Secrets of the Merseyrail - Part 2
HTML-код
- Опубликовано: 5 окт 2024
- Once again, inspired by Geoff Marshall's "Secrets Of" series, and thanks to several comments on last video, I bring you the long awaited sequel; Secrets of the Merseyrail 2!
Twitter: @NickBadley
Fun Fact: The Seacombe branch (technically) still exists in almost it’s full entirety. If you look to the right after passing Birkenhead North TMD on the New Brighton line, you can still see the heavily rusted (and partially submerged) tracks follow along the curve, before then splitting off and disappearing into bushes and swampland. If you look on satellite imagery though, you can still see that those tracks keep going all the way to Seacombe, which always fascinated me as a kid.
Another good video Nick. I thoroughly approve of any video that showcases our often neglected Merseyrail history. If only certain parties recognised the heritage they have on their own system
Very informative videos .. You certainly have done your homework Nick.. I worked on Merseyrail for 25 years (16 yrs. Booking offices and 9 years as a train guard) and your showing me stuff that I never knew before !!
Green Lane Station served the Cammel Laird shipyard, which was a large employer in the 1960s. My Dad worked there and took the train one stop from Rock Ferry where we lived. The incline towards Green Lane was marked out in miles & chains - I wonder if those distance markers still exist?
Another fact for the Southport to Hunts Cross line, Starting from Bank Hall, there are old, abandoned platforms at Bank Hall, Bootle Oriel Road and Bootle New Strand before the tracks turn and go over using a bridge which you can access by a hill but its fenced off. The line curves off Hunts Cross to Southport line and then connects with Aintree to Ormskirk. Also, you can see at the end of the Southport Platform heading towards Bootle Oriel Road, they've threw a station sign for Bootle New Strand. And one more. Like Seaforth and Litherland, Bootle New Strand use to have the same ramp as Seaforth And Litherland. Which is now closed because of the ww2 destroyed nearby as the ramp access was used for hiding people away from the war.
Otterspool was a good station and still has a station house, that is a house now on a road marked unadopted in otterspool Park. Good video mate. That was boss watching that.
In around 2002 I gained a few weeks' work experience with an engineering firm called Bullen, on the Woodside Business Park in Birkenhead. One of the jobs I got to work on was the design and construction of a pedestrian footbridge over a section of the disused Seacombe branch line that is located just behind B&Q and next to Bidston Moss tip. The engineers there told me how they were surprised when they were given the specification to learn that the bridge was to be built unusually tall, for they'll be running double-decker trains. Now I think I remember freight trains running along to the docks there in the 90s (supplying iron ore to Shotton steel works, I believe), but what would Network Rail (or Railtrack, as it might've been at the time) have wanted the footbridge built high enough for double-decker trains to run along a disused section of track for? I'd love to know. The bridge got built, is still there today. goo.gl/maps/XUtmSC3j8eczgj3r6 and streetview goo.gl/maps/sniAuxPYKGBLKea57
After the 1938 electrification, the LMS no longer served Seacombe so you ended up with an LMS station, staffed by LMS personnel and only LNER trains. Much of the trackbed is the approach road for the new Mersey Tunnel. To confuse things, there is a road in Liscard called Station Road but no station for at least two miles
The bit you showed as remains of the Seacombe Branch are actually part of the dock line to what used to be Bidston Dock. If you would have carried on walking about half a mile to Mill Lane or Breck Road you would come to the new tunnel approach roads which is the the line of the Seacombe Branch.
Do you know when it was that trains stopped running along that section of line that joins between B&Q and Bidston Moss? I worked briefly in around 2002 on the design and construction of a footbridge of that line that was supposed to give enough clearance for double-decker trains. I've not see anthing run along that line since the 90s, so I've never understood why.
Hamilton Square has a staircase which you can access. I like going there because it’s so quiet and desolate, you literally can’t hear a thing there.
However when you get to the surface it’s on the opposite side of the ticket gates which is awkward
The stairs get pretty cramped a lot of people use them (like when the lifts are off).
Hamilton Square also has a disused foot tunnel that exits on to Shore Road, too.
@@hybridmodulation9386 Is that through the yellow doors next to the Cheshire Lines Building? I've often wondered if those 'Merseyrail yellow' doors offered access to the underground.
Yes, that's right
Great video, missed the other abandoned station on the wirral chester line at ledsham. Closed in 1959, I think some parts of the platforms are still there but some were demolished when the Welsh road was realigned.
The station house is still there though, facing the yeoman pub.
