the Subarus never get in the ditch in the first place.
Pretty much and I've been trying to figure out for years which camp I belong to, but so far, I shop the jeeps and 4 runners, and buy Subarus.
and for that reason, it will still be successful. wildly so in the PNW. I could see people having one Outback Wilderness as a daily and maybe a vastly customized rock crawling Wrangler, or just one 4Runner. and i think going either route is perfectly valid.
It's not about people, it's about uses. I wouldn't want the 4Runner for a 125-mile commute in "mountain driving" conditions (i.e. anything is possible), but I also can't imagine the Subaru on anything more than an easy dirt road. The CVT is a PITA in the best conditions and it doesn't have any low gearing. Subaru claims 8.5" of ground clearance, but that is the clearance of the entire underbody. The stock 4Runner is 9" (ish?) minimum ground clearance -- i.e. a single low point. Further, approach, break over and departure angles are what you would expect in a car. One is a truck that drives fine on road, one is a car that can be driven in dirt. If you have a long daily commute and expect to travel extensively off pavement, you need both.
I’m loving this battle. But the Subaru still made it ;) And can we just talk about that turning radius? If there were dirt roads to my office , I would so be in the 4Runner camp. Maybe I should change jobs. I love both vehicles!
I was just laying here on the couch selling an outback to my wife.... when in the first 30 seconds, I recognize the spot where we cur our christmas tree! Then proceed to notice the trail system they're using is in our back yard! Great video, great review!
I'm watching you from Germany. I'm so jealous of the cool cars you have in the USA. We don't have any 4Runners and the Outback is only a standard model without a turbo engine. Your videos are wonderful! Thank you so much for that!
We don't have the GR Yaris, 2 Door Land Cruiser Prado, Corolla Touring Sports or Yaris Cross to name but a few.
@@rightlanehog3151 Pros and Cons for us on either side of the pond.
In America, we do get some pretty cool 'adventure' oriented rides. There are lots of places to have fun around here and millions of people live on dirt roads out in the country.
I have an Outback and 4Runner... the Outback is an unbeatable road car especially in snow country. The 4Runner is a great off-road machine. The Outback is not a serious off-road machine. The Outback can handle light off-road situations just fine, but that CVT transmission will burn up if you aren't careful. Don't get an Outback and try to follow Jeeps and 4Runners. You will burn and bash it up pretty fast...
My 2018 Outback burned oil. :(
The cvt is updated for the Wilderness. But basically you are right.
Do you have the wilderness??
No manual option?
Agreed that Outback is unbeatable road car with off road capability. I've had a 2010 for years and a 2019 replacement with no CVT issues whatsoever while towing a boat with the 2010 for years on end. That said the 4Runner is more truck like and it shows off road.
Impressive performance by the Wilderness. But hey, if you're serious about off-roading, come on, the 4Runner is very tough to beat. If your definition of off-roading is a wide track made of gravel, the Wilderness model seems to be very adequate.
I bought a new 4Runner Sport V8 back in 2004. Little did I know that I would still be driving it every day in 2021. Over 200,000 miles with zero problems - and I'm taking it on a 2,000-mile cross-country trip next month. The biggest issue with my 4Runner is that I really want to get a new vehicle soon - but I can't find a good reason to buy one. My best advice to anyone who is thinking of getting a 4Runner is to make sure and get all the options you want, and get the right color because you are probably going to live with it for decades.
@@zzanatos2001 guess gas is cheap enough in the US that going for something more efficient like the Outback isn't really necessary. $4.90USD/gallon (3.78L) here in Vancouver BC. Makes gas guzzlers pretty painful. You are definitely getting your dollars' worth out of your 4runner, which is awesome.
@@zzanatos2001 best 4runner ad ever! Toyota should be sending you one for free!
@@bradcomis1066 that about what prices are like here in california. i just paid over 5/gallon the other day for premium. lots of the country is still pretty cheap in the 3 dollar range though. all depends where ya live
We can realistically expect gas prices of over $6 in the near future with Sippy Cup Sleepy Joe skuttling the newly gained energy independence of the United States in favor of buying the same amount of fuel from competitors overseas. Databyter
Impressed by the subie! If i would be going for a full off-road adventure/project i'd choose the toyota of course. But If i'd just be an off-road&camping adventure amateur i'd go for the subie for sure.
Finally somebody who gets it.
@@Databyter yup and what was the 4runner rated at.. 17mpg?
Yeah my only beef with the outback wilderness is it really expensive for The fact that it’s still doesn’t have a normal automatic transmission, no real four-wheel-drive. Subarus thing is being cheap but capable enough, the outback is capable but not cheap.
@@jpc3984 Yes and honestly those CVT's scare me. I don't think I'm ready to trust my $40k on something that might hand grenade and leave me stranded 1000 miles away from home.
@@frankish5314 The Wilderness Drivetrain is warrantied for 6 years or 60,000 miles. Subaru is standing behind their new CVT. This is the CVT used in the Ascent which is tow rated for 5,000 lbs. If your gonna have CVT problems for your usage, chances are you will have them within that Warranty period. That is huge and worth 40K in my opinion. Databyter
Ryan thank you for taking the Wilderness on a little adventure. I was impressed with its ability to direct power to the wheels that weren't spinning. I have watched the regular Outbacks and the like spin their wheels - going nowhere. Excellent job on the editing and Karleen adds to the episode.
I have a 2022 Outback Wilderness and a 2015 4Runner so theses challenges were particularly fun to watch. I think they are both excellent vehicles with their own individual attributes. I would never be doing that level of off-roading. More mud , loose rock and lots of snow where both are very capable. Great videos!
Which is better for a daily?
