REMOVING A LOAD BEARING WALL | Joshua Tree Cabin Renovation
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- Опубликовано: 16 май 2024
- Today I'm taking out a load bearing wall dividing the kitchen and living space in my Joshua Tree Cabin. The ceiling joists are spliced where the wall was, so I added a header or a "strongback" in the attic to make sure the ceiling doesn't sag. This project was fun and opening up the space made a huge difference. I've got more content in this series on the way! Make sure to subscribe!
-Mike Montgomery
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-Mike Montgomery
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Hi, My name is Mike Montgomery and I'm a MAKER; a designer, builder, and full-time content creator. Accessibility is my focus with Modern Builds, not simply accessibility of designs, but accessibility in materials, information, and projects themselves. I've focused on creating furniture and DIY projects that are simple enough that any beginner maker can accomplish, yet interesting enough that any expert might be inspired. Building and making is becoming less and less of an exclusive hobby and profession. My goal is to reduce that separation even further. 
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Hi Mike! Great job!. Big Fan! Perhaps the title should read removing a non load bearing wall. Your structure in the Attic seems to be holding the ceiling only which by definition is not load bearing. Although your approach worked it would be life threatening for anyone who tries the same thing with actual load bearing structure. Adding extra studs at the load point is probably a good idea. Perhaps showing your hardware and structural screws in the description would help. Your rafters are actually acting like collar ties that hold up drywall. most houses like yours use trusses. very interesting. Feel free to reach out in the future if you have questions about your reno project. Looks like you are making some good headway! Would just hate to see you do all that and have trouble with the inspectors. Cheers!
The 🐐 himself
I was thinking was that even a load bearing wall. Being that there no load above.
If anything, just go and sister those ceiling joists. Or sandwich them.
I don't really know. That's one thing I would have hired out. And not do it myself.
Mike! Civil Engineer here, a header by definition is made to transfer loads outward onto other points. Please put a disclaimer in this video. If those ceiling joists are truly load bearing they should be resting on top of the header, not suspended by a hurricane tie. You could’ve also cut a 3 inch wide space between the ceiling joists and installed the header flush with the Sheetrock using joist hangers. I know it appears that yours is mostly there for Sheetrock reinforcement and not actually bearing weight, but this video could be dangerous to someone lacking understanding.
That header should be bearing on at least a double 2x4 Jack stud on both sides.
This video is DANGEROUS to those that follow it as a “How To”
Also- When using Simpson strong tie brackets ALWAYS use 10d nails or similar screws specified by manufacturer, NOT DECK SCREWS!
I was looking for a comment about the screws. I’ve seen Project Farm demonstrate how screws snap in half under light pressure whereas nails can flex and hold your house together
@@dylan-nguyen Simpson strong tie does make a structural screw meant for their connectors. But I still prefer nails for that reason.
Omg 😳 I saw mike’s video and I was like “Immediately take this video down. This video can be used as disinformation to people that don’t know about structure bearing walls this can be a disaster to other people. Please just take this video down or fix the disclaimer.
As an engineer you should be able to tell if that’s a load bearing wall. Contractors walk through houses and can tell you. I appreciate your info for those who don’t know. Of note it’s a half wall with a large opening not likely load bearing. Cali has the strictest bulging codes in the nation period.
@@lechatbotte. I can tell, those joists break on top of the wall therefore yes it was there to bear weight. Luckily it doesn’t have a floor above it or have the roof load on it, nonetheless still load bearing.
I always learn so much from his videos by assuming he did something wrong and reading the comments.
I'm sure most of the comments are similar to mine. This was not done properly. In fact, I think you just made it worse as far as safety. You just added more weight to something that has no support to it. The header should go underneath the ceiling joist or cut the joist 1.5 inches on each joist where both joist meet and fit the double in between and use joist hangers.
If the double is sitting on that 4ft kitchen wall and on the header of that door, then you might want to let your audience know.
I've never seen so many civil engineers in one spot before
It doesn't take a civil engineer to know that he used hurricane straps in a non-approved way, he didn't spec his beam, he turned a distributed load into two point loads (without consideration to whether that was carried to the foundation), and he is generally not smart.
It's a pretty ingenious way of getting an engineer to tell you how to do it properly, by first doing it the improper, dangerous way and posting it on the internet.
