Water Pump Fail - EricTheCarGuy
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- Опубликовано: 9 сен 2024
- Water Pump Fail - EricTheCarGuy
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This one is a continuation of the cooling system overheat video, here is a link
• How To Solve An Engine...
Many of you pointed out that the water pump could be at fault and it just so happened I got this car in a few weeks ago with this exact problem.
I hope you have as much fun watching these as I have making them.
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The two times I've had water-pumps fail on me (two different cars, BTW), I've noticed that the heater quits working, or doesn't work as well as it used to. That's the primary indicator (in my mind, anyway) that your water pump is dead or dying.
Electrolysis is what happens... (I'm an ASE and state of Michigan, certified Master Automotive Technician and own Reliable Auto Repair of Wayne) In ANY bi-metal engine (i.e aluminum heads, iron block) coolant goes bad and turns acidic... It then combined with a ferrous and non-ferrous metal, makes a battery essentially.... This eats away at any steel or iron components in the cooling system.... i have seen this problem with the impeller dozens of times... You can check it by removing the upper rad hose, and start the engine with the rad hose facing a bucket.... It should pump coolant out very quickly... If it does not, you need a pump...
I've heard that G12 (the red coolant) is rated lifetime.
Until you flush it every 60000, or leave it if it stays red.
It's kind of like why flush tranny fluid if it is still red, clear (it hasnt lost it's viscosity in that at any rate)
So,m then there must be an additive that can prevent this.....water-to-glycol mix change?
I had it inside mine for 5 years and definitely less than 60000 kilometers, and now i'm gonna change it since i'm putting a new radiator on (factory one has a very small leak on it). It's still red, but not as clear as the new one.
+g money I was gonna say that cute girl in your profile picture is your girlfriend and that you're a guy but that girl is actually you! :O
So a short cute girl is a master tech? Either this generation is really different now or you're lying. :P
I've had this problem with my car for years with the overheating and the no heat. Car is 97 Protege with 107000 miles on it but it was used by another person for a few months and they drove it more in those few months than I did in years. So yeah water pump failed and this video helped out greatly. RUclips to the rescue again.
7 years later, I have just bought a 57 plate Mondeo 1.8 diesel (uk) and driving round small side streets, it was absolutely fine, soon as speed built up, heater went cold and the temp gauge shot up to a dangerous level, shut down and parked up, its now in for belts and water pump, because I watched this video. Many thanks ETCG
Tim Wilkie Did that fix the problem?
Dj J-Doo sorry, yes it did, my mechanic told me the pump looked fine but replaced it anyway I sat at 70 mph for 20 minutes on the motorway with no issues at all
Tim Wilkie nice!
11 Years later ... The video is still good as new.!
@DAQUAN88 Interesting approach. I think the most important clue for this is an overheat on the highway but not at idle, opposite of a bad cooling fan. After eliminating the other usual possibilities I think it's safe to start looking to the water pump or a coolant flow problem for the cause of this type of overheat. Thanks for your comment.
There's nothing like watching an Eric the Car Guy vid after a long day. I sit the laptop on my, well, lap, grab a glass of cab sav, sit back and enjoy Eric doing his thing. I hope you never stop making auto vids Eric. They are the best.
Bro straight up lol, here I am straight out of work, having my late night lunch while watching , such a great guy , very informative.
One of the most useful tools used in numerous fields of work I've added to my collection is a thermal imaging camera. Watch in real time parts heat up or not. I use it in HVAC and construction for appliances, walls/windows, water leaks inside walls etc. $250 will get you a FLIR for your phone. Also, for automotive, see cylinder exhaust manifold for dead cylinders, in & out of catalytic converter for clog etc, etc.
@Standingwithfeast Thanks for that great comment, I really appreciate it.
@Kirayamatoplay That works great on engines where the water pump is accessible but in many cases it's not possible to do that without tearing the engine down. Thanks for the suggestion and comment.
Thanks Eric. I've never seen a water pump with an impeller that has corroded away like that. Very informative.
@ElderlyIron Interesting approach however I see air in the system cause intermittent heat issues as well. I think the most important clue to this issue is that it would overheat while driving on the highway but not idling, I think this is an indication of a cooling system efficiency problem as when the vehicle is under load it will increase the heat load. Thanks for your input and your comment.
I've never seen an impeller waste away to that degree. Great information on the cooling system in general. Nice vid.
