Why Queer Monks in Thailand Have to Hide Their Identities | The Rainbow Guide To Life
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- Опубликовано: 10 сен 2024
- Thailand has long been known to be friendly to the queer community. However this is not always the case for gay monks in the country’s Buddhist monasteries, who often have to hide their sexuality to be accepted. In this episode of “Rainbow Guide to Life” VICE World News takes a look at what life is like for them.
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It is expected that monks abstain sexual endeavors so why does gay matter
technically yes, but I think it's much more complicated than that.
nah gold
That's what I thought as well... The subject is confusing...
@@cobaltblue119 nah if you're a monk it's important to abstain and free yourself of desire altogether. That's the whole point Suzy. You need to let go
@@cobaltblue119 how? A monk is a monk. They are forbidden sexual feelings and contacts. How does their sexual orientation matter
Most Thai people don't understand the teachings of Buddha. A person can reincarnate in different sex in different lifetimes which means that sometimes the body has changed but the sexual preference has not changed.
There is nothing wrong being gay but a Buddhist monk shouldn't think of sex whether gay or straight.
This comment right here!
This is rarely heard in Dhamma talks as well, as it seems most only want to hear what makes them feel good, meaning the truth isn't a high priority.
ส่วนมากคนเอาแต่ธรรมที่ไม่ใช่ธรรม
In the end, they're only humans. What makes them think that by becoming a buddhist monk will not make them human anymore?
Reincarnation is not even a Buddhist teaching. The correct term is rebirth. About your explanation, it is only your opinion, but it is not written nothing like that in the Pali Canon, the Buddhist Scripts used in Thai Buddhism.
For someone who is lecturing others about Buddhism, you should know better.
People should be enlightened. Doesnt matter straight or gay. A monk should strive to transcend sex and cravings.
@@yimveerasak3543 They are still humans at the end. Sex and craving are just part of human natures.
As the Thai Buddhists, I don't mind about Gay monks as long as they keep on the Buddhist path and praticing Sila.
True
You like lady boys??
@@KirksCORNER-1983 did u even watch and understand the video?
@@KirksCORNER-1983 disengenuous bigot.
Exactly
I am a gay Buddhist monk. Although I am celibate as a monk, I will never be in the closet. It is unacceptable to discriminate on the basis of sex, gender, or orientation. To discriminate against people in that way is a cultural error and not part of Buddhism. Queer people are humans who are worthy of love and respect just like any other human. 🌈🙏❤🏳🌈
You are not a Buddhist monk then, the first thing a monk does it’s to eliminate any personal belief or characteristics to follow the Buddha steps
@@juanvaliente5421”eliminate any personal beliefs”? Sir, I’m sorry, but you profoundly misunderstand what it means to walk the path of an Arahant. Many arahants identify as straight men and no one has any issue. To be a monk is to walk the path more earnestly, but it certainly does not mean to deny reality. You don’t have to become personality-less to become a monk.
You’re a worthy human being, just not a monk.
@ndusuliga5349 you don't decide if someone is a worthy monk or not. That is not your place.
@@queenbionica7347 To anybody, monkhood and homosexuality don’t go together. It’s not me judging any individual, it’s just the reality.
Buddhism embraces and welcomes diversity. As a bisexual Buddhist I can confirm that. However, Monastics must be celibate, therefore would be considered to have to identify as aromantic and asexual upon ordination.
It is not Celibate . It is letting go the materialistic nature . Too much of attraction and aversion is no good.
I agree, monk need to be asexual. If you can't be asexual and still yearning for household standard like being cis, bi, gay. you are not fully monk.
With respect, you don't choose to identify as asexual any more than one decides to be gay. Being asexual is a person's innate, inborn sexuality. They do not have sexual attraction or desire like most other people do, whether it's a desire toward a man or a woman.
If only people who were innately asexual were allowed to be monks and nuns, there would be very few monastics in the world, and the dharma would die out. Buddha taught that clinging to our desires is the source of our suffering. As a monk, one chooses to live a life that routes out desire and the general pleasures of lay life. Whether you desire a man or a woman, you are still left with the root cause of the problem - desire.
Also, being Queer is more than sexual desire. Queer people have a unique experience of the world and culture they grew up in and have seen and experienced life from a different vantage point, and that is an asset when it comes to living and teaching the Dharma.
May all beings be happy! 🙏
Like most of the commenters, I've formed my opinion from just reading the title. Indeed, Buddhism practitioners aim to free themselves of desire, so why should their sexual preference matter?
It is only after watching video that I realised the title and video could have been framed better - it is not an issue of which sexuality the monks prefer, but rather, who they identify as before being ordained, and how they are discriminated against because of it. Supposedly they have to declare their sexuality, and they risk being shunned/denied if they decide to be honest.
The message the video is trying to convey is that no matter the gender/sexuality they identify as, they should be allowed to practice Buddhism (which sees everyone as equal).
You are there to study about Buddhism, not your sexuality. If you cannot separate your sexuality from your Spiritual self - then you are there for the wrong reasons. Our sexuality is only a physical aspect of ourselves - our Spirituality has no gender and has no need to be expressed. Buddhism and Hinduism is about letting go of things. How can you hang on to your sexuality if you are seeking release? If you are hanging on to your sexuality as an identity, then you are seriously lost. Our sexual preference does NOT define who we are for it is only a myriad of the many things that makes us human. Spirituality is about finding peace within ourselves by realizing that we are no thing and no one, we are only a small particle of this vast Universe that is constantly evolving. May Peace be your path, always.
Namaste!
S.E.X =Sacred Energy Exchange
"Our spirituality has no gender"? So why do male monks only ordain other males ?
True if you are pursuing monk life there shouldn't be a topic about sexuality, its all about obliterating the physical attachments.
If monks life isn't your way then they are free to live as a Karma yogi.
I think you really missed the point here.
If a monk is sexuality attracted to a woman, it is considered a "normal" issue in Thailand; while if the monk is sexuality attracted to a man, sometimes this is considered more than an issue, it is considered a dishonor. Some monks have been expelled from monkhood when their sexuality was disclosed. Others are banned from being ordained if it is known they are gay, even if the person seeking for ordination is a committed Buddhist. No one is going to prohibit a man who was in a relationship with a girl in the past to become a monk. But in many places, if they know the monk had a relationship with a boy, he is forbidden to become a monk.