@@stevep4236 with the price of gas probably the Outback😁
@@truenorthcarver especially when you're in places like CA...lol looking into the outback myself, Thx for replying back
You guys are the best! Thank you so much for this video!!! So well done. Excellent editing and production! As a Subaru sales rep and future Wilderness owner, I value this. I’ve owned a 4Runner and loved it... but for the value and performance....Outback all the way always!🙂
I’m going outback all day. They both handle the terrain and the fuel economy it’s much more realistic on the outback for a daily driver. The reality is, most people who buys these vehicles are not driving through that type of terrain.
Also, subarus are decent at off roading but snow is where they really shine
Your right but the 4runner looks sexier.
No thanks. There's a reason most offroad Aussies stick with Nissan Patrols, Land cruisers Hiluxes etc. No bash plates that's a bad day CVT off roading is asking for premature death that's why Toyota won't budge for the Truck class anyone that knows there grit of actual offroading and not trail driving knows there's a minimum requirement for ground clearance and Subarus don't have that
99.5% of the people I see driving 4runners will never get more than dirt from parking lots on them
@@Tallnerdyguy i think more people get them for the bulletproof factor and resell value. Subarus lose there value pretty quick conpared to a 4 runner or tacoma
This is the first RUclips video where I’ve seen a 4Runner with the bronze TRD wheels. I’m loving it.
Mine is black with matte bronze wheels. It looks fucking dope. Wish I could post a picture in here.
Check out speed academy channel. They've just modified a 4runner and it's awesome
I don’t even own a Toyota but I do like the wheels 😊. I would totally put em on an older Hilux diesel if I had one, should have bought a JDM ‘runner while they were cheap here in British Columbia, oh well.
@@rsscott5672 just watched the whole series. Was awesome. Most impressed by those morimoto head/taillights. Wow
This is exactly the test I was waiting, those are the only modern cars I am interested in, otherwise I'd have to go for an '05 pajero sport, and both outback wildernerness and 4runner trd pro are US-exclusive. Since I am from Europe, well done motor companies, you f us once again
Same here...wish I could get me a 4runner TRD Offroad over here in Germany - so far my 2018 Forester is holding up well tho when it comes to some more "serious" offroading...hoping to be able to upgrade sometime rather sooner than later
4runner I can live without, a Hilux or Isuzu with a bit of is a good alternative, but that we cannot get the newer turbo engined Subarus here in Norway /EU is just a shame..
we may have a few more offroad vehicles in north america but you guys in europe have us beat in terms of sports cars and wagons, y'all have so many of them and so much choice in general it's not even funny
Seeing someone put the outback wilderness through its paces outside of a subaru press course was great. Excellent production quality and I hope subaru will loan you out more offroad vehicles in the future for these kinds of tests, far more capable than it looks
The next off road vehicle Subaru makes, will be their first. C'mon man, these are station wagons that are meant for wet pavement.
@@javar2r3ra clearly it is more capable than simply going over wet pavement.
@@DragoVids barely.
@@javar2r3ra Did we watch the same video? It doesnt have a dedicated super low gear, that's the only thing holding it back. I own one and take it anywhere my jeep can go.
@@ozzyakiro4734 yes we watched the same video. All you Subaru guys are the same, "if only it had" excuses. Like I said, it's a station wagon with all wheel drive, and you guys think it's a real 4wd. 🤣
You guys are So MUCH better than TFLtrucks, this is unbiased real reviews with real people!
I hope TFL learns something here...quite few of us don't like their style anymore
Watching from Europe!
So!
Roller slip test of both would be nice!
@@T.e.d.d.y. I doubt I can find these cars, 4Runner is not offered in Europe. Outback is available but not in Wilderness version.
to polecam 4runner TRD PRO do testu tam w Polsce. Kupilem w tym roku i jestem mega zadowolony tylko wyzsze modele wranglera w terenie sa lepsze
@@windirwindir4518 Super, skąd dokładnie jesteś? Jeśli masz możliwość, to zapraszam do kontaktu przez Facebooka albo gdzieś u mnie na kanale 🙂
Even though it seems like an odd comparison, it’s a solid test for the Outback to compete with a BoF off road SUV.
Great vid!
The Subaru: more comfortable, better mileage, cheaper, easier to park, cheaper to insure
And it hangs with a trd 4runner on trails that most of it's owners will never endeavor to take on .. And on the tires it came with! Big win in my books. Guaranteed that 4runner gets even worse mileage with that wheel/tire package...
Repairing and maintaining the Subaru would be cheaper and easier most likely.
@@imnotacrook5298 way cheaper - but you probably won't have to repair much on the Toyota ☺️
That 4 Runner has a bullet proof rep not to mention you hardly lose any money when you sell it might even make a profit these days...if the Subaru reliability is close to the Toyota it should be a no brainer for most...
I went back and forth for a few months between Outback and 4 runner. I bought the Outback XT and very happy I did. I live in Nevada and go off on trails for hiking and mountain biking. Longs drives are more enjoyable with the Outback vs my SUV I had.
This just proves that a subaru does pretty much all you would ever need. If you do anything more than that you should just be getting a dedicated off roader at that point
You mean everything you would ever need. My last camping spot needing 4WD I would have never made it out with a Subaru. 0 percent chance. And yes I’ve owned an Outback recently.
@@milesb4231 not this subaru though... they've done a lot to enhance it.
Still it’s AWD. Also it’s subjective because a lot of us want our vehicles to do more. The thing slipped a hell of a lot more and was on three wheels.
@@vilhelmstein2091 This is a stock Subaru from the factory🤦 It's no different than a Toyota TRD.
@@veganpotterthevegan all I'm saying is it's better than your average outback. Hell no it won't do hardcore off roading, but it's still pretty darn impressive.
Throw some KO2s on it and it would do even better.
You'd have to be a little off in the head to believe its on the same level as a true 4x4.