Was loose for a while a owner stretched every day out of it it played rust recipe before it eventually failed belong usage then thats where they decided to change it
@EricWaterTruck You are correct that as coolant breaks down it will become acidic and electrically charged. The reason it begins to corrode the system is 2 part, one part because of the acidity but also because it looses it's rust inhibiters. Thanks for the comment.
My automotive book says to warm the engine to operating temperature then shut it off and squeeze the upper radiator hose while an assistant starts the engine again. Apparently you should feel a pressure surge in the hose to know if the water pump if forcing coolant through the system. I don't know if it works though because i haven't tried it yet.
If you have a return pipe from the radiator to the reservoir tank i think that if you see the coolant flowing through this pipe into the reservoir once the thermostat opens you have a good pump (at least one that pumps; then if you hear strange noises around it then the bearing is about to give up).
Can you share with me what the title of your book is?
I just want to let you know that I enjoy watching your videos. It's not boring and I learn something new each time. Thanks.
@infinity3jif It's not actually a bearing but a bushing and it does wear out and can make a heck of a racket when it does. Thanks for the comment.
Good video. I had the same thing happen on a 1987 jeep YJ. Cheap punched steel impeller and old coolant that had no anti-corrosion properties left caused the exact same damage you show. I have also seen a few impellers that had odd erosion patterns caused by cavitation.
@EricTheCarGuy have fun making more videos. It is great to see folks using the internet for productive purpose like this and a place to share knowledge that is benefiting to all. Take care.
@cipmars Indeed it would. Thanks for the comment.
@midlantic1 I've had lots of comments about plastic impellers on some pumps including BMW. I haven't seen one myself yet but that sounds even cheeper. Thanks for the comment.
PS: It's nice to see someone who actually understands methodical, rational diagnosis. Haven't watched all videos, but if you are a shop (which I think you are) you are one of an elite few mechanics customers can trust.
Eric,
I used to work for Hyundai and this is a pretty common problem with the V/6 engines. Great informative video. Thanks for sharing.
thank you and your viewers, without you guys i wouldn't have been able to fix my car. the impellers on my water pump were completely gone. thank you
@4micaman That's a gerat idea but may engine designs to not allow for this type of inspection but on the ones that do this would be a great test, thanks for the comment.
@kneedown4GOD I don't think that was the case, I think not changing the belt and pump at the service interval of 60K caused it, in fact this was caused by inaction rather than an action. Thanks for your comment.
@hubbleISS You are correct, in fact the heat in this car still isn't great, it probably needs a flush just like you say, I think it's more like sediment rather than "pieces" of the old impeller, I'm sure there is other corrosion in there too. Thanks for the comment.
@thaik56 If you suspect a belt you might start by tightening them all up a little to see if the noise goes away, if the belts are old you might want to replace them altogether. If that's not the issue look to see if your stock air snorkel is fitted properly if it's not it could also cause a noise like that. Good luck and thanks for your comments.
@axenz1 I think the metal is only part of the equation, I think the real culprit is the breakdown of the coolant due to lack of service (it and the H2O pump should have been changed at 60K), coolant is mostly water, when it breaks down it looses it's rust inhibitors and therefore will increase corrosion, it also becomes more acidic and develops an electric charge, all of these things add up to accelerated corrosion so I agree, poor quality coolant. Thanks for the comment.
@mystiqueman366 I'm really not sure of the logic of using plastic impellers as it just doesn't seem like a good idea to me. Thanks for the comment.
@OptimusOne Thanks for the comment, good luck with the overheat.
@finalman82 As for zinc I've never tried it but in theory it should work to help eliminate the corrosion in the cooling system. I think just following the service recommendation on this engine would have eliminated this situation as the coolant and water pump should have been replaced at 60K. Your assessment of the overheat is correct in that when the engine is not under load such as at idle it will not produce as much heat as when cruising or under load. Thanks for the comment.
@2ub40 Forget the heater core it's really not possible for that to cause an overheat but if you have ANY coolant leaks they should be addressed and if you have overheat problems I recommend you follow the steps in the video that I directed you to.
@cov01crew Cool, glad you were able to find that as it's not an easy diagnosis. Thanks for the comment.
Calm and matter of fact aren’t bad traits in a mechanic... will check out your other posts, cheers bro
@groutaone Thanks for the comment, good to see you.
@dseries16 In my experience it's mostly air in the cooling system that causes intermittent heat especially on Hondas. You are correct about coolant draining out of the weep hole under pressure, I covered this in the Diagnosing an Overheat video. Thanks for weighing in.