Thank you so much for this brilliant video. I’ve learnt so much about a service I’ve used so many times in my life but I knew nothing about.
The new Liverpool Baltic station is to be semi-underground. A part of the station will be in a tunnel, the rest in a deep cutting. Similar to Green Lane and Conway Park, Birkenhead, where stations are underground being open to the atmosphere.
This is the first time that I have come across your channel and found it very interesting and informative. As a follower of Simon on Trains and Geoff Marshall and Let's Make a Trip you are right up there with them all and i do find that you are very well spoken and it's lovely that you acknowledge the fact that you have made a mistake during the video and go back again to put it right! Best wishes to you sir and keep up with your excellent filming 👍
5:05 - Someone leaving the tip and forgetting to do something before setting off
That was my favorite bit. I wonder how far he got home before noticing the extra ventilation.
dont know if youll see this comment since the videos a year old now, but i thought id add some stuff ive noticed travelling the ellesmere port line daily
at port sunlight station on the platform travelling towards chester and ellesmere port, you can see a section of an old platform that wasnt removed and some old tracks just before stopping at the station
at ellesmere port station about halfway towards overpool, you can see the track split onto a different unused section that leads towards the boat museum and docks - i dont think any trains use it anymore since sections of it are covered by roads and bushes when looking on google maps, but i assume they were used to transport cargo to the docks
also on ellesmere port, it used to be called whitby locks before the name changed in 1870 and fun fact: twice a day (once in the morning once in the evening from monday to saturday) trains run further past ellesmere port, travelling to helsby in the morning and further to liverpool lime street in the evening, going through the unused station stanlow and thornton, helsby, runcorn and warrington bank quay
on some of the bromborough based stations (cant remember which ones specifically off the top of my head) you can see bits of old tracks too, as well as the bridges going over the tracks having a second arch going over the tracks
still on the topic of extra tracks, just before entering green lane from rock ferry you can see 3(?) sets of unused old tracks as well as a really nice view of liverpool over the mersey :)
finally, though this ones not really as cool as the others, just before entering james street from liverpool central, if youre sitting at the very front of the train and look closely you can actually catch a glimpse of where the tracks split for the new brighton and west kirby services - also on certain trains in the morning theyre timed so that just before you enter james street when travelling towards liverpool central you can see a train going the opposite way (towards you) before the train youre on speeds up and enters james street
sorry for the super long comment! if you ever revisit this series (can you call it a series when it only has two parts?) itd be awesome to see you check some of these out if they spark your interest at all :)
Another (kind of) secret is that the trains used to trip the lighting while in the tunnel and that Moorfields and Liverpool Central tunnels do have lighting.
Awesome video, love the secrets that Merseyrail has to offer
Very interesting to learn about underground railways outside London!
Also - my aunt used to live in Maghull.
Very nice secrets of Merseyrail video Nick, love learning about the secrets of various different railway lines. Also I've been passed the abandoned Upton by chester station myself. :)
I can't recall seeing New Brighton station, I visitied this town in my childhood, I recall the weather was not so good (cool & foggy) and have a photo somewhere to prove it. I also felt shortchanged as I was looking for the mini electric railway (as found in Brighton in Sussex!)
Interesting to learn about the Seacombe branch of the Mersey Rly. Would I be right in thinking this follows the route of what is now the A59 cutting from the 'new tunnel' (as we still call it!) to the M53 flyover at Bidston?
I believe so, yes!
Yes, that’s correct.
The approach to the new tunnel used the Seacombe branch from about BreckRd to just past the Wheatland Rd bridge.
My brothers and I used to play in the abandoned line cuttings when we were kids. The contractors who built the tunnel even nicked our playground swings on St Paul’s Rd as a site office.
@@NickBadley extend Blackpool tram to Preston🎉
Frank Hornby is also buried in Maghull in the parish church, I think St Andrew's. I was baptised there too!
I was a signalman on Merseyrail. Starting at Green Lane (freight line signalbox, 1984) ending up at Hall Road (1991). Can you do a story on the freight line from Rock Ferry. Through Green Lane and Morpeth sheds, Four Bridges to Birkenhead North?
As a kid, I was fascinated by the level crossing at the eastern end of Corporation Road. I always hoped there would be a train coming and we'd have to stop and wait, but there never was. It was a shame when they changed the road there a few years ago and resurfaced it. Now there are no rails to run across, but on one side there is still part of the old barrier and warning lights. I'd love to see that line open again.
