Ludwig van Beethoven - Symphony no. 10
HTML-код
- Опубликовано: 19 фев 2012
- Ludwig van Beethoven's Symphony No. 10 in E flat major is a hypothetical work, assembled by Barry Cooper from Beethoven's fragmentary sketches. This title is controversial since it cannot be proved that all the sketches assembled were meant for the same piece. There is consensus, however, that Beethoven did intend another symphony.
cond. Walter Weller 
Видеоклипы
No matter how hard I try, he’s always staring at my forehead
I turned my phone upside down and he stopped doing that
Turn your phone off boom
LMAO
Mr. S Ramanujan brought me here :) discovering that i m not the only one... funny :)
olivier SIMON SAME!! I’ve just seen the movie. ^^
The man who knew infinity, just watched it
Ramanujam....may he rest in peace......I am crying now..
Same
Same!
If only Beethoven lived a few years longer
There is no if in history
If only Mozart lived a few years longer...
If only Chopin lived a few years longer...
If only Rachmaninoff lived a few years longer...
If only Stravinsky lived a few years longer...
THERE IS NO "IF" IN HISTORY!!
Marshal Beard lol he would have been executed in nuremburg
Marshal Beard Oh now I can see that you are a stupid nazi
Vagner Pereira At the very most you can say I have a passion for Hitler's obsession with technological advancements in warfare among other things. Also, how is he being racist and how am I supporting it....? Oh and by the way, if it weren't for the Americans showing up during WWII at the time they did and not a year or two later, you could expect aircraft resembling the B2 bomber dropping nukes in London or via sub-orbital rocket powered bombers well before 1950... Maybe you should be thanking America? Point is, many countries can be thanking many others, and therefore whatever point you're trying to make is pretty stupid and you're the one being racist. Anyway, I'm not wasting anymore time on you considering you think I'm a stupid Nazi. Before you start calling me a fat murican or some other insult as silly as your last, I'll let you know that I'm just a Canadian that doesn't really like the U.S much.
I'd give 10 years of my life to give 10 more to Beethoven.
Maybe you did
Lol
i presset the button 10000000000000 times! :D Just imagine what Beethoven would have done in that time, but otherwise, his dead was a big relief for sure. (for him of course).
Just let everyone on earth die one day earlier and give that day to Beethoven. He would live for more than 7 Billion days
your 10 years like 10 min fo him
Imagine how richer the world would have been if Beethoven and Mozart had lived another 30 years. The mind boggles at the possibilities.
Barry Cooper has done a remarkable job in bringing together fragments of very little readable scores left by Beethoven.
i sure know that beethoven wuz messy
like the mess up on fur elise
Are you still alive?
"I woke up. The pain and sickness all over me like an animal. Then I realized what it was. The music coming up from the floor was our old friend, Ludwig Van, and the dreaded Ninth Symphony."
Bluswede Clockwork Orange?
@@kenmoore137
LOL!...yup, I couldn't help myself!
Can you imagine the things we will never hear because these greats were struck down ahead of time! It makes me rather sad actually
"No human being has ever died complete."
It is really sad. But just think, imagine we never had him, like he died as an infant (as most did back then). And think of all the people who would have been great composers but died too young to write anything. There's got to be a few
Imagine him dying before his 9th
It must be.
Beethoven was born in 1770. The closest numbers I could find were for 1800, when life expectancy in Europe was about 34 years in average. Beethoven died when he was 56. Statistically speaking, he lived far longer than could have been expected. We should be grateful he grew so old. I don’t see the tragedy. He left a mostly complete oeuvre, too. Sure, a tenth would have been nice - but the 9th... what a climax to end on! What work could possibly achieve more. Just imagine his last symphony would have been more like the 8th. Then, many would say he might have ended on a slight low (in comparison to the rest of his works of course - generally, the 8th is still an amazing work of art!).
Whether this is considered a hypothetical work or not, elements of it that prove that the sketches it's taken from could only have been written by one person. It deserves recognition and Mr Cooper deserves congratulation.
Oh how I do agree with you David.Pure genius.
@@petercook4070 Thank you Peter.
4:46 to 11:50 is pure Beethoven.
Right 😄
Sounds more Brahms in some parts
I agree. But it also sounds much like Brahms’s first movement of his first symphony.
Yes, it is typical Beethoven: contrasting dynamics, dim 7ths, syncopated rhythms and overall, clever use of the motif, widely. I believe Barry Cooper has assembled these fragmentary sketches very accurately. It's a great work!
@@chrisclr i always feel that beethoven mostly uses minor keys and a lot of weird keys in his pieces. That emphasizes the shit's his been through in his life. While mozart uses a lot of joyful music almost like a children songs. Bottom line i tend to think that beethovens music is more matture
For the first 4 and half minutes Beethoven is playing around and then he thinks, okay, time to make things more interesting.
thank u so much, im laughing a lot
I'm seeing it for the first time when i saw you comt so i take it to 4 and half mn 😂
Standard Beethoven approach in many of his works. A long introduction then the music takes off. Good example is the first movement to his 7th symphony, or the 4th piano concerto.
