I’m discovering this action with great success. For those who really struggle with serve please note that the focus here is on shoulder and elbow. Relax everything else - no wrist action required until your phase with hitting the ball
Fantastic advice. You are one of my two favourite tennis coaches on RUclips and #1 for the serve. I just looked at a slow motion video of my serve and I am “guilty as charged”. I look forward on focusing on your tip to see what impact it can have on my serve. 😊
This is a great peace of advice. Realized this only when I watched my serve videos over and compared with pros. Great reminder. Thanks for making this much needed content.
Just been studying this and trying different practice drills from different videos. I put a ball in a long sock and practiced the ball swing drill in this video: "6 Drills For Improving A Shallow Drop In A Tennis Serve" (at 2:52). That's what so far seems to work best for me, to quickly build up the muscle memory for this movement.
2:14 Right vs wrong way comparison 4:22 How to practice the right way Thanks for this detailed instruction. I saved all 3 videos from you on the topic and will use them to work in this. Filmed myself and noticed the error.
The fact that you explained the source of that sharp drop behind the back is so golden. I have wondered WHY I do this and now I know not only why but how to fix it. Everywhere I go now it's like 'sixth sense' I see high elbow people.
Absolutely nailed that advice - great video. Its so easy to misunderstand the serve mechanics from half-serve to racket drop. I find that when the elbow bend is done correctly, the whole motion feels very fluid and effortless...you can feel the momentum take over.
This makes such a big difference in generating power. There are days when my serve is off and I couldn't figure out what the problem was. This was the main issue. Thank you!
great video, great tips to learn, plz i have a question about tennis court in your town, is free to play tennis there or it's a club you have to pay? how much?
Like winding up to throw a baseball. Great points! Looks as if the correct drop is away from the body as opposed to down the back. Is this a product of cocking (supinating) the hand full stop? Or from pointing the elbow forward?
Great video. i am aware of the racquet path on the serve. When you are a self taught player, sometimes you struggle and you are unable to diagnose on your own. As of late, I have struggled with power and consistency on my serve. This has broken down where I believe I am missing in the process. Also, dare I say, it seems like your explanation simplified the actual movement, which is great. Keep up the good work and thanks very much.
I am going to try this and then post a follow-up. A lot of pros stress the opposite of what you taught; that is keeping the elbow up high (yours is down) so that greater acceleration of the arm can be achieved by coming from a higher racket head position to complete a wheel of acceleration. But, I have seen pros with short swings (like you are advocating) that have gotten great results (e.g. roscoe tanner; andy roddick). I will let you know.
Ok, so I tried this and it works, with a caution. The elbo must still stay up even as your body tilts back onto the back foot. If the elbo drops down, you no longer have the trophy pose (no longer 90 degrees) and you lose power. Further, if the racket head is tilted too far behind the head, you interrupt the flow of the racket snapping down behind the back and lose speed/power. You lose power because you are forced to lift the racket head up again during the cartwheel rotation in which the racket head snaps down behind the back. If done correctly, I estimate that this tip adds 5-10% power, which is noticeable. But, I recommend several hopper practices to work this technique in properly. Thx James for the tip.
First-class video!👍I think that keeping the wrist bent inward and at the same time pointing the racket strings slightly upwards to the sky will do the trick and rectify this common problem. Raonic and Djokovic can be observed doing this on their serves. Starting with the edge of the racket facing directly upwards along with not having the wrist bent inwards encourages the wrong elbow move. I am not a tennis coach but I noticed this phenomenon on my serve, which makes all the difference. Relaxation and looseness are also guaranteed.🎾🎾🎾🔊🙂
There is a video from the inventor of the ServeMaster training device that helps correct the serve elbow-racket looping motions. The key is to not have a death grip to free up the wrist and to allow the momentum of the racket to do the work. Done correctly, the elbow bends naturally, just as you recommend. In lieu of the training device, you can try holding the butt of your tennis racket grip with just two fingers and thumb and work up to about 50% speed shadow swings in front of a mirror, focusing on making smooth hitch-free racket loops and accelerating smoothly from the coiled, loaded position. Then three fingers and thumb up to about 75% speed and power with shadow swings. Then full grip at full speed. If you regress and overtighten your grip and lose the smooth continuous looping accelerating motion, just fall back to the 2 or 3 finger training. My problem is inconsistent elbow draw back, which I remedy by imagining drawing a Kyudo bow for a snap shot at the ball. In traditional Japanese archery the draw hand goes behind and above the ear, similar to the trophy position. In archery the elbow is drawn back in line with the shoulders in a T-form. More flexible elite players draw the elbow beyond this T-form for extra coiling tension, but this might be too extreme for the rest of us.
