LUMO vs. LNER: I travel by train from London to Edinburgh on both services to spot the difference.
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- Опубликовано: 2 июл 2024
- Three months ago I witnessed the inaugural Lumo service from London Kings Cross to Edinburgh Waverley, and decided to try this new train out. Lumo and LNER use the same track, so who's best? I catch Lumo from London to Newcastle, and then LNER from Newcastle to Edinburgh.
#lumo #LNER
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*** TIMESTAMPS:
00:00:00 Introduction
00:00:10 Kings Cross
00:02:20 Lumo
00:03:30 Welwyn Garden City
00:03:55 Peterborough
00:04:05 Grantham
00:04:20 Doncaster
00:04:45 Darlington
00:05:05 Newcastle
00:07:45 LNER
00:09:00 Berwick-upon-Tweed
00:09:50 Edinburgh Waverley
*[36.00]
Refreshingly different content. Hugely enjoyable. Keep these reviews coming!
There are a few more differences. If a limo train is cancelled you have to wait for the next limo which can be a very long wait. The power backup for limo is only for 'hotel' services not for actually moving the train unlike LNER's. I've tried both and would generally just go with whoever is cheaper. I do find that with Lumo the newcastle stop is chaos as there are so many people changing.
Thanks for this comparison. I will be making my first journey on this route in just over a month. We decided on LNER mostly for the first class offering, which was affordable when we booked it several months ago. But I am surprised now how many different ways there are to get from London to Edinburgh. You folks have it really good over there. The Lumo service is intriguing, and it will probably be worth checking out at some point in the future. Thanks! Also, wow. Newcastle’s train station is a real beauty.
Love this channel thank you for taking us along SCOTT 😁💟💟💟💟
Thanks Mary. I'm glad you appreciate the effort put into my little channel.
Fantastic. Still haven't tried Lumo for myself, so thanks for this Scott!
Timetable challenge / race between the two best Scottish travel RUclipsrs surely has to happen!
It's definitely worth a try Steve, if you take the Lumo trains north from London you get to go on the little used line that cuts out York completely. It only happens going Northbound though, the train still passes through the station going south
@@benalowery Cheers Ben! Definitely on the research list now for good fares :)
Thanks Steve. It's always great fun doing these videos. If people enjoy them, then that's a bonus.
Now that's an idea! I did the challenge between Glasgow and London to see what was the quickest - air or train. I've often thought about an Edinburgh-London challenge. Maybe one day!!! 😁
Loved seeing Welwyn garden city, reminds me of going home
Just found your channel and really enjoying it! you have a great manner and it's great to come along on your journeys
I think it's excellent that a new company is providing service competition. Thank you for the excellent breakdown. I can definitely see a good market for the service. For me, I'll be fairly likely to call into York or stop further up the line in Kirkcaldy. Also, I think the ability to transfer tickets could be very useful in the event of unit failure. I imagine the food would be better on an LNER train, but if I'm wrong I'll stand corrected. Lastly, the added capacity of first class could be a bonus for late booking (if one has the money), and the next available train is wanted. All in all, I think it's a great idea and I wish them good luck.
Excellent video. Very comprehensive and I can actually understand clearly what he is saying at all times unlike some videos where they either have a mask on, the audio is otherwise muffled, or a language other than English is used with no subtitles. .
Yet another fantastic video I enjoyed watching this review of Lumo and LNER I look forward to watching many more of your videos
Hi Scott, many thanks for all your videos, which have kept me going in quarantine from the dreaded Covid. In particular, I love your forays across La Manche. Re the difference between the two versions of the Hitachi trains that the outfits run, Lumo's are purely leccy, but the LNER version you were on was going North of Waverley to Inverness, where there is no OHLE provided, so it would have fired up its diesel engines as soon as it was out of the station on its way North. Before the arrival of the Azumas, this route was run by the dear old HSTs, some all the way from London. Ciao Hugh
Excellent video scott mate
Last November visiting from Canada I took the lner(wich I keep on calling liner) from London to Edinburgh, I enjoyed it very much but the best thing was the scenery.
