Mixing With Mike Mixing Tip: How to Approach Mix Buss Compression
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- Опубликовано: 13 сен 2024
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Yo mike just wanna say i appreciate your approach, flow and presentation. Youre the channel any serious amateur or even versed producer/mixer actually looks for within the heavily dense space of mixing videos. While everyone focuses on click bait and pseudo tips you always always keep it real without needing to hype anything up Because the substance is there
Genuinely suprised by your "low" views and subscriber count compared to everyone out there
This is a really interesting comparison with so much useful information. Thank you! For me, the SSL was bright and punchy, the API was a natural sounding, and the V-Comp was mellow. This video illustrated very well making a mix sound 3D.
Actually think the API is punchier and the SSL is more neutral
paying attention and *boom* disco songs starts ... involuntarily start dancing.
The VComp is a really weird 2bus compressor for me. 90% of the time I replace it almost immediately, but for the 10% of the time when it does it, it’s absolutely amazing, like nothing else could create that magic. Love it.
GREAT VID. I OWN ALL OF THOSE COMPRESSORS AND I MUST SAY, I USE THE SSL MORE THAN THE OTHERS, BUT I THINK I NEED TO START USING THAT API 2500 A LITTLE MORE!!! THANKS!!
They all have something a little something different to offer. I try to to keep an open mind and see what works best for the song and mix. SSL is a great one though!
Cheers!
I've mainly been using the SSL Compressor on the mix buss. I'm definitely going to try out all these compressors to hear what's best for my mix. Thanks for sharing Mike!
YOU out so many useful tutorials out !!! Thank you
Second great tip of the day thank you!!! I only have a SSL, now I can make good use of it. I feel an openness after adding the buss compression (Drums no bass / vocals / synths)
Quickly wanted to record my 60+ tunes which had all been done on tape here and there. Now I'm going back and actually learning how to mix on digital and found your site to be the most helpful both with unbiased reviews and just great tips. I wish I had started here and saved myself a lot $ on plugins.I agree with nearly all the comments on the mix buss compressors with the API being one of my favorites from the start. This particular SSL plugin accentuates the high end a bit more with the VComp being more cushy and mellow. Another great video and thanks!
Cheers Terry!
Great video! It's nice to see all the possibilities lined up so I can make more informed, quicker choices. And thanks for gain staging to the best of your ability so we're not just fooled by volume.
API sounded the best for sure. SSL was okay but it changed the balance too much. The API retained the balance & made it groove harder and most musically
When it comes to electronic music, my favorite for this job still is the MasterMix Buss Compressor by Minimal System Group, even when it is only 32 bit and has some bad reputations on the net.
1:54 I never thought about setting the amount of make-up gain I'm actually aiming for and then attenuating my compression settings to make the compression amount so exact.
The better I know the compressor and what it sounds like, the more likely I will work this way. If I am working with a less familiar compressor I will adjust the Makeup gain as I go to see how it responds.
Cheers!
Mike
dope vid! ive been using the VComp as my mix bus compressor (followed by RComp) as i get awesome warmth as i hit the inputs sweet spot and tweek settings around that. ur loudness course is the shit btw!
To my ear, this SSL plugin adds too much glue and kind of deadens the high end on the transients. You can hear this especially by listening to the claps. I was having this problem at home, as I usually always use the SSL on the mix bus, but have had to stop because I feel it is stealing some life from my mixes. I'll have to try the API 2500 on it. Sounds to me like it keeps it bright and snappy while still staying quite natural. Just my opinion of course.
I stopped doing buss compression for the same reason; the effect is quite unpleasant on snare rolls with SSL. The thing I got from the video is: don't go for a big GR, needle dancing around 0 is quite noticeable/good too (aiming for the musical release), I feel that makes the best of both worlds without sucking the life out of the buss
I liked the SSL and API the most.
I’d pick the SSL because the initial mix lacks a tiby bit of drum kit. The SSL is the only one who brings it a tad forward (the V comp adds weight to the snare though, but blurrys the kick). I’d pick the SSL
This is great. Thank you!!
Where does the Fairchild factor into these big 3 main ones to you? Similar to the Neve?
a rare video on how to use a mix-bus compressor the right way.
That track gives me the Chromeo vibes!
Tone boosters has a really good bus comp
I love their bus comp.
is it good to have the mix buss compressor on before mixing
Awesome track
This really helped me out, I was struggling a little bit with how to go about using mix bus compression but this video helped me get a better understanding...thank you :)
Also I wanted ask your opinion on the Vertigo Vsc-2 by brainworx....was considering picking that up for my mix bus compression. Good choice ?
+mkvemcee Cheers!
I have a video of the VSC-2 and I love it. ruclips.net/video/hkbhoY7Y3uY/видео.html
Best!