Great tip, this is something that I have always wondered about with my serve. I see now I will have to work on getting a bit more bend in my elbow, thanks!
very good expplication!!!!! Thank you very much!!!!, could you please tell me where to throw the ball, it's always something I have a hard time with!!!, I'm a fan from Argentina, I greet you very cordially.
Hey! Thanks for the tip. I'm having exactly this type of problem -- the drop is shallow. With your technique I'm really scared to hit myself in the forehead -- as I almost did couple of time while trying to find the right angle of bending my elbow.
Great video!! I think this is going to help me get my old, good serve back. It went wrong when I started playing just clinics where there is no serving allowed.
Great tip! I'm just begining tô understand why my serve is só bad and I'm improving with the feel of bending the elbow. Even my smashes are better. Thank you very much.
Thank you, for this Excellent tip! I recorded myself and notice I have the same exact mistake in my serve. However, unfortunately it has become a muscles memory for me :( . How to unlearn this bad move?
This is great, one single element that makes or breaks it [for me]. I have the problem exactly at the elbow bending. Thanks a lot, will try shadow to gain new muscle memory right away.
Thank you for addressing this issue. I have been mistakenly moving the racket from right to left while maintaining approximately the same angle at the elbow, and could not understand why I couldn't accelerate the racket to the ball.
Another perhaps vital difference I see at 2:44 is that your elbow is stretched out and back from the chest as far as it can go, which seems not to be the case with the other fellow.
Yes i achieve a better shoulder and elbow alignment...that's great you were able to pick that up :) However, you want to be careful not too hyper extend the elbow and pull it too far back, that can put unnecessary stress on the shoulder.
Confused about something. Does the "right to left" movement end at the trophy position when the elbow angle is most closed ("hand over bicep")? And after that position is reached, what initiates the racquet drop and is the drop active (like the right to left movement) or passive as a result of leg drive, hip rotation, etc? Thank you.
Hello. Just wanted to say that your videos are great. I especially like video comparisons. And I wanted to compare my own videos in order to know what I should be working on. Could you please tell what software you use in order to make video like this one?
We were using Coachseye, but the app is being discontinued. However, I've heard there's another software players using which is called Onform. I hope this helps you :)
Thank you very much for the lesson.Been struggling for a long time for a proper raquet drop.Is it O.K. if I start with a half serve position ? Because I also have a low ball toss.
Thank you for the feedback! :) You can definitely isolate the swing and start from the half serve position initially. After time you can slowly progress it to a full service swing. But you can still hit a very good serve starting from the half serve position
Great advice! I noticed your hand remained over your right bicep as your shoulders rotate up to the ball. Am I correct? What should your feeling be, or what move do you make, after your hand arrives over your right bicep? Thanks again.
Thanks for the feedback Thomas :) Regarding your question, so after your hand arrives over your right bicep..you then begin to lead with the elbow. So the elbow will begin to move forward and upward and the racket falls down and away from the body. Check this video out for more details: ruclips.net/video/X3VInBD9wMU/видео.html
You want to almost think of it like a 'unit turn' that we reference for the groundstrokes. It will be a combination of turning the shoulders away from the target and a slight raising of the hitting elbow to get into that half serve position. I will take this into account and create a video on it for the future :)
@@OnlineTennisInstruction Appreciate it. It’s like the minor details such as how high elbow should be, hand and racket position, should be at level of elbow, below, etc. which is hard to get based on video. Will try it for now. Thanks!
