[WARFRAME DISCUSSION] A STEP TOO FAR? Jade Shadows Armor/Resistance Changes Overview | Dante Unbound
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- Опубликовано: 7 июн 2024
- At first I hated these changes but ultimatley we still lack critical information such as how much the enemy HP is being multiplied this will be an indirect nerf to slash damage in endurance runs which is fine.
Link to ash build used in video: • [WARFRAME] "Shadow Of ...
Link to dev workshop: forums.warframe.com/topic/139...
0:00 Intro
1:30 What Is Changing? (Resistances)
3:05 My First Issue With Changes
4:10 This Controversial Change Isn't A Huge Issue
6:05 Enemy Armor Changes
8:30 Steel Path "TOO EZ NOW"
12:00 Remove Enemy Level Cap?
12:45 Enemy Shield Changes
14:45 TLDW
15:35 New Armor Removal Meta?
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I'm confused by the problem with the armor changes.
Pablo's example was a level 200 Heavy Gunner has 10,815 armor, which is 97.30% DR, if you use an 80% armor reduction ability it goes down to 2,163 armor, which is still 87.82% DR.
2,700 armor will still be 90% DR, without any armor strip whatsoever it'll still be a ton of DR, it's just that now partial armor strip will be a more viable option.
The problem is that partial armor strip is completely useless right now, it's either 100% or bust, that's why Inaros needs 2 green shards to function properly at high levels.
You are saying that Steel Path is too easy, okay, what do you propose they do to adress that without nerfing our weapons and warframes?
Because not just the rest of the Warframe community, you yourself explode for any and all nerfs, look at Dante, though to be fair the line of sight checks were cancer so that was a completely valid criticism.
DE seem to suck at scaling enemies beyond "normal" levels, anything above level 300 is about as tanky as any level obove that.
Because armor scaling is pointless when everyone runs armor reduction.
They tried nerfing armor reduction, and again both the community and YOU complained, now you complain that it's too easy.
So what is the answer?
Either way people will complain.
Even to survive at high levels you use cheese to never die, if they nerf that the amount of complaints will explode, if they nerf damage there'll be complaints, if they buff enemies I guarantee people will complain, "I used to reach level 9999, now I can't beat levels 1500, nice balancing DE"
Remember the self damage change?
I remember you complaining about it, saying that knockdown was worse.
They wanted to bring back self damage in a much more forgiving state, you complained.
Remember when objectives had limited health?
Now they are practically invincible because people complained.
YOU complain that health tanking can't reach level 9999, even though Inaros easily can tank levels 1500.
Instead if saying that every form of tanking should do that, you complain that it isn't good enough, now you complain that level 9999 is too easy.
I agree, level 9999 should be a nearly impossible challenge that requires a perfect team, but people, including you, will complain.
Look at the top comment you favorited, "it's because of mobile", yeah it's totally because of that, it's not like this shit was a back and forth for many years now, no... It's the mobile port's and China's fault.
I HATE "white knighting" for DE, but it feels like no matter what they do people will always complain.
I like your videos, but man this ping-pong shit gets annoying.
You do realize he's pointing out things that could happen and isn't actually complaining? Or are you too slow to even listen to the words he's saying?
@@uraveragewiteguy So saying that level 9999 on steel path is too easy or saying that now all Grineer will be equal in tankyness to a level 27 Heavy Gunner is not complaining, it's "pointing out things that could happen"
"Or are you too slow to even listen to the words he's saying?"
Considering this a channel that does pretty harsh and often fair criticism I would hope that we could have an actual discussion instead of slinging "Or are you too slow to even listen to the words he's saying?"
@@someguy6152 I don't wanna put energy into arguing lol, fair point tho. Idk I just know that tone can come off as complaining even when they're not.
@@uraveragewiteguy To be fair I was a bit harsh...
That's why it's called balance. I can appreciate this game is incredibly difficult to balance based on the sheer amount of frames, weapons, and synergies alone. But it's up to the community to point out the worst areas of balance and DE's job to consider, and correct it.
This is kind of unavoidable with how the game has been dealt with so far. There are so many weapons that I find cool and enjoyable to use, but because they don't function at high level, I am literally prevented from using them, and forced to use boring overused meta weapons instead
Thats true asf. Warframe has no middle ground. Either you fuck everything and the game is mad boring or there are places you can't even go period with your loadout. Also a lot of mods a straight up useless. On the other side tho its weird because noe the game will be literal god mode at all times for anyone that can mod just decently. They really need to find a way to keep the end game hard to the point where you HAVE TO watch what you have and match it with the enemy while making the game easier to adapt to at earlier ranks. Which is not easy to do and we know DE will take the easy route AKA: just make the game easy for everyone
Yeah I paid for the full stug you better bet I'm gonna take the full god damn stug to the endgame.
but the weapons wont become better and might even become worse if they buff HP which will be significan at high level scaling specifically, now you can at least easily make old weapons viable at sp with slash or armor strip, with this change you wont
@@SusloNick yes the HP increase worry me the most
people said the enemies will be so much easier 12:35 "by a long shot" but i think it could be the opposite even can be extreme depend on how much they increase the health.
let say they double it, that mean you will need to double your damage to kill as fast as before unless you have a reliable way to deal percentage max health damage.
it would be funny to see the expression of people who complain that this update will make the enemies too weak just to realize that its actually the opposite and now they are strugling to even complete the mission because the enemies HP are doubled
You can already make any weapon viable in steel path by modding it properly
For the humanoid corpus, i thought they were all enhanced with tech like in fortuna. So, using magnetic on them i think would still make sense.