The Flying Scotsman is actually an LNER express from Edinburgh to London that takes just four hours, quicker than LUMO, but it runs just twice a day.
Doing London - Newcastle in a few weeks. Thanks for the video
What id have liked is more footage of the train, the buffet cart, the toilet, the carriage just as a guide.?
Yep could be a decider
Thx! I had to cancel my own Lumo Vs LNER challenge earlier in the year due to self-isolating but hope to re-attempt over the summer. Love your content and down-to-earth presentation as always :-)
thank-you.
I have not travelled on Lumo yet, but it is on my hit list as it travels on the York avoiding line on it's northbound journey.
Not worth it, please don’t do it. Uncomfortable seats, food every 3 HOURS don’t do it please!
OMG Scott! Just googled Lumo vs LNER and your little video popped up! Finally visiting London and Edinburgh again in a few weeks.. and just booked my Lumo ticket to Edinburgh :-) would be cool to catch up if possible!
only traveled on LNER and to say the standard class seats are hard is an understatement, diamonds are softer
Yeah I agree. The seats on the Azuma trains are as hard as bell metal and I’m told the same is true of the Lumo too.
The most comfortable seats are on the Mk 4 coaches of the class 91s.
A lot of trains are using the ironing board type seats now the class 156 printers and the class 158 all have them too.
If I had a choice between a class, 91 or Azuma I choose the class 91 every time.
Good video!
I want to take a Lumo someday.
Took Lumo London to Edinburgh. The seats are way more comfortable.
Also when I did my GPS test, it did reach the max 125 MPH.
They all do 125 mph
@@kevinpoulton The train could actuly do 140mph but they are only aloud to go up to 125 mph. To go faster they need to fit in cab signalling.
@@markpritchard yes I know
Just booked Kings Cross to Inverness first class £88.10 on LNER This includes food, drinks and the use of first class lounge with refreshments . The bad news, the seats on all the Japanese 800 class are hard. Do miss the HST seats
Why not take the national express bus it's way cheaper than train
@@cliffsofmoher4220 cos it’s like 10 hours lmao
@@greena3464 yeah but it makes no sense if its 10 hours that means they have to pay the bus drivers more but on train there is more passengers and less time on train mean they pay them less and it runs of electricity so I don't see why trains are more expensive than bus logics don't add up
@@cliffsofmoher4220 its not just the driver's wages. The bus has a driver so does the train but they're not paid the same. Then the train also has another 3 or 4 staff depending on route. Then there's the operational and maintenance costs. A train costs a lot more to build, lease and run than a bus. By an order of magnitude. A 9 coach class 800 costs many tens of millions. A modern coach costs a couple of hundred grand. The maintenance of the train is far more expensive. Those people need paying too. Cleaning it take more people than a bus. Track access charges, insurance, etc... Etc...
@@typhoon-7 so the train tracks are maintained by rail company's like LNER or Cross Country
A great video, you now have a new subscriber .
Thank you
Very useful comparison. Interesting comment about Lumo giving a smoother ride. We just did the Inverness-London run last Sunday (LNER 1st class) and I found that last stretch from York to London really bumpy and uncomfortable, so if the Lumo's trains can improve on that it's a bonus. I had wondered about trying bus Inverness-Edinburgh (free, as I'm of a certain vintage!) followed by Lumo to London, but it sounds like the pricing on the Lumo is similar to LNER, so probably not a lot to gain.
Edit to add; it would be interesting to see (hear?) a comparison of what I call the "See It, Say It, Sorted" factor. The LNER service is plagued by a constant litany of announcements - many pre-recorded but then duplicated by the guard. If Lumo has a lower SeeSaySort factor then that's a bonus in my book!
@@derektaylor2941 Yes, probably.
There the same trains in design, just different interiors and prices. Great video Scott.
So many beautiful landmarks (Erik from Belgium)
Love the deep blue color of the lumo
They also have a very no frills approach to the journey.
