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I LOVED the first season and I can't defend it enough for the past 3 years. But I couldn't deny that season 2 was rushed even Christian admitted skipping some of Vi's arc because there just was so much to do, if they just had one more act or just a little more time then I think it would've help.
10 more minutes on each episode would have probably had a noticeable benefit. When I look at the pacing between the seasons, the thing that draws my eye is the ending for S1. That iconic ending is probably responsible for most of the pacing issues in S2. Act 1 in S2 feels like such a natural continuation and the fight scene in ep 3 is actually in the opening credits in S1 (statues of Jinx and Vi fighting) I wouldn't be surprised if S2 ep 3 was supposed to be the ending for S1 but got pushed to S2 in favor of the tea party/Rocket ending.
I hated her ending with Caitlyn. It feels unearned even though I was a big Caitvi shipper in season 1. But they actually destroyed their relationship for me I'm season 2. I blame it on the writers the animation makes it feel so romantic and the context and dialogue makes it feel empty. I also wanted her to be more than just a part of a ship and Jinx's sister but they wasted her.
I can somewhat understand people disliking the more 'music video' style sequences in season 2 compared to the less stylized use of music in season 1, but to say it doesn't progress the plot is just telling me they didn't actually watch the show. The music videos are used to show what's happening to the characters and to Piltover and Zaun at a faster pace so they can get to the other plot points later in the episode. The whole point of the montages is to *show what's happening* and *progress the plot*
that’s the problem though. all it does is serve as a form of stylized exposition. they never let the plot, the setting, or the characters breathe. it just feels like the show is trying to get from point A to point B as fast as possible without giving itself time to develop any of its ideas or story beats further.
@@eebbaa5560 I agree with that, yeah. The music videos were definitely more rushed, but with the timeframe that Fortiche had for season 2, it's probably one of the better ways they could've gone about the issue of pacing. Season 2 definitely had a lot of flaws, but the music videos were pretty minor in comparison to other issues, like abandoning side characters/arcs and pushing the Piltover and Zaun conflict aside near the end. And personally, I thought it was pretty fun to have the music and the visuals compliment what was happening at the time. Being able to leave some of the plot points up to interpretation while still conveying what's happening was a pretty good decision with the time restraints they had imo
idk about you but i wasn't exactly a fan of having to pause every 3 seconds and rewind to try to not even catch all the details, but at least get a grasp of what was going on in those music videos, especially since it felt like 90% of the episodes were music videos. the music sections in season 1 were much more meaningful, slower paced and understandable, while still being worth of rewatching with all the symbolism in them. additionally, i had to watch in English which isn't my native language, and for some reason my native (Ukrainian) wasn't available where i live (Germany). which, as you can probably imagine, didn't make whatever ghost of the plot remained in those music videos any more coherent. so, yeah, the criticism of the music parts is very valid imo. the music itself was great, but playing a new song every 5 minutes made it feel less like a deep story and more like a car karaoke :/
@@WhoEustace Still, I feel it was a better option than just exposition dumping everything. Fortiche has said that they wished they could do more to cover some of their flaws with the second season, but with everything they had to wrap up and all the plot points they had to hit, there wasn't a whole lot of room for better exposition. I completely agree that Season 1's use of music was way better, but Season 2 wasn't nearly as bad as people are making it out to be. Things could've been much worse, and it would've been a lot harder to make them better with the constraints
Yes, the montages progress the plot but it doesn't progress the character arcs. That's kinda the issue. But for what it's worth, the music videos weren't the problem. The music videos were the bandaid solution to the much larger issue, the fact that the creators tried to shove 2 seasons worth of material into one season, and because of that, they marathoned through the story and a lot of important character and plot beats were cut out in the process, resulting in the rushed "mess" that was this season
The story overall in S2 is fine, but I feel like it was 2 seasons worth of content shoved into one and rushed at the same time. Arcane should've been 3 seasons, and it would've been a 10/10 undisputed champion of the entertainment world for the next decade or longer. Now the haters have their ammo needed to bash the living hell out of arcane and make a mountain out of a mole hill.
An extra episode or 2 sure. An entire season? 3 more years? I doubt it. S1 is much slower paced in act 1 and the most common complaint is "its kinda boring until ep 3" or "i wasn't sure if it was good until ep 3." Adding a whole other season, 9 more episodes, we'd get the exact opposite problem. "act 2 feels pointless" "why is this scene even here" "didn't they already cover this" As far as ammo for haters. Most of it is subjective so if they are saying they didn't enjoy S2. All good no worries, there are people that didn't like S1.
@@Joeda89 The ideal season 2 would've focused on Vi and Caitlyn hunting Jinx down with an emphasis on Vi being significantly more conflicted between wanting to help Caitlyn and wanting to save Jinx, the sister she's been trying to rescue for the whole first season. If the first season focuses on Jinx choosing between Powder or Jinx, then it seems rather obvious that the second season would've focused on Vi's decision between being Vi as Caitlyn's partner or Vi as Jinx's sister. Then Vi makes her choice and the Vi vs Jinx fight would've been the climax of the season. Then the third season would focus on Vi and Jinx being forced to work together to save Vander while Caitlyn's running her dictator arc and trying to chase them down. and Caitlyn would have to contend with watching her ex-girlfriend conspiring with her mother's killer and the Shimmer weapon killing off her enforcers. It's the same story with the same trajectory. But with a lot more room for the character arcs and plotlines to breathe
I agree. 3 seasons would’ve been much much better for with all the moving plot points they wanted to cover. Two things that stand out are Isha and Mel’s involvement with the Black Rose.
@@Scr4mbledM3ggs I wouldn't say no to more scenes with Isha and I would gladly watch an entire season of Mel making her way back to Piltover, but tv history doesn't support this. So many shows start out slow and get dropped because it takes too long to really start. Would this story still be fondly remembered if it took another 3 years to finish? When the number 1 complaint about S1 was "it takes 3 episodes to get good" is it really a surprise that they made cuts to speeding the pacing up?
The worst part about this season is lack of character interaction. There are so many plots in the series that i want reaction from the main chracters. I want to see mel response to embessa successfully starting a war. I want to see ekko and firelight response to vi joining caitlyn and gassing the city. I want jayce reaction to caitlyn becoming a dictator. There are so many interesting interaction they just ignored.
Not ignored, had to cut. Regarding mel, we did get that scene lol. The other two would have been nice and the only one I really want is Ekko Vi scene. The Jayce Cait scene would have been nice but I understand why it had to go.
Sure, more moments showing how the characters are feeling would have been nice, but it's not a dealbreaker since they wouldn't be essential to advance the plot. Just because we didn't get to see some interesting bits, it doesn't mean what we actually got was disappointing.
@@rowandavis2061 I feel like you had to pay really close attention to this season to catch subtext and nuance that wasn't as prevalent as season 1. Lots of people who are critical missed things I thought were apparent or even obvious, although some criticisms are definitely fair.
@@rowandavis2061I mean I agree I think the shoe was still good. But the issue is how much detail they put into season 1, and I get the plan was only 2 seasons but when you have a show that has put so much detail into the little things in the first season and then in season 2 you have a major character (cait) go through a villain ark off screen. We get a jump forward after a large amount of time of cait being a dictator and now she’s questioning if they are the good guys.
@@rowandavis2061It absolutely does. Arcane season 1 best point was characters. By far. Arcane s2 weakest point is characters. By far. Ofc it's a problem.
The problem with the second season is that most of the character development happened off screen and created a lot of ambiguity and speculation to the point that we had to interpret the blanks/spaces between each scene. Such a strange way to force a narrative device of reading between the lines more often when compared to the first season where it kept its pace consistant. A lot of the scenes are not spelled out to the average viewer which caused many to percieve the ending as quick and abrupt with a lot of the story threads unresolved or even unsatisfying. Reading intention and what the characters are thinking based on character expression, reaction, focus, etc, based on the limited availabe information is what creates discussion and discourse among the community, but at the same time viewers can speculate and give their interpretation, but that's all it will ever be interpretation based on speculation. Writers have already outlined the intention and established direction. We won't see the end result until the next series where we see those characters again. Like Spider-Man 3 in 2007 and The Amazing Spider-Man 2 in 2014, and fans waiting until 2021 to see these Spider-Man characters develop and interact in Spider-Man No Way Home. Fans of Arcane are in for a looong wait if this will be the case.
Plot holes like how did Jinx and Warwick escape and leave Stillwater if Ambessa was there in the area of the cable cart, how did the free inmates also leave? Even though Sevika didn't have any spoken dialogue and mostly her presence in the last episode, did she find out that Isha died or find out what happened to Jinx? What was her reaction? Did Sevika know that Jinx killed Silco? Did Jayce and Caitlyn find out that it was Vi and Powder/ Jinx that stole from them? Did Ekko realize that it was Jayce that he was trialing when he was in the alternate universe? What happened to Heimendinger? Jayce and Viktor? Too many things are up in the air or did not give enough closure.
@@PillowEgg the lack of character reaction or interaction was a huge flaw in this season tbh. there were so many moments when things happened and characters didn’t even get a chance to react to the events of the story or the world changing. sevika in general was just completely sidelined even though she had the setup for a compelling character arc.
They resorted to telling the story this way because they tried to shove 2 seasons worth of story into one. They needed more time for the story to breathe
Well said, one issue I had with character development off screen was Victor going from "You must destroy the Hexcore" at the end of season to 'cyborg jesus' to 'I will assimilate every one and end free will using this arcane technology I thought was too dangerous to exist 5 minutes ago'. Like I am not saying he couldn't make that change but dang it seemed to happen fast and with very little under pinning it.
The real problem is they made serious plots into music video. Caitlyn brutality and zaun revolution should have weight and now people remember them as fun music video.i m thinking it might be intentional to water down the seriousness of the situation.
I felt like it was 10/10 on first watch for sure. Given some time to marinate, I'd say 8.5 or 9 maybe. I have some issues, but they pale in comparison to the overall product.
@@WickedHumor do you watch for the entertainment or to review the content? Just enjoy bro if you said it was 10/10 on first watch then it is watching it again will be another experience so of course you will give it another evaluation
The one valid point out of all these reviews is the mention of Silco's murder never being discussed. It wouldn't be far-fetched for Zauners to believe that Silco was killed by topsiders and that Jinx avenged him by blowing up the Council. If I were an average Zauner that would make sense to me: the wild dog avenged its master and took down the enemy in one go. It's a plausible interpretation so I just ran with it. For a few seconds I thought that Sevika might find out that Jinx was the one who killed Silco and that would create tension, but that was just for a few seconds. Pace-wise it wouldn't fit and a Jinx vs Sevika conflict wouldn't bring out a lot of emotions since they didn't like each other in the first place. Yes, the pacing in season 2 was faster than the pacing in season 1...and it makes perfect sense. Season 1 took the time to make us feel invested in the characters while unveiling the plot, we wouldn't have cared if things happened too fast! And Season 2 did its one job to end the story. I don't know the video game lore, but I believe that it's because I knew that Arcane is based on a video game that I enjoyed it so much. Growing up I liked reading books, but sometimes I would set them aside to watch my cousins play video games--for the sake of the storylines, of course. Of course my cousins didn’t pause for me to catch up on what was happening, at best I'd get some quickly thrown explanation for why who could do what or not. I had to keep my eyes and ears wide open to catch as many details as possible so that I could piece things together myself. Even when I guessed wrong, the reveal/plot twist was rewarding anyway.l and the visuals always stunned me. Watching Arcane felt like watching my cousins play a video game. My personal experience lends a nostalgic element to the show, which further elevates its already outstanding value. I mean, someone could teach a whole art class on how well the creators used color-coding conformation to emphasize characterization. Nowadays too many members of the audience feel entitled to receive the pacing, dialogues and ending THEY want. Whining just because the creators/directors didn't deliver your fantasy is childish.
I agree with you alot, especially the last point you made, but I did want to touch on the Jinx killed Silco and it's not discussed bit. I think this point would have more merit if it would change anything in Zaun. Silco was not loved in Zaun, he was tolerated. He had money, the weapons so what he was in charge. Vander was the beloved folk hero of Zaun, not silco.The only way he kept power was it being given to him by Sevika, and that was just because there wasn't a better option. Even the peace deal silco gets is given to him by Jayce cause he feels bad for killing one of Silco's child workers. Once Piltover put out the reward for Jinx, that ensured that Sevika wouldn't turn on her, how could she turn on Jinx when she just blew up the council and Sevika betrayed Vander for being too weak. Jinx isn't going to brag about killing silco she is struggling too much with that fact to openly talk about it. If blowing up the council laid the foundation, then clearing the gray and sending back topside solidified it and it echoes when the mural in ep 5 doesn't show Jinx and silco on the wall, but Jinx and vander. All this to say if the people of zaun found out Jinx killed silco, they wouldn't turn her in, they would thank her and since that is where she ends up anyway then it's not really needed. Still it would have been nice, like she tells Sevika or somehow Sevika finds out I can hear Sev saying something like "Hmph, I told him not to go after you, that you would come to him. Guess I was right." it could have been a nice scene in S2 between ep 3 and 4, but it would mean something else has to go and I can't even begin to think of what should be cut for it.
The music videos are contentious because they essentially boil down what could be half a season of content into just a couple minutes. Regardless of how cool you think they are, most people will feel slightly cheated out of the opportunity to get to see the situation and characters develop. Like I'm really dissapointed we didn't get to see HOW Isha pulled Jinx back from the brink, didn't get to see Jinx reluctantly taking care of her and start to realise they have a bond, I wish we got to see Jinx struggle with her mental illness but develop and figure out how to come to manage her problems (and if your honest answer is that she isn't managing her problems at all, and Isha is just a light-switch that controls whether or not Jinx has schizophrenia than I don't know what to say to you). I wish we got to see more of Viktor explaining his philosophy and delve deeper into the conversation of free will, show us WHY he thinks the hivemind is a better option, with what we are given it comes across as shallow, like the writers didn't have skill to write more complex conversations between character about their philosophies. I could only appreciated Viktor's point of view because I have watched evangelion and other shows with similar themes around "self-destructive human nature, and assimilation", except those shows are actually interested in having that conversation, not just reading you the footnotes. Done well the exploration of Viktor's character could have been on the level of the hedgehog dilemma and human instrumentality from evangelion. This summarizes my issue with season 2: although the ideas were great and the art was great it was poorly executed because it was rushed, like they didn't have time to explore beyond the surface level, so they provide the footnotes rather than delving into the actual thesis. It comes across as very "first draft-y" Then you have the issue of characters just doing things that are absolutely out of character, or at best very rushed development making the shifts in views feel jarring. Look at Jayce at the end of season 1, he tries to invade the under city solely on a whim because he is upset, and immediately decided to dismantle the operation after accidentally killing a child. But then what must be at most a week later ends up making weapons for Cait in season 2 when she wants to invade the underground. I think that is blatant character assassination, even if they gave us more scenes showing why he had a change of heart, this is too quick for him to immediately go back on his decision to stop making hextech weapons. Also, do you really expect me to buy that Vi would go and use the grey on her people just because she wants to find Jinx, like for all she knows she might end up gassing Ekko, you know, the boy who is basically her best friend? And the final twist that Viktor was the mage from Jayce's memory in season 1 is 100% a rhetcon, and if you disagree you are lying to yourself. Why did Jayce shoot Viktor in act 2 instead of trying to talk to him when that was his plan all along? How does Warwick operate the cable car mechanism to get to and from stillwater? Why does Jayce not get bodyswapped when displaced by the anomaly but Ekko and Heimerdinger do (the answer is that it's an unexplained plot convenience because if he got body swapped he would end up in the body of the hivemind Jayce)? How does Jinx overcome schizophrenia in 3 months, I originally bought into it more because I assumed a few years had passed (even then it's obv very unrealistic but I can suspend my disbelief enough to still buy in). There is just a lot of plot holes that show a drastic lack of quality control in season 2. I liked season 2, thematically the ideas of forgiveness and hope resonate with me more than the bleak and depressing themes in the first season, but I can't deny that the writing clearly had far less quality control than season 1. Season 1 still has some contrivances but it is air-tight in comparison to season 2. My brother seems to hold this superiority complex because arcane season 1 is one of his favorite shows, but just because you like something that is well made doesn't make you any smarter or better than anyone else, I like plenty of bad shows and movies but that doesn't make me feel some inferiority complex about my intelligence. But that doesn't mean we should dismiss the impact that good writing can have on a story, and the effort that goes into making it.
Specifically the music scene with The Line as well as the one in the alternate universe hit me so hard, more than any other piece of media ever. In my opinion, season 2 blows season 1 out of the water for me, I’m not sure why. I think part of it is visuals, part of it is the struggle that Jinx works through, part of it is Viktor, and plenty more.
When you realize the Line was inspired by the singer's loss of his grandmother and it get's to "Take a seat" "But I'd rather you not be here for " "What could be my final form" I cry everytime
As someone who adored the 1st season and has spent the past 3 years praising it as the single greatest piece of media ever made, and also someone who hates the 2nd season, I would like to elaborate on, or even add some of my own issues with the season. The music Videos: I agree, they're fantastic... as set-pieces. The issue with the MV's this season is that they're treated as self contained scenes. What should've given opportunity to characterise Loris and maddie, and show Vi embracing the role as an enforcer is replaced by an MV. What should've been Vi's lowest point, where she's left directionless and alone (or with Loris, I guess) is nothing more than a 2 min MV that could be removed and nothing would be lost. These MV's replace alot of opportunity for character growth. I was expecting to further elaborate on other reviews, but I guess you weren't lying when you said these reviews are terrible. So, I guess I'll get into my own gripes. The Zaun plot line is entirely abandoned. Seriously. A civil war has being brewing for almost a decade by the finale, but for some reason the Zaunites run to their oppressors aid. Paint the town blue showed that the situation between Zaun and Piltover was worse than ever, indiscriminate assaults and imprisonment of civilians for standing on the street. I could maybe make sense of it had there been anything in it for them, but Jayce couldn't even manage a plea when attempting to conscript them. The characters. Honestly, I can't consider Caitlyn a character anymore. This isn't rhetorical, what did they do with her character this season? The single thing she got, they reverted before actually doing anything with it. Caitlyn can be replaced by any nameless enforcer from episode 4 and onwards and I feel the series would be better for it because it would at least spare me the scenes between her and Vi. Which brings me to Vi. She is one of the biggest disappointments this season, so many incredibly intriguing plot points that they do nothing with, her becoming an enforcer, her being an enforcer, her break up with Cait, her hitting rock bottom, her grieving losing her father figure again, and none of those were anywhere to be seen. All she had this season was her relationship with Jinx, and whilst it works, it becomes tiring when it's all she has had for the past 11 episodes and that's only amplified by them not doing anything with the other things that were available for her. It also makes what should've been a great moment, where Jinx forces her to let her go, feel underwhelming. The single arc that Vi has had for a majority of the series at this point isn't even resolved by her. And there's 'the scene'. Personally, I'm just not a fan of sex in media, not that I'm a prude, but I feel there's generally a more effective way to establish the point that these scenes generally are there to set, so no matter how this scene was placed I likely wouldn't like it, but... Good lord. They couldn't have done this worse. She just woke up from a concussion after watching her father figure die, and her sister- who has previously expressed relief at the thought of death- just alluded to killing herself. Throw in the fact that she's also a manic terrorist and a mass murderer, the focus of both Caitlynn and Vi should be to find her. Jinx isn't just a threat to herself, she's a threat to the whole city's populace. And, to be clear, I dont want Vi to go after Jinx. That would be regressive for her character. What I thought would, and feel should've happend, is Vi actually grief all the loss she's experienced and Cait to be there to comfort her, but instead they did what they did and to me it paints them both as callous and selfish. I have a quite a few more issues, but I've being writing for a minute now, and I feel putting anymore would be daunting for anyone that would actually be looking to engage in a convo. I would love to hear thoughts from anyone that sees this and disagrees with me
this, oh my god this. i wouldn't say i HATED season 2, there were some good parts that i personally liked, but i still agree 100% with everything you said
Wow! This is.. awful! Never review anything again! As if the civil war… isn’t the last act lmfao. But wahhhh it didn’t end how you wanted so ?? bad?? Checks notes. Sex is bad because you find it icky and you cannot process the fact that these characters are meant to be messy humans who don’t follow a narrative how you want. You’re mad at the sex because you do not understand Caitlyn. Shush
@palemeadows I honestly have no clue what you was trying to say in reference to the civil war not being the last act. I feel I made it clear why I generally don't like sex in media, and why i dont like this scene in particular. If its done well (like the scene between Khal Drogo and Daenerys in GoT) I obviously won't take issue with it, but if its not it just feels like a way for the directors to project their fetishes (like most sex scenes from GoT). And the team talking about an extended cut pushes it further towards the latter for me. And, no. My issue with Vi and Caitlynn is actually the exact opposite. I feel they have no agency and bounce around solely in service of the plot. You say my review is terrible, but you didn't dispute anything I said. Where am I wrong? I would love to be proven wrong, that's why I posted this, I want to have a discussion that'll change my mind about these things.
Season 2 showed us everything we NEEDED to see in order to wrap up the story in a satisfying way and did it in style. Yes, there were plenty of things that would have been nice to see, like more scenes with certain characters together (e.g. Ekko and Jinx) or more of the build-up to certain events, but they weren't essential for keeping you invested in the characters or progressing the story. They did an amazing job with the limited run time they had, and saying it was garbage because they left out some interesting bits of fluff is incredibly harsh. Remember that plenty of truly great stories are ones that leave you wanting more.
@rowandavis2061 the whole show was about zaun v piltover until the last 2 episodes when suddenly it was about viktor flying in space hypnotizing everyone. Hours of deep storytelling about class war that's just forgotten so they can have a marvel fight scene Also how about the scene where ekko talks jinx out of blowing herself up and into helping?? How is it remotely acceptable to do that off screen This isn't missing fluff, it's missing heart
Thankyou for this comment really. It’s tough to scroll through all the hatred around the show. Like come on, let’s watch it together again without toxicity and obsessively talk about the cool parallels😭
@@DRsideburnsI kinda agree with you, but no at the same time. The show did Definitely build up to viktors villian arc. It was an amazing BEAUTIFULLY crafted story. My only complaint is they packed to much into to little time. They needed more time to flesh everything out and give each plot breathing room. And I do agree they sacrificed a lot of heart for moving the plot. But no nothing happened in the plot randomly I would say
@@rowandavis2061 I wouldn’t say that ALL of it was satisfying because there were definitely weird plot decisions make all throughout the second season. (In my opinion) There was a ton of content to cover and I think the show could’ve benefited from a few more episodes and a few revisions to the script. However there was a lot of things wrapped up somewhat nicely with a few lingering questions here and there. And of course this show has a ton of style in the animation and art category. The people who worked on this shows visuals deserve nothing but praise and respect.
@Scr4mbledM3ggs I mean, yeah, I'd definitely say season 1 is slightly more cohesive overall. As someone who still found season 2 outstanding, though, it kinda sucks to see all the negativity towards it.
Part of me wish it had stopped after season 1, as the ending was perfect. They could have taken season 2 to a different part of the world and told a new story there. I do not get the people saying the ending was a cliffhanger, as the point of the ending was that she fired the rocket, not what it hit, which pretty much sums up my problems with season 2 starting where it does. That said i cant deny it was awesome to see Ekko with his full kit, and Victor too. Season 2 did feel like they tried to cram too much story into too few episodes, and one of the leads on it did say they had plans for 5 seasons, and i wonder how many of those plans were crammed into the season.
i remember thinking the exact same thing during episode 2 as one of the people reviewing the series . When Sevika was supporting jinx and convincing her to become the new Zaun leader/idol, I remember thinking I can't wait when Sevika finds out Jinx actually killed Silco. It is very implied Sevika and other zaunites don't know who killed Silco and probably think he was killed by some enforcer like Caitlyn. I really thought Sevika was going to find out somehow and confront/fight Jinx knowing she killed her boss. At the end of the day Sevika was very loyal to the Zaun cause therefore loyal to Silco since he was the one orchetrating Zaun independence. Also there is no way that Sevika could know about Silco not wanting to give up Jinx to Piltover in order to create the nation of Zaun, so if she found out about Jinx killing Silco she should be very mad. Did I miss something? I felt like Silco demise at the end of Jinx was a big plot point that went nowhere. Thrn after episode 3 and a week passing I kind of forgot about it until I watched this video. Please let me know what you think
Why would Sevika fight Jinx if she found out she killed Silco? How would the rest of Zaun learning Jinx killed Silco change things? If it doesn't change anything, which it doesn't, then it's one of the first things to go when deciding what to cut.
