Magic's Most Toxic Commanders: Where Are They Now?
HTML-код
- Опубликовано: 2 май 2024
- We're looking at some of the most TOXIC commanders in history and asking, where are they now? Are they still as HORRIBLE as when they debuted?
Buy some amazing cards from Card Kingdom and use this link so they know we sent you!
www.cardkingdom.com/nerds
Sign up for whatnot using our link and get $15 to spend on whatever you want! whatnot.com/invite/nitpicking...
Buy awesome sleeves from Dragon Shield and SAVE 5% using code "nerds" at checkout: dragonshield.com/?ref=nerds
Follow us on Moxfield!
www.moxfield.com/users/Nitpic...
Consider Supporting us via Patreon!
/ nitpickingnerds
Come join our Discord community!
/ discord
Want to send us something cool? We'll open it on stream! Send to:
Mia Largo
PO Box 29372
100 Hartford Ave,
Providence, RI 02909 
Игры
I can't in good conscience say I've never been described as toxic, and I don't love it but then I tap Krenko, double my Goblins, and let the good times roll.
Me and my homies hate gobos
I have been playing since 1994 in a bubble and I just made my first Commander deck... Is Krenko really toxic? Goblin King was one of my first rare pulls and I have played goblins a lot ever since.
How can you see krenko as toxic when commanders like jodah, go-shintai and myrim are brought to casual tables?
@@digiprez77 You just have to be okay with no one letting you untap with your krenko, almost ever. There are other goblin commanders if you want a less targeted commander
Nah man krenko is cool play him!
There are multiple Oloro decks at my game store and one in my pod. They are still obnoxiously strong too
Dang, who knew!
Not to spread more toxicity but I'm generally curious as to how the hell they built him... Like on paper he's great.. in practice I die SO damn fast when I tried like a dozen times to rebuild my Oloro deck... As soon as my pod read him the first time that was it... I die first EVERY GAME with him it's basically a ritual or a race to see which one of them can kill me first... Most times commander damage obviously though one time I died to getting hit for like 30-40 per turn from over 170 life... just damage per turn was STRONG... I've all but given up building him...
@@nonaG123 The one in my pod is a death and taxes deck which only comes out when we're down for that kind of game. One at my store is an aristocrats deck and the other one is a secret commander Will Scion of Peace
@@nonaG123 I have one that uses a bunch of "whenever you gain life" or "At beginning of end step if you've gained X life do Y" (also the Vito or Aetherflux things, but those are less prevalent)
Someone else at my lgs plays it with as many double you life cards as he can and then a win the game st upkeep for having a lot of life or Aetherflux
@@nonaG123 My take on Oloro is the anti-creature stax/control deck route, and so far, it is pretty successful, been playing it for almost 8 years now, constantly looking for ways to improve it with every new set coming out. While there are some lifegain theme in the deck, the main strategy now is just disabling creature strategies while backing it up with loads of interactions and card advantage pieces, the deck has several ways to achieve infinite extra turn combos with PWs providing inevitability, also second sun as alternate wincon. It is not my most powerful deck, but I really love playing it LOL.
I'm amazed Narset, Enlightened Master wasn't on this list. Looping extra turns/combats to slowly dig for wincons when some of your opponents haven't had a 3rd turn is gross.
exactly....
@@f.s3613 I used to have this deck built and around the time I was like "Ok, I have 2 extra combats and 3 extra turns banked up" people scooped.
It got built to win me Fatal Push promos and it won me 12 in those 5 weeks with me driving to 2 different LGS's that started an hour apart (12-3 record).
I only played it once every 6 months or so afterwards (usually for overly confident "my decks never been beaten" braggarts) because I felt dirty doing it to friends and I eventually sold the deck. I've never ran another extra turn spell in the 4ish years since... I took my fair share for a lifetime lol.
I guess she is either housebanned or no one around them plays it in genetell. She was new enough that good commanders weren't in demand as much as earlier.
Damn guys... Am i a bad guy with my narset super friend deck?