I'm actually really impressed with the Subaru. I knew the 4Runner would handle all these with ease, also great choice on the new tires and wheels, I love that color combo. But I did not think the Subaru would do as well as it did. Really, unless you're regularly doing trails this difficult or harder, the Subaru is a great choice, because it (probably) does literally everything else better than the 4Runner, and is much easier, comfortable, and economical to live with.
(I have a 5th gen 4Runner with all terrains, BTW, and I drive with a light foot and do mostly highway at 70 mph or under, and I typically get about 20.5 MPG with it)
That said, I wouldn't buy a Subaru, because I don't like their engines, and I'm still not sold on the CVT. If they ever get around to updating their engines and putting in say an 8 or 10 speed auto, I'd be a potential customer.
The engines and the CVT keeps me away from Subaru as well....or at least if they'd offer a manual transmission they might get my interest but the CVT in itself keeps me away. They're cars are capable in certain models like the Outback Wilderness, its not 4x4 rock crawling vehicle of course but for most of us who just drive down some gravel and dirt backroads to a camping spot occasionally, the Subaru would be a great fit for those duties, as well as snow/ice.
@@wildbill23c Without those engines, they wouldnt be subarus, so its kind of an oxymoron. Absolutely nothing wrong with them.
@@somethingelse9535 Nothing wrong with them other than the fact they still have the same power outputs they've had for what 20+ years...although good for snow/ice as they don't have as much power to just sit there and spin the wheels like today's high horsepower/torque crossovers do. They had issues with overheating and cylinder head warping did they fix those problems in the newer models? I think those were issues in the early to mid-2000's? They've come quite a ways with their CVT's as shown in some recent videos with the Wilderness models.
@@wildbill23c The only real issue with them were the 2.5L NA motors from 2002 to around 2005 with head gaskets. Which at worst was a gradual thing, not a leave you stranded fault. (the fix is to use the gasket from the Turbo model). Otherwise Subarus are extremely reliable.
If you want a modern car with old used forever motor designs, try Toyota. There's a reason Toyota and Subaru stick with a design.
@@somethingelse9535 I've been eying the new Subaru Outback Wilderness lately. I wanted a Ford Maverick AWD Fx4 but they're so backed up with orders, and I'm not all that fond of a turbo replacing a larger displacement engine LOL. So the Outback Wilderness might find itself in the driveway in the next year or so.
I just bought my daughter a 2022 Outback Wilderness, she loves it. I paid just over 49,000 with an added hitch, a little bumpier tire, plus the trade in of my daughters older Subaru. Subies rock!
Hey it's me, your long lost daughter. I could use a new subaru!
@@johnathonuncapher7523 Lol, I only have one daughter. If I had extra money, I would actually buy you one for your cute comment! 🙂
49,000?? Was there a dealer markup?
@@CruisinForCustys No, that was the price.
I have a 2022 Outback Wilderness. I would not trade it in for anything. Good fuel economy, turbo, and pretty capable AWD. I have taken my Subaru to gnarlier places than in this video. No sweat. Almost 3ft of snow, deep mud and severe grades. Love this channel, great content.
I'm a former Rubicon owner (loved it), current 4runner owner (love more) but may move to the Subaru. Throw some BFG ATs on and that vehicle will really shine. With much better gas milage than my last and current vehicle (though little less cargo space than 4runner).
Just purchased Subu. Drove home in a complete monsoon. Handled every rain pooled road perfectly. Stuck like Velcro.
As a Seattle-ite, I have a major bias in favor of Subaru, and this video only validates my opinion
In these tests the Subaru kept up with the 4-runner and did quite well and I thought the challenges were very difficult. It’s still not as capable obviously but it seems like it’s a significantly better than a basic outback or forester. Very impressive.
The Outback did remarkable, end of story
My Forester Touring with a 2 inch lift from Ironman 4X4 and the Falken Wildpeaks can do as much as a Forester Wilderness.
Sadly you can no longer get skid plates from Subaru. Ralitek had the best skid plates on the market, (my opinion).
But for any serious off roading (if you don’t have a Wilderness trim), you’ll need to install an additional engine and transmission cooler.
My wife will Not let me take her Outback on anything more than light off roading (like her parents’ 3 mile long driveway in MT), but she’s ok when I do a bit more in my Forester.
For serious off roading, we take our 4X4 pickup.
That 4Runner with those TRD bronze wheels is sheer beauty. Great video.
Does he have a video detailing the wheels and tires?
Ryan, your channel has become one of the best auto channels on YT.
Just bought a 2021 Crosstrek Sport. I immediately lifted it 2" and put on a set of Toyo ATIII's and a skid plate. It handled Moab without a problem but I stayed off the more aggressive trails. All this in a much more agile and fuel friendly vehicle .. been averaging 30 mpg.
I put toyo at3 on my rav4 hybrid. Amazing tires!
Thanks Ryan for a great review!! I’ve been waiting for The Wilderness and you just demonstrated that it has more capabilities than I’ll ever need. Subaru has hit a home run with this.
Mine arrives on July 13th, been waiting since early May!😀
Just got mine last Monday. CANNOT wait to hit the Rockies this fall!
Great review. For me it is the 4runner without a doubt, but subaru have done a really great job with this new outback.
The Outback did well now let’s see the wilderness on TFL with better tires.
TFL will take it somewhere it can't handle and then complain about it
Lol they will say it sucks
They are just haters 😏
Subaru doesn’t loan cars to TFL. They don’t want their cars in true off road situations, I guess 🤷♂️
TFL junior will back it up into a wall in a shopping mall
Interesting comparo. I was expecting the 4Runner to trounce, but the Subie did quite well (and I own an Outback). For "heavy lifting," I'd still pick the 4Runner, but for more moderate adventures combined with daily driving, the Subaru looks to be a fine choice as well.
