You said the majority of people didn't vote labour, and you're right. However, I voted lib dem to get rid of the tory where I live, but I wanted a labour government. There was no point voting labour here. How many people do you think voted lib dem for exactly the same reason. Voting tactically should be talked about when talking about vote share.
This is a poor argument. Labour were the main challengers for the tories in the majority of seats. By your own logic, there will have been far more tactical voting for labour than anyone else.
It can’t be because there’s no way of knowing if you voted tactically or not. You voted for the Liberal Democrat’s not for Labour whatever your motivation. Not saying you’re wrong to do so but it’s “gaming” our system and can’t be taken seriously in discourse or figures because we can’t guess your reason for voting Lib Dem’s and have to assume they are popular.
I see that David Cameron has resigned from the position of shadow foreign secretary. In my opinion he should never be allowed into Parliament again, he is a complete disappointment.
He’s in it for the money, there’s not much of that around when you’re shadow foreign secretary as he would find it difficult to offer his ‘consultancy services’ when in that position, particularly as he’d have to declare his income and it’s source.
@@paulcookies I seem to remember her talking about a previous campaign where she described her start as "hitting the ground" but omitting the "running". She probably put an ellipsis after 'ground' when brainstorming in her hello kitty notepad.
To be fair to Starmer he thought that the speed of prosecution was an important aspect in bringing the riots under control, he didn't feel that long prison sentences were necessary at all.
The problem for Keir Starmer is either people lie about what he did or didn't do, or deliberately misinterpret what he did.It's been Tory spin for years. Boris Johnsons senior advisor resigned because of his lie in Parliament.
@danthsmith certainly no question of jobs for the boys or girls with Starmer's Labour, or hidden policies now being imposed upon the 66% of the country that didn't vote for them. No, we are blessed with a New Jerusalem.
@@TimComleytrue apart from already setting up their stall and laying out the plans. They’ve communicated very well and given many of us a bit of hope after the Tory disaster. It feels like adults are back in charge and they have skills and knowledge which even the most diehard Tory has to accept they lacked these last few years.
@@TimComley I think it's hard to produce major changes in a capitalist inferno such as UK where people exist as resources only but at least they're trying. NHS will probably not be saved (I have spoken to a few who work in NHS) but wt the very least housing, zero hour contracts etc should be remediated
It's nice that for the first time in my adult life I do not feel burning shame for my country every time I hear political news now. Good riddance to nasty rubbish!
@@rhysrail oh please we were collapsing under the Tories, and they are the only reason I'm, now paying twice the mortgage others are. good riddance. it was the final nail in the coffin and I voted Labour. they should have managed finances better, and why on Earth is cheddar cheese in security boxes in a first world country (Tesco;s)? not even Russia has that
Starmer was Head of PROSECUTIONS, not Head of SENTENCING. He had no control over what sentences Judges handed down, he just had control over who got prosecuted, and with what. Good GRIEF. You should KNOW better. You're ADULTS.
Typical legacy media, nowhere near as clever as they think they are they've been anti Labour all through the campaign Freddie's a Reform booster thick as mince
@@jaygggthey are definitely authoritarian though, when that’s the Tory’s with conscription, reform with immigrant hate or labour with strict business policies
I came here to make that self same point. And to add that it is ridiculous to imply that FPTP has given the UK stable government over the past fourteen years. Cameron had to negotiate a coalition (common in PR systems), which was back then described as the most rebellious parliament of all time (whereas coalitions here in Finland are extremely stable, in my 25 years here every single government has gone its full term, despite them all being three to six party coalitions). Once Cameron got a slim majority he was forced to hold a referendum to leave the EU. That lead to huge divisions within parliament. Theresa May had two of the largest backbench rebellions in parliamentary history. Boris Johnson's government was the most chaotic in living memory (immediately following May's most chaotic parliament in living memory). Liz Truss lasted seven weeks! To describe that as "stable" is a joke! I'm also surprised and shocked that the New Statesman would express such a strongly nationalistic and xenophobic attitude. That smug "oh aren't we superior to those inferior foreigners" is the sort of thing I expect from the Telegraph, not a serious publication of the centre-left.
My question: there’s been all this talk about Labour only winning about a third of the vote. Why hasn’t there been more talk about the fact that the left of center parties and independents scoring well more than 50% of the vote while the right wing parties only reached about 37%? It seems to me that the majority of British voters wanted a left leaning government and because of that, is there a chance the LibDems, Greens, and independents could make a more effective opposition than the Conservatives? The Conservatives will try to pull Labour to the right, but given only about a third of voters want a right leaning or right wing government, can’t the parties on the left do more to pull Labour in that direction and give Labour cover to do the things they want to do on things like taxes, social care, the two child cap, etc?
All the evidence so far is that this labour government is going to be more left leaning than new Labour was. I don't know that them being pulled more left would reflect the position of the UK population.
If you had looked west instead of east, i e. Ireland, you would have seen a PR elected parliament, and a strong stable three party coalition government, with a rotating prime minister and finance minister also.
France does not have a system of proportional representation. The members of the French parliament are elected using a two-round system with single-member constituencies. To be elected in the first round, a candidate is required to secure an absolute majority of votes cast, and also to secure the votes of at least 25% of eligible voters in the candidate's constituency. If none of the candidates meets these criteria, a second round of voting follows. Normally this happens in most constituencies. Only first-round candidates with the support of at least 12.5% of voters in the constituency that are eligible are allowed to participate in that second round. However, if only one candidate meets that standard, the two candidates with the highest number of votes in the first round may continue to the second round. In the second round, the candidate with a plurality is elected. So in the end, each constituency is represented by only one person. Just like in the UK. (Source Wikipedia)
Enjoyable analysis. Enjoyable time; what a relief. PR+ etc should be talked about more- many people wanted to vote Green had the priority not been to rid ourselves of a corrupt incompetent mafia🎉😅
there's some good signs from this cabinet but im terrified of how they are going to handle the NHS and also worried about disability benefits under liz kendall...