@ the explain why it doesn’t change anything. I think it changes a lot, Sevika was always loyal and defended Silco till she could. It would have been interesting to see maybe Sevika having to choose between leaving an icon for Zaun without going to war with Jinx for what she has done and so choosing to be loyal to Zaun or trying to kill her or expose her for the killer freak she is but leaving Zaun without a symbol for rebellion. I guess Sevika was heavily sidelined as a character compared to S1 since she does pretty much nothing in S2 besides the first 3 episodes
@@poorguy2839 Sevika isn't necessarily loyal to Silco, she's loyal to Zaun. She only follows Silco because she believes he will do the best for Zaun. If Silco is gone, she'll move on to the next best option, which would be Jinx. And I feel ep5 of s1 shows Sevika to be capable of compassion, and more understanding of Silco and Jinx's relationship than anyone else. I think she knows that there isn't anyone that was more affected by Silco's death than Jinx, and I think she recognises that Jinx's intent wasn't to sabotage Zaun, or kill her father. Even if Sevika held resentment towards Jinx for killing Silco, Jinx is only thing in Zaun that can unite the people and I think set aside her own feelings for what's necessary for the progress of Zaun
@ yeah but my problem is we don’t see any of this. I think it would have been important to see Sevika struggle to do the right thing for Zaun after Jinx sabotage of Silco’s plan
@@poorguy2839 Whilst it would be nice to offer more to her character, Sevika just doesn't have the relevance in the story to warrant dedicating that much time to her. Considering the numerous other things we didn't get that hold much more importance, I feel Sevika's internal struggle been cut isn't bad. And, whilst I won't speak for you, I think most people would take major issue if this was given screen time over something like Ekko talking Jinx down from ending her own life
They wanted 2 seasons because they wanted this story over and done with irrespective of whether or not the story could be told in that timeframe, which it very much couldn't. They really wanted to move on to their next spinoff and it's so disappointing
S1. That ending. It was iconic, beautiful and perhaps the best ending any season could have. It also meant that S1 had much more time for slower side characters. S1 having that ending meant S2 had to go lightning fast. Everything has a cost, every cut hurts. That beautiful scene means the pacing isn't perfect
My main complaints are I felt like Warwicks involvement in the plot in act 2 was a little sloppily done overall and the last episode needed like 10 minutes more screentime. But even then, I wouldn’t consider the season as a whole less than an 8/10. Edit: Oh I forgot one more. The Maddie traitor “twist” was really dumb. Like REALLY REALLY dumb. Like it made even less sense when I rewatched the season beginning to end.
I love the maddie traitor twist, it recontextualizes all those scenes where she's trying to get Cait to reinstate the council as Maddie trying to get cait killed. Like "i hate this rich spoiled brat, if she reinstates the council Ambessa will be forced to take her out." "Oh you betrayed Ambessa, maybe try to go negotiate(trying to deliver her to Ambessa)"
@@Joeda89 So what, Maddie was actively doing the opposite of what Ambessa wanted because of some personal dislike of Cait? That would make Maddie the most incompetent spy ever.
@@christopherhenson50 Not really, Ambessa doesn't need Cait she needs hextech. In fact one could argue that Ambessa is keeping Cait around out of "affection" more than need. Heck staging Cait's death at the hands of Zaun would play into Ambessas favor even more, buut Ambessa like's Cait, until she costs her Rictus. Ambessa has some connection to the enforcers. Thats how she gets the uniform and helps Reni get into the memorial. It's Maddie's smoke grenade that gives Noxians cover to take out everyone that knew they were involved. The last impact frame when Maddie shoots Cait it shows us the real Maddie and the smile she has as she finally gets to shoot Cait, in the neck so she would drown in her own blood. Maddie hated Cait
i felt they played too safe. If they want caitlyn to go down the dark path, let her go. for me that was the biggest disappointment. I know people will tell me she came back to her senses, but storywise her being the commander leads up to nothing. The same way they could have maddie as the commander.
Cait doesn't go down that dark path cause in S1 we saw who she really was. The heart of the show isn't not going to start executing zaunites in the streets. That's not to say she doesn't change. She is in a very different place than S1. But thinking she would go full evil is ignoring everything in S1.
@@rashimalviya8263 except it's not out of nowhere, you may wish it had more time and emphasis but the pieces/groundwork were laid all throughout act 2.
@@Joeda89litteraly out of nowhere. Vi comeback and BOOM cait is a good girl again. Tell me what scenes show us that cait is questionning her own moral or even ambessa's goals ? The only i could think of is when she said that ambessa's sword is double-edged too. And the scene in the bed with maddie when she looks like she's questionning herself and what she's doing. But these two scenes are way too early(and close to each other) compared to her turning good again. She's even more in dictator mode after these two scenes cause she clearly choose to follow ambessa AFTER theses scenes. Cait was one of my favorite character in s1 and i was excited when i understood that jinx had probably killed her morher in the end of s1 cause i absolutely wanted to see a dark caitlyn going full revenge. But what we got was just a total mess of character. 0 setup. 0 emotionnal impact (other than the scene when shit hit vi. Probably one of the only scene in s2 where i actually feel some emotions) 0 setup for her redemption. 0 reason to love her in s2. Like wtf she just used maddie like a litteral cumm socket and I'm supposed to hate maddie for that ? No fcking way. I don't like maddy but clearly i hate caitlyn way more than her. And again It was my favorite character in s1 it's crazy to even think that it's the same character.
My only issue was Maddie I wish she was done differently because I actually liked her When you consider how fleshed out and multi-layered they made every other character in this show, making Maddie so dirty and disposable feels kinda unfair She had a lot of potential as a character She looked up to Vi when we first met her, took Cait's advances without knowing that was being used as a rebound. That could've led to a love triangle subplot, where Cait tries to make things right not only with Vi, but also with Maddie. They really wasted her.
@@darklord4531I just hate when toxic communities hate someone for no reason In this case, they hated her even before they had a reason to actually hate her
@RayMcElroy50 i feel like the sex scene shouldve been earlier when Maddie was eavesdropping, would've made a bigger impact for the eventual betrayal but alas
Tbh, it's pretty realistic. Sociopathic people can be very likeable. And my understanding was that Maddie had been working for Ambessa for a while, she was intentionally trying to get to Cait's & Vi's good side.
Them deciding to turn Viktor into a demi-god / avengers level threat really feelt very marvel. Compare that to his source material counterpart that is just a cyborg revolutionary inventor.
Season 1 gets better with every watch. Season 2 is the opposite. More and more plot holes become apparent, more gaps or straight up unearned reversals in the character development become apparent, more questions arise to be realised they're never addressed... "rushed?" - yes it feels rushed. But more than that, season 2 lacks the depth of interplay of character interaction that made season 1 a masterpiece. Season 2 isn't terrible. But it's absolutely a drop off in quality from season 1 in everything but the animation and presentation.
@palemeadows Silco acts like he doesn't know who Vi and Powder are in season 1 but it's revealed that he indeed did know them and had a relationship with their mother. Mel didn't know she was magic despite being covered in expanding gold decal on her skin which was directly linked to her being magic. Victor goes back in time to give Jayce the hex crystal starting the development of hex tech which he sought to prevent. Maddie tries to advise Cait not to do the thing Ambessa wants her to yet it is revealed she is a traitor plant. That's just the first handful. I could write paragraphs about all the things wrong with the plot progression and the logic of the character's actions in season 2. I say this in full knowledge that season 1 was a masterpiece. If you don't understand what's wrong with 2 you aren't thinking.
Never understood the “rushed” complaints, so far I haven’t seen a single description of what is supposedly missing that so desperately needed to be in the series, just vague gesturing at more content which I think boils down to a feeling of failing to understand the series and just wanting more post hoc rationalized as it being the show’s fault and not my engagement with it, in a world where many series are bloated and go on for ages without enough focus.
I don't see how it skips over it. It happens on screen, it's fast, we don't get dialogue but we have the lyrics to the song. "I'm at the bottom, it's a long way down (don't slip)" "I'm on the bend, and it's a long way round (I'm sick)" "Of who I am and what I'm talking about" '"Cause no pretty face can save me now" I don't see how this is skipping her arc, it is literally exploring it through song and the actions on screen. We see things start to go well, she's beating up the same guy from S1 nice call back. Lorris is there good to see what happened to him after he left during Cait's deal with the devil. The song continues to explore her character arc "So lock me up, I cannot take it" "Lock me up, I've already lost" "Lock me up, I've gone and jinxed it" "Hold my cocktail molotov" Her room is cramped like the cell in stillwater, Cait is the one that broke her out and her breakup put her back right back there. "Kick me 'til I'm cold and weary" "Stab my heart and hope to die" "Writing my obituary" "Might as well just bury me alive" We see the toll drinking and this life style takes on her. We see her start to lose, Lorris leaves her. And we see Jinx in the crowd, keeping an eye on her. This over the visuals we get, is the arc, that is Vi going through it. It's different than normal arcs that rely on dialogue, but it still happens, it doesn't get skipped.
I can understand the gripes some have about music videos in the show, it’s like how some people don’t like long cutscenes in video games. Some people like it, some people don’t, and that’s okay.
the problem isn’t the length; it’s the content of the music videos and the frequency of their use. too many important events happen during the montages, and they have at least one in every episode. the problem isn’t that the “cutscenes” exist; it’s that there needs to be more substance outside of them.
@@eebbaa5560It’s how they show the story instead that makes it interesting to me. I don’t know about you, but I did not need a full episode dedicated to Caitlyn and Ambessa taking over Zaun. That would’ve not fit the show at all.
I think a lot of the reason people didn’t like the music videos this season is because they fill in for scenes that should’ve been there. For example, the Hellfire music video shows the enforcers gassing the Undercity, but that should’ve also been explained within the actual dialogue or scenes. It’s fine to show plot-points in music videos, but it doesn’t work if they are only shown within the music videos and never followed-up within actual scenes. Another example of this is Vi becoming a pit fighter. We see her pit fighting in the Cocktail Molotov music video, and her appearance changes afterward, but we don’t have any information about it outside of that. This isn’t as big of an issue as with the gassing in Hellfire since it’s a very easy plot-point to understand, but it represents a larger theme present in the season of not explaining things and using music videos as an excuse. However, one example of a place where this is not done is in the music video at the beginning of episode 1 in which we see Caitlyn grieving Cassandra. The plot point is shown for the first time in the song, but is then elaborated on within the actual dialogue. This is how the music videos should be used, and it’s how they were always used in the first season. I think having music videos as a fill-in for plot explanation was a big thing that contributed to the season feeling rushed, and that’s probably why people had issues with them this time around.
I bet we could’ve gotten something beyond what already is an amazing show, and I suppose what understandably sucked was the craving after all the emotional attachment most of us developed for the characters. But well, being able to smoothly accommodate all that was in Season 2 despite several (and possibly important) cuts is a tough job for both animators and script-writers to be real. We all wanted more, and I absolutely love it regardless. So, hats off to the entire fortiche and Riots collaboration for being able to create in my opinion, one of the best series ever made. Really excited about and looking forward to more from them.
I don’t think the season was rushed at all. I think they told a story they wanted to tell exactly how they wanted to tell. They bent and broke some storytelling rules that’s why the show feels off for some people. I, however, would rather take an unconventional story and weird directorial choices over something that was done safe way by the books. I want to see the expression of the authors creativity and this season completely delivered on that. Although, I can’t say I’m a huge fan of the world and characters
My one gripe with s2 is how they toned down the classism struggle by WAY too much. Barely anyone but literally Sevika gives a shit about the poor conditions of the people of Zaun anymore bc Jinx is too depressed, and Vi.. like got broken up with or whatever.
my friend , I may be late to the party, but I feel, even as drunk as I am from NYE celebrations, I can dd wisdom here. And what I wish to add is: Don't. Feed. the Trolls!!! just follow this in the year of whoever 2025 and you will be so much happier. Moloch bless. Happy New year
a lot of them are petty, cinema sins style issues that either don't matter, are completely wrong or are necessary in order to tell the story. To give a 1 star for these issues is something you can do, art enjoyment is subjective so there is nothing wrong with giving a 1/10 due to these issues, but it's so funny to see these reviews also talk as if they are objectively true in their critique and that is just too funny.
@@Joeda89 i don't agree with giving it 1 star ofc, but these "petty nitpicks" if they keep adding up start harming the story. And quite a few of the problems season 2 has are not small at all.
@@danutghidia5820 if they're anything like "why didn't Cait/Vi tell the undercity about Jinx killing Silco", or "why isn't Jayce part of the council scene with Mel. Schoola and Salo in ep 1", "the music montages are a waste of time", "the wild runes came out of no where" or any "critique" or "complaint" that is answered by looking at S1 then I don't care how many of them there are cause that's just people missing information the show provides. There are a few critiques/issues that the show takes on in order to tell the story in the time restraint while still honoring the characters and keeping themes in tack. I have a feeling(based videos/reading comments/social media) that when most people list out the problems they have with the show, those will mainly be personal, such as wanting something explored more, wishing we got a scene with X and Y character, sad we didn't get to see character X react to event Y (which is totally valid and if that drops the show down to a 6-7 or lower for you that's all good cause it's properly framed as a personal issue with the show). It's when those personal issues are treated as rules the show is breaking cause the writers are bad (which is usually what happening when people give it a 1/10)
@@danutghidia5820 if they're anything like "why didn't Cait/Vi tell the undercity about Jinx killing Silco", or "why isn't Jayce part of the council scene with Mel. Schoola and Salo in ep 1", "the music montages are a waste of time", "the wild runes came out of no where" or any "critique" or "complaint" that is answered by looking at S1 then I don't care how many of them there are cause that's just people missing information the show provides. There are a few critiques/issues that the show takes on in order to tell the story in the time restraint while still honoring the characters and keeping themes in tack. I have a feeling(based videos/reading comments/social media) that when most people list out the problems they have with the show, those will mainly be personal, such as wanting something explored more, wishing we got a scene with X and Y character, sad we didn't get to see character X react to event Y (which is totally valid and if that drops the show down to a 6-7 or lower for you that's all good cause it's properly framed as a personal issue with the show). It's when those personal issues are treated as rules the show is breaking cause the writers are bad (which is usually what happening when people give it a 1/10)
Loved season 1, I wish season 2 had more episodes so that they could give certain points in the season more time to focus and develop, and I'm not fond of the gif fight scenes, still enjoyed it but it wasn't quite what I was hoping for, but that could just be me loving the first season so much that my excitement was expecting absolute perfection
I absolutely loved Arcane it was a masterpiece with a few missing pieces. I just wish they added a little more to the characters I just feel like there's some stuff missing and questions not answered.
I don't think season two was trash, but I find myself agreeing with the critiques made by people who do. I am convinced the motive to open up new stories rather than close out the existing ones is the root of all of the problems with season two. We still got a good story, but a great story was left on the table.
@@Joeda89 Laurice, Maddie, and the green guy should have been cut. Sello's arch went nowhere, so he should have jsut died in the rocket blast. Mel should have died as well and the Black Rose stuff could have been cut since Mel spent most of her time in a pit anyway. Jayce, Ekko, and Heimerdinger should have been in the story the whole way through instead of having their characters given a time out for three episodes only to introduce a multiverse. That would have given us more time for Jayce to come around to the problems of hextech under the influence of Heimerdinger and Ekko while being tempted by Ambessa to make weapons to avenge Mel's death.
@@anthonysabatino4317 oh boy, alot to cover here. I agree with some of these points more so than others. For most I don't see them as new things in S2, but continuations of pots set up in S1. 1. Maddie, Laurice, Steb. While they didn't get much time they are pretty important as literary devices. The one that really really can't be cut is Maddie, she is way too important to the plot, Ambessa and Cait. Laurice's importance is his connection to Vi, the start of ep 5 Vi pushing him away showing us how bad it's getting for her and his return in act 3 to man the gun, the most dangerous and open position letting him be a shield one last time. I think it's clear that scenes with them were cut but removing them completely would cause more problems than it solves and would require re-writing act 1 entirely. I agree that Laurice and Steb were probably my two biggest disappointments in the series. Maddie was brilliant and part of Ambessa's story which was started in S1. 2. Salo has a very important role to play to Victor's story which was started in S1. He's not going through an arc(kinda) but he is used to signal that something isn't right with Victor's(Sky's) commune. Why would Salo, the most selfish, egotistical, vain council member run errands for people in the undercity? When we see the commune through Vander and Husk, we don't question it, Husk becoming a follower tracks and Vander is in such a bad state that anything Victor does to him is an improvement, but Salo is wealthy, Salo is prideful. What did Victor do to him that made him an errand boy? That's why Salo can't die in the explosion. That and Ambessa was suppose to prop him up in act 1. Ambessa choosing Cait over Salo shows us that she is taking a risk, one that seems like it pays off but eventually backfires. It doesn't necessarily need to be Salo that survives, but his vanity and pride are important so he isn't easily replaced narratively with other council member. 3 This is a very weird take. Mel's story was no where close to being done. Her death would make no sense in the explosion. It would be so weird to set up the tyranny of mages like S1 does and just not pay it off at all in S2. Mages kidnap one of the most powerful members of society from her home. That shit is terrifying. A pillar of Piltover, the city to escape mages, was a mage. That's too good to just kill her off. The way we get to see actual mages use the arcane, the way that is shown to be deceitful, tricking their eyes and the parallels back to Victor's commune, the way everyone seems happy and perfect, the way the hextech from Jayce made Piltover look beautiful while hiding horrors of the undercity and the corruption of the wild rune. If Mel dies so does Jayce and Víctor, so I guess just don't have them in S2? Her using Ambessa as bait to lure out the black rose and see the face of Leblanc, the final fight with Ambessa against Cait and Mel, surrounded on 3 sides (Vision MIght Guile, ) and the only open side is through Ambess (sacrifice) AHHHHHH, that fight was too good. Mel adds so much to the story It's really hard for me to even toy with the notion of killing her off in the explosion. 4 " Jayce, Ekko, and Heimerdinger should have been in the story the whole way through instead of having their characters given a time out for three episodes only to introduce a multiverse." Jayce would be dead if mel dies in the explosion, so I guess Mel shouldn't die. I agree that this story beat happens too fast. An episode's worth of time, either a few minutes extra per episode or one more episode at the end of Act 2 or beginning of Act 3 would go a long way to making this feel better. That said I really like what we got from the story itself. The price for commodifying a wild force like magic to ship noxian wine across the world. Paying off Heimerdinger's warnings in S1(similar to how S2 pays off Vander's philosophy compared to Silco in S1 ) and completing Heimerdinger's arc. The other world in ep 7 is indescribably important to Ekko, and the story as a whole, it's how Victor ultimately wins. Structure wise their absence is very important. Ekko and Jayce's absence is 100% needed for Cait to go along with anything Ambessa brings up. I would have liked to see more of Jayce and Ekko's interactions when they return though. Sadly no time, I hear they are working on something and that Ekko's story isn't over so hopefully we get those interactions in the future. The only new story from these is Laurice and Stebb, but those aren't new stories so much as devices to aid the main characters in their arcs. I don't think Ekko Jayc Heimer do a new story, they continue the one set up in S1, the dangers of hextech. If your talking about the introduction of Wild Runes, is that really a new story. Is it not just the old story of the dangers of unchecked progress that we get in S1? I can see the black rose being seen as a new story beat for Mel and Ambesaa, but it's not really new it's the payoff from the S1 story. We can't just leave that unanswered. At the end, none of these things I typed may impact the way you look at the show, especially if there was something missing from the story that you really wanted to see
@@Joeda89 I was thinking Jayce's hammer could have protected him from the blast, kind of like how Vi's gauntlets protected her from Sevika in the bar fight. The reason I thought Mel should have died is that it would have set Jayce and Ambessa down a revenge arch together which would have more acutely alienated Victor, sending him into Singed's influence, and instead of a commune, Victor just wants to counter Piltover and becomes a weapon for that purpose. Hiemerdinger and Ekko could have been trying to talk sense into Jayce about the construction of Hextech weapons, and perhaps do something to save the firelights from the insane police brutality which could have been even worse than we got to see. I think Caitlyn should have been a voice of forgiveness given her season one arch to counter Ambessa's vengeful influence on Jayce. I also would have loved to see more of Warwick killing things than we got. Someone made a good point that he could have been used to force people together because he is triggered by blood, so fighting and spilling blood would get everyone killed because he is so overpowered. Maybe that is how Jinx and Vi team up and then they find out Warwick is Vander. Perhaps Sevika and Vi have to work together because of Warwick and Jinx. Perhaps escaping Warwick is what lets Sevika forgive Jinx for killing Silco. There are some things that could have been done in that vein I think. Overall, I am not hateful over season two like some people are. I just think there were things which were rushed when a few cuts could have fleshed out some more gradual changes, allowed room for drama which we didn't get let alone get resolved, and didn't change some of the characters in ways that seemed questionable given the time we had to see those changes. For example, I don't think Vi would have been conflicted about using the Gray. I think she would have outright refused to go along with that. It seemed a little hard to believe.
@@anthonysabatino4317 Honestly that sounds like great material for a fanfic. Throw in a scene before the Jinx rocket with Ambessa meeting Silco, maybe she tries to kill the peace deal put in a line about her hearing this from an enforcer contact and I'm sold. It wouldn't deliver on the S1 themes and character setups as much but it would still be an interesting read. I do feel a bit weird about Mel dying, that's a bit too close to fridging, it isn't fridging since it's the consequence of her actions but I think there was too much setup in S1 with her to not pay it off, that and Ambessa's music video. OH oh this as one of the alternate timelines would be so cool actually. Then you can draw so many connections between this story and the original. LIke Jayce hammer in the main story and in game don't have shielding abilities, they have acceleration, but in a world where Victor gave Jayce a shielding rune then you can ask how would that affect what he builds, how would that affect what the Hexgates do, how can you relate the aspect of shielding to Jayce now seeking revenge. How does that compare to the acceleration rune and the price of progress from the main story. That would be a very compelling read.
I get if peopled loved the plot of season 1 so much that they just want more of that. Season 2 was something different. At first I thought it was a little weird, but once I was able to get out of my own way and see season 2 for what it was (which was not the same as season 1), I could see that it was at least as good as season 1, just for different reasons.
No, it's really not. I even like the plot of season 2 more. I like the music segments. I like mostly all of where each character's arc leads to. The problem is in its quality. It is not at least as good as season 1. It has new reasons for me to like it, yet next to nothing of what made season 1 great is present. Almost anything subjective that there is to like, I like season 2 more. But anything objective, it has so many flaws. Episode 6, IMDB 9.8/10. Almost every scene is so badly written. It's just worse than season 1 whether you or I or anyone likes it more or less. They closed the writers room, reduced the writers, worked from home because of covid and it shows. I personally hate the "just didn't get what they wanted" argument, because from a story or plot perspective, I got a whole lot of what I wanted. From a storytelling perspective, I just wanted it to be good. It didn't need to be great or exceptional like season 1.
@@alicea3421 This was badly written by you. But I still get it and in a way I can appreciate the beautiful mess of it. Art and expression is like that, there's beauty in imperfections.
@@mrglassscience Yes, I agree it was badly written by me. Art is objective. I made multiple objective flaws, but you didn't name any. Yet, for all I know, your idea of bad is not the same as mine. Is it too vague? Did I not cover any flaws of the show itself? Did I reiterate too often with little expansion? The idea was to prove an exception. It was written through frustration out of distaste for that particular argument. Was I drunk? Was I awake for 48 hours? Was I otherwise occupied? Was I unwell? Who cares? It's a terrible piece of writing. Even if we like or agree with what I was conveying, my storytelling was very flawed.
@@Joeda89 I haven't had time to rewatch it today, and I want to respond with more depth than I'm currently capable of. Just to let you know that I'm not ignoring your question.
i don’t think the show was bad by any means, but people seriously need to stop coping. arcane season 2 had real, serious flaws that probably wouldn’t have been excused if people didn’t like season 1 so much. season 2 was fine overall, but for every high high, there were some very low lows.
@@OGTwist How does nobody in Zaun find out Jinx killed Silco, that information seems like it would change some of their behavior towards Jinx? Why does the Hex core/gate/thing send Jayce forward in time instead of an alternate universe like it does Ekko & Heimerdinger? If Victor can read minds why doesn't Jayce simply walk up to him and say "Hey I've been to the future, your current plan will destroy the world unless you stop. Read my mind if you don't believe me" instead of straight up shooting him with a Hextek hammer? Why would Ambessa want her warriors converted into Arcane robots when doing so would mean they are controlled by Victor and not her. Like they don't die but Victor has mind control over them so inevitably she would either end up a puppet answering to Victor being assimilate by him too? Maybe I missed or didn't understand somethings, but all that being said the sex scene was fantastic.
I'm very much of the opinion that people loved it as much as they did because of the music and the animation. Those two things carried this season where the writing very much faltered
@@stuartjsa139 1. Answered this one above. Jinx killing Silco wouldn't be important to anyone other than Sevika, if your going to explore Jinx as a symbol of good for Zaun Sevika would be fine with her killing Silco 2. He has the acceleration rune on his person. edit: didnt see the other 2 3. He doesn't know victor can read minds. He just knows he needs to stop him 4. She doesn't know his plan is to forcefully evolve everyone. Victor says he will evolve all those willing. Symbolically she just lost her Rictus( the one who protects her from magic) and Cait(the noxian principal of vision) so her not seeing through Victor's guile makes sense.
@@OGTwist ambessa is against magic because "everyone in a battlefield is equal" but want to convert her soldiers into mutant unkillable pupets by magic, jinx went from a completly schizophrenic to a caring sister in 10 mins, caitlyn went from the wholesome and positive character to an abusive dictator and all the way back in 10 mins, both of the fixed their relationships with vi in half episode, Vi had less time on screen than smeech.
Personally the second season had a lot more plot points going on and some things felt rushed. Mainly because arcane was going to be 5 seasons long but was cut to 2 some things are flawed but i still liked the second season. 3:20 it's to tell stories . More show don't tell and it works 5:58 ok i can understand that but the music lyrics are to tell how the characters feel in the moment like the song "wasteland" 7:12 it's a war . A lot of people will die but yea....main characters not dying is 90% of shows because you can't kill the main characters (is it plot armor? Yes) 9:14 excuse me? Have you seen Jinx after isha died? Or Caitlyn after her mom died? Those deaths meant something
I loved Arcane! And the music videos were the best part. How can people not like them? The music in season 2 was amazing! The time travel and multiverse stuff was a bit confusing but I just rolled with it and I understood it by the end of the episode. And Isha's death was the saddest death ever. I only cried more at the end of the season.
Lost definitely had a time jump thing that was really annoying. Also at the end of lost * (SPOILER) * it’s left up to the watcher but it seems like the entire show “never happened” or the crew was “unalived the enter time” so that person was wayyy off. I really liked arcanes multiverse episodes! Those were my favorite.
I wish S2 had a bit more of Jinx and Ekko getting together and making the blimp out of Jinx's home, and I think the three timeline thing was a little convoluted, but still, that's just wishing for more Arcane. Still 10/10.
