Solving the Superman Problem - Changing Zack Snyder's Justice League
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- Опубликовано: 8 сен 2024
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The Snydercut was certainly an improvement but can it be...improved again?
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#Snydercut
What’s funny is if Steppenwolf destroys Diana’s axe, it’ll be the second time in the DCEU she uses a supposed legendary Amazonian weapon against a big, grey, CGI villain only for them to break it in one go
Her legendary armor also broke in WW1984 lol.
@@jcie3424 Doesn't count
@@KRYMauL I mean if steppenwolf destroys Diana's axe then it'll be the third time Something legendary breaks and I find that funny that Legendary stuffs in the Amazonian armory are nothing but normal equipments with exaggerated stories that she doesn't really need but the story builds up the hype around it anyway.
That's what you get for trying to fight with antiques.
Why not just have Diana break her bracelets then? In the comics, when her bracelets are destroyed, she's even more powerful than ever.
0:35 "no one ever loses"
But Nando, as a wise philosopher named Dom once put it: The street always wins.
Dominicles Torettus, 3rd century BC
@@ArifRWinandar - The Art of Street Fights
"what kind of axe are we talking about here.?"
"The Darkseid killing kind."
"Don't you think that we should all have an axe like that.?"
"No. You simply lack the strength to wield them. Your bodies will crumble as your minds collapse into the madness."
😄
🤣
"Is it weird that I want to do it even more now?"
Cringe marvel dialogue
@@thunderbear9418 Cringe DC fanboy who doesn’t know what a joke is.
I love the idea of Steppenwolf laughing Batman off as a joke, it's a great setup. But you need to pay that off! He should face off with him in the final fight, and catch him off guard with some trap or something. He needs to show that he is just as valuable as the rest of the team.
Yes, this is exactly what I want to see.
Throw in some Adam west dialogue and it's golden. Maybe have Bruce's voice synthesizer get damaged in a fight beforehand so you hear a real human voice.
Steppenwolf is expecting brutality, but a display of self control and bravado might be enough to distract steppenwolf long enough for something momentous to happen.
Problem is cyborg can do everything batman can. He needs a serious upgrade, and should be dc's iron man or dr. strange. He can stay street level in his own movies, but not a JL movie.
They had to revive Superman because there wasn't any other character as powerful as he is. It's not like there was some other Superman who also had the power to shape shift, turn invisible, and read minds just hanging around pretending to be Martha Kent.
Best comment by far
And imagine if that other character could also be intangible against a villain that just has strength and physical attacks, wouldn't that be something very useful in an apocalyptic level threat?
To be fair, nobody knew about Martian Manhunter and he made sure of that. To be equally fair, Batman is the world's greatest detective.
@@porkchopsensei2742 Pretty sure Martian Manhunter knew about Martian Manhunter. And, you know, telepath, so its not like they would be able to keep Steppenwolf a secret from him.
@@karlocortes3342 If only!
Nando: Steppenwolf needs to win every fight before they resurrect Superman...
Me: So, basically they need to make Infinity war before Endgame...
Not every story with the villain winning a big battle is directly tied to Infinity War.......
@@JoeChillton and it’s not like Steppenwolf is winning at the end of the movie.
But he does win pretty much every battle, basically. And even with Superman Steppenwolf won. Until Barry decided to Uno reverse it, hehe.
Endgame in this context is Injustice/World's End because Stephenwolfe is just a General and not Darkseid.
Yeah, it's like the MCU actually had a plan and WB, even Sydner was making this up as they went and tried to play catch up...
"You know what the Snyder Cut felt like to me?"
4 hours long?
"Riders of Rohan shows up" Nice reference.
I know this isn’t a hot take or anything, but I just always thought, as much as I liked Superman’s short but sweet role in the movie, they did NOT need Superman to beat Steppenwolf
'... they did NOT need Superman to beat Steppenwolf' No, they didn't and a victory over Steppenwolf without Superman would have made the movie better in my book. As soon as Superman step in, Steppenwolf was history and it was very disappointing. The villain in the movie must be a close match for Superman, otherwise what's the point.