Yes, i will create a video on this topic soon so we clarify this in more detail :) just a few quick tips, the elbow will be just below shoulder level approximately, the hand will be just below or on par with the elbow...you want to avoid having the hand too high (in the half serve position), and the tip of the racket will be pointing slightly down and towards the right side. Shoot me an email to florian@onlinetennisinstruction.com and i will send a quick image that highlights the position for you :)
@@OnlineTennisInstruction I would also be keen to see a video on how to break this movement skill down a little, in order to coach it properly to students. Thanks!
After bending does the elbow move towards ball from bottom of drop with that less angle then arm straighten, or does arm start straightening from bottom of drop
Thanks so much for this inciteful tip. I am pretty sure I am guilty and will begin the long process of breaking an ingrained habit. I personally was not successful in Gregg's first 30-day service challenge despite putting in the time. I am much better now, but it takes me a long time to modify incorrect technique. I am pretty sure you will suggest a thousand shadow swings. I would be interested in your advice on how to correct an incorrect swing path. I also have trouble with the toss and when I begin to focus on a piece of the swing, the problems with the toss are exacerbated. Do others have similar problems? Advice?
Thanks for the excellent feedback Frank! :) Yes those 2 problems...transitioning from the shadow swing to the ball and also combining the ball toss with the swing can be very challenging for players. The key is to build it up using micro-progressions. So let's say for example, you're working on the right to left action. First step is master it in the shadow swing slowly, once that's sufficient then you want to speed up the shadow swing so it replicates the regular timing and speed of your service swing. This will make the transition easier. After doing that in the shadow swing, then i would recommend using what we call a 'dummy ball toss'. This means you toss the ball up but don't hit it. Simply focus on executing the technique. What is this doing? it's training your brain to see the ball toss whilst still executing the new techniques. And then from there you can slowly continue to increase the difficulty and start attempting to hit the ball. But do your very best to make a conscious effort on focusing on executing the new mechanics, regardless of where the ball goes :)
Thanks for the feedback Steven! :) I'm based in Cardiff, Wales. If you're interested in private lessons you can send a direct email to florian@onlinetennisinstruction.com and we'll reach out to you :)
yes, you need to constantly film yourself during practice and check yourself after every few repetitions. Start with shadow swings, and when it works well with shadow swings, then move on and start to hit a ball, but not trying to hit it into the service box… Against the wall is ideal. Only when that works consistently, then do you advance and try to do it adding a regular serve into the service box. Throughout all the stages constantly films And check that you were doing it correctly before moving on to the next stage
Is it okay to not decrease the elbow angle of 90 degrees if you do not break at the elbow like James showed? In other words can you still perform a full service motion right to left with a 90 degree angle at the elbow or is that going to be detrimental either in loss of power and or risk of injury
In terms of the ‘Actual timing’ when do I bend my elbow? Assume my ball toss is within the normal accepted height James, when do I commence the elbow bend? This is something I struggle with?
Thanks for the message John :) The general guideline is, you want to be initiating the right to left arm action from that half serve position just after you release the ball. So think to yourself, release the ball first and then bend from the elbow to begin the right to left motion.
The racquet drop should be initiated at trophy position, when the upper arm and forearm form a roughly 90 degree angle, i.e. 90 degree elbow flexion. The common error is to arrive at trophy position with too much of a straight arm and begin the elbow flexion too late (when hitting arm has already dropped behind the back). Is that the idea?
The best server ever Sampras does exactly what you’re saying shouldn’t be done! Never bends the elbow beyond 90 degrees ( yours bends almost 45 degrees ) and his racket head doesn’t travel close to his head at all. Interestingly enough though one of the greatest servers ever Kyrgios does very similar to what you’re saying.😀
Thanks for the feedback Yucel :) Yes for example, Sampras doesn't decrease the angle in the arm as much...but he still bends at the elbow at the correct time to get the racket moving in a right to left manner over his head. So there are definitely variant degrees to this that can still work. But we've found the most effective way to teach club players this movement is to practice what we reference in the video. As we say "there is no right or wrong way...there's simply an efficient and inefficient way'. If you have any further question Yucel please let me know :)
I'm curious what region you're from, as some of your pronunciations remind me of aspects of American Appalachian / Southern accents, as distinct from New England, Midwestern and Middle Atlantic accents. I believe the Appalachian and Southern areas were mainly settled by Celts -- the Welsh, Scots, and Northern Irish, whereas the other regions were settled early by the English, the Dutch, Germans and Scandinavians.