"AS SOON AS TGET GET TO A FIGHT SCENE THERES MUSIC AND ART" WHST IS THIS GUY ON, WHAT DOES HE WANT A SCENE WITH THE CHARACTERS GRUNTING AS THEY GET HIT, THEIR SHOES SQEEKING ON TGE FLOOR L, JUST A REALY AWKWARD SCENE
I'm like 90% sure the majority of the 1 star reviews are just paroting their favorite podcast. The reviews sound like they are reading off a script/checklist. Having issues with pacing, how themes are explored, and even not enjoying the music make sense for docking the show points, but giving the show 1-2 stars for pacing is hilarious.
Yeah like, I understand that some people don’t like season 2, but giving it a 1/10? Surely they must have a good reason since they thought EVERYTHING was bad, even the animation. I don’t really understand 1 star reviews in general
How did people in Zaun not figure out that Jinx killed Silco? Like it seems odd that Caitlyn and Vi would cover that up, and that it would change the way a lot of the people in Zaun(especially Sevika) would act towards Jinx?
@@stuartjsa139 This assumes the people in piltover have any contacts in Zaun. Mel proposing a reward doesn't require contacts just putting up wanted posters which enforcers can do. I would have loved to seen that explored. I would love more scenes with Sevika, but there was no time for a plot thread that would ultimately go nowhere. S1 got the luxury of ending with the Jinx Rocket, that meant it had much more time to fill. That ending while iconic means that S2 must go faster. S2 doesn't have the time to explore this through a full on narrative. Silco was not the savior of Zaun. He wasn't a beloved name or a folk hero, that's Vander. Silco barely held on to power thanks to Sevika, and she didn't keep Silco in power out of loyalty but because Finn wasn't any better. Sevika chose Zaun of Vander and would certainly choose Zaun over Silco. The info that Jinx killed Silco would honestly make Jinx more popular. The only time Sevika would care that Jinx killed Silco, enough to not follow her, would be some time before ep 3. In ep 3, Jinx clears the Gray and sends it back to Piltover, from this point on Sevika is loyal to Jinx and any news about her killing Silco would be pointless. She would probably laugh at the idiot for getting sentimental before trying to convince Jinxe to step up. Would I want this scene? Oh absolutely that would be great, but S2 doesn't have time for it. Especially cause this plot thread is not necessary, once Jinx clears the gray she has Sevika and Zaun's favor so if a plot thread about Sevika learning that Jinx killed silco would just lead to the same place then it really doesn't need to be in the show. It would be nice but not necessary and S2 can't afford plot threads that aren't necessary. Edit: I didn't even bring up Jinx just blew up the Piltover council. Do you really think Sevika is gona turn on her. I take back what I said earlier, there was never a point where Sevika learning about Jinx killing Silco would have done anything other than make Sevika hound Jinx to rally Zaun, which she is doing in act 2.
@@V1ctorTrophies It's funny you see it from people that really liked Silco, and I mean really liked him as in the "Silco did nothing wrong" crowd. Like did they forget Silco was hunting the youth's Zaun via the Chief of Police he had on payroll. The guy has the cops in his pocket and uses them so smuggle drugs and hunt down his own people. The only reason Savika didn't betray him was cause Silco was better than Finn, a low bar. Even the sovereignty was given to him cause Jayce killed one of his child workers and felt bad. Silco wasn't good for the undercity, he was the only option after he killed the other one. Edit: There's a Statue of Vander and not Silco for a reason.
Season 1 was one of my favourite seasons in Television history, Season 2 on the other hand was much weaker with characters making somewhat illogical decisions(Tho I still liked it)
Most of the people complaining about the season 2 can be resumed as -> Lacking media literacy / comprehension issues / "it wasn't like I wanted, so it's bad"
Half of these are just people who didn't like the style, which I guess is fair. We can't all like the same thing, but the others just lack basic media comprehension 😭 It feels like they're complaining that Arcane is too realistic instead of being like any usual movie. For example, the guy that said "Nobody found out that Jinx killed Silco! Why do they follow Jinx?!" is basically telling us that they didn't watch or didn't actually pay attention to the series at all. Half of Jinx's arc this season is becoming a hero and how unexpected and out of place it feels, because that's how it's supposed to be. And about the Silco thing, yeah, she's not going to let people find out. Imagine being loyal to Vander, only to switch to Silco, only to find out he died so now you follow Jinx and THEN you find out that it was Jinx who killed Silco and she's bot the perfect hero you think. Of course no one's going to let that message spread. Even Sevika who despised Jinx allies with her because she sees Jinx's potential for uniting Zaun. She probably wouldn't even care or be that surprised if she found out Jinx was the one who murdered Silco. That and many of these reviews just tell me that they didn't actually take time to think about the plot at all
I do think season 2 was way to packed and needed more time to fully flesh out all the different plots. Season one was perfectly balanced, paced, and dark and gritty. Season two waaaaas a bit more out there. When there was a monster, or some magic drug, the show took time to build it up, to show its progression. But season to just does things, like things just happen. Idk I just wish they gave themselves more time to flesh out the plots. Again loved season 2, it was almost pretty much a 10 outta 10 in my book, but I don’t think it topped season one. I think if they did just one more season and took the time to build up to stuff like the Ross, the arcane, the multiverse, and the beast, it would have just felt more believable? Idk I do also think there where either to many music videos, or they used music videos in replacement of actual interesting conflict and fleshed out scenes. Not to say the music videos weren’t interested, and awesome. But idk when season one had a music video it felt like a big deal and oh damn somethin crazy or emotional going down. Season two just had a music video for everything I feel
People giving Season 1 a perfect score while criticizing Season 2 is wild. All of season 2 problems are rooted from Season 1. Too many characters... Side characters with main character energies.
No. The characters not discussing Silco's death in season 2 is not a fault of season 1. Season 2 wasting 15-20 minutes on this rhoided rat that leads to nowhere and nobody asked for is not a fault of season 1. Season 2 introducing the black rose convoluted plot without actually resolving or explaining anything is not a fault of season 1. Season 2 butchering Vi's character is not a fault of season 1. Season 2 finale turning into an avengers style battle against space jesus is not a fault of season 1. if they didn't want to continue after season 2 and found they had "too many" characters, they could have done the sensible thing and focused on the storyline that most people were interested in and that made season 1 so good: The story between Vi and Jinx (and maybe Cait). The political meddling wasn't nearly as good nor original and I find it baffling that they chose to do that over more Vi+Jinx+Vander
@@thomasmann4536Vi and Jinx worship is over proportional,i glad that in the second season at least more interesting characters took the charts over those 2 overdramatic sisters.
S2 was rushed and its pretty fucking sad. All they needed to do is continue the plot they were building from entire S1 but they didnt. They didnt even flied that high but still landed pretty hard. Including Noxus in this show was a pretty bad mistake and you can see the results in S2, taking up half of the screentime for nothing. And now theyre sayin next show is going to be about Noxus, like wtf, i wont be surprised if they will include Ionia or Demacia in that show giving them half of the screentime too. Charatcer developments were bad, like pretty bad and cheap. It felt like watching Pixar movie from 2000s, ik Pixar movies slaps but we loved Arcane S1 not bcs of that. Animation and Music also slaps in S2 but the parts like "paint the town blue" was horrible bcs it wasnt supposed to be shown like that. Also the ending was pretty bad and cheap way to conclude the show. They literally did The Walking Dead special in last epsidoes and killed characters for no reason. Im not even going to talk about pacing problem its just makes me cry. S2 didnt felt like same show and its clear that Riot intervined and changed the plot. If they just made Medarda fly away to noxus and focus on piltover and zaun it would be enough to make S2 perfect. But with this concept they needed S3 and they didnt make it. Sad, just sad.
Yeah these reviews are valid though. The lore was so much better and Arcane ruined it for me in a way. The character development in some of the lore just had value that I think goes over arcane fans heads.
To be honest, I felt the same way about season 2 the first time round. It was much better the second time round, and even now on the fourth, I keep discovering new things. And yes. The CaitVi scene also irritated me a bit, because it doesn't fit in with the tone of the rest of the film at all. Some of my homosexual friends say the same thing. My best friend is bi and also found that rather... strange. And when I think that this scene should have been much longer... doesn't fit in with the rest at all. It seems clumsy. Apart from that, both seasons are masterful, but it would indeed have been better to invest the extra million to give the second season a little more space.
I tried to defend Maddie's VA on Twitter, but I'm too weak because haters did anything to me like stupid. So I DM them to give my address and take my life for defending her because toxic people are doing toxic things.
this season only has one issue in my opinion......pacing....so much in between scenes needed this season to make it a better paced show...but even with the issues its still my favorite show.
These reviews are somewhat missing the mark of what actually was wrong with season 3 so I’ll give a few examples of what actually went wrong. #1 Victor being the mage that saved Jayce, if you give it a little thought it makes no sense! In order for hextech to exist “victor” has to inspire Jayce by saving him with magic, so don’t give Jayce the gem and how did the first “glorious evaluation” come about? And on top of that Jayce shooting Victor was the reason why he decided to evolve, Victor gave no indication of wanting to take everyone’s freedom away so why send Jayce away to start it instead of blasting him just show him what you did in the ending of the season. #2 VI and Caitlin, VI had no business having that prison scene with Caitlin, her sister was going to commit self unalive and she decided to make out instead of trying to find her in case it was too late? On top of that Caitlin PHYSICALLY and emotionally abused VI and became a dictator hurting the people of the Zaun with no apology given. #3 On the subject of Caitlin no one ever made her account for her actions, apart from VI in that 1 minute scene where all she said was “I know” like girl be accountable say you regret it something #4 Sevika being on the council does nothing for Zaun, we are supposed to look at this as Zaun finally being seen as an equal but Sevika is outnumbered she will be out voted in anything that she could vote for when it comes to any decisions for the betterment of Zaun, and by the way they looked at her she isn’t welcome among them so that just proves that she will be out voted on most things And a couple honorable mentions, Ambessa’s motives change throughout the show, the black rose subplot and there questionable methods to get Mel on their side, Jinx’s death being the most avoidable thing ever and it did nothing for VI’s character development which was pretty bad and nonexistent throughout the show, and the whole Zaun vs Piltover being totally sidelined whilst it was the whole set up in season 1 and honestly there is plenty more, I’m not saying season 2 didn’t have good moments there are some beautiful moments and scenes that I loved and enjoyed but as a whole season 2 missed the mark and it is sad we waited so long for the conclusion of the story of characters we all loved for it to be this badly executed, which is why I think so many people are high on copeium not wanting to face the reality. The writing team can say the planned this ending from the beginning but they ain’t fooling me there is no way they had this ending in mind while writing season 1.
1. That's just the nature of time travel stories, does this mean the story isn't clean yeah. Should you avoid these loop style stories, no I loved this reveal. I don't crea how non logical it is especially when the source of this is magic. I like the idea that the void is planting the hexcore idea into Victor as a way to reach that dreamless emptiness it craves, and Victor trying to undo that through the time loop is compelling enough to justify the logical issues with time loops. That said I get why people hate these kinds of stories and don't begrudge anyone for really not liking this. I still love the movie Your Name 2 I think we are using hindsight to assume that Vi knew Jinx was suicidal. I've watched several reactions to this that are surprised when the start of ep 9 has Jinx's suicide. it's not unbelievable that Vi thought Jinx just escaped and was planning to flee the city. She says as much at the start of that scene Vi: "I really believed she'd help. Say it. You told me so. I was an idiot to trust her I went behind your back" She doesn't know Jinx is suicidal, we do, we the audience know and yeah that makes it awkward, but knowing that Ekko is going to be there it doesn't make sense writing wise to have Cait and Vi running out to look for her. Especially when this is Cait's apology. 3 Just incorrect. She apologizes to Vi by letting her free jinx, she pays for her flirt with fascism by losing her eye, several enforcers die during the attack, and Maddie betrays her. Then she also gives up her families council seat to Sevika (yes it is the one Catherine would sit in). Caitlyn was not executing people in the streets, she was not a butcher. She overstepped authority after a week of attacks from Zaun. 6 officers killed, the hex crystal stolen, the chief of police and more enforcers killed on the bridge, the rocket hitting the council and the attack during the memorial. If Salo was in charge there would be bodies cause he would have let Ambessa do whatever she wanted. 4. Sevika getting the Kiraman council seat is goated. Ep 7, we saw the goal, we saw heaven working towards that is the point of the show. Sevika on the council is better for Zaun than independent Zaun with Silco in charge. She won't be outvoted, she has the only surviving member of the original council (Shoola) backing her. You think them holding the memorial on the bridge was just coincidence and the scene where Sevika takes her seat its Shoola and Sevika looking at the council together. Saying she would be outvoted is like saying Mel would be outvoted. hitting those honorable mentions *Ambessa motives never change, they are consistent through the whole show. She wants hextech to take out the rose, she's doing this for her family. When that isn't an option and she lost Rictus/Cait she takes a risk by trusting Victor. Nothing is weird here. *mages were set up in S1, paying that off by making Mel a mage (a pillar of Piltover, the city to escape magic, being a mage is too good) The black rose shows how terrifying mages are. They just straight up kidnap mel, like yeah that shit is scary. Mel using Ambessa to get to the black rose to see the face of the deceiver, mmmm YES that's the wolf shit *Jinx's death is set up all through S2, Isha gives her a reason to live, is that force of order in her otherwise chaotic life. When she lost Isha, she was ready to die again (the first time was in S2 ep 3) Ekko saves her, now she is looking to build something new for someone. That's the key. She dies for Vi, just like Isha died for her. She breaks Vi from the burden Vander gave her in S1 ep3 that has defined Vi's entire life. Schnee's video on this is really great.
@ Before I get started, I would like to disclose I am a writer and study writing on the side I love creating stories and finding new ways to make them better and complex , I’m not claiming to be a better writer then riots team but it gives me experience with that field and a bit of insight which leads me to 1 There are plenty of ways to make time travel not messy, and the fact that the writers have such a messy vague story when it comes to Victor being the mage in a show with a 250,000,000 dollar budget is actually really bad, this is the pinnacle of the show supposedly you should be in awe of the reveal and feel like the connection they made makes sense not be left wondering, and while I agree having some wonder left in a story is good but not in the sense it’s so hard to wrap your head around it begins to feel like they just said hey this would be cool and didn’t jump through any of the hoops to make sure it makes sense. Victor should have never gave Jayce the ruin if his goal was to keep the “glorious evaluation” from happening, why save young Jayce as well if they both die in the end anyway let them die in the beginning and yeah it’s a morbid take but you have to ask yourself why he didn’t do that or anything else, just the presents of the episode 7 timeline should have been enough for Vicktor to call it good? why try so hard on this timeline? I don’t care that anyone enjoys it I envy that people can over look the problems and enjoy it. #2 THIS is they only argument that gets under my skin nothing against you personally but I’ve heard this take way to many times to the point it gets sad, there is no hindsight, as a sibling I would know IMMEDIATELY what this means, maybe it’s because I always assume the worst but I don’t think that’s the case, Jinx just lost everything, Isha, Vander and her self described second chance on things, Vi knows this and why would VI ask scared might I add “What are you going to do?” It’s because she has no business assuming Jinx somehow “betrayed” her and that throw away line saying she somehow did was to justify her and Caitlin having sex in a cell Jinx was just wasting away in, and saying Ekko being there makes it better no, no it does not, VI just lost Vander she should not be in the mood anyway might I add #3 Sooo she let her free her sister is enough to make up for an emotional and physically abusive relationship???! I think that shines a bad light a little, would you tell someone you know in abusive relationship to settle for that sorry excuse for an “apology” and I’d like to disclose I NEVER said Caitlin didn’t pay for her actions, I said she never was made to account for them and never apologized for anything, we don’t know if she was executing people, we do know she stood and watched while innocent Zaunites where getting beaten and wrongly imprisoned and she released the grey which is a deadly poisonous gas that can cause permanent damage, and almost shot VI and Isha, point is if she apologizes it happens off screen which unfortunately happens way to often this season, I would have liked to hear what she said to sevika while giving her a seat since their last interactions was less then friendly, yeah maybe salo would have been worse but that doesn’t excuse Caitlin’s actions #4 Sevika getting a seat is not enough for the betterment of Zaun as “goated” as it is even if Shoola is on her side that makes it 2-5/6. They looked a sevika with disgust they aren’t reaching that heaven anytime soon. Shoola dose not have the same kind of power Mel did, Mel is a Madarda and she dealt in shifty things and mind games to bend the councils votes. No hate on Mel but she should have had some character development in that department as well as a little add on to the other things I’ve mentioned Ambessa went from trying to get hextech weapons to trusting victor for what an army? It was pretty stupid for her to trust him, and she would have just became one of the evolved, as someone who was built up as being so cunning this makes no sense for her character lol Mel could have doomed everyone calling the black rose to piltover like she did, she just learned she has powers and somehow she knows she is powerfull enough to stop a witch that has her mother on the run, she never learned anything from waiting to defeat the black rose she never showed her “true face”, and in turn she got her mother killed and then got all sad about it Jinx’s death I agree there is set up for it, I said it was avoidable but it’s also a little counterproductive, and Jinx didn’t free VI of anything, VI lost Jinx because she couldn’t let go it would have been more impactful for VI to reach the point where she was strong enough to move on herself. If they were set on having Jinx die for VI it could have gone better routes something that felt impactful not avoidable because it was. Again this is just the tip of the iceberg there is plenty more wrong with this season, I was scared how excited I was for season 2 because it’s no secret that entertainment has been lackluster lately, Nothing will amount to the disappointment I felt when the credits rolled for the last time and the emptiness that I felt it was awful, I let myself get so excited for season 2 and riot threw us this, I tried to like it but I would always end up in that same empty disappointment, and I’m not the only one so it has to make you think a little bit that all these people are coming to the same conclusion, there has to be something in you that realizes that there is some truth behind everyone’s disappointment.
@@Alifer2002 Thank you for the reply, of all the complaint comments so far, this one was the most interesting to think about. 1. Yeah but several great time travel stories are messy, Back to the future movies, Terminator, Your Name. Logically none of those make sense but it doesn't matter. I feel the same way with Victor/Jayce. Thematically, Victor realizing that that by ending conflict (removing the cycle) he is doomed to emptiness, the implication that this is all the void's plan, and the way he frees himself/everyone else is to create a loop of conflict until Ekko and Jayce are able to break it. That to me is worth the messy aspect. Would a scene where Victor evolves without Jayce fix it? No not really, I don't see an easy fix. It's that kind of really tough choice of do we go with what thematically gives the biggest payoff, Victor/Jayce Loop or make something that would fit more logically, Make it Ryze or change Jayce's origin. I could see a scene where Jayce's origin is different, maybe in timeline 0 Jayce was interested in Magic but never obsessed, but then you lose Jayce experiencing fast travel and how that was the inspiration for the hexgates. I don't begrudge anyone for not liking this part. I just like what it does thematically enough to really not care about logic problems regarding magic fueled time travel. 2. A critique that really gets under my skin, is "the character heard someone say X so they should have done Y" I hear that constantly, from cinema sins style channels and it feels so wrong. If we cut the line jinx gives Vi after she locks Vi in the cell, then sure now logically Vi wouldn't be worries about Jinx buut we the audience lose out on JInx's head space. It would lose thematic connection between Jinx and Victor. That isn't worth it to me. Then if we decide ok Vi hears that and should go rush after JInx. Well considering we are about to have Ekko be the boy savior, what should we just have Vi running around the underground looking for Jinx? Do you want Vi to save her instead of Ekko? If Ekko saves her do you want a scene where Vi stumbles on them? That would then require several more scenes to not feel weird and there isn't time. The sex scene itself, echoing the way Vi and Cait met, Cait giving Vi more than an apology but reassuring that no you dumb dumb you didn't choose wrong. Cait showing Vi without words that she has changed and it is thanks to Vi. It does a lot with not much time. 3 Yeah. It's not just this, her helping Vi in ep 6 was the start and this was the payoff. The real life comparison to abusive relationship is unreasonable. This is a tv show with limited time and every second takes 10's of hours to create. Actions speak louder than words, Cait helping Vi in ep 6 and then letting Vi release Jinx are more than enough in a STORY to be an apology. In real life, probably not but it's not real life. You want a scene where Cait gets a dressing down from Ekko, I know we all want that and it probably exists on a hard drive in Fortiche somewhere. With how much Cait pays, and she pays a lot, for her actions the dressing down is one of the first things that should be cut. Cait doesn't know how innocent the JInxer are. They are openly supporting a terrorist, a mass murderer, and even then she makes Ambessa explain her actions. " we don’t know if she was executing people" we know she wasn't. If they were executing people Sevika would have mentioned it at the Vander Statue, there would be names/martyrs. Sevika lists cait's crimes. "Enforcers raiding our homes, Noxians down our throats, Innocent carted off to stillwater" We know still water isn't using the deep cells that Vi was held in during S1 cause Cait shut them down. Cait was never this evil in waiting hiding behind privilege that so many people wanted her to be. Her characterisation in S1 told us that but people wanted her to go evil cause they saw privileged pilty and wanted her to justify the notion that Piltover needs to burn for zaun to be free. The use of the gray was probably the worst things she did, but it wasn't some kind of diabolic move. It isn't deadly like chlorine or bio weapon gasses, Smeech's accountant was hanging in it for an untold length of time. It most certainly is deadly with prolong exposure, if only Cait had some way of removing it once their mission was done. 4. It is. It's their spin of the wheel. It's not a happy "all problems in Zaun are fixed and now Piltover and Zaun are friends." It's the path to resolution is long and bumpy, this is a step along that path. Anything you can say about why it won't work is speculation which is the point the potential of the future is more important than focusing on the perfect one. Shoola is the last surviving member of the original council, there is no reason to think that along with Zaun saving piltover wouldn't earn them more sway. The framing of the scene gives it away. There are only 2 council members in that scene that are framed to oppose Sevika and School the rest of the council members are not framed to be antagonistic. Thinking that "oh the council won't work with Sevika" is just hating on the show for not giving you what you wanted instead of seeing what the show is presenting. Mel did have that character development. She used Ambessa to draw out the black rose, just like she used Jayce to remove Heimerdinger, but this time it wasn't subconscious this time it was intentional. Her being an empath and able to manipulate people to do what she wants, even if she isn't honest about what she wants with herself, added so much to her S1 scenes. When Ambessa makes the deal with Victor, she had lost two very important things. She lost Rictus, her literal and symbolic guard against magic, and she lost Cait, the Vision. Her believing Victor when he says he will evolve all those willing makes perfect sense here. It fits thematically, it ties in with noxian ideals and it shows how desperate she is. The specifics of how the deal works isn't important, we don't need a scene of her asking a bunch of questions that shit would be trash. " she never learned anything from waiting to defeat the black rose she never showed her “true face”" Mel literally says "I see your face deceiver" when the black rose has her mother. That is her using ambessa as bait, that's the wolf. This fight scene as a whole is outstanding, I can gush over all the details in that fight but this comment is too long already, and this from Mel is one of the most satisfying ends to a character arc I can think of. She's an empath, its safe to say she garnered something from the black rose that gave her insight, she knew the black rose wanted to end Ambessa and used that to get to their head, she knows Leblancs face now. They way they have enough themes for Jinx and her death that you the viewer can choose which you prefer is honestly really impressive. Jinx finally able to die as a good Sister, not a force of destruction or chaos or even the identity of Jinx that lead to Isha's death but in an act of love for her sister, or Jinx escaping the blast putting her father to rest(the lyrics from The LIne hitting hard) and living to build something new thanks to Isha and Ekko. The fact that both of these situations are thematically supported and can work is fascinating. That's more than enough for me to overlook anything regarding the setup of the scene. I don't disagree, people's expectations for what S2 would be absolutely ruined the show for them. But that is on them. I was hoping we would get a great fight scene between Ambessa and Vander/Warrick and have some great payoffs to the champion of the wolf and sacrifice symbolism in the show. I also thought this would be a great way to finally show a champion, Ambessa, can die in the show. What I got wasn't that, instead I got a tsunami of thematic parallels that have kept me coming back to the show. Everything else I watch seems almost hollow now compared to what Arcane managed to do with it's characters. Then I started looking into the lyrics of the music and that lead to whole other iceberg. Two sides of the same coin, sacrifice, identity, and the cycle of violence. Exploring s1 and 2 through these themes puts a new light on every character interaction. Sure Jinx and Cait are super obvious foils, but then what about Jinx and Jayce and then you watch that scene in episode 5 where Jayce comes back "I'm sorry too" said by Jinx and Jayce one to Salo and the other to Vi, is this just a coincidence and then you start looking at the similarities between Jayce and Jinx. This works for so many characters and also works with the music. No show gets me to think about it's characters as much as Arcane. So do I care that some people think Vi or Ambessa acted a way that didn't make sense? Absolutely not.