This guy is a total hack and deserves the hate
“1800 super pro”
You are the definition of the dunning-kruger effect
I’ve been watching mike for awhile now even since he was a bit beefier. I enjoy his fun little DIY videos for inspiration and entertainment. BUT, these are the kinda videos he’s does that don’t sit well with me. My guy is not an actual pro despite being a “super pro”. This is dangerous and he doesn’t know what he’s doing. Somebody might try this now because of him without knowing the actual consequences.
I respect what you doing my guy but there’s already a ton of comments on here saying what I’m saying. Please take the time to have a contractor double some of your bigger ideas! Still a fan and watch all your videos
As a structural engineer who is installing a 27 ft LVL in my own home.... how this was done terrifies me
As a structural engineer I second that.
In what way? Tell me more I am legit curious! I don't know any structural engineers IRL and I have big dreams for changing up my townhouse
@@hey_virginia too many things wrong with this video for a comment. Have an engineer draw you a detail and then have experienced contractors bid on the install of that detail.
@@hey_virginia the major issue is he is removing the support for the dead load of the ceiling away. His is spanning a strongback from the exterior wall (likely okay for bearing this load - in this application) to the header over the original walk way between the wall he removed and the other wall. So now half that load, previously carried by the wall, is suspended by a cantilevered header, which was not designed to be cantilevered. He stiffened the rafter ties which is probably why it didn't collapse.
@@mattarenz1195 so tremendously helpful!!
Love the videos Mike!
But as a civil engineer I really recommend adding a disclaimer to always consult a licensed engineer. This could be dangerous for people following this video as a ‘how to’ and don’t understand how structural supports should work.
Thanks for the tip! How do I find a licensed engineer who does small-scale residential projects? My initial searching nearby turned up mostly engineers who work on commercial projects or with entire housing developments
@@hey_virginia I am a licensed Engineer in my area that will consult on these projects. I’d recommend looking into local town/Facebook groups online and asking who people have used before.
Looks nice Mike although it does not appear to be structurally sound. You have always made it clear that you are not a professional builder or electrician. I am a nurse -midwife and not a builder or constructional engineer yet very concerned about the safety of your technique in the video. As a home owner who DIYs a lot in my home, I would not remove a load bearing wall without paying the money for an expert and getting necessary permits if needed. You are a talented young man and I will continue to subscribe. I do suggest taking this video down before someone follows the how-tos and it leads to a devastating accident and the person sues you.
So glad to see you back at the Joshua Tree House. Really looking forward to seeing you finish it.
If you‘re watching this and planning to do the same thing yourself: DONT!
1st it’s fucking dangerous
2nd you‘ll need permits for this
3rd it’s fucking dangerous!!
Holy cow, I missed something else. You put the main bearing header on top of a cripple stud which used to go over a header that you saws-all'ed through! I cannot express how dangerous you made this house. The city should condemn it until it's fixed!
Title should be renamed: How not to remove a Load bearing wall
Hurricane ties aren't meant to hang things. They're meant to strap things down and only provide counteracting forces under intermittent uplift loading conditions. They aren't meant to be under continuous load duration as part of the main structural support. Just watching your video, you would have been better off using joist hangers off of your header. Installing double joist hangers on alternating sides would counteract twisting forces too.
If I was the inspector and saw this, I'd definitely ding your for it. It's a major structural concern IMO. The span should be alright with double 2x10s, but I would have glued and screwed them together to be sure. Also, if you don't have posts supporting that header in the ceiling, that's a major concern as well. I'm not a structural engineer (EE by training) but I did convince the city well enough that I know what I'm doing and got my own self-made trusses passed off because truss outfits had a 2-year backlog during the pandemic.
It is possible to do what you're doing in a much safer way though and you probably should have done a little more research on what a better approach might be with your project before you signed off on this attempt.
A project like this would require engineer stamped drawings where I live and I imagine it would be the same in CA. Probably not a great idea to put a un permitted structural project on here. especially with your reach. Still a fan And I've been missing the podcast.
What I thought
I’Looking forward to seeing what you’re going to do in the kitchen. Would be kind of fun to see a recreation of that routed door style but updated with the capabilities of today’s tools (CNC).
4:29 You cant have open electrical splices in wall without being in a box that is accessible. Also for header the correct way would be to have the beam flush with drywall. Cut the ceiling truss 1 1/2" for a 2x8 or 3" if you have to double in your area, then use joist hanger to attach the truss to joist, also if needed more studs needed from floor to ceiling to carry the additional load from the beam and that has to go to foundation.