The second problem with your argument is that you seem to believe that only gays have an identity. Heterosexual people also have a hetero identity. Monks also identity themselves as straight even if they use different words for that.
@@tiagocarioca oh thats how it is, but if a monk is sexualy attracted to any genders he should stop pursuing the monk life and live as a normal person.
I thought monks of any kind had to not have sex tho?
They aren't. Vice just sells false advertisement and these "monks" are paid actors
@@jamisedenari2449 The issue isn't that the monk is gay. The issue is that he was told not to act camp... because apparaently if lay people saw a campy monk it would cause them to lose faith in Buddhism. A lot of Thais are still homophobic and think being gay is immoral, it would shock them (mostly the older generations) to see an obviously gay monk. Most still feel homosexuals are unsuitable for monkhood despite homosexuality not holding any stigma in Buddhist teachings. This is a case of secular social norms of homosexuality being seen as abnormal filtering in to Buddhism which had no negative or previous views on the subject.
@@abmong read the room. Monks take a vow of celibacy. How can he have any notion of having sex or sexuality if monks give that up? This doesn't make sense.
@@jamisedenari2449 Humans often don't make sense, we're creatures of contradictions. In theory monks and nuns are meant to maintain celibacy and remove themselves from temptations of the flesh as much as possible. That's why monks are not allowed to touch women and nuns not allowed to touch men and why monks and nuns are segregated to help them not fall to those temptations. When you're putting someone who's gay into a monastery full of their own sex, that's putting them into a temptation rich environment. It defeats the objective of them living free of temptation, and we're not talking about just the sex acts, Monks and Nuns aren't meant to entertain sexual thoughts. How much harder would that be if they find a fellow monk or nun attractive.
The path of the monk or nun is the trying and maintaining of that Asexual state, they don't always succeed, and depending on the level of the fall, they may get defrocked.
@@jamisedenari2449 celibacy has nothing to do with sexual orientation
Being GAY I learned that it's the ones frowning upon it, ACTUALLY PRACTICE IT MORE THAN THE "HOMOSEXUALS."
I agree with the researcher. The monk who disrobed also raised valid points. Essentially, the Vinaya code (that real monks follow) prohibits many actions, around 200-400 rules, let alone sexual misconduct.
With regards to gender, it is recorded in suttas that the Buddha taught both male & female lay followers, as well as male bhikkhus (monks) & bhikkhunis (nuns) - with various examples of them attaining enlightenment/arahantship. So what's the problem? Ignorance & ill-will.
If followers are unable to see beyond a shriek and focus on learning Dhamma, then they are missing the whole point. They need better teachers :-D And they will find one when their kamma is ripe ;-)
In Theravada Buddhism lay followers and Anagarikas can attain Arahatship, but after that, they must ordain. Otherwise they must reach Parinibbana, or so, die. Theravada doesn't have the Bhikkhuni lineage anymore, so, it leaves female followers, transgenders in a kind of limbo.
As a Buddhist, i became a monk 3 times in Myanmar, the first thing you do before becoming a monk, You must read the rules, such as Thou shall not kill, steal, etc. One of the rules is You can't be GAY. You can be gay as a Buddhist, there is nothing wrong with it. You just can't become a monk since all the monks are men & boys. It would be troublesome and might cause scandals...
@@xthia25 thankfully, impermanence...
@@CrimsonAlchemist lucky you! Must be your good kamma. But I'm not sure why gay is in caps... if I learnt anything about metta, I do wish everyone the opportunity to practice, solidifying the right view all the way to nibbana 🙏
@@CrimsonAlchemist With respect, you have been misinformed. There is no prohibition on GAY people becoming monks. Dealing with troublesome emotions, internal conflict and how we view things contrary to reaching Enlightenment is the primary purpose of becoming a monk. Monks don't arrive at their head-shaving ceremony already enlightened and free from desire - we enter monkhood to free ourselves from such desires and temptations. Whether you desire a man or a woman makes no difference whatsoever - desire is desire.
This claim that there is an issue with GAY men being monks because the monastery is made up of men and boys seems to be an issue created by the monks in charge of the monastery. Sadly, this attitude can cause a great deal of harm and spread false teachings and understanding about being GAY as both a layperson and a monk. Living in a community means novice monks should be supervised and observed by senior monks and teachers, so their sexuality should never be an issue.
It broke my heart when he said that he would rather remain in the closet, that's so sad😢
He's being unselfish. He doesn't want to rock the boat n cause a scandal. A discreet act for the sake of his faith in Buddhism.
In Thailand, is there a different relationship between gender and orientation? There was a lot of overlap between the terms that originally didn't make sense to me, since gender expression and sexual/romantic orientation are fundamentally different. Since there was a lot of outdated terms (at least in English) being thrown around, I'm not sure if it's a matter of translation, ignorance, or just a whole different perspective on LGBT that I'm not familiar with /gen
Overall, it was lovely watching this video :) Buddhist monks in my country have always been very kind to me, and when it's safe to do so, I'd love to make another pilgrimage to my nearest monastery. Much love from a gay trans man
The word Phet in Thai can mean "gender", "sexual orientation" or even "sex". If someone is questioned about their "Phet", they are being asked about all their sexual/gender/expression identity. It is a very broad term and it is very very difficult to translate it.
@@tiagocarioca Ah understood! Thank you for explaining :)
They misgendered the trans woman who became a monk
Budhhism doesn't really address homosexuality so the way they came to think of it in Southeast Asia was as a kind of transsexual (man body, woman lust). Different views existed elsewhere in the Buddhist world.
Is it not a little discriminatory to say he rarely “sees” a gay monk? Like a sexual orientation always is visible on the outside. Especially when living in celibacy and therefore not looking for a partner.
I feel like a lot of people got the wrong impression on this video. No, it's not about 'why do you care about your gayness, if you're going to celibate?'. No, it's not about sexual identity of the monks, it's rather about the identification forced upon them by others, how the lay community and other monks perceived the monks' gayness (femininity) and how they may make some prejudiced judgements based on that. Just like how in the first part of the video the monk explained how a lay person took back his offering after seeing a feminine monk. Also, Pandaka is not best translated to gays and transgenders. There are fives types of Pandaka, even in Dharmaguptaka lineage (Mahayana) also recognized this. If pandakas referred to gay people, then why did the Buddha made some distinctions in the vinaya about the offence of monks having sex with a man, a woman, and a pandaka anyway
You writing a compo?