It's a smart move Sunak was releasing prisoners 6 earlier before the end of their sentence... Because the prisons are full so the Tories can't pull labour up on it .
Everyone just wants an honest, straight talking, decent, effective, trustworthy, efficient, decisive, forward thinking, cohesive, fair, consistent, practical, ambitious and long term government. Everything we have been denied over the last 14 years.
Why are we talking so much about the majority of the country not having voted for labour. The Tories never had the majority vote for them in previous elections!! Why is this such a topic? It’s like this every single election.
I'd rather a "boring" PM that does their job, than an "entertaining" PM that doesn't. Realise that PM's, cabinets, and governments aren't there to entertain us. There's in office to run an entire country. Priorities.
Weird to hear people say the French election results are good, if you support the EU, NATO, Ukraine, then Mélenchon's victory is equally as bad as one for the RN would have been. Also RN still got more votes than any other party (over 10 million compared to about 7 million for the NFP and Ensemble)
Yes the result is far from good and lots of UK commentators are either incredibly naive about this or of the belief that hard left is somehow better than hard right. They are as bad as each other just with different "enemies".
I have a feeling the Gaza stance was also a reason for the AG appointment. Labour lost seats and majority to Independents, Greens and Workers Party over Gaza. They need to attract the muslim and moderate left vote back to Labour over the next 5 years. I agree with Rachel; we haven't heard the last of Emily Thornberry yet.
Australian here: it’s not just a choice between PR and first past the post. Preferential voting delivers a better representation of the will of the people, and functions well within the Westminster system. First past the post is madness for a democracy as large as the UK.
It is a long time ago, but the 5th Marquis of Lansdowne was Foreign Secretary under Balfour, therefore a Conservative and would have been succeeded in the post by his brother, Lord Edmund Fitzmaurice, as a Liberal in Campbell-Bannerman's government if Sir Edward Grey had declined to serve.
I enjoyed reading James Timpson's new book a few months back and am glad he has got the job - re-offending is a major problem that no British govt. has yet fixed but he (and his father before him at Timpson) has put in place some positive initiatives that could be very positive at a national level. Hope they go well.
Hi all, Thanks for the engaging discussion. While it was enthusiastic, it felt a bit light on critical analysis. I genuinely hope Starmer and his cabinet succeed. However, so far we've mostly heard generic terms like "change", "service", and "growth", along with specific plans for prisons, schools, and house building. But where's the cohesive vision that ties these principles and initiatives together? As the saying goes, action without insight is blind. Andrew Marr also mentioned on Question Time last week that electoral reform is now a moral imperative, I think. Looking forward to seeing a clear direction emerge. Anyone else?
I’d also like to see electoral reform, though very unsure what exactly the reform should be and how it should be decided. In the short term it’s not a priority for most people. But if things don’t improve it might be an ace card in the next GE.
Hi @jaybee4288, thanks for your response. You've got a fair point. I'm just asking for a bit more clarity. We need to know the reasoning and direction behind their plans, rather than just hearing buzzwords like "change," "service," and "growth."
It depends on your definition of succeed, I think they will do a very good job at sorting out the issues short term but long term there massive debt pile will increase even more bringing inflation up with it and taxing the rich will just draw the rich out along with stupid regulations against zero hour contracts which could collapse many more especially small business, and the only reason labour doesn’t send us into inflation death spirals like in other country’s is because they are distributing the money out but it will catch up with them eventually, most likely through a collapse in trading and many businesses
Well he has done his first U turn on PR after saying in 2020 the system needed change, now he has control FPTP is ok now. I small gust of wind and Starma changes his position.
Hannah's comment at the end re fptp is a point I've often thought about. Is it better to have clear strong government delivered by fptp or the potential hamstrung government that PR might deliver. For years I was a PR exponent, mainly because fptp always impacted the left. Now with Reform challenging the Tories, fptp is suddenly looking quite attractive again.
No system is great but, FPTP at least let's us elect based on constituencies. I'd hate the likes of Farage getting a say based on national vote share and only winning in 5 areas and getting nothing or 2nd or 3rd etc in all others. If the tories move back to the centre, he'll bleed votes again. Tories will get all the ones back who would never vote Labour or any left leaning Party
Im not starmers biggest fan but wow what a difference when people n charge have a clue. just even the way they are going about things.. long may it continue .. please no more bs party infighting or bs wanting the top job or watever.. i dont care who you vote for we all pay tax and want this country to work for everyone.. and if not we we will boot em out like we did the tories.. give it time 14 years wont be fixed overnight thats for sure.
I had reservations on the incoming government. However hearing the prison reform. Now I would love to see a skill based education that plays to people who aren't academics but hold talent and huge potential in manual and creative industries. 76% of kids go to the grinder year in year out. I work with teenagers on a Monday and they look defeated after day one. I look forward to seeing how this government lays down it's tracks. I am however sceptical of the new prime minister after his flip flopping on some things he's said.