I love your videos, but please make a disclaimer on this. I am a structural engineer and this does not seem like it was done correctly. I really don't want your RUclips channel to lose credibility but you should not be doing your own work on load bearing walls without consulting a structural engineer. It does not seem clear as to where that new header beam is spanning to. Also how do you know (2)2x10s are adequate, and how to correctly fasten it together. It looks like the walls were not reinforced on either side for where the beam above is landing. There are several things that should be analyzed and reviewed by an engineer - the beam size (determine if the (2)2x10s are adequate, detail connections at the ends, detail connections for the joist hangers and size the screws, review the load at the end of the beam and see where the load gets transferred to the walls below, and reinforced the walls below. Also, an engineer can help with the sequencing to make sure that support is installed prior to cutting out the wall. This video doesn't sit right with me so please make a disclaimer and guide people to consult an engineer when dealing with load bearing walls. I see some crazy construction errors on large buildings I work on and it is important to make sure engineering is not skipped.
I have done in my house what he did but first I called house inspector who was inspecting my house before purchase. He suggested me to do it that way.
Between the poorly designed and installed strongback (best of luck when you go to sell the house because no home inspector is going to miss that massive liability) and the use of a jigsaw to cut drywall, this video was a hot mess. This video is a fine product of RUclips University
Can't wait to also see the popcorn ceiling going! Be careful in case it happens to contain asbestos, stay safe!
Mike, Laura Kampf just did a similar project. Learn from her mistakes, so you can easily correct yours. :)
My first thought was…”It’s not really holding the load. That’s dangerous.” Dude, this isn’t good without a disclaimer or something.
I’ve never seen a beam put in above the ceiling joist before very interesting 🤔
This is NOT a how-to. Dangerous! It will probably be fine for his application but I would NOT do this. He uses deck screws as a structural connector for crying out loud.
@@nickmatarazzo879 yeah I figured as much. I tend to watch This Old House if I want to see something done right
Normally your videos are pretty good but you really missed it on this one. Not only are the tools and techniques you used wrong but the “header” you put in is downright dangerous. It is not doing anything to support those joists. I think you need to do some more research before taking on a project like this, especially if you are going to use it to teach others.
How did you determine it was a load bearing wall and what board size was necessary for the re-inforcement?
I believe it’s wall that runs perpendicular to direction of the floor joist
Ok, did you even watch the video? He answers both those questions clear as day 🤣
Consult an ENGINEER! Licensed engineer and contractor here. Please, safest bet.
The reality is magic of editing. He probably took the wall out first, someone told him that was load bearing, he went "oh shit" and added that beam in the ceiling with deck screws he had lying around. The modern builds way 👍
@@mattjames8683 Based on head to attached the header. Which is not a beam. I really wouldn't trust him.
Mike, I'm sorry but this is one of those times that I would call fail. IIRC, load bearing walls and changes to the electrical require permits and testing the popcorn for asbestos prior to removing would be important.
There are probably legitimate ways to support from the top to create the hidden support, but that would require checking with engineers and your code enforcement people.
You would also need to increase the number of king studs to properly support the ends of your beam.
Most, if not all, areas require a hallway between the bathroom and kitchen, for sanitary reasons, and you've removed it.
I love open concept, but there are right ways and wrong ways.
Learned two good tips Mike… screws in drywall before hanging and tinted skim coat. Great job. Can’t wait for kitchen 👍
Now i want to see the fridge moved over to where the ovwn is and a stove oven combo installed where the stove is, and extended cabinets and counter tops where the fridge is
I’m obsessed with all the engineers in the comments demanding a disclaimer.
Same, so many engineers.
This application is seriously dangerous. He added more weight and removed support.
Not to mention he doesn’t live here, I think he rents this place out. Further making it dangerous…
That's uh, not how you install a load-bearing beam.
"That way I could reference it and do everything correct." Why did the outlet originally the two 14ga wires coming into the box but when you reassembled you had added a 12ga wire into a 14ga outlet box? Seems very misleading and illegal (code compliant) to me. 3:52
Why is that? If the breaker is still sized for 15 amps or whatever, what's the harm in going with thicker wires?
Just to add to this comment…
Looks like it’s a patch wire. This wouldn’t be an issue (not sure about code) because the wires on both sides of that path wire is 14AWG (and the 12AWG doesn’t go anywhere else as a feed), not the best thing to do, however what he did is illegal and a safety hazard. The patch wire is just nut tied and hidden in the wall, it should go to a junction box. You can’t just hide junctions in the wall.