@@malcolmabram2957 nicely said sir.
its the story, the buildup
No question...at least for me...that this was written by Beethoven. This piece carries his own musical fingerprints that nobody on earth mimic or come out with something close to it. Each musician has his own soul in his music, and this one definitely carries Beethoven’s. If only he had lived to finish it. Maybe destiny wanted Beethoven’s ninth to remain the pinnacle of symphonies. RIP Ludwig
I'd be willing to bet this could have broken more grounds than his 9th.
@@scotchwhisky6094 It kind of lacks the incredible structural elements of the 9th. The 9th was the first time we have heard the sonata form being streched this much. Also the 72 minutes length of the symphony was unheard of at the time.(The CD Audio format was chosen to be 72 minutes long, so that the 9th Symphony would fit perfectly.).
@Tunahan Karatay 74 minutes, right?
He took an average of 5 years on every masterpiece. His 9th took 20 years. He knew due to failing health that the 9th would be his last.❤
@@tunahankaratay1523structure? Once he went deaf, structure went out the window. He pieced together stuff, then he reworked until he was happy. Lucky for him, his lack of creativity to follow a structure blueprint was seen as revolutionary and ahead of his time. But in reality he wrote what sounded good in his heart and to impress some mystery woman.
Beethoven wrote little notes to himself with ideas that sometimes resonated in his mind for years. This music in interesting. Even Beethoven's doodles are good music.
More orchestras should play this. Cooper did a wonderful job, and I would love to listen to the symphony at a live performance.
I remember the first time hearing this (many) years ago. After rushing home from the music store with my surprise CD find, I threw it into the CD player and was instantly lost in a never-to-be world. By the time the last quiet notes faded away I was frozen for quite a surprising length of time in a state of depression and sadness at the thought of what could have been if Beethoven was gifted a few more years. The world was robbed by Beethoven's unfortunate death of another towering musical accomplishment. But Dr Cooper masterfully created for us what could have been. To this day every time I listen to this piece of music I get that same feeling of loss. I'm sure it's partly due to the music itself, but without a doubt it is from losing such a musical force far, far too soon. We are so much richer from what Beethoven gave the world. May God grant him back the life that was stolen from him, peace, and rest from his struggles.
his death at 56 was as great a loss as mozart's early death
After hearing Beethoven's music one can easily say that Mr. Cooper has done a great job with this piece. It is all Beethoven's music and a great piece of music at that.
It is not Beethoven.
No it's not all Beethoven's music. Cooper contributed a great deal to flesh out Beethoven's unrevised first thoughts some of which are good and others that are too reminiscent of earlier works.
This Symphony gave me goosebumps for some reason.
the first 2 minutes of the no. 9 symphony does the same to me every time
This Symphony makes me more alone....
Me too, a bit -- because the fragments are from so soon before he was to die.
Beethoven is judging your life decisions
It's great to hear the themes that Beethoven had in mind. Of course Beethoven's symphonies would at times seem to lift off the ground as if by magic, but this piece is still on the runway.
@ 4:46 is when I start to hear Beethoven.
agreed
Ohhhh yes that blasted my ears😂😂
THAT ROCKED THE B----LLS OUT OF ME! HEAVY!
I was doing some revision and that just came. Damn almost gave me a heart attack
To me it sounds more like Brahms plus a little bit of Mendelssohn, although there is some resemblance to Beethoven as well.
But the first part, although a bit less spiced up than he would, has an unmistakable flavor of Beethoven in it.
Leaving unfinished work is how I believe that only great people give a hand in helping another to become just as great or greater..... It's a circle and f paying it forward.
+Desiree Aguilar I like the fact that he saw fit to leave unfinished work, despite what I'm sure would have been his lessening health. Keep kicking till there is nothing left to kick I say!
if you think about what he wouldve done with the music, its kind of sad that he died
all becuze of the STUPID THUNDERSTORM :(:(:(:(:
13:37 Sonata "Pathetique" second movement.
the theme appears first at 0:09
same thing happens in the 3rd mvt of his 9th
If that reconstruction sounds great... ¡Imagine if Beethoven had finished his work!
I remember my stepfather giving me a first edition cassette by Dr. Cooper with "Beethoven Symphony No. 10" on the cover. You should have seen the "?" floating over the top of my head! It all makes me wish Louie had lived longer. But we are so fortunate to have had his contributions touch our lives. He truly saved my life in a time of darkness.