Yeah Supes should not have stomped
@@Age_of_Apocalypse umm they did need Superman. Diana is the only person who can fight Steppenwolf head on
I agree. And I think it would have been better story wise if the justice league beat steppenwolf without superman but with their strength in unity
@@gohanson27 The Justice League is supposed to be a team and the beat the bad guys with teamwork; the fight between Superman and Steppenwolf was absolutely not satisfactory because this villain was nowhere to be a match for the man of steel.
HE just wants to go home... he doesn't want to show off
So he’s E.T.? Our antagonist ladies and gents.
zuko also wanted to go home
@@K3end0 no, its just not YOUR cut of Justice League lol
@@K3end0 what? How is that a boring character? He has no need to fight. He has a goal and he has already done it. Get the motherbox. Why would he waste time fighting? What you are saying sounds ridiculous.
@@parkeranimations3671 the film establishes that Steppenwolf isn't doing this because he really wants to but because of his debt. Heck, the fights kinda reflect that:
- He had the opportunity to maybe deal a fatal blow to Arthur but chose to go after the Motherbox
- He didn't fight the team in the tunnel or Star Labs cause the Motherbox called to him and he retrieved it respectively
Look at us! Twins! Haha
Just finished watching your video before this one. Great work, as always! Keep it up, Scott! (Even if it’s a while before you make another video.)
So happy you’re uploading again!! I watched you back when you had that fauxhawk
Some one send NerdSync's video to zack snyder please!
And both y’all rewrites together made the movie better in my own mind (for me personally, these rewrites are canon).
I think the reason why Steppenwolf didn’t take the effort to how off his strength is because he doesn’t want to waste his time. He’s already taken over 50,000 other worlds and conquered them all, and he still has to get 50,000 more. He doesn’t wanna take more time than necessary.
Actually I think he conquered 100,000 going by his mention
I still think they needed to show us his capabilities before making him out to be a huge threat. Them telling us the worlds he conquered isn’t enough to make us feel like he’s some larger than life character. The only thing that this version has to offer is how pathetic & sad he is. He’s formidable, and scary in design, but once Superman enters he doesn’t even put up a decent fight.
@@trentonsmith4869 Darkseid is the threat 🙄
@@nemya9586 Talking bout the main villain dude, Darkseid is just the lingering threat that is to come.
@@trentonsmith4869 and Steppenwolf came to make a "lingering" threat an apparent one. He didn't come to earth on his own accord.
Hermione: Mostly dead. How can you be mostly dead?
Sir Nicholas: like this
Almost Headless Nick
4:20 I personally would have loved the Snyder cut to end with this cut. Would have been the most baller move in film history.
Justice league fking dies
Sooooooo Steppenwolf is basically an intergalactic Marty McFly? Just call him “chicken” and the fight is on. I’m on board for that.
"Nobody calls Steppenwolf chicken! NOBODY!"
Darkseid: "bring me the Anti-life equation... Unless you're a chicken"
STEPPENWOLF! Read my fax!
::YOU’RE::
::FIRED::
How could you improve Steppywolf in ZSJL? Have you seen him? His eyes are adorable, he’s just such a big, sympathetic, spiky baby 🤣
😆😆😆😆
Yes lol
puppy eyes
🤣
Look at little Steppenwolf jr. Gonna cry?
Idk, I kinda feel like Steppenwolf is acting like an actual person. He's been tasked with conquering countless worlds to regain the trust of his master and this one world isn't any more special than the others until he notices the Anti-Life Equation. After he's retrieved the MBs, he has *no reason* to do anything that you've said he should do other than stereotypical villain gloating and ego stroking imo and he doesn't have much ego left at this point.
You'd have to change his entire motivation for your rewrite to work.
I actually felt it demonstrated how serious a threat he was that he was so objective focused, not a villain you can trick into monologing or challenge to a fight to the death just as his plans about to come to fruition.
Agree. We opened with Steppenwolf slaughtering Amazons. Who were not portrayed as weak, they were actually holding their own... for a minute. Steppenwolf acted in a very realistic fashion as a general on a mission, steadfast in its completion, someone who looked like he has done this many times before and wasn’t going to waste his time. We also have Diana literally saying...”I’ve never seen anyone as strong as him...”