@@akhurash Oh shoot yeah I had to rewatch to catch that buried wire nuted splice. That is no bueno and definitely not super pro!! 🤔
@@fgbhrl4907As I understand it, even if your breaker is rated for it, the wires getting to the larger gauge wire are not. Essentially you are pulling too much electricity (causing heat) through them which can lead to a fire.
Also dangerous “header”installation
Ha! I just did this in my 3 bedroom duplex….BUT I have trusses and you do not.
This is unbelievably bad, my man.
Why did you leave part of the wall?
Those outlets are wired in series might wanna rewire in parallel for troubleshooting purposes because if one fails the others after it wont work where parallel will fail but the others will still work
Also exposed wire nuts behind drywall #superclown 🤡
I want this done to my house. Im going to hire a contractor
You should have put the header flush with the ceiling joist and put the joist with hangers
Should have just used a beefed up header and opened up the space but left support on both ends. Would open up the space but left the support for the ceiling joists.
RUclips strikes again. I haven't recieved notifications for 2 months. Luckily tonight I went to the search bar to see what's going on.
where is the link to the dust mask you used?
The useful thing about this video is that it shows the all too common “techniques” of aesthetic home flippers. I think work like this gets done a lot. See it, recognize how bad it is, and learn how to fix it. The house won’t fall down but I’m sure that ceiling will sag over time.
Nice job.
Never use deck screws for structural work
I was today years old when I realized he didn’t live there. I thought that was his house!
Looking great! Attic in AZ, not my idea of a good time.
Someone please entertain this conversation: this clearly isn’t for education purposes, correct? As someone who watches a lot of RUclips, I recognize being a RUclips content creator is a grind. It’s not about the craft, it’s about Mike pumping out videos just to get views and engagement. It doesn’t matter if the work is crap, he’ll post another video next week and we’ll watch. Just pure entertainment.
"A dust mask and eye protection is a good idea" SO IS KNOWING WHEN YOU HAVE NO IDEA WHAT THE HELL YOURE DOING!!!
Mike receiving the wrath of engineers. There's zero chance of anyone watching this is going to do what mike did. Everyone can relax😏
Civil Engineers !!!!!! - Assemble....
Hurricane ties are not meant for a static load.
Mike very nice job. Looking a lot better Mike. So happy to see a new video on your house build. Can't wait to see more videos soon my friend. Keep up the great craftsmanship and hard work my friend. Keep making. God bless.
I've watched him for a few years now.. his work is constantly sloppy. I'm not referring to the "structural" work he did (other comments can handle that situation lol) I'm referring to the finishing work. I questioned what his renovations would look like in person ever since his bus renovation series.. probably only showing the good angles for the views
+1
spot on
It is making RUclips content for cheap :D. I hate that it works but it does, we are all here watching.
So its cool you make all these other videos and stuff but are you ever going to finish the bus?
Can't wait for the next one
Im guessing Ryobi did Mike dirty and he has now spraypainted all his tools. lol
Maybe, you can change where the refrigerator is placed (for example, near the new wall)... I think it would be a nice idea to have more light and space. thank you for your videos! I enjoy them a lot!
You should get a kwickan for your trash bags it will help ALOT I promise you!!!
goodness: I spent one summer afternoon up in my attic trying to fix the insulation & realized it was too hot for me...good on you for not being a wimp & doing it yourself 👍👍
So you removed the second light switch for the dining room? Did you replace the first one? You probably left the three way switch in there. You also had 15 amp wiring and 20 amp wiring going to the outlet you moved. Bet you didn’t check the circuit to see the breaker size or what else was on that circuit.
title of the video should be: removing a load bearing wall by a hipster
The framing of that beam is dangerous. PLEASE DONT ANYONE DO THIS. I couldn’t even finish the video
That fridge is an eye soar. Maybe move it out of the kitchen next to the window. I would have opened up the little remaining piece of wall as well and redone the kitchen across the wall with the window in an L shape. It still looks a bit dingy.
This video should be taken down immediately. This is beyond dangerous.
He just leaves wires in the wall?
I hope you had that ceiling tested for asbestos? You should really wear a mask (and eye protection) when taking that stuff off!
You should apply primer to any exposed brown paper on drywall.
Why do your voice overs always seem like your screaming into the microphone????🤣🤣 And cutting drywall and cornerbead with a jigsaw, like wtf 🤣
looking forward to this series
As a mechanical engineer student I sure you that the way you have put in that beam does not counteract the forces in a equivalent way compared to the wall you took out.
just what I need. another overhyped u tube "star". Why would anyone expect to learn anything from a guy that pulls a wall without checking if it is a support.
awesome, keep going!