@j300ex1 Yea those plastic impellers are not long for this world. It is true that as coolant breaks down it does become more acidic. Thanks for your input.
@daddybraz Thanks for the comment and good luck with whatever you decide.
@happy543210 Bleeder valves are not for bleeding air out of a hot cooling system they are there to help fill the system faster by giving the air in the system a place to escape as the incoming coolant displaces it.
That is amazing that the impeller had completely corroded away. Like Eric said, the only thing I had ever seen on a water pump was the weep hole leaking as the bearings went bad.
@Jafromobile Excellent! I could not have put it better myself. Thanks for weighing in I really appreciate it.
@EvilDemonRain If you pressure test it I'm sure the leak will be visible and remove all doubt. I suggest taking the time to do this since a head gasket is often labor intensive and I rarely see them leak externally.
@happy543210 No, I don't think they did anything to the coolant, I think they didn't do anything at all and the cheep coolant and cheep impeller added up to this failure. Keep in mind that Hyundai puts the belt and pump replacement at 60K so if that was done at that time we wouldn't have this problem on this car.
@mrexecutive1 Interesting approach however after some thought I think if the symptom is that the overheat occurs on the highway and not while idling is the most important clue as this would indicate a problem with cooling system efficiency. I would first eliminate all other possibilities and then suspect the water pump or a restriction in the system.
if you put a pressure gauge on the heater hose you should see about 8 lbs of pump pressure, I have found this a good test , pressure guage from harbor freight and a few adapters try it Eric love your films ward
@AcheLone Sometimes but if it's bad enough to make noise failure is imminent. I would look to other possible causes of the noise before I condemned the water pump however.
Hi, Thanks for the education class. I just drove back from work and in about a mile I found my heat gauge went way above red. Car was running fine. First I assume heat gauge may be miss read the temperature and same time I pulled over my car to gas station which was very close. stop the engine pop the hood up and notice steam was coming out of from timing belt cover. I took big cloth Which I usually keep in my trunk and ball it up and put over rediator cap and gradually twist the cap continue...
I really appreciate your videos because you explain what could have happened what has happened and what usually does happen and that really helps me learn. I doubt my 79 el camino has ever had the pump changed lol im the second owner. It just overheated today, and I remembered my heat never worked. (Im level 2 out of 10 mechanic skill Lvl)
@Nztimr33 A few people have mentioned the plastic impellers, not a good idea in my opinion. Thanks for the comment.
Car overheats, owner starts putting water in it with little or no anti-freeze, water rusts impeller, and/or winter comes block partially freezes start the car, and shear off pump impellers.
ipissed I think the belt would slip or the ice would brake before the pump will shear off it's fins.
Also wouldn't the fins still be in the cooling system? If they didn't corode and they just broke off.
@@12101DyM how bout they were corroded so broke easily.
@slemy077 I don't think that would work because as the coolant heats up it expands and would make the hose feel hard if the water pump was working or not. Thanks for the input.
@siemenstraffic I do believe that is the reason for this failure and testament to your statement. Thanks for the comment.
Eric takes all automotive questions at his forum now.
Anyway, I wouldn't worry about it. Every once in a while, a drop or two of coolant will get past that seal. You don't have to worry unless your coolant level drops.
@journeyquest1 For me I don't see this often so normally I would exhaust all other possibilities before I looked to the pump. Thanks for the comment.
@thaik56 Probably not. If you have a 'cold air intake' I would look there as I've seen those cause that condition often. The stock intake actually has mufflers to prevent this from happening.
@Moosepiesandwich I'm not so sure about that, as coolant when it heats up expands which would also make the hose feel hard. I think the best clue is that if it overheats on the highway and you have eliminated all the other possibilities listed in the overheat video then it may be time to look into the water pump or some other flow issue. Thanks for your input.
@HGarden27 Couple of ways, you can do the standard drain and refill, personally I do this whenever I do the water pump because the coolant will come out anyway. The second method is with a dedicated machine that does this very thing, it will do the best job. It's very important however that you bleed the air out of the system after you refill it with new coolant, if not you will have cooling system problems.
@testbooster I don't have one of those yet but the next time I get one in I hope to make a video.
I really enjoy these videos. I'm a newbie, as in never done this at all, and can still pretty much follow it. No money to pay someone, but one of my cheaper hobbies anyway. I have a 1995 Honda Accord LX Wagon. I've replaced the starter, distributor cap, alternator, and fuel filter. The guy who first diagnosed it pointed toward accessory belts, timing belt, and water pump. Found out where my coolant was leaking from, but think I had already toasted the head gasket. I only paid $1350, so just practicing is cheaper than a class or mechanic. Keep up the good work!