As can i, my rational is that if a man who couldnt even hear his own works had the ability to change the world whats to say i cant try and do the same
@Potpourri 1951 i'm sorry to hear from your loss :( as long you can keep enjoying the beauty of life :)
My life, too together with Schubert
I can't say that Beethoven saved my life, but what I can say is that there are times that I listen to him, he speaks to me like no other composer can, telling me that life is bloody tough, full of disappointment, despair, tragedy and sorrow; but that it is also precious, beautiful and wonderful too. He is a very human composer that speaks to us still vividly 200 years after his time.
I practically grew up with Beethoven, especially his symphonies. These always provided support when I needed it most. First time for me to listen to #"10". Sounds pretty good so far half way down the 1st movement.
The story behind this is really fascinating. This is good music. 10/10.
I see you standing in front of God, and saying: your creation, the Earth is fantastic, America has a wonderful shape, but, on the other hand Africa is way too large, and Australia simply flows away. If you saw the movie: Copying Beethoven.
@@aronollerer5745 🧐?
100/10
This would have been one of his best compositions had he completed it, no doubt. If this is what a bunch of sketches sound like pasted together, the full thing would have divine
Oh, Alekhine... Why did you not accept the challenge of the Capa?
Yo Alekhine how's it going against Capablanca? Have you beaten him in heaven yet?
Ten to one says there are more unfinished works of his that they pending the outcome of this one might work on and release as well 🤔
Exactly, it has that eroica fire to it
@@kellymiller1309 how about the 6th piano concerto in D Major? Beethoven actually finished (not just sketched) about 4 minutes of it. There is a recording of one mvt of it.
Lots of people are saying how it doesn't really sound like Beethoven. Well, even if it's not quite Beethoven, I think Mr. Cooper did a pretty fine job at the completion. Then again, Sussmayer's completion of Mozart's Requiem is accepted as OK and yet, Mozart didn't even have fragments of the last half of the piece -- 50% of the piece is completely Sussmayer's work. So even if like 40% of this is connecting material between 60% original Beethoven fragments, that should still be better.
I absollutely do agree.
Absolutely
Remember though that Süssmayr was Mozart's student, which isn't the case for Cooper obviously, but still the completions we hear here and in Mozart's Requiem remain hypothetical but they still are beautiful in their own way !
Cooper is a highly respected Beethoven scholar, though. His edition of the Beethoven piano sonatas is one of the most thoroughly researched. I think this counts for even more than being the composer's student because students don't typically go through everything their teacher ever did with a fine-toothed comb.
OMG, how can someome say that this doesn't sound like Beethoven?? It does unmistakably sound like his music (some fragments clearly resemble the 9th and the 5th). However, the overall structure is indeed weaker than an actual Beethoven's symphony due to the fact that a) it's made of glued sketches and b) Cooper is not Beethoven!
I was expecting Brahms' 1st
Good man
most clever, classical music comment ever
@@johnbarry5036 it's a common joke among musicians probably since Brahms premiered it
oooof
Sshooter444 And Brahms did not like it much.
Mr Cooper does an incredible job here, 9.5 out of 10: he certainly produces a very good facsimile of Beethoven's later Symphonic and Choral works. He is to be congratulated for musically "channeling" Beethoven so well. Just a few spots here and there where he seems unsteady or uncertain, but otherwise really marvelous for such a reconstruction as this,- the overall spirit of Beethoven is certainly present here, and at times it's Beethoven himself that lives and speaks again through this piece..
i will say that i agree with you very much. The end wasnt as good though
@@illusionparagon9006 I'm just confused as to why it ends in E-flat Major when the main section is in C Minor and the very opening is ambiguous (though it makes more sense to me to start on the dominant than on the mediant)
What if cooper was possessed by Beethoven?
@@illusionparagon9006 The endings Beethoven wrote often weren't very good, either...
I'm sorry, but I beg to differ!
Beethoven is staring on my hair
I think he didn't like it
At. Not "on". "At".
Perhaps thinking of it as Sibelius thought of his discarded Eighth Symphony?
😂
Même si les fragments laissés par Beethoven ne sont que parcellaires, le travail de reconstitution effectué par Mr Cooper est remarquable.
Since Ludwig left a bunch of sketches lying around, this is a nice way to gather them together, to tie together these loose ends, so to speak. It does grant a sort of closure to the great man.
It's too bad Mozart's sketches are a different story since most were destroyed by his wife following his premature death in 1791.
I am listening from 4.46 to 11.55 again and again. I will never be tired of it. It sounds like a thunder not even the nature itself would be capable of. A roar, a scream never heard before. The eye of the hurricane is recognizable only fleetingly yet of such power and majesty to move mountains.
Fragmentary sketches is the last gift of Beethoven for the mankind. Thank you very much Ludwig.
Barry Cooper has done a good job. It wouldn´t be surprising, if Beethoven had done more or less the same. After all, he was on his way to later romanticism in his very last works... and even further ahead.
It is surprisingly beethovenish.