It sort of sets up the strength of Superman... which we know was supposed to foreshadow Darkseid’s strength. Up until Darkseid would eventually show up, no one was stronger than Superman. Not even the combination of Arther and Diana.
Having said all that... the axe thing is a great idea.
My favorite Marvel movie is 'Captain America: The Winter Soldier'. The story is great, the Winter Soldier is more than a match for Captain America and at the end, the Winter Solder saves Captain America 👏👏.
I don't understand why the Amazons locked up the mother box in a fortress with a hole in the ceiling directly about it, especially when Darkseid/Steppenwolf commands an army of flying Parademons.
I don't really want to defend this movie, but that room was meant to be one big trap.
@@lofr8982 With an opening in the ceiling. The trap was to shut the front door and have the whole thing fall into the ocean. Except the bad guys they were protecting it from could 1) teleport and 2) fly.
@@misterdarwin And yet they didn't teleport outside of it. They were being hold by the amazons, specially Steppenwolf. Yet they survived the fight, the fall and managed to get out.
@@misterdarwin well, if the enemies could teleport and fly, then it doesnt really matter where they keep it. might as well build a giant trap around it. whether there is an opening in the ceiling is irrelevant.
@@amazo88 Get rid of the hole and the trap works better for flying things. All they did was trap their own people inside and send them to die over a cliff.
One my problems with the JL movie (both the Snyder and Joss Whedon versions ) is the use of Steppenwolf and Apokolips forces as villains in the first JL movie. The whole concept of Darkseid and the New Gods is just big to be done in the first JL movie. Considering that the intention of DC/Warner was to make a movie shared universe, they should have saved all this for phase 2 or 3 and have the Justice League fight another of their villain in their first adventure, someone like Starro, Brainiac, AMAZO or Vandal Savage.
They were going to. A movie called the New Gods was in development but ultimately got canceled because WB doesn't want this universe to continue.
I think the villains were fine because the three act structure of the JL movies tie directly jnto each other. You can save those other villains for post Flashpoint movies.
@@kmshana94 The new gods movie was gonna happen after the JL movie, after they had already establish Apokolips and Darkseid in the JL movie, which is terrible idea by shared movie universe build up since, if the League defeated Apokolips forces in the first movie there's no way to top that in the sequel. They would be ending their franchise before even begins. It would be the equivalent of making the first avengers movie with Thanos already as the main villain. It's simple escalation: You start simple then you move to bigger things.
@@alexandrefrauches132 who's to say it wouldn't have been escalation.
A new gods movie focusing on the entirety of 4th world seems alot more than 7 metas fighting Darkseid's servant
Also escalation may not always be better. Winter Soldier was better than Avengers 1 in my opinion.
I think you can have a movie that hints at a larger threat while another movie explains the larger threat that way the last movie can just tell a story without it having to be an origin story and a final story.
I'd be so down for an Amazo or Dr. Ivo first battle, or the Royal Club Gang working with T O Morrow's robots and maybe get a hint at Red Tornado.
Those classic ones.
@@kmshana94 I meant escalation in the sense of the level of the threat. I agree that Winter soldier is a better movie than Avengers 1 however, it works because the villains are is in the level of Captain America and it's allies. If it was a movie with the Avengers, it wouldn't be a challenge for the heroes compare to Loki and the Chitauris, Ultron or even Thanos. In the case of the League, if they defeat Apokolips forces in the first movie, there no way other villain can shine as threat because the heroes already defeated the bigger villains, taking away the sense that the characters are evolving and delaing with new challenges than before.
aah... the nando v movies double upload......
Oh it's too much!
Just like your Avenger’s Infinity War video, I did not really have the same problem. However, I get your point and I love your change
I still can’t believe BvS rushed the whole “Death of Superman” storyline at the end of a movie with an entirely separate storyline
Agree. They should had left Superman alive in the end of BvS, allowing him to have the more scenes with the other members of the league, interacting with them and developing his dynamic with the team.
That’s one of the biggest sins of the whole movie. That should be the third Superman movie AT LEAST.