My wife’s Outback stays on the road. My Forester Touring can do mild to moderate off roading, but for the serious fun we take our 4X4 pickup
I love this channel. One of my favorites for sure. Having owned a 4Runner TRD OR in the past, I wasn't surprised that it tackled everything without issues. However the Subie did surprise me. I didn't think it could make it. Awesome job
4 Runner = Serious Adventure Off Roadster
Outback = Multi Terrain SUV
Outback= dirt or paved roads. 4Runner= everything else
@@Chasing-the-outdoors well clearly the ob can do more than that based on this test.
subaru = junkyard at 88k miles. 4 runner = almost broken in at 188k miles
@@blueridgedsia nah we had a 500k mile outback
@@blueridgedsia also like why is that all you care about? You act as if reliability is the sole concern when buying a car…
Great, was looking forward to this, my reflexes hit the thumbs up immediately!
Much respect for the subaru's but let be honest that 4Runner is made for strictly off-roading and it was not even driven to its full potential. Toyota for the win.
Subaru is a comfortable safe AWD vehicle. However that outback with the same kind of tires as on the 4 runner may perform a little better for the intended test. We know. Subaru hasn't built a real 4x4 suv yet. Up to now It's an excellent AWD.
@@housco11 your right is it a good vehicle nothing taken but... it is still not a full 4x4 meaning that in a tight situation would you take a Subaru out in the wild country hunting probably not. Most will have a truck or real 4x4 they just have different suspensions longer travel better shocks etc.. I'd take the Subaru to the beach though... they actually nice... just like the toyotas better
@@Adrian-jh5cr I agree with you in some points, and I think one of the weak points of the Outback is low travel due to independent suspension front and back, but the Subi with better tires a lift and suspension has a lot to offer. Having said that, more often than not, the driver makes a lot of difference, as seen in the video on the following link ruclips.net/video/_RafVwMjOKY/видео.html I own a 2004 Legacy but I wouldn't buy an Outback to do off road (for overlanding perhaps) I own an old Jeep for off road and a 426 Unimog for mix off road and some work.
@@pablomaximilianogomezaguir7659 Your right I have seen them do some pretty cool stuff i saw one that was lifted and had KO2s on it did very well.
@@Adrian-jh5cr Yeah properly equipped they can do a lot, considering they are AWD and have independent suspension, there's a guy here on RUclips that travels around on a lifted forester with Ko2s and it does pretty well.
Great review!. I would say the deciding factor for getting an AWD over a 4x4 is usually MPG. The wilderness edition was definitely impressive and I think it did great!. The biggest issue that isn't shown in the video is heat. Here in the California desert that CVT will overheat very quickly when pushed up climbs. Dealing with that much wheel spin and climbing over an extended period of time has proven to overheat the Subaru CVT in our experiences. I do not doubt that wilderness will do a 40% grade... the real question is... for how long!
Q
Exactly right. Great vehicles, but unfortunate they used a CVT. Even automatics without dedicated coolers can overheat in sand and snow. Having 4lo helps that significantly. The CVT just cannot provide the torque to overcome the braking force on the spinning wheel. The whole X mode system is fighting itself braking the slipping wheel to simulate a diff lock and the whole time it’s putting more heat into the CVT. If you did this often you would run into problems for sure. Heat is the killer of any automatic or CVT.
Wow, I really appreciate this comment. Thanks for sharing the knowledge!
I live in the high mountains of Colorado and there are jeep roads of varying difficulty everywhere. If your goal is off-roading, it’s a no brainer, get the 4-Runner. However, if your goal is to get to hiking trailheads or reach some interesting campsites, get the Outback Wilderness. For me, I spend 90% of my time driving on the highway and the last 10% on jeep roads getting to hiking trailheads. Most of these jeep roads are only moderately difficult. Consequently, I am purchasing the Outback Wilderness. Thanks Ryan for making my choice an easy one.
Finally watching! from Chile! 🇨🇱
You definitely showed at the end of the video that driving skill and experience has as much to do with off roading as the vehicle. So yes crawl control is a cool trick.
I mean from the start the 4runner is going to have a huge advantage with those tires. That's a huge upgrade.
Agreed. It was the first thing I changed on my 4R. Toyota really should be selling these with more capable off road tires, but that might cut into sales of the Pro version.
The Outback tires are Yokohama are Geolander G015's all terrains. Not a slouch tire by any means.
@@levskitoronto Not even comparable to the Falkens. BFG and General ATX are really the only AT that are same aggressiveness.
@@levskitoronto it’s like the least aggressive all terrain tire there is tho
Still amazed at how well the outback kept up, even if there was a slight mismatch with the tires, still did amazing.
Subaru has had me thoroughly impressed as of late. Their attention to detail and everyday focusing is great. I'm bummed they didn't put the turbo in the Forester Wilderness, or bring back the XT, but I'm sure it's on the horizon now that Foresters have taken over as the top sales vehicle for them.
The wilderness is turbo charged
@@AltonTorres that’s what I thought too
Not the forester wilderness
Not the forester Wilderness only the Outback
The more I watch about the wilderness edition, the more I want one! Great video as always!
That second course…….. the Outback handled it like a champ. That was NOT and easy course.
did not expect it to make it
@@ismaelsandoval9240 I didn't either. I was sure that with the stock tires it was going to fail.
Yeah, it was pathetic how much it took to make it though.
@@javar2r3ra I wouldn’t call it “pathetic”. All things considered, the Outback is a car posing as an SUV. So with stock tires and a CVT that cripples it due to its lack of a low-range gear. Getting up that corse was pretty gnarly. There’s some CUVs that can’t do that.
@@javar2r3ra for a wagon it was fucking great lmao
Cool! Once again, the Subie is amazingly impressive, especially given the less-than-comparable tires.