That's what I thought as well. Vital organs and systems either augmented or supplanted. That's why it should have been easy to kill Darth Vader, they have all the tech so they couldn't have a pocket EMP. I digress 😅
In game, corpus flesh was weak to viral and slash just like Grineer Cloned flesh. I think shields and proto shields resisted viral and slash
Yeah, if it's a pure immersion argument you are looking for you can just say Corpus make their machines resistant to the same environments they themselves work in etc etc
blame elon
The point of the armor changes isn't to cater to the extremes, the difference at that level will most likely be negligible and go completely unnoticed. The point is that armor right now is entirely bottom heavy, where you get 90% DR at 2700 and then scale from there to infinity up to 99.999% whatever DR. It's extremely front loaded to the point where partial armor strip is currently pointless. It's less about the true number value and more about the resulting %DR
I imagine they'll be changing the scaling curve alongside the cap of 2700, as keeping the current curve would only result in a ~20% change in DR with 10 corrosive stacks vs what it is now
my worry is this 8:26 "health scaling of greneer enemies will be re-aligned...to try and maintain a similar time-to-kill feel"
they should be very careful with that because it will be a direct nerf to bleed and any strategy that fully remove armor.
even if they only increase the health for 50% that would mean we will need 1.5 times longer to kill a greneer, let say you need 4 seconds to kill a heavy gunner before the update, now you will need 6 seconds which sound insignificant if you ignore the fact that there is more than one heavy gunner that you need to kill in a mission while the bombards trying their best to reduce your warframe and defense objects to ashes at the same time
Seems like they are cleaning up the code. Right now the damage resistance system is complex for no reason. I mean players literally ignore it for the most part. My guess is that it will be over tuned either for or against us to begin but with a simplier system it allows them to make adjustments more effectively on the fly.
Long story short: the complexity of the current system doesnt serve a purpose. By cleaning up the system hopefully the devs can make more effective challenges in the future
I can make that Argument about 10 Other Things in Warframe. This Game is Convoluted Right Down to it's Very Core.
I bet 10 Platinum DE is Going to Give Upon the Idea Half Way through.
yeah this seems like a code cleanup tbh 13 hp types
This seems about right tbh
That is nice because after 2.6K hours since today, ive never bothered to know any of these armor and health status types, all i needed was heat is good, viral and slash is meta and that is it. Sometimes if i have problems with viral just change to corrosive and im set.
I think your reading too far into this. The point of this is to give the player more options to approach difficult content, if it ends up being to easy then they can just adjust the health or damage types like slash later
not sure what you mean by reading too much into it i'm just reading the post they put up
I think they said thwy want it to be the same difficulty as before. So i think you might be misunderstanding the changes. Say an enemy had 10k hp, and 99% dmg reduction from armor. Meaning if you shot it with a gun that does 100,000 dmg, it woupd take 1k damage, or 10 shots to kill. If there new damage reduction ammount ended up being 50%, your gun would do 50k damage. If they wanted it to take as long as before.. the new health total woupd be 500,000, a multiplier of 50x not 5x. There is a second difference here. Before you could use pillage and then 1 shot it with said gun. After the change you use pillage so armor is 0%, but youd still need 5 shots to kill the raw hp pool.
From what i understand, everything will be a little harder, not easier. They will have more health, so your slash procs will have to tick over more to kill enemies.
Dumbing down enemy health types really makes no sense to be honest, i really don't know why they are doing this. Players don't struggle at all in this game until they hit steel path lol.
Even then, SP is easy asf
you would be surprised. some peole even think dante is "unusable" on the steel path so there is a wide variety of palyers for sure
@GazTTV well people being dumb isnt a reason to make changes
@@GazTTV I have watched some really clueless players who have played this game for the first time as i often watch new players, like not reading what quest text says to do next and they rant about the game not being clear on what to do.
That being said, they do seem to be the minority and most of their paying players surely are longer term players? Dumbing stuff down just seems like such a weird choice when they have spend a decade refining the damage system.
@@robotic-race unfortunately, when your goal is to be as appealing as possible to as many people as possible, people being dumb absolutely is a reason to make changes. I doubt I personally know anyone with an IQ below 115, which means that more than 8 out of 10 people are more stupid than the stupidest person I know.
Most players haven't farmed every high-end mod/arcane/weapon/frame out there, so what's trivial for for Gaz is actually quite difficult fot most players.
Fully agreed, not everyone has the time of patience to min/max for everything.
Skill Issues. ¯\_(ツ)_/¯
@@lookalike4805"skill issue" -s. Thus skill issue
You don't even need the best arcanes or weapons to get through 95% of warframes content. Just a decent gun that has a basic build for the enemy you're fighting against is usually enough. These high-end arcanes are mostly there if you want to stay in missions for longer than 2 hours. People forget that we were able to blast through enemies before incarnons existed or arcanes slots on our weapons.
So get to farming
They could just make steel path mods instead of increasing armor since it’s gonna be capped it instead increases health a whole bunch as the new steel path modifiers. Currently armor increases by 250 percent but they could just add that 250 percent to HP instead ya know so it’s 500 percent.
Honestly I think it's going to be an indirect nerf to slash and armor strips.