@@nickasaro8789 they used the death of Superman as a catalyst for the JL forming and Steppenwolf appearing on Earth. In Snyder's an the death of Superman was not going to be a factor in the later movies. He needed Superman to be away for most of JL so that Bruce could get the team together. The DoS was just a means to an end
I think the way Steppenwolf doesn't hang around to fight is a positive more than a negative. He's focused on getting the job done. He's harder to be distracted and the tension comes from preventing him from getting his hands on what he wants, not if he can be beaten or not. Showing Steppenwolf as being completely overpowered would end up making the movie too reliant on Superman, and in turn also overpowers Superman (even if they basically made Superman overpowered too anyway).
Doesn't even need to be any fancy special effects for the atlantian or amazon fight to save time and money. Have the shot of the army coming in, close up on Steppenwolf's face and he smiles, fade to black. Final shot of himboom tubing out with the camera panning down and pulling out to reveal a field littered with Amazons
“With all dead there’s only one thing you can really do.”
“What’s that?”
“Look through his pockets for loose change.”
A classic 👌
Also, nice formatting.
Lol where that from?😁
@@moygame159 The Princess Bride.
Its fantastic! I highly recommend.
Honestly with this change you could even keep one of the only whedon steppenwolf lines I kinda liked: "The old gods died." He could say it as he's snapping the axe
I usually agree with most of what Nando says. But imo giving Steppenwolf an ego flies in the face of his humbled attitude in the movie where he just wants to go home. And if superman was alive and Steppenwolf killed him however the league defeats Darkseid would never be believable
This video actually showed ways to improve the threat of Steppenwolf in the Snyder cut, and a better justification for bringing Superman back to life.
...yes.
Thing is if you set him this strong then Darkseid is going to have to be even more ludicrously strong to seem better. Power scaling is a tricky thing to do well.
Yh the thing is if diana and aquaman had a tough time dealing with Stephen wolf yet superman dealt with him with ease the we wouldn't be of any use in a fight again darkseid it would just be a solo between shoes and darkseid
@@weshal5732 True.
Batman prepared more for a Superman he thought had a 1% chance of evil than he did for the guy trying to take over Earth
Do we need to talk about Nando’s fantastic Gal Gadot impression? No? Ok…
My one small change to the entirety of Justice League (Zack’s or Joss’s, doesn’t matter) is that Steppenwolf should’ve resurrected Superman and brainwashed him into thinking he’s from Apokolips and use him as a weapon to take over earth (Just like in that Superman TAS ep)
Its planned in JL2 actually. But its darkseid who controls him
@@greengarden7557 If there’s a JL2 😕 Also, the direction Zack was going for felt a bit more like Injustice to me
@@JamesLawner well the set up is sort of like injustice it's just instead of turning evil after Lois's death his spirit is weakened and that enables Darkseid to take over his mind without too much resistance
This change would unfortunately fail the biggest challenge of a Justice League movie: explain why the Justice League is not just Superman’s cheer squad. But then both Wheedon and Snyder kind of failed that too.
This is also true.
Take flash out what happens?
See I look at the snydercut like its dragon ball z. Think about it, Steppenwolf is basically just raditz. The big strong guy who's just there to be super powerful til they beat him him it turns out he was the weakest bad guy and two more saiyans are on their way and their names are Darkseid and Dessad.
This and NerdSync's video make a very nice double feature of "we get it, Zack, 'badass' is the only adjective you respect" 😅
What about Epic or Mythic.
@@Fenris30 He can't really do either. He tries way too hard for them and consequently falls way short.
One change that would make it easy. Replace Steppenwolf with a character that would be an actual serious threat. Let Darkseid be the guy they are actually up against. Omega effect and all. That way reviving superman becomes a necessity, the team can't stand a chance without the big gun. It would also lead to a final act with more weight. The team has to push Darkseid back and straight remove him from earth back into the boom tube he opens for his generals and parademons.
That's kinda like what they did in Justice League War but that Darkseid behaved nothing like Darkseid and was defeated kinda meh. Specially to be the first time the team gets together. I feel it's more believable that is Steppenwolf (which even won and killed everyone except the Flash).
Wasn’t a fan of how stepphenwolf was a joke to sups. Last couple of scenes was lack luster because sup had no challenge.
He just beats him again and gain, so blunt and boring.
He beats him and still gets help of WW and Aquaman. And even then Steppenwolf wins. Becuase he wasn't the only challenge but to stop the Unity.