Thats actually sad seeing that offering being taken back based on percieved gender role since monk are required to be celibate so those stuff ahouldnt happened
Thank you for yr clarification. The Head monks had to deal with the prejudicial views of temple visitors and donors I guess and that's not easy.
As a Buddhist, i became a monk 3 times in Myanmar, the first thing you do before becoming a monk, You must read the rules, such as Thou shall not kill, steal, etc. One of the rules is You can't be GAY. You can be gay as a Buddhist, there is nothing wrong with it. You just can't become a monk since all the monks are men & boys. It would be troublesome and might cause scandals.. . .
@@CrimsonAlchemist I'm aware that this depends from monastery to monastery, from lineage to lineage, just like Bhikkhuni ordination, some do and some do not, even if they follow the same Theravada Vinaya. I'm sure you're familiar that there are 5 types of Pandakas, and not all pandakas can't get ordained according to vinaya atthakattha. Quoting from Bhante Dhammanando from Dhammawheel:
"Regarding paṇḍakas, in the Vinaya Atthakathā these are classified as being of five types:
1) āsitta-paṇḍaka: - (literally, a "sprinkled one") a man who finds sexual fulfillment in performing fellatio on another man and bringing him to climax. (For some reason, other homosexual acts, even though they were known in ancient India, are not included under this type nor under any of the types in this list.)
2) usūya-paṇḍaka: - a voyeur a man who finds sexual fulfillment in watching other people have sex.
3) opakkamika-paṇḍaka: - A eunuch - one who has been castrated.
4) pakkha-paṇḍaka: - A half-time paṇḍaka - one who is a paṇḍaka only during the waning moon.
5) napuṃsaka-paṇḍaka: - A neuter - a person born without sexual organs.
(I have followed Ven. Thanissaro's translations of these terms)
Of these five kinds, the first two may ordain as bhikkhus, the other three may not. So, given that the āsitta-paṇḍaka -the type closest to what we call a "homosexual" today- is permitted to ordain, I think we have to take it that such persons are in fact capable of awakening.
I'm aware that some monasteries go as far as defining pandakas to all gay or LGBT people, which nobody couldn't help but just accept it is. Scandal or not doesn't depend on people's sexual orientation, one may become a Bhikkhu and have a scandalous relationship with his upasika, one may taking grafts and support a corrupt government, etc
I think I'll lost respect too if monk can't abandon their gender or sexual desire and still being activist on political subject like that. And it's not about being gay. If monk flirting on woman or can't control their lust, their anger. I lost respect too.
The whole point of Buddhism is to throw away your worldly desire and finding nirvana. Monk is not gay and monk is not man. They're asexual, They are celibate.
Human body we live in is just a shell and they can't even cut their attachments of that which it should be one of first step. Of course as believer, I'm dissapointed
If you can't do that, you can just be believer. Buddhism always open you to be believer no matter what's your gender.
Exactly..I was confused
I am Thai and i think it is fine if they behave as such. After all, we are just human. But if one holds on to a certain label ie. being gay or others, they couldnt truly let go of self. So, not sure if persons can get the fullest benefit from being buddhist monk.
Your a lady boy😂😂
A lot of our parent's generation and older probably can't handle it. People in their 50s and younger probably more accepting hopefully.
@@KirksCORNER-1983 If you're going to be obtuse, then at least do so properly. *You're
@@abmong im 38 and cant I am old skool
do straight monks let go of self truly?
Btw it’s common to be a monk in Thailand for temporary amount of time.
Monks and Nuns (in most organized religions) are meant to live detached from worldly desires. Sexuality and renunciation never really mixed . However there is a fabulous book called : "Lust for ENLIGHTENMENT" collection stories of Buddhist monks and nuns who sought ENLIGHTENMENT through sexual release. "Tantra" & "trantic" practices explore this concept in detail !!! Kudos to the guy who is looking after LGBTQ rights!!!👏👏👏🏳️🌈💛👏👏👏
celibacy in the monastic community is there partly to prevent the abuse of students by higher level monks and nuns . things have gone horribly wrong when sex abuse happens in religious groups .
Woah this is really interesting
I think what the lord Buddha meant is that upon entering monkshood, you're supposed to be modest, and your regular gender expression is just not it. Not necessary that only gayness is prohibited, even if you were all macho the effect is still the same for you. The sad thing is that Buddhism's teachings have been twisted and turned by patriarchal societies for more than 2,500 years so the result is reflected in this video.
Arent monks meant to be celibate? Why are they concerned about their sexual orientation? Is there something we arent aware of?
I see many conservative and libertarian monk . sexuality doesn't affect enlightenment . They are gay before became monk .
Is stupid
@@superfluous5162 That doesnt still answer my question. Are monks supposed to be sexually active? Arent they sworn to an oath of celibacy? If they are, does their sexual orientation matter then?
@@ejay4032 it about representation not about sex . In India you see naked monk , monk do weed , monk who live in jungle . Monk mean devotion , yes it related bramchariya (no do sex or even think of it ) but not stickly follow .
Actually Indian religious (Buddhism one of them) is more about devotion than God .
I am not sure about the concept of “gender” in English but in Thai, เพศ which normally means gender, literally means “ornament” or appearance. Being a monk or สมณเพศ in Thai can also be translated as being in a “Monk Gender” per se.
If you are a Monk, you are wearing an ornament of “Monk” simple as that.
This kind of video is just some kind of overdramatized and kind of redundant to the concept of Monkhood itself.
I am a gay man and I was a monk in Thailand for 6 rainy seasons (vassa) . I left the order last October for personal reasons, some of them being how much I was discriminated against. I have more tattoos than the average person, let alone the average monk. I lived in a famous temple in Bangkok and was constantly placed in the back of the line when we had precessions so that “we don’t have any problems with the lay people. “ I am not mad at anyone because of my experiences. I understand that people can only operate from what they know and after living in Thailand, I can understand many of the reasons why.
Aren't they dedicated to a life of celibacy what is the point in sexual orientation.
it matter to vice
Exactly! Is stupid . They aren't having sex anyway ! I wish someone expose their stupidity ! Use logic and common sense .