Having armor strip makes steel path content trivial as long as you are running armor bypass or armor strip. If you don't you are going to have a bad time.
I think it's great if they don't make the game way easier with this but rather allow other options to be viable.
Not trying to be too much of a DE Dickrider here but I am seriously excited for these changes as I have gotten tired of putting armor strip on everything whether it's terrify, pillage, shurikens or two green shards
Same every time I build the first thing I think off is should I subsume an ability or use 2 green shards. Not great tbh
I’m curious how the health changes will affect Zeoloid boss fight.
This is good before the only way to kill enemies with armor was with. Slash/viral or 100% armor strip. Now even a lesser armor strip should be noticable and allow for different builds besides slash/viral.
a bit of an oversimplification IMO those were not the only practical builds but honestly these changes seem meant for base SP
@@GazTTV Yeah, I understand. We will see how it plays out. Hopefully it doesn't make higher levels to easy.. Maybe if they standardize things it will give them more options for harder content down the line.. maybe thats just wishful thinking.
Bro levelcap heavygunner just have 200.000 !!!! armor and ı can one shot her easily without any armor strip with her %99,85 dmg reduction . Yeah with revenant. I don't even use a damage buffer warframe like saryn.
@@maximumplayer8849so you just proven devs point - why give enemy 200k armor if you can still one shot it?
@@chotnik Yea remove their armors and make the game even easier :D
all im hearing is that all robotics are actually meat :) which is infinitely more disturbing than anything else in the game
Always love your videos man 👍
Bro, most of this video just seems like you were complaining, not like actually informing people about it
Yeah, the thing is that these changes are not for people that play level cap, these changes are for the usual playerbase and to make some builds more viable and not rely on full armor strip, slash, 2 green shards to full armor strips, etc.
He Showed you were the Dev Workshop Is.... Go Inform Yourself ¯\_(ツ)_/¯
kinda hard to inform peole when the info is so incomplete if we had teh full info I'd be able to make a more concrete opinion but as it stands we need to know the HP multi
@GazTTV I will definitely, but I think you should remember. That you're like in the In the upper end of player skill. And well, if they make it harder for you, that makes it harder for everyone, and that leads to people leaving like why I left destiny. Just.
Kept getting harder and it never got more fun. This game does actually get more fun. Please don't try to beg for it to be this super hard game. Okay, you just sound awful. The game needs to be based around the middle and lower middle section of players. Congratulations on learning how to play The Game. I mean you have kind of made this into your job. Which congrats like? How would love to have this kind of job not saying you didn't work hard to do that but? Most people have like an hour. Maybe 2 sometimes 3 or 4 on the weekend. Because we got a lot of other stuff going on in our wives, others then and warframe. I do very much enjoy your content. And you, I just do not enjoy when people beg to have the game be harder. Because most of the time, it's not that the game is too easy. It's the Dave mastered everything and they should find other challenges. Cause you could always make it harder on yourself with personal challenges.thank you and have a blessed day ✨️
@@lookalike4805 No I read the Dev workshop. I very much agree with the Changes. They're trying to make the game more accessible. Which means more players biggerbuilds more people find warframes and other different small items. In big items that is also good for the player market and more people in the market. What's the next market more competitive? The game doesn't need to be a super hard impossible game where you need to have a degree to understand it. Most people just want to sit down and play for a little bit and like forget the world. Oh, it's great when you're just like cool. I'm just gonna go wipe out hordes of enemies which is really? Where this game shines and I think people should remember that. And Understand that not everyone is at this like top terror level 9 billion. Type play because the water at the community is based around. Build it how you want, go have fun. Which is really a good type. A way to have the community said because then it's not really about the balance. Or the Meta or anything like that which keeps people playing and keeps people engaged, which once again makes them more money. The longer people play, the more the better you're going to be that player Into a repeat customer or first time customer.
wouldnt corpus clones still be affected by a emp since they are extremely tech heavy. their weapons their armor and tools etc
Sounds to me like their focus is in making players more inclined to choose all the conditionals in deep archimedea, because to be quite honest some of the weapons and frame some players have to deal with can make the mode such an utterly unpleasant slog to go through even when modded correctly, especially with the troll level conditionals that can appear.
Looking forward to it
1. The armor number doesn't matter, its the %. If you need to quadruple armor for 10% of reduction it's strange, and same reason why corrosive sucks on high levels.
2. Like you said - no one mods rad to kill Bombard, hence why even have alloy armor in the first place... Especially that corrosive damage doesn't have bonus to alloy armor BUT corrosive procs reduce alloy armor...
to me, steel path isn't a "hard mode" it's more of a "big number mode" because of the health and damage and density of enemies increasing, what i would love to see is a harder ai in steel path, like throwing grenades at where you stealthed at or having more tools for the enemies to assist each other, like a grineer unit that can place down a structure that makes allies in a close radius immune so statuses, anything that just isn't more enemy health and armor
Might be able to make a all around kit
9:00 I love how blast ignis wraith is used for this example. Ahh the ol spray and walk a way flame thrower that we all needed when were were MR9. Must say I still use that for Kela de Thenyne and - if nothing else is available - in the circuit. Blast tho.. eek.
well you do make a good point honestly, can pop millions of damage after modding stuff relatively easy if you know what youre doing. I'm guessing it will make things more tanky despite the DR nerf. Dont worry they will probably end up bringing the armor back up or something. Even worse if they start doing archon damage attenuation just to make the enemies tankier. I feel like elemental and status need to be brought up to viral/slash levels anyway. Though I'm interested to see what theyre going to do with blast
Imo dummy down the dmg resistances is fine i guess, ive been playing for 8 years and i already look at resistances like this anyways. I dont like the armor change tho, enemies with either have ludicrous hp or just feel like normal path.