Apart from anything else, the appointments of Harmer and Timpson are excellent examples of the Lords done right. That's not to say they justify the continued existence of the Lords in its current form, but actually using it to get experts into Government, rather than using it for patronage, appointing relatives and illegitimate daughters is an example of grown-up government
I always feel that people should wait until the cabinet has been successful before being proud of its makeup. I mean, Tories were proud about May as the second female PM, and Sunak as the first ethnically Asian PM. Maybe a little less proud of each now. Let's just hope that we are feeling proud of them after 5 years, and the Tories aren't bragging about how bad an idea it is to have a near total working class cabinet(!) Also - the council thing is a Tory problem... but it was a national Tory problem more than it was a local Tory problem. The national Tory plan seems to have been to make them all bankrupt in time for Labour to take over so they can blame Labour for raising taxes. That said, my own locality was recently taken over by the Lib Dems from the Tories, and from what I understand they couldn't believe what they discovered when they took over, so maybe there were some local problems too - that said, they in the same breath will talk about how a huge number of councils are set to go bankrupt all over the country that everyone considers to be run really well, and clearly are not a fault for their finances.
@@adrianthoroughgood1191 He was a snake under Corbyn, working against electing a Labour government. Do you not recall the (most likely deliberately leaked) phone call before the 2019 election?
I think so. Liz Kendall is in charge of that. I’m sure they will get to it soon because the sick and disabled have been treated abominably under the tories.
unfortunate slip-up on PR [in France], which is what I assume she was referring to … here in the Great South Land we have PR and compulsory voting … in general, I think, it works for us and is a stable system, but every country is different
I think the way the election went & how people voted shows that people don’t that old fashioned ways of doing things.They want change not more Incompetent politicians or Extreme Separatist Right Wing Nationalists & populists & culture wars Trump light style leaders in the U.K. They want more moderate close to home politics that work out everyday problems not more Extreme GB News style Politics.
Labour has made a great start to government. However, the scale of the problems are immense. I watched Reeves giving her speech at the Treasury today. It did not fill me with confidence and they have boxed themselves in to Tory spending plans which severely limit their room for manoeuvre. My fear is that Reeves and Starmer are administrators, not politicians of vision who will take the steps to urgently deal with inequality, low pay, health disparities and much more. I hope I am proved wrong but my fears persist.
The national debt is 500% higher than it was in 2010. We spend 60bn a year servicing the debt alone. I’m sure they would love to throw the cash around but the truth is there’s less cash than when labour were last in. All of that austerity really worked out.
timpson seems like a good appointment with a goal to reduce recitivism. however i'd note that if labour really wanted to grow the economy they could private prisons and just build more of them. now i wouldn't support that, I think reducing recitivism is great. but the point is that some things which are damaging to the social fabric are good for economic growth which is "good for the economy" according to the status quo in politics & media. the point is that we can and should make sacrifices on economic growth in order to make a better society. this is why the green party doesn't prioritise economic growth - we should measure what makes a good society in different ways.
“Politics doesn’t have to be tribal” says the man who did his best to purge everyone from the ‘wrong tribe’ out of the labour candidate lists just a few weeks ago
It's ruthless and decisive but not necessarily bad. Look at the mess the Tories ended up in because they tried to appease groups in their party with opposing views to each other.
I think that what we have to remember is that Labour has not gained in popularity in UK, they did not attract more voters in numbers vs. last election, but their voters went out to vote. On Tory's side, it looks like many of their voters were too disappointed of their party that they simply didn't go out and vote and of those who did go out and vote, some voted Reform. It is up now to Labour to gain voters for next election.
Yeah Labour are no more popular than they were under Corbyn. The Tory vote collapsed and we exist in a two party system. As people kept saying a vote for reform was a vote for Labour. As was a vote for anyone but the Tories really.
Impressive talk so far, but just talk, or "a difference in tone". We'll see how far it gets against a barrage of litigation and whatever shenanigans can be brought to bear. I hope I'm wrong, but I doubt they will stand up a single onshore wind turbine by the next election.
Great discussion and analysis....until the end, when Hannah Barnes incorrectly stated that France uses PR. In fact it's the only other country in Europe, apart from the UK, that doesn't use some form of proportional representation.
Australia has had PR *for more than 100 years* and I doubt you can point to a more stable system in the world. It is a domestic situation in France, nothing to do with voting system. Silly/ignorant comment to make, really.
Excellent podcast spoiled by a throw away comment about PR at the end. France does NOT have PR - it has a first past the post system which differs from ours only in that you have to win 50% + of the vote to take a seat. So, if you manage that in round 1, you have the seat. If no-one does, then the top two contenders (plus others if specified conditions are met) run off in round 2 and the winner of more than 50% of the votes then takes the seat. That is NOT PR - you can easily see how, if in every seat candidates take 50.1% of the vote in round 1, then they all win - and the 49.9% of the people who didnt vote for them are 'unrepresented'.
France does not have PR, it has a two round voting system. Nonetheless I am sure in the current political climate there almost any system could deliver chaos. Don't forget the UK with its FPTP has not been a beacon of stability for the last decade and a half either with its revolving door PMs!
France not really PR, although there are plenty of PR results elsewhere in Europe that prove that FPTP is still a very good system (even if I want AV instead). The crazy thing is that all of these democratic system work differently, and so comparing FPTP to PR as if they are somehow like for like is asinine. FPTP's job is to produce as moderate a candidate as possible for each set, so that the most possible amount of people will be represented fairly by them, even if they don't exactly fit any of their preconceived notions. FPTP will always beat PR at the job FPTP does, and vice versa. Sadly, the level of discourse at the moment seems to suggest that the only thing that matters is proportional voting, and therefore PR is miles better than FPTP. Which is just a tautology. It would be nice if what was being discussed were the strengths and weakness of each system, rather than try to judge all systems by what one particularly flawed system is best at doing. I like FPTP because it guarantees that neither the far right nor the far left will ever come to power. That doesn't mean they don't have a voice, it just means that by making enough noise, any good idea gets filtered out as it the right and left wing get a look at them and then the central get a chance to look over it too.