Zan Huang amazing.Its almost as if Beethoven wrote it. You can tell this guy did his research
J Paul lol
J Paul He says this because the piece was arranged from bits and pieces of a sketch, and stuff would have had to be added in. There’s also no way of knowing if all of the sketches were intended to be in the same piece
@@fletchercalderbank8498 Yes but Beethoven did write the melodies so it would've definitely sounded Beethovenish, even more so if they added accompaniment based on his style (which they did)
No shit Sherlock 😂
I really enjoy this fragmented piece. It's even more touching for me than the 9th symphony in certain parts. I hope I get to hear his other symphonies in the afterlife.
Me to👍
سيأخذ ابليس موقع الاكسترا يوم إذن ستكون موسقى مثيرة للمسخرة حين يشهد مسرحها من يشهدون جهنم ، اظن ايضا في المستقبل القريب سيتم تجهيز مسرح لا بأس به ، ستكون الكثير من جماجم اليهود حاضرة كتلال و جثامينهم منتشرة على سحر البحر الأبيض الذي ينتمي الى سيناء ذات الرمال الحمراء ، كونوا متجهزين ويقضين لليوم العظيم ايها الأوباش السفلة الهالكين .
Very interesting ideas presented here both musically and in the comments section. My feelings about this piece really concern it's "rambling" nature, which makes it very distinct from B's other symphonies. In many respects, thematic treatments resemble his construction of his last (and even some of his earlier) string quartets, which does make some sense considering the suspected time chronology here. His later string quartets are brilliant, deep, profound ruminations much like what we hear in this purported 10th Symphony. It seems almost like B was rambling and ruminating musically, almost in experimental fashion, to see if he could construct a work not so much to outdo his 9th but one that he could consider worthy of the title of a Beethoven symphony. Without going into great detail here, what really makes for a great symphonic masterpiece (not only B's which especially is the case) is what I call an "economy" of composition. The energy and therefore what I believe to be a strong element of the appeal of B's symphonies is how musically he travels from one musical idea to the next in a very short time span. As an example, turn to B's piano sonatas, which I believe was his greatest experimental tool which led to much of his genius musical compositions. As an example, listen to his 7th piano sonata: the 1st movement exposition, according to some musical scholars, contain about 7 different themes which are very short and certainly likable because of how they flow effortlessly and appealingly from one to next, without much if any musical rambling. This, I believe,
is a quality of B's genius musicianship which places his symphonic writing in the absolute pinnacle of such. This philosophy of musical composition, I believe, was summed up quite succinctly by none other than J. Brahms who opined (I'm paraphrasing here) that great musical writing involves not only knowing when to start composing but, more importantly, knowing when to stop! Enough said.
Of course you can't compose a 10th symphony while decomposing!
+artman40 But maybe later as a spooky skeleton!
artman40 if you can compose it as deaf, you can play it as dead
You're so right he only composed 9!!!!! Not 10. 9!however made this was not that bright/smart
Quinny Hainer Read the video description maybe?
@@learnsomethingsimple7903 beethoven dued writing the 10th Symphony. This is an finished piece drawn from those sketches. Yes it isnt his completed work but for thr man who died writing it...its fitting and very much in line with his later works.
I am glad these 'partial' symphony fragments are available. I am delighted with this bonus. 'From the heart to the heart'. Thank you, Ludwig.
¿como es posible componer cosas tan maravillosas estando sordo?
¿un compositor que no escucha su propia musica?
este hombre, sin duda fue increible.
no se como 10 personas pueden odiar este video
Gibran pues diez bestias q mas
Tenia 13 años cuando escribi ese comentario
He vuelto, en cuarentena a volver a escuchar esta joya
@@harryk4840 fua te acordas cuando habían dislikes en youtube? los extraño mucho
@@speedynacho5097 hombre, fue hasta hace poco
What can I say? It's not really 'real', I know, but I still love it. It does give me what I expect to have when I put on a Beethoven record.
A monster of a work and delicious listening. Thank you, Mr. Cooper, for your courage to dare to touch the fragments of the great Beethoven. May he pat your back with approval from the other end. :)
No longer am I afraid of dying. The master will be there and the ultimate symphony will be heard.
Amen. I hope to hear his godly 10th too.
gosh, the first 4:45 seconds is absolutely beautiful. Mr. Cooper has performed a great service!
I meant the first four minutes and forty five seconds, obviously.
AntiProUltra
It's like walking into a painter's studio and ruffling though his desk with all of his sketches. The outflow of uncompleted ideas that are little more than doodles, many of which were discarded.
It's exciting to think, that some of this could have potentially be crafted into a pillar of music that might have resonated and affected the world over. We will never know what he had planned for the music.
Beethoven's genius was contagious. Had Ludwig lived a longer life, the music world would've hemorrhaged his illustrious symphonies. Kudos!