@@arthurndongmeza8922 yes, but thats also probably the least annoying way to play her (rather than chaining extra turn/combat spells). All in all she is generally to strong for a casual table to deal with unless there is a hard control player keeping her in check but that is not a realistic expectation for most games.
I played against a Child of Alara deck ONCE and I remember that game like it was yesterday. The board got wiped probably seven or eight times and the game took two hours. It was so miserable.
I played against one and two of us just decided to go home because it was already 2.5 hrs in and there were no wincons in sight
the one ring is a reason why some people are playing Derevi in Cedh all the untaps are brutal. another fun piece of tech in that deck is the include of Shorikai
Oloro, Ageless Ascetic was never all that threatening on its own. You always attacked the Oloro player when you had spare creatures because they were often playing Felidar Sovereign. So at no point in the game were they allowed to untap with 40 or more life.
Commander 2013 had some really fun commanders in it. Personally my favorite was Jeleva, Nephalia's Scourge. She could just steal games and players scrambled to remove her only for her to be cast again to make things worse for them. I love Jeleva and really want to build her again.
Yep, won with Felidar Sovereign after Vedalken Orrey just last week.
The set that gave us the saltiest commander for a long time. Nekusar! Love that deck
@@chaserevstuning9271 Some people feel Salty about Nekusar but I never felt that way. I target the Nekusar player first most the time for the same reason I target the group hug player. I have an interest in stopping my opponents from accelerating their game plan. I don't think i've ever seen Nekusar win either. They always draw someone else into their win con. That's been my experience. Heck, I've drawn 10 cards in the face of Nekusar and went down to like 5 life and still beat them. Because Card draw is worth the damage.
Although I haven't faced a modern Nekusar deck, I'm sure Nekusar players have gotten a lot smarter about keeping opponent's resources in better check. With Sheoldred, the Apocalypse and Orcish Bowmasters I can't imagine the games lasting very long..
Derevi has become cEDH viable again, mostly due to emiel, Delney and the one ring.
Everyone targets our ololro player and is kinda fun to team up. We've given him an inch many times and lost to him.
I play a child of alara Baby Gates deck that only casts the commander when the board state is overly threatening as i assemble maze's end for my win con. splashing some landfall payoffs like avenger of zendikar or rampaging baloths to have a token beatdown shenanigans along the way!
Well thought out strategy!
Against Zur... "Back to Natre" is a enchantments -wipe for 1G in instant. An uncommon. Lovely
Spring Cleaning is potentially the same, but one-sided, if you win the clash.
You do realize the problem with enchantments is that only 2 colors can effectively deal with them right? Just give us 1 black boardwipe that removes enchantments (cause black has at least some removal for it). Make it a colorshifted austere command and replace artifacts with planeswalkers or graveyards (maybe change destroy with sac effects) and you got probably the most played wipe in the color.
@@Shimatzu95green white and red all remove enchantments. Blue if you consider bounce permanents.
@@johnnoreau3570Outside of Chaos Warp and Wild Magic Surge, how does red deal with enchantments?
You make it sound so easy, Zur often had counters to back up their enchantments
Pod works at Sorcery speed so you can’t really stack triggers.
Kaalia just suffers from the sins of her past. Take out the quick master of cruelties kill and the armageddon with avacyn on board and she really isn't a satly commander.
Definitely play all that in my kaalia deck. Is it even kaalia without the cruelties combo?
Smacking me with a giant cheated in dragon, demon, or angel will always make me salty
considering I've died to that master of cruelties kill SEVERAL times cause my friend is a douche about it... yea.. still salty
Derevi is coming back with untapping the One Ring many times in one turn.
I still get flashbacks from thinking about the Kaalia MLD deck that I played against back in the day
I have an oloro deck :) my friends hate it cuz it was all stax with the exquisite blood infinite combo. thankfully I've now changed it and focus on gaining as much life as possible and get out bolas citadel or aetherflux
Greatest game I ever played was my Yuriko deck. Turn 2 or 3 kill. Draco, ulamog, Emrakul and some other big spell all came out dealing like 40 dmg. But nothing like having LED, lotus petal and a ton of those 0 cost mana rocks come out and decimate everyone while having haste.