Starmer certainly has hit the ground running won’t work Friday night or Saturday,Sunday but expects all Consultants,Surgeons, Doctors, Nurses and all NHS staff to work 24/7 to clear the back log of appointments caused by the Covid pandemic.Good luck with that.
I think the purging of Emily Thornberry to the back benches shows that Starmer is both ruthless and unwilling to accept his own failings as the obvious reason is how she backed up his LBC comments and further highlighted his true opinions on Gaza and the crimes being committed against it !!
The U.S. could care less. Neither party here has any interest in ‘trade deals’ with the UK. The EU will always be the focus as stated by Obama in 2016.
@@stuartjameswright I understand that he only attended ONE meeting ( out of 40 ? ) claiming it was a waste of time. He then used the U.K. fishing industry as a lever to campaign to leave the EU…..exploiting inshore fishermen who appear to have genuine grievances, but in fact hobnobbing with some of the big names in fishing…..Greenpeace exposed the way the industry works, primarily for 10 big families who control the industry. So Her Farage can take his place on a parliamentary committee, and demonstrates his expertise (lack of ) and show U.K. fishermen how he proposes to sort out the mess he caused.
@@californiadreamin8423 that’s why your comment threw me. Sarcasm doesn’t translate well into RUclips comments these days. I’m sure Reform supporters think he’s a genius.
@@stuartjameswright I doubt Farage now has the support of the broader fishing communities , who have learnt the hard way that he lied and exploited them. I believe he is an agent of chaos and subversion of the state. I’m baffled why he gets the support he does .
You said the majority of people didn't vote labour, and you're right. However, I voted lib dem to get rid of the tory where I live, but I wanted a labour government. There was no point voting labour here. How many people do you think voted lib dem for exactly the same reason. Voting tactically should be talked about when talking about vote share.
Exactly, this isn't being mentioned.
This is a poor argument. Labour were the main challengers for the tories in the majority of seats. By your own logic, there will have been far more tactical voting for labour than anyone else.
Ever considered that Sunac deliberately called an early election and that both parties did a pincer movement on us?
Me too, there was no way Labour would have got in where I live but Lib Dems were just 3K behind in last election, now Lib Dems have a 7K majority
It can’t be because there’s no way of knowing if you voted tactically or not. You voted for the Liberal Democrat’s not for Labour whatever your motivation. Not saying you’re wrong to do so but it’s “gaming” our system and can’t be taken seriously in discourse or figures because we can’t guess your reason for voting Lib Dem’s and have to assume they are popular.
I see that David Cameron has resigned from the position of shadow foreign secretary. In my opinion he should never be allowed into Parliament again, he is a complete disappointment.
Ha he ran away once he stopped having any power. Classic Dave.
He was made a Lord. He gets to be in the Lords for life.
He’s in it for the money, there’s not much of that around when you’re shadow foreign secretary as he would find it difficult to offer his ‘consultancy services’ when in that position, particularly as he’d have to declare his income and it’s source.
Everything since 2016 is directly his fault
Disappointment? You mean an actual disgrace!
Liz Truss is thinking "but why is he running when he hits the ground?"
Do you think that Dizzy Lizzie knows what 'running' or 'the ground' is?
@@paulcookies I seem to remember her talking about a previous campaign where she described her start as "hitting the ground" but omitting the "running".
She probably put an ellipsis after 'ground' when brainstorming in her hello kitty notepad.
😂😂😂
@@paulcookiesgiven how many times she’s buried herself, I hope she knows what the ground is.
@@bendaniel2271 I think it's more waddling - greedy Starmer has been overdoing it on the taxpayer funded food..
To be fair to Starmer he thought that the speed of prosecution was an important aspect in bringing the riots under control, he didn't feel that long prison sentences were necessary at all.
The problem for Keir Starmer is either people lie about what he did or didn't do, or deliberately misinterpret what he did.It's been Tory spin for years. Boris Johnsons senior advisor resigned because of his lie in Parliament.
The contrast with the venal shambles of Johnson's "government" is incredible
@danthsmith certainly no question of jobs for the boys or girls with Starmer's Labour, or hidden policies now being imposed upon the 66% of the country that didn't vote for them. No, we are blessed with a New Jerusalem.
😵💫😂
Having the Attorney General be a member of the House of Lords is actually a return to form - it was the case for the majority of the New Labour years.
I think it's good. You want someone focussed on the law, I not someone with one eye on reelection.
As we enter the first few weeks of the labour government, its been 3days? I know it feels like weeks with all they done.
Haha get out of town they haven’t done a dam thing yet
@@TimComleytrue apart from already setting up their stall and laying out the plans. They’ve communicated very well and given many of us a bit of hope after the Tory disaster. It feels like adults are back in charge and they have skills and knowledge which even the most diehard Tory has to accept they lacked these last few years.
@@TimComley I think it's hard to produce major changes in a capitalist inferno such as UK where people exist as resources only but at least they're trying. NHS will probably not be saved (I have spoken to a few who work in NHS) but wt the very least housing, zero hour contracts etc should be remediated
Bot.
@@TimComley Still pursuing the anti Starmer narrative I see...It'll need a special type of nob to keep that up for the next 5 (10?) years...