I could say same with mozart. Give mozart 30 more years , and he would've blown even Beethoven away
this is quite stunning - one can hear a continuation of sorts along some of the musical paths Beethoven had explored in the 9th - one hears both the ruggedly bold profound utterances and the peacefully sublime sections of pure heavenly light
Whether all these fragments were meant for Beethoven's 10th or not, Cooper definitely did a good job arranging them into a movement of Beethoven sketches. It sounds believable for a 10th symphony. Asides from the fact that I have found letters or diary entries that Beethoven wrote saying that he was planning on writing a 10th Symphony, this music also makes sense for a 10th Symphony. Beethoven's symphonies followed a trend: symphonies 3, 5, 7, and 9 are very dynamic, while symphonies 4, 6, and 8 are less dynamic. Therefore, since this music is not as dynamic as Beethoven's odd numbered symphonies, it would make sense to assume that it was for his 10th symphony.
What's the relation of Mr. S Ramanujan and this 10th Symphony could anyone tell about this?
Its a metaphor
Got it!
Mr. S Ramanujan Notebook and 10th symphony lost, but when they found. Both equalized in matter of greatness.
This is like more precise reason, thanks.
Ankit Singh Rathor thank you
I don't even know how many times I've listened to this little musical gem, many, many times: I always come to the same conclusion. If only Beethoven had had a few years of time, today we would be talking about a beautiful tenth symphony, which would join the remaining nine, one more beautiful than the other. Let's consider ourselves lucky that these notes have reached our days and that someone has worked to make them usable to the public.
From sketches almost unreadable to this beauty Mr cooper is to be thankful for this achievement.
I accept this is really Beethoven 10-Th. symphony.Maestro Barry Cooper did really very difficult work to find and understand the Beethoven’s sketches.
It was not finished but it doesn’t matter also us Mozart ‘s Requiem the same situation difference is only that after Mozart Requiem wife Constance should finished is because Mozart already got the payment for his Requiem but Beethoven wrote it for himself.Why it similar with real Beethoven?Because the theme of Symphony No 9 Adagio also piano sonata Patetique also many Beethoven’s slow movements have similar atmosphere and melodies also the scherzo is typically Beethoven’s scherzo also it sounds and harmonically more higher than Symphony No 9 it going more and more faraway from classical music like XX century music,same as in last Beethoven’s string quartets No 13,14 in his last pieces Beethoven’s music complete different with that music which he composed before Symphony No 9,I can say just his Symphony No 4 the beginning also piano concerto No 4 similar with his last works.
The problem that many orchestras now have scare to accept official that it really Beethoven’s No 10 I think it’s pity .in future it will be acceptable I am shore about it.I am going to perform it someday too.
Maestro Cooper and orchestra that perform this piece on this recording Bravi! Thank you very much for downloading.
"Oh if only had Beethoven lived a little longer..."
He had and finished the Ninth.
? He would have finished this. He finished the 9th like 3 years before his death.
And if Schubert had lived a little longer... If Bruckner had lived a little longer... If Mahler lived a little longer... and so on... :S
The 1st main theme is very similar to the Aria from Fidelio (Florestan): "In des Lebens Frühlingstagen" - 2nd act, which is in Ab-Major, very close to this Eb-Major. If Beethoven really intended to use this for his new symphony he would have revised it a great lot before completion. So this version is not only purely hypothetical, but definitely far from any final state. However - better than nothing, the c-minor section sounds quite convincing ... but Beethoven would have made much more of it.
It is similar, but the Fidelio version is clearly better, and not so repetitive.
@@peace-now Yes, I agree ... much more ...but as the numerous scetches of Beethoven show: he worked immensly on his 1st ideas until they were heavily improved and far better - and this stage of his work is clearly missing here, something that no "arranger" could do, because it means to change the few material we´ve got from B.
I commend the excellent work here by Barry Cooper. My only quibble is that stylistically this appears to have more in common with Beethoven's earlier works than his later works. I think a 10th Symphony, written after the 9th, would be reflective of the more unconventional sound world evident in the late string quartets and late piano sonatas. Yes, it would probably be lyrical rather than titanic (to fit Beethoven's custom of his even-numbered symphonies), but it would be more of an introspective lyricism, pushing Classic boundaries of harmony and structure. That is what I don't hear in this work.
Indeed, this symphony reminds me more of Eroica and the Fifth Symphony than anything else. The heroism of the Eroica and Eb major contrasted with the bombastic drama of C minor and the Fifth Symphony. And is it just me or is there the Fate Motif in the C minor section? I hear a lot of short, short, short, long rhythms in there, same rhythm as Beethoven's Fifth. And I hear a lot of what sounds like rhythmic variants of that motif as well, like short, short, long, or just the 3 short notes.
yes.
I'm not a Beethoven or music expert. However, from a Blues and Rock singer it sounds so gooooood. Thanks Dr. Cooper. After having a couple of hours of hard and constant beat, this is just lovely...
I think Beethoven would approve of this rendition. Very well done, Mr. Cooper
If this had been found as a completed manuscript, and put forth as assembled sketches. I think you would still have a lot of people rip into it just because they could. Let's just be happy that a skilled musician and historian gave us more than a glimpse into Beethoven's last thoughts.