Cant stand killing enemies below 100 because i cant even maintain my combo multiplier.
Hey Gaz, I'm not sure if I have this right, but I understand it differently- I don't think 2700 armor will still mean the same thing that it does right now. If they make the 2,700 armor cap equal 99.9999999% DR then the game would be even harder, despite the lower armor cap.
I think they said the new cap will be 90% DR @ the new max of 2700 armor? (I could be wrong, or they could change the DR cap to something other than 90%). It's all about scaling;
Let's just say current lvl. 9,999 enemies have 9,999 armor at 99.99% DR, (a Linear +1 armor & +0.01% DR per level). If DE doubled the final armor value to 19,998 at lvl. 9,999 but kept the same scaling and same 99.99% DR cap, literally nothing would change besides enemies showing double their previous armor value at any given level (lvl 9,999 enemies, 19,998 armor, but still 99.99% DR) and the same would go for cutting it in half...
But armor/ DR doesn't currently scale linearly alongside enemy level, making partial armor stripping inconsistent (50% strip at low level could remove 50% DR, while at high level a 50% strip might only take 10% DR, but 100% armor strip will always remove 100% of DR from armor) due to the current exponential scaling.
So, I guess the whole point of capping the DR at 90% (and max armor at 2,700) will be to make armor stripping consistent or, closer to it. (50% armor strip could always remove 50% DR no matter the lvl)...
If lvl cap enemies are at 97% damage reduction right now, then yes lowering them to 90% would make them about 7% weaker (without health changes) but not near as weak as just dropping the current armor value from over 100,000 down to 2700 (more than 97% weaker)
I hope that makes some kind of sense, and I hope I didn't butcher it. I have a splitting headache so that's the best I do right now.
The number 2700 armor cap is not what is important here. They are changing the way armor scales up to 2700 where the DR is capped at 90%.
The more important number is 90% because we were already armor stripping by % (outside of some base armor reduction). Instead of going up to 99% or whatever it was, it's now maxed out at 90% and thus stripping even partially will have a more significant effect.
I would personally simplify resistance types a bit and try to focus on giving things uses besides a straight +dmg multi, but this does seem like a bit much, the robotic example immediately came to my mind as well, let's say 2 types of resistance per faction maybe? I've always thought armor was overtuned even after the previous changes, it's disproportionately important to completely counter for too many things. I'm not against crazy dps checks in this game, it's just that the varied approaches to deal with armor taper off into 100% strip or slash proc as it is. Most nuking wants 100% strip everywhere, it's mandatory instead of just being the best most specialized option among things like Roar, Molecular Prime and stacking with other nukes.
Why would it matter; if you mod right, even with how damage currently is, everything just dies anyway? This isn't for us dude. This change is for new players who don't have a build to deal with everything, in any situation. In early game, is quite difficult to deal with shit, when you don't have shit and don't know shit. Lmao
i wasn't really complaining about it but its just kinda funny that base SP is gonan be literal marshmallows now (as said in the video we still need more info)
The game has always had the same play style. You get stuck somewhere, you farm for certain things, and make changes, then make progression. Even at the end game, we do this over and over except the progression is not really there in terms of contents but minmax on the player power.
The pros of this change will create a reason for less popular dmg type to be used, base on how they will distribute weaknesses to different groups and planets. This will mean viral slash is no longer the most efficient dmg even at lvl cap against Grineers which has small health pool. Literally get one primer, one big slash weapon and a defensive frame and you can lvl cap too.
The downside I see to this change is for players who already have a lot of power. This will further trivialize certain contents, and we will start seeing more wacky builds as we can give up opportunity cost for more shenanigans. Then nerf hammers starts hitting indirectly even for newbies due to veterans abusing certain mechanics. The hardest content, EDA which forces players to run specific loadouts to gimp our power, will now be less of a challenge if this change affect that content due to armor normalization.
On the low end, your nerfs are probably just deferred. For newbies with certain effective loadout and limited resources, this will force you to grind more for other dmg types and weapons. For veterans, most contents are now trivialized and the most challenging one just got dumbed down.
@@GazTTVprobably for people who don’t have shit, but older players have everything from end game content, so the game will probably always be easy for them. just what comes with having end game tier gear.
Different shield and armor types was very stupid to begin with you would never care to swap weapons per enemy in a hord shotter
However i am curious what will they do about fully stripped enemies will they still be weaker to viral than corrosive or will the faction be just weaker to corrosive in general
It made sense back then since corrosive couldnt fully strip but now with the 2 green shards corrosive does strip 100% again
If they made grineer health weaker to corrosive it would make 2 green shards better but 1 tau worse
Hopefully they make viral neutral damage resistance since its proc is already so strong
The level cap situation is a bit misleading IMO because at that point virtually everyone is using either full strip or armor bypass; the cap could be 50 or it could be 500,000 and it wouldn't matter because everyone is already just removing the mechanic entirely. In that situation simply increasing the HP, and reducing the best damage modifier from 75% to 50% *should* increase the TTK for all enemies slightly but I don't see how it can be that impactful.