Finally a serious government. Just deliver please
It's nice that for the first time in my adult life I do not feel burning shame for my country every time I hear political news now. Good riddance to nasty rubbish!
Hope you enjoy this brief period as the second they get onto economic policies we will look like the shocked union
@@rhysrail oh please we were collapsing under the Tories, and they are the only reason I'm, now paying twice the mortgage others are. good riddance. it was the final nail in the coffin and I voted Labour. they should have managed finances better, and why on Earth is cheddar cheese in security boxes in a first world country (Tesco;s)? not even Russia has that
Starmer was Head of PROSECUTIONS, not Head of SENTENCING. He had no control over what sentences Judges handed down, he just had control over who got prosecuted, and with what.
Good GRIEF. You should KNOW better. You're ADULTS.
Journalists talk as much bullshit as politicians.
Typical legacy media, nowhere near as clever as they think they are they've been anti Labour all through the campaign
Freddie's a Reform booster thick as mince
Just a note on France. Their system is not PR. It's a modified form of FPTP.
The grownups are in charge 👍🏻
lol
Yeah, what a relief. Childish, evil, corrupt, short term, populist tories are out. And worse - they were also incompetent.
Careful, there's a whole five years to roast the gammons, don't want it charred before the week is out.
@@JoeWedgwood-ik9zo I wish that were true but sadly it's not
More hot air !
Isn't it great the UK fascists are really surly about it all
I think you should look up the definition of fascist.
@@jayggg I think you should listen to some of the people representing Reform.
@@jaygggthey are definitely authoritarian though, when that’s the Tory’s with conscription, reform with immigrant hate or labour with strict business policies
@@paulinequinton1478 Pauline. Are all Labour voters anti-Semites? What a ridiculous comment.
What is this feeling? Optimism?
The only problem is it will be short lasted though when in a few years time he will further bankrupt the country and then want socialism
delusional 😂
Genuinely stunned that the panel don't know that France doesn't have PR and also uses first past the post.
I came here to make that self same point. And to add that it is ridiculous to imply that FPTP has given the UK stable government over the past fourteen years.
Cameron had to negotiate a coalition (common in PR systems), which was back then described as the most rebellious parliament of all time (whereas coalitions here in Finland are extremely stable, in my 25 years here every single government has gone its full term, despite them all being three to six party coalitions). Once Cameron got a slim majority he was forced to hold a referendum to leave the EU. That lead to huge divisions within parliament. Theresa May had two of the largest backbench rebellions in parliamentary history. Boris Johnson's government was the most chaotic in living memory (immediately following May's most chaotic parliament in living memory). Liz Truss lasted seven weeks! To describe that as "stable" is a joke!
I'm also surprised and shocked that the New Statesman would express such a strongly nationalistic and xenophobic attitude. That smug "oh aren't we superior to those inferior foreigners" is the sort of thing I expect from the Telegraph, not a serious publication of the centre-left.
My question: there’s been all this talk about Labour only winning about a third of the vote. Why hasn’t there been more talk about the fact that the left of center parties and independents scoring well more than 50% of the vote while the right wing parties only reached about 37%? It seems to me that the majority of British voters wanted a left leaning government and because of that, is there a chance the LibDems, Greens, and independents could make a more effective opposition than the Conservatives? The Conservatives will try to pull Labour to the right, but given only about a third of voters want a right leaning or right wing government, can’t the parties on the left do more to pull Labour in that direction and give Labour cover to do the things they want to do on things like taxes, social care, the two child cap, etc?
All the evidence so far is that this labour government is going to be more left leaning than new Labour was. I don't know that them being pulled more left would reflect the position of the UK population.
This is a cabinet full of talent, unlike the oafs that were kicked out.
😂😂😂😂 talent ...civil war about to happen .. and you call it talent .😂😂😂😂
Great start for the new gov. Look and feel professional which is very welcome
Yes, please let's have a podcast about PR - proportional representation, not public relations...
I hope they will discuss the relative merits of STV and Proportional Past the Post (PPP).
The French system IS NOT REGARDED AS PR!!!!
Because it isn't.
Pretty simple concept; % votes = % seats.
If you had looked west instead of east, i e. Ireland, you would have seen a PR elected parliament, and a strong stable three party coalition government, with a rotating prime minister and finance minister also.
Keep up the videos guys. Love the analysis.
Rumpole's ghost must be chuckling. A Timson as prison minister.
The irony! The Timpson Brand known for cutting keys is Prison Minister!😂😂😂
France does not have a system of proportional representation. The members of the French parliament are elected using a two-round system with single-member constituencies. To be elected in the first round, a candidate is required to secure an absolute majority of votes cast, and also to secure the votes of at least 25% of eligible voters in the candidate's constituency. If none of the candidates meets these criteria, a second round of voting follows. Normally this happens in most constituencies. Only first-round candidates with the support of at least 12.5% of voters in the constituency that are eligible are allowed to participate in that second round. However, if only one candidate meets that standard, the two candidates with the highest number of votes in the first round may continue to the second round. In the second round, the candidate with a plurality is elected. So in the end, each constituency is represented by only one person. Just like in the UK. (Source Wikipedia)
Would be great to have a podcast discussing the House of Lords. Its current size and any likely changes to it under Labour
Maria and Angela Eagle were twin sisters and ministers in government.
U mean Twisted Sisters. 😊😅😂
Good breakdown and analysis of the government, very informative. 👍
Enjoyable analysis. Enjoyable time; what a relief. PR+ etc should be talked about more- many people wanted to vote Green had the priority not been to rid ourselves of a corrupt incompetent mafia🎉😅
there's some good signs from this cabinet but im terrified of how they are going to handle the NHS and also worried about disability benefits under liz kendall...