Mike
VSC2 is flipping awesome
Good vid Mike! Question: I noticed in another video you used a multitrack that is a vailable to everyone online, is that also the case for this one? I'd love to give mixing this a go.
FlamingBeatz Hi FlamingBeatz,
Unfortunately I do not have permission to release this one.
Sorry!
Mike
For dance style music the API and SSL compressors work best. Also some multiband compressors are recommanded for this kind of music like the good old T.C. Finalizer.
For this song I would prefer the API more than the SSL. Although the SSL is a great compressor too. But if SSL then I would choose "The Glue" from Cytomic. Sounds better than Waves. If API then the one from Waves.
For Neve stuff I would go with UAD plugins.
Really helpful,.
Hi Mike. What would you say as Mastering Engineer if I ask you about sending the Final Mix with a little bit of Bus Comp? Let's assume that it keeps a nice -3.0db to -4.5db headroom. In a nutshell: Bus Comp Yes or No when sending to Mastering? Thx as always.
As a mastering engineer, I am less concerned about bus compression on the mix bus than I am about heavy limiting for the purpose of loudness. If the compression feels good to you, then keep it in the mix, if you are not sure then leave it out. You can also send a non-compressed version of the mix to the mastering engineer as a backup.
Regarding the headroom, it is nice to see a good 3-6 dB of headroom but I don't get too caught up in the amount of headroom as much as I do with clipping. I master entirely in the box these days and will usually adjust input gain even if there is already 6 dB or so already there. As long as you are not clipping the gain staging is easy to deal with. Mastering engineers that deal more in the analog realm quite often want to see a good 10 dB or so of headroom because analog operating levels are generally much lower than digital.
Hope this makes sense...!
Question: I've gotten into recording and mixing in the past three years and I've learned a lot. But the one thing I'm struggling with is what to listen for in different compressors, especially on the mix bus. To me these compressors sound very similair, yet there are many comments saying how big of a difference there is between them. I can hear a difference, but to me it just sounds like a loudness thing. It's so subtle. And yes I'm listening in studio headphones!
So what do you listen for to tell these "big" differences apart? Low end, high end, transients etc?
Great video, subbed!
Thanks!
There are different things to listen for with compression on the mix bus. I mostly listen for how it either pulls the mix levels together or how it helps to make the music groove better. The type of compressor may also effect the frequency response but that is just a bonus. The final result should always sound more focused and image better in the speakers. Otherwise it is just a load of wanking :-)
Ceers!
Mike
i had find that the SSL and the API with diferent charater works great in electronic music, SSL to me more EDM and API Techno, the SSL pump and breath nice and the API is a good spot for snapy transients a bit more agressive
Isn't it funny how much the SSL is ingrained by all the hits...i think the API adds some depth and height better then the SSL
but i still love the SSL
It is primarily because SSL consoles were the preferred mix consoles of most engineers through the mid 80's and 90's. The Neve 33609 was also a great mix buss alternative. The API2500 is a more recent hardware unit and has had less time to establish itself as a go-to buss compressor. Great unit though, I like it too. Cleaner sounding that the SSL for sure.
ssl really brings out the reverb
SSL does the trick
SSL wins to me here by far, but now if i use a compressor with settings like this in the mix buss i like to add in serie a vari mu it make a huge difference, mostly accentuanting the breath and warming even more, i use the outrageouses Antelope Audio FPGA vintage compressors emulations :D (i produce Techno) Anyway the real API Hardware is a beast really high end luxury sound it is not the same than the poor Waves emulation and don´t react the same, as well the real SSL the punchy pumping famouse effect is also lot more audible in the real thing
Thank God it's not only me that sees nothing wrong with working from left to right (input tracks - sub-groups - main group busses - (proper) parallel processing - stereo buss)! I know it's all the rage to get the stereo buss processing going good and hard well early in a mix. But NOT FOR ME - I just can't make it work for me. I like to add (or subtract) as I'm working along 'the board' - adding something OVERALL to the mix through each stage and then gluing it all together with buss processing.
+Keiron Metcalfe Thanks Keiron,
There's a method to the madness that has worked for decades and continues to work for me. I find the stem and buss compression much better when placed after the rest of the mix is done. That said, there are some seasoned professionals that go to the mix buss compression first and get great results. I always feel it is too limiting :-) Pun intended!
Cheers!
Mike
As you said earlier, it boxes you into a corner somewhat. And it seems that one is always having to go back 'to the right' to re-adjust - i.e. if you start with the stereo busses, then go to the group busses, chances are that what's been done on the group busses will've affected the stereo buss..... so back you go to the right again; then you go down to (in my case) sub busses..... only for that to have affected the group busses..... so back you go to the right again.... and again. There's obviously a way to do it - I mean, CLA's got the Grammy's, so......... But, if you want a compressor on the stereo buss so as to 'glue' your mix together, then why would you try to 'glue' together a mix that's been barely started? Each to his own a suppose.