The only way to really impact at that point would be to maybe give enemies an unstrippable armor value equal to their level; capping at whatever value is equivalent to 50% DR on the new curve; and then aggressively ramping up health scaling after that level. Maybe a curve that hits 50% DR at 500 instead of 300, so that past level 500 the best armor strip you can get is to achieve 50%DR. It's more complex, but it produces a result that's a bit more interesting that just removing the interaction completely and making everything a health tank. If the armor cap was then around 5000 with that equal to 99% DR, armor bypass from damage type removed, reduced modifer and greater base health there should be room for fraction strip to be effective without trivializing earlier content...maybe...
Way I see it, It is crazy how in higher difficulty you have to absolutely have 100% armor strip, if they make the armor just right, then we could potentially have more freedom in how we build. If The Armor DR isn't too insane than with enough damage on any weapon I could possibly have more peace in mind to go for alternate builds like perhaps using electric x gas melee influence melee set ups without armor strip and have the element stacks and damage brute force through the DR.
9:30 that’s the part I personally really enjoy about the game. I mainly play solo because I like the challenge of being alone and doing it myself, I hit SP a few months ago and when I first got there I couldn’t do it, I didn’t have a helminth or anything yet. I loaded into the Earth exterminate and ripped like 5 mag into 1 enemy and immediately backed out because I knew I had to use a real build. Now months later I make all my own builds from scratch and love messing with all the numbers which is how it should be. BUT I will say I think enemies need more HP, I shouldn’t be able to press pillage, armor strip a whole room and then be able to kill them with literally any gun in the game.
You're slow huh? 🤦 I'm sure..
@@javionholley397 in agreeing with you
@@javionholley397 you get notifications because you commented on the post, not because I replied to you
Robots, shields, and beings literally made of stone currently bleed, you can't really complain about corpus health being consolidated if you're okay with that.
Oil, battery acid, mercury. There, I gave them blood. Also, I always figured it was a cyberpunk kinda situation with the Corpus: They bleed, but there's chrome under that meat.
Frankly, this a change I am not caring too much about. I'm cutting through the enemies like paper already, this will likely feel not much different. But what kinda annoys me is that they used up time and resources on a matter that wasn't exactly catastrophic when there are matters of utmost urgency in the game (CC vs AOE!)
I worried it will be on extreme or the other. Ether the enemy will be way weaker to catering to newer players or Hp buff makes em too tanky.
Crazy cause I just now started to understand modding too. Even though I played the game for so long I was never interested in certain ways to mod. Now that I am everything is basically changing again. I now just figured out how to make my Khora steel path viable.
Armor being capped is literally something players asked for 5-7 years ago and it IS a good change. Why? Cause now you wont need to mod for full armor strip, and your partial armor strip will pretty much reflect how much DR you remove from the enemy, when currently you can have 99% armor strip and it will maybe cut enemy DR by 10%. Basically, current armor system looks like this:
Put 10 Corrosive and some Heat on armored enemy ➡️ reduce their armor value by 90% ➡️ it did nothing
Yea, frankly this should have been done the last time armor and status was reworked, which is something we had asked for for 7 years. The old guard was just that stubborn.
This is my guess as to what's going on I believe their going to add a new endgame when warframe 1999 comes out and they are trying to give the players a little help to get them ready for it when it goes live so more newer people can talk about it and the challenges instead of needing to play catch up (or atleast as heavily as they do now) so more newer creators and players can talk about it sooner. But who knows.
I think this has something to do with the souped up netra cells, most guns become straight up useless and you just sit there and cry. (Yes I know there are work arounds) Rather then nerf enemies, make more weapons viable since there are weapons with stupidly low base stats.
the murmur enemies are not being changed as far as we can tell
Well the honest truth is this is an indirect nerf to the meta, by indirectly buffing everything (directly on the case of cold, blast, and maybe gas, they've been not so clear on if they're actually changing it).
Gas they said they weren't changing anything other than how it looks visually to better indicated what it's doing
@@Purturtur Yeah, one second look at the post and I realized they're talking solely FX, though those are still some pretty nice changes lol.
To be honest, the changes are surprisingly sensible.
Nobody uses blast outside of new players, people trying to meet a Nightwave goal, or people that just like staggering enemies.
Maybe they should increase level cap?
If these changes make it worth me building each weapon in my loadout for different damage types I’m all for it. As of now the damage types do practically nothing unless armour is involved then we use Pillage or Slash to bypass it entirely. On the other hand people will complain that they can’t mow down an entire room with a single swing of a max range + bleed build Guandao 💀
I'd say redoing health types could be a little better for more lore-relevant details. Void power is poison to Sentients, but it mostly just resets their resistances in-game. Now the Sentient faction can be universally weak to void damage. Even corpus humans rely heavily on tech, so I could see them uniquely being more vulnerable to magnetic and electric. Amalgams can be true to their design, losing their void weakness while improving their human half.
Eny one Remember railjack dmg types ? 😂
"particel" iirc lol
I completely forgot those but DE also doesn't update railjack content anymore, kinda sad imo
Seems like a missed opportunity to shake up the stale damage meta we've been in for years....I'd like to see punct and impact (and their effects) combined into "physical" with slash staying the same, viral nerfed, gas, blast, electric all buffed and then we'd have a good range of viable options
corpus are cyborgs, so half-way robot ...kinda sensed for dmg weakness
If they do these changes I think that they should remove/increase the level cap and increase the scaling rate that way harder content will still be accessible to late game players.