@@Joeda89 Not a problem I enjoy debating, and I want to thank you for staying in the debate usually people never respond after the first reply or turn to insulting instead of trying to be civil and talk about their views First I would like to argue that Back to the Future (at least the first one it has been a long time since I saw the others,) and Terminator (apart from the last one,) have pretty simple rules and guidelines for time travel and where are main timeline is and how it began is never a question. I'm not sure about Your Name I've never seen it before, While there is beauty to Viktor's quest to heal himself he lost everything he cares about, and by ending the conflict he is left with a world with no soul, it is not enough for me to overlook the writing flaws, and with writing you have to think logically about what makes sense for your universe in your story otherwise down the line things get sloppy, like in the MCU. The fact is Viktor himself is the only reason we are presented with that explains Jayce's obsession with magic so Viktor simply not giving Jayce the ruin or simply not saving him at all would have worked and wrapping your head around why supposedly this is the only way things can go to end up right seems a little far fetched especially when in s2 e7 presents us with a different solution not to mention I can think of multiple ways Mage Viktor could have stopped the Glorious Evolution And with what you are saying you do acknowledge that it doesn't make sense you just ignore it because you like the premise which I feel is a bit of a biased way of looking at things, and you wont get to the core problems with blinders on, and I feel with a little bit of work they could have made it work but from the perspective of the WRITING it doesn't, I may be speaking my opinions on it and the way I feel but it is because of my writing experience I have the opinion I do if that makes sense, not that I'm just a grump and don't like it, I tried hard to like it because with some work it would have been an intrueging story but being able to see the writing flaws and inconsistent writing I cant. #2 I truly believe this was one of the weakest parts of the show and I only say Vi should have gone after her because it is the moral thing to do and as a middle child I have experience in both the older and younger sibling department and as an older sibling she absolutely should have gone after her, it was character sabotage to make her stay and get it on instead of looking for her, as a sibling and just a person who cares about others this is simply something you can't change my mind on, I was actually abandoned by my older sister whom I was really close to during a really hard time in my life and related to Jinxs story a lot, so to see VI abandon her again (and yes I know the first time she didn't really mean to leave but both VI and Jinx refer to that time as VI leaving Powder,) was very disappointing, this time she actually did leave Jinx to be sucked into the self-destructive vacuum, I feel VI has every right to be judged here, not just from a personal stand point but from a writing stand point as well because it makes VI seem uncaring and the sex scene gross after witnessing someone at their lowest about to commit self unalive. VI and Ekko have no speaking lines and having a scene where these three come together one last time to fight together would have been actually pretty good for the story. #3 Why is a comparison to real life unreasonable? Arcane is known for its reflections on real-life problems and if a show doesn't want to take the time to flush out a story that echos in real life DONT DO IT, saying it is enough for a story is not true because we had enough time for Cait to be like "Oh, by the way, I was with someone" but not enough time to say "VI I messed up I wronged you, I hurt you and its something I will never forgive myself for," she strolled down so confident to VI in the cell it actually made me disgusted to think she had the gull to not be guilty of what she did to VI around VI, we shouldn't excuse poor pacing and choice of scenes because its "a show" show us don't make us assume don't make a drastic 180 in a character and expect it to make sense, I liked Cait in season 1 and her turn in season 2 never screamed it was because of her "privilege" it made sense she let grief get a hold of her and it turned her into a monster. Just because she did a few nice things doesn't mean she is actively trying to make up for her mistakes. #4 I understand it is now working toward betterment, but these council members' families were just killed by a Zaunite and Sevika worked with her it only makes sense that they wouldn't like her, and to say it's because I'm hating on the show for not giving me what I want is a bit of a personal jab but I'll overlook it. But don't assume it is because I'm being petty, need I remind you, you are the one who keeps saying you overlook many things because you like a certain premiss You are willingly overlooking things, most of my critiques come from my experience in writing except for Jinx and VI where I let a little more of my personal opinion on experiences determine some of my gripes with the story they are presenting but even with that I still ran it through my writer's brain to see if my feelings are clouding my judgment but the truth of the matter is, no, writing a caring sibling or decent human being that way is counter productive and character sabotage, all of these and the honorable mentions can be chalked up to that they rushed and overlooked way too many important details, they might have been able to keep everything the same if they decided to flush out the story, but they were trying to get way too many stories finished and new ones set up that they got sloppy, to quote Viktor, "In the pursuit of greatness they forgot to do good," all the important things happen off camera and the things that need explaining are simply left in the air, I in no way am doubting how wonderful arcane season 1 is, it has to be one of the best if not best series I've ever watched which is why season 2 disappointed me so badly, and people expectations should have been surpassed not less then, the fact that peoples imaginations made a better season 2 then we got and people are disappointed means they failed as writers, parallels are not enough to keep a story going at the point we are at now it just felt like something shiney to distract the viewer from the writing flaws.
@@Alifer2002 1 I bring up Back to the Future and Terminator because both movies send beings to the past that dramatically alter the future and thus would change the circumstance that lead to them being sent to the past. Marty has a massive impact on his Parents life and dramatically changes the future, but still has the same personality and is the same person at the start of the movie even though his siblings are different. Terminator the human that goes back to protect Sarah connor turns out to be John connor's father but then that means he wasn't there in the original timeline, so who was John Connor's father before time travel happened? Your Name is great and that's all I'll say, highly recommend. I do think that it is unfortunate that we have time travel in arcane, but I like what it does thematically enough to not care about the logic of it. Maybe if it was at the start of the story and we understood that going in, "hey this is gona be time travel story, we sacrificed some logic to hit the themes and explore characters this way" this from the start while alienating people could have played better than the reveal that it was Victor all along. 2 Not much I can say here. I can see why you would see it this way. I am definitely too invested in Cait/Vi's relationship and so I'm probably way too forgiving here. The scene was an unfortunate victim of time and the desire to invoke the way they first met. 3 Because I would look at any form of physical abuse as immediate relationship ender and would need police involvement, but it isn't real life. Vi is a street rat who grew up in prison, her getting hit by Cait, is thematically necessary to tie the breakup back to S1 ep3. So once Cait has helped Vi save Vander(before Isha) and let Vi free Jinx (also fix ep 3) she has redeemed the thematic debt Vi had over her. Thematically Cait is in the clear, but we don't have time for couples therapy. I don't think this is 10/10 or anything i just wouldn't include it in a list of complaints, I would tie it in with the show needing just a bit more time (an extra 10 minutes per episode, 1 more act, or 1 more episode per act) 4 I don't think so. Those council members fled the city. In ep 8 we see the hexgate evacuating people before the final fight. i still think by the framing of the scene it is setup as 2v2 with the rest of the council open to influence. Is this a problem with the pacing? Yeah I can only imagine what had to be cut, it seems pretty clear that Sevika and Schoola had some plot beat planned (they light the paper names together and thematically they are the only council members that lived through the attack/remember Silco) I was out of line with the last bit of the paragraph I let other comment conversations bleed into this one. The jab was unnecessary and rude in discussion. I don't like the term rushed, cause it makes it sound like the writing was done quickly. Did the cuts they were forced to make have a detrimental effect? Yes. Would a director's cut fix the majority of the complaints, also yes. This to me makes it not feel rushed, but squished, and dense. The main reason I feel so strongly about this, about the story not being written quickly with disregard for plot holes, is the absolute iceberg of character parallels/foils/themes. Does this excuse the time travel, putting the Vi/Cait sex scene at terrible time? No those are still problems, but I see those as problems the show voluntarily takes on in order pack everything into the last season they were given. The connection between the characters like: ( just to name a few) JInx/Cait Ambessa/Silco Heimerdinger/Singed Victor/Jinx Mel/Jinx Jinx/Jayce Jayce/Ekko Ekko/Victor Vi/Ekko Heimer/Silco And then how do those charcters explore the themes of the show, Two sides to every coin(human dichotomy), Sacrifice, Identity, Cycles of Conflict. That's not even going into the lyrics to the music in the show and absolute brainblast I had thinking about who the Blue Bird was in Ashes and Blood. Or listening to the lyrics for The Line while watching Cait accept Ambessa's nomination. I don't consider that separate from the writing, the lyrics and music are part of the writing too. There is so too much tying those characters together in terms of their actions, what those mean to them, the people around them that I can't accept the term rushed. That's why I'm so combative around things that sound like they undermine the work the writers put in. Too much work has clearly gone into the writing. Edit: I can't think of another show that does what Arcane S2 does. My love for the way these characters connect thematically is very much something that I can't expect everyone else to value.
Some would say Arcane is great because it respects its audience's intelligence by excelling at "show, don't tell." However, for some morons, they should go watch movies that spoon-feed everything to their viewers.
look, I have nothing against the sex scene but, shit dude, knowing we could have had ekko telling jinx how amazing she can be cuz he went to another timeline and saw her on her "best"... just makes me a bit sad.
Listen, I get both sides. Season 1 was a masterpiece from it's storytelling, character and worldbuilding, cause and effect, character motivations, animation, music, sound design, voice cast...."the whole package, you were." It's not perfect but it's pretty damn close. Whatever shortcomings season 1 had were all but negligible, except for Caitlyn's divine plot armor. Season 2 is arguably even better on a technical level, including animation, music, sound design and voice talent but it also feels very disconnected. There's a lot of new plot threads introduced, including Warwick and the Black Rose. The passage of time is difficult to discern as much of it is glossed over with stylized short music videos. Mel going from skillful and engaging politician in season 1 to Super Saiyan in season 2 ultimately hurts her character. The 'Blisters and Bedrock' flashback recontextualizes Silco and Vander and creates a gaping plothole in act 1 of season 1. Many of the emotional payoffs feel unearned, manipulative and effective to varying degrees but no less contrived. Vi had no agency the entire season. She was just a passenger, along for the ride with Caitlyn in Act 1. Then a tagalong for Jinx in Act 2 and then has to say goodbye to both her father and her sister in Act 3. Isha was a character device, as was Warwick. Neither were characters. You could say the same about Sky and Alura but neither had nearly the amount of screen time when they were alive as Isha and Warwick. What was the point of Loris? I mean, I'm pretty sure he was meant to be sort of a big bother figure for Vi, that kinda reminded her of Vander to help her through her dark period after the fallout of episode 3 but it's barely implied, let alone explored. He disappears for a large chunk of the season and then just shows up and dies unceremoniously in the final episode. The way Loris died didn't bother me so much as why should I care? I honestly had more connection to the piano guy that joined the fight than I did with Loris and I'm so happy he lived. Ultimately, I still love 'Arcane', warts and all and I'm thankful for this once in a generation, at least every couple decades, for something so beautiful, showcasing all the talent and passion that went into it, ironically from perhaps one of the most cynical and dubious of sources but because I love it so much, I have difficulty just waving away a lot of the issues season 2 suffers.
Dude why does everybody in this comment section hate season 2? Like i swear most comments here are just "It had a couple plot holes so its f tier garbage" like holy shit did we watch the same show?
I get some of those points. But Arcane is a masterpiece. I think a HUGe thing is that people watch season 2 and they're like : this isn't at all what I expected the storylines to evolve into. Dont get me wrong, most people love Arcane. It's my favorite show of all time and while every show has its problems arcane is simply a masterpiece. Period. What also helps is rewatching the whole show and accepting the story as it is. When you do that, you can really see the Beaty in it. And all things considered, Arcane s2 exceeded my expectations. Haters are gonna hate I guess
hater = capable of viewing media with a critical lens you arcane fans need to stop coping. also, arcane’s story was extremely predictable in season 2. it was disappointing because it did exactly what i expected it to do at every moment.
Hater? I frickin loved season 1, Arcane is the best show to hit Netflix in my opinion but that is what makes season 2 all the more unwatchable. I defended season 2 when it first came out but if you take even one second to stop coping and look back on the story you will see how bad it actually was.
Such an awful argument. What about anyone that liked where the storylines went? The storytelling is the problem. It's objectively, measurably provably worse than season 1. It's filled with serious flaws that aren't present in season 1. Let's not pretend it's subjective. Ideas are cheap.
@@eebbaa5560I think it’s unfair to people who like the show to invalidate the fact that they love it by saying they’re coping. Season 2 emotionally impacted me to a level that no other art has ever done, and that isn’t something that can be considered “cope.”
I hope they can retell the story in the future the same way Hideaki Anno did with REBUILD OF EVANGELION This way, they can fix all the issues with season 2
First season, nothing to complain about Very good I came here to talk specifically about the second season, which was honestly the biggest disappointment of the year for me. Extremely poorly developed plots, a lot going on and little time to really tell and develop these plots properly. Making the series very fast, why the hell didn't they do another season??? Or why didn't this season have like 15 episodes??? Poor character development. I'm actually shocked, how can a series in one season have developed its characters SO well, only to throw it all in the trash in the second season??? Violet, is one of the protagonists and this woman had NO focus, no type of development, no type of attention in fact, her plot in the 2nd season is summarized around Caitlyn, it's comical, it's sad. Why the series was supposed to be about the sisters, but it made Vi care more about the pussy she wanted to eat than about her own sister. Caitlyn, her arc this season would be wonderful if they needed time to develop, really cool when she ordered the commander of Ambessa's army, and extremely AWESOME when in the second act it doesn't matter AT ALL, because months go by and we don't see she is actually commanding and being this leader of Piltover. Jinx, this was the one that hurt me the most, because she's my favorite character. Her development in season 1 is brilliant, completely perfect, she really had everything to become this great revolutionary symbol of Zaun, but in the end SHE DIDN'T BECOME IT, she didn't lead ANYTHING! Tell me, WHAT'S THE POINT OF PUTTING HER HOLDING A FLAG AT THE OPENING OF THE SEASON, BUT IN THE SERIES ITSELF SHE DOESN'T HOLD ANY FLAG?? Jinx is one of the protagonists of the series along with Vi and she barely had screen time in act 3, THE TWO SISTERS DIDN'T HAVE SCREEN TIME IN ACT 3 and the series was supposed to be ABOUT THEM, RIGHT! Also very shameful how they came together too quickly in act 2 to save Vander, truly SHAMEFUL. like, oh my god, they tried to kill each other in episode 3 and now they're all good again??? Jinx was angry with Vi at the end of season 1, she said that they could no longer be what they were before. Another mistake in the speed of the series. One more thing, the series is about Piltover vs Zaun right? So why in the end is Piltover and Zaun vs Ambessa's army??? What is the point and MOSTLY, what is the point of the Zaunites helping the Piltie people in the war after they have been neglected and inferiorized for years??? The Black Rose plot had everything to be one of the best, but it was one of the worst, BECAUSE THEY DIDN'T KNOW HOW TO DEVELOP IT WITH SO LITTLE TIME THEY HAD!! Well, season 2 is terrible, is not good at all. I'm happy that arcane didnt won in best adaptation at game awards, because the writers definitely doesnt deserve this award I miss season season 1, I miss when the show was about the sisters, about the cities, when the characters had a good development
I feel that Vi was sort of done dirty in this. I know some of you may disagree, but I think Vi should have swapped places with Jinx when it came to the end. It would have felt so much more impactful and would have actually ended fully instead of the speculation of "yeah jinx survived, see that purple ray and the shot at the end that was the same as the first shot in the season?" Who tf is gonna follow that? Should have been Vi and (warwick?) that guy battling it out as they were falling and they just both died from impact when they got to the hexcore location. Then Jinx (or maybe powder depending on how you see it) leaving piltover and zaun finally breaking the cycle as she was meant to. Everything technically was Vi's fault (or Ekko as he gave the tip to rob the place) and she finished what she truly started. Would have been such a good moment and gave Jinx's character time to reflect on things and maybe reconsile more with Ekko. At the end of the day, Vi was really the true side character in all of this.
i disagree, simply bcs we know vi could sacrifice herself for powder since s1, seeing powder doing its impactfull, instead of "giving jinx time to reflect" wich she already did in chapter 8, u can see actuall development, i agree tho that the whole speculative part is dull.
I mean, dying has been part of Jinx's character arc in S2, not Vi's. Schnee's video on this was really good. That said fanfic exploring what would happen if Vi sacrificed herself here to save jinx would be a really interesting read. I hard disagree with the side character comment, side characters don't get to end an episode like Vi did in S2 ep 5.
Season two was just really bad. The characters, story, and writing were all terrible and nowhere near what season one was and achieved. The only thing that remained consisted was the animation, the acting and some good song here and there, but for the rest? Truly disappointing
i felt like the quality change is worse than game of thrones. s1 was such a smooth plot to follow. s2 was a music video time travel multiverse hallucination coming back alive for the third time wtf am i watching. no clue how people think there both in the 9s ratings other than hype
i loved isha as a character so i might be a little biasis but i felt like she was very important to the story as vi gets abandonded and therfores walks a mile in jinx's shoes and jinx takes on a big sister/motherly role and walks a mile in vi's shoes. SInce she nonverbal she never says jinx or powder and considering jinxs whole charcter arc is kinda a struggle between her 2 idenities, someone who just sees her as she is and not as jinx or powder is so powerful to the audience to remember that they are the same person and not 2 seperate identities. There is so much more with the symbolism behind isha and such that i felt she was vidal to the story
@@jellofish7228 isha was derivative, predictable, and chopped up into tiny pieces to be as digestible as possible. she was created just to fridge and give jinx another reason to have the exact same arc she had in season 1.
@@flowchartkenYT Good job on choosing the most remedial, low-hanging fruit for your video here, champ. There are legitimate criticisms of this season that even Christian Linke was forced to acknowledge. Yet somehow you only managed to cover the individuals whose complaints were essentially aesthetic in nature as opposed any that address the more egregious issues with narrative inconsistency, illogical character motivations, the abundance of major plot points happening off-screen, deus ex machinas, lack of character development, et al. All this tells me is, with the way you're heading, you are definitely primed to be a successful RUclipsr. That's not a compliment.
I think that many of the music video sequences are slightly selfe indulgant, and towards tbe end of the show the writers use them to fast track characer developement. Such as the sequence where Heimerdinger sings over the montage of them building the time machine, while I do love this sequence, it implies character progression afterwards that I am not fully able to get behind because I didn't see any of the small bonding moments like season 1 had. So while the music videos are good at setting tones and stakes, like ep2 and 4, others feel rushed, like ep3 and 7. I do particularly love the watercolours showing vander's personality and the sequence right before Isha's death. Over all they are a mixed bad of excelent exposition and lazy
read a book from any time period thats not today. or watch a movie from a different culture. jesus, youre so annoying. sitting here smugly yapping when you dont even understand how common this is. HELLO ANIME?
Sorry, but season 2 was just wasted potential. They did wrong to almost the entire cast. The things that really stand out in this season are the animation, the sound design and the attention to detail in the artistic department. Story wise it was a complete mess. I'm glad the gaslight is getting the response it should've had from the beginning.
Okay i was going to do a play by play of every problem in season 2 but a lot of other comments have pointed out the flaws and nobody probably will even read this so I'm just going to give my overall opinion. Season 2 as a whole was a letdown, abandon plots, characters were ruined, and the Viktor twist was not thought through at all. I defended season 2 when it first came out but after watching it back again after the disappointment that was the end i can't help but see all the flaws that made this season almost unwatchable if it weren't for a few scenes and moments. I don't know why anyone would try defending this season after waiting so long just to have rushed trash throw on the screen.
@Joeda89 my case is justified at this point if that is all you have to say rather than being able to come up with a valid response or coming up with your own defense for this season. The fact that nobody has given me one counter argument about how the show was actually good only proves my harsh judgement is justified and season 2 was as bad as I say. Thanks for the easy W man.
I liked season 1 a lot, I disliked season 2 because of pacing, plot holes that needed a lot of explanation, characters behaving in ways that didn't match their motives, & unexplained contrivances. Also, characters coming back from the dead & fake out death are tropes that just always annoy me in stories. Also how did nobody in Zaun ever figure out that Jinx killed Silco, that's weird as hell.
it’s the complete opposite. most league players, myself included, are way more critical of the show because we have an actual appreciation for the characters outside of it. arcane fans just watch this show and eat it up because they like making ship art and tiktok edits or they’re 35 year olds who still think that “mature” cartoons are cool.
Really? For one that is childish as heck, like come on dude. Secondly season 2 was a far fall from season 1 not just because of "sensibility" how about the fact is season 2 is being criticized because it had major flaws?
@@Joeda89 what? Why would I delete it? It is a pretty well known fact by now that season 2 isn't getting the same love season 1 did, for very good reasons.
Nah. The most fun part for me is how d@mb these people are, they don't even know what they are talking about, it's just blind rage / emotions. One of the reviewers called Jinx a psychopath, a common missconception, but demonstrates that he didn't take any effort on doing a proper review.
I consider myself a pretty unique case. I did not like season 1 at all. I considered it the worst piece of art ever produced. Regardless I gave season 2 a chance, a few days ago and I loved it and I think it's in top 10 of all art I have consumed.
Ambessa is against magic, because it makes mages more powerful than the others and "everyone in battle should be equal" yet she wants to transform her soldiers into unkillable mutant zombies through magic, her invasion of piltover in the last episode feels like a small skirmish with almost no build up. The whole piltover/zaun plot is almost gone completely, they had a lot to develop, showing how silco´s dead caused more problems than anything or how caitlyn tryin to end the crime in zaun through pure force brings nothing but chaos, and that ending, with the ppl from zaun going to fight for piltover was so fucking bad . I honestly like the idea for caitlyn's character, but she just haves like 20 minutes in screen. Vi does literally nothing in the whole season, which is probably my biggest disappointment bcs she was my favorite character in s1. And ekko`s whole story is that he saves the world, literally, we see nothing of him in 7 episodes, then in episode 7 he gives up a perfect world and saves the day in the ending and even if his story with powder made me cry hate the time travel/multiverse plot. Jinx went from a completely dysfunctional psycho to a loving sister in 10 minutes, and her relationship with vi fixes bcs vander reappears, like, she's been trying to kill vi since s1 ep 7, but now they are good again in half episode.This finale remind me a lot to the mcu, everything ends with a battle between good and bad, and every 5 minutes a reference to another league champion to ensure your hype for next shows. Even with that i think that it haves way more good things, and rating it 1 out of 10 its criminal, i wouldn't rate it less than a 8 but i can't stop thinking how much better it could have been with a bit more of time.
Im so tired of people accepting season 2 and giving it that high of a rating after the horrible cheesy marvel- disney fan service storyline we were served. The animation is AMAZING and voice acting is PHENOMENAL but the writing was VERY BAD. None of thw characters felt like the same as season 1 and i get that their motivations change but we should be able to understand their decisions atleast. It felt like they just gathered what people liked the most from season 1 and put it all together the music video montages, fight scenes, a bunch of "WOAH THAT WAS A COOL SCENE" moments, slow motions and drama just for reaction but no clear motivation. I know its just a show but still season 1 changed my life (im dramatic). We spent 3 years expecting a masterpiece and this is what we got. I understand its hard to satisfy everyone's expectations but all they had to do is follow through with all the storylines established in season 1 there was no need to add any more side characters to take up too much screen time just follow the main cast.
I can't figure out the part with Jayce going to the future, like if the problem is Hextech then just don't give Jayce the Rune stone that inspires him to make Hextech in the first place and problem solved, right?
Not exactly, everything I wanted to see happened off-screen and also IT WAS RUSHED, vi literaly makes out with caitlyn instead of chasing her sister which went off to kill herself. That scene felt so disrespectful and out of place. It shows the bad pacing of season 2. They didn't have any other place to put the scene.
![Noob To Max With DRAGON REWORK In Blox Fruits [FULL MOVIE]](http://i.ytimg.com/vi/LnBMOinoOvA/mqdefault.jpg)
I LOVED the first season and I can't defend it enough for the past 3 years. But I couldn't deny that season 2 was rushed even Christian admitted skipping some of Vi's arc because there just was so much to do, if they just had one more act or just a little more time then I think it would've help.
10 more minutes on each episode would have probably had a noticeable benefit. When I look at the pacing between the seasons, the thing that draws my eye is the ending for S1. That iconic ending is probably responsible for most of the pacing issues in S2. Act 1 in S2 feels like such a natural continuation and the fight scene in ep 3 is actually in the opening credits in S1 (statues of Jinx and Vi fighting) I wouldn't be surprised if S2 ep 3 was supposed to be the ending for S1 but got pushed to S2 in favor of the tea party/Rocket ending.
I would have loved more Vi.
I hated her ending with Caitlyn. It feels unearned even though I was a big Caitvi shipper in season 1. But they actually destroyed their relationship for me I'm season 2. I blame it on the writers the animation makes it feel so romantic and the context and dialogue makes it feel empty. I also wanted her to be more than just a part of a ship and Jinx's sister but they wasted her.
I can somewhat understand people disliking the more 'music video' style sequences in season 2 compared to the less stylized use of music in season 1, but to say it doesn't progress the plot is just telling me they didn't actually watch the show. The music videos are used to show what's happening to the characters and to Piltover and Zaun at a faster pace so they can get to the other plot points later in the episode. The whole point of the montages is to *show what's happening* and *progress the plot*
that’s the problem though. all it does is serve as a form of stylized exposition. they never let the plot, the setting, or the characters breathe. it just feels like the show is trying to get from point A to point B as fast as possible without giving itself time to develop any of its ideas or story beats further.
@@eebbaa5560 I agree with that, yeah. The music videos were definitely more rushed, but with the timeframe that Fortiche had for season 2, it's probably one of the better ways they could've gone about the issue of pacing. Season 2 definitely had a lot of flaws, but the music videos were pretty minor in comparison to other issues, like abandoning side characters/arcs and pushing the Piltover and Zaun conflict aside near the end. And personally, I thought it was pretty fun to have the music and the visuals compliment what was happening at the time. Being able to leave some of the plot points up to interpretation while still conveying what's happening was a pretty good decision with the time restraints they had imo
idk about you but i wasn't exactly a fan of having to pause every 3 seconds and rewind to try to not even catch all the details, but at least get a grasp of what was going on in those music videos, especially since it felt like 90% of the episodes were music videos. the music sections in season 1 were much more meaningful, slower paced and understandable, while still being worth of rewatching with all the symbolism in them. additionally, i had to watch in English which isn't my native language, and for some reason my native (Ukrainian) wasn't available where i live (Germany). which, as you can probably imagine, didn't make whatever ghost of the plot remained in those music videos any more coherent. so, yeah, the criticism of the music parts is very valid imo. the music itself was great, but playing a new song every 5 minutes made it feel less like a deep story and more like a car karaoke :/
@@WhoEustace Still, I feel it was a better option than just exposition dumping everything. Fortiche has said that they wished they could do more to cover some of their flaws with the second season, but with everything they had to wrap up and all the plot points they had to hit, there wasn't a whole lot of room for better exposition. I completely agree that Season 1's use of music was way better, but Season 2 wasn't nearly as bad as people are making it out to be. Things could've been much worse, and it would've been a lot harder to make them better with the constraints
Yes, the montages progress the plot but it doesn't progress the character arcs. That's kinda the issue.