It’s very impressive. It only needed 1 quart of oil to top it off this time. And the cvt went out on his way back home instead of on the trail. Very impressive indeed.
@@haroldbeauchamp3770 that you need to make stuff up and lie to make your points is enlightening.
Actually this model uses smaller rims and taller tires designed to hold more air, that can be aired down, which makes a TREMENDOUS DIFFERENCE when going over rocks and stumps. The tire deforms over the obstacle and grabs it like a glove. I get why reviewers don't air down, but people going over challenging roads do, and carry either a small air tank or an electric pump with them to re-air at the highway. It really makes a big difference and most serious AT or AT light tires are designed to be aired down with less chance of slipping a bead. Databyter
I just found out this amazing channel a few days ago and I have already watched so many of your videos and I seriously love them you guys are doing amazing job .
That 4Runner is definitely the benchmark. I can’t believe how well that Subaru did. I just picked up a 2018 outback with the 3.6R. It’s really a great vehicle
What kind of fuel economy do you get in the outback? Looking to replace my wife's Legacy, and weighing economy vs power for occasional trips to Utah and Colorado.
I have a ‘13 Outback with the 6. Thinking of trading it in for a new Outback.
@@forkthepork I get between 23.7 and 24mpg combined. It’s a pretty big vehicle with a pretty powerful flat six. So it’s actually not too bad. The lack of high mpg is definitely worth that extra power
I think one thing people are forgetting is also that the subaru is sort of pushing its limits to do this kind of stuff. Yes you CAN do this with the Subie, and its great that it can handle this kind of stuff from time to time, but...
If you did this regularly with your outback it would definitely pop some rivets. Where as the 4Runner is made for this and is not pushing any limits at all.
Great video as always Ryan. I greatly appreciate your work in taking these vehicles in real life situations that many of us use them in. Far more informative than the reviewers that never venture off the pavement.
Great review. I had a 2011 Outback that I loved. Great fuel economy, and light off-road capability, excellent awd system for driving in the snow (one of the best out there). I am glad to see the Wilderness version is living up to the hype. I am impressed that the Outback could handle (not with ease) those rough trails. The 4-Runner did as expected. You can’t go wrong with the Toyota, but the Outback smokes it on economy and handling. Really, I wouldn’t be trying to decide between the two vehicles. The 4-Runner is a truck, super rugged, and compares best to a Jeep or a Bronco. For the crossovers, I think Subaru wins against all the other unibody vehicles. Well, maybe the RAV4 Adventure it’s it’s arch rival (But Jeep Cherokee Trailhawk is King). That trail test would be more applicable than this, but is great to see the Wilderness can almost keep up with the 4-Runner. The Outback is like a Swiss Army knife. It’s just does almost everything you need it to do.
That's an engaging comparision, loved those explanations. Well done team!!
Thanks for confirming my decision that I still want to trade in my 2" spacer lifted 2018 Outback 3.6 for a 6th gen 4Runner when they finally come out. Toyota fanboy here. The Outback certainly has done a better than expected job on trails but I just want that 4Runner, can't afford the gas on the current one.
Nice, thanks for the insightful tips. Just bought a 2023 Wilderness and I am incredibly satisfied with it "out of the box". And FYI, I'm a 25 year veteran of the Old Dale District running over that terrain with 3 generations of Toyotas!
Nice review! Finally see some offroad action above somethig any stock prius can do. It's always nice to see cars pushed to their limits.
Great way to start my Saturday!
Great comparison! Outback Wilderness was impressive more than capable for most people but, man, 4Runner Off-Road is unfairly better and so composed.
On 12/11/22 I bought a 19 Forester Touring from Carter Subaru in Shoreline WA.
My “new” Subie had only 4,700 miles.
I was so impressed with the staff at Carter, that the 3 hour drive was worth it.
My Forester is a Certified Subaru.
We get 5-6 feet of snow every winter so I was looking for a low mileage Forester for myself at a good price and light colored exterior. Mine is Sephia Bronze with Saddle Brown interior. It’s a beautiful Forester.
The previous owner put on Michelin Cross Climate tires. I’m very impressed with the traction from the tires.
The only reason why I bought my Forester is because of how well my wife’s 19 Outback handles all road conditions.
My wife’s Outback still has factory tires (her Outback only has 21K miles), so we’ll be driving my Forester to MT for a mini family reunion over New Years. It’ll be interesting to see how it compares with our Outback for our MT road trip.
I hate the Stop Start function and the Drivers distraction on my Forester so I have to disable it every time.
But I love everything else about my Subie.
This spring I’ll be adding a Ironman 4X4 2” lift and skid plates from Ralitek .
I’ve already added a K&N intake, mud flaps, WeatherTech window vents, bug shield, and full floor mats (in brown). When it gets warmer I’ll have it pinstriped. I will also be adding a FlowMaster exhaust. I’ve got a dashboard cover on back order.
I have a 2020 Forester and I love it. I don’t do a lot of off roading but I do wish to do it more.
My pick is the Outback since I’ll probably use it more as a daily/ family car than an off roader. But I must say 4runner has been my dream to have and honestly I’m rooting for it but the fuel economy is going to be a big deal for me.
I'm surprised how the Outback did, certainly would handle anything I would throw at it.
Outback huge interior quiet ride and safety features including near autonomous driving I used in traffic daily it’s a no brainer. It’s the only car I don’t get tired after 10 hrs. Audi Q7, xc90 in comparison. 4 runner is a truck, period. I’ll get one if I off-road more than 50 percent. Check the spec of outback rear leg room and head space vs ANY VEHICLE!
@@edwardlaw797 Absolutely 100% correct. As someone who purchased an Outback Onyx edition last year I considered the 4runner but ultimately gas mileage, and 4runners lack of blind spot monitoring did it for me.