I know someone as ex Buddha
As a Buddhist, i became a monk 3 times in Myanmar, the first thing you do before becoming a monk, You must read the rules, such as Thou shall not kill, steal, etc. One of the rules is You can't be GAY. You can be gay as a Buddhist, there is nothing wrong with it. You just can't become a monk since all the monks are men & boys. It would be troublesome and might cause scandals.
Rules made up by people like you.
Basic logic! That’s why nuns are separated, rape and sexual abuse can occur!
The discussion is on social norms of the society, than the actual practice of dhamma. So, naturally there are biases. But if we just consider the dhamma, reading the sutras from the time of Buddha, people from all walks of life gained enlightenment, even criminals and outcasts from society.
I'm a monk and according to the Buddha they would have to disrobe!!!! Being gay is okay but not as a monk!!! During ordination they question is asked if your homosexual and if they answered no then they broke one of the principal percepts. I shall not lie cheat or steal!!!! A gay monk isn't a monk but just a person in monk robes!!!!!!
Thank you for fighting for the Dhamma!
Nuns are kept separate as well to avoid rape and sexual abuse!
Monks are to free themselves from earthly desires through practice, prayer, meditation etc. The whole point of one becoming a monk or say a Christian nun is to decide to live close to God/heavens and less on earthly things. This whole discussion is the complete opposite of what the holy life is meant to be. Gay or Straight you are to abstain
God doesn't require you to live as a monk.
This is not an issue of sexuality. It is an issue of misogyny amongst males. They regard the feminine aspects of humanity as weak or inferior. No monk can be sexually active for any reason whatsoever, so their prejudice toward people they perceive as “feminine” has more to do with their own mental conditioning, which is itself a HUGE obstacle toward both sila AND samadhi.
you can be gay and have same sex marriage but you cant do adultery. this applies to all sexualities even heterosexual, you cannot commit adultery because it causes more suffering. it never say anything bad about lgbt in buddhist text.i accept all gay and lesbians🏳🌈
Identity politics is the problem... gay should be just another part of a person like being a monk, nationality, gender or skin colour... it shouldn't define the person...
But people will discriminate against you if you are effeminate with a high pitched voice or have gay mannerisms
It's an odd contradiction that although most religions emphasise compassion and empathy, religious people often seem to struggle the most to be compassionate to those who are different. Perhaps the type of personality drawn to the clearly defined worldview religion offers may have more difficulty when faced with things that don't fit into it.
As a Buddhist, i became a monk 3 times in Myanmar, the first thing you do before becoming a monk, You must read the rules, such as Thou shall not kill, steal, etc. One of the rules is You can't be GAY. You can be gay as a Buddhist, there is nothing wrong with it. You just can't become a monk since all the monks are men & boys. It would be troublesome and might cause scandals.......
Commenting this before watching the video.
As a Thai Buddhist. a monk's duty is to preach the dharma and attain enlightenment (nibbana). sexual identity is utterly irrelevant to a monk's life, if a yellow rob indulges in it, he's no longer a monk. If a so called monk thinks being gay sex is relevant, he could fuck off from monastery, he is not holy or sacred, him being monk is blasphemous to the buddha dharma and he shall never achieve nibbana. if you enter monkhood, you are obliged to become asexual.
I think you mean 'celibate'
@@chasestefanson8501 no,
I am Indian Hindu. Tell me one thing, I aversion as destructive as attachment?
I think Buddhist monk can't use f word why r u using that?
@@ytchannelstyle3224 differentiate between a buddhist commoner and a buddhist monk first, and english curses don't feel offensive to my ears.
It seems like losing the respect and support of the community is top of mind for the monastery. It's all good and well to seek enlightenment, but you've got to keep the lights on.
It's a shame that the host is confusing sexual orientation with gender idetity. In this day and age. I refer paricularly to the dialogue ag 9:43 in this video. I have watched only to that point thus far. Okay now I see. Gay, trans, and queer are used interchangeably. So confusing. 😢
Whether you are gay or lesbian or normal people. To be a monk is to practice religious as long you are a human beings can be ordained . Whatever practice is from your heart there’s nothing to do with your gender. Animals also can practice religious.whatever practice is from your heart not external or outlook.
I think the real issue here is gender expression. If the monk is feminine then he is discriminated against. It is strange though that they wouldn’t be ordained just for being gay given that all sexual interactions are forbidden in the first place. I guess that is the explicit discrimination of being gay.
They wouldn't be having sex anyway lol so what matter if they gay or not?
Buddha is nonsense teaching and make no sense .
@@Moodboard39 you say that and you dont even know what Buddhist teachings are, clown
It is nobody's business what one's sexuality is. Why is there a need to tell everyone????? And, just because a guy is gay, doesnt mean he acts effeminate.
Someone needs to expose they bs . They close minded
I'm a former Bikkhu monk, a monk is not gay or heterosexual, a monk a no sexuality he's impersonnal and must pratice the Dharma that's all. When a monk leaves monastery in life he can have his personnal orientation. Satthu 🙏
As a monk didn't you bear witness to peadophile activities .Sri lankan monasteries are notorious for peadophilia due practice of recruiting underage boys for lifetime of monkhood. No sane person would agree to lifetime of celebate monkhood after reaching puberty.
This is false, then why bother separating nuns? Because of rape, abuse!
This is ridiculous and you are creating demerit for yourself and ancestors.
@@saddha1 monks and nuns have to be separated from each other. Period, what’s so scandalous about that?
You act like women cant voluntarily end up breaking the celibacy vow🙄
@@guanchandrashakya monks ordain at all ages before and after puberty, wth are you talking about
@@floptaxie68 maybe read what the topic is about, it’s about homosexuals which defeats the purpose of separating monks from nuns due to possible sexual violations.
It should be the norm for all religions and societies, to accept, but unfortunately too many are so unrealistic about truth and humanity... Hopefully, this will change quicker than it is.
Please make sure you check the rules of monks community laid down by its creator, The Buddha himself. A pandaka is not available to become a bhikkhu. All ordination will become failure if the candidate is a pandaka. But still they can be ordained as a novice monk (samanera). This is the monk community created by Buddha, whatever rules laid down by Him is the guideline. If there are people want to break the guidelines such as ordaining gay as a monk, please create your own new community, use your own name. Dont use the Buddha and Bhikkhusangha name.
By the way, there is nothing wrong with being a gay. But there was, sexual misconduct done in the past cause people to become a gay. Buddhism doesnt judge a gay. He still can practice as a novice monk or a layperson, only can not go a step further to become a monk.