But for what it's worth, the music videos weren't the problem. The music videos were the bandaid solution to the much larger issue, the fact that the creators tried to shove 2 seasons worth of material into one season, and because of that, they marathoned through the story and a lot of important character and plot beats were cut out in the process, resulting in the rushed "mess" that was this season
The first person has a point. S2 did feel rushed. The music being used to cover that deficiency is debatable...but it was definitely rushed
So was Season 1 if you think about it. It just got away with it cause it wasn’t the last season
@@e-man7418got away with it because the plot was so narrowly focused on the relationships.
They say is rushed or fast is slow-witted
@@e-man7418 No. Season 1 was fine. Season 2 was more rushed because it had more story plots and character arcs than the first season.
@@chrishaven1489I love how you say this and… don’t tell us how!
The story overall in S2 is fine, but I feel like it was 2 seasons worth of content shoved into one and rushed at the same time. Arcane should've been 3 seasons, and it would've been a 10/10 undisputed champion of the entertainment world for the next decade or longer. Now the haters have their ammo needed to bash the living hell out of arcane and make a mountain out of a mole hill.
An extra episode or 2 sure. An entire season? 3 more years? I doubt it. S1 is much slower paced in act 1 and the most common complaint is "its kinda boring until ep 3" or "i wasn't sure if it was good until ep 3." Adding a whole other season, 9 more episodes, we'd get the exact opposite problem. "act 2 feels pointless" "why is this scene even here" "didn't they already cover this"
As far as ammo for haters. Most of it is subjective so if they are saying they didn't enjoy S2. All good no worries, there are people that didn't like S1.
@@Joeda89 The ideal season 2 would've focused on Vi and Caitlyn hunting Jinx down with an emphasis on Vi being significantly more conflicted between wanting to help Caitlyn and wanting to save Jinx, the sister she's been trying to rescue for the whole first season. If the first season focuses on Jinx choosing between Powder or Jinx, then it seems rather obvious that the second season would've focused on Vi's decision between being Vi as Caitlyn's partner or Vi as Jinx's sister. Then Vi makes her choice and the Vi vs Jinx fight would've been the climax of the season.
Then the third season would focus on Vi and Jinx being forced to work together to save Vander while Caitlyn's running her dictator arc and trying to chase them down. and Caitlyn would have to contend with watching her ex-girlfriend conspiring with her mother's killer and the Shimmer weapon killing off her enforcers.
It's the same story with the same trajectory. But with a lot more room for the character arcs and plotlines to breathe
I agree. 3 seasons would’ve been much much better for with all the moving plot points they wanted to cover. Two things that stand out are Isha and Mel’s involvement with the Black Rose.
@@Scr4mbledM3ggs I wouldn't say no to more scenes with Isha and I would gladly watch an entire season of Mel making her way back to Piltover, but tv history doesn't support this. So many shows start out slow and get dropped because it takes too long to really start. Would this story still be fondly remembered if it took another 3 years to finish? When the number 1 complaint about S1 was "it takes 3 episodes to get good" is it really a surprise that they made cuts to speeding the pacing up?
The worst part about this season is lack of character interaction. There are so many plots in the series that i want reaction from the main chracters. I want to see mel response to embessa successfully starting a war. I want to see ekko and firelight response to vi joining caitlyn and gassing the city. I want jayce reaction to caitlyn becoming a dictator. There are so many interesting interaction they just ignored.
Not ignored, had to cut. Regarding mel, we did get that scene lol. The other two would have been nice and the only one I really want is Ekko Vi scene. The Jayce Cait scene would have been nice but I understand why it had to go.
Sure, more moments showing how the characters are feeling would have been nice, but it's not a dealbreaker since they wouldn't be essential to advance the plot. Just because we didn't get to see some interesting bits, it doesn't mean what we actually got was disappointing.
@@rowandavis2061 I feel like you had to pay really close attention to this season to catch subtext and nuance that wasn't as prevalent as season 1. Lots of people who are critical missed things I thought were apparent or even obvious, although some criticisms are definitely fair.
@@rowandavis2061I mean I agree I think the shoe was still good. But the issue is how much detail they put into season 1, and I get the plan was only 2 seasons but when you have a show that has put so much detail into the little things in the first season and then in season 2 you have a major character (cait) go through a villain ark off screen. We get a jump forward after a large amount of time of cait being a dictator and now she’s questioning if they are the good guys.
@@rowandavis2061It absolutely does. Arcane season 1 best point was characters. By far. Arcane s2 weakest point is characters. By far. Ofc it's a problem.
The problem with the second season is that most of the character development happened off screen and created a lot of ambiguity and speculation to the point that we had to interpret the blanks/spaces between each scene. Such a strange way to force a narrative device of reading between the lines more often when compared to the first season where it kept its pace consistant. A lot of the scenes are not spelled out to the average viewer which caused many to percieve the ending as quick and abrupt with a lot of the story threads unresolved or even unsatisfying.
Reading intention and what the characters are thinking based on character expression, reaction, focus, etc, based on the limited availabe information is what creates discussion and discourse among the community, but at the same time viewers can speculate and give their interpretation, but that's all it will ever be interpretation based on speculation. Writers have already outlined the intention and established direction. We won't see the end result until the next series where we see those characters again. Like Spider-Man 3 in 2007 and The Amazing Spider-Man 2 in 2014, and fans waiting until 2021 to see these Spider-Man characters develop and interact in Spider-Man No Way Home. Fans of Arcane are in for a looong wait if this will be the case.
Plot holes like how did Jinx and Warwick escape and leave Stillwater if Ambessa was there in the area of the cable cart, how did the free inmates also leave?
Even though Sevika didn't have any spoken dialogue and mostly her presence in the last episode, did she find out that Isha died or find out what happened to Jinx? What was her reaction? Did Sevika know that Jinx killed Silco?
Did Jayce and Caitlyn find out that it was Vi and Powder/ Jinx that stole from them?
Did Ekko realize that it was Jayce that he was trialing when he was in the alternate universe?
What happened to Heimendinger? Jayce and Viktor?
Too many things are up in the air or did not give enough closure.
@@PillowEgg the lack of character reaction or interaction was a huge flaw in this season tbh. there were so many moments when things happened and characters didn’t even get a chance to react to the events of the story or the world changing. sevika in general was just completely sidelined even though she had the setup for a compelling character arc.
They resorted to telling the story this way because they tried to shove 2 seasons worth of story into one. They needed more time for the story to breathe
Well said, one issue I had with character development off screen was Victor going from "You must destroy the Hexcore" at the end of season to 'cyborg jesus' to 'I will assimilate every one and end free will using this arcane technology I thought was too dangerous to exist 5 minutes ago'.
Like I am not saying he couldn't make that change but dang it seemed to happen fast and with very little under pinning it.
The real problem is they made serious plots into music video. Caitlyn brutality and zaun revolution should have weight and now people remember them as fun music video.i m thinking it might be intentional to water down the seriousness of the situation.
One of the few season’s of a show that even with its flaws, I still give it a 10/10.
I felt like it was 10/10 on first watch for sure. Given some time to marinate, I'd say 8.5 or 9 maybe. I have some issues, but they pale in comparison to the overall product.
@@WickedHumor do you watch for the entertainment or to review the content? Just enjoy bro if you said it was 10/10 on first watch then it is watching it again will be another experience so of course you will give it another evaluation
The one valid point out of all these reviews is the mention of Silco's murder never being discussed. It wouldn't be far-fetched for Zauners to believe that Silco was killed by topsiders and that Jinx avenged him by blowing up the Council. If I were an average Zauner that would make sense to me: the wild dog avenged its master and took down the enemy in one go. It's a plausible interpretation so I just ran with it. For a few seconds I thought that Sevika might find out that Jinx was the one who killed Silco and that would create tension, but that was just for a few seconds. Pace-wise it wouldn't fit and a Jinx vs Sevika conflict wouldn't bring out a lot of emotions since they didn't like each other in the first place.
Yes, the pacing in season 2 was faster than the pacing in season 1...and it makes perfect sense. Season 1 took the time to make us feel invested in the characters while unveiling the plot, we wouldn't have cared if things happened too fast! And Season 2 did its one job to end the story.
I don't know the video game lore, but I believe that it's because I knew that Arcane is based on a video game that I enjoyed it so much. Growing up I liked reading books, but sometimes I would set them aside to watch my cousins play video games--for the sake of the storylines, of course. Of course my cousins didn’t pause for me to catch up on what was happening, at best I'd get some quickly thrown explanation for why who could do what or not. I had to keep my eyes and ears wide open to catch as many details as possible so that I could piece things together myself. Even when I guessed wrong, the reveal/plot twist was rewarding anyway.l and the visuals always stunned me.
Watching Arcane felt like watching my cousins play a video game. My personal experience lends a nostalgic element to the show, which further elevates its already outstanding value. I mean, someone could teach a whole art class on how well the creators used color-coding conformation to emphasize characterization.
Nowadays too many members of the audience feel entitled to receive the pacing, dialogues and ending THEY want. Whining just because the creators/directors didn't deliver your fantasy is childish.
I agree with you alot, especially the last point you made, but I did want to touch on the Jinx killed Silco and it's not discussed bit. I think this point would have more merit if it would change anything in Zaun. Silco was not loved in Zaun, he was tolerated. He had money, the weapons so what he was in charge. Vander was the beloved folk hero of Zaun, not silco.The only way he kept power was it being given to him by Sevika, and that was just because there wasn't a better option. Even the peace deal silco gets is given to him by Jayce cause he feels bad for killing one of Silco's child workers. Once Piltover put out the reward for Jinx, that ensured that Sevika wouldn't turn on her, how could she turn on Jinx when she just blew up the council and Sevika betrayed Vander for being too weak. Jinx isn't going to brag about killing silco she is struggling too much with that fact to openly talk about it. If blowing up the council laid the foundation, then clearing the gray and sending back topside solidified it and it echoes when the mural in ep 5 doesn't show Jinx and silco on the wall, but Jinx and vander. All this to say if the people of zaun found out Jinx killed silco, they wouldn't turn her in, they would thank her and since that is where she ends up anyway then it's not really needed.
Still it would have been nice, like she tells Sevika or somehow Sevika finds out I can hear Sev saying something like
"Hmph, I told him not to go after you, that you would come to him. Guess I was right." it could have been a nice scene in S2 between ep 3 and 4, but it would mean something else has to go and I can't even begin to think of what should be cut for it.
The music videos are contentious because they essentially boil down what could be half a season of content into just a couple minutes. Regardless of how cool you think they are, most people will feel slightly cheated out of the opportunity to get to see the situation and characters develop.
Like I'm really dissapointed we didn't get to see HOW Isha pulled Jinx back from the brink, didn't get to see Jinx reluctantly taking care of her and start to realise they have a bond, I wish we got to see Jinx struggle with her mental illness but develop and figure out how to come to manage her problems (and if your honest answer is that she isn't managing her problems at all, and Isha is just a light-switch that controls whether or not Jinx has schizophrenia than I don't know what to say to you).
I wish we got to see more of Viktor explaining his philosophy and delve deeper into the conversation of free will, show us WHY he thinks the hivemind is a better option, with what we are given it comes across as shallow, like the writers didn't have skill to write more complex conversations between character about their philosophies. I could only appreciated Viktor's point of view because I have watched evangelion and other shows with similar themes around "self-destructive human nature, and assimilation", except those shows are actually interested in having that conversation, not just reading you the footnotes. Done well the exploration of Viktor's character could have been on the level of the hedgehog dilemma and human instrumentality from evangelion.
This summarizes my issue with season 2: although the ideas were great and the art was great it was poorly executed because it was rushed, like they didn't have time to explore beyond the surface level, so they provide the footnotes rather than delving into the actual thesis. It comes across as very "first draft-y"
Then you have the issue of characters just doing things that are absolutely out of character, or at best very rushed development making the shifts in views feel jarring. Look at Jayce at the end of season 1, he tries to invade the under city solely on a whim because he is upset, and immediately decided to dismantle the operation after accidentally killing a child. But then what must be at most a week later ends up making weapons for Cait in season 2 when she wants to invade the underground. I think that is blatant character assassination, even if they gave us more scenes showing why he had a change of heart, this is too quick for him to immediately go back on his decision to stop making hextech weapons.
Also, do you really expect me to buy that Vi would go and use the grey on her people just because she wants to find Jinx, like for all she knows she might end up gassing Ekko, you know, the boy who is basically her best friend?
And the final twist that Viktor was the mage from Jayce's memory in season 1 is 100% a rhetcon, and if you disagree you are lying to yourself. Why did Jayce shoot Viktor in act 2 instead of trying to talk to him when that was his plan all along? How does Warwick operate the cable car mechanism to get to and from stillwater? Why does Jayce not get bodyswapped when displaced by the anomaly but Ekko and Heimerdinger do (the answer is that it's an unexplained plot convenience because if he got body swapped he would end up in the body of the hivemind Jayce)? How does Jinx overcome schizophrenia in 3 months, I originally bought into it more because I assumed a few years had passed (even then it's obv very unrealistic but I can suspend my disbelief enough to still buy in). There is just a lot of plot holes that show a drastic lack of quality control in season 2.
I liked season 2, thematically the ideas of forgiveness and hope resonate with me more than the bleak and depressing themes in the first season, but I can't deny that the writing clearly had far less quality control than season 1. Season 1 still has some contrivances but it is air-tight in comparison to season 2.
My brother seems to hold this superiority complex because arcane season 1 is one of his favorite shows, but just because you like something that is well made doesn't make you any smarter or better than anyone else, I like plenty of bad shows and movies but that doesn't make me feel some inferiority complex about my intelligence. But that doesn't mean we should dismiss the impact that good writing can have on a story, and the effort that goes into making it.
Specifically the music scene with The Line as well as the one in the alternate universe hit me so hard, more than any other piece of media ever. In my opinion, season 2 blows season 1 out of the water for me, I’m not sure why. I think part of it is visuals, part of it is the struggle that Jinx works through, part of it is Viktor, and plenty more.
When you realize the Line was inspired by the singer's loss of his grandmother and it get's to
"Take a seat"
"But I'd rather you not be here for "
"What could be my final form"
I cry everytime
As someone who adored the 1st season and has spent the past 3 years praising it as the single greatest piece of media ever made, and also someone who hates the 2nd season, I would like to elaborate on, or even add some of my own issues with the season.
The music Videos: I agree, they're fantastic... as set-pieces. The issue with the MV's this season is that they're treated as self contained scenes. What should've given opportunity to characterise Loris and maddie, and show Vi embracing the role as an enforcer is replaced by an MV. What should've been Vi's lowest point, where she's left directionless and alone (or with Loris, I guess) is nothing more than a 2 min MV that could be removed and nothing would be lost. These MV's replace alot of opportunity for character growth.
I was expecting to further elaborate on other reviews, but I guess you weren't lying when you said these reviews are terrible. So, I guess I'll get into my own gripes.
The Zaun plot line is entirely abandoned. Seriously. A civil war has being brewing for almost a decade by the finale, but for some reason the Zaunites run to their oppressors aid. Paint the town blue showed that the situation between Zaun and Piltover was worse than ever, indiscriminate assaults and imprisonment of civilians for standing on the street. I could maybe make sense of it had there been anything in it for them, but Jayce couldn't even manage a plea when attempting to conscript them.
The characters. Honestly, I can't consider Caitlyn a character anymore. This isn't rhetorical, what did they do with her character this season? The single thing she got, they reverted before actually doing anything with it. Caitlyn can be replaced by any nameless enforcer from episode 4 and onwards and I feel the series would be better for it because it would at least spare me the scenes between her and Vi. Which brings me to Vi. She is one of the biggest disappointments this season, so many incredibly intriguing plot points that they do nothing with, her becoming an enforcer, her being an enforcer, her break up with Cait, her hitting rock bottom, her grieving losing her father figure again, and none of those were anywhere to be seen. All she had this season was her relationship with Jinx, and whilst it works, it becomes tiring when it's all she has had for the past 11 episodes and that's only amplified by them not doing anything with the other things that were available for her. It also makes what should've been a great moment, where Jinx forces her to let her go, feel underwhelming. The single arc that Vi has had for a majority of the series at this point isn't even resolved by her.
And there's 'the scene'. Personally, I'm just not a fan of sex in media, not that I'm a prude, but I feel there's generally a more effective way to establish the point that these scenes generally are there to set, so no matter how this scene was placed I likely wouldn't like it, but... Good lord. They couldn't have done this worse. She just woke up from a concussion after watching her father figure die, and her sister- who has previously expressed relief at the thought of death- just alluded to killing herself. Throw in the fact that she's also a manic terrorist and a mass murderer, the focus of both Caitlynn and Vi should be to find her. Jinx isn't just a threat to herself, she's a threat to the whole city's populace. And, to be clear, I dont want Vi to go after Jinx. That would be regressive for her character. What I thought would, and feel should've happend, is Vi actually grief all the loss she's experienced and Cait to be there to comfort her, but instead they did what they did and to me it paints them both as callous and selfish.
I have a quite a few more issues, but I've being writing for a minute now, and I feel putting anymore would be daunting for anyone that would actually be looking to engage in a convo. I would love to hear thoughts from anyone that sees this and disagrees with me
this, oh my god this. i wouldn't say i HATED season 2, there were some good parts that i personally liked, but i still agree 100% with everything you said
Wow! This is.. awful! Never review anything again!
As if the civil war… isn’t the last act lmfao. But wahhhh it didn’t end how you wanted so ?? bad??
Checks notes. Sex is bad because you find it icky and you cannot process the fact that these characters are meant to be messy humans who don’t follow a narrative how you want. You’re mad at the sex because you do not understand Caitlyn. Shush
@palemeadows I honestly have no clue what you was trying to say in reference to the civil war not being the last act.
I feel I made it clear why I generally don't like sex in media, and why i dont like this scene in particular. If its done well (like the scene between Khal Drogo and Daenerys in GoT) I obviously won't take issue with it, but if its not it just feels like a way for the directors to project their fetishes (like most sex scenes from GoT). And the team talking about an extended cut pushes it further towards the latter for me.
And, no. My issue with Vi and Caitlynn is actually the exact opposite. I feel they have no agency and bounce around solely in service of the plot.
You say my review is terrible, but you didn't dispute anything I said. Where am I wrong? I would love to be proven wrong, that's why I posted this, I want to have a discussion that'll change my mind about these things.
@palemeadowsyou're onto nothing 😭🙏
@palemeadows I mean, why don’t you make a proper review? You’re just insulting at this point. And objectively, season 1 is better than season 2.
The story was bad. Too much to go into but the more I think about the season, the less I like it sadly, the opposite is true for season 1 though.
Season 2 showed us everything we NEEDED to see in order to wrap up the story in a satisfying way and did it in style. Yes, there were plenty of things that would have been nice to see, like more scenes with certain characters together (e.g. Ekko and Jinx) or more of the build-up to certain events, but they weren't essential for keeping you invested in the characters or progressing the story. They did an amazing job with the limited run time they had, and saying it was garbage because they left out some interesting bits of fluff is incredibly harsh. Remember that plenty of truly great stories are ones that leave you wanting more.
@rowandavis2061 the whole show was about zaun v piltover until the last 2 episodes when suddenly it was about viktor flying in space hypnotizing everyone. Hours of deep storytelling about class war that's just forgotten so they can have a marvel fight scene
Also how about the scene where ekko talks jinx out of blowing herself up and into helping?? How is it remotely acceptable to do that off screen
This isn't missing fluff, it's missing heart
Thankyou for this comment really. It’s tough to scroll through all the hatred around the show. Like come on, let’s watch it together again without toxicity and obsessively talk about the cool parallels😭
@@DRsideburnsI kinda agree with you, but no at the same time. The show did Definitely build up to viktors villian arc. It was an amazing BEAUTIFULLY crafted story. My only complaint is they packed to much into to little time. They needed more time to flesh everything out and give each plot breathing room. And I do agree they sacrificed a lot of heart for moving the plot. But no nothing happened in the plot randomly I would say
@@rowandavis2061 I wouldn’t say that ALL of it was satisfying because there were definitely weird plot decisions make all throughout the second season. (In my opinion)
There was a ton of content to cover and I think the show could’ve benefited from a few more episodes and a few revisions to the script.
However there was a lot of things wrapped up somewhat nicely with a few lingering questions here and there. And of course this show has a ton of style in the animation and art category. The people who worked on this shows visuals deserve nothing but praise and respect.
@Scr4mbledM3ggs I mean, yeah, I'd definitely say season 1 is slightly more cohesive overall. As someone who still found season 2 outstanding, though, it kinda sucks to see all the negativity towards it.
Part of me wish it had stopped after season 1, as the ending was perfect. They could have taken season 2 to a different part of the world and told a new story there. I do not get the people saying the ending was a cliffhanger, as the point of the ending was that she fired the rocket, not what it hit, which pretty much sums up my problems with season 2 starting where it does.
That said i cant deny it was awesome to see Ekko with his full kit, and Victor too.
Season 2 did feel like they tried to cram too much story into too few episodes, and one of the leads on it did say they had plans for 5 seasons, and i wonder how many of those plans were crammed into the season.
i remember thinking the exact same thing during episode 2 as one of the people reviewing the series . When Sevika was supporting jinx and convincing her to become the new Zaun leader/idol, I remember thinking I can't wait when Sevika finds out Jinx actually killed Silco. It is very implied Sevika and other zaunites don't know who killed Silco and probably think he was killed by some enforcer like Caitlyn. I really thought Sevika was going to find out somehow and confront/fight Jinx knowing she killed her boss. At the end of the day Sevika was very loyal to the Zaun cause therefore loyal to Silco since he was the one orchetrating Zaun independence. Also there is no way that Sevika could know about Silco not wanting to give up Jinx to Piltover in order to create the nation of Zaun, so if she found out about Jinx killing Silco she should be very mad. Did I miss something? I felt like Silco demise at the end of Jinx was a big plot point that went nowhere. Thrn after episode 3 and a week passing I kind of forgot about it until I watched this video. Please let me know what you think
Why would Sevika fight Jinx if she found out she killed Silco? How would the rest of Zaun learning Jinx killed Silco change things? If it doesn't change anything, which it doesn't, then it's one of the first things to go when deciding what to cut.
@ the explain why it doesn’t change anything. I think it changes a lot, Sevika was always loyal and defended Silco till she could. It would have been interesting to see maybe Sevika having to choose between leaving an icon for Zaun without going to war with Jinx for what she has done and so choosing to be loyal to Zaun or trying to kill her or expose her for the killer freak she is but leaving Zaun without a symbol for rebellion. I guess Sevika was heavily sidelined as a character compared to S1 since she does pretty much nothing in S2 besides the first 3 episodes
@@poorguy2839 Sevika isn't necessarily loyal to Silco, she's loyal to Zaun. She only follows Silco because she believes he will do the best for Zaun. If Silco is gone, she'll move on to the next best option, which would be Jinx. And I feel ep5 of s1 shows Sevika to be capable of compassion, and more understanding of Silco and Jinx's relationship than anyone else. I think she knows that there isn't anyone that was more affected by Silco's death than Jinx, and I think she recognises that Jinx's intent wasn't to sabotage Zaun, or kill her father. Even if Sevika held resentment towards Jinx for killing Silco, Jinx is only thing in Zaun that can unite the people and I think set aside her own feelings for what's necessary for the progress of Zaun
@ yeah but my problem is we don’t see any of this. I think it would have been important to see Sevika struggle to do the right thing for Zaun after Jinx sabotage of Silco’s plan
@@poorguy2839 Whilst it would be nice to offer more to her character, Sevika just doesn't have the relevance in the story to warrant dedicating that much time to her. Considering the numerous other things we didn't get that hold much more importance, I feel Sevika's internal struggle been cut isn't bad. And, whilst I won't speak for you, I think most people would take major issue if this was given screen time over something like Ekko talking Jinx down from ending her own life
Season 2 was rushed. The originally wanted 2 seasons but I don’t get why the story wasn’t fleshed out as they intended.
The writers wanted two seasons. They wrote what they wanted. There was nothing more to be fleshed out in their opinions.
They wanted 2 seasons because they wanted this story over and done with irrespective of whether or not the story could be told in that timeframe, which it very much couldn't. They really wanted to move on to their next spinoff and it's so disappointing
S1. That ending. It was iconic, beautiful and perhaps the best ending any season could have. It also meant that S1 had much more time for slower side characters. S1 having that ending meant S2 had to go lightning fast. Everything has a cost, every cut hurts. That beautiful scene means the pacing isn't perfect
@ That’s war for ya. Doesn’t slow down.
@ Nah, two seasons was enough. The story was concluded nicely
My main complaints are I felt like Warwicks involvement in the plot in act 2 was a little sloppily done overall and the last episode needed like 10 minutes more screentime.
But even then, I wouldn’t consider the season as a whole less than an 8/10.
Edit: Oh I forgot one more.
The Maddie traitor “twist” was really dumb. Like REALLY REALLY dumb. Like it made even less sense when I rewatched the season beginning to end.
I love the maddie traitor twist, it recontextualizes all those scenes where she's trying to get Cait to reinstate the council as Maddie trying to get cait killed. Like "i hate this rich spoiled brat, if she reinstates the council Ambessa will be forced to take her out." "Oh you betrayed Ambessa, maybe try to go negotiate(trying to deliver her to Ambessa)"
@@Joeda89 So what, Maddie was actively doing the opposite of what Ambessa wanted because of some personal dislike of Cait? That would make Maddie the most incompetent spy ever.
@@christopherhenson50 Not really, Ambessa doesn't need Cait she needs hextech. In fact one could argue that Ambessa is keeping Cait around out of "affection" more than need. Heck staging Cait's death at the hands of Zaun would play into Ambessas favor even more, buut Ambessa like's Cait, until she costs her Rictus.