Oloro was my first commander. I started playing magic last year. He has been and still is my strongest deck aside from Galadriel Elves and Eriette Aids.
Just got the orloro precon for a birthday deck looking forward to upgrading it
Oloro was my first commander back when I started in 2014. A fellow player generously bought Sorin Markov, and a few other cards to upgrade my deck. Oloro has gone through many upgrades and rebuilds throught the years, but Sorin Markov will always remain in my Oloro deck.
I have a board wipe deck.
It's Ravos, soul tender and Anara, wolvid familiar.
It pretty much revolves around playing board wipes or pump spells attached to creatures on my turn and trying to beat people to death with commander damage.
I have my Oloro deck on Moxfield (Ramzoid). First commander I bought after grabbing the Urza precons from Brothers War
I always thought that one of the cards that made Zur so frustrating to play against was Vanishing because that, combined with some form of hexproof, make him nearly impossible to remove.
Man, I can't believe Beezy would just lie to us in the intro like that.
My oldest son and I started plying Magic in 1994. In 2000, we left and came back to Magic a few times. I never saw the Oloro card before and it looks quite good as a Commander. Where does Toxrill rank? Thank you Mia & Beezy AKA Nitpicking Nerds for the video.
I’d love to have Kaalia of the Vast. Those creature types are some of my favorites, next to zombies.
😂 this brings back so many memories. And I consider myself a new player, even though I’ve been playing a little over a decade now. I love these old commanders so much I’ve built basically all of these again in the past 2 years and it was amazing to see how different it is nowdays
I'm waiting for my Oloro cards to arrive right now in these weeks! Long live the Eternal King!
I played Oloro draw, had things in it like Alhammarrets archive, teferi's puzzle box and archimage ascension. Then it had some control cards but it was really trying to get out krakens and leviathans to shut down boards. I don't play many counter spells because they just don't feel good to play.
I have an Oloro Lich deck. Lich, Lich’s Mastery and Nefarious Lich are pretty nasty when you swap Lifegain for Card Draw. The rush of knowing you can die at any moment from an enchantment board wipe is also a lot of fun.
In my anecdotal evidence, people run much less removal these days. Back in the day everyone used to pack a lot of answers to everything and even Derevi decks used to also run Seaside Haven because of tuck existed and when tuck rule was changed, Derevi players rejoiced and everyone else was miserable.
We have a rule in our pod, if your have a trigger - you have to pay attention or its doesn't trigger. Even triggers that can't be missed. Following comp REL rules, and people kept forgetting (me too lol), so he faded out of the meta. Once we started playing more competitive formats, he came back into the meta. Edgar was released, we were paying attention to each trigger. Our games were punishing to the smallest misplay - we had to keep everyone responsible for keeping track of the board state :).
Playing Grand Arbiter right now... its as toxic as it was before. Approach of the Second Sun is in there with no tutors... I have to draw it eventually right?
My Oloro deck is still my go to when I feel I need to knock someone down a peg.
There is always at least 1 Oloro deck at my LGS every time we play. It tends to be on the somewhat higher end of power but it's not nearly as threatening or toxic as many of the other decks there. It's fun to play against.
Oloro was my first commander and I love him made it easy to get back into magic.
My Derevi deck is 65 Instants, 38 lands (3 MDFL).
Strat: +1/+1 counter Voltron with a ton of phasing, targeted protection to keep Derevi alive and stacking until you drop people with your 11/12 Bird Wizard.
It's a tempo deck in commander, and you use Derevi's mana cheating ability to get around the Voltron flaw.
Why bother with counters if Derevi doesn't keep them in the command zone? At that point, leaning into equipment voltron sounds better.
I got a friend into Magic in 2020, he wanted to build a weird control deck around swapping life totals like people usually do with Selenia, Dark Angel, but he wanted blue. He built it with Oloro. The deck got him constantly targeted and he was too salty and quit in 2 months.