@Online Tennis Instruction I just saw your other vids in one of them you just had mentioned Cardiff. Otherwise I can't tell for sure. Still puzzled why this was raised in the vid re. the serve. Good luck
In my case, I have a classic "waiter's tray" issue in which my palm opens up and the strings face the sky. During shadow swings without the ball, I can easily recreate the racquet drop on edge but when the ball strike is involved, it all goes to 💩
The elbow bend isn’t the key. In fact, it may be causing your low elbow flaw. Bending the elbow too much is basically the old scratch the back concept. It is about the timing of the forearm supination. If the forearm supinates the elbow can remain at or close to 90 degrees and you’ll be in a stronger position at the bottom of the racquet drop.
@@OnlineTennisInstruction Now all you need to do is come up with a full proof method for explaining how to time the racquet drop with a correct 60/40 back/front leg drive. 😂🤣😂🤣😂 Then you will be the serving coach genius. P.S. And after you have walked on water and turned it into wine, find a way to have students value a good ball toss so they execute that consistently well enough to take advantage of all these great serve tips. 🤣🤣🤣🤣🤣
It is impossible to control when you “break your elbow” on a serve as its one synched motion. Does a baseball or football player think of “when to break their elbow” when throwing ? Rick in your video simply just doesn’t have the shoulder flexibility, and his body is moving before his arm - his “kinetic chain” is slightly off
![I.N "HALLUCINATION" | [Stray Kids : SKZ-PLAYER]](http://i.ytimg.com/vi/n5B5q1Hwt_U/mqdefault.jpg)
Muchas gracias! Gran video! Saludos desde Argentina!
I’m discovering this action with great success. For those who really struggle with serve please note that the focus here is on shoulder and elbow. Relax everything else - no wrist action required until your phase with hitting the ball
Fantastic advice. You are one of my two favourite tennis coaches on RUclips and #1 for the serve. I just looked at a slow motion video of my serve and I am “guilty as charged”. I look forward on focusing on your tip to see what impact it can have on my serve. 😊
I have this exact problem on my serve, thanks for the video, gonna try to improve that
This is a great peace of advice. Realized this only when I watched my serve videos over and compared with pros. Great reminder. Thanks for making this much needed content.
thanks for the kind feedback!! :)
Just been studying this and trying different practice drills from different videos. I put a ball in a long sock and practiced the ball swing drill in this video: "6 Drills For Improving A Shallow Drop In A Tennis Serve" (at 2:52). That's what so far seems to work best for me, to quickly build up the muscle memory for this movement.
2:14 Right vs wrong way comparison
4:22 How to practice the right way
Thanks for this detailed instruction. I saved all 3 videos from you on the topic and will use them to work in this. Filmed myself and noticed the error.
The fact that you explained the source of that sharp drop behind the back is so golden. I have wondered WHY I do this and now I know not only why but how to fix it. Everywhere I go now it's like 'sixth sense' I see high elbow people.
Absolutely nailed that advice - great video. Its so easy to misunderstand the serve mechanics from half-serve to racket drop. I find that when the elbow bend is done correctly, the whole motion feels very fluid and effortless...you can feel the momentum take over.
Exactly right!! getting this movement right can totally transform your whole motion :) thanks for the feedback
I love how you teach
This is a terrific tip I definitely think I’m guilty of improper elbow position. Thanks!
Federer is a good example of this. Thanks.
This makes such a big difference in generating power. There are days when my serve is off and I couldn't figure out what the problem was. This was the main issue. Thank you!
This is great video! You address issue so hidden, yet so important!
Hello, This is the best tip I have ever had in tennis serve. Thanks
Best ever tennis Lesson on serve.Thanks immensely
Respect for the lad training his serve while its snowing!
Yes Robert is one dedicated student :)
great video, great tips to learn,
plz i have a question about tennis court in your town, is free to play tennis there or it's a club you have to pay? how much?