The seats are great for short journey (less than 5 hours)
There's lots of class 800/1/2s!
I was 35 years on the railway and I can tell you, nothing will surpass the comfort of a Mark 1 carriage.
Well maybe a Mk 3? (40 years on the railway)
Agreed
@@johnthomas5966 mark 3s never surpassed , we have gone backwards since. I used to go from wolves to london as a kid and occasionally upgraded to first, those orange seats with the little white pillows, so so comfy
Death traps.
Hear, hear.
My son used Lumo from Edinburgh back to Kings Cross & he wasn’t too impressed. He is 6ft 2in tall & is a rugby player, so he is of a stocky muscular build. He wanted to use his laptop to do some work, but he couldn’t because his knees where up against the seat in front so he couldn’t use the table. He was also sat at a seat between windows which he said made him feel like he was in an aircraft. He prefers LNER because they also stop at our local station Grantham so he can get a connecting train to see his parents on the Lincs coast
Letting us know the cost of tickets etc would be a great addition to your videos .
I travel regularly between Newcastle and London and I have to say that I prefer LNER. I have travelled Lumo a couple of times and I like their trains and staff but there's more of a back up should something happen. With LNER you can just travel on the next train but with Lumo there doesn't seem to be any agreement with LNER to accept tickets in the event of cancellations. My friend was told to travel via the WCML and to change at Carlisle when his train was cancelled.
Another thing with the Lumo 803 sets is that the batteries on them can't actually move the train in the event of an overhead line failure, they can only keep things such as power and HVAC units going where the LNER class 801s are fully bi-mode
That was one thing I forgot to mention - staff. I didn't see staff on either train apart from ticket inspectors. I thought they would wheel a food trolley along the train, but nothing on either service. Point taken about Lumo... they're OK as long as things go fine, but as soon as there's a glitch, it's a long wait between trains. I hadn't realised the LNER sets could move using the diesel power. I had assumed it was for lights etc. Thanks for your comment. Much appreciated.
You make a good point. Lumo claims its units are 'greener' as they are electric power. But LNER can score if and when there's infrastructure failure over the ECML because *some* units are bi-mode. In addition LNER operates roughly every 30 mins during the week.
To add further, LNER’s 801 units are fully electric however have 1 Diesel engine to move the train in the event of OHLE power loss. Does certainly get the train going but at a much reduced speed. 800s are fully bi-mode. I’ve witnessed a Lumo train sit for 4hours awaiting rescuing or for power to be restored whereas LNER units managed to continue. Also witnessed Lumo passengers awaiting said train be left stranded with no help as Lumo do not staff stations nor are they easy to contact. LNER obviously have plenty station staff and are easy to contact via other means. To me, that’s the real winner.
@@craigallan93 Indeed. There have been at least two occasions when Lumo has had to cancel its schedules owing to power failure/track damage along the ECML... notably between Edinburgh and Newcastle. On the other hand LNER could still operate via a diversion.
The key with Lumo is book early. I've had prices as low as £15 Edinburgh to London (with railcard). Not had that cheap on LNER.
Tge big thing I did notice is Lumo have next o no space for bigger luggage.
That was interesting, was under the impression Lumo were cheaper.
Big one for me would be if a train company would dare turn the lights OFF for night trains. As a very frequent traveller on night time services, it would be a major improvement ..... u can see out if the lights are dimmed in a train at night and its wonderful - if u have never experienced this, you haven't lived - the Lumo trains do have the option of doing this because they have individual reading lamps - and it was my interpretation of the pre-publicity that that is what they would do ...... do they?
Travelled on both and two things won it for me, but in favour of LNER. First LNER have a buffet car so you can get food and drink if you wish throughout your journey. Second, there was a weekend with line problems. LNER due to the diesel engines were able to take a detour in the Newcastle area. Lumo had to cancel as the battery only powers the lights and aircon. Oh I guess also LNER goes further north so you aren't just limited to Edinburgh. I can jump on at Inverkeithing. Lumo interior is nicer than second class LNER though.