..what is the name of this temple and where it is located in Thailand..?
To be a monk, you must be aromantic/asexual. Bhuddist monks are not allowed to have romantic feelings for anyone. There shouldn't be such a thing as straight monks or gay monks. Now, if you naturally exhibit feminine qualities or expressions...then we are talking about something different, and I agree monks should be able to act like themselves without being forced.
That first monk is a sad case, since celibacy is a requirement for being monk, being gay or not is not a problem for anyone, may people may see thing as it is 🙏.
Does gender or sexual orientation (not being just male and asexual) matters in being a monk? I mean, monks wouldn't allow themselves to be romantically and sexually attracted with others right?
The problem is some gays are naturally effeminate with a high pitched voice and people discriminate against them
He said he isn't his self. I thought that there was no self in Buddhism. Isn't any sexual orientation identifying with the world?
If one become a monk, because he abstain from sexual desires, they are consider neutral people.
.....like most of the comments here, it's confusing when u link sexuality to monkhood. The basic 5 precepts of a layman - already denotes one should not have "Sexual misconduct" and to be a monk there are more rules to comply and one should strive to free themselves from sexual desires. This topic is so wrong.
LOL how does that even matter for a Buddhist monk?!
I was wondering the same. Not an lol matter of course because we all have struggles but gay monks?
This is vice wanting more views and paid actors wanting money.
As a Buddhist, i became a monk 3 times in Myanmar, the first thing you do before becoming a monk, You must read the rules, such as Thou shall not kill, steal, etc. One of the rules is You can't be GAY. You can be gay as a Buddhist, there is nothing wrong with it. You just can't become a monk since all the monks are men & boys. It would be troublesome and might cause scandals.!
Sex and sexuality are desires which the Buddha teaches are the root of suffering. I’m not sure why it matters what you were, when you’re following the middle path all those things cease to be of importance.
The whole teaching is nonsense
Im from Pakistan, I'm fashion designer by profession and by Qualifications also' but now I want to move toward thailand bangkok, I'm LGBT community activist I want to do work in thailand for lgbtq welfare. Please guide me 🙏
i dont understand what in the budhist religious philosophy would justify such discrimination, isnt attachment to the concept of any gender part of the trivial matters of the material worldview and to truly be in harmony with the limitless nature of the universe require letting go of such divisions??? i ask because i legitimately dont know
Ummm, could it be rape and sexual abuse. Hmm. I wonder why nuns are kept separate, why they should be sleeping right next to them🤡
8:27 “… people not accept Gay Monk”
i feel the narrative of this vice asia is pushing radical Leftist toward Monkhood now 😂❤
People Respect Monkhood because their discipline and Ethic conducts.
Again, they are not layperson.
They don’t have comfort as layperson.
Monk is a being who let go of their layperson identity and embrace study of Dharma.
That’s the greatest privilege oneself of Buddhist has.
stop Pushing ur political agenda to our buddhist community
As for me to become a monk only for few days just to get some merits is more weird thing than gay monk. Why people insult him while he is keeping celibacy? But what we can say if they even don't accept woman as nuns.
Sometimes people around you won't understand your journey. They don't need to ,it's not for them
All monks are celibate so sexual orientation shouldn't matter. Also, I don't know of any teaching of the BUDDHA that is anti-gay. Even when the Dalai Lama was challenged for saying something anti-gay he couldn't provide a teaching of the Buddha to back up his statement so he had to admit that his statement was a personal prejudice and not a Buddhist teaching. It's very sad to me that this monk see's his being out as damaging to Buddhism instead of realizing that it's HOMOPHOBIA that is damaging to Buddhism. LGBT people are taught from a very young age to apologize for who they are and to take responsibility for harms and abuses committed by homophobes. When gay people are attacked they are told that it is because they are gay. When people are uncomfortable with homosexuality due to their ignorance, gay people are told that it's their fault and that the answer to ignorant people's discomfort is for gay people to hide their nature and/or pretend to be straight, instead of realizing that the real and just answer is to educate the ignorant and to condemn homophobia. It's a shame that in 2024 we're still having to deal with ignorance and hate directed at LGBT people for simply being who and how they are by nature.
All monks are celibate? They PRACTICE and some are just sick people who can rape and sexually abuse people. Which is why nuns are separate.
Those who allow gay/bi monks/nuns will only gain great demerit for all their families.😢
Monks and nuns are there for lay people to create merit.
@@saddha1how are they gonna gain demerit🙄 straight and gay monks are equally able to break the precepts
@@floptaxie68 gay acts by itself is demeritorious.
@@saddha1 how is it demeritorios? Please check your prejudices that come from social conditioning
@@floptaxie68 any sexual deviance is demeritorious.
Merit comes from doing the right thing.
If the Thai Buddhism cannot give equal importance and treatment to female buddhist monks like Bhikku, what hope is there for other personalities.
Women should come to the Mahayana school, where many, many nuns are amazing Dharma teachers and excellent community leaders. There is also a group of women led by a Thai woman who has been ordained into the Thai Thervada tradition with the help of monks from the West. I believe there is a video on Vice about her - you should check it out and help if you can...
And, there is always HOPE 🙏
Because Monk doesn’t have Gender
Monk is genderless
So no Liberal or republican
Buddhist Monk is not layperson
Everyone has to watch their manners queer or not. If you decide to be a monk, you decide to accept change. There are many gay monks who accept change. There’s no more sexual pleasure/endeavor. It’s the path to peace. It’s all about your mind and not the body. Buddhism accepts all, queer or not, prisoners, homeless, orphans, anyone who wants to practice mind over body. People are trying to bring queer politics in everything…sad facts of life.
celibacy is celibacy. sexual orientation does not matter in this.
but monks are suppose to be celibate why does it matter?
How you found this out.
How does it matter what sexuality you are , when you are a monk or a nun ???? Am I the only one confused with the whole documentary?? I mean there are many asexual LGBTQ+ people out there and monks are expected to go all sexual desires , so how does it matter yo!