My cousin has an oloro deck that's lich themed and just pumps out zombies and phylacteries and has some stupid you can't touch me forever card
Zur was my baby for awhile. Its also the deck I had both Armageddon and Cataclysm. I don't have that deck anymore lol.
20:58 hoarding broodlord is kind of a nonbo as it has you exile the card while kalia has "put from your hand". Maybe not why it was included but i can see that misplay
OG Oloro player here. I still keep the list updated but probably only play it 1-2 times a year.
I build a Oloro deck couple weeks ago it’s insane
I play an Oloro extort kindred deck. It’s soo fun and my blatant rule 0 conversation includes the fact that I do not play aetherflux nor bond combos. Thankfully it’s not a deck perceived ‘toxic’ by my pod
I used to have a blink themed Derevi deck. It accidentally would sometimes turn into a stax deck, and my friends hated it, so took out Green for Red and Black, and I retooled it to be a Bjorna and Wernog Blink deck instead. Still miss Derevi, as they were my firat ever commander, but love the new deck all the same.
Nah. Derevi Voltron. Nothing is more fun than using pure steel paladin and sigards aid for free equips. Run enlightened tutor and stone forge mystic to grab pieces that I need. And there’s an enchantment in there somewhere that lets me untap all my lands at my end step. Run most of the swords of “ “. Equip holy avenger to speed the process up. Annnnd we’ve got mantle of the ancients and brilliant restoration in case of artifact wipes lol.
@@johnnoreau3570 Gotta watch out with the Swords, because if you give them protection from white, can't use mantle of the ancients on them lol
My preferred Voltron is Rograkh and Ardenn.
My Derevi blink accidentally assembled an infinite blink combo where at the start of every player's turn I would tap down all of their lands so they couldn't do anything. Wasn't even intentional......just happened to be pieced together on board lol
@@DrRoflcopter43 oh my god that’s funny. Thanks for the reminder! Luckily I think the only pro white sword I’ve got is war and peace and I just bought that one. So it’s never been a problem I’ve run into before 😅
Oloro was my first commander deck and is probably my favorite to go back to time and time again! He just has so many support cards and creatures that make the deck better and better every year
I have an Oloro deck, a Kaalia deck, and an Atraxa deck, but none of them has seen the light of day in over a year. Same with Edgar Markov. All pretty powerful decks and I enjoyed them for a while but I’ve moved on to more unique Commanders. One of my favorites is ranked #2672. (Karlach with Popular Entertainer as the Backround.)
I play Oloro but focus almost entirely on me getting things because of the life gain like +1/+1 counters and tokens. I don't have any cards that make opponents loss life.
I have an Oloro deck. It was one of the first decks I ever made back in 2022 when getting into commander. I made it with combos and group draw just so I can compete with the more experienced, better players. I rarely play it now in 2024 unless I’m playing a more competitive game.
I still have an Oloro deck. Rarely gets played as it wins through misery (counterspells and punishing players for playing anything) and manlands
my oloro just uses life as a resource and it gets nasty fast. Probably my favorite deck i have built!
I play Zur the Enchanter today, and the only board wipe I fear is Farewell. Which is something my counterspell can fix.
There were so many Child of Alara players in my playgroup when we were in middle school. They all played High Market and a bunch of land ramp and just reset the board until we all lost interest in the game and went to do something else
I used to have an Oloro deck but I took it apart because of all the targeting I’d receive because of the Commander alone
I am currently building an Oloro deck but it’s more of a diplomacy and taxes deck (though Esper usually is great at that regardless) I just want to be able to gain life so I can last longer and he’s a fantastic card draw engine. I do have a test of endurance planned for the deck but I don’t have felidar sovereign in there.
I also just want to be slightly annoying with the deck by using a lot of voting cards.