What was the catering service like? Was it at seat, a buffet car or just available to first class passengers
It’s interesting watching someone get caught up in the idea that if a train runs non-stop London to Newcastle that it must be quicker than one that makes a few stops. If I read it right Lumo was allowed 2 hours 58 minutes for that run to Newcastle yet LNER’s fastest runs are 2 hours 52 minutes calling York & Darlington also. Lumo is squeezed on to an already busy railway and so pays for it in slower paths despite fewer stops but price will swing the decision for most people although I’d think LNER would match those low prices.
Also, I understand the Azuma's acceleration is faster than its predecessors, so that will reduce further any time penalty caused by multiple stops.
I used to drive the 43's out of Kings X up the ECML... With 4500 hp under the bonnet ( 2250 hp ) one up front and one up the botty there was plenty of power on tap... Pulling out of the station on notch five with the Paxman Valenta turbo's screaming their little heads off and clouds of exhaust smoke ( sorry Greta Thunberg ) was something to behold with more excitement to enjoy... 125 mph here we come although they would top 148 mph... Now there is food for thought but as I did not fancy tea and biscuits with the Boss well need I say more...
It was also quite an experience when the 91s were introduced before the Mk4 coaches were available. After it was found that the 43s being used as a DVT on the other end of a HST set were suffering engine problems on idle revs, adding their 2250hp to that of the 91 made for some spirited performance. And of course, that lovely sound of the Valenta's turbos could still be heard.
Sadly a bygone era
@@gfgfgf466 Yes indeed my friend...
Azumas are far superior on electric to HSTs. In fact a 2+9 Valenta HST set could never keep to todays ECML schedules particularly the ones with lots of stops.
I wish lumo ran to Leeds. Hope they do in future
Great job on the video.
Best uk train operator i have ever used was the Wrexham and Shropshire.
There are several LNER services a day that don’t have as many stops as the one you took that extends to Inverness.
Was on lumo last week great service better than lner if you want to travel standard class
How was the tea and coffee? Were the restrooms clean? And a question that perhaps can’t be answered, but would the conductors on both lines react the same way to fights or rowdy passengers?
Hi Scott,really good to meet you today,so sorry I interrupted your video,hope you can forgive me for that..love your work..
the first-class of lner is very cheap and cost-effective (for advanced tickets)
and lumo's advanced tickets are hard to buy
there is little difference between the price of lumo's off-peak tickets and lner's first-class advanced tickets
so I would prefer lner
Tried Lumo and LNER. Lumo is vastly inferior, being rather crowded. I find the seats in LNER to be ok, although the HST ones were better. Lumo may be cheaper, but you can tell its cheaper.
Good to see you "rusty". Funny I was literally talking about you and your channels yesterday... I was saying that I love your channels and how it must have been incredibly difficult to do your day job because of... Well we all know why. Cough cough.
Hopefully you'll post something new on the other channel. See ya soon hopefully.
Hi Sean and thanks for your comment. Rusty has taken a well earned break as he doesn't have a car, and carting a metal detector, shovel and all of the other bits and pieces on public transport is not the done thing. As time goes on, I'm having to look further afield for ideas, which is also a challenge without a car. Rusty will return...
@@PlanesTrainsEverything No place better to look than your own backyard... Plus it's cheap on the petrol. LoL we all understand definitely do I don't drive at all. Im a walker or bike rider... Most the time if I can't walk there or ride my bike there they probably don't need to be going there that's where I see it at least. Good luck man
LNER diesels have amazing leather seats in 1st class. The Azumas have horrendous fabric seats in 1st.
Book an advance standard class, then use Seatfrog to get a 1st upgrade for around £10, and you can use the lounges at stations with all the free food and drinks there, as well as the food on the train.
LNER don't have any diesels, apart from the 800s and they have the same seats as the other trains/
@@Bungle2010 the ones that aren't Azumas I assumed they were diesels?