It's all about behavior. Some gays have a naturally effeminate way of acting, prancing and high pitched voice and you cannot change that
ต้องรู้ว่าจุดประสงค์ที่บวชคืออะไรก่อน ถ้าบวชเข้ามาแล้วปฏิบัติตามธรรมวินัยได้ก็ไม่น่ามีป้ญหาอะไร แต่ที่มีข้อห้ามก็เพราะมีผู้ที่บวชเข้ามาแล้วไปยั่วยวนให้ผู้อื่นมีเพศสัมพันธ์กับตนจึงมีกฏข้อนี้ขึ้นมา การบวชคือการเข้ามาเพื่อละทางโลก แต่เพศที่สามส่วนมากจะมีความรักสวยรักงามและอื่นๆชึ่งเป็นเครื่องกั้นการหลุดพ้นถ้ายังละไม่ได้ แต่การบรรลุธรรมไม่เกี่ยวกับเพศ อยู่ที่การปฏิบัติ ถ้าปฏิบัติได้ก็บรรลุได้ ไม่ว่าจะป็นนักบวชหรือฆราวาส ดังนั้นถ้าอยากปฏิบัติธรรมก็สามารถปฏิบัติได้แม้ไม่ต้องบวช เพราะธรรมะมีหลายระดับให้เลือกปฏิบัติให้เหมาะกับตัวเอง
A monk can be wondering monk not attaching to any temple.
2:05 Being a man is the greatest a merit a man make...do you mean man as in male or mankind? And make merit to who? How can and why should 'man' make merit for or to parents? What does merit mean?
The liberal “buddhist” version of “gay priest”. Next, Vice Asia will make a video about “queer Imams”.
Fascinating! Thanks for posting this...It seems to emphasize what it means to be gay rather than what it means to be Buddhist? Is the Buddhist goal the application of Buddhism to all parts of life? And what does it mean to "be gay" if monks don't have sexual relationships anyway? (Real religious question - NOT hating). The last monk had wonderful points! I'm mostly ignorant about Buddhism, just wondering what the monks think is their role or focus and how that affects personal life. Thanks
If you become a monk, would you still be straight? Is being a heterosexual man only about your desire to have sex with women, or is there more to it?
How do monks have sexual orientation? i thought they didn't had any interest in human affairs
Hard to say when they're only humans themselves.
@@KingOfThePirates101 yes and monks are supposed to be more than human , enlightened form of human with no attraction to material world
@@darthashpie3370 Yeah. But in the end they're still human. Just because they've reached enlightment doesn't mean they've become a God.
@@KingOfThePirates101 no they haven't reached enlightenment if they still have feelings about material world
@@darthashpie3370 Enlightenment is different for everybody else. It seems your form of enlightenment is letting go of feelings in the material world, and yet here you are. Perhaps becoming a Buddhist monk will help him find the answers to his questions. Isn't that what Buddha himself did in the beginning? He was finding answers to his questions.
Every person wanting to give up worldly life and live the holy life should be accepted. This people want to attain enlightenment why stop them?
A Theravada Buddhist monk cannot marry or have sexual thoughts of any kind. It's against the discipline.