He desevers 3.22M subs not 3.22K subs. He has made me so interested in trains recently.
Something else about Moorfields that I know Nick, the long walk and deep escalators to the Wirral line, from the ticket office or Northern Line, is because of the Queensway Road tunnel; the Northern Line is above it, the Wirral line below it!
I remember using the Merseyrail at Central Station when the mainline station was open, the inbound trains came in and everyone got off, then the train went into the tunnel past sprung points, then came back on the opposite platform.
I remember getting the train to Bidston, the station of which was in the middle of a field, crossing over the railway bridge and waiting for the steam trains to pass underneath, then crossing the fields to Bidston hill.
When the Ellesmere Port branch was electrified it terminated there because the line went through the oil refinery and they were afraid of the sparks produced, next to the Hrlsby bound platform they made provision for a rail for a diesel train to Helsby so commuters wouldn't have to cross platforms but they then said they couldn't afford the money to change the tracks and put in signalling, it then became a parliamentary line with 2 trains early morning and 2 returns in the evening, this end reduced further although the train went directly to Leeds and back. Cheshire West and Chester along with Merseyrail wanted to reinstate the line using the battery trains but the government has rejected the bid as there is no call for the service, well there is no service to use and people from Ellesmere Port and Ince and Elton have to drive to Helsby to get the train to Manchester, there was talk of demolishing a historic building to create more car parking,
With Cheshire Oaks nearby, reinstating this service and using a shuttle bus would help with traffic congestion in the area.
The congestion at the Oaks isn't that bad - there is barely ever any congestion in Ellesmere Port.
If I was spending money, I'd extend the M53 motorway that ends near Chester - currently people and goods in the Wirral, Chester (including the Eastern boroughs), and North Wales, all have to drive up to Manchester before they can join the M6 - I'd extend the M53 to join with the M6 near Stoke.
The amount of fuel and time, this would save, would be massive.
@@garyphisher7375 I live in the Port and the congestion around the Oaks can get bad.
@@peterbrown1012 Usually only on Saturdays and Bank Holidays. The other times it is congested, it clears up quite quickly.
I'm from the Port though I've moved away recently.
Great video.
Between Hooton & Chester you did miss out Ledsham, which is still quite visible as a former station. (former Mollington station is along there too, before Upton)
Brilliant Nick, really enjoyed this. Keep smashing out the content mate.
Extra fact. Hightown (my hometown) has a disused station that was used solely for the rifle range there.
Back at James Street eh? Btw SCR is getting an extension. Beyond James Street, the revamped airport zone. And a mesh body upgrade for the class 360
Ahhh, I have fond memories of Birkenhead Park. Specifically of one occasion where, as a trainee, I was used as target practice by an air rifle enthusiast, whilst cleaning the aspects on a semaphore signal. (Yes, I am that old.) Also, the Mersey railway tunnel is one of the spookiest places I’ve ever walked through.
Once, on my way from Heswall via Bidston, a local man tried to nick my new bicycle off me at Birkenhead North. I'd been waiting for a New Brighton train with my school mates. I kept hold of my bike, but ever since then, for New Brighton trains, I've changed at Birkenhead Park. I never had any problems with air rifle enthusiasts, thankfully.
I'm from Liverpool so don't know the Wirral Stations that well but was going a pub near Hamilton Square and the stairs were open so I thought I'd walk up. What a mistake that was, felt like there was about 100 flights of stairs.
is no one gonna talk about the car driving with the open trunk at 5:07
Im sure i remember some sort of bridge that crossed the new cheser road towards camel lairds. i think it must have gone into the yard?.
1:41 Thats an unusually clean window... 2:08 Oh, Back to normal
I’ve done a video with very similar secrets to these, however I lost the file so unfortunately could never upload it. So, I am grateful someone has made it public! Great video Nick. Do you mind me sharing this with the Merseyrail enthusiast community group?
Don't mind at all! Go ahead! And that's a shame to hear about the file :(
@@NickBadley It was, my MacBook cloud had broken and Apple couldn’t recover it.
@@NickBadley Thanks!
@@NickBadley Shared :)
You haven't been on Central platform much then, its always packed whenever am down there
Two episodes whole and you didn't get to Ellesmere Port. How could you have missed that!
Great video, would you di a video on the Liverpool overhead railway?
It would be great to have a preston or warrington train, both are quite industrial places which might have a lot of work commuters both ways!