Looking forward to infested hp scaling changes, i hope it will make them more viable for a long run challenge
They are Already "Viable" now 👀
@@lookalike4805right tf is he on about lol infested are pretty strong and annoying
oh the irony of someone not being able to come up with a better term than "dumbing down" for when something is simplified or streamlined...
increasing health to grineer will be a direct nerf to bleed,
8:26 "health scaling of greneer enemies will be re-aligned...to try and maintain a similar time-to-kill feel"
this could be a direct nerf to not just bleed but also any strategy that fully remove armor.
let say they double the health of all greneer enemies that would mean if you use bleed or full armor strip strat, you will need time to kill twice longer than before.
that would enrage a lot of kids
They’re acting like we can’t steamroll all the factions in the game as it is, what end game content is being added to make everything even simpler?
i feel like the whole point of the changes are to let more weapons and builds work for non level cap/base steel path activities. As someone who just got to SP a week or two ago it was a huge wall in order to do anything at all, all of my good weapons and builds were suddenly useless and i had to redo most of my progress to get something going. it wasnt too bad since i was able to get the base zariman incarnons and last weeks rotations of torrid and dual toxocyst but i was a bit disappointed that so many of my favorite base starchart weapons got so bad instantly(even after galvanized mods and optimizing). currently there are ~40 incarnons out of over 500 weapons which imo makes the meta and buids quite stale. as well as most warframe builds making use of like 5-10 subsumes out of 56. obviously the meta will remain the same but i hope the changes will open up options for base steel path and non level cap activities, as i feel like most players dont exclusively run level cap
By nerfing armor values, partial strip is more important, meaning heat is going to do better, as well as normal corrosive, and raw damage is also kinda getting buffed so things like Mesa's Peacemakers, etc will be stronger. Yes this might make the game "easier", but given the current ludicrousness of our builds, does it really matter? Making enemies bullet sponges isn't the way, instead DE should focus on things like Deep Archimede which makes things challenging in more ways.
All the resistances/weakness/armor changes would make sense if enemies in steel path were actually difficult to kill.
But they are not. So this is a totally unneeded change, just to make steel path easier.
Buffing all the other damage types we do is actually good, so maybe we want to use anything other than the damages that already wipe the enemies.
If any, they should buff enemies in steel path, rather than making them weak. Maybe slow down the scaling so lvl cap feels the same, but entry steel path is already too easy
Removing toxins ability to bypass shields would be stupid.
Tbh, im end game rn, and i see this armor change as an absolute win as my build doesn't 1 shot everything on the map, but it kills what im shooting at stupidly quick. After the change it will be the same. It will still kill anything i point it at stupidly quick.
Level 54 heavy gunner level?!! That is stupidly low. I think it is gonna be nice to have to rely on armor stripping abilities a lot less heavily, but I do think this change is slightly too far. I don’t really mind the shield/armor/health resistance changes though, that was always a subtly confusing thing in the game imo
Right now the game has a hard weapon heirarchy from mastery, and frames have a psuedo heirarchy by age and their kit "theme". Most of the game is balanced around gamestates that no longer exist. Warframe is a casual game that most people don't see 90% of because of how much of a time investment it is to actually get through the content. DE seems to be trying to make "it takes 100 hours of play before it gets good" less of an issue with changes like this. The current way of things isn't really learning to interact with the game's systems so much as it is looking up how to bypass them and grinding to the point where they don't mechanically matter. That has to be addressed if DE is going to add mechanical difficulty to the game instead of just dumping loads of negative effects on the player(like deep archimedea). The game abruptly goes from a sandbox with unlimited possibility to 10-15 relevant mods per item type because any ability or mod with hard numbers instead of multipliers/percentages just stops working.
If DE was in the business of keeping hard lines on how they want people to play, instead of streamlining the game to ~feel~ better, we'd still have stamina, no shield gating, and no bullet jump.
There are legendary 4 players that just fuff around in the sandbox and MR20 players with 2-3 min-max loadouts for endurance.
They're not just capping enemy armor, but changing the scaling so it functions differently from player armor. Right now it's an asymptotic curve where DR can never reach 100%. By changing how enemy armor works, they could still theoretically give enemies 98% DR without giving them armor values in the tens of thousands, and have it scale on a curve where corrosive, without shards, would take off more than just 10% DR.
The armor curve works on the player side, because there is only so much armor we can get through modding/arcanes, and even the highest player armor possible won't prevent being killed in 2 bullets once enemy damage reaches a certain point.
The weapons and abilities that can reach tens, to hundreds of millions of damage are outliers to the rest of the game. Hard metas get stale, and there's no way for warframe to get away from them without fundamental changes to how it works.
Love how you're worried about game being too easy but not worried about farming log in rewards
We need a Steel Path for the Steel Path
“We want build variety” how strange de
no gaz. enemies will not become easier to kill. they stated explicitly that they aim at keeping ehp/ttk similar. what they do is they reduce the effectiveness of armor stripping by making enemies hp tanks. and by that increasing the importance of modding against the faction. but I agree that we might see slash procs become useless.
Switching load outs is already annoying and inconvenient enough. But to do that before every mission is bothersome.