You have solved my high elbow in this short video. Thanks so much
Perfect, 4.3 player and you just made me a 4.5 71 year old!!
Very useful. I’ve seen many videos talking about servers, but rarely focused on this tip. It is the same technique with ‘the birthday hat’ from Ryan.
Like winding up to throw a baseball. Great points! Looks as if the correct drop is away from the body as opposed to down the back. Is this a product of cocking (supinating) the hand full stop? Or from pointing the elbow forward?
Fantastic tip, you really are helpful. Thank you.
Thank you this clarification was important for me. Did it the same way as your student.
Good tips James
Excellent, I could totally see myself in your student's action!!
excellent David :)
Great video. i am aware of the racquet path on the serve. When you are a self taught player, sometimes you struggle and you are unable to diagnose on your own. As of late, I have struggled with power and consistency on my serve. This has broken down where I believe I am missing in the process. Also, dare I say, it seems like your explanation simplified the actual movement, which is great. Keep up the good work and thanks very much.
awesome!! i'm happy the video helped you. please keep us updated on your progress :)
Thanks a lot 👍
do we lift the racquet with the forearm will create bend in arm or we deliberately bend arm?thanks for your videos and explanation
I am going to try this and then post a follow-up. A lot of pros stress the opposite of what you taught; that is keeping the elbow up high (yours is down) so that greater acceleration of the arm can be achieved by coming from a higher racket head position to complete a wheel of acceleration. But, I have seen pros with short swings (like you are advocating) that have gotten great results (e.g. roscoe tanner; andy roddick). I will let you know.
Ok, so I tried this and it works, with a caution. The elbo must still stay up even as your body tilts back onto the back foot. If the elbo drops down, you no longer have the trophy pose (no longer 90 degrees) and you lose power. Further, if the racket head is tilted too far behind the head, you interrupt the flow of the racket snapping down behind the back and lose speed/power. You lose power because you are forced to lift the racket head up again during the cartwheel rotation in which the racket head snaps down behind the back. If done correctly, I estimate that this tip adds 5-10% power, which is noticeable. But, I recommend several hopper practices to work this technique in properly. Thx James for the tip.
First-class video!👍I think that keeping the wrist bent inward and at the same time pointing the racket strings slightly upwards to the sky will do the trick and rectify this common problem. Raonic and Djokovic can be observed doing this on their serves. Starting with the edge of the racket facing directly upwards along with not having the wrist bent inwards encourages the wrong elbow move. I am not a tennis coach but I noticed this phenomenon on my serve, which makes all the difference. Relaxation and looseness are also guaranteed.🎾🎾🎾🔊🙂
Great instruction. I’ve been doing it all wrong. Will try tomorrow
Amazing Instructor!!!!
This was a killer video. Nicely done. It can be so hart to figure this out just on your own!
Love it. Such a simple and effective method to improve the serve. Many thanks for this video
thanks for the feedback :)
There is a video from the inventor of the ServeMaster training device that helps correct the serve elbow-racket looping motions. The key is to not have a death grip to free up the wrist and to allow the momentum of the racket to do the work. Done correctly, the elbow bends naturally, just as you recommend. In lieu of the training device, you can try holding the butt of your tennis racket grip with just two fingers and thumb and work up to about 50% speed shadow swings in front of a mirror, focusing on making smooth hitch-free racket loops and accelerating smoothly from the coiled, loaded position. Then three fingers and thumb up to about 75% speed and power with shadow swings. Then full grip at full speed. If you regress and overtighten your grip and lose the smooth continuous looping accelerating motion, just fall back to the 2 or 3 finger training. My problem is inconsistent elbow draw back, which I remedy by imagining drawing a Kyudo bow for a snap shot at the ball. In traditional Japanese archery the draw hand goes behind and above the ear, similar to the trophy position. In archery the elbow is drawn back in line with the shoulders in a T-form. More flexible elite players draw the elbow beyond this T-form for extra coiling tension, but this might be too extreme for the rest of us.
Spot on! Thanks for this.
thanks for the feedback Richard :)
Great tip, this is something that I have always wondered about with my serve. I see now I will have to work on getting a bit more bend in my elbow, thanks!