My kitchen is the same way and i want to do this sooo bad
I did that last year in my Tri-split level house. Now I have 600 square foot open concept kitchen with enormous island instead of walls :)
@@club4ghz I am working on everything else at the moment. Will save that for last
@@club4ghz I also have a tri split
Great job mike im excited to see more videos from you
I love youre videos
I’m not a civil engineer or a contractor but for your own sanity and peace of mind please hire this type of work out and do not try the beginning of this ‘DIY’
Wasn't it a really good time to address the remaining ugly popcorn ceiling, also at the same time?
What about an exterior wall
Mike is really loud and always shouting his voice overs but at the same time I love his content and his ideas are often off the charts terrific. So I'm gonna stick around and just turn the volume down. Great editing, too. What's not to love!
It's the industrial deafness kicking in. He thinks that wearing AirPods with loud music is enough to protect your hearing.
holy mother of god people dont use this as your how to
Mike Mike Mike… I don’t know much about this stuff but I do know that’s not the correct way of doing what you did.
Maybe add HOW NOT TO at the beginning of the title.. i'm not a structure engineer and even i know that this is completly wrong! Guys don't play with the structure of your house, just spend the couple hundreds $ and have an engineer have a look first.. or ruin your house, whatever floats your boat... (and lol @ the screws in the simpson ties)
Dude as soon as I saw you put "load bearing wall" in the title I knew the engineers would be out in droves with PSAs (maybe justified but I have no knowledge on the subject). I hope this change to your cabin goes well for you and safety isnt compromised.
I'll know this house will not pass inspection.
If he even did get it inspected.
I'm no expect, but I don't think that header is the correct way to do it.
There's supposed to be a post on both ends of the beam. A header is not a beam.
You can tell that wall was load bearing and the ends of the joists were sitting on the top plate.
He just put the hearder on the beam. Like that will hold up anything.
If that was me, I'll get an expect to take care of that.
Dude if that was a load bearing wall shouldn't you have checked with an engineer? Even if you DIY the work a pro will make sure it's safe. That beam in the attic seems more Super Sketch than Super Pro.
Lots of comments about the danger of this video. I’m no expert, but here’s my take.
As far as I can tell, the “load bearing wall” he’s removing doesn’t support any point loads. If it did, the ceiling joist wouldn’t be spliced together with plywood. Also, the ceiling joist are in tension and any pressure from the roof should be a point load on exterior walls of the house. If anything the strong back is just a precaution to support the weight of the ceiling joists.
Like others have mentioned, deck screws and hurricane ties shouldn’t mix. Deck screws are brittle.
This is not right dude.
'Load bearing' in stick framing, means that loads from above are transfered down to the slab/post/beam below all the way to the ground. What you've done In the attic here doesn't accomplish that.
I was expecting that long beam to be under the ceiling to provide support...
I love your videos
This is stupidly dangerous. That ceiling is going to stag and it is NOT up to code. When my contractor did the load bearing wall removal-he framed an extra temporary wall to hold the weight before knocking down the old wall. It would help to add several jacks to hold the current wall up before demo. Then he needs to install a huge steel I-beam right below the horizontal 2x6. The 4x4 two extra posts were added to the sides to hold the weight. This is completely wrong wrong wrong. That board you put in the attic does nothing and even put more weight.
I have no idea what just happened but judging by the comments I shouldn't try it
Hey mike, keep it up!
Why would you ever keep a popcorn ceiling they’re gross
MISINFORMATION! that isnt how structure works at all. The load carried by the wall was not transferred. At the very least you should've extended the beam to the ext wall for support and have the opposite side sit on the assumed existing post (assumed cause there is already an opening). Always consult a professional! seems harmless at your house but not everyone's home is the same and a video like this can lead to safety issues.
rafters are supposed to lay on a header and you didnt even use proper fasteners for the hurrican ties, just some 3 inch deckmates. this video might get some unknowing diy-er hurt.
Love the content
Let’s hope that “header” doesn’t collapse on someone’s head. Read the comments, dude.
Why are you ignoring all the critical comments on this video?
I'm with all the inadequate structural support comments. Add a disclaimer or take the vid down.
Love your other videos but can't be silent on this one
Is that a Manufactured on foundation?
Good
I guess paper houses do have their merits