King Air Crash Marietta OH 18 Oct 2022
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- Опубликовано: 18 окт 2022
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De Icing Video: • King Air C90A De-icing
Real ATC Audio: • King Air N515GK Crash ...
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As a retired FAA ASI and accident investigator (USC Safety, Army Safety Officer) I find your accident coverage videos to be very factual and correct in all most all I have seen. Thanks. Keep up the good work and keep the greasy side down.
When I first saw your name I thought the impossible had happened. Then I realized the spelling is slightly different. Lost a good guy named Bill Kinsinger back in 2018 on a pilots and paws mission.
Whatever bro army safety officers are a joke
I had planned to fly me and my wife to Maine from Illinois yesterday in our Cessna 210. After thoroughly checking weather we drove. She was quite disappointed. I made her watch this report. Her attitude changed dramatically. Tragic - just tragic 😞
Good for you, Marlin. Many aren't brave enough or conscious enough to make the tough decisions.
As a pilot I have a saying “ fly and die or land and live “. I’m basically a blue sky flier in order to keep flying safe and enjoyable for my wife
Weather when entering geographic hollows (like near that river) can go from fair to frosty in minutes this time of year.
@@SeekingTheLoveThatGodMeans7648 that particular time period Monday thru Tuesday had airmets tango and Zulu posted for that route of flight. 4000’ and above for Zulu (icing) . As Jain Braun mention they would have been in icing conditions virtually the entirety of their flight.
Smart move. Stay safe 💕
Guys like Juan, Dan, and many others deserve an award for promoting aviation safety.
Promoting aviation safety, that's what Dan does?
It’s a shame RUclips keeps them from showing videos of the final moments. It’s important for analyzing the causes…..
Agreed 💯 %
Dan especially
Heck, Juan needs an award for promoting and inspiring young adults to become pilots, there's a shortage, you know!
I was the last student of one of the pilots involved in the crash. I couldn’t believe it when I heard what happened. He taught me so many things that you just don’t get from the bare-bones curriculum style training found at most schools, and he went the extra mile to make sure that I made sure that we were safe on each flight. He said that “it could happen to anyone,” and it gave me perhaps the hardest reality check I’ve ever had when I heard about this. RIP to Tim, thank you for all the great experiences given.
I was a witness to this accident. I was eating breakfast at the Holiday Inn next door to the car dealership. I heard the propellers drone for about a second or two and then a loud crash that shook the hotel. An enormous fireball that seemed to engulf the entire sky. I told my two co workers that I just saw a plane crash and we ran out to see if we could find survivors. The plane had crashed into a parking lot of the dealership body shop and multiple cars were on fire and there were secondary explosions occurring from the burning cars so we couldn’t get very close. There were small parts of the plane scattered all over and the only recognizable price was a small section of the tail that still had the tail number legible. The engines were still running at the time of the crash as I could hear the props were loud.
Thanks Velke.
You from the area I live a few blocks from where the crash happened I herd the sirens and the bangs I didn’t see anything tho
Thank you Juan, I knew one of the pilots and PKB is my home airport. I live here in Marietta and will say. The pilots here at PKB are a tight group and are devastated by the loss of one of our own. The names have been released but I will just say, ES will be truly missed. Thank you for your factual information. Keep up the great work for the benefit of all of us pilots.
ES was my first instructor I have to say he was a good man he will be missed.
I'm so sorry for your loss gentleman.
He was my instructor in which I obtained my PPL, this is such a tragic event and I’m still in disbelief… my sincere condolences go out to his family and friends and all others whose lives he touched.
My heart goes out to y'all for your loss. 🌹
I'm sorry for your loss.
As a retired ATC, I'm each and every time impressed by your highly professional accident presentation. Thank you, Juan !!
Thank you Juan for the service you do for the aviation community.
As an airline captain for 33 years, I have flown several aircraft with similar deice systems as the KingAir. I retired from the airlines five years ago to fly in the corporate world. The first aircraft I flew as a corporate pilot was a KingAir 250.
I’ve been flying a KingAir C90 for the last 4yrs.
As I do believe that icing may have been a contributing factor, I have another thought.
During my last trip to the school house (FlightSafety Wichita) I was given (on final over the final approach fix) while configuring the aircraft (simulator)to land, an ‘asymmetric flap extension’. The auto pilot was engaged and was trying to keep the aircraft level. Since my hand was on the control wheel I felt the control wheel going full deflection to the left. My first thought was an ‘auto pilot trim runaway’ so I disconnected the auto pilot only to cause a violent roll to the right and the aircraft pitched straight down.