Awesome...thanks for the feedback Kirk :)
very good expplication!!!!! Thank you very much!!!!, could you please tell me where to throw the ball, it's always something I have a hard time with!!!, I'm a fan from Argentina, I greet you very cordially.
james you had a video on the serve that addressed keeping your chin up during the serve (quiet eye) I haven't been able to find it is it still posted?
Hey! Thanks for the tip. I'm having exactly this type of problem -- the drop is shallow. With your technique I'm really scared to hit myself in the forehead -- as I almost did couple of time while trying to find the right angle of bending my elbow.
Great video!! I think this is going to help me get my old, good serve back. It went wrong when I started playing just clinics where there is no serving allowed.
Awesome Ken :) please keep us updated on your progress
Excellent. Very valuable tip about the 🎾 tip!
thanks for the feedback :)
This is GREAT stuff! You really know what you are talking about.
Great tip! I'm just begining tô understand why my serve is só bad and I'm improving with the feel of bending the elbow. Even my smashes are better. Thank you very much.
That's great to hear :) thank you for your feedback
Perfect video. Very very useful and important. Thanks.
Great instruction, maestro 👍
Great instruction, never seen this explained anywhere else. Thank you
Thank you Christopher for the feedback :)
Thank you, for this Excellent tip! I recorded myself and notice I have the same exact mistake in my serve. However, unfortunately it has become a muscles memory for me :( . How to unlearn this bad move?
Great tip ! Thank you
Great explanation! Very useful!
great tip James
Thank you Rudy for the feedback! :)
This is great, one single element that makes or breaks it [for me]. I have the problem exactly at the elbow bending. Thanks a lot, will try shadow to gain new muscle memory right away.
Yes this one is a common problem for many people...so i'm happy this video has helped you :) thank you for the feedback
Great great way to explain it from the don't and the proper 👏👏☑
Thank you for addressing this issue. I have been mistakenly moving the racket from right to left while maintaining approximately the same angle at the elbow, and could not understand why I couldn't accelerate the racket to the ball.
No problem Alex :) thanks for the feedback
Great tip.
Thanks for the feedback Vincent :)
@@OnlineTennisInstruction not only does it help the racket drop, but it also fixes extension problems.
Another good tip. Will work on it. Thanks.
Thanks for the feedback Harold :)
Thanks,great help as always. The bottle trick was a big eye opener for me. Can't wait to practice this one!
Awesome Leon! :) thank you and keep us posted on how it goes when trying this serve tip
Great explanation, James! Very helpful advice!
Great to hear from you John! thanks for the feedback :)
Really a great video on a serve nuance that can be overlooked. Thanks.
Thanks for the feedback Richard! :)
Another perhaps vital difference I see at 2:44 is that your elbow is stretched out and back from the chest as far as it can go, which seems not to be the case with the other fellow.
Yes i achieve a better shoulder and elbow alignment...that's great you were able to pick that up :) However, you want to be careful not too hyper extend the elbow and pull it too far back, that can put unnecessary stress on the shoulder.
Also, these movements are occurring in a split second, so how do you suggest drilling for the correct right to left movement?
Great tip!!!!
Confused about something. Does the "right to left" movement end at the trophy position when the elbow angle is most closed ("hand over bicep")? And after that position is reached, what initiates the racquet drop and is the drop active (like the right to left movement) or passive as a result of leg drive, hip rotation, etc? Thank you.
A good tip that helped me was to imagine you are wearing one of those birthday party cone hats and knocking it off your head with the racquet.
Very cool tip
Thanks for the feedback Benny :)
Hello. Just wanted to say that your videos are great. I especially like video comparisons. And I wanted to compare my own videos in order to know what I should be working on. Could you please tell what software you use in order to make video like this one?
We were using Coachseye, but the app is being discontinued. However, I've heard there's another software players using which is called Onform. I hope this helps you :)
Thank you very much for the lesson.Been struggling for a long time for a proper raquet drop.Is it O.K. if I start with a half serve position ? Because I also have a low ball toss.