Ambessa has some connection to the enforcers. Thats how she gets the uniform and helps Reni get into the memorial. It's Maddie's smoke grenade that gives Noxians cover to take out everyone that knew they were involved. The last impact frame when Maddie shoots Cait it shows us the real Maddie and the smile she has as she finally gets to shoot Cait, in the neck so she would drown in her own blood. Maddie hated Cait
I think another 5-10 minutes for each episode, or even the OG 90 minute finale would have been enough to fix a lot of problems.
I give the haters my address and took my own life for defender the VA and her character.
Please don't hate her.
i felt they played too safe. If they want caitlyn to go down the dark path, let her go. for me that was the biggest disappointment. I know people will tell me she came back to her senses, but storywise her being the commander leads up to nothing. The same way they could have maddie as the commander.
Cait doesn't go down that dark path cause in S1 we saw who she really was. The heart of the show isn't not going to start executing zaunites in the streets. That's not to say she doesn't change. She is in a very different place than S1. But thinking she would go full evil is ignoring everything in S1.
Exactly then they gave her a stupid out of nowhere poor redemption arc
@@rashimalviya8263 except it's not out of nowhere, you may wish it had more time and emphasis but the pieces/groundwork were laid all throughout act 2.
@@Joeda89litteraly out of nowhere. Vi comeback and BOOM cait is a good girl again. Tell me what scenes show us that cait is questionning her own moral or even ambessa's goals ? The only i could think of is when she said that ambessa's sword is double-edged too. And the scene in the bed with maddie when she looks like she's questionning herself and what she's doing. But these two scenes are way too early(and close to each other) compared to her turning good again. She's even more in dictator mode after these two scenes cause she clearly choose to follow ambessa AFTER theses scenes. Cait was one of my favorite character in s1 and i was excited when i understood that jinx had probably killed her morher in the end of s1 cause i absolutely wanted to see a dark caitlyn going full revenge.
But what we got was just a total mess of character. 0 setup. 0 emotionnal impact (other than the scene when shit hit vi. Probably one of the only scene in s2 where i actually feel some emotions) 0 setup for her redemption. 0 reason to love her in s2. Like wtf she just used maddie like a litteral cumm socket and I'm supposed to hate maddie for that ? No fcking way. I don't like maddy but clearly i hate caitlyn way more than her. And again It was my favorite character in s1 it's crazy to even think that it's the same character.
My only issue was Maddie
I wish she was done differently because I actually liked her
When you consider how fleshed out and multi-layered they made every other character in this show, making Maddie so dirty and disposable feels kinda unfair
She had a lot of potential as a character
She looked up to Vi when we first met her, took Cait's advances without knowing that was being used as a rebound. That could've led to a love triangle subplot, where Cait tries to make things right not only with Vi, but also with Maddie.
They really wasted her.
Buddy there are MUCH worse issues than Maddie. Nobody actually cared about her bad development bcs she was like 10th issue
@@darklord4531I just hate when toxic communities hate someone for no reason
In this case, they hated her even before they had a reason to actually hate her
@RayMcElroy50 i feel like the sex scene shouldve been earlier when Maddie was eavesdropping, would've made a bigger impact for the eventual betrayal but alas
Tbh, it's pretty realistic. Sociopathic people can be very likeable. And my understanding was that Maddie had been working for Ambessa for a while, she was intentionally trying to get to Cait's & Vi's good side.
@@darklord4531 i agree. maddie was symptomatic of a much larger issue with the show lol. she was just the cherry on top.
Yo i'm convinced people be hateing on multivers and timeline plots because of marval.
Them deciding to turn Viktor into a demi-god / avengers level threat really feelt very marvel. Compare that to his source material counterpart that is just a cyborg revolutionary inventor.
Season 1 gets better with every watch.
Season 2 is the opposite.
More and more plot holes become apparent, more gaps or straight up unearned reversals in the character development become apparent, more questions arise to be realised they're never addressed...
"rushed?" - yes it feels rushed. But more than that, season 2 lacks the depth of interplay of character interaction that made season 1 a masterpiece.
Season 2 isn't terrible. But it's absolutely a drop off in quality from season 1 in everything but the animation and presentation.
describe the plot holes quickly! (watch out! dont make it obvious you havent watched the show 😂)
@palemeadows Silco acts like he doesn't know who Vi and Powder are in season 1 but it's revealed that he indeed did know them and had a relationship with their mother. Mel didn't know she was magic despite being covered in expanding gold decal on her skin which was directly linked to her being magic.
Victor goes back in time to give Jayce the hex crystal starting the development of hex tech which he sought to prevent. Maddie tries to advise Cait not to do the thing Ambessa wants her to yet it is revealed she is a traitor plant. That's just the first handful. I could write paragraphs about all the things wrong with the plot progression and the logic of the character's actions in season 2. I say this in full knowledge that season 1 was a masterpiece.
If you don't understand what's wrong with 2 you aren't thinking.
@palemeadows And I've watched the show multiple times. I watched season 1 a lot more tho.
@palemeadowswhy don’t you describe why arcane season 2 is perfect? Your comments are pretty rude.
@palemeadows Instead of insults why dont you argue with valid points.
Never understood the “rushed” complaints, so far I haven’t seen a single description of what is supposedly missing that so desperately needed to be in the series, just vague gesturing at more content which I think boils down to a feeling of failing to understand the series and just wanting more post hoc rationalized as it being the show’s fault and not my engagement with it, in a world where many series are bloated and go on for ages without enough focus.
The only music video I hated was the pit fighter bit cus it totally skips over the actual character arc
I don't see how it skips over it. It happens on screen, it's fast, we don't get dialogue but we have the lyrics to the song.
"I'm at the bottom, it's a long way down (don't slip)"
"I'm on the bend, and it's a long way round (I'm sick)"
"Of who I am and what I'm talking about"
'"Cause no pretty face can save me now"
I don't see how this is skipping her arc, it is literally exploring it through song and the actions on screen. We see things start to go well, she's beating up the same guy from S1 nice call back. Lorris is there good to see what happened to him after he left during Cait's deal with the devil.
The song continues to explore her character arc
"So lock me up, I cannot take it"
"Lock me up, I've already lost"
"Lock me up, I've gone and jinxed it"
"Hold my cocktail molotov"
Her room is cramped like the cell in stillwater, Cait is the one that broke her out and her breakup put her back right back there.
"Kick me 'til I'm cold and weary"
"Stab my heart and hope to die"
"Writing my obituary"
"Might as well just bury me alive"
We see the toll drinking and this life style takes on her. We see her start to lose, Lorris leaves her. And we see Jinx in the crowd, keeping an eye on her.
This over the visuals we get, is the arc, that is Vi going through it. It's different than normal arcs that rely on dialogue, but it still happens, it doesn't get skipped.
I can understand the gripes some have about music videos in the show, it’s like how some people don’t like long cutscenes in video games. Some people like it, some people don’t, and that’s okay.
the problem isn’t the length; it’s the content of the music videos and the frequency of their use. too many important events happen during the montages, and they have at least one in every episode. the problem isn’t that the “cutscenes” exist; it’s that there needs to be more substance outside of them.
@@eebbaa5560It’s how they show the story instead that makes it interesting to me. I don’t know about you, but I did not need a full episode dedicated to Caitlyn and Ambessa taking over Zaun. That would’ve not fit the show at all.
Yeah, and riot should not be afraid exploring some stuff for the show and not go into hollywood-y style of show
I think a lot of the reason people didn’t like the music videos this season is because they fill in for scenes that should’ve been there. For example, the Hellfire music video shows the enforcers gassing the Undercity, but that should’ve also been explained within the actual dialogue or scenes. It’s fine to show plot-points in music videos, but it doesn’t work if they are only shown within the music videos and never followed-up within actual scenes. Another example of this is Vi becoming a pit fighter. We see her pit fighting in the Cocktail Molotov music video, and her appearance changes afterward, but we don’t have any information about it outside of that. This isn’t as big of an issue as with the gassing in Hellfire since it’s a very easy plot-point to understand, but it represents a larger theme present in the season of not explaining things and using music videos as an excuse. However, one example of a place where this is not done is in the music video at the beginning of episode 1 in which we see Caitlyn grieving Cassandra. The plot point is shown for the first time in the song, but is then elaborated on within the actual dialogue. This is how the music videos should be used, and it’s how they were always used in the first season. I think having music videos as a fill-in for plot explanation was a big thing that contributed to the season feeling rushed, and that’s probably why people had issues with them this time around.
I bet we could’ve gotten something beyond what already is an amazing show, and I suppose what understandably sucked was the craving after all the emotional attachment most of us developed for the characters. But well, being able to smoothly accommodate all that was in Season 2 despite several (and possibly important) cuts is a tough job for both animators and script-writers to be real. We all wanted more, and I absolutely love it regardless. So, hats off to the entire fortiche and Riots collaboration for being able to create in my opinion, one of the best series ever made. Really excited about and looking forward to more from them.
I don’t think the season was rushed at all. I think they told a story they wanted to tell exactly how they wanted to tell. They bent and broke some storytelling rules that’s why the show feels off for some people. I, however, would rather take an unconventional story and weird directorial choices over something that was done safe way by the books. I want to see the expression of the authors creativity and this season completely delivered on that. Although, I can’t say I’m a huge fan of the world and characters
My one gripe with s2 is how they toned down the classism struggle by WAY too much. Barely anyone but literally Sevika gives a shit about the poor conditions of the people of Zaun anymore bc Jinx is too depressed, and Vi.. like got broken up with or whatever.
if you went up to people going through a breakup or suicidal feelings, they’re typically not concerned with classism. shocking.
my friend , I may be late to the party, but I feel, even as drunk as I am from NYE celebrations, I can dd wisdom here. And what I wish to add is:
Don't. Feed. the Trolls!!!
just follow this in the year of whoever 2025 and you will be so much happier.
Moloch bless. Happy New year
i mean, a lot of those points made are valid and some are true. You can still like the show, but it doesnt make them less true
a lot of them are petty, cinema sins style issues that either don't matter, are completely wrong or are necessary in order to tell the story. To give a 1 star for these issues is something you can do, art enjoyment is subjective so there is nothing wrong with giving a 1/10 due to these issues, but it's so funny to see these reviews also talk as if they are objectively true in their critique and that is just too funny.
@@Joeda89 i don't agree with giving it 1 star ofc, but these "petty nitpicks" if they keep adding up start harming the story. And quite a few of the problems season 2 has are not small at all.
@@danutghidia5820 if they're anything like "why didn't Cait/Vi tell the undercity about Jinx killing Silco", or "why isn't Jayce part of the council scene with Mel. Schoola and Salo in ep 1", "the music montages are a waste of time", "the wild runes came out of no where" or any "critique" or "complaint" that is answered by looking at S1 then I don't care how many of them there are cause that's just people missing information the show provides. There are a few critiques/issues that the show takes on in order to tell the story in the time restraint while still honoring the characters and keeping themes in tack.
I have a feeling(based videos/reading comments/social media) that when most people list out the problems they have with the show, those will mainly be personal, such as wanting something explored more, wishing we got a scene with X and Y character, sad we didn't get to see character X react to event Y (which is totally valid and if that drops the show down to a 6-7 or lower for you that's all good cause it's properly framed as a personal issue with the show). It's when those personal issues are treated as rules the show is breaking cause the writers are bad (which is usually what happening when people give it a 1/10)
@@danutghidia5820 if they're anything like "why didn't Cait/Vi tell the undercity about Jinx killing Silco", or "why isn't Jayce part of the council scene with Mel. Schoola and Salo in ep 1", "the music montages are a waste of time", "the wild runes came out of no where" or any "critique" or "complaint" that is answered by looking at S1 then I don't care how many of them there are cause that's just people missing information the show provides. There are a few critiques/issues that the show takes on in order to tell the story in the time restraint while still honoring the characters and keeping themes in tack. I have a feeling(based videos/reading comments/social media) that when most people list out the problems they have with the show, those will mainly be personal, such as wanting something explored more, wishing we got a scene with X and Y character, sad we didn't get to see character X react to event Y (which is totally valid and if that drops the show down to a 6-7 or lower for you that's all good cause it's properly framed as a personal issue with the show). It's when those personal issues are treated as rules the show is breaking cause the writers are bad (which is usually what happening when people give it a 1/10)
Loved season 1, I wish season 2 had more episodes so that they could give certain points in the season more time to focus and develop, and I'm not fond of the gif fight scenes, still enjoyed it but it wasn't quite what I was hoping for, but that could just be me loving the first season so much that my excitement was expecting absolute perfection
A lot of people who wrote those reviews are now in the comments
once i saw someone wrote "this show cringer and lame!" like bro idc if you dislike it but don't say it like it's a fact.
I absolutely loved Arcane it was a masterpiece with a few missing pieces. I just wish they added a little more to the characters I just feel like there's some stuff missing and questions not answered.
I don't think season two was trash, but I find myself agreeing with the critiques made by people who do. I am convinced the motive to open up new stories rather than close out the existing ones is the root of all of the problems with season two. We still got a good story, but a great story was left on the table.
I'm interested to know what stores were left open. I didn't see s2 open new stories, as much as continue ones that were already started in S1.
@@Joeda89 Laurice, Maddie, and the green guy should have been cut. Sello's arch went nowhere, so he should have jsut died in the rocket blast. Mel should have died as well and the Black Rose stuff could have been cut since Mel spent most of her time in a pit anyway. Jayce, Ekko, and Heimerdinger should have been in the story the whole way through instead of having their characters given a time out for three episodes only to introduce a multiverse.
That would have given us more time for Jayce to come around to the problems of hextech under the influence of Heimerdinger and Ekko while being tempted by Ambessa to make weapons to avenge Mel's death.
@@anthonysabatino4317 oh boy, alot to cover here. I agree with some of these points more so than others. For most I don't see them as new things in S2, but continuations of pots set up in S1.
1. Maddie, Laurice, Steb. While they didn't get much time they are pretty important as literary devices. The one that really really can't be cut is Maddie, she is way too important to the plot, Ambessa and Cait. Laurice's importance is his connection to Vi, the start of ep 5 Vi pushing him away showing us how bad it's getting for her and his return in act 3 to man the gun, the most dangerous and open position letting him be a shield one last time. I think it's clear that scenes with them were cut but removing them completely would cause more problems than it solves and would require re-writing act 1 entirely. I agree that Laurice and Steb were probably my two biggest disappointments in the series. Maddie was brilliant and part of Ambessa's story which was started in S1.
2. Salo has a very important role to play to Victor's story which was started in S1. He's not going through an arc(kinda) but he is used to signal that something isn't right with Victor's(Sky's) commune. Why would Salo, the most selfish, egotistical, vain council member run errands for people in the undercity? When we see the commune through Vander and Husk, we don't question it, Husk becoming a follower tracks and Vander is in such a bad state that anything Victor does to him is an improvement, but Salo is wealthy, Salo is prideful. What did Victor do to him that made him an errand boy? That's why Salo can't die in the explosion. That and Ambessa was suppose to prop him up in act 1. Ambessa choosing Cait over Salo shows us that she is taking a risk, one that seems like it pays off but eventually backfires. It doesn't necessarily need to be Salo that survives, but his vanity and pride are important so he isn't easily replaced narratively with other council member.
3 This is a very weird take. Mel's story was no where close to being done. Her death would make no sense in the explosion. It would be so weird to set up the tyranny of mages like S1 does and just not pay it off at all in S2. Mages kidnap one of the most powerful members of society from her home. That shit is terrifying. A pillar of Piltover, the city to escape mages, was a mage. That's too good to just kill her off. The way we get to see actual mages use the arcane, the way that is shown to be deceitful, tricking their eyes and the parallels back to Victor's commune, the way everyone seems happy and perfect, the way the hextech from Jayce made Piltover look beautiful while hiding horrors of the undercity and the corruption of the wild rune.
If Mel dies so does Jayce and Víctor, so I guess just don't have them in S2? Her using Ambessa as bait to lure out the black rose and see the face of Leblanc, the final fight with Ambessa against Cait and Mel, surrounded on 3 sides (Vision MIght Guile, ) and the only open side is through Ambess (sacrifice) AHHHHHH, that fight was too good.
Mel adds so much to the story It's really hard for me to even toy with the notion of killing her off in the explosion.
4 " Jayce, Ekko, and Heimerdinger should have been in the story the whole way through instead of having their characters given a time out for three episodes only to introduce a multiverse."
Jayce would be dead if mel dies in the explosion, so I guess Mel shouldn't die. I agree that this story beat happens too fast. An episode's worth of time, either a few minutes extra per episode or one more episode at the end of Act 2 or beginning of Act 3 would go a long way to making this feel better. That said I really like what we got from the story itself. The price for commodifying a wild force like magic to ship noxian wine across the world. Paying off Heimerdinger's warnings in S1(similar to how S2 pays off Vander's philosophy compared to Silco in S1 ) and completing Heimerdinger's arc. The other world in ep 7 is indescribably important to Ekko, and the story as a whole, it's how Victor ultimately wins.
Structure wise their absence is very important. Ekko and Jayce's absence is 100% needed for Cait to go along with anything Ambessa brings up. I would have liked to see more of Jayce and Ekko's interactions when they return though. Sadly no time, I hear they are working on something and that Ekko's story isn't over so hopefully we get those interactions in the future.
The only new story from these is Laurice and Stebb, but those aren't new stories so much as devices to aid the main characters in their arcs. I don't think Ekko Jayc Heimer do a new story, they continue the one set up in S1, the dangers of hextech. If your talking about the introduction of Wild Runes, is that really a new story. Is it not just the old story of the dangers of unchecked progress that we get in S1? I can see the black rose being seen as a new story beat for Mel and Ambesaa, but it's not really new it's the payoff from the S1 story. We can't just leave that unanswered.
At the end, none of these things I typed may impact the way you look at the show, especially if there was something missing from the story that you really wanted to see
@@Joeda89 I was thinking Jayce's hammer could have protected him from the blast, kind of like how Vi's gauntlets protected her from Sevika in the bar fight.
The reason I thought Mel should have died is that it would have set Jayce and Ambessa down a revenge arch together which would have more acutely alienated Victor, sending him into Singed's influence, and instead of a commune, Victor just wants to counter Piltover and becomes a weapon for that purpose.
Hiemerdinger and Ekko could have been trying to talk sense into Jayce about the construction of Hextech weapons, and perhaps do something to save the firelights from the insane police brutality which could have been even worse than we got to see.
I think Caitlyn should have been a voice of forgiveness given her season one arch to counter Ambessa's vengeful influence on Jayce.
I also would have loved to see more of Warwick killing things than we got. Someone made a good point that he could have been used to force people together because he is triggered by blood, so fighting and spilling blood would get everyone killed because he is so overpowered.
Maybe that is how Jinx and Vi team up and then they find out Warwick is Vander.
Perhaps Sevika and Vi have to work together because of Warwick and Jinx. Perhaps escaping Warwick is what lets Sevika forgive Jinx for killing Silco. There are some things that could have been done in that vein I think.
Overall, I am not hateful over season two like some people are. I just think there were things which were rushed when a few cuts could have fleshed out some more gradual changes, allowed room for drama which we didn't get let alone get resolved, and didn't change some of the characters in ways that seemed questionable given the time we had to see those changes. For example, I don't think Vi would have been conflicted about using the Gray. I think she would have outright refused to go along with that. It seemed a little hard to believe.
@@anthonysabatino4317 Honestly that sounds like great material for a fanfic. Throw in a scene before the Jinx rocket with Ambessa meeting Silco, maybe she tries to kill the peace deal put in a line about her hearing this from an enforcer contact and I'm sold. It wouldn't deliver on the S1 themes and character setups as much but it would still be an interesting read. I do feel a bit weird about Mel dying, that's a bit too close to fridging, it isn't fridging since it's the consequence of her actions but I think there was too much setup in S1 with her to not pay it off, that and Ambessa's music video.
OH oh this as one of the alternate timelines would be so cool actually. Then you can draw so many connections between this story and the original. LIke Jayce hammer in the main story and in game don't have shielding abilities, they have acceleration, but in a world where Victor gave Jayce a shielding rune then you can ask how would that affect what he builds, how would that affect what the Hexgates do, how can you relate the aspect of shielding to Jayce now seeking revenge. How does that compare to the acceleration rune and the price of progress from the main story. That would be a very compelling read.
I get if peopled loved the plot of season 1 so much that they just want more of that. Season 2 was something different. At first I thought it was a little weird, but once I was able to get out of my own way and see season 2 for what it was (which was not the same as season 1), I could see that it was at least as good as season 1, just for different reasons.
No, it's really not. I even like the plot of season 2 more. I like the music segments. I like mostly all of where each character's arc leads to. The problem is in its quality. It is not at least as good as season 1.
It has new reasons for me to like it, yet next to nothing of what made season 1 great is present. Almost anything subjective that there is to like, I like season 2 more. But anything objective, it has so many flaws.
Episode 6, IMDB 9.8/10. Almost every scene is so badly written. It's just worse than season 1 whether you or I or anyone likes it more or less.
They closed the writers room, reduced the writers, worked from home because of covid and it shows.
I personally hate the "just didn't get what they wanted" argument, because from a story or plot perspective, I got a whole lot of what I wanted. From a storytelling perspective, I just wanted it to be good. It didn't need to be great or exceptional like season 1.
@@alicea3421 What are the problems with ep 6?
@@alicea3421 This was badly written by you. But I still get it and in a way I can appreciate the beautiful mess of it. Art and expression is like that, there's beauty in imperfections.
@@mrglassscience Yes, I agree it was badly written by me.
Art is objective. I made multiple objective flaws, but you didn't name any. Yet, for all I know, your idea of bad is not the same as mine.
Is it too vague? Did I not cover any flaws of the show itself? Did I reiterate too often with little expansion?
The idea was to prove an exception.
It was written through frustration out of distaste for that particular argument.
Was I drunk? Was I awake for 48 hours? Was I otherwise occupied? Was I unwell? Who cares? It's a terrible piece of writing.
Even if we like or agree with what I was conveying, my storytelling was very flawed.
@@Joeda89 I haven't had time to rewatch it today, and I want to respond with more depth than I'm currently capable of.
Just to let you know that I'm not ignoring your question.
i don’t think the show was bad by any means, but people seriously need to stop coping. arcane season 2 had real, serious flaws that probably wouldn’t have been excused if people didn’t like season 1 so much. season 2 was fine overall, but for every high high, there were some very low lows.
like what? besides an unnecessary sex scene that made no real sense thematically what else was wrong with it?
@@OGTwist How does nobody in Zaun find out Jinx killed Silco, that information seems like it would change some of their behavior towards Jinx?
Why does the Hex core/gate/thing send Jayce forward in time instead of an alternate universe like it does Ekko & Heimerdinger?
If Victor can read minds why doesn't Jayce simply walk up to him and say "Hey I've been to the future, your current plan will destroy the world unless you stop. Read my mind if you don't believe me" instead of straight up shooting him with a Hextek hammer?
Why would Ambessa want her warriors converted into Arcane robots when doing so would mean they are controlled by Victor and not her. Like they don't die but Victor has mind control over them so inevitably she would either end up a puppet answering to Victor being assimilate by him too?
Maybe I missed or didn't understand somethings, but all that being said the sex scene was fantastic.
I'm very much of the opinion that people loved it as much as they did because of the music and the animation. Those two things carried this season where the writing very much faltered
@@stuartjsa139 1. Answered this one above. Jinx killing Silco wouldn't be important to anyone other than Sevika, if your going to explore Jinx as a symbol of good for Zaun Sevika would be fine with her killing Silco
2. He has the acceleration rune on his person.
edit: didnt see the other 2
3. He doesn't know victor can read minds. He just knows he needs to stop him
4. She doesn't know his plan is to forcefully evolve everyone. Victor says he will evolve all those willing. Symbolically she just lost her Rictus( the one who protects her from magic) and Cait(the noxian principal of vision) so her not seeing through Victor's guile makes sense.
@@OGTwist ambessa is against magic because "everyone in a battlefield is equal" but want to convert her soldiers into mutant unkillable pupets by magic, jinx went from a completly schizophrenic to a caring sister in 10 mins, caitlyn went from the wholesome and positive character to an abusive dictator and all the way back in 10 mins, both of the fixed their relationships with vi in half episode, Vi had less time on screen than smeech.
Personally the second season had a lot more plot points going on and some things felt rushed. Mainly because arcane was going to be 5 seasons long but was cut to 2 some things are flawed but i still liked the second season.
3:20 it's to tell stories . More show don't tell and it works
5:58 ok i can understand that but the music lyrics are to tell how the characters feel in the moment like the song "wasteland"
7:12 it's a war . A lot of people will die but yea....main characters not dying is 90% of shows because you can't kill the main characters (is it plot armor? Yes)
9:14 excuse me? Have you seen Jinx after isha died? Or Caitlyn after her mom died? Those deaths meant something
I loved Arcane! And the music videos were the best part. How can people not like them? The music in season 2 was amazing!
The time travel and multiverse stuff was a bit confusing but I just rolled with it and I understood it by the end of the episode.
And Isha's death was the saddest death ever. I only cried more at the end of the season.
Lost definitely had a time jump thing that was really annoying. Also at the end of lost * (SPOILER) * it’s left up to the watcher but it seems like the entire show “never happened” or the crew was “unalived the enter time” so that person was wayyy off.
I really liked arcanes multiverse episodes! Those were my favorite.
I wish S2 had a bit more of Jinx and Ekko getting together and making the blimp out of Jinx's home, and I think the three timeline thing was a little convoluted, but still, that's just wishing for more Arcane. Still 10/10.