I made an Oloro deck about a year ago, I feel like life gain isn't like broken or anything but wincons based on having life and free triggers on anything life gain based every single turn garunteed
I’ve played my trostani deck. On curve top decked felidar sovereign on turn 6 with 43 health. Played it and proceeded to win the game before 😭😅
My introduction to commander was my buddy playing a mono white life gain oloro deck 😂
I had 0 clue Oloro was hated when I joined. Literally picked him because he was a stand in for a character role-play Esper Voltron deck with treasure fueled All That Glitters KOs
I feel like they could've erratad Commander Ninjutsu to be affected by Commander Tax when used from the Command Zone, like they erratad the companion mechanic to require you to pay 3 at sorcery speed to put the companion into your hand.
17:52 “this is my baby!”
She’s one of my top favorites too!!
I have a gates/maze's end centered child of alara deck. I don't like playing it but I have it to pull put against other decks I find annoying.
Oloro Player here. Love my friendly giant in the command zone.
A buddy in my regular group of friends still plays Oloro, and rarely casts him from the command zone. He just uses his life gain to trigger off other cards and go infinite with pings and drains. It still does really good work, and he has a good win rate with him.
Edit: Same buddy also run Yuriko. Maybe he's just a toxic player. 🤣
Derevi and The One Ring is pretty good I hear.
I play an Oloro deck on and off. They keep printing life gain pay offs and stuff to spend life on. It is still powerful. I don't know if he is as dominant as he used to be. But a reliable way to get life gain is great.
I've played Commander first when Oloro came out. Bought the precon, then assembled my deck.
NEVER CASTED IT ONCE!
Oloro was the only Esper good Commander in those days. Also, I was playing Enter the Laboratory with Lab Maniac, so... no f...s given to a Commander on the field! :D
My Derevi deck is Derevi Birds, but i ended up adding stax because Birds are not that good. And theres some stax that only hurt groundbound creatures.
I have about 60 fully sleeved Commander decks and Child of Alara is still my favorite. As far as a “cute way to build it,” throw in all indestructible Gods and gradually build color devotion in between board wipes. “Devotion to Gods.” It’s hilarious.
This is such a good idea. Love your build!
I actually had that exact idea years ago, but never got around to building it. I'm just really glad to hear the dream lives on!
Im gonna be rebuilding oloro soon. I took it apart a year or two ago becuase i got tired of winning via combo and it just kinda got too tuned with everything else.
He is still the best life gain commander. You get the strongest control colors and free bonus life so aggro can't beat you. Voltron is so easy to beat it's never a concern for oloro. So all you need to do to win is hold up some interaction for combos.
My friend plays Derevi as a casual Birds Venturing Into The Dungeon commander. Literally the only thing this deck wants to do is get birds and finish a Dungeon, and then she doesn't care if she wins or loses. Well, needless to say, it's still Derevi, and it turns out this deck is lowkey fire and might be one of the best decks in the playgroup. Roaming Throne only made it better.
This person also has an Oloro deck! And that was probably the source of the funniest moment our friend group has ever had when a different friend at the table spitefully tried to make sure I lost the game after killing her by making literally 16 million Scute Swarms with her infinite landfall combo deck just so the lifegain deck would gain that much life from another creature entering the battlefield, thereby nullifying any threat my commander Craig Boone had. And then I won anyway with commander damage.
Ironically, the player behind the Oloro and Derevi decks is the least toxic person at the table and they're almost never actually trying to win. You wouldn't even know these commanders are toxic across from them at the table.
a friend of mine built hes first commander deck last year and it was oloro..
Yea, Oloro Upkeeps was one of my first decks I made and be a cool deck, but dismantled it after realizing waiting for my 2-3 upkeeps each turn wasn't a very fun game to actually play. Random wins through Bolas Citadel also felt very same-ish every game. Borrrrring. :)
Never been called toxic, but when I play my Scion of the ur-dragon I’m public enemy #1, sometimes that isn’t enough, moltensteel+skittles with an extra combat step is two players removed
What is the opposite of Toxic? Why, Moxic, of course! If you use Moxfield, your decks are now Moxic and you're awesome 😎
My CoA deck is a wipe deck, but I like using the Zubra/Spirit/Changling deck
Oloro was my first commander and is still my favorite commander. He's my strongest deck, Lifegain control is surprisingly strong.