Who even has a problem with armor anymore since HM and cheap armorstrip which got buffed on every frame and got 4 helmints, and non-SP mobs die to corrosive as is (free frame Umbra with basic build EB corrosive+heat facerolls SP too btw). Unifying resistances within factions is good cause the current system is clusterfuck nonsense, but I hope armor change doesn't babyfy the game even more
armor calculation for enemies should be diffrent then warframes, you remove 60% armor, it should be 60% armor, not 60% of current armor value that in actuallity amount for 5-10% of the armor.
I just need the Murmur enemies to have a consistenr and visible headshot hitbox LMAO 😂😂😂😂😂
please I would love uncaped enemy level. and try to kill some level 9999999999 charger or something
Not an issue,nerf to dot builds, especially slash,more viability to everything else.
Honestly im fine with a little shake up in the meta
I laughed when i saw DE had impact as recommended element against grineer and magnetic (when toxin completes ignores shield)against corpus . why make your life harder?
Some people want a "Challenge"
¯\_(ツ)_/¯
How does bro have 300k plat
I don't know. It feels like it is made too easy then that makes God roll rivens pointless. It also sounds like we would probably do more partial armor strip but focus on HP damage.
yeah focusing more on HP will be interesting
God roll rivens are already pointless. You can one shot any levelcap enemy without any riven. Rivens are just for more fun.
rivens are really only useful for convenience of not having to use multiple mods to create basically the same outcome, overkill amounts of damage. you don't need rivens for anything besides selling for plat or just to minmax your build.
DE: "We lowering Enemy Armor."
Also DE: "We're Keeping Damage Attenuation."
Me: "Then Whats The Point ?"
¯\_(ツ)_/¯
Damage Attenuation not a issue.
Damage Attenuation don't stop us 1 shooting. If you not change & experiment with builds.
So the tools they just gave us, green shards and all of these armor strips, they all just become meaningless?
They're tanking up the Corpus and making us actually change our fucking builds?
Plus this is actually just a giant nerf to frames like Dante, Hydroid, Voruna, etc. that do slash or corrosive, because a bigger portion of enemy EHP will be actual HP, making every single DoT that reduced or ignored armor instantly much, MUCH worse.
I'm not happy about this. They're going to fuck this up. If it ain't broke, DON'T FUCKING FIX IT.
this was a barrier of entry i suppose which is why thye are simplifying it but its also one of the things some players really enjoyed
Ongggg
Simplified.. might be another term lol :)
Gazzz let them nerf it I'm not good like you SADGE making me cry ;(
yeah i saw u in twich chat saying this
All i really want is warframe syngery so multiplayer feels better. As it stands it hits a point where you are either so strong you prevent teammates from contributing unless they run away effectively making it multiplayer in name only OR you rely on a CC or Buff frame and just spam one ability while taking a nap and letting your nuke frame team member do all the work.
Thats my biggest issue with the game. It feels so lonely to play next to instead of with friends. I love Warframe but its the one game my friends and wife wont play because of how it forces you into effectively singleplayer play.
:/
There is no build diversity, not because of armor but because its nuke or nap. There ia no other viable playstyle outside of base steelpath and only if you CHOOSE to kneecap your builds.
Duviri pushes more people away than anything else in the game
The game is easy already even mouth breathers apparently can do max lvl enemies , so i don't see the issue lol
These changes aren't extreme at all. Viral+slash will still be head and shoulders above the rest. Corrosion is still extremely good. It's just that partial armor strip is actually becoming decent.
Also you seem to have misunderstood the changes to armor. They are changing up the scaling entirely on enemies. 10 corrosive stacks on a thrax isn't going to leave them at 10% DR and with the EHP that a mk1 kunai can one tap them.
It's kind of crazy how detached the diehard core of warframe is from the rest. Yall are so used to modding 100% armor strip and viral slash on every build that you fail to see the fundamental flaw that it's the only way to actually play. What build diversity? There is none. If you look past the shiny surface, you realise that every viable build is the same: If you aren't running full armor strip, and you aren't running viral slash, you don't have a chance of doing anything at level 300+. There is not even much thought that goes into modding, every weapon runs the same damn mods we've been running since 2016. The only exception we've recently had is with melee weapons adding electricity to the mix.
Hell 300+ is even a very generous number I gave. You can't do netracells without the same shit that everyone HAS TO run. That's not a hardcore endurance mission.
Bro levelcap heavygunner just have 200.000 !!!! armor and ı can one shot her easily without any armor strip with her %99,85 dmg reduction and now 2700 armor? And she has 1.345.541.856 EHP without armor strip. I think its a joke. And each element was good for something different except blast. But why should I use radiation anymore? Maybe many elements will be trash? Just use corrosive against yellow, magnetic or toxin against blue, fire against red ohhh yeass amazing update. In the video you said no one uses radiation. But radiation is good against new necramech demolishers and many bosses like eidolon. Now what about eidolon ? Are we going to use corrosive against him too? And magnetic was good for slash weapons againts corpus. I don't like this new update. It will make Warframe sooo easy. I think corrosive and radiation will be good against yellow - gas, fire will be good against blue after this update or something like that.
The same thing happened when they did the first enemy ehp rework. Enemies before were ridiculously tanky, you needed a full squad and crazy synergies to kill level cap (unless doing ivara covert lethality cheese or octavia vs corpus). Then the first enemy scaling rework turned them into paper tissue. It was kinda shocking to see level cap enemies melting to glaive throws at first. But now they're going full marshmellow, seems you'll just be able to brute force anything in the game up to level cap. Such is WF, our power creep keeps growing exponentially while enemies just get weaker. Pablo was better about giving us more challenge than Steve was, but seems like he caved in as well. Ah well.