It's a smart move Sunak was releasing prisoners 6 earlier before the end of their sentence...
Because the prisons are full so the Tories can't pull labour up on it .
Everyone just wants an honest, straight talking, decent, effective, trustworthy, efficient, decisive, forward thinking, cohesive, fair, consistent, practical, ambitious and long term government.
Everything we have been denied over the last 14 years.
Why are we talking so much about the majority of the country not having voted for labour. The Tories never had the majority vote for them in previous elections!! Why is this such a topic? It’s like this every single election.
FPTP might deliver “strong government”, but does it deliver what people want?
The Boss of the Boring is scoring points on his opening lap.
I'd rather a "boring" PM that does their job, than an "entertaining" PM that doesn't. Realise that PM's, cabinets, and governments aren't there to entertain us. There's in office to run an entire country. Priorities.
Weird to hear people say the French election results are good, if you support the EU, NATO, Ukraine, then Mélenchon's victory is equally as bad as one for the RN would have been.
Also RN still got more votes than any other party (over 10 million compared to about 7 million for the NFP and Ensemble)
Yes the result is far from good and lots of UK commentators are either incredibly naive about this or of the belief that hard left is somehow better than hard right. They are as bad as each other just with different "enemies".
I have a feeling the Gaza stance was also a reason for the AG appointment. Labour lost seats and majority to Independents, Greens and Workers Party over Gaza. They need to attract the muslim and moderate left vote back to Labour over the next 5 years. I agree with Rachel; we haven't heard the last of Emily Thornberry yet.
Australian here: it’s not just a choice between PR and first past the post. Preferential voting delivers a better representation of the will of the people, and functions well within the Westminster system. First past the post is madness for a democracy as large as the UK.
He’s started with a bang, good news on the legacy amnesty in NI.
@@stephfoxwell4620Northern Ireland!
@@stephfoxwell4620 The terrorist attacks from Ireland kept happening throughout the early 2000s
It is a long time ago, but the 5th Marquis of Lansdowne was Foreign Secretary under Balfour, therefore a Conservative and would have been succeeded in the post by his brother, Lord Edmund Fitzmaurice, as a Liberal in Campbell-Bannerman's government if Sir Edward Grey had declined to serve.
"Hit the ground running" was New Labour's slogan in 1997.
Only at a greekmyre can someone say "William Timpson to Prison's Administrator"
This looks like the most uncomfortable seating arrangement.
I enjoyed reading James Timpson's new book a few months back and am glad he has got the job - re-offending is a major problem that no British govt. has yet fixed but he (and his father before him at Timpson) has put in place some positive initiatives that could be very positive at a national level. Hope they go well.
France doesn’t have PR. It is a two-round FPTP.
Hi all,
Thanks for the engaging discussion.
While it was enthusiastic, it felt a bit light on critical analysis. I genuinely hope Starmer and his cabinet succeed. However, so far we've mostly heard generic terms like "change", "service", and "growth", along with specific plans for prisons, schools, and house building. But where's the cohesive vision that ties these principles and initiatives together? As the saying goes, action without insight is blind. Andrew Marr also mentioned on Question Time last week that electoral reform is now a moral imperative, I think.
Looking forward to seeing a clear direction emerge.
Anyone else?
With respect it’s been a week. What have you done this week?
I’d also like to see electoral reform, though very unsure what exactly the reform should be and how it should be decided. In the short term it’s not a priority for most people. But if things don’t improve it might be an ace card in the next GE.
Electoral Reform is a moral imperative esp given the GE results - but it cannot be driven from Govt, it needs to be pushed by the grassroots
Hi @jaybee4288, thanks for your response. You've got a fair point. I'm just asking for a bit more clarity. We need to know the reasoning and direction behind their plans, rather than just hearing buzzwords like "change," "service," and "growth."
It depends on your definition of succeed, I think they will do a very good job at sorting out the issues short term but long term there massive debt pile will increase even more bringing inflation up with it and taxing the rich will just draw the rich out along with stupid regulations against zero hour contracts which could collapse many more especially small business, and the only reason labour doesn’t send us into inflation death spirals like in other country’s is because they are distributing the money out but it will catch up with them eventually, most likely through a collapse in trading and many businesses
I'm encouraged by Starmer's appointments.
Did LOTO tell Nandy 'it could be you ' ?
I think he’s hit the ground!
CONGRATULATIONS AND BEST WISHES FROM RAVINDER TALWAR JALANDHAR CITY PUNJAB INDIA
Well he has done his first U turn on PR after saying in 2020 the system needed change, now he has control FPTP is ok now. I small gust of wind and Starma changes his position.
Hannah's comment at the end re fptp is a point I've often thought about. Is it better to have clear strong government delivered by fptp or the potential hamstrung government that PR might deliver. For years I was a PR exponent, mainly because fptp always impacted the left. Now with Reform challenging the Tories, fptp is suddenly looking quite attractive again.
No system is great but, FPTP at least let's us elect based on constituencies. I'd hate the likes of Farage getting a say based on national vote share and only winning in 5 areas and getting nothing or 2nd or 3rd etc in all others.
If the tories move back to the centre, he'll bleed votes again. Tories will get all the ones back who would never vote Labour or any left leaning Party
And he's still running.
It is a long pier but he'll get to the end shortly
Any drawers in this cabinet.......
Edwina Curry's
The elector system whatever it is has problems. PRs problem is government formation and it can be difficult ot understand.