Exactly this has happened to my mother's Peugeot 307. Water pump failed, engine overheated and headgasket blew pushing oil in the coolant system. So in other words. I noticed the oil in the water reservoir. That meant taking the head off the engine. And as soon as I started to replace the timing belt and water pump, I found the original overheating problem.
@OptimusOne It sounds like it could be a fan issue. You might want to watch the video I did on Diagnosing An Overheat as I cover a lot of different causes of an overheat problem in that video.
My wifes 1995 Isuzu Rodeo is having similar symptons. Just changed the thermostat and is still running hot. So bouts to change the water pump next, because the coolant is not flowing through the engine. The bearings were making noise but didnt get to it in time. Thanks for the video wasnt sure if it was the water pump.
@ptlraven It could be a restriction in the system somewhere or the radiator is not working as well as it should, the only way to really test for this is to take the temperature at different points on the radiator and look for inconsistencies. You might also check for debris in front of the radiator. Good luck.
@paigen65 I don't think that would work as it really isn't conclusive of anything. Hot coolant exposed to the atmosphere would boil out of the bleeder even if there wasn't any flow because you are allowing atmospheric pressure into a pressurized system thus causing the coolant to boil instantly. Thanks for the input though.
@elihurodriguez I got a very interesting email this morning about checking the vent temperatures of the heater that seemed very promising, I think I'm going to try that method next time I suspect a problem like this. Thanks for your input and comment.
one more thing love ur videos they always give me ideas on how to proceed. when I'm stuck. keep em coming
@Bushougoma I agree about adding too much tap water. In this case I think the coolant just broke down and lost it's rust inhibitors, couple that with a cheep metal impeller and you have what you see here. I will say however that if they had changed the belt and pump at 60K like it's recommended it probably would have never happened.
@seniorjohnl A few people have mentioned that technique but I've never had any luck with it. Thanks for the comment.
@kenman1717 Not at all as they pretty much turned to dust, they didn't just break off so much as rotted away.
@2ub40 I wouldn't go that far but if I read you correctly it's just leaking at a hose, why not replace the hose and see what happens then?
I think you are spot on Eric to why this happened. Unfortunately it seems like changing coolant is a foreign concept to many people, as a result you end up with things like this. Coolant it extremely cheap in comparison to the cooling system parts that fail due to poor maintenance.
@shyameetu To me it sounds like air in the cooling system, if you did not bleed the air from the system after your repairs this is the most likely cause. I recommend you watch the video that I did on dealing with Cooling System Overheat issues as I cover that and some other suggestions you might benefit from.
This is very helpful. We have a 2001 Pathfinder and it overheated at the summit of Vail Pass. The mechanic was stumped because it had fluid, fans worked, no leaks, but also no heat when he tried to "burp" the system. It runs perfectly on idle, no heat issues as we let it run nearly an hour. The minute he gets it on the freeway, it overheats. He guessed this or a head gasket and wants to go right to the head gasket. I want him to try the water pump.
What was the problem eventually?
Hi Eric, I just wanted to tell you that you are an awesome resource, I'm always watching your videos. Just to give you another example of an overheat condition due to water pump failure, I recently did a timing belt, tensioners/water pump replacement on a 97 Protégé 1.5L. The kid complained of no heat and overheat condition. He said he topped off the coolant fairly frequently ( I later discovered he didn't know anything about the radiator and had only topped off the overflow reservoir). Before I did a pressure test, I topped off the radiator and immediately had a steady drip/fine stream coming from the timing cover/oil pan interface before and after startup. Then I checked the water pump pulley and found the telltale wobble. After I was finished, no leaks, had heat but no overheat. THANKS A MILLION for helping so many of us to be better mechanics-shadetree(me) and pros alike!!
Rob Basso-Fredericksburg, VA
@shak11uk You still haven't mentioned the type of car but I can say right off that 'thinking' something is working is not often good enough especially with electrical diagnosis. Don't forget to check for air in the system because if the sensor is getting bad information it won't turn the fans on properly.
@founditnow54 I agree, I think both the impeller and the coolant were not of good quality and this is the result. In Hyundai's defense however they do recommend changing out the belt and pump at 60K.