Thank you for the feedback! :) You can definitely isolate the swing and start from the half serve position initially. After time you can slowly progress it to a full service swing. But you can still hit a very good serve starting from the half serve position
Great advice! I noticed your hand remained over your right bicep as your shoulders rotate up to the ball. Am I correct? What should your feeling be, or what move do you make, after your hand arrives over your right bicep?
Thanks again.
Thanks for the feedback Thomas :) Regarding your question, so after your hand arrives over your right bicep..you then begin to lead with the elbow. So the elbow will begin to move forward and upward and the racket falls down and away from the body. Check this video out for more details: ruclips.net/video/X3VInBD9wMU/видео.html
This tip helped me but one might be confused given how far out some tennis pros swing the arm before bending it inward.
Great tip!
thanks for the feedback! :)
Do you also give real life serve training/workshops?
Good video, what is the best way to reach that half serve position however? That seems to be my main issue. thanks
You want to almost think of it like a 'unit turn' that we reference for the groundstrokes. It will be a combination of turning the shoulders away from the target and a slight raising of the hitting elbow to get into that half serve position. I will take this into account and create a video on it for the future :)
@@OnlineTennisInstruction Appreciate it. It’s like the minor details such as how high elbow should be, hand and racket position, should be at level of elbow, below, etc. which is hard to get based on video. Will try it for now. Thanks!
Yes, i will create a video on this topic soon so we clarify this in more detail :) just a few quick tips, the elbow will be just below shoulder level approximately, the hand will be just below or on par with the elbow...you want to avoid having the hand too high (in the half serve position), and the tip of the racket will be pointing slightly down and towards the right side. Shoot me an email to florian@onlinetennisinstruction.com and i will send a quick image that highlights the position for you :)
@@OnlineTennisInstruction will do! Thanks
@@OnlineTennisInstruction I would also be keen to see a video on how to break this movement skill down a little, in order to coach it properly to students. Thanks!
After bending does the elbow move towards ball from bottom of drop with that less angle then arm straighten, or does arm start straightening from bottom of drop
Thanks for the Great video coach!!!
No problem Omar :)
Strong tips....
Thanks so much for this inciteful tip. I am pretty sure I am guilty and will begin the long process of breaking an ingrained habit. I personally was not successful in Gregg's first 30-day service challenge despite putting in the time. I am much better now, but it takes me a long time to modify incorrect technique. I am pretty sure you will suggest a thousand shadow swings. I would be interested in your advice on how to correct an incorrect swing path. I also have trouble with the toss and when I begin to focus on a piece of the swing, the problems with the toss are exacerbated. Do others have similar problems? Advice?
Thanks for the excellent feedback Frank! :) Yes those 2 problems...transitioning from the shadow swing to the ball and also combining the ball toss with the swing can be very challenging for players. The key is to build it up using micro-progressions.
So let's say for example, you're working on the right to left action. First step is master it in the shadow swing slowly, once that's sufficient then you want to speed up the shadow swing so it replicates the regular timing and speed of your service swing. This will make the transition easier.
After doing that in the shadow swing, then i would recommend using what we call a 'dummy ball toss'. This means you toss the ball up but don't hit it. Simply focus on executing the technique. What is this doing? it's training your brain to see the ball toss whilst still executing the new techniques. And then from there you can slowly continue to increase the difficulty and start attempting to hit the ball.
But do your very best to make a conscious effort on focusing on executing the new mechanics, regardless of where the ball goes :)
Thank you!
Brilliant
👏👏👏
Where does James coach? Surely gotta be somewhere in UK, I'd love to get on court with him and for him to sort my serve out.
Thanks for the feedback Steven! :) I'm based in Cardiff, Wales. If you're interested in private lessons you can send a direct email to florian@onlinetennisinstruction.com and we'll reach out to you :)
I have this problem and been trying to fix it, but i always revert back to the wider elbow angle. Any advice would be great.
yes, you need to constantly film yourself during practice and check yourself after every few repetitions. Start with shadow swings, and when it works well with shadow swings, then move on and start to hit a ball, but not trying to hit it into the service box… Against the wall is ideal. Only when that works consistently, then do you advance and try to do it adding a regular serve into the service box. Throughout all the stages constantly films And check that you were doing it correctly before moving on to the next stage
Great stuff👏👏👍
Thank you Ronnie :)
Is it okay to not decrease the elbow angle of 90 degrees if you do not break at the elbow like James showed? In other words can you still perform a full service motion right to left with a 90 degree angle at the elbow or is that going to be detrimental either in loss of power and or risk of injury
Wow...appreciate the detail!!!