Well put Keiron!
Cheers!
Mike
great video ... but I thought it was unfair because the VCOMP was with in 2:1 ratio for sure will offer less punch than others .... hug and good mix.
+vanderlei sperandio Hey Vanderlei,
I was trying to do a similar subtle pumping movement with the same amount of GR. The V-Comp does that best at lower ratios. Probably not the best setup for the V-Comp, but worth the comparison.
Thanks!
Mike
+Michael White
Yes. you're right. I didn't think this way ... Thank you!
cheers
Would it be an issue using api on mix bus and Ssl for mastering??
I like the retro style. I do the same :-D.
+creative media Cheers! Glad to have you aboard!
What about a mixing contest ? Would be interesting :) (just an idea~)
I have thought about it. Not the right time yet. The latest Indaba/Pure Mix contest had over 1000 submissions. That's a lot of listening!
I noticed that some "old school mixing engineers say " use the 2 bus compression at the end of the mix and new school engineers say use it at the beginning of mix .do you think one will have less problem's if use at the end or traditionally it's done at the end on a console
I've seen engineers do it both ways and have great results. My personal preference is to only put it at or near the end of the mixing. The benefit of working on an analog desk is that buss compressor is always there for you to see unlike a plugin which is hidden most of the time. If you wanted to put the compressor on early in the mix I would suggest leaving the plugin open at all times so that you can see what it is doing as you get sounds and structure your mix. To me, because of the gain reduction, it can make boosting less pronounced (pushing more signal above threshold thus more GR) and cutting more pronounced (dropping more signal below threshold thus less GR). I find that annoying.... The conventional wisdom says to wait until the end of the mix.
Great point Mike, leaving the bus compressor visible at all times
I love ssl and v comp. but for some reason always end up with Api. To me sounds more natural and pure. Clean... could be the word. But anyways ...theres a big pallet of colors for everybody says the painter.
The API rocks, more full bodied than the SSL. The SSL is great for radio mixes and the V-Comp takes a while to really master but is a beast when you figure it out.
Cheers!
Hey Mike, when producing a drum loop from scratch, should I start mixing into a buss compressor right away? I've heard from multiple sources that producing INTO a buss compressor can positively affect your mixing decisions in later stages. Is there any validity to this statement?
Hey Z,
One issue you will encounter when recording into a mix buss compressor is latency. Depending on the plugin you are using, it will affect the output timing of the mix bus.
As far as mixing goes, what I have noticed is that mix engineers who like heavy mix buss compression are usually served better by putting it into the mix buss earlier on in the mixing process. My personal experience is that it boxes you into a particular sound and limits your ability go outside of that vibe. I prefer to apply my heavy compression techniques in the form of parallel compression busses where I have control over the "wet/dry" balance. Much more flexible and allows me to easily adapt or change directions if that is where the production needs to go.
All that said, everyone is different and if you find a vibe that works for you that includes the buss compressor in from the beginning then I would suggest that you monitor that buss compression throughout the mixing process to see how it is responding to the mix changes you make.
Great Question!
Mike
Michael White Awesome advice, thanks Mike! Also...if I use the buss comp for the liveliness objective only, then use other processing like tape compression/ saturation for tone/character, where should the buss comp be relative to all these on the signal chain?
Hi, Mike. Necro-ing this comment. Since you mentioned you prefer parallel compression, when then do you apply this type of gentle compression on the 2bus? Do you apply it when you've shifted your focus on the stems or do you slap it on when you've made initial/essential on the individual tracks after all the initial tweaks/static mix? Thanks!
The 2bus and mix stems are at the very end of the mix for me. I find that is most effective that way when the mix is really ready for it. The "light" compression really glues the track together. Add a good tape emulation after that and it is a beautiful thing!
Will keep a mental note of this. Thanks for answering and, of course, all the videos!
Not sure if I don't prefer the V-Comp. Maybe I am a closet Neve fan-boy. Lol
I love the V-Comp but don't use it often on the mix buss for some reason. I prefer the 33609 which came out in the late 80's and was based on the 2254 limiter that the V-Comp emulates. Sounds a bit tighter and more focussed than the V-Comp to me. No reason to be an "in the closet' Neve fan-boy. You're not alone!
Haha, yes fan boy indeed. Talking of Neve... do you use the BX console or the Lindel Audio 254E? I think the 254E, in particular, has a fantastic sound... very particular applications though. I also do not use the V-Comp much, although I do like the sound. Popping the 254E on the master bus almost automatically improves the sound, whereas I have to work harder when using the V-Comp
love ssl
+الموزع الموسيقي محمود عمار Me Too!
To me the API makes the other 2 sound like trash. Well that's hyperbole but it clearly sounds the best imo
V comp sounds more flat
SSL sounded better to me.
If you saturate enough you will not need compression