@@JoeChillton He destroyed his axe with freeze breath, kicks him, uses his heat vision, punches him again, then WW and Aquaman uise their "ultimates" too and after three more punches he uses his lasers to destroy his armor and cuts one of his horns off. How is that even boring, lol?
So by that logic thanos never won against any of the avengers because he runs away using the space stone at the end of every fight.
He killed heimdall, Loki too, knocked out hulk and beat thor first five minutes 🤦🏾♂️
he still teleported away tho🤣🤣🤣
Im just saying. Steppenwolf slaughtered hordes of Amazons and atlanteans. He just went away because he had like 50k worlds to do so. I'm pointing out the loophole in this logic
@@koushikraja331 I get what you're saying, neither came with intentions set on beating every soul individual... but Thanos actually had dubs in multiple encounters before even getting every stone. Darkseid shouldn't have lost that first fight, it's Darkseid!!! And wolf felt like adorable in some scenes lol
@@koushikraja331 Yeah but thanos beat the hulk so bad he was afraid to come out of banner. He killed gods, not just amazons and he eventually gets multiple infinity stones which had been built up and showed off for 20 movies at that point so we know he is dangerous. AND there is a point in that movie where he literally fights multiple avengers and guardians and Strange has to bribe him with the time stone.
@@champcpr Darkseid lost just like Sauron lost in his introduction, by his fingers been chopped off... That didn't take away the fact that he was the main villain or how powerful he was.
Darkseid didn't have the Omega effect and was fighting against three literal gods and a Green Lantern.
I think it would have been better for Steppenwolf to now take the axe as his own, as he is filled with rage withstanding its power and becoming even more of a threat
He also is already using an axe, makes more sense
Doesn't make sense to make the Axe able to take down Darksied but not Steppenwolf. That then makes Darksied look soft, which that axe scene did enough of. Terrible idea.
Fun Fact: Ares and Darkseid we’re going to team up in the original New Gods script and take down the old gods. Although it was scrapped because Warner didn’t want anything connecting to ZSJL universe
Instead of Steppenwolf going "heh", I would have him say Batman is "like a helpless child" and thus not worthy of a fight. Really would play into what drives Batman and the need to prove himself, as well as call back to when he felt helpless as a child when his parents were murdered in the alley. He's essentially reliving that moment again.
I don't love how the death of Superman was handled in BvS as it did feel unnecessarily tacked on, but at least it was made the climatic moment of the movie and was given enough time to let the weight of it sink in. I think Superman's death just being used as the midpoint of Justice League to raise the stakes, just to have them immediately resurrect him, would simply make it feel cheap and way more unnecessary then it did in BvS.
I heavily disagree with your statements steppenwolf he was decisively winning every encounter and it kind of showed in every fight that even if they fought together they were not able to overcome him not without superman and in the superman resurrection fight it was a literal stomp like not even close superman recked them all too lol there are many issues with this film but that wasn’t one of them as far as steppenwolf the only issue is what they did in the flashback replacing him with darkseid it borderline killed any perceived power the big bad powerful darkseid as supposed to it being steppenwolf in the 2017 version
At last... i was'nt The only thinking like this... I'm not alone...
“The movie starts with Steppenwolf stealing DVDs.”
God, I wish it did.
When you live in a bad neighborhood.
Cyborg: You should probably move.
Great vid. I was also annoyed at how little justification they had for bringing back Superman when and how they did. I love that in your videos, you don't just criticise the film but also point out how these things could be fixed.
This is what i call genuine constructive criticism. While I disagree, I can see why you feel the way you do. You actually care and paid attention enough to put at least a little effort into genuinely trying to what make what you feel would make the movie stronger. You can genuinely learn something and maybe grow from criticism like this. Many others....... not as much. This I feel is actually productive conversation
Nando I know you probably like chicken more, but what’s your favorite Pringle’s flavor?
Idk man I'm not feeling this one. I get having him win every fight. Show's he's a threat but honestly. I don't think it would really impact as much as you think it would. Plus it would seem like a weird change. My small change would just be not needing superman at all. He really only shows up to beat Stephenwolf and honestly I don't really care if he's a threat or not. I care that he is a focused person who doesn't have time to worry about those in his way.