The Seacombe branch was closed and the cutting was used for the m53 motorway connection to the kingsway tunnel
Just wanted to let you know the L in Skelmersdale is silent so you say “Skemersdale”
Great video nick. If you’re looking for video ideas, you should cover why you can only use physical tickets on the Mersey rail network and how they seem to refuse to adapt to accepting digital ones. I know it might be a little bit political but it could be an interesting topic.
Merseyrail are planning to introduce a “tap and go” later this year (2024) using dedicated cards. Sometime next year (2025) they are planning to extend that to credit/debit cards, smart phones etc.
2:25 I use central everyday and didnt know about those portals
I can confirm, Geoff has seen this video 😂
Wow, that was fast 😳
@@NickBadley You're welcome 😂 I tagged him on Twitter
Thank you for doing this for a second time now haha
As like a Yt Short can you discuss anything about Bebbington because if i recall correctly i dont think you have said anything abt it so. Please :D
Bebington & Port Sunlight are worth mentioning for the Leverhume Estate & Lever factory. Like Bournville & Saltaire, this was a worker's village. The Lady Lever art gallery is worth a visit to see the ceramics and art collections.
Where's my Halewood Merseyrail connection?! 😭 I wanna be able to visit me na!
It's a shame the network can't be expanded due to regulations regarding building new 3rd rail track (that being: you can't), since it always seemed silly that the network went to places as far as Chester and Southport, but not reasonably large towns like Halewood within Liverpool itself!
On that topic, it would also be nice to re-open the North Mersey branch as a heritage line running one or two 507/8 stock and maybe even the surviving 502 unit? Since we can't build 3rd rail, this scouser can only dream...
You should also consider covering the North Mersey Branch in a potential part 3, as well as the entrance to the network at Bootle Jn, and Bootle Oriel Road's abandoned platforms / tracks (they're all right next to each other, too!). The abandoned platform at Aintree? How about the abandoned tunnel at Kirkdale, or the abandoned rail bridges near Rice Lane / Walton? There's always the LOR railway things too, like the Dingle tunnel portal near Brunswick station... or does that not count?
That is interesting. Third rails have never actually been a problem for me. I know to not walk on them. I wish they would have electrified Bidston to Shotton. As a kid, I felt so cut off from my mates on the north and east of the peninsula. I wanted to be able to take the train to Liverpool from Heswall with my BMX bike.
People who sold the car with no boot closed 5:07
Good video Nick. I've got to ask : why do you refer to it as 'the' Merseyrail? I've never heard it referred to as that.
'The Asda', on the other hand...
Honestly, mainly just consistency reasons. 😂
Since secrets videos typically start with "Secrets of the.."
I dunno if it's unnecessary, but I preferred keeping it that way is all.
5:05 Is the driver's trunk seriously open??
Great channel. And you use actual BR font!
Awesome
I have a merseyrail train teddy and u can get them at Liverpool central in a shop
I live in upton-by-chester and I never knew we once had a train station! Not that bache is very far away haha
Same here, bache is probbably more convenient
Very interesting video. Have you been to Garswood near St. Helens which is served by Northern but branded as Merseyrail . Any idea why ? I did ask Merseyrail but they didn't answer !!
In a very abridged sense, basically when any train line enters the Liverpool City Region, it becomes Merseyrail branded.
@@NickBadley But Merseyrail don't go to Garswood and it isn't on their list of stations.
Garswood is just barely in Merseyside. It lies on the City line of Merseyrail, Which is basically any national rail service that terminates at Liverpool Lime Street. They aren't operated by Merseyrail but they still use the Merseyrail branding at the stations that are within Merseyside.
@@NickBadley OK Thanks
*All* urban rail within the Liverpool City Region comes under the travel authority, Merseytravel.
Merseyrail has two 3rd rail _dedicated_ and segregated lines, the Northern and Wirral Lines. Some of the stations are not in the Liverpool City Region. But they are branded _Merseyrail,_ because they are on the dedicated Merseyrail network. Chester and Ormskirk are examples.
*All* urban stations under Merseytravel, the travel authority are all branded _Merseyrail._ That is the colour yellow, signage and seamless ticketing across Merseyrail's three lines: Northern, Wirral and City Lines. From a passengers view it is all one network. As the Northern and Wirral lines are dedicated 3rd rail electric and segregated from other lines and trains, they were run as one via a franchise by Serco-Abellio for Merseytravel.
The _City Line_ is the line that confuses people. The City Line is _shared_ services. That is, any urban services operated by other train operators other than Serco-Abellio that enter the Merseytravel area from other areas automatically become Merseyrail trains, operating on the City Line. City Line is _'shared'_ services, the other two 3rd rail lines are not. But all still on Merseyrail. Quite simple but hard for some to grasp.