@@masere They are class 91 electric trains! (Well, class 91 electric loc, 9 mk1 (might be mk3 or something else), and a DVT)
Since they’re not about to change the carriage seats anytime soon… a frequent traveller would do well to carry some kind of memory foam gel pad in his/her satchel. Would potentially make travelling more comfortable. An excellent Holiday gift. And …no … I do not promote or work for such a manufacturer…. in fact I don’t know if such a cushion/pad exists. 😉
Cheers 🥂 🇨🇦
You can find them on Amazon...
I actually do this whenever I travel between Grantham & Newcastle. My back is fine for the 1st hr or so, but then I start to get the ‘num bottom’ feeling
I’d say Lumo because they are brand new and only stop at key stations including Newcastle, Morpeth and Edinburgh Waverley. Whilst LNER operates services on the ECML and along the East Coast and are to expand more services. Including to Harrogate and Middlesbrough. And possibly LNER could expand to Scarborough, Cleethorpes, Grimsby Town, Whitby, Battersby and Hartlepool. And some Lumo Class 803 trains do stop at Stevenage.
What use is stopping only at key statons if the journey is slower anyway?
Traveled Lumo. Watch your luggage if you are getting on at Newcastle - train was rammed, we had reservations, but the carriage position of the train did not match advice at station, so joined a scrum, nowhere for luggage. Staff made me move it and told me my suitcase was too big. But they are smart trains.
Surprised it was your first time at Newcastle station I have been there many times. The Lumo service seems very limited and does not seem to stop at Peterborough where I live. A shame really.
Glad you thought it good - but unfortunately Lumo is just yet another ''brand' owned by First Group. If they can operate Lumo in this low cost way why can't they do it with all their brands? Your mention of people travelling with the 'wrong company' tickets only reinforces my feeling of how very unwelcoming the boarding announcements are on UK trains. I have yet to try Lumo so shouldn't judge too harshly and hope I'll be pleasantly surprised - but have to say I found it's launch and subsequent advertising just full of - quite corny - marketing blah. Roll on 'Great British Railways' - and the long overdue simplification of fares and hopefully much improved services for travellers.
I predict however simple the fares structure becomes, the government will still keep them extortionate.
This is the first video of yours I've watched. As I will be visiting Britain next spring I'm interested in learning all I can regarding transportation services throughout the UK. One thing; your comment about backup power on Lumo seems moot to me. What kind of fuel does the backup generator use? Do both lines run on electricity and then switch to diesel if the power drops, or does LNER run diesel continuously? Just wondering. The electricity must come from somewhere.
Are the first class seats more comfortable?
How does the ticket price compare?
Can I get some opinions on which route has the nicer views, between London to Edinburgh on the east coast vs. London to Glasgow on the west coast? Different UK cousins are telling me different things! TY
Catering? How long is the trip?
Interesting re: tickets, guessing open tickets which do not specify an operator would not be valid on Lumo if it's pre-booked Lumo tickets only? Little bit restrictive in that respect.
I've been on lumo unfortunately there is not enough luggage space
Great vid, but the top speed of those trains (803/801) is actually 140mph! They're limited to 125 by the speed limits on that line, but they're set to be increased.
I think a high speed line is a must for the distance
Don't hold your breath. Virgin Trains bought its Pendolinos for 140 mph running many ears ago. These units remain the backbone of the WCML with (now) Avanti WC but guess their top operational speed today !
The top speed of the old Class 91 / mark5 carriage sets was also 140mph. It was thought that the line limit would be increased soon, but that was in 1991!! I heard recently that BR did a special test run with a Class91 set and got over 155mph out of it! There again, there were reports that the old IC125 would be found to be travelling well over 125 on occasion....
@@timbounds7190 I hope they pull through this time. Hope. Because seeing 80x trains fulfill the objectives of the 91 would be like their legacy living on. And hey, maybe they'll refurbish the seats so there are no complaints.
Will never happen
Can either train accommodate large luggage?
This looks too complicated for little old me, I think I’ll fly. But thanks for posting.