If you want to have sex, you should disrobe and be a lay person. Buddhist lay people can be queer.
Isn't an openly gay monk by definition someone who embraces individualism, feelings, sexuality and desire over prioritising being an ascetic, community leader and a person of vows to renounce ego?
You blur the monks face in the video but show it completely in the thumbnail lol
You can be far or close, if you don't know where to go it matters little, if you don't know what you want nothing happens. you need to make a point of arrival before you leave or you will never know where it is
*Thank you.* 🙏🙏🙏🙏🙏🙏🙏🙏🙏🙏🙏💐💐💐💐💐💐💐💐💐💐💐💐💐💐💐💐💐💐💐💐💐💐💐💐💐💐💐💐💐💐💐💐💐💐💐💐💐💐💐💐💐💐💐💐💐💐💐💐💐💐💐💐💐💐💐💐💐💐💐💐💐💐💐💐💐💐💐💐💐💐💐💐💐💐💐💐💐💐💐💐💐💐💐💐💐💐💐💐💐💐💐💐💐💐💐💐💐💐💐💐💐💐💐💐💐💐💐💐💐💐💐💐💐💐💐💐💐💐💐💐💐💐💐💐💐💐💐💐💐💐💐💐💐💐💐💐💐💐💐💐💐💐💐💐💐💐💐💐💐💐💐💐💐💐💐💐💐💐💐💐💐💐💐💐💐💐💐💐💐💐💐💐💐💐💐💐💐💐💐💐💐💐💐💐💐💐💐💐💐💐💐💐💐💐💐💐💐💐💐💐💐💐💐💐💐💐💐💐💐💐💐💐💐💐💐💐💐💐💐💐💐💐💐💐💐💐💐💐💐💐💐💐💐💐💐💐💐💐💐💐💐💐💐💐💐💐💐💐💐💐💐💐💐💐💐💐💐💐💐💐💐💐💐💐💐💐💐💐💐💐💐💐💐💐💐💐💐💐💐💐💐💐💐💐💐💐💐💐💐💐💐💐💐💐💐💐💐💐💐💐💐💐💐💐💐💐💐💐💐💐💐💐💐💐💐💐💐💐💐💐💐💐💐💐💐💐💐💐💐💐💐💐💐💐💐💐💐💐💐💐💐💐💐💐💐💐💐💐💐💐💐💐💐💐💐💐💐💐💐💐💐💐💐💐💐💐💐💐💐💐💐💐💐💐💐💐💐💐💐💐💐💐💐💐💐💐💐💐💐💐💐💐💐💐💐💐💐💐💐💐💐💐💐💐💐💐💐💐💐💐💐💐💐💐💐💐💐💐💐💐💐💐💐💐💐💐💐💐💐💐💐💐💐💐💐💐💐💐💐💐💐💐💐💐💐💐💐💐💐💐💐💐💐💐💐💐💐💐💐💐💐💐💐💐💐💐💐💐💐💐💐💐💐💐💐💐💐💐💐💐💐💐💐💐💐💐💐💐💐💐💐💐💐💐💐💐💐💐💐💐💐💐💐💐💐💐💐💐💐💐💐💐💐💐💐💐💐💐💐💐💐💐💐💐💐💐💐💐💐💐💐💐💐💐💐💐💐💐💐💐💐💐💐💐💐💐💐💐💐💐💐💐💐💐💐💐💐💐💐💐💐💐💐💐💐💐💐💐💐💐💐💐💐💐💐💐💐💐💐💐💐💐💐💐💐💐💐💐💐💐💐💐💐💐💐💐💐💐💐💐💐💐💐💐💐💐💐💐💐💐💐💐💐💐💐💐💐💐💐💐💐💐💐💐💐💐💐💐💐💐💐💐💐💐💐💐💐💐💐💐💐💐💐💐💐💐💐💐💐💐💐💐💐💐💐💐💐💐💐💐💐💐💐💐💐💐💐💐💐💐💐💐💐💐💐💐💐💐💐💐💐💐💐💐💐💐💐💐💐💐💐💐💐💐💐💐💐💐💐💐💐💐💐💐💐💐💐💐💐💐💐💐💐💐💐💐💐💐💐💐💐💐💐💐💐💐💐💐💐💐💐💐💐💐💐💐💐💐💐💐💐💐💐💐💐💐💐💐💐💐💐💐💐💐💐💐💐💐💐💐💐💐💐💐💐💐💐💐💐💐💐💐💐💐💐💐💐💐💐💐💐💐💐💐💐💐💐💐💐💐💐💐💐💐💐💐💐💐💐💐💐💐💐💐💐💐💐💐💐💐💐💐💐💐💐💐💐💐💐💐💐💐💐💐💐💐💐💐💐💐💐💐💐💐💐💐💐💐💐💐💐💐💐💐💐💐💐💐💐💐💐💐💐💐💐💐💐💐💐💐💐💐💐💐💐💐💐💐💐💐💐💐💐💐💐💐💐💐💐💐💐💐💐💐💐💐💐💐💐💐💐💐💐💐💐💐💐💐💐💐💐💐💐💐💐💐💐💐💐💐💐💐💐💐💐💐💐💐💐💐💐💐💐💐💐💐💐💐💐💐💐💐💐💐💐💐💐💐💐💐💐💐💐💐💐💐💐💐💐💐💐💐💐💐💐💐💐💐💐💐💐💐💐💐💐💐💐💐💐💐💐💐💐💐💐💐💐💐💐💐💐💐💐💐💐💐💐💐💐💐💐💐💐💐💐💐💐💐💐💐💐💐💐💐💐💐💐💐💐💐💐💐💐💐💐💐💐💐💐💐💐💐💐💐💐💐💐💐💐💐💐💐💐💐💐💐💐💐💐💐💐💐💐💐💐💐💐💐💐💐💐💐💐💐💐💐💐💐💐💐💐💐💐💐💐💐💐💐💐💐💐💐💐💐💐💐💐💐💐💐💐💐💐💐💐💐💐💐💐💐💐💐💐💐💐💐💐💐💐💐💐💐💐💐💐💐💐💐💐💐💐💐💐💐💐💐💐💐💐💐💐💐💐💐💐💐💐💐💐💐💐💐💐💐💐💐💐💐💐💐💐💐💐💐💐💐💐💐💐💐💐💐💐💐💐💐💐💐💐💐💐💐💐💐💐💐💐💐💐💐💐💐💐💐💐💐💐💐💐💐💐💐💐💐💐💐💐💐💐💐💐💐💐💐💐💐💐💐💐💐💐💐💐💐💐💐💐💐💐💐💐💐💐💐💐💐💐💐💐💐💐💐💐💐💐💐💐💐💐💐💐💐💐💐💐💐💐💐💐💐💐💐💐💐💐💐💐💐💐💐💐💐💐💐💐💐💐💐💐💐💐💐💐💐💐💐💐💐💐💐💐💐💐💐💐💐💐💐💐💐💐💐💐💐💐💐💐💐💐💐💐💐💐💐💐💐💐💐💐💐💐💐💐💐💐💐💐💐💐💐💐💐💐💐💐💐💐💐💐💐💐💐💐💐💐💐💐💐💐💐💐💐💐💐💐💐💐💐💐💐💐💐💐💐💐💐💐💐💐💐💐💐💐💐💐💐💐💐💐💐💐💐💐💐💐💐💐💐💐💐💐💐💐💐💐💐💐💐💐💐💐💐💐💐💐💐💐💐💐💐💐💐💐💐💐💐💐💐💐💐💐💐💐💐💐💐💐💐💐💐💐💐💐💐💐💐💐💐💐💐💐💐💐💐💐💐💐💐💐💐💐💐💐💐💐💐💐💐💐💐💐💐💐💐💐💐💐💐💐💐💐💐💐💐💐💐💐💐💐💐💐💐💐💐💐💐💐💐💐💐💐💐💐💐💐💐💐💐💐💐💐💐💐💐💐💐💐💐💐💐💐💐💐💐💐💐💐💐💐💐💐💐💐💐💐💐💐💐💐💐💐💐💐💐💐💐💐💐💐💐💐💐💐💐💐💐💐💐💐💐💐💐💐💐💐💐💐💐💐💐💐💐💐💐💐💐💐💐💐💐💐💐💐💐💐💐💐💐💐💐💐💐💐💐💐💐💐💐💐💐💐💐💐💐💐💐💐💐💐💐💐💐💐💐💐💐💐💐💐💐💐💐💐💐💐💐💐💐💐💐💐💐💐💐💐💐💐💐💐💐💐💐💐💐💐💐💐💐💐💐💐💐💐💐💐💐💐💐💐💐💐💐💐💐💐💐💐💐💐💐💐💐💐💐💐💐💐💐💐💐💐💐💐💐💐💐💐💐💐💐💐💐💐💐💐💐💐💐💐💐💐💐💐💐💐💐💐💐💐💐💐💐💐💐💐💐💐💐💐💐💐💐💐💐💐💐💐💐💐💐💐💐💐💐💐💐💐💐💐💐💐💐💐💐💐💐💐💐💐💐💐💐💐💐💐💐💐💐💐💐💐💐💐💐💐💐💐💐💐💐💐💐💐💐💐💐💐💐💐💐💐💐💐💐💐💐💐💐💐💐💐💐💐💐💐💐💐💐💐💐💐💐💐💐💐💐💐💐💐💐💐💐💐💐💐💐💐💐💐💐💐💐💐💐💐💐💐💐💐💐💐💐💐💐💐💐💐💐💐💐💐💐💐💐💐💐💐💐💐💐💐💐💐💐💐💐💐💐💐💐💐💐💐💐💐💐💐💐💐💐💐💐💐💐💐💐💐💐💐💐💐💐💐💐💐💐💐💐💐💐💐💐💐💐💐💐💐💐💐💐💐💐💐💐💐💐💐💐💐💐💐💐💐💐💐💐💐💐💐💐💐💐💐💐💐💐💐💐💐💐💐💐💐💐💐💐💐💐💐💐💐💐💐💐💐💐💐💐💐💐💐💐💐💐💐💐💐💐💐💐💐💐💐💐💐💐💐💐💐💐💐💐💐💐💐💐💐💐💐💐💐💐💐💐💐💐💐💐💐💐💐💐💐💐💐💐💐💐💐💐💐💐💐💐💐💐💐💐💐💐💐💐💐💐💐💐💐💐💐💐💐💐💐💐💐💐💐💐💐💐💐💐💐💐💐💐💐💐💐💐💐💐💐💐💐💐💐💐💐💐💐💐💐💐💐💐💐💐💐💐💐💐💐💐💐💐💐💐💐💐💐💐💐💐💐💐💐💐💐
I had no idea. 🤔
Bhikkuni are female monks not nuns.