Really, it showed that subaru is a joke off road. Now imagine it loaded with gear , along with your family that 4runners and jeeps tend to haul.. This thing was loaded and had problems. They just need to get rid of cvt or make more Manual transmission. If they are concerned about gas, then make a more efficient engine. But honestly I did harder stuff than that this weekend in my gladiator ecodiesel, and it gets better mpg than both , has more torqe, more room, and latest tech and comfort., ps, I pulled one out of sand at Lopez lake sunday.lol.
@@taraaaron1242 Sure, but it depends what you want it for. I'm not going "off roading", so it's more than enough, and better than expected.
@@taraaaron1242 Jeeps are basically purpose-built for off-roading. Subarus are made for every-day driving with off-road capabilities. Not everyone likes the utilitarian styling of the Jeep, and that's fine. The Jeep is also a lot more expensive, so that's a consideration.
My Forester Sport has done an amazing job with everything I've thrown at it, including driving in snow up to the bumpers. I will agree that the CVT is a weak-point, but as far as CVT's go, it's actually pretty good.
I really wish Subaru would've spent their time developing an auto transmission instead of throwing their CVT into everything. The CVT was the biggest reason why I got rid of my Crosstrek (that and it's horrible power out put). Got into a WRX and it's great, but when it's time to grow up and get a family car, it's probably going to be a Toyota.
Agree but offer this counterpoint: I just sold my Outback 3.6R due to concerns with frequent towing and the CVT (had one replaced under warranty). Bought a 4Runner and took it on a trip last week with the camper. The five-speed AT was hunting constantly so I had to use manual select mode. It was still a compromise and loud getting over Sonora Pass in 2nd and 3rd gear. The gearing was truly annoying compared to the CVT. Never thought I'd say this about the CVT. Still glad to not have the mechanical hassles of our Subaru though.
This. Woedul CVT and under powered engine killed the cross-trek. Disappointing that the CVT is not going away.
The CVT is horrible on the crosstreks especially the 1st gen. That and the gutless 2.0 is the reason why I'm selling mine soon. The only good thing about these cars is that they hold their value extremely well especially in the north east.
@@pepehands8224 the new Crosstreks have the option for bigger engine/more HP
Crosstrek is great for doordashing. You know, potholes, paved asphalt street hills and the ocassional gps mapping thru an unpaved rural road on a long dried up lake bed with rain divots.
The Wilderness seems like a great value at 39K while the prices on 4Runner is crazy high, for long term purchase the 4Runner still reins due to resale value. I'm sure Subaru will make changes every year/other year so the re sales won't be nearly as high long term.
It isn't just resale value, it is also reliability. The Toyota and pretty much every one in their family has a life span of about 400K and beyond for many. And that is with regular maintenance and very few major repairs.
@@gabrielreyes8476 Exaggerate much? Real stats have been analyzed on the topic, only about 4% of 4Runners make it to 200k miles. About 5% of Chevy Suburbans make it to 200k miles, by comparison. Normal people don't keep cars much beyond 100k miles, but almost every manufacturer has examples of cars that make it to a million miles, or darn near it, including Subaru.
@@mechmat12345 Could care less about your "stats" and I never exaggerate; I'm speaking from real world experience. I have an uncle who still drives his 1986 Corolla. Currently, almost 780k miles on it. Never a major repair.
My sister's 1992 4Runner SR5, 520k on the clock. Never any major repairs and still runs flawlessly.
My neighbor's 2001 Avalon, over 600k on the clock. Never a major repair. Currently a garage queen, but still runs flawlessly.
I'd like to know what you consider "normal". Yes, every manufacturer has examples, but in the real world, not on paper, Toyota's and Honda's are proven to last outrageous lengths of time. Subi's included.
@@gabrielreyes8476 yep - I have a 99 Lexus LX470 - 298K runs like day 1 (msrp back in 99 was over 59K)
That CVT is why I’m a “bitter clinger” when it comes to my 2013 Forester. As a great patriot once said, _”From time to time, the Tree of Liberty must be watered with the transmission fluid of CVT-equipped Subies.”_
I own 2 vehicles. A 5th Gen 4Runner and and a 2020 Outback XT Onyx. This was a satisfying video knowing both can perform well. My 4Runner is my tow vehicle and offroader, and the Outback is a great road tripper for everything else. Really two different tools for two different purposes. I enjoy driving the Outback on roads and gravel roads more, and 4Runner makes easy work on the harder stuff with a locker and 4LO.
The wilderness and 4Runner have the same tow cap of 3500lbs I believe.
Having had both, I think they are both great vehicles, but as far as longevity, nothing beats a 4 runner
Yep this is exactly what I've been waiting for... (Rubbing my hands together) Lets get to it!!! lol
I'd take the Subaru because I know that it is more than capable for the kind of trails that I would be on. Also, the fact that the vast majority of my driving would be on paved roads makes it an easy choice.
Well done Karleena! Great job with the 4Runner and nice video of both of you. Greetings from Austria
Another excellent video. Ryan. I really like the addition of an unexperienced driver. Kudos! Itsa 10!
The Outback IMO is a weekend warrior’s “soft” off-road vehicle. Comparing it to a legendary 4Runner (body on frame) wasn’t fair, maybe the new Ford Timberline would have been a better head-to-head comparison. I’ll pick the 4Runner if I am doing serious off-road or overlanding. ✌️🇨🇦
though on the second hand 94 vs 67 on full tank not huge deference
I wont consider the outback a light offroader! It's more of a well rounded intermediate offroad vehicle!