Im not starmers biggest fan but wow what a difference when people n charge have a clue.
just even the way they are going about things.. long may it continue .. please no more bs party infighting or bs wanting the top job or watever.. i dont care who you vote for we all pay tax and want this country to work for everyone.. and if not we we will boot em out like we did the tories..
give it time 14 years wont be fixed overnight thats for sure.
"FPTP delivers strong governments"
We're less than a week out from the Tories and they're already starting to forget ffs
The Eagles have landed. Maria and Angela...
I had reservations on the incoming government. However hearing the prison reform. Now I would love to see a skill based education that plays to people who aren't academics but hold talent and huge potential in manual and creative industries. 76% of kids go to the grinder year in year out. I work with teenagers on a Monday and they look defeated after day one.
I look forward to seeing how this government lays down it's tracks. I am however sceptical of the new prime minister after his flip flopping on some things he's said.
Apart from anything else, the appointments of Harmer and Timpson are excellent examples of the Lords done right. That's not to say they justify the continued existence of the Lords in its current form, but actually using it to get experts into Government, rather than using it for patronage, appointing relatives and illegitimate daughters is an example of grown-up government
I always feel that people should wait until the cabinet has been successful before being proud of its makeup. I mean, Tories were proud about May as the second female PM, and Sunak as the first ethnically Asian PM. Maybe a little less proud of each now. Let's just hope that we are feeling proud of them after 5 years, and the Tories aren't bragging about how bad an idea it is to have a near total working class cabinet(!)
Also - the council thing is a Tory problem... but it was a national Tory problem more than it was a local Tory problem. The national Tory plan seems to have been to make them all bankrupt in time for Labour to take over so they can blame Labour for raising taxes. That said, my own locality was recently taken over by the Lib Dems from the Tories, and from what I understand they couldn't believe what they discovered when they took over, so maybe there were some local problems too - that said, they in the same breath will talk about how a huge number of councils are set to go bankrupt all over the country that everyone considers to be run really well, and clearly are not a fault for their finances.
Jonathan Ashworth was my Portillo moment. Jacob RM a close second.
I didnt think Liz Truss was aware of her reality on the stage.
Ate there any reasons to be pleased about Ashworth?
@@adrianthoroughgood1191 He was a snake under Corbyn, working against electing a Labour government. Do you not recall the (most likely deliberately leaked) phone call before the 2019 election?
How many non Labour mayors are there?
Do you think the labour government will be more compassionate regarding the disabled and dwp pip esa just wondered what people thought GOD BLESS
I think so. Liz Kendall is in charge of that. I’m sure they will get to it soon because the sick and disabled have been treated abominably under the tories.
Er, France doesn't have Proportional Representation...
Is he going to stand in NI?
unfortunate slip-up on PR [in France], which is what I assume she was referring to … here in the Great South Land we have PR and compulsory voting … in general, I think, it works for us and is a stable system, but every country is different
Macron had no choice, he had to do something.
I think the way the election went & how people voted shows that people don’t that old fashioned ways of doing things.They want change not more Incompetent politicians or Extreme Separatist Right Wing Nationalists & populists & culture wars Trump light style leaders in the U.K.
They want more moderate close to home politics that work out everyday problems not more Extreme GB News style Politics.
Labour has made a great start to government. However, the scale of the problems are immense. I watched Reeves giving her speech at the Treasury today. It did not fill me with confidence and they have boxed themselves in to Tory spending plans which severely limit their room for manoeuvre. My fear is that Reeves and Starmer are administrators, not politicians of vision who will take the steps to urgently deal with inequality, low pay, health disparities and much more. I hope I am proved wrong but my fears persist.
Their manifesto made no promises about finding new money ie increase taxes. So it will be interesting to see how they fund their ambitious programs
@@PassiveAgressive319 yes, exactly
@@PassiveAgressive319 Financial engineering. Article in the FT
Quite happy with efficient administrators!
The national debt is 500% higher than it was in 2010. We spend 60bn a year servicing the debt alone. I’m sure they would love to throw the cash around but the truth is there’s less cash than when labour were last in. All of that austerity really worked out.
timpson seems like a good appointment with a goal to reduce recitivism. however i'd note that if labour really wanted to grow the economy they could private prisons and just build more of them.
now i wouldn't support that, I think reducing recitivism is great. but the point is that some things which are damaging to the social fabric are good for economic growth which is "good for the economy" according to the status quo in politics & media. the point is that we can and should make sacrifices on economic growth in order to make a better society. this is why the green party doesn't prioritise economic growth - we should measure what makes a good society in different ways.
Jeez thank god LOTO was explained! Seriously - I think your audience is a bit wider than people who live and breath politics.
New brooms sweep clean.Let me see the headlines on July 8th 2025.
A key copying company hires former prisoners?
“Politics doesn’t have to be tribal” says the man who did his best to purge everyone from the ‘wrong tribe’ out of the labour candidate lists just a few weeks ago
Who?
It's ruthless and decisive but not necessarily bad.
Look at the mess the Tories ended up in because they tried to appease groups in their party with opposing views to each other.
Not mad about this. The harder left won't listen to anybody but themselves - that made them a problem that needed quietening down.
He’s hit the ground running…… Last few PM’s just hit the ground…..😂
OMG they are wanting to build more houses and release prisoners God help us 😢
The ex prisoners need somewhere to live to stop them offending again...