Beethoven's biographer was with Beethoven in his chambers, and Beethoven played on the piano the commissioned Tenth. His biographer's description of what he played, starting slow, then allegro, then resuming the slow section (A,B1,B2,A), corresponds to this realisation.
These sketches were clearly meant for his tenth symphony as Cooper explains it, but wether Beethoven would cast them aside is another matter. Personally, even though Beethoven must have been fond of it, I don't think he would have settled for a theme very much like the second movement to the Pathetique and the third movement of the ninth which he does here. I disagree with a lot of commenters, I think it sounds *very much* like Beethoven, but it's 'normal' and if he intended it to be a pair with ninth like he paired the 5th and the 6th, completely unsuitable. Fantastic work nonetheless!...
I think you are right
Beethoven's 7th and 8th are very similar in some aspects... an example of this is the 8th finale which suggests that it would be a continuation of the 7th finale, as Beethoven composed these two symphonies in the same year. The 8th symphony was heavily criticized at the time for being a classical style (but that was Beethoven's intention, as his last three were a success, he wanted to remember the classical style), and Beethoven felt the criticism and was very upset. During that time until the ode to joy (1824) he composed relatively little for orchestra (apart from the opera Fidelio and the solemn mass that was a year before the 9th tune) considering the late stage of Beethoven dedicating himself to his piano sonatas/ cello. in 1814 he even started the piano concerto no. 6 however he gave up, the score itself indicated Beethoven's indecisions. And in 1815 he starts a terrible battle for custody of his nephew (since his brother had died) so it cost a lot of emotional wear reflecting in his songs. his 9th symphony in 1824 was the work that cleansed the soul, as it was everything he composed and felt, played in music... in 1826 his nephew Karl van Beethoven attempted suicide. With the guilt of almost a suicide Beethoven began to feel severe abdominal pains caused by anxiety and alcoholism... in 1827 he unfortunately died because of this, but in the draft of the 10th symphony (in 1825) it could be the beginning of a great work already that in some final drafts he showed irregular rhythms (now known as ragtime, this is made clear in his last piano sonata in variation no. 3 arietta), and claiming that these irregular rhythms were all the pain he endured during his life... I think his 10th symphony would be his last symphony because he recognized that he was very old and would not survive for a long time, but I would imagine this symphony as something shocking and complex to understand, (perhaps even being a symphony of modern times) after all it is about out of the whole life of Beethoven
Anyway, this is a wonderful piece of music, breathing Van Beethoven 's soul! Barry Cooper understands Van Beethoven deeply so and the work he brings is entirely worthy to go for the completed 10th!
I don't know, but after the 9th Symphony it's hard to imagine what was in his brilliant mind ...
Even with all of the criticism, people who say that this doesn't sound like Beethoven, or it doesn't feel like a Symphony 10, I think that this music is just fine as it is. Barry Cooper is who we should thank for, since if not because of him, we wouldn't be listening to a hypothetical 10th Symphony. This music is still good, and it sure would have been a great mystery what Beethoven would have decided to throw into this piece, it is something that I think in my mind: what would Beethoven have done.
Such a pity he didn’t finish, listen to the heroic roar! Sounds like he’s going to swallow the universe!
Leave his 9th in the shadows for the almighty 10th!
this is actually really good
yu mean yu didnt think it wuz good?
@@illusionparagon9006: For an incomplete piece that was later realized, it sounds very good.
Your grammar, however, could use a quick tune up. 😉
@Spellcaster86: Yeah yeah yeah...
I almost feel like the meat is all beethoven but the garnish seems to be an imitation. has the free flowing form of his late quartets. i enjoyed listening to this a lot.
Hört sich ganz hervorragend an, obwohl diese Sinfonie von diesem großen Meister nicht vollendet wurde. Barry Cooper hat sie sehr gut hervorgebracht! Die Melodie der 10. Sinfonie ist wirklich Super!
the way music goes to the soul
I think Beethoven would like this..... I love this symphony and play it over and over again....
An inresting attempt but let's remember that Beethoven used to work for a long time wrinting and re-writing and correcting his scores. A premier jet (early sketch) has not to be taken as a result.
Correct!
Is the orchestration Beethoven's or did someone else orchestrate the Master's ruminations. Lots of characteristic gestures here, but of course not cohesive. I'm glad this music was posted for us to hear.
According to Wikipedia, "Symphony No. 10 in E♭ major is a hypothetical work, assembled in 1988 by Barry Cooper from Beethoven's fragmentary sketches for the first movement."
This is Beethoven, but not really. 🤔
Nicely done, Barry. But it feels to me that the longer overarching Beethoven themes that wrap around the shorter subjects are not there. If there were less modulations from one subject to another, if it were less busy, less like a lesser composer trying too hard, then it would feel more genuine. Some of the modulations are not quite Beethoven, but the subjects themselves - thrilling!