You reaming me of the chief officer on porridge what was his name.. Lol.. You must have an army background as you are like my ex seargent major.... But I enjoy the vlogs to be fair.....
Lomo OK if you want to go the full distance or use Newcastle or Morpeth. No good if you wish to use Berwick, Durham, Darlington, York, Doncaster, or Peterbrough and a few other stations so hardly a fair comparison.
Fair?
How much does it cost per person? From London to Scotland?
I use Grand Central from Sunderland. No point in wasting time heading to Newcastle when you can go direct to.London at a cheaper fare
You mentioned coat hooks, but I always wonder why you never take your jacket off any journey? Sometimes you wear your hat as well inside
thumbs👍👍
You missed out the Penshaw Monument just as you left Durham
It's a shame to hear the lad on your train got caught out by the tickets! I wish we had a simpler ticketing system, the only options I want are single or return (and peak/off peak tickets are a good idea too), it'd be so much easier.
And more expensive.
Avanti West Coast should also be in the race
Imagine this distance at 300 kmh
LNER DOES have USB sockets
LNER seats to Newcastle I found to be so uncomfortable that I had to get up and walk around.
The problem is getting past the tickets sales, booked some train tickets with Lumo,, and they made a complete mess of it, not just once but three times, they don't exist as far as im concerned.
I can't afford either. Nor would I ever want to visit Glasgow.
I'm not sure where you got the impression that Lumo is faster? It's a lot SLOWER!
1st class LNER takes some beating
LUMO can be half the price of LNER (standard seating).
Same damn trains…… hitatchi a trains, so depressing. Rock hard seats too
Do me favore if you answer my question please !! Is it cold in Scotland on May or not .I would prepare for trip to it on May.! Thnx
Google is your friend. Lots of websites answer this question.
It's always cold in Scotland, you're welcome.
And how far will Lumo get on their battery power...?
Possibly to the next station, but probably not. The battery is only there because they took the engines out and they needed to put *something * there to replace the lost weight. It's more for lighting and heating in emergency situations.
LNER have to provide a service. Run trains at less popular timidest etc. Lumo pick and choose the best times for them to run trains.
Mate to point a couple of things out, there wasn't much point in pointing out speed of the service as yes both are capable of 125mph but there are speed constraints put on different sections of track by network rail, both lease their trains and the seats are a spec of seat thats set by the government, what about catering ? Speed of service to Newcastle is about the same on some lner as they only stop two places and some lumos and lner services are held and set to arrive later or earlier due to fitting into the paths given to them amongst the flow of other trains......if there were no other trains on the track and no stops they'd both do it a lot quicker than either do....the only real difference I can see from your video is a light and USB......oh and yes lumo have battery back up should the worst happen to the overhead line but are you aware that is just too maintain on board services and not to move the train, so if it stops, it stops.....and no other class 800 (800,801,802) can attach to it because of software conflicts on board, except another 803.....that's why they're called EMUs
Assuming this ticketing thing is due to lumo being a open operator and not a franchise like LNER
The LNER has to have ICE as it go's on to route with out wires for power and battery would run out before making to the end . Having battery dos means you have lighting and heating when train stoped with out over head power not that you be going anywhere. Not all LNER 800s have ICE. Also sound can be different what coach you in as not all coaches have drive to track
All 800s have engines for lines in Scotland etc
It's the 801 which is electric only
@@epender sorry I was not clear in my answer . In my reply as I said 800s as in the type of train 800 801 802 803
LNER London North Eastern Railway
They r the same train g
Less window gazing more review
LUMO is gimmick service, LNER is far better speaking from experience a few weeks ago. Northallerton one day from Kings Cross then York the next day both bang on time. Order at seat service was excellent & very reasonable prices 👍😊
Elner's seats are uncomfortable for such a long journey.
Pretty poor if seats are hard and uncomfortable on long journey trains. No wonder people fly.
That Lumo hostage letter at the beginning was a big turn off
LUMO ALL THE WAY
hopefuly lumo will soon stop at Doncaster !