@@stevebrooks9119 Yeah Rwanda
I think that what we have to remember is that Labour has not gained in popularity in UK, they did not attract more voters in numbers vs. last election, but their voters went out to vote. On Tory's side, it looks like many of their voters were too disappointed of their party that they simply didn't go out and vote and of those who did go out and vote, some voted Reform. It is up now to Labour to gain voters for next election.
Yeah Labour are no more popular than they were under Corbyn. The Tory vote collapsed and we exist in a two party system. As people kept saying a vote for reform was a vote for Labour. As was a vote for anyone but the Tories really.
you are ignoring the tactical vote though. I voted LIb Dem, because I wanted Labour.....
Hit the ground running to?
Your country is doomed.. 🤣
Impressive talk so far, but just talk, or "a difference in tone". We'll see how far it gets against a barrage of litigation and whatever shenanigans can be brought to bear. I hope I'm wrong, but I doubt they will stand up a single onshore wind turbine by the next election.
France, of course, doesn't have Proportional Representation either.
Great discussion and analysis....until the end, when Hannah Barnes incorrectly stated that France uses PR. In fact it's the only other country in Europe, apart from the UK, that doesn't use some form of proportional representation.
Loto 😂
Australia has had PR *for more than 100 years* and I doubt you can point to a more stable system in the world. It is a domestic situation in France, nothing to do with voting system. Silly/ignorant comment to make, really.
Excellent podcast spoiled by a throw away comment about PR at the end. France does NOT have PR - it has a first past the post system which differs from ours only in that you have to win 50% + of the vote to take a seat. So, if you manage that in round 1, you have the seat. If no-one does, then the top two contenders (plus others if specified conditions are met) run off in round 2 and the winner of more than 50% of the votes then takes the seat. That is NOT PR - you can easily see how, if in every seat candidates take 50.1% of the vote in round 1, then they all win - and the 49.9% of the people who didnt vote for them are 'unrepresented'.
And we are Americans.
Starmer hit the ground running yes on his face. Nigel looking forward to hearing you in question time getting stuck into Starmer and his clowns.
France does not have PR, it has a two round voting system. Nonetheless I am sure in the current political climate there almost any system could deliver chaos. Don't forget the UK with its FPTP has not been a beacon of stability for the last decade and a half either with its revolving door PMs!
France not really PR, although there are plenty of PR results elsewhere in Europe that prove that FPTP is still a very good system (even if I want AV instead). The crazy thing is that all of these democratic system work differently, and so comparing FPTP to PR as if they are somehow like for like is asinine. FPTP's job is to produce as moderate a candidate as possible for each set, so that the most possible amount of people will be represented fairly by them, even if they don't exactly fit any of their preconceived notions.
FPTP will always beat PR at the job FPTP does, and vice versa. Sadly, the level of discourse at the moment seems to suggest that the only thing that matters is proportional voting, and therefore PR is miles better than FPTP. Which is just a tautology. It would be nice if what was being discussed were the strengths and weakness of each system, rather than try to judge all systems by what one particularly flawed system is best at doing.
I like FPTP because it guarantees that neither the far right nor the far left will ever come to power. That doesn't mean they don't have a voice, it just means that by making enough noise, any good idea gets filtered out as it the right and left wing get a look at them and then the central get a chance to look over it too.
Starmer certainly has hit the ground running won’t work Friday night or Saturday,Sunday but expects all Consultants,Surgeons, Doctors, Nurses and all NHS staff to work 24/7 to clear the back log of appointments caused by the Covid pandemic.Good luck with that.
I think you'll find it was just Friday nights...
We find it very exciting. 😐
I think the purging of Emily Thornberry to the back benches shows that Starmer is both ruthless and unwilling to accept his own failings as the obvious reason is how she backed up his LBC comments and further highlighted his true opinions on Gaza and the crimes being committed against it !!
Cant wait till them ex tory voters that voted Labour get 500 crappy new builds in there village 😂😂😂
Once upon a time your home was seen as a crappy new build
I somehow think the people moving into those 500 crappy new builds will be favourable to the party that put them on the housing ladder.
Blair puppet
Look how the media are covering starmer from the get go. Will this honeymoon ever end?
How would the new labor government fare with a second term Trump administration vs a second term Biden administration?
Who cares?
The U.S. could care less. Neither party here has any interest in ‘trade deals’ with the UK. The EU will always be the focus as stated by Obama in 2016.
All you need to know about Starmer is that he failed the victims of Saville, possibly because Starmer doesn’t know what a woman is!!
Yawn...
This is going to be a World record honeymoon, it wont take Labour long to make things worse
Let’s have Farage on the Fisheries Committee. He displayed his expertise when he served on that committee when he was an MEP.
Could you tell me if you are being sarcastic or trolling?
I heard how hard he worked to get to the Committee Meetings.....................
@@stuartjameswright I understand that he only attended ONE meeting ( out of 40 ? ) claiming it was a waste of time. He then used the U.K. fishing industry as a lever to campaign to leave the EU…..exploiting inshore fishermen who appear to have genuine grievances, but in fact hobnobbing with some of the big names in fishing…..Greenpeace exposed the way the industry works, primarily for 10 big families who control the industry.
So Her Farage can take his place on a parliamentary committee, and demonstrates his expertise (lack of ) and show U.K. fishermen how he proposes to sort out the mess he caused.
@@californiadreamin8423 that’s why your comment threw me. Sarcasm doesn’t translate well into RUclips comments these days. I’m sure Reform supporters think he’s a genius.
@@stuartjameswright I doubt Farage now has the support of the broader fishing communities , who have learnt the hard way that he lied and exploited them. I believe he is an agent of chaos and subversion of the state. I’m baffled why he gets the support he does .