Thanks for the feedback Kenneth :)
very good!
In terms of the ‘Actual timing’ when do I bend my elbow? Assume my ball toss is within the normal accepted height James, when do I commence the elbow bend? This is something I struggle with?
Thanks for the message John :) The general guideline is, you want to be initiating the right to left arm action from that half serve position just after you release the ball. So think to yourself, release the ball first and then bend from the elbow to begin the right to left motion.
The racquet drop should be initiated at trophy position, when the upper arm and forearm form a roughly 90 degree angle, i.e. 90 degree elbow flexion. The common error is to arrive at trophy position with too much of a straight arm and begin the elbow flexion too late (when hitting arm has already dropped behind the back). Is that the idea?
Gracias
So the elbow should be low, not high as is depicted in the “trophy position”??? Thanks for anyone’s feedback on this.
Props to the student for serving in snow!!!!
Yep Robert is one dedicated student that's for sure :)
Thanks!!!
The best server ever Sampras does exactly what you’re saying shouldn’t be done! Never bends the elbow beyond 90 degrees ( yours bends almost 45 degrees ) and his racket head doesn’t travel close to his head at all. Interestingly enough though one of the greatest servers ever Kyrgios does very similar to what you’re saying.😀
Thanks for the feedback Yucel :) Yes for example, Sampras doesn't decrease the angle in the arm as much...but he still bends at the elbow at the correct time to get the racket moving in a right to left manner over his head. So there are definitely variant degrees to this that can still work. But we've found the most effective way to teach club players this movement is to practice what we reference in the video. As we say "there is no right or wrong way...there's simply an efficient and inefficient way'. If you have any further question Yucel please let me know :)
Gonna try this, I’ve been practicing serve every day for 2 years and it’s becoming frustrating because idk what I’m doing wrong
hi, Why does my racket hitting my left leg after serving?
I'm curious what region you're from, as some of your pronunciations remind me of aspects of American Appalachian / Southern accents, as distinct from New England, Midwestern and Middle Atlantic accents. I believe the Appalachian and Southern areas were mainly settled by Celts -- the Welsh, Scots, and Northern Irish, whereas the other regions were settled early by the English, the Dutch, Germans and Scandinavians.
Cardiff, Wales I guess. Why? Puzzled
Yes i'm from Cardiff, Wales :) Sometimes my accent is hard to identify...it has become more of a hybrid haha.
@Online Tennis Instruction I just saw your other vids in one of them you just had mentioned Cardiff. Otherwise I can't tell for sure. Still puzzled why this was raised in the vid re. the serve. Good luck
In my case, I have a classic "waiter's tray" issue in which my palm opens up and the strings face the sky. During shadow swings without the ball, I can easily recreate the racquet drop on edge but when the ball strike is involved, it all goes to 💩
The elbow bend isn’t the key. In fact, it may be causing your low elbow flaw. Bending the elbow too much is basically the old scratch the back concept. It is about the timing of the forearm supination. If the forearm supinates the elbow can remain at or close to 90 degrees and you’ll be in a stronger position at the bottom of the racquet drop.
good stuff
Very good explanation James
Thank you for the feedback :)
@@OnlineTennisInstruction Now all you need to do is come up with a full proof method for explaining how to time the racquet drop with a correct 60/40 back/front leg drive. 😂🤣😂🤣😂
Then you will be the serving coach genius.
P.S. And after you have walked on water and turned it into wine, find a way to have students value a good ball toss so they execute that consistently well enough to take advantage of all these great serve tips. 🤣🤣🤣🤣🤣
It is impossible to control when you “break your elbow” on a serve as its one synched motion. Does a baseball or football player think of “when to break their elbow” when throwing ? Rick in your video simply just doesn’t have the shoulder flexibility, and his body is moving before his arm - his “kinetic chain” is slightly off