They definitely didn’t need Superman. Like, Martian Manhunter is just running around doing nothing and he’s basically Superman but green.
He has been who knows how long on Earth and trying to not be noticed. And for what it seems not even knowing about the invasion. Until the end.
@@Vesohag Yeah my mans Martian Manhunter really come at the end like “aye bruh I got u next time.” Like bruh the world almost ended twice where tf were you lol.
@@Atlantafan21 it actually shows that not everyone who has power to be one, wants to be a hero, i know i never will. Some people just want to blend in because it doesn't matter how many wars you try to stop, how many thiefs you catch. There will always be more and humans would have stopped those criminals without your help too and also you'll create your own problems with your divine intervention, there is a joker because there is batman, same goes for luthor and superman. But in the end he says that he has realised he has a stake in this world so he'll try to help the team maybe something happened that changed his mind idk.
@@Atlantafan21 He even says that he has realised he has a stake in the world, that he can't hide no longer since there is a huge threat coming. Implies he was always trying to remain hidden but now it is obvious he has to be in the front line with the rest of the heroes of Earth.
If anything, he wasn't even gonna be in that scene but Green Lantern.
@@Vesohag Yeah Ik Snyder wanted Lantern to be in that final scene. But Manhunter kinda breaks the move imo considering the fact he is just about as powerful as Superman but doesn’t participate, whether he’s trying to hide or not. In the one scene he was supposed to be in, I don’t believe he mentions trying to hide but instead just says the world needs Lois, even though the world needs him not Lois lol. I like Manhunter a lot, but the movie could have done without him and it would have been for the better imo.
Gotta disagree with you on this one. It’s more telling that Steppenwolf doesn’t fight them. He doesn’t even think they’re worth his time.
You know he loses constantly, The Avengers. They have lost to each other in Civil War and lose to Thanos in Infinity War.
It only took multiple movies to finally take a risk lol.
You made a ton of sense in this video. I believe Snyder didn’t go that route because that’s what we were meant to get in JL 2 when they face off Darkseid and key characters actually die, raising the stakes like you earlier said against a bigger and badder villain. We can’t have heroes dying back to back in movies
Thank you for acknowledging the Mera situation, so much would've been solved if they brought Mera ex Machina
Why would Steppenwolf choose to stay and fight the "Riders of Rohan" if he already has what he came for? There's no reason to. He isn't looking to fight, he isn't looking to win, he's looking to get the Motherbox. Once he had that, he had no reason to be there.
Having Steppenwolf win every fight was done in the first version and everyone HATED it! It made the Justice League look USELESS!!
Also, I love your impression of Gal Godot! Super well done accent!
honestly Nando, if I had complete control over this universe, I would make it completely different than the Snyderverse….I would make it more akin to the DCAU with changes (some big, some small)
I think Steppenwolf tearing Cyborg in half could be quite emotional because after having endured a lot of physical trauma, he could respond to someone asking him if he's okay by saying ,,I didn't even feel it" and him being sad because he doesn't feel any pain anymore, making him feel even less human.
a couple more small changes i’d suggest (these wouldn’t all necessarily work alongside each other but still):
- ezra miller is playing wally west instead of barry allen
- remove martian manhunter or add him more
- remove the knightmare scenes
- adding a green lantern
- save the talk of the anti life equation for the sequels
If it’s Wally then you can also swap out Iris West for Linda Park
I agree with most of these (though I'm not sure how having wally West rather than barry would improve things) however I think the antilife equation is important to mention as it sets up the threat that darkseid will be coming back to earth... But I'd rather set it up like steppenwolf gets all the motherboxes and is about to use them... But then gets the hint of the antilife equation which delays him cos he flies off to confirm its there before triggering the final sequence basically implying the heroes would have lost had he not hesitated at the chance of a greater prize, which plays off how objective focused wolfi boi is all movie.
@@Cheesusful it’s because dceu flash acts more like wally so it’d be comic accurate
Nando, I find it curious that your One Small Change for ZSJL is essentially identical to your One Small Change for WW84... that Diana digs up an ancient mythical artifact (the gold eagle armor in 84, the Axe of Ares in ZSJL) to balance the scales of a fight; and that said artifact has the side effect of inducing the war-like rage of Ares upon the person wielding it.