@@forza388 Come on. It’s a lifted grocery hauler posing as an “off-road” vehicle. And have you ever wonder why none of the 4WD vehicles have CVT transmission? Because their engineers know that it wouldn’t stand a chance in real off-road adventures. ✌️🇨🇦
@@mariog5062 I disagree, everyone has his opinion! Sure this car is not a Rubicon or 4 runner! It's not an extreme offroader! But it is very capable for what it is! And in the city ots much better! Very well rounded!
@@mariog5062 How many people do you know, even Wrangler owners who really use the full potential of its trail capability? The Subaru is what most people need and doesn't sell itself as the most capable rock crawler. I just don't understand why people don't understand that. Show me anywhere in the marketing where they claim to be the end all of off-roaders and tackling the ultimate rock crawling course. For 90%of the camping, outdoorsy population this wilderness will be sufficient. Plus they can still use if as a daily driver that won't kill them on gas. Did I mention blindspot monitoring is standard?
Yep I'm buying the Subaru!
Having owned 4 Runners, Land Cruisers, and Subarus, the Outbacks are far more comfortable and economical to drive over long distances than the 4Runner. The 4Runner is more capable when things get really nasty, but that usually represents a very small amount of driving over the life of the vehicle. Land Cruisers are the best overall, but very costly to purchase and operate. The Outbacks drive more like cars with really good trail handling characteristics and the Wilderness only improves that. I'd get the 4Runner for towing and heavy trail use, but I'd get a Wilderness for everything else. It's a better all around package for touring and easy to medium off road use.
On road, in normal life, if you own a certain size trailer, then, well, only the Toyota is “capable”. No matter if you never go off road or do that every day.
@@JeepCherokeeful Most of the Subaru crowd won't pull anything larger than a small trailer or a teardrop. Roof tents are super popular with them as well as the roof is rated for the weight. Even 4Runners and Jeeps aren't great for towing. That's what a Tundra or a F-250 or F-350 trucks is for, and diesels models are even better. There's no such thing as one universal all around vehicle and it's best to weigh your needs and buy accordingly.
@@WS102 obviously. Just like Wrangler buyers aren’t interested in pickups and Tundra buyers don’t pull goose neck s
I own the 4 Runner and I'm happy to say that it's great for the mountains and off roading I recommend it big time.
I'm sure the 4runner is the superior performer but it really invalidates any comparison when the tires on the 4runner are significantly better. Why bother if you're not keeping things equal where you can?
Do you really think tires would have made this any closer?
@@javar2r3ra Would you like to play basketball in High heels vs playing in Basketball shoes? Put snow tires on the Outback, and Off Road tires on the 4Runner and then lets do a street run on 6 inches of snow and see which one handles better?
Idk why but Subaru never gets a Fair game. Always needs to stand up against 4x4s or clearly more off-road capable cars... Subaru should get compared to Audi quattro,Volvo Cross country and so on.
@@marcymcsheehan3579 dude you literally could put fucking highway tires and steelies on the 4runner and it would still walk over the subiewooo in mud or rocks
@@ToyotaNutjob Cite your source..
Just bought a 2021 TRD Off-Road Premium. Loving it so far. Need to find some winter tires and wheels for our deep snow in the snow belt where 20" over night is not that uncommon.
Jim, Toyo Open Country ATIII are incredible. I had them on my 4runner and so do several other friends. I would drive 1200 mile trips with them , no noise either.
Only Ryan and Carlina make Subaru offroad videos like this, there’s literally no competition (because the other comparable channel doesn’t get them 😃). I’m sure I speak for most of the internet when I say “I love you ❤️ “. Good results with the Outback Wilderness. I can honestly say from my experiences with a 2015 Forester XT, the Outback wilderness is a lot more capable. My Subaru would have stalled out on the rutted climb with the speed you approached it at. That’s one major complaint with the CVT Subarus, people say the CVT cuts power, but it’s always seemed to be simply transmission stall.
The other complaint is overheating. I recently went on a Utah trip with my friend that has an Ascent. We climbed Croton road near the Alstrom Point/ Brand Bench area and we had to do a sustained climb up and over the mountains. This road would easily make a Crosstrek overheat, but the Ascent stayed cool. Transmission temps were monitored via Scangauge II, and the Ascent never went higher than 217F (I’ve seen Crosstreks hit 270F, triggering the CVT temp light).
The Outback wilderness is said to have the same gearing as the Ascent, sounds like there may be even more improvements. Edit** it’s not just the gear ratio, Subaru must have done something with the cooling system, because a 14.3:1 crawl ratio isn’t enough to keep a transmission cool.***. With a smaller package and less weight, I’d be interested to see a climbing stress test compared to an 2021/2022 Outback 2.5. We know the wilderness will do better, but I’d be curious to see how much better.
That’s why subaru should bring back the manual gearbox with low range.
@@KamenKachev I’m sure that would make a lot of people happy! One of the reasons Subaru doesn’t go with a 9 speed automatic is because the current offerings just wouldn’t fit the design. Dual range gear box they can DEFINITELY Do! Right?
The fact that a Subaru is even keeping pace with a 4Runner blows my mind.
It's because the 4Runner is soft.
@@717UT lol
As someone that off-roads his subaru a lot in Utah, it's not really keeping up. It definitely could on these trails though. I'm disappointed they picked Geolander tires for the car.
@@veganpotterthevegan Tires can completely change the characteristics of nearly any vehicle. Sometimes with my WJ, I wish I had bought a set of MTs before I ever lifted it and just drove the heck out of it. Now I have a small lift and 31" MTs and I can go way more places than I ever imagined. 33s here I come!
@@717UT I love only having a 1" lift and tires that just barely fit. The low center of gravity makes up for a lot of my Forester's shortcomings
I bought a brand new Subaru Outback in 2012. It was the 2.5L model. The Outback now has over 410,000km on it (255,000mi) and is ready to retire.