Beethoven could go completely out of character and yet still be Beethoven. In Hammerklavier and other late piano sonatas, and late string quartets for example, his mind wanders into and gets stuck in dark, unhappy places from which you think, "when are you coming back". But this different music is still in some way Beethoven. That means I am either brainwashing myself with a placebo effect of knowing it's Beethoven, or there is always something there even if one can't precisely put one's finger on it.
Beautifully put
Sono sempre momenti affascinanti entrare nel clima del primo Romanticismo; c'è sempre qualcosa di grande, anche se a frammenti. Lì intorno aleggia ancora l'epopea napoleonica di cui Beethoven è stato la "colonna sonora".
Remarquable ! Du vrai Beethoven ! Excellente performance. Je découvre cette œuvre avec tant de joie et d'émerveillement en écoutant la partie centrale. Brillant ! Phénomenal 👏
Merci Barry Cooper.
To those who think that this symphony-in-the-making has not "enough power to it" or that "this doesn't sound like Beethoven": of course, it doesn't. The video's description doesn't have to repeat itself that *these are just fragments* compiled together by some guy in the future. (i.e. Barry Cooper), and so this couldn't have been the final form, or even a final symphony.
Had Beethoven lived long enough, he would have given this the "power" and "UNF" so wanted and expected from him.
This music sounds like sketches of several different movements. Strung together, they are a bunch of expositions and are not yet developed into a cohesive work.
Yes in Ramanujan's movie talks about this symphony.
They are genius that come world to share an teaches knowledge to humanity.
I bought this CD over twenty years ago, the music is followed by a lecture on how it was all brought together from notes that Beethoven had left
Según el sitio de Wikipedia, un texto de la biografía de Beethoven acerca de la obra dice lo siguiente:
La salud del maestro decayó inexorablemente durante su estancia en la casa de su hermano en Gneixendorf, a pesar de los cuidados de su familia. Su hermano Nikolaus Johann recordaba: «Al almuerzo comía únicamente huevos pasados por agua, pero después bebía más vino, y así a menudo padecía diarrea, de modo que se le agrandó cada vez más el vientre, y durante mucho tiempo lo llevó vendado». Tenía edemas en los pies y se quejaba continuamente de sed, dolores de vientre y pérdida de apetito. En esa época, comenzó la composición de la Décima sinfonía.
Esto quiere decir que la sinfonía empezó a escribirse entre 1822 y 1824 pero nunca vio la luz. También tenía planes para un quinteto (comisionado por el editor Anton Diabelli); sin embargo, ninguna de estas obras llegó más allá de una etapa de esbozos.
Opening theme sounds vaguely like the 3rd movement of the 9th symphony. The 6/8 C minor stuff sounds a lot more like late Beethoven. It still would have needed some baking by the master...but very promising stuff.
Michael Canales Certainly, yes.
Sounds like Brahms played extremely heavily
Several times I half expected the symphony to just turb into Brahms1
If these were authentic Beethoven fragments I would categorize them along with his middle period works as evinced by the themes and the developments which seem to indicate an earlier work. The 9th symphony had already shown us how robustly rhythmical, at times sublime, and oftentimes unpredictable his themes had grown, and listening to this recording here seems to suggest that it could be an earlier work.
His 9th belongs to his late period, exhibiting signs of great maturity and spirituality with regards to the themes (and programs). Even his late period piano works such as the last piano sonata #32 demonstrates how he treats his themes and dresses them up with such masterful touches in embellishments, rhythms and virtuosic techniques. He has long departed from the Haydn-ian and Mozartian molds so that his late period presents the mark of a "made" and fully rounded Beethovenian flavor, no longer beholden to his predecessors, nor tied in parallel with contemporaries like Hummel.
If the work recorded here were to be a piano work with orchestra, I would tie it in to the same period as the 4th piano concerto, or place it between the 8th and 9th symphonies.
tuberobotto It’s strange... but I would have to say this is in a way a new mold. It’s everything from his whole life in one. It reminds me of so much of Beethoven. I almost like the thought that he never finished it. It’s almost more satisfying than any real conclusion
danky in music history we have had cases of composers setting aside certain works for later completion or revisions, it could be an early, middle or late work but there are such cases that I have read about though I just can't pin one right now. To be honest, I don't think the same had been told about Beethoven who as a musician, was somehow portrayed to be thoroughly meticulous that he attended the rehearsal of his violin concerto to see if it was being played as he intended it. I don't know if that anecdote is genuine but there are other stories portraying him as thorough. My point here is that with a thorough artist like him I don't think he'd leave any unfinished work or manuscript lying around. He did live long, in fact longer than Mozart did, to not leave behind any unfinished work. Maybe until I hear from an honest musicologist or historian that Beethoven DID have unfinished works, then I'll concede.