He's running low on Hephaestus juice.
It was interesting what you said about killing Superman here. I do think it would establish Steppenwolf and by extension, the Apokolips gods as a force to be reckoned with, and I think it would especially fit if Superman went out saving a ton of people.
I disagree with Nando on that one. If I was handling this, I would have preferred it if Superman died against Darkseid, not his general.
My big problem with the Snyder Cut is that they go through all the trouble of rescuing Superman and don't even need him for the final fight outside of one moment, which Cyborg probably could have done on his own anyways. The entire resurrection arc felt like a waste of time
I don't get the tearing Cyborg in half being an issue. If you can blow him up, tear him apart limb from limb, and he's STILL standing at the end, and he's a better hero than ever before? That's badass and truly super heroic- ye can't be beaten! I definitely don't li,e Joss's JL, but I think caving in to RF on that was a bad move.
You explaining the problem...
Me... wait.. you're absolutely right! Felt like they revived supes just because everyone missed him.
They revived him because the motherboxes feared him. And because to just keep fighting like this, without Superman, could be just a way to buy some time but not a bullet proof way to defeat the invasion.
It is not adorable that nobody wins in f&f, it is sad, how insecure do you have to be to count punches in a movie. But to the main point of the video, superman getting killed in this movie by some second rate replacement darksied would be unexpected but I dont love the idea. In the rewrite you suggest, I really like that idea. It would have been nice if the main villain was an actual threat at some point that justified bringing superman back to life. great video my guy
They did justify why bringing Superman back was needed though. They say the motherboxes were awoken only after Superman was killed, showing how they were afraid of him. And that to defeat the invasion and Steppenwolf they need everyone, including Superman. And since the motherbox managed to remake Victor, it could do that to Superman.
@@Vesohag Them being afraid of superman is one of the least logical things in the film so it being a justification for anything is just not going to work for me
@@extonjonas6820 It is what it is. Even if it doesn't work for you, it is still what the story presents and explains. At most you could say is a convinance but not devoid of a logic or justification.
@@Vesohag It is just not logical. It is not even convenient, it is just poor writing. It is not even a necessity, if it were I would perhaps be more willing to forgive it
@@extonjonas6820 It is logical. The motherboxes have been asleep since they were separated thousands of years ago. Only one gets to be activated and goes back to sleep. Superman's scream is so precise that makes them to be activated for a moment to be able to call Steppenwolf. It's that simple. What would you have done?
“No main character ever loses a fight”. Themyscira battle, Atlantis battle, underground battle, the final fight where they literally fail at stopping the world from being blown up and the flash has to rewind time to fix it. Did you watch the movie
You don't have to rip Cyborg fully in half. Show tearing metal, sparking circuits, and him screaming so that Diana rushes in before he's too hurt. You can even play it as Stepenwolf taunting Diana. He's drawing it out, staring right at her. She charges in, he just drops Cyborg.
Fisher would have as much an issue with that. I think only something like another black guy like John Stewart in the team would have made him less critical of all race issues.
That would be a perfect way for Batman to be the one to beat steppenwolf, maybe by wielding that axe because he’s batman
I get where you’re coming from, but what was some of these points about? The group has lost plenty of times to steppenwolf throughout the film. Even when Superman comes in, it’s not like they win there either because there is a bigger glaring problem on their hands, the motherboxes. They have to stop them from syncing and they don’t. They are too late and the team dies bc of it. But, not Superman, the flash makes use of his abilities to travel back in time and largely contribute to the battle as everyone else did in this movie. Why are people trying to find problems with this film. Well not problems, I get what you’re doing here, to make it fit your image of the film more which is always a nice thing to watch here and there. Although the movie doesn’t really need any necessary changes as I found mostly everything to work out quite well here in this movie, considering the narrative and story zack wanted to tell with these characters.
If Steppenwolf was as strong as his earth 2 new 52 introduction then it would make sense for them to bring back Clark
"and GORES him." a gentleman and scholar of ECW I see.
I’m always super impressed by your Diana impression
Nando wants him to be Frieza... nice
This series is my favorite! Its so cool ehat you come up with with a small change.
finally watched Snyder League. Man I miss these videos.