"An entire season of 9 or above." It sweet me bruh
2:33 it's very valid point
"AS SOON AS TGET GET TO A FIGHT SCENE THERES MUSIC AND ART"
WHST IS THIS GUY ON, WHAT DOES HE WANT A SCENE WITH THE CHARACTERS GRUNTING AS THEY GET HIT, THEIR SHOES SQEEKING ON TGE FLOOR L, JUST A REALY AWKWARD SCENE
I'm like 90% sure the majority of the 1 star reviews are just paroting their favorite podcast. The reviews sound like they are reading off a script/checklist. Having issues with pacing, how themes are explored, and even not enjoying the music make sense for docking the show points, but giving the show 1-2 stars for pacing is hilarious.
Yeah like, I understand that some people don’t like season 2, but giving it a 1/10? Surely they must have a good reason since they thought EVERYTHING was bad, even the animation.
I don’t really understand 1 star reviews in general
How did people in Zaun not figure out that Jinx killed Silco? Like it seems odd that Caitlyn and Vi would cover that up, and that it would change the way a lot of the people in Zaun(especially Sevika) would act towards Jinx?
@@stuartjsa139 This assumes the people in piltover have any contacts in Zaun. Mel proposing a reward doesn't require contacts just putting up wanted posters which enforcers can do. I would have loved to seen that explored. I would love more scenes with Sevika, but there was no time for a plot thread that would ultimately go nowhere. S1 got the luxury of ending with the Jinx Rocket, that meant it had much more time to fill. That ending while iconic means that S2 must go faster. S2 doesn't have the time to explore this through a full on narrative.
Silco was not the savior of Zaun. He wasn't a beloved name or a folk hero, that's Vander. Silco barely held on to power thanks to Sevika, and she didn't keep Silco in power out of loyalty but because Finn wasn't any better. Sevika chose Zaun of Vander and would certainly choose Zaun over Silco. The info that Jinx killed Silco would honestly make Jinx more popular. The only time Sevika would care that Jinx killed Silco, enough to not follow her, would be some time before ep 3. In ep 3, Jinx clears the Gray and sends it back to Piltover, from this point on Sevika is loyal to Jinx and any news about her killing Silco would be pointless. She would probably laugh at the idiot for getting sentimental before trying to convince Jinxe to step up. Would I want this scene? Oh absolutely that would be great, but S2 doesn't have time for it. Especially cause this plot thread is not necessary, once Jinx clears the gray she has Sevika and Zaun's favor so if a plot thread about Sevika learning that Jinx killed silco would just lead to the same place then it really doesn't need to be in the show. It would be nice but not necessary and S2 can't afford plot threads that aren't necessary.
Edit: I didn't even bring up Jinx just blew up the Piltover council. Do you really think Sevika is gona turn on her. I take back what I said earlier, there was never a point where Sevika learning about Jinx killing Silco would have done anything other than make Sevika hound Jinx to rally Zaun, which she is doing in act 2.
@ Never looked into it and why would they say it? It’s not like Undercity liked Silco very much.
@@V1ctorTrophies It's funny you see it from people that really liked Silco, and I mean really liked him as in the "Silco did nothing wrong" crowd. Like did they forget Silco was hunting the youth's Zaun via the Chief of Police he had on payroll. The guy has the cops in his pocket and uses them so smuggle drugs and hunt down his own people. The only reason Savika didn't betray him was cause Silco was better than Finn, a low bar. Even the sovereignty was given to him cause Jayce killed one of his child workers and felt bad. Silco wasn't good for the undercity, he was the only option after he killed the other one.
Edit: There's a Statue of Vander and not Silco for a reason.
Season 1 was one of my favourite seasons in Television history, Season 2 on the other hand was much weaker with characters making somewhat illogical decisions(Tho I still liked it)
Most of the people complaining about the season 2 can be resumed as -> Lacking media literacy / comprehension issues / "it wasn't like I wanted, so it's bad"
I didn’t like that one scene, but I loved everything else.
Half of these are just people who didn't like the style, which I guess is fair. We can't all like the same thing, but the others just lack basic media comprehension 😭
It feels like they're complaining that Arcane is too realistic instead of being like any usual movie. For example, the guy that said "Nobody found out that Jinx killed Silco! Why do they follow Jinx?!" is basically telling us that they didn't watch or didn't actually pay attention to the series at all. Half of Jinx's arc this season is becoming a hero and how unexpected and out of place it feels, because that's how it's supposed to be. And about the Silco thing, yeah, she's not going to let people find out. Imagine being loyal to Vander, only to switch to Silco, only to find out he died so now you follow Jinx and THEN you find out that it was Jinx who killed Silco and she's bot the perfect hero you think. Of course no one's going to let that message spread. Even Sevika who despised Jinx allies with her because she sees Jinx's potential for uniting Zaun. She probably wouldn't even care or be that surprised if she found out Jinx was the one who murdered Silco.
That and many of these reviews just tell me that they didn't actually take time to think about the plot at all
I do think season 2 was way to packed and needed more time to fully flesh out all the different plots. Season one was perfectly balanced, paced, and dark and gritty. Season two waaaaas a bit more out there. When there was a monster, or some magic drug, the show took time to build it up, to show its progression. But season to just does things, like things just happen.
Idk I just wish they gave themselves more time to flesh out the plots. Again loved season 2, it was almost pretty much a 10 outta 10 in my book, but I don’t think it topped season one. I think if they did just one more season and took the time to build up to stuff like the Ross, the arcane, the multiverse, and the beast, it would have just felt more believable? Idk I do also think there where either to many music videos, or they used music videos in replacement of actual interesting conflict and fleshed out scenes. Not to say the music videos weren’t interested, and awesome. But idk when season one had a music video it felt like a big deal and oh damn somethin crazy or emotional going down. Season two just had a music video for everything I feel
People giving Season 1 a perfect score while criticizing Season 2 is wild. All of season 2 problems are rooted from Season 1. Too many characters... Side characters with main character energies.
No
No. The characters not discussing Silco's death in season 2 is not a fault of season 1. Season 2 wasting 15-20 minutes on this rhoided rat that leads to nowhere and nobody asked for is not a fault of season 1. Season 2 introducing the black rose convoluted plot without actually resolving or explaining anything is not a fault of season 1. Season 2 butchering Vi's character is not a fault of season 1. Season 2 finale turning into an avengers style battle against space jesus is not a fault of season 1.
if they didn't want to continue after season 2 and found they had "too many" characters, they could have done the sensible thing and focused on the storyline that most people were interested in and that made season 1 so good: The story between Vi and Jinx (and maybe Cait). The political meddling wasn't nearly as good nor original and I find it baffling that they chose to do that over more Vi+Jinx+Vander
@@thomasmann4536Vi and Jinx worship is over proportional,i glad that in the second season at least more interesting characters took the charts over those 2 overdramatic sisters.
S2 was rushed and its pretty fucking sad. All they needed to do is continue the plot they were building from entire S1 but they didnt. They didnt even flied that high but still landed pretty hard. Including Noxus in this show was a pretty bad mistake and you can see the results in S2, taking up half of the screentime for nothing. And now theyre sayin next show is going to be about Noxus, like wtf, i wont be surprised if they will include Ionia or Demacia in that show giving them half of the screentime too. Charatcer developments were bad, like pretty bad and cheap. It felt like watching Pixar movie from 2000s, ik Pixar movies slaps but we loved Arcane S1 not bcs of that. Animation and Music also slaps in S2 but the parts like "paint the town blue" was horrible bcs it wasnt supposed to be shown like that. Also the ending was pretty bad and cheap way to conclude the show. They literally did The Walking Dead special in last epsidoes and killed characters for no reason. Im not even going to talk about pacing problem its just makes me cry. S2 didnt felt like same show and its clear that Riot intervined and changed the plot. If they just made Medarda fly away to noxus and focus on piltover and zaun it would be enough to make S2 perfect. But with this concept they needed S3 and they didnt make it. Sad, just sad.
Yeah these reviews are valid though. The lore was so much better and Arcane ruined it for me in a way. The character development in some of the lore just had value that I think goes over arcane fans heads.
Finally someone saying the quiet part out loud.
I agree. Thing is, there's a chance that I could've stomached the lore changes a lot better if they didn't rush the bloody story as much as they did
The 1/10 is way over the top. It’s at worst a 5 or 6.
League lore was "good" for video game lore. Arcane fixed it.
The only people who even knew jinx killed silco (who were alive) were vi, jinx, and caitlyn.
To be honest, I felt the same way about season 2 the first time round. It was much better the second time round, and even now on the fourth, I keep discovering new things.
And yes. The CaitVi scene also irritated me a bit, because it doesn't fit in with the tone of the rest of the film at all. Some of my homosexual friends say the same thing. My best friend is bi and also found that rather... strange. And when I think that this scene should have been much longer... doesn't fit in with the rest at all. It seems clumsy.
Apart from that, both seasons are masterful, but it would indeed have been better to invest the extra million to give the second season a little more space.
"music bad" aaand opinion invalid.
Not pieces of content homie that's Art
I tried to defend Maddie's VA on Twitter, but I'm too weak because haters did anything to me like stupid. So I DM them to give my address and take my life for defending her because toxic people are doing toxic things.
this season only has one issue in my opinion......pacing....so much in between scenes needed this season to make it a better paced show...but even with the issues its still my favorite show.
These reviews are somewhat missing the mark of what actually was wrong with season 3 so I’ll give a few examples of what actually went wrong.
#1 Victor being the mage that saved Jayce, if you give it a little thought it makes no sense! In order for hextech to exist “victor” has to inspire Jayce by saving him with magic, so don’t give Jayce the gem and how did the first “glorious evaluation” come about? And on top of that Jayce shooting Victor was the reason why he decided to evolve, Victor gave no indication of wanting to take everyone’s freedom away so why send Jayce away to start it instead of blasting him just show him what you did in the ending of the season.
#2 VI and Caitlin, VI had no business having that prison scene with Caitlin, her sister was going to commit self unalive and she decided to make out instead of trying to find her in case it was too late? On top of that Caitlin PHYSICALLY and emotionally abused VI and became a dictator hurting the people of the Zaun with no apology given.
#3 On the subject of Caitlin no one ever made her account for her actions, apart from VI in that 1 minute scene where all she said was “I know” like girl be accountable say you regret it something
#4 Sevika being on the council does nothing for Zaun, we are supposed to look at this as Zaun finally being seen as an equal but Sevika is outnumbered she will be out voted in anything that she could vote for when it comes to any decisions for the betterment of Zaun, and by the way they looked at her she isn’t welcome among them so that just proves that she will be out voted on most things
And a couple honorable mentions, Ambessa’s motives change throughout the show, the black rose subplot and there questionable methods to get Mel on their side, Jinx’s death being the most avoidable thing ever and it did nothing for VI’s character development which was pretty bad and nonexistent throughout the show, and the whole Zaun vs Piltover being totally sidelined whilst it was the whole set up in season 1 and honestly there is plenty more, I’m not saying season 2 didn’t have good moments there are some beautiful moments and scenes that I loved and enjoyed but as a whole season 2 missed the mark and it is sad we waited so long for the conclusion of the story of characters we all loved for it to be this badly executed, which is why I think so many people are high on copeium not wanting to face the reality. The writing team can say the planned this ending from the beginning but they ain’t fooling me there is no way they had this ending in mind while writing season 1.
1. That's just the nature of time travel stories, does this mean the story isn't clean yeah. Should you avoid these loop style stories, no I loved this reveal. I don't crea how non logical it is especially when the source of this is magic. I like the idea that the void is planting the hexcore idea into Victor as a way to reach that dreamless emptiness it craves, and Victor trying to undo that through the time loop is compelling enough to justify the logical issues with time loops. That said I get why people hate these kinds of stories and don't begrudge anyone for really not liking this. I still love the movie Your Name
2 I think we are using hindsight to assume that Vi knew Jinx was suicidal. I've watched several reactions to this that are surprised when the start of ep 9 has Jinx's suicide. it's not unbelievable that Vi thought Jinx just escaped and was planning to flee the city. She says as much at the start of that scene
Vi: "I really believed she'd help. Say it. You told me so. I was an idiot to trust her I went behind your back"
She doesn't know Jinx is suicidal, we do, we the audience know and yeah that makes it awkward, but knowing that Ekko is going to be there it doesn't make sense writing wise to have Cait and Vi running out to look for her. Especially when this is Cait's apology.
3 Just incorrect. She apologizes to Vi by letting her free jinx, she pays for her flirt with fascism by losing her eye, several enforcers die during the attack, and Maddie betrays her. Then she also gives up her families council seat to Sevika (yes it is the one Catherine would sit in). Caitlyn was not executing people in the streets, she was not a butcher. She overstepped authority after a week of attacks from Zaun. 6 officers killed, the hex crystal stolen, the chief of police and more enforcers killed on the bridge, the rocket hitting the council and the attack during the memorial. If Salo was in charge there would be bodies cause he would have let Ambessa do whatever she wanted.
4. Sevika getting the Kiraman council seat is goated. Ep 7, we saw the goal, we saw heaven working towards that is the point of the show. Sevika on the council is better for Zaun than independent Zaun with Silco in charge. She won't be outvoted, she has the only surviving member of the original council (Shoola) backing her. You think them holding the memorial on the bridge was just coincidence and the scene where Sevika takes her seat its Shoola and Sevika looking at the council together. Saying she would be outvoted is like saying Mel would be outvoted.
hitting those honorable mentions
*Ambessa motives never change, they are consistent through the whole show. She wants hextech to take out the rose, she's doing this for her family. When that isn't an option and she lost Rictus/Cait she takes a risk by trusting Victor. Nothing is weird here.
*mages were set up in S1, paying that off by making Mel a mage (a pillar of Piltover, the city to escape magic, being a mage is too good) The black rose shows how terrifying mages are. They just straight up kidnap mel, like yeah that shit is scary. Mel using Ambessa to get to the black rose to see the face of the deceiver, mmmm YES that's the wolf shit
*Jinx's death is set up all through S2, Isha gives her a reason to live, is that force of order in her otherwise chaotic life. When she lost Isha, she was ready to die again (the first time was in S2 ep 3) Ekko saves her, now she is looking to build something new for someone. That's the key. She dies for Vi, just like Isha died for her. She breaks Vi from the burden Vander gave her in S1 ep3 that has defined Vi's entire life. Schnee's video on this is really great.
@ Before I get started, I would like to disclose I am a writer and study writing on the side I love creating stories and finding new ways to make them better and complex , I’m not claiming to be a better writer then riots team but it gives me experience with that field and a bit of insight which leads me to
1 There are plenty of ways to make time travel not messy, and the fact that the writers have such a messy vague story when it comes to Victor being the mage in a show with a 250,000,000 dollar budget is actually really bad, this is the pinnacle of the show supposedly you should be in awe of the reveal and feel like the connection they made makes sense not be left wondering, and while I agree having some wonder left in a story is good but not in the sense it’s so hard to wrap your head around it begins to feel like they just said hey this would be cool and didn’t jump through any of the hoops to make sure it makes sense. Victor should have never gave Jayce the ruin if his goal was to keep the “glorious evaluation” from happening, why save young Jayce as well if they both die in the end anyway let them die in the beginning and yeah it’s a morbid take but you have to ask yourself why he didn’t do that or anything else, just the presents of the episode 7 timeline should have been enough for Vicktor to call it good? why try so hard on this timeline? I don’t care that anyone enjoys it I envy that people can over look the problems and enjoy it.
#2 THIS is they only argument that gets under my skin nothing against you personally but I’ve heard this take way to many times to the point it gets sad, there is no hindsight, as a sibling I would know IMMEDIATELY what this means, maybe it’s because I always assume the worst but I don’t think that’s the case, Jinx just lost everything, Isha, Vander and her self described second chance on things, Vi knows this and why would VI ask scared might I add “What are you going to do?” It’s because she has no business assuming Jinx somehow “betrayed” her and that throw away line saying she somehow did was to justify her and Caitlin having sex in a cell Jinx was just wasting away in, and saying Ekko being there makes it better no, no it does not, VI just lost Vander she should not be in the mood anyway might I add
#3 Sooo she let her free her sister is enough to make up for an emotional and physically abusive relationship???! I think that shines a bad light a little, would you tell someone you know in abusive relationship to settle for that sorry excuse for an “apology” and I’d like to disclose I NEVER said Caitlin didn’t pay for her actions, I said she never was made to account for them and never apologized for anything, we don’t know if she was executing people, we do know she stood and watched while innocent Zaunites where getting beaten and wrongly imprisoned and she released the grey which is a deadly poisonous gas that can cause permanent damage, and almost shot VI and Isha, point is if she apologizes it happens off screen which unfortunately happens way to often this season, I would have liked to hear what she said to sevika while giving her a seat since their last interactions was less then friendly, yeah maybe salo would have been worse but that doesn’t excuse Caitlin’s actions
#4 Sevika getting a seat is not enough for the betterment of Zaun as “goated” as it is even if Shoola is on her side that makes it 2-5/6. They looked a sevika with disgust they aren’t reaching that heaven anytime soon. Shoola dose not have the same kind of power Mel did, Mel is a Madarda and she dealt in shifty things and mind games to bend the councils votes. No hate on Mel but she should have had some character development in that department as well as a little add on to the other things I’ve mentioned
Ambessa went from trying to get hextech weapons to trusting victor for what an army? It was pretty stupid for her to trust him, and she would have just became one of the evolved, as someone who was built up as being so cunning this makes no sense for her character
lol Mel could have doomed everyone calling the black rose to piltover like she did, she just learned she has powers and somehow she knows she is powerfull enough to stop a witch that has her mother on the run, she never learned anything from waiting to defeat the black rose she never showed her “true face”, and in turn she got her mother killed and then got all sad about it
Jinx’s death I agree there is set up for it, I said it was avoidable but it’s also a little counterproductive, and Jinx didn’t free VI of anything, VI lost Jinx because she couldn’t let go it would have been more impactful for VI to reach the point where she was strong enough to move on herself. If they were set on having Jinx die for VI it could have gone better routes something that felt impactful not avoidable because it was. Again this is just the tip of the iceberg there is plenty more wrong with this season, I was scared how excited I was for season 2 because it’s no secret that entertainment has been lackluster lately, Nothing will amount to the disappointment I felt when the credits rolled for the last time and the emptiness that I felt it was awful, I let myself get so excited for season 2 and riot threw us this, I tried to like it but I would always end up in that same empty disappointment, and I’m not the only one so it has to make you think a little bit that all these people are coming to the same conclusion, there has to be something in you that realizes that there is some truth behind everyone’s disappointment.
@@Alifer2002 Thank you for the reply, of all the complaint comments so far, this one was the most interesting to think about.
1. Yeah but several great time travel stories are messy, Back to the future movies, Terminator, Your Name. Logically none of those make sense but it doesn't matter. I feel the same way with Victor/Jayce. Thematically, Victor realizing that that by ending conflict (removing the cycle) he is doomed to emptiness, the implication that this is all the void's plan, and the way he frees himself/everyone else is to create a loop of conflict until Ekko and Jayce are able to break it. That to me is worth the messy aspect. Would a scene where Victor evolves without Jayce fix it? No not really, I don't see an easy fix. It's that kind of really tough choice of do we go with what thematically gives the biggest payoff, Victor/Jayce Loop or make something that would fit more logically, Make it Ryze or change Jayce's origin. I could see a scene where Jayce's origin is different, maybe in timeline 0 Jayce was interested in Magic but never obsessed, but then you lose Jayce experiencing fast travel and how that was the inspiration for the hexgates. I don't begrudge anyone for not liking this part. I just like what it does thematically enough to really not care about logic problems regarding magic fueled time travel.
2. A critique that really gets under my skin, is "the character heard someone say X so they should have done Y" I hear that constantly, from cinema sins style channels and it feels so wrong. If we cut the line jinx gives Vi after she locks Vi in the cell, then sure now logically Vi wouldn't be worries about Jinx buut we the audience lose out on JInx's head space. It would lose thematic connection between Jinx and Victor. That isn't worth it to me. Then if we decide ok Vi hears that and should go rush after JInx. Well considering we are about to have Ekko be the boy savior, what should we just have Vi running around the underground looking for Jinx? Do you want Vi to save her instead of Ekko? If Ekko saves her do you want a scene where Vi stumbles on them? That would then require several more scenes to not feel weird and there isn't time.
The sex scene itself, echoing the way Vi and Cait met, Cait giving Vi more than an apology but reassuring that no you dumb dumb you didn't choose wrong. Cait showing Vi without words that she has changed and it is thanks to Vi. It does a lot with not much time.
3 Yeah. It's not just this, her helping Vi in ep 6 was the start and this was the payoff. The real life comparison to abusive relationship is unreasonable. This is a tv show with limited time and every second takes 10's of hours to create. Actions speak louder than words, Cait helping Vi in ep 6 and then letting Vi release Jinx are more than enough in a STORY to be an apology. In real life, probably not but it's not real life.
You want a scene where Cait gets a dressing down from Ekko, I know we all want that and it probably exists on a hard drive in Fortiche somewhere. With how much Cait pays, and she pays a lot, for her actions the dressing down is one of the first things that should be cut.
Cait doesn't know how innocent the JInxer are. They are openly supporting a terrorist, a mass murderer, and even then she makes Ambessa explain her actions.
" we don’t know if she was executing people" we know she wasn't. If they were executing people Sevika would have mentioned it at the Vander Statue, there would be names/martyrs. Sevika lists cait's crimes. "Enforcers raiding our homes, Noxians down our throats, Innocent carted off to stillwater" We know still water isn't using the deep cells that Vi was held in during S1 cause Cait shut them down.
Cait was never this evil in waiting hiding behind privilege that so many people wanted her to be. Her characterisation in S1 told us that but people wanted her to go evil cause they saw privileged pilty and wanted her to justify the notion that Piltover needs to burn for zaun to be free.
The use of the gray was probably the worst things she did, but it wasn't some kind of diabolic move. It isn't deadly like chlorine or bio weapon gasses, Smeech's accountant was hanging in it for an untold length of time. It most certainly is deadly with prolong exposure, if only Cait had some way of removing it once their mission was done.
4. It is. It's their spin of the wheel. It's not a happy "all problems in Zaun are fixed and now Piltover and Zaun are friends." It's the path to resolution is long and bumpy, this is a step along that path. Anything you can say about why it won't work is speculation which is the point the potential of the future is more important than focusing on the perfect one. Shoola is the last surviving member of the original council, there is no reason to think that along with Zaun saving piltover wouldn't earn them more sway. The framing of the scene gives it away. There are only 2 council members in that scene that are framed to oppose Sevika and School the rest of the council members are not framed to be antagonistic. Thinking that "oh the council won't work with Sevika" is just hating on the show for not giving you what you wanted instead of seeing what the show is presenting.
Mel did have that character development. She used Ambessa to draw out the black rose, just like she used Jayce to remove Heimerdinger, but this time it wasn't subconscious this time it was intentional. Her being an empath and able to manipulate people to do what she wants, even if she isn't honest about what she wants with herself, added so much to her S1 scenes.
When Ambessa makes the deal with Victor, she had lost two very important things. She lost Rictus, her literal and symbolic guard against magic, and she lost Cait, the Vision. Her believing Victor when he says he will evolve all those willing makes perfect sense here. It fits thematically, it ties in with noxian ideals and it shows how desperate she is. The specifics of how the deal works isn't important, we don't need a scene of her asking a bunch of questions that shit would be trash.
" she never learned anything from waiting to defeat the black rose she never showed her “true face”" Mel literally says "I see your face deceiver" when the black rose has her mother. That is her using ambessa as bait, that's the wolf. This fight scene as a whole is outstanding, I can gush over all the details in that fight but this comment is too long already, and this from Mel is one of the most satisfying ends to a character arc I can think of. She's an empath, its safe to say she garnered something from the black rose that gave her insight, she knew the black rose wanted to end Ambessa and used that to get to their head, she knows Leblancs face now.
They way they have enough themes for Jinx and her death that you the viewer can choose which you prefer is honestly really impressive. Jinx finally able to die as a good Sister, not a force of destruction or chaos or even the identity of Jinx that lead to Isha's death but in an act of love for her sister, or Jinx escaping the blast putting her father to rest(the lyrics from The LIne hitting hard) and living to build something new thanks to Isha and Ekko. The fact that both of these situations are thematically supported and can work is fascinating. That's more than enough for me to overlook anything regarding the setup of the scene.
I don't disagree, people's expectations for what S2 would be absolutely ruined the show for them. But that is on them. I was hoping we would get a great fight scene between Ambessa and Vander/Warrick and have some great payoffs to the champion of the wolf and sacrifice symbolism in the show. I also thought this would be a great way to finally show a champion, Ambessa, can die in the show. What I got wasn't that, instead I got a tsunami of thematic parallels that have kept me coming back to the show. Everything else I watch seems almost hollow now compared to what Arcane managed to do with it's characters. Then I started looking into the lyrics of the music and that lead to whole other iceberg. Two sides of the same coin, sacrifice, identity, and the cycle of violence. Exploring s1 and 2 through these themes puts a new light on every character interaction. Sure Jinx and Cait are super obvious foils, but then what about Jinx and Jayce and then you watch that scene in episode 5 where Jayce comes back "I'm sorry too" said by Jinx and Jayce one to Salo and the other to Vi, is this just a coincidence and then you start looking at the similarities between Jayce and Jinx. This works for so many characters and also works with the music. No show gets me to think about it's characters as much as Arcane. So do I care that some people think Vi or Ambessa acted a way that didn't make sense? Absolutely not.
@@Joeda89 Not a problem I enjoy debating, and I want to thank you for staying in the debate usually people never respond after the first reply or turn to insulting instead of trying to be civil and talk about their views
First I would like to argue that Back to the Future (at least the first one it has been a long time since I saw the others,) and Terminator (apart from the last one,) have pretty simple rules and guidelines for time travel and where are main timeline is and how it began is never a question. I'm not sure about Your Name I've never seen it before, While there is beauty to Viktor's quest to heal himself he lost everything he cares about, and by ending the conflict he is left with a world with no soul, it is not enough for me to overlook the writing flaws, and with writing you have to think logically about what makes sense for your universe in your story otherwise down the line things get sloppy, like in the MCU.