Instead of doing this they should rework others warframes
These changes were crazy needed. 1) Simplifying so that certain factions are weak to certain damage types makes a lot of sense. Now impossible to understand what to use unless you utilize trial and error or trust a RUclipsr. 2) The only thing that mattered was armor. If armor was too high, you couldn't do much damage. You had no choice but to strip armor. Nothing else mattered and once you stripped the armor they died right away. Now they will have a lot of health so they will die slowly at high levels and you can, over time, kill high level enemies. Also Corpus shields meant nothing and Corpus died quickly, so why use Magnetic? Now their shields and Magnetic will be buffed so you can benefit from using Magnetic on them. Why have all these different damage types like blast and Magnetic and cold if they have little benefit? These changes are good for the game - if they get it right. The current system is messed up. The armor might be the same at high levels,, but they will compensate with lots of extra health which is how it should be. I doubt they will make Steel Path a lot easier at the entry level, which is all that most people play. Infinite enemy scaling sounds good.
🤦🤦
Step too far? No. I hoped they stepped farther.
07:00 I’ve known DE too long to fully believe they’re doing the community a solid. Trying to make the game easier
I agree gaz wants it hardcore I get it but I like it easy lol
Isn’t 2700 armor and 2 billion armor still just 90% dr? This just makes more build options open up so what’s the problem? You won’t need green shards to make corrosive good.
No.... One will Have more DR than The Other.
if u liook in the video they show a heavy gunner with 10k armor having 97% dr
@@GazTTV ok so they’ll have 9 more percent at the most so but the difference is corrosive will actually work on one but not the other. Even tho the number I had were wrong it’s not that much of a difference, armor number doesn’t matter the dr does. If you full strip this does nothing for you if anything makes them more tanky since health will scale.
The 9 percent increase can make a big of difference. Assume 100 health enemy
90%dr - 1k ehp
99%dr - 10k ehp
But i think they will most likely change how the dr calculated if they are going to cap at 2700. Let's just wait until we get more details.
@geraldclark9280
That Tiny Difference is Exactly why People use Total Armor Strips and Bleed + Viral. ¯\_(ツ)_/¯
Warframe has no middle ground. Either you fuck everything and the game is mad boring or there are places you can't even go period with your loadout. Also a lot of mods a straight up useless because they are scared in balancing the game, therefore its a much needed change. Im sick of running viral slash, armor strip builds etc... On the other side tho its weird because now the game will be literal god mode at all times for anyone that can mod just decently. They really need to find a way to keep the end game hard to the point where you HAVE TO watch what you have and match it with the enemy while making the game easier to adapt to at earlier ranks. Which is not easy to do and we know DE will take the easy route AKA: just make the game easy for everyone which, with how easy the game becomes once you can actually mod, is a huge problem. A lot of people will find the game trash asl. And they are the people that play this game the most...i never understood modern gaming ideology to cater to the people that can't play the fkn game.(the game does have mad variety issues tho, but thats not how we should address them)
Everyone: warframe is in a good place these days.
DE: EXTREME CHANGES!!!
With incarnon weapons and archon shards, steel path has already become easy.
Pls DE Delete warframe mobile.
Why?
What DE is doing is making the game easier for new players. Cause new players don't want to go through all the work we did. It will eventually backfire because players that want everything easy eventually quit. Quit = less revenue
They need to worry about their damn server issues rather than trivial things that arent an issue if you actually work with the community. DE has been failing as of recently with some of these updates and its sad.
Give me a like when I’m right.
Steel Path 2
Watch rivens price drop to 2 digit numbers, because: why i would spend 300k kuva on a god roll if i can just slap a rank 6 serration and phase through steel path
Rivens were never about Killing Enemies... They were about Seeing Bigger Numbers on Screen.
They would probably Still Sell if you Capped Enemy Level Scaling to 10. Because that would just let Damage Numbers get Bigger. 😎
Bragging that level 10,000 enemies are too easy because you use a setup that completely strips armor, and then bitching about them lowering armor lol.
We wouldn't want all 57 frames to be able to do content. Leave it at just the ones that build armor strip😂
Let's be real, this is all just to cater to mobile players. Yet another reason that was a horrible idea in my opinion.
Nah man, the fact that armor strip was the only mechanic that actually made the whole difference between a build that would clear Steel Path or not was always an issue.
Warframe mobile is perfectly fine lmao it plays better than the switch version and is easily the best mobile game in the market currently besides vampire survivors.
Huh? What does this have to do in the slightest with mobile players?
No, viral slash has been dominant at lvl cap vs Grineers. This change will improve the effectiveness of other forms of dmg vs them while decreasing the efficiency of slash dmg vs healthbar(depending on the multiplier) on a lvl cap Grineers. Then we will see Ember Prime resurgence again.
@@darkduprey4079 cmon bro SP easy af without armor strip
If people want more difficulty, I have an amazing solution. :) Remove trading and being able to buy stuff with plat. Will it kill content generation for the game? Probably. Will it be hard because sweaties will have to no life for 12hrs a day instead of just buying everything? Yes
You're fucking slow 🤦 like holy shit that's the stupidest shit I ever heard
You wouldn't have to No Life Anything or Grind Anymore than you already do because all means of Progression (Like Getting More Slots) are Hard Locked to Nightwave and Special Alerts.