I like the subtle accent your do for Diana
‘Book book’ is what my chickens call them too.
Low emotional/dramatic stakes and fights not escalating have plagued Zack Snyder before, cf. Sucker Punch. He's such an awesome visual storyteller that you don't always notice it until rewatch later though (or obsessive RUclipsr nitpicking 😉).
Spikey flex is the coolest thing to happen in the entire movie
My one, small change would be to rewrite the whole script. That would of course require a few small reshoots, but only about 2-3 hours worth.
I gotta say, Ray Fisher's request not to give Cyborg a beating coz he's black is pretty bonkers. Arguments like these is what leads to Mary Sue characters like Rey that take no damage, and ultimately hurts black / female / minority characters.
JL was originally written as part of a trilogy, so I think they wouldn't raise the stakes THAT much in what *was* supposed to be the first movie. If Steppenwolf already wrecked them so bad, how would they even portray Darkseid? Just my two cents
Easy, they need to be a team to beat Steppenwolf, but in JL2 even together they still lose.
9:00 You don’t really have to worry about heroes acting out of character here. Snyder sure didn’t.
OMG Nando can please give us a tip as to how you are so good at making these types of changes please
Except Steppenwolf is on a mission FROM Darkseid. Its not about a character flaw or feeding his ego. If you're wanting to further Wheddonize Zack's original vision which includes an Injustice version of Superman then sure. Resurrect Superman in JL 2 & forget about a 3rd. Otherwise you're just unnecessarily convoluting an already solid storyline 🤷
Alternative title: "Continuing Nando's superior BvS: Dawn of Justice film"
Main difficulty I see here is this would really undermine the Amazons. If they don't fight to the last woman, then their specialness is lost. If Steppenwolf kills them all, it plays into some uncomfortable tropes & creates its own problems. Steppenwolf running away & telling everybody he killed them resolves this problem & still gives us insight into his character.
I think Nando wanted to solve a short-term problem here but is inadvertently writing himself into a long-term one. I agree with his pitch for Steppenwolf vs the League under Gotham Harbor but that's about it. He wanted to have Superman die against Steppenwolf. That alone is insane. I would have had Supes die against Darkseid while saving people instead.
I love your proposed changes, friend, but I feel they would reduce Steppenwolf to a bad guy that's a bully. We've already seen that in SO many of these movies.
All the points he made doesn’t make sense. He just tried to make a dramatic disney story. Steppenwolf’s main goal was to collect mother boxes, form the unity and take earth in Darkseid’s name. There is no any reason for him to fight everyone, beat everyone. He has a mission and he knows it. By the way, superman’s death was the main reason to activate one of three motherboxes so superman getting killed later in movie how does it make sense? According to his logic, this movie will be 5 hrs long.
I didn’t really notice this problem until now and honestly this is part of why I prefer BvS over ZSJL. Still love the film a lot though 👍
steppenwolf dosent wanna fight an army of amazons because he dosent wanna waste time killing them and to unite the mother boxes ASAP
I’ll do you one better: Superman stays evil after his revival. The League uses the Mother Box but Superman stays rabid. The League gets beat down, but Green Lantern saves them at the last minute. Only he and Wonder Woman can fight him off, before they get beat too.
Superman flies off to join Steppenwolf for the Unity. The final fight takes place more or less the same but with Superman leading the Parademons. Green Lantern pins Superman down with energy chains and Cyborg frees his mind with his Mother Box tech.
The rest is basically the same as what we got afterwards
As someone who knows how Judas Contract is different from the show's version of it, I understand and recognize your surprise.
As long as we have more of the brine kingdom (those crab warriors) I’m all game.
I said the same thing for the First Movie, did they really NEED Superman...
How many movies have it where the villain gets the upper hand early on, and just kills the protagonist? It's pretty much a given that no one will fight pragmatically...
Steppenwolf winning every fight up until the end is perfect. This is the reason why Thanos was such a problem. Up until the very last fight of end game Thanos beat everyone definitively. The only person that got close the only end was Thor when he classically should have aim for the head.
the change should be that there should have been a stand alone flash movie and a stand alone cyborg movie or a show.