The fact is Viktor himself is the only reason we are presented with that explains Jayce's obsession with magic so Viktor simply not giving Jayce the ruin or simply not saving him at all would have worked and wrapping your head around why supposedly this is the only way things can go to end up right seems a little far fetched especially when in s2 e7 presents us with a different solution not to mention I can think of multiple ways Mage Viktor could have stopped the Glorious Evolution And with what you are saying you do acknowledge that it doesn't make sense you just ignore it because you like the premise which I feel is a bit of a biased way of looking at things, and you wont get to the core problems with blinders on, and I feel with a little bit of work they could have made it work but from the perspective of the WRITING it doesn't, I may be speaking my opinions on it and the way I feel but it is because of my writing experience I have the opinion I do if that makes sense, not that I'm just a grump and don't like it, I tried hard to like it because with some work it would have been an intrueging story but being able to see the writing flaws and inconsistent writing I cant.
#2 I truly believe this was one of the weakest parts of the show and I only say Vi should have gone after her because it is the moral thing to do and as a middle child I have experience in both the older and younger sibling department and as an older sibling she absolutely should have gone after her, it was character sabotage to make her stay and get it on instead of looking for her, as a sibling and just a person who cares about others this is simply something you can't change my mind on, I was actually abandoned by my older sister whom I was really close to during a really hard time in my life and related to Jinxs story a lot, so to see VI abandon her again (and yes I know the first time she didn't really mean to leave but both VI and Jinx refer to that time as VI leaving Powder,) was very disappointing, this time she actually did leave Jinx to be sucked into the self-destructive vacuum, I feel VI has every right to be judged here, not just from a personal stand point but from a writing stand point as well because it makes VI seem uncaring and the sex scene gross after witnessing someone at their lowest about to commit self unalive. VI and Ekko have no speaking lines and having a scene where these three come together one last time to fight together would have been actually pretty good for the story.
#3 Why is a comparison to real life unreasonable? Arcane is known for its reflections on real-life problems and if a show doesn't want to take the time to flush out a story that echos in real life DONT DO IT, saying it is enough for a story is not true because we had enough time for Cait to be like "Oh, by the way, I was with someone" but not enough time to say "VI I messed up I wronged you, I hurt you and its something I will never forgive myself for," she strolled down so confident to VI in the cell it actually made me disgusted to think she had the gull to not be guilty of what she did to VI around VI, we shouldn't excuse poor pacing and choice of scenes because its "a show" show us don't make us assume don't make a drastic 180 in a character and expect it to make sense, I liked Cait in season 1 and her turn in season 2 never screamed it was because of her "privilege" it made sense she let grief get a hold of her and it turned her into a monster. Just because she did a few nice things doesn't mean she is actively trying to make up for her mistakes.
#4 I understand it is now working toward betterment, but these council members' families were just killed by a Zaunite and Sevika worked with her it only makes sense that they wouldn't like her, and to say it's because I'm hating on the show for not giving me what I want is a bit of a personal jab but I'll overlook it. But don't assume it is because I'm being petty, need I remind you, you are the one who keeps saying you overlook many things because you like a certain premiss You are willingly overlooking things, most of my critiques come from my experience in writing except for Jinx and VI where I let a little more of my personal opinion on experiences determine some of my gripes with the story they are presenting but even with that I still ran it through my writer's brain to see if my feelings are clouding my judgment but the truth of the matter is, no, writing a caring sibling or decent human being that way is counter productive and character sabotage,
all of these and the honorable mentions can be chalked up to that they rushed and overlooked way too many important details, they might have been able to keep everything the same if they decided to flush out the story, but they were trying to get way too many stories finished and new ones set up that they got sloppy, to quote Viktor, "In the pursuit of greatness they forgot to do good," all the important things happen off camera and the things that need explaining are simply left in the air, I in no way am doubting how wonderful arcane season 1 is, it has to be one of the best if not best series I've ever watched which is why season 2 disappointed me so badly, and people expectations should have been surpassed not less then, the fact that peoples imaginations made a better season 2 then we got and people are disappointed means they failed as writers, parallels are not enough to keep a story going at the point we are at now it just felt like something shiney to distract the viewer from the writing flaws.
@@Alifer2002
1 I bring up Back to the Future and Terminator because both movies send beings to the past that dramatically alter the future and thus would change the circumstance that lead to them being sent to the past. Marty has a massive impact on his Parents life and dramatically changes the future, but still has the same personality and is the same person at the start of the movie even though his siblings are different. Terminator the human that goes back to protect Sarah connor turns out to be John connor's father but then that means he wasn't there in the original timeline, so who was John Connor's father before time travel happened? Your Name is great and that's all I'll say, highly recommend.
I do think that it is unfortunate that we have time travel in arcane, but I like what it does thematically enough to not care about the logic of it. Maybe if it was at the start of the story and we understood that going in, "hey this is gona be time travel story, we sacrificed some logic to hit the themes and explore characters this way" this from the start while alienating people could have played better than the reveal that it was Victor all along.
2 Not much I can say here. I can see why you would see it this way. I am definitely too invested in Cait/Vi's relationship and so I'm probably way too forgiving here. The scene was an unfortunate victim of time and the desire to invoke the way they first met.
3 Because I would look at any form of physical abuse as immediate relationship ender and would need police involvement, but it isn't real life. Vi is a street rat who grew up in prison, her getting hit by Cait, is thematically necessary to tie the breakup back to S1 ep3. So once Cait has helped Vi save Vander(before Isha) and let Vi free Jinx (also fix ep 3) she has redeemed the thematic debt Vi had over her. Thematically Cait is in the clear, but we don't have time for couples therapy. I don't think this is 10/10 or anything i just wouldn't include it in a list of complaints, I would tie it in with the show needing just a bit more time (an extra 10 minutes per episode, 1 more act, or 1 more episode per act)
4 I don't think so. Those council members fled the city. In ep 8 we see the hexgate evacuating people before the final fight. i still think by the framing of the scene it is setup as 2v2 with the rest of the council open to influence. Is this a problem with the pacing? Yeah I can only imagine what had to be cut, it seems pretty clear that Sevika and Schoola had some plot beat planned (they light the paper names together and thematically they are the only council members that lived through the attack/remember Silco)
I was out of line with the last bit of the paragraph I let other comment conversations bleed into this one. The jab was unnecessary and rude in discussion.
I don't like the term rushed, cause it makes it sound like the writing was done quickly. Did the cuts they were forced to make have a detrimental effect? Yes. Would a director's cut fix the majority of the complaints, also yes. This to me makes it not feel rushed, but squished, and dense. The main reason I feel so strongly about this, about the story not being written quickly with disregard for plot holes, is the absolute iceberg of character parallels/foils/themes. Does this excuse the time travel, putting the Vi/Cait sex scene at terrible time? No those are still problems, but I see those as problems the show voluntarily takes on in order pack everything into the last season they were given. The connection between the characters like: ( just to name a few)
JInx/Cait
Ambessa/Silco
Heimerdinger/Singed
Victor/Jinx
Mel/Jinx
Jinx/Jayce
Jayce/Ekko
Ekko/Victor
Vi/Ekko
Heimer/Silco
And then how do those charcters explore the themes of the show, Two sides to every coin(human dichotomy), Sacrifice, Identity, Cycles of Conflict. That's not even going into the lyrics to the music in the show and absolute brainblast I had thinking about who the Blue Bird was in Ashes and Blood. Or listening to the lyrics for The Line while watching Cait accept Ambessa's nomination. I don't consider that separate from the writing, the lyrics and music are part of the writing too.
There is so too much tying those characters together in terms of their actions, what those mean to them, the people around them that I can't accept the term rushed. That's why I'm so combative around things that sound like they undermine the work the writers put in. Too much work has clearly gone into the writing.
Edit: I can't think of another show that does what Arcane S2 does. My love for the way these characters connect thematically is very much something that I can't expect everyone else to value.
Some would say Arcane is great because it respects its audience's intelligence by excelling at "show, don't tell." However, for some morons, they should go watch movies that spoon-feed everything to their viewers.
look, I have nothing against the sex scene but, shit dude, knowing we could have had ekko telling jinx how amazing she can be cuz he went to another timeline and saw her on her "best"... just makes me a bit sad.
0:10 Why do people think this? Chernobyl's season 1 episodes have ratings of 9.3 or higher on IMDB, and that came out before Arcane season 1.
Was so excited for season 2, and then I watched it, and good god what happened, the characters got absolutely butchered
I don’t like arcane bc it’s OVER 😂
But I Can’t get it over😢
Listen, I get both sides.
Season 1 was a masterpiece from it's storytelling, character and worldbuilding, cause and effect, character motivations, animation, music, sound design, voice cast...."the whole package, you were." It's not perfect but it's pretty damn close. Whatever shortcomings season 1 had were all but negligible, except for Caitlyn's divine plot armor.
Season 2 is arguably even better on a technical level, including animation, music, sound design and voice talent but it also feels very disconnected. There's a lot of new plot threads introduced, including Warwick and the Black Rose. The passage of time is difficult to discern as much of it is glossed over with stylized short music videos. Mel going from skillful and engaging politician in season 1 to Super Saiyan in season 2 ultimately hurts her character. The 'Blisters and Bedrock' flashback recontextualizes Silco and Vander and creates a gaping plothole in act 1 of season 1. Many of the emotional payoffs feel unearned, manipulative and effective to varying degrees but no less contrived. Vi had no agency the entire season. She was just a passenger, along for the ride with Caitlyn in Act 1. Then a tagalong for Jinx in Act 2 and then has to say goodbye to both her father and her sister in Act 3. Isha was a character device, as was Warwick. Neither were characters. You could say the same about Sky and Alura but neither had nearly the amount of screen time when they were alive as Isha and Warwick. What was the point of Loris? I mean, I'm pretty sure he was meant to be sort of a big bother figure for Vi, that kinda reminded her of Vander to help her through her dark period after the fallout of episode 3 but it's barely implied, let alone explored. He disappears for a large chunk of the season and then just shows up and dies unceremoniously in the final episode. The way Loris died didn't bother me so much as why should I care? I honestly had more connection to the piano guy that joined the fight than I did with Loris and I'm so happy he lived.
Ultimately, I still love 'Arcane', warts and all and I'm thankful for this once in a generation, at least every couple decades, for something so beautiful, showcasing all the talent and passion that went into it, ironically from perhaps one of the most cynical and dubious of sources but because I love it so much, I have difficulty just waving away a lot of the issues season 2 suffers.
Dude why does everybody in this comment section hate season 2? Like i swear most comments here are just "It had a couple plot holes so its f tier garbage" like holy shit did we watch the same show?
Hahaha, a couple?
I get some of those points. But Arcane is a masterpiece. I think a HUGe thing is that people watch season 2 and they're like : this isn't at all what I expected the storylines to evolve into. Dont get me wrong, most people love Arcane. It's my favorite show of all time and while every show has its problems arcane is simply a masterpiece. Period. What also helps is rewatching the whole show and accepting the story as it is. When you do that, you can really see the Beaty in it. And all things considered, Arcane s2 exceeded my expectations. Haters are gonna hate I guess
hater = capable of viewing media with a critical lens
you arcane fans need to stop coping. also, arcane’s story was extremely predictable in season 2. it was disappointing because it did exactly what i expected it to do at every moment.
Hater? I frickin loved season 1, Arcane is the best show to hit Netflix in my opinion but that is what makes season 2 all the more unwatchable. I defended season 2 when it first came out but if you take even one second to stop coping and look back on the story you will see how bad it actually was.
Such an awful argument. What about anyone that liked where the storylines went? The storytelling is the problem. It's objectively, measurably provably worse than season 1. It's filled with serious flaws that aren't present in season 1. Let's not pretend it's subjective. Ideas are cheap.
@@eebbaa5560I think it’s unfair to people who like the show to invalidate the fact that they love it by saying they’re coping. Season 2 emotionally impacted me to a level that no other art has ever done, and that isn’t something that can be considered “cope.”
Dude. You look so much like Adam Ragusea
I have never heard of this guy but I can kinda see it tbh
The one I get a lot is Jack Antonoff
@@flowchartkenYT That works too, but Ragusea is closer :P You could be his little brother.
I hope they can retell the story in the future the same way Hideaki Anno did with REBUILD OF EVANGELION
This way, they can fix all the issues with season 2
we need to ban people from making reboots they had their chance and they blew it
No I think arcane can actually do it though that is a very good idea. @@eebbaa5560
The music video scenes are kind of cringe gonna be honest, it's a little too Riot for me lmao
"It's a little too much of the people who created it" Brainlet take.
First season, nothing to complain about Very good I came here to talk specifically about the second season, which was honestly the biggest disappointment of the year for me. Extremely poorly developed plots, a lot going on and little time to really tell and develop these plots properly. Making the series very fast, why the hell didn't they do another season??? Or why didn't this season have like 15 episodes??? Poor character development. I'm actually shocked, how can a series in one season have developed its characters SO well, only to throw it all in the trash in the second season???
Violet, is one of the protagonists and this woman had NO focus, no type of development, no type of attention in fact, her plot in the 2nd season is summarized around Caitlyn, it's comical, it's sad. Why the series was supposed to be about the sisters, but it made Vi care more about the pussy she wanted to eat than about her own sister.
Caitlyn, her arc this season would be wonderful if they needed time to develop, really cool when she ordered the commander of Ambessa's army, and extremely AWESOME when in the second act it doesn't matter AT ALL, because months go by and we don't see she is actually commanding and being this leader of Piltover.
Jinx, this was the one that hurt me the most, because she's my favorite character. Her development in season 1 is brilliant, completely perfect, she really had everything to become this great revolutionary symbol of Zaun, but in the end SHE DIDN'T BECOME IT, she didn't lead ANYTHING! Tell me, WHAT'S THE POINT OF PUTTING HER HOLDING A FLAG AT THE OPENING OF THE SEASON, BUT IN THE SERIES ITSELF SHE DOESN'T HOLD ANY FLAG?? Jinx is one of the protagonists of the series along with Vi and she barely had screen time in act 3, THE TWO SISTERS DIDN'T HAVE SCREEN TIME IN ACT 3 and the series was supposed to be ABOUT THEM, RIGHT! Also very shameful how they came together too quickly in act 2 to save Vander, truly SHAMEFUL. like, oh my god, they tried to kill each other in episode 3 and now they're all good again??? Jinx was angry with Vi at the end of season 1, she said that they could no longer be what they were before. Another mistake in the speed of the series. One more thing, the series is about Piltover vs Zaun right? So why in the end is Piltover and Zaun vs Ambessa's army??? What is the point and MOSTLY, what is the point of the Zaunites helping the Piltie people in the war after they have been neglected and inferiorized for years???
The Black Rose plot had everything to be one of the best, but it was one of the worst, BECAUSE THEY DIDN'T KNOW HOW TO DEVELOP IT WITH SO LITTLE TIME THEY HAD!!
Well, season 2 is terrible, is not good at all. I'm happy that arcane didnt won in best adaptation at game awards, because the writers definitely doesnt deserve this award
I miss season season 1, I miss when the show was about the sisters, about the cities, when the characters had a good development
I feel that Vi was sort of done dirty in this. I know some of you may disagree, but I think Vi should have swapped places with Jinx when it came to the end. It would have felt so much more impactful and would have actually ended fully instead of the speculation of "yeah jinx survived, see that purple ray and the shot at the end that was the same as the first shot in the season?" Who tf is gonna follow that? Should have been Vi and (warwick?) that guy battling it out as they were falling and they just both died from impact when they got to the hexcore location. Then Jinx (or maybe powder depending on how you see it) leaving piltover and zaun finally breaking the cycle as she was meant to. Everything technically was Vi's fault (or Ekko as he gave the tip to rob the place) and she finished what she truly started. Would have been such a good moment and gave Jinx's character time to reflect on things and maybe reconsile more with Ekko. At the end of the day, Vi was really the true side character in all of this.
i disagree, simply bcs we know vi could sacrifice herself for powder since s1, seeing powder doing its impactfull, instead of "giving jinx time to reflect" wich she already did in chapter 8, u can see actuall development, i agree tho that the whole speculative part is dull.
I mean, dying has been part of Jinx's character arc in S2, not Vi's. Schnee's video on this was really good. That said fanfic exploring what would happen if Vi sacrificed herself here to save jinx would be a really interesting read. I hard disagree with the side character comment, side characters don't get to end an episode like Vi did in S2 ep 5.
I found the music videos annoying but not so much that I'd complain about it.
Season two was just really bad. The characters, story, and writing were all terrible and nowhere near what season one was and achieved. The only thing that remained consisted was the animation, the acting and some good song here and there, but for the rest? Truly disappointing
i felt like the quality change is worse than game of thrones. s1 was such a smooth plot to follow. s2 was a music video time travel multiverse hallucination coming back alive for the third time wtf am i watching. no clue how people think there both in the 9s ratings other than hype
the first 6 episodes of season 2 are awful and isha never should have been added
i loved isha as a character so i might be a little biasis but i felt like she was very important to the story as vi gets abandonded and therfores walks a mile in jinx's shoes and jinx takes on a big sister/motherly role and walks a mile in vi's shoes. SInce she nonverbal she never says jinx or powder and considering jinxs whole charcter arc is kinda a struggle between her 2 idenities, someone who just sees her as she is and not as jinx or powder is so powerful to the audience to remember that they are the same person and not 2 seperate identities. There is so much more with the symbolism behind isha and such that i felt she was vidal to the story
@@jellofish7228 isha was derivative, predictable, and chopped up into tiny pieces to be as digestible as possible. she was created just to fridge and give jinx another reason to have the exact same arc she had in season 1.
This comment section lol...
Nothing but parrots and bad takes.
I like your hat!
Thanks! Sharks suck right now but I am high on rebuild copium
@flowchartkenYT Come on Celebrini, we believe!
@@flowchartkenYT Good job on choosing the most remedial, low-hanging fruit for your video here, champ.
There are legitimate criticisms of this season that even Christian Linke was forced to acknowledge. Yet somehow you only managed to cover the individuals whose complaints were essentially aesthetic in nature as opposed any that address the more egregious issues with narrative inconsistency, illogical character motivations, the abundance of major plot points happening off-screen, deus ex machinas, lack of character development, et al.
All this tells me is, with the way you're heading, you are definitely primed to be a successful RUclipsr.
That's not a compliment.
I think that many of the music video sequences are slightly selfe indulgant, and towards tbe end of the show the writers use them to fast track characer developement. Such as the sequence where Heimerdinger sings over the montage of them building the time machine, while I do love this sequence, it implies character progression afterwards that I am not fully able to get behind because I didn't see any of the small bonding moments like season 1 had. So while the music videos are good at setting tones and stakes, like ep2 and 4, others feel rushed, like ep3 and 7. I do particularly love the watercolours showing vander's personality and the sequence right before Isha's death. Over all they are a mixed bad of excelent exposition and lazy
read a book from any time period thats not today. or watch a movie from a different culture.
jesus, youre so annoying. sitting here smugly yapping when you dont even understand how common this is. HELLO ANIME?
Sorry, but season 2 was just wasted potential. They did wrong to almost the entire cast. The things that really stand out in this season are the animation, the sound design and the attention to detail in the artistic department. Story wise it was a complete mess.
I'm glad the gaslight is getting the response it should've had from the beginning.
Okay i was going to do a play by play of every problem in season 2 but a lot of other comments have pointed out the flaws and nobody probably will even read this so I'm just going to give my overall opinion. Season 2 as a whole was a letdown, abandon plots, characters were ruined, and the Viktor twist was not thought through at all. I defended season 2 when it first came out but after watching it back again after the disappointment that was the end i can't help but see all the flaws that made this season almost unwatchable if it weren't for a few scenes and moments. I don't know why anyone would try defending this season after waiting so long just to have rushed trash throw on the screen.
🤡
@Joeda89 my case is justified at this point if that is all you have to say rather than being able to come up with a valid response or coming up with your own defense for this season. The fact that nobody has given me one counter argument about how the show was actually good only proves my harsh judgement is justified and season 2 was as bad as I say. Thanks for the easy W man.
@@nooshy805 🤡
I liked season 1 a lot, I disliked season 2 because of pacing, plot holes that needed a lot of explanation, characters behaving in ways that didn't match their motives, & unexplained contrivances. Also, characters coming back from the dead & fake out death are tropes that just always annoy me in stories.
Also how did nobody in Zaun ever figure out that Jinx killed Silco, that's weird as hell.
examples? And I've already covered why Zaun wouldn't care about Jinx killing silco in other comments.
All the hate is so vlid
I hate the word content
Honestly I think a lot of these were just written by Arcane Normies. All league players enjoyed this.
This is bound to get some hate.
I don't think arcane normies wrote these
it’s the complete opposite. most league players, myself included, are way more critical of the show because we have an actual appreciation for the characters outside of it. arcane fans just watch this show and eat it up because they like making ship art and tiktok edits or they’re 35 year olds who still think that “mature” cartoons are cool.
@@eebbaa5560 I'm a League player and I really liked the show, as well as other players who I know. So, what are you even talking about?
@@dertgok9813 They're probably talking about how awful the writing in season 2 was.
Its mostly because of season 1's mainstream sensibilities. But I know that season 2 is superior. Those mainstream whiner babies can suck it.
Really? For one that is childish as heck, like come on dude. Secondly season 2 was a far fall from season 1 not just because of "sensibility" how about the fact is season 2 is being criticized because it had major flaws?
@@nooshy805 There is still time to delete this
@@furynotes
Thats…
I really like Arcane but that’s a crazy thing to say.
@@Joeda89 what? Why would I delete it? It is a pretty well known fact by now that season 2 isn't getting the same love season 1 did, for very good reasons.
They didn't even know Jynx killed Silco, you can see from how Smeech was shocked when she told him
Why would it matter if people knew Jinx killed Silco?
me looking at the comments. gods, arcane is way too complex for teenagers. go away.
You're not that guy 😭🙏
Most of those reviews are pretty accurate and valid. They are not just haters they are the ones asking the writers to do better for future projects
Nah. The most fun part for me is how d@mb these people are, they don't even know what they are talking about, it's just blind rage / emotions. One of the reviewers called Jinx a psychopath, a common missconception, but demonstrates that he didn't take any effort on doing a proper review.
I loved season 2. Season 1 birthed the characters, and season 2 let them run.
I preferred season 2
I consider myself a pretty unique case. I did not like season 1 at all. I considered it the worst piece of art ever produced. Regardless I gave season 2 a chance, a few days ago and I loved it and I think it's in top 10 of all art I have consumed.
The Arcane fandom is so cooked 😢
Ambessa is against magic, because it makes mages more powerful than the others and "everyone in battle should be equal" yet she wants to transform her soldiers into unkillable mutant zombies through magic, her invasion of piltover in the last episode feels like a small skirmish with almost no build up. The whole piltover/zaun plot is almost gone completely, they had a lot to develop, showing how silco´s dead caused more problems than anything or how caitlyn tryin to end the crime in zaun through pure force brings nothing but chaos, and that ending, with the ppl from zaun going to fight for piltover was so fucking bad . I honestly like the idea for caitlyn's character, but she just haves like 20 minutes in screen. Vi does literally nothing in the whole season, which is probably my biggest disappointment bcs she was my favorite character in s1. And ekko`s whole story is that he saves the world, literally, we see nothing of him in 7 episodes, then in episode 7 he gives up a perfect world and saves the day in the ending and even if his story with powder made me cry hate the time travel/multiverse plot. Jinx went from a completely dysfunctional psycho to a loving sister in 10 minutes, and her relationship with vi fixes bcs vander reappears, like, she's been trying to kill vi since s1 ep 7, but now they are good again in half episode.This finale remind me a lot to the mcu, everything ends with a battle between good and bad, and every 5 minutes a reference to another league champion to ensure your hype for next shows. Even with that i think that it haves way more good things, and rating it 1 out of 10 its criminal, i wouldn't rate it less than a 8 but i can't stop thinking how much better it could have been with a bit more of time.
Im so tired of people accepting season 2 and giving it that high of a rating after the horrible cheesy marvel- disney fan service storyline we were served. The animation is AMAZING and voice acting is PHENOMENAL but the writing was VERY BAD. None of thw characters felt like the same as season 1 and i get that their motivations change but we should be able to understand their decisions atleast. It felt like they just gathered what people liked the most from season 1 and put it all together the music video montages, fight scenes, a bunch of "WOAH THAT WAS A COOL SCENE" moments, slow motions and drama just for reaction but no clear motivation.
I know its just a show but still season 1 changed my life (im dramatic). We spent 3 years expecting a masterpiece and this is what we got. I understand its hard to satisfy everyone's expectations but all they had to do is follow through with all the storylines established in season 1 there was no need to add any more side characters to take up too much screen time just follow the main cast.
I can't figure out the part with Jayce going to the future, like if the problem is Hextech then just don't give Jayce the Rune stone that inspires him to make Hextech in the first place and problem solved, right?
"it was rushed" , that doesn't mean you don't like the show, it means you wanted it to last longer, and take more time to develop every idea
No, it just means it was rushed
Not exactly, everything I wanted to see happened off-screen and also IT WAS RUSHED, vi literaly makes out with caitlyn instead of chasing her sister which went off to kill herself. That scene felt so disrespectful and out of place. It shows the bad pacing of season 2. They didn't have any other place to put the scene.
Anyone who puts bad reviews on the show needs to be ignored and/or punished.
Chill just let them have their opinion
smartest arcane fan. you people need to be studied fr
Because we aren't coping for season 2?
what about some kind of chamber?
Like this comment if you think they should make a third season.
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