Oloro players unite! Still have and play this deck. Have gotten to about 600 something most of the time
Child of Alara is my Gates deck. Gates takes a while to get to the win so CoA is perfect for biding time. And the rest of the deck is also build around the potential board wipe. Usually doesn't get salty since everybody sees the big red panic button and can prepare for it.
I play gates with Kyodai from Kamigawa. 😅something about being able to flash it in and grant something indestructible just is too good for me.
Oloro player here ! Been playing that guy for almost 8 years now, I do admit, Oloro by himself is not a very strong magic card like it used to be. Gaining 2 life every upkeep used to be a powerful thing to do, but now, it's almost nothing. I have great success with the deck, but it is no longer the life gain strategy everyone used to know, the life gain aspect is just a sub theme at this point, the deck is just a control/stax deck now.
Mia, please watch Jurassic Park!
She said she will!
I use Oloro as a commander, but not for the sake of running him. I have a fun Sphinx-Dragon deck that's all about card drawing and voting, I simply use Oloro because he's the colors I need and his passive ability gives me the extra life to pay to my own costs. I rarely if ever cast him as the deck is too busy to bother. I usually get up to 10 extra life before games get rolling, and for the first couple of attacks I get targeted, but once board states become more developed that becomes less a problem for me.
Outside of my regular playgroup the majority of people I play with have been in the game only a few years, and most don't even know who Oloro is. Most see his abilities as subpar compared to today's options. Which for me is great because I don't become the Archenemy instantly.
I used to play Stax Kaalia with Mass Land Destruction and even when I try to play her nowadays with a different build, I will always be the archnemesis just because of the rep. Altho for normal builds, I agree that she isnt the boogeyman she used to be
I am building a Oloro pillow fort deck currently
They do exist!
I have an Oloro deck I play from time to time.
The audible gasp from Beezy when Mia said she hasn’t seen Jurassic Park lmaooo
Just wanted to comment that I’ve only been playing for 2 years and I ended up building my girlfriend an Oloro deck about 8 months ago! She loves life gain and so I saw him and felt the eminence on him would be awesome for her. And she absolutely loves playing him too😂😭😂😭
The thing about these, and other toxic commanders, and why they stop being played: they get boring or you get kicked from the group.
I think power creep in general too. A lot of the newer precons are pretty strong out of the box with multitudes of mechanics that weren’t there 10 years ago.
Child of Alara with gods and indestructible creatures is how you make it toxic.
I remember playing against these commanders and not having too much of a problem. People would call what I play super salty, Osgir, Winota, Light Paws, or Chiss Goria.
I play Oloro as a Cedh Commander :) But only in CEDH games. 😅
Heh, no love for Sen Triplets or Memnarch? Always knew what kind of game it would be when those got plopped down.
I used to ''LOVE'' my Oloro deck but I was always winning by people scooping cause I had over 100 life. I didnt even have a win con in it.... Yeah I know!
Narset, Enlightened Master is offended that she didn't make the list.
Oloro is definitely in my top 5 commander decks.
Bought the Oloro pre-con back in 2014 or whenever that was and haven't stopped playing him since. Still my favorite commander ❤
I run derevi but it’s all janky cards that tap to make creature tokens.
I have an Oloro deck and it is one of my strongest decks!
14:47 This is just not true. With split cards, Delve, Affinity, pitch spells, and good expensive bombs like omniscience there was no reason to put Draco in the deck. Also she came out after the original commander (modern) horizons set, so there were a bevy of ninjas and changeling. She was basically solved on release. The bricks were added to the deck... by bad players I guess.
Another one I think is Urza, High Lord Artificer
Am I alone, on missing "good" old Sen Triplets or a nice Narset "infinte turns or attack phases" in this video?
Quite powerful decks back than...
I bought the original precon of oloro and its my favorite