The City Line was supposed to be an integrated part of the 3rd rail electrified network. However when Thatcher came to power the work was dropped. The lines to Warrington and Wigan were to be on the 3rd rail network but left to be diesel (Wigan is now electrified) unable to enter the electric central underground section. The Wapping Tunnel into Central from Edge Hill was not used, so leaving the eastern part of the city isolated. The City Line stayed as shared services.
In 2015 the Liverpool to Wigan Line, via St.Helens, was electrified using wires. This was not brought into the Serco-Abellio franchise as the trains, even though they also had 3rd rail shoes, could not get to the Merseyrail stabling and maintenance depots at Kirkdale and Birkenhead, so stayed with Northern. If the Bootle Branch line is electrified (it was to be along with Liverpool-Wigan) you may find the Liverpool to Wigan line brought into the Serco-Abellio franchise, as the trains can then reach Kirkdale. Also they may be the new 777s.
A side notes.
*1)* Network Rail want the WCML from Crewe to Preston upgraded, with also wires offering more current to use heavy electric freight trains from Liverpool's port. If this is done, expect a station or two on the Bootle Branch around Anfield and the Liverpool-Wigan line taken into the Serco-Abellio franchise.
*2)* If the Liverpool-Warrington Line is electrified expect Warrington to Liverpool Central services with this line in the Serco-Abellio franchise. That is the City Line no longer _shared_ services.
*3)* The metro-mayor wants Merseyrail hybrid battery trains to run from Liverpool to Runcorn East via Ellesemere Port and Helsby.
*4)* The metro-mayor ideally ants Liverpool to Chester via Runcorn on Merseyrail. Halton is within Merseytravel's remit, so needs to be integrated with the rest of the urban rail.
*5)* The metro-mayor wants Liverpool to at least Neston or Shotton on Merseyrail battery trains - Borderlands Line.
up the skem branch
would anyone know. The hard days night Hotel. ( beatles hotel ) has trains passing underneath it. but I'm not sure what trains it would be. was wondering what route the trains would be going.
That would be the Northern Line with trains running in either direction between Moorfields and Liverpool Central. Have you been in the hotel and heard them? In the 90s, I was in the basement of the Liverpool Museum (now the World Musuem) with my grandfather, viewing the old steam locos and tractions engines. We were alone, and it was dark and very quiet. Until a terrific rumbling was felt. My grandfather assured me that it was just the underground trains passing beneath us. I've been fascinated by underground trains ever since.
@Ian Stoyan I work here Ian. Thank you, I've always wanted to know. Cheers Ian
Guess what ? this crap anti railway Govt have just cancelled the Skelmersdale extension
But needless HS2 is progressing.
@@johnburns4017 HS 2 will be a world class railway when finished hardly needless
@@rockerjim8045
HS2 is totally needless. It runs to cities which already have fast lines. Lines that can be much, much faster.
The Chiltern diesel Line needs electrifying. Chiltern say they can do London to Birmingham non-stop seven mins slower than HS2 if electrified, with two stops 13 minutes max' slower - *as the line stands.* With all West Mids trains on the Chiltern Line there will be greater capacity on the WCML.
The Chiltern Line will better HS2 times if HS2 is canned above Aylesbury, with the HS2 London-Aylesbury section used. The construction is advanced on this section so may as well use it. Add a branch at Aylesbury onto the Gt.Central trackbed to WCML at Rugby, then two extra fast WCML tracks into London.
*Currently,* the fastest London Edinburgh time on the ECML is 12 minutes slower than proposed HS2 times. Upgrade the ECML with faster trains, HS2 times will be equalled.
Fastest London to Manchester time is 1 hr 53 mins, set in 2013 - Liverpool a minute or so slower. That was before the Norton Bridge bottleneck removal with trains only reaching 125mph. Remove WCML bottlenecks using faster trains HS2 times are approached.
The Integrated Rail Plan states that London to Sheffield on the MML will equal HS2 times.
_"Upgrading the East Coast Main Line to 140 mph operation as a high priority alongside HS2 and to be delivered without delay. Newcastle-London timings across a shorter route could closely match those achievable by HS2."_
- Beyond HS2 by Greengauge 21 (HS2 consultants)
The UK does not have a capacity problem the existing network cannot handle.
We *need* water reservoirs urgently, so instead we build a needless railway. We will all die of thirst riding in fast trains.