The work performed here is a wonderful piece I agree, and though I I tried to pin it to one of the stages of his musical career, I'm scared to discover eventually that it might not be even his composition. I guess every human being would have that same reservation and hesitation.
tuberobotto I didn’t even consider how little we actually can really pin point! we’ll probably never know what was intended with this piece. And we’ll neither know how much of the accountability of Beethoven, himself, is actually credible.
Barry Cooper said: "It also sounds more typical of middle period than late Beethoven, although this may be due to the close connections with the early piano sonatos [sic]."
This is beauty in its purest form. Bakunin said to wagner this is the only piece of music that would survive.
Después de la novena sinfonia "Himno de la alegría" Beethoven desnudo su inspiración, y presentó su alma tal como la sentía y vivía...desbrozó todas las ramas que le dificultaban caminar y ver la luz ...y armado de sinceridad y transparencia genuina esbozó estas notas de sinceridad... La Sinfonia Sincera!!!
I just discovered there was even an unfinished 10th symphony becasue of the news to finish it using AI. This just made my month lol.
Elad Mashiah Pity we won’t be seeing it this year in all likelyhood...
Beethoven já tinha inovado tanto nas sinfonias. A Sinfonia nº 3 em Mi bemol maior considerada a primeira romântica, a 5ª Sinfonia em Dó menor com as células musicais de uma forte personalidade musical, a 6ª com um sentimento bucólico e o uso de instrumentos para imitar animais, algo nunca feito antes numa sinfonia. A 7, dispensa comentários. a 8ª com o olhar irônico para o período Clássico, uma joia preciosa. A nona com o coral e o esgotamento aparente da música, que fez compositores contemporâneos como Franz Schubert e posteriores como Wagner afirmar que não tinha mais o que compor. Imagino com a intencionalidade de uma 10ª sinfonia o que nos aguardaria desse gênio.
Gostei da sua colocação
This is absolutely very fascinating attempt by scholar Barry Cooper to reconstruct the first movement of Beethoven’s 10th Symphony. Mostly it sounds very familiar in its musical language, for me however, it comes closer to the composer’s earlier composing period (etc. ’Eroica’ Symphony No. 3) than his late style. As there are sketches also to the remainder movements (not enough for reconstruction, though) it would have been interesting to know how Beethoven would have finished the work. He was clearly turning back to more Classical musical language instead of early Romanticism.
Yes even Mendelssohn is audible
The theme that enters at 2:18 is divine... if only Beethoven had composed a entire movement or work to that theme.
I came here as it is told to us that Ramanujan's lost book findings were related to find Beethoven's 10th symphony. No lie!!!!
But I love Beethoven's Sinfonia 5!!!!
Yes, my favorite too
It would be interesting to see peoples reaction on the understanding that they were told this was the composers original score. Deryck Cooke's orchestration of Mahler's sketches on his tenth is superb, and the same thing applies here. Had people been told this it was the original score, who would have realized it was not so? Like so many paintings attributed to an artist that were later proved to be fakes, only those who invested squillions of £££££ would be upset. Surely if the work is that good , does it really matter? Discuss.
Very few people who have spent a lot of time listening to Beethoven would have bought it. Unlike wine tasting and figurative arts, there is a lot less charlatanry at least among non-professional critics who love the great composers. It is just not of anywhere near high enough quality to pass for a Beethoven work
Great job I like it very much. It's very likely to Beethoven's style. Sometimes we can ear a little remembrance of Čajkovskij, especially in the chromatic develop of theme but this is unavoidable because Cooper is a man of our day. This piece is very fascinating.
Superb reimagination and most moving with (dare I say it?) touches of Brahms in the lyrical passages and Mendelssohn in the bridge passages.
I think Beethoven would've composed similar to this 'hypothetical' work. Perhaps, even, a true and authentic likeness. I think Barry Cooper has, actually, assembled this '10th Symphony' very intelligently. I like it!
Where can I listen to the Rosemary Brown version of Beethoven's tenth symphony?
My God. Imagine If Beethoven Live atlast one more year, this Symphony will be the best to end all. Its Dramatic, Sad, And Full of Epicness
The assembly was probably very difficult: few sketches, some unintelligible others written in great haste and only deductible.
But the work submitted for this presentation is worth all our consideration.
Anyway, it is not bad music, in fact, quite delectable, resembling a bit sometimes Beethoven, sometimes Schubert.
It is after all reconstructed from Beethoven's sketches
The slow stretch might suggest Schumann or Chopin... treat this as an overture, and it would satisfy.
Como às pessoas podem ainda dar dislike nessa obra magnífica?.
Olyan csodálatos,zseniális zeneszerző mint Ludwig van Beethoven nem volt sem előtte,sem az ő korában,sem utána nem lessz több.Esetleg akkor,ha Ő újra megszületne...
The commercial at 8 and a half minutes really ties the movements together
Awesome. Thanks Mr. Ripple for posting this!