@aeligos As for removing hoses that would work I suppose but it would probably make a mess no matter what you do, I like your check of the impeller better, if it doesn't move and the blades are good then the pump is good.
@RamblinAround Yea, that was cool. Thanks for the comment.
Eric the car guy. You are my go to source. Your doing a great job. I have a 2002 dodge ram 1500 5.9l. No heat. My temp gauge hovers right in the middle leading me to believe the water pump is good. I replaced my thermostat and thermostat housing. I flushed my heat or core. Both hoses coming out of the firewall are warm/hot. My blend door is working properly. I'm at a loss. If my water pump was bad wouldn't I be over heating?
Hey Eric what takes place between to dissimilar metals ? electrolysis maybe ? You add that to the lack of any PM maintenance and you get what they got . nice Video .....
@chillincruisin Yes it is my own shop. I don't advertise however or solicit work, for the most part people know me and seek me out for repairs and if I have time I record those repairs and post them here. My business is strictly word of mouth and I plan to keep it that way as I spend a great deal of time making these videos and growing ETCG, I don't have much interest in growing the repair side of the business.
@TeDuaMalakie I don't think this coolant was ever changed and as a result caused this failure. The interval for replacing the water pump on this car is 60K, had they done that along with a coolant change I don't think this would have happened.
@XYtruck25 If you have a gasket DO NOT use RTV as it can actually cause a leak not to mention make a mess that needs to be cleaned up the next time you replace that component, let the gasket do it's work.
In my 93 Honda Civic 1.6l I've had a few symptoms like the one you stated before, a loud yelling noise from the engine bay and really bad leaking from the timing belt area of the engine
A lot of newer cars went to composite or plastic impellers, which have to tendency to fail as well. For testing bad water pump fine, is it possible to put a PSI gauge on the radiator to see if it build pressure? I know it will build some pressure just from heating up, but one would figure it would be minimal when the engine is cold, thoughts?
1998 ford Taurus never over heated but had no heat, the water pump looked same as that. Nasty rusty coolant. Keep that coolant changed regularly. the heater core was plugged up also.
@grawey77 I would defiantly agree and I think that is the most important clue to cause of the problem.
@IrnMaiden304 Interesting, thanks for the input and comment.
@EvilDemonRain I know Fiat, in fact they own Chrysler now and we should see them here in the states soon. Anyway as to your problem it sounds like you can easily see where that water is going if not you might want to get a pressure tester and pressurize the system to make the leak more apparent, I show this is the Diagnosing an Overheat video if you want a visual. Keep me posted.
@CRISTIAN123JOSE That would be the ideal but it's not available to everyone. Thanks for weighing in.
I have a Mini Cooper that was overheating a few years back.
I was 15 yo, loved the car, it was nearly abandoned, as my father was not inclined to spend more money on it, having changed the head gasket, radiator, pipes, thermostat, and everything else BUT the water pump, as it was not leaking.
I took the water pump out (which is not easy in a Mini, as the fan is actually bolted to the water pump, so it's necessary to take the radiator out of its housing, take the fan, and the the pump) and two of the impeller's blades were broken, stopping the water flow.
So yes, it happens! :P
@davelowe1977 I don't think that would be conclusive as it does not account for a restriction in the system or a sticking thermostat.
hi how are Eric car guy i really learn alot from your video may Suggest you connect Transparent pipe between two side of in let water going to thermostat when engine hot i mean when thermostat open you can see the flow of the water crosse the to side of the Transparent pipe i hope it will help thank you for your video
@linuxbox11 Well thank you for that. Sometimes I have the time to make a video and sometimes I don't. If I make a video it adds a significant amount of time to a job and sometimes I just need to get it done. Thanks again for your comment.
Watched your alternator troubleshooting video and found out it (My problem) wasn't there but in the idlearm bearing under the alternator. Thanks so much for your videos. 2002 dodge caravan.
@pabllosee I think Honda also uses a better coolant than Hyundai that doesn't break down like this one did.
@Lillie1986 Not always so easy in my experience especially if the thermostat isn't open. Normally you eliminate all other overheat possibilities before you look to the water pump however it's become more common since some manufacturers use plastic impellers that can be damaged easily.
@jaklvm12 Thanks for the tip but honestly I think during your second attempt you were able to get the air out of the cooling system which probably also helped the issue. Thanks for the update.
@bigdaddy9976 I would recheck it after you get the blower motor working as if you don't have air moving past the heater core you won't have heat. Start with the easy stuff as a bad water pump is a 'last resort' in my opinion.