I love that you're out here calling Jess out on his behavior. Because he does get better, off screen. But I don't know what it is in the fandom. Maybe I see the show differently because I was closer to Lorelai's age at the time that I finally got around to watching Gilmore Girls, and more invested in her relationships than Rory's. But for some reason, people like to go around saying that Jess was the best boyfriend Rory ever had, when he wasn't. He really wasn't. There is a lot of room to say that he grew up to become the best person out of the bunch (personally I don't think we see enough of Dean in YITL to know how much he may or may not have grown from his past mistakes), but someone becoming a better person after you date them does not retroactively make them a good partner at the time that you were together.
Yes!! Completely agree! But I think the issue isn't really about that. Looking at a lot of different fandoms, I think many people see characters as very black and white, even in retrospect. And so they talk about them like that. This character turned out bad? They were horrible all along!!! That character ends up great? They were the sweetest cinnamon roll right from the beginning!!! It's like they just ignore the amount of character development any of them went throught to end up the way they are now and just warp their former good or excuse their past awful behaviour by any means to fit the new narrative of "They are good/bad and they've always been. We've just been blind"
I'm not gonna lie. Jess is my favourite of all three guys. But he was definitely the worst bf. It was inevitable that it would fail because Jess lacked the tools at that time. He had too much existing baggage which he wasn't ready or equipped to deal with yet. Dean had his flaws. I see that more now than I ever did at the time. Still, I think to a certain extent you have to realize the writers don't always see exactly what it is they are presenting on screen without their own biases being projected onto the characters. I don't think they intended to write Dean the way the modern fandom sees him, not to the same extent. He definitely got too posessive, too black and white, too angry at times. And yeah it's not great that Lorelai literally doesn't see any of this at any point. It would have been a good thing for an adult in Dean's life to give him some perspective there. We don't see that at any point. That's the unfair thing about Dean and getting a read on him. Unlike with Jess and Logan we never meet Dean's parents. The impression is that he's from a stable family. But we don't know how his parents helped him through certain things or what their influence was on...things that will be coming later. But the early 2000s vs the mid 2020s audience....there's gonna be some clashes there which weren't probably meant to be taken as severely as we might take it now Logan I can never empathize with as much as Jess(not to say I don't at all I'm not heartless) but that guy got away with so much because daddy could throw money at every problem. Logan messes around at school? Np. Just pay big bucks to get him into the next prep school until he gets kicked out of that one too. Jess fucked up, but he had to figure it out himself eventually. Logan has some redeeming qualities though, sure. Logan is meant to be an older Tristan in many ways(I believe they said Tristan was meant to be a long term love interest for Rory but with the actor leaving they went in a different direction until they created Logan later.
I used to watch it when I was little and I didn't like Jess lol, then I got to watch it all when I was 17 and still didn't like Jess... Now I tend to watch it as a comfort show being 25 and now I actually dislike Jess when he's a teenager. I didn't have a strong opinion about him before.
I think we are obsessed with Jess from later seasons. We love the arc they created for him. But we do agree this stage of the game, he is awful. But am surprised at how the writers made him this toxic at first. And while he was a jerk to Rori, some of his best storylines were with Luke.
Definitely agree that at this point in the series, Jess is a walking red flag. A lot of the growth he does is *after* they break up. I'm going to be very interested to see what you have to say about Logan though, because I feel like he has a lot red flag behavior (especially when it comes to pushing boundaries) that isn't necessarily as immediately as obvious as Jess
Oooh I agree with you 100%. And to be honest, i never liked Jess or Logan 🤷♀️ Dean was okay and perfect for her first boyfriend, but that didn't last. So I don't like either of her love interests by the end of the show 😢
He has a very rough moments even after they break up. It is interesting because as you watch the show you can understand why he