It took my family to so many places, adventures and towed our ATV, dirt bike, Sea-Doo and pop-up camper. All I did was regular oil/filter changes, kept it nice and clean and rust-proofed it every fall (we live in southern Ontario, so snow and salt roads are the norm). The money it saved us by having the 2.5L engine with the CVT was great. My parents both have the 2010 Outback but with the 3.6R, so I see a big difference when it comes to mileage. I usually drove it to around 700km on a full ~60L tank (around 430mi on 16 gallons).
I really like the 4Runner, but I think that given our Outback's performance, capability and value, we might go with another one, one day.
I really really want a Wilderness Forester. But of course I have had concerns with the CVT. I love the info that was packed into this video
The Outback impressed me with its capability, however, the 4Runner accomplished the same feats with less effort and in a more controlled manner. Both have their strengths and compromises but in this case, the 4Runner is still clearly the superior off-roader. That said the Outback should still be capable enough to meet most SUV buyer's needs.
It definitely meets my needs, I just want to hit some beginner to intermediate trails on the weekends. Nothing too crazy, but enough to have some fun.
If I really wanted more obviously the 4runner is king, but as a daily driver I see the subaru being more comfortable.
Except the 4 runner is like 30-40,000 dollars more lol
@@Stancedude1 bro I just got my 4 runner off road Premium and it was 47 they are just 10 grand more than the $38,000 wilderness I work at the subaru plant and most of the car is made with cheap materials every year. The Outback wilderness is probably the best car and the crosstrek Don't get the Ascent it's more expensive for a 4 cylinder boxer engine
Two of the best cars on the market. Fan from Ukraine
I've had 7 Subaru's and can say I was not impressed when the CVT came about. But have racked on 366xxxkms on the last couple and never had one issue and I use them off road all the time also. The 4 runner is definitely the better grunt for extreme off road , but for the lower price , better milage , better highway driving and all-around great overlander, I'll stick with the Outback.. I've also upgraded to the Falken Wildpeak AT3w and they are a great tire also have the 2" lift whick helps alot off road ..i wish when the do these comparisons that they would outfit both vehicles with the same tires rather than just upgrading one
100% on another guy who has had seven different Subarus I miss every one of them every damn day
I watched this video about 2 months ago when I first started looking for a new car to replace my 2011 Outback 2.5i Limited. I had narrowed it down to these two models after watching a ton of videos and lots of forum threads.
The engine in my Outback shit the bed 3 weeks ago. It was finally time to make a decision, so I went and test drove both vehicles.
Ending up going with a 2022 4Runner Off Road Premium with the TRD wheels option. I choose it over the Subaru for a few reasons: The climate/heated seat controls are built into the screen on the Subie (this is super annoying!!), I preferred the styling, much more capable in off road scenarios, but mainly it came down to the build quality and reliability of the 4Runner. A well maintained Toyota can easily last +200k without any major repairs and they retain their value. Subaru makes great cars but mine was too unreliable, and it cost me $4k in repairs over the 3.5 years that I owned it.
Only downside to the 4Runner is the gas mileage(I can get about 22mpg on the highway but usually stay around 18 around town) but otherwise no regrets. Hopefully this can help someone else with deciding which car to get.
Thanks for your opinion. I am about to test drive the 4Runner and Outback/Forester vehicles.
Subaru is by far the best valued vehicle on the planet. Capable beyond its class.
Now that the video is over... I am glad I got to watch it... Here for the channel first and foremost... But, Carlena, Ryan, Subie and the Mighty 4Runner, make it way more enjoyable...
Oh and yeah... I'd still take the 4Runner!!!!
Same
Love the video, I'm so excited for my Wilderness, it's coming in the next few weeks. I haven't decided if I'm going to get the two extra skid plates for the differentials, did you find that they came in handy during this? Did they prevent any scraping?
It’s for them to be scraped vs what they are covering your soft bits…per say
It's only $600 for a vehicle that costs 40K. I would personally do it because I WILL and HAVE taken my Subarus off the beaten path and always have to be super careful. And even with skid plates you will still have to be careful, but it should help a lot and give you advance warning of problems in your line. Databyter
I was looking to buy a 4Runner but found a used 2018 Outback Limited for $20k with low miles and clean title. Currently waiting on Toyo at3 tires and 2” lift kit on it 🤷🏽♂️.
Great test. The 4Runner with good tires is unstoppable, but the Outback really punches above its weight.
wondering if you could compare 4 runner limited with 4 runner off road. not much information available about that...
Toyota hasn’t put a Limited in the fleet for a long time. Mechanically, it has the same diff setup as the Lexus GX, so that would be another place to look for videos.
In a nutshell: the Outback gives you up to ~90% off-road capability while dedicated off-roaders sacrifice alot to get you that next 10%.
Expanded version: the Outback is not a "rock crawler", it simply cannot produce low end torque delivered via a locking diff. But what it does do is give amazing off-road and deteriorated conditions capability via full-time AWD that's symmetrical, with minimal compromise to everyday use, in a very reliable package that's far more efficient than a truck/Wrangler.
The Subaru did this with much less aggressive tyres, ideally you want the same tread on both vehicles or it’s more a battle of tyres, it’d do a lot better with the more aggressive ATs.
Also if you’re doing this type of thing in either vehicle you should have a deflator and a pump. Both vehicles are running at highway tyre pressure, they would both do this a lot easier with more appropriate off-road pressure.
Unfortunately, with borrowed vehicles, (from the MFGs?), They can't lower tire pressure. Not sure why. Liability reasons?
Total respect for the Subaru! 😎
I have a 2016 outback and I followed a bunch of friends in lifted trucks out way on a farm and they told me to leave my car behind because it wouldn't make it.. I made it no problem... they were all very impressed.
I live In Africa Kenya, i happen to own a Subaru outback 2020, it handles our weather roads very well. I lv subaru forever.