One of the hardest things to do is to deny yourself or become someone you're not. Many people do to survive and to fit neatly into society but I always go to the golden rule. If you believe that God created people to be straight, then why not also believe that he can do many other things beyond human understanding. Then you would also believe that all of God's children are just the way he wanted them to be and its not for us to decide otherwise because we don't have the capacity to understand all things but we should at least, respect them as an honor to God himself.
Thank You 😊
Wtf. If you’re celibate how can you be gay?
If you’re celibate, how can you be told to be straight? Orientation and celibacy have nothing to do with each other
@@markcorneliuslau well, it wouldn't matter anyway. If u gay, you wouldn't be having sex lol 🤣 is fucking dumb
@@Moodboard39 it shouldn’t matter but homophobes think it does
If you're celibate how can you be straight? Homosexuality is nature not an act, that your dirty mind sexualized
I always knew there were similarities between Catholic priests and Thai monks. Yes, little boys are the victims.
Scriptures say women can be fully enlightened (arahant) but not have Buddha-hood (world teacher, very rare).
four of my 5 Buddhist teachers were female . male or female does not matter . buddha nature is neither male or female . so the realization of buddha nature matters not if you are male or female .
@@plookngo67 yeah, im just quoting scripture, scripture not perfect as said in the scripture
There are three types of Buddha
1)Samyak SamByddha who become Arhant by own path and teach others.
2)Pratek(Individual) Buddha who become Arhant by own path but does not teach others.
3)Arhant Buddha who achieve enlightenment by following path of samyak SamByddha and teach others.
It is said in Buddhism that to become Samyak SamBuddha n Pratek Buddha bodhistwas take its last birth as man to abstain from bodily sufferings of menstruation and pregnancy.
Furthermore, to become Arhant Buddha, there is no any bodily restriction.
That phrase isnt in the Chinese Tripitaka, so was probably made up. A Buddha has to be someone that people is gonna listen to, so it makes sense that in a mysoginist society a Buddha cant be born as a woman, but women can attain enlightenment and even be a Buddha in a society that wouldn’t care about that.
@@floptaxie68 women are built to follow
also, why is everyone classifing Buddhism as a religion in this video by calling it sat-sa-naa? A quick Google search will show you that Buddhism is an ideology not a religion 🤷♂️Any well versed person knows Buddishm is not a religion
What is religion in your opinion? If it’s something that you pray for before dying is not religion thing I don’t know what it is.
@@vassanab4243 nice question, and in my opinion, religion is a belief system that entails that there is a higher being(God) that defines purpose, morals and guidance.
Even you said it yourself, you think religion is something that you PRAY before you die.
Question is, pray to whom? Another man or a Godly figure?
If another man, then how can another man define morals and purpose for me?
Oh wow, I always thought monks would let go of all their sexual desires and romantic attractions. I've been to Thailand, and found the monks very fascinating, here I am learning more about them...do they get also get married then? Will they not allow marriage between gay monks? Seems unfair.
If I'm not mistaken, in Thai Buddhism, marriage, sexual intercourse or romantic relationships is not allowed, in others are allowed, but I can't remember which ones right now. Hongan ji monks are allowed, at least the ones I know of
The same reason everyone needs to, no?!
Seems that Buddhists don't follow the teachings of Buddha.
😂😂😂😂
Is a nonsense teaching
Love to each of you who hold love in your hearts
Once you a Buddhist monk. You are no longer straight, gay, sisgender, queer, white, black , Asian, African and so on. You are just a monk. You are above those levels.
😑😑😑 yeah whatever but sometimes a bad thing need to keep it in urself..dont coming out if not really important.. I think this ur strategy to get Partner in monk area..
12:00 🙌🙌🙌
6:35
11:00
There is no such thing called Buddhism. Buddha is enlightened being. People follow Buddha's path. That's it. What did Buddha say. Well there are many Buddha. Which Buddha are you referring to? Gautama Siddharta?
In the Buddhist teaching, same-sex marriage is acceptable but you cannot do an adultery.
What is the point of being a monk when suffering, physical attraction, feeling of "I" is strongly attached? He can let go his acting of monk and run a normal life
Sadly, in the end a monk is still just a human.
@@KingOfThePirates101 yes, swayed by other thoughts but still has to come back and focus.
@@vishnuvardhan3047 That's just human nature. You really think by becoming a monk, they've become a God?
@@KingOfThePirates101 no, when mind is in control you attain one pointed buddhi which leads to peace , strength and makes wise.
@@vishnuvardhan3047 No. Monk can never attained that. They're still humans after all.
There are only monks. Not straight or gay or lizard loving nor anything. The attatchment to sexual attraction of any kind ends when you put the robe on.....in theory....the reality is it the last major struggle for all of us before we attain arahantship. Anyone who attempts this,let alone attains it should be respected and supported. Who householders sleep with is nobodies business if they are consenting adults.
Edit: I received sak Yant from a monk who's lay sexual orientation was gay, he was the abbot, highly skilled and good monk.
This is vice agenda to spread lgbt ideology in any place
CC's would help.
They are Bramacharies in india,. No sex life celebrity 🎉
They'll have trans monks soon
They have to hide because of Islam hating them
Don't ask don't tell.
Don't watch. Just ignore.
@@KingOfThePirates101 lol. They weren't showing HOW to hide sexual orientation, but asking why.
@@skellingtonmeteoryballoon Oops. My mistake.