I obviously red screened the simulator as I was unable to recover with elevator and ailerons.
It was a valuable lesson learned. It all happened very fast.
I’m sure the NTSB will consider all possible scenarios
That has happened for real on other aircraft. There was a case on an Airbus where an asymmetric fuel leak resulted in the autopilot running out of roll control. When the crew noticed that when reaching a turn-point, the aircraft turned left rather than right and discontented the autopilot, the aircraft performed a 180 degree left roll and dive.
I agree that NTSB need to consider such eventualities.
Thank you for suggesting this possibility - definitely possible.
Autopilots + Icing can be a very bad combination.. what a shame these pilots lost their lives. RIP.
I just watched the NBC 4 interview with Dr. Pruchnicki… The airplane is most certainly *not* on fire as he suggests. The “smoke” he’s describing is just a video compression artifact as a new object moves across an otherwise stable image. As Juan already mentioned the “flame” was simply over exposed landing lights.
It frustrates me when “experts” make such quick and histrionic conclusions, especially in the context of public attention. I’m sure Dr. Pruchnicki was excited to be interviewed on TV, however it is baffling how he convinced himself that the aircraft was on fire; not to mention pretty unprofessional to make such a dramatic statement to the public.
Thanks for keeping everything straight Juan, you’re an invaluable resource to us in the aviation community and everyone else.
You may see two vertical smoke lines in the video that could simply be the exhaust fumes from the two (still running) engines. Which would imply that there was no engine failure or fire prior to the impact.
Thanks for this Juan
Thank you for sharing this. A hard lesson indeed. Be safe everybody!
Thank you JB. Prayers for their families and friends. RIP Eric and Tim.
I love that you go through and watch every video before you post. You brief subtitles that amend speaking errors really are a great attention to detail. I wish full time youtubers could do the same
Keeping icing systems in good check on very old aircraft is always a challenge. This incident has all the hallmarks of an icing issue, possibly over only one wing
JUAN, THANK YOU & KEEP UP THE GOOD WORK, GREAT VIDEO...WE ALL NEED TO HEAR THIS & PAY ATTENTION...
Another professional analysis, thank you Juan
I saw this on VAS Aviation.. my deepest condolences to all the families of the deceased.
Heartbreaking.
Thank You Juan
Thanks for sharing. Sad accident. Important to learn from it. Condolences. RIP.
always so educational, even for a land lubber! thanks for taking this accident apart . keep up the excellent work!
Juan, thanks for ALL your vids. My son-in-law runs his 1993 King Air C90A from McClellan. Never has had a problem (and he hires a professional pilot), but whenever I see 'King Air', I make note. I hope you follow-up with this story, very interesting to me (as his/and my daughter's, grandkids safety who occasionally fly in it are important to me ----- and I 'occasionally' stress safety to them). You DO make a difference.
Also N600JG happened the 18th too. It was sad towards the end he said tell my family I love them and ATC tried to keep him calm but he didn't make it.
Thank you for covering this. Living in Ohio this was in the news this morning. I’ve been wondering what caused the crash.
Horrible man just horrible. Prayers to all the families that lost a loved one in this accident
rime icing wing or tail stall, likely not experienced enough in ice with deteriorating speed causation in IMC. recipe for disaster, experienced or not. (could have also been oblivious to the ice, but IMO no, not with those flight hours and dual pilot)
Condolences to the families and friends of this tragedy 🙏 😢 Great work Juan and for giving heads up for other pilots of icing conditions risks.
Nice work as usual Juan. Sad story. Your ability to tell the story on these unfortunate mishaps is great. Very concise, well-organized, and backed by thorough knowledge of the subject.
Not to cast aspersions, I can see why that Ohio State prof left aircraft investigations and took up teaching. Short final stalls are really difficult to recover from. Great assessment Juan.
Used the boots on the Pilatus for the first time yesterday morning in Afton WY. That valley can build with considerable fog this time of year when the temps drop and the rivers and wet ground are still warm. There was a small precipitation system over the airport and we did pick up some of that as well. However, from experience at these western mountain airports, the fog from the warm rivers and bodies of water in these valleys and the cold air can cause considerable buildup given the correct conditions. Stay on top of your situational awareness fellow aviators. This time of year with the icing issues we have not flown in for months is not the time to be getting complacent. Myself and the copilot have all sorts of “games” we play (which is our self training) all the time to keep us sharp. These kinds of situations happen so fast, we don’t have time to think about it. It absolutely has to be second nature and muscle memory. Stay safe out there and condolences to our fellow aviators and loved ones of those who passed.
I landed with so much ice once that the guys in the tower laughed and laughed, and told me I had "littered all over their runway". When we did our 180 to taxi back, I saw they were right. All down the centerline. Looked like snowmen had fallen down all over the place.
I always respect my aircraft, but maybe never more so than when in icing conditions.
Ice should be in our drinks. Not on our aircraft.
Thank you for putting this all together. Fantastic reporting & explanation of everything.
Juan , terrible when these accidents occur , so sad to lose fellow aviators .. your coverage outstanding , thank you
wow Juan thanks for presenting this issue with such clarity!
Yet another one of your excellent presentations. Thank you!
thanks for the hard work keeping us safe Juan.
Thank you for the report Juan. Good luck to you!
Thank you for taking the time to cover this case. This was such a devastating accident in our community. I knew Eric Seevers, personally, and he was such a kind, caring man. He touched so many lives and this was such a tragedy. This was so unexpected and heart-wrenching. It helps to have some answers as to what happened to those men on that morning. I saw the posts and videos of the plane crashing on social media, almost immediately. I never imagined that it would hit so close to home. Eric was living his dream as a pilot, and it's devastating that something that he loved so much, ended up being his demise. RIP.
Good content.
Condolences to all affected.
Thank You Juan. I hadn't heard about this crash till I found your review.
Juan you became an indispensable reference source for aviation mishaps. Your analysis are objective and provide a service to the aviation community.
Please keep the good job. Thank you for your efforts.
Thanks, T. Great job.
Thanks for sharing that. Greetings from Switzerland.
This one is hitting close to home. Driven thru that area plenty of times, have extended family living outside of Marietta. Good video report Juan. Stay safe out there.
As a part 141 student I flew a stage check with Tim.... A bit of an old school style pilot but a great pilot none the less. Sad to hear about this.... R.I.P Tim, and R.I.P the other pilot who I did not have the pleasure of knowing. Thoughts and prayers for the families.
Same with me. Tim was an incredible person to fly with and learn from. He will be truly missed. 😔
So sorry for your loss. These good pilots are the ones who make flying worth it, if you ask me. I am so sorry. May they RIP. @@madisonbaird8668
Thank you Juan🤙🏼
Thank you for clearing that up. That’s why your the best.
Condolences to the families of those lost in this accident.
In the Navy we used to say, our procedures are written in blood. We can all learnnew or re-enforce lessons from this accident and unfortunately 2 people had to pay the price of that lesson. My sincere condolences to the families of the victims.
So sorry about this accident, but thank you for this informative video, as always. Great work.👍
Ugh RIP the two lost souls in this crash...terrible seeing the last moments of life...sympathies and condolences to the families of those whom perished.
Thank you for the always informative video Juan...whilst not a pilot myself...I'm sure those whom are will always take something of great value from these videos to use in their own flying and make their trips safer...and if it's only to be more mindful of the tiniest thing they hadn't been before...it's a good day.
Whilst it's unfortunate these video's are aired (i.e. they continue to happen) and the endstory is tragic...it serves purpose alone just to signify how fickle flying still is when all the parameters aren't in alignment...and how much concentration and alertness is required by a pilot of ANY aircraft at ALL times.
Cheers from Sydney Aus!!!!
Juan, Your usual excellent presentation. What ever happened occurred very quickly. The pilot on the radio sounded very professional and matter of fact. I have 1200 hours in a king air 200 and I found that it handled icing very well. Looking forward to the finished accident report. Always sad to see losses.like this.
Outstanding reporting Juan
Thank you.
I've flown with Eric and we have been friends for several years. One of the best people I've ever known. I live near the airport along the river. I saw on Facebook the day of the accident that a witness said that the plane "did several flips" before it came straight down. We are also inundated with Canada geese along the river. I'm not sure if this would be a possible cause or not. Either way, I'm sending up prayers for Eric's family and for the other gentleman's as well.
I thought about a bird strike as maybe being a cause of this accident.
More likely hitting unexpected imc briefly during iaf. Just a few seconds of imc while distracted by radios is enough loc
Thank you for your informative video. It is sad that the route to education is almost always a bitter tragedy. Please keep up the good work even if ideally it would be at the lowest possible frequency.
my call--iced horizontal stab before he applied flaps. after flaps deployed it changes center of lift of wing requiring higher down-force of H-Stab which stalled.
Condolences, config change at FAF
Concur
Thank you
As always, a thorough review of this accident. So sad, this is in my region and it hits ya right in the gut….
Juan, your analysis is spot on. Thank you.
Thanks for your professional review and concise presentation.
Excellent, thanks for sharing.
I've flown into PKB. The river valley is often fog covered during spring and fall when the water and air temps. It would be easy to fly into the fog and have the windows frost up on short final.
Very informative first look at this crash. I went and watched the video and I agree with you that the aircraft has no signs pre-impact smoke or fire. Not sure what their expert was looking at, except maybe the way the image pixelated at the trailing edge of the aircraft lights. The video was taken in low light, on a low resolution security camera, and the frame rate makes the moving lights appear elongated. Still good video evidence of final second. May those lost RIP. Prayers for the families.
Juan my condolences and prayers goes out to family members
Lived in that area and worked out of Marietta much of my life but had never seen the Parkersburg airport. That's life and weather in the hills. RIP to the pilots
Excellent report, RB, Nova Scotia, thank you.
My deepest condolences to the families and friends of these fine men. Lifting you all up in my prayers. 🙏🙏🙏❤️
Thanks for sharing
Great Job Juan, very professional presentation.
Great analysis as usual. Very sad to see these types of accidents happen. God speed to the crew..
paused your video when you said you couldnt post the footage, watched it, listened to the ATC. now im here to have my mind expanded further.
Tragic accident. Thanks for your fine coverage and explanation of the available data.
My first time watching this kind of video. Very informative and very professional. Thank you.
Welcome aboard!
Excellent brief. Thanks for your report.
Thanks Juan for covering this , this is local to me as I’m about 30mins south east of the accident, the weather was about 36 degrees at 7:00 EST where I live , and I also figured that the weather played a part in the tragic accident, as it is usually cooler over by the river by a few degrees
I'm in morgantown and as soon as I heard it on the news my mind went to ice also... it was just barely cold enough but I think it was.
Glad to finally find some more information on this. I live in Marietta and witnessed the crash from about a mile away. I was working overnight at the Walmart just down the main drag. My shift had just clocked out for the day Myself and a few coworkers were outside talking when it came down. I had line of sight on the aircraft for maybe 15 seconds before the fireball impact. The home I grew up in is roughly under pkb's holding loop and in the final descent path. Thank you for the information.
Probably not. King Air 90 is a single pilot airplane. I flew one the last 3 1/2 years of my career for Eagle Med, an EMS company. My passengers were a nurse, paramedic and a patient while flying him/her to a city with a hospital.
Thanks again, Juan.
This one hits hard. I used to live and work in that area. I know exactly where all this took place.
I know that area well, the terrain can do some strange things when the weather moves in. Prayers too all involved.
I checked Foreflight weather (a pilot app) about the time of the accident. The entire Ohio region was covered in icing conditions starting from 0-3k feet up to 15k feet. Low ceilings, clouds, mist, drizzle and rain, with temps just above or at freezing. I thought to myself this is the kind of weather I would not want to be flying around in. I'm not rated to fly anything as capable as a King Air but icing conditions would almost certainly have been encountered based on the available data. Could certainly have been something else but I think JB is on the money on this one. Condolences and thoughts to the families impacted by this.
so maybe the atc/tower controller should have warned them of icing conditions
Thanks fir your report, RB, Nova Scotia.
Could you do a video on the Aero Adventure Adventura II that crashed into a home at North Perry KHWO this past Monday the 17th
Thanks Juan
dang, didn't consider icing before entering final, realized he was icing during final and threw the deice switch at a critical time further reducing already compromised lift and no time to recover from the inevitable stall. sigh. number one rule... one thing at a time. never try to solve two problems at the same time. problem one being ice and problem two being the desire to get on the ground. if you are in this situation and have to deice during a critical flight period, remove the criticality first, then solve the new problem. meaning, abort the landing, add power first, then deice and go around. I'll toss this out as a reminder as well... your number one job is to FLY the plane NOT land the plane. If you do not FLY the plane, the plane will land it's self without your help, and usually not where you intended.
It´s indeed possible that it went this way.
This is a great comment on this situation.
Very well done as usual Juan. This is just so so sad for so many people. I think with almost no doubt this was ice related because I just don't see this pilot not keeping up with airspeed and/or angle of attack necessities on final.
Could it be engine icing? There is a standard switch two for each engine, with a heated element at the moth of rhe intake.
Looking over the altitude and speed graph the decent on final looks okay but the speed during is not? Maybe loss of Pitot-static?
Used to fly in there in the early-mid 90s with SAAB-340 on a 121 operation. Not much terrain nearby…
The King Air also has a rubber boot on the leading edge of the vertical tail, but not sure if it inflates, or what effect ice buildup here would have on flight…thanks for the report Juan
Not the same thing, of course, but a few years ago I was in a private aircraft on final approach to KPKB. Our aircraft hit a downdraft while over a mountain valley and immediately we lost several hundred feet of altitude. Fortunately the pilot was able to bring the aircraft back to altitude and we landed safely. It was a rather scary situation to say the least!
Another excellent analysis.
good stuff as always Juan
Great show
NWS CIP and FIP icing probability/severity graphical forecasts (historical) will give some decent insight into the actual icing potential along the flight route/altitude. These have come a long way and will undoubtedly be part of the NTSB weather package that is made for this accident.
So great to have Juan figure this stuff out.........its a skill not many have................
Great commentary Juan. Sad. Reminds me a bit of the aircraft that went down on approach into LBB likely associated with heavy airframe icing in freezing rain.
Well done Juan for alerting the on-line community of these types of tragic events. I’m about to call a young pilot friend who flies the King Air here in UK. He’s a co pilot on an air ambulance operation over here. I will let him know what you reported and no doubt he will review his knowledge and SOPs for Winter Ops. Many years ago , I lost an engine to ice on a practice single engine IFR approach at 500’. I performed a single engine go around using the remaining engine which had been at flight idle. We were not in icing conditions at the time, but had been earlier. The ice from earlier, had cleared from the wings , in vmc, prior to descent. We were down in warm , clear air when the engine failed. Some must have remained in the engine intake and broke off in the warm conditions. There was no engine anti ice like on the Airbus I’m on now. Icing conditions have to be respected. Condolences to family and friends of the 2 deceased.
Quite a few years ago, there was a Kingair crash at Reno under similar circumstances.
If I remember, the main cause was a faulty pneumatic tube that went to the boots on the elevator and rudder. These boots never inflated so ice continued to build up.
I don’t remember if the approach speed was normal or not.
I was one of those who mistakenly speculated about fire prior to impact. You did a great job of explaining the reason this was not the case. Thanks!
If you follow the link to the video of the crash, they strongly imply that their expert, a former airline pilot and accident investigator, said that the aircraft was “clearly on fire” before it hit the ground. So you are not alone.
It’s really weird that an “expert” would make a definitive statement like that either way. I look at it and I see fire or lights, I have no idea which, and smoke or compression artifacts in the video, also can’t tell which. Whatever is happening there, it is not “clear” that it is on fire.
(Hope it doesn’t sound like I’m criticizing your comment, I’m not. I’m criticizing the expert.) :)
@@mattj65816 After watching the video in the link, I see what you mean. I can understand why analysis of a low quality security camera video is subject to varying interpretation, especially when respected aviators with lots of experience see things so differently. Thank you for drawing my attention to the other video.
This was something I thought about with my mother, who is best friends with Tim’s widow. In the video you can clearly see the bright light that looks like a fire, but the video creator states the lights and landing/nav lights and what we thought was smoke as “heat signature”, which would be more transparent than what it shown. With a fire, instrument failure would be expected. Given that the accident happened in the dark, it would be easy to lose bearings without instruments. They fell out of the sky. Either way the circumstances are odd.
@@NEO-TROPOLIS I am so sorry for the suffering of his family and friends. Condolences.
@@NEO-TROPOLIS it's possible there is more to it, but it's like a 20% shot at best. The 80% case is that 1.5 years from now we get a probable cause from the NTSB to the effect of "pilot's failure to maintain sufficient airspeed and subsequent aerodynamic stall" or however the wording for that one goes. With ice, possibly, as a contributing factor.
Fire erupts, knocks out the instruments, and drops you out of the sky in
G,day from Sydney Australia.
No indication in the radio transmission of wing icing ?
🌏🇭🇲
all the atc calls were so normal crazy it went from that to what
looks like a near vertical crash in 40 seconds my prayers to the
familys involved
Iced up static port will make the airspeed indicator show higher speed than you have while descending
. They are right on track altitude wise on the whole approach but the speed is gradually reducing until they stalled.
WOW, what a great aircraft to fly.....sad.....Great debriefing.
Great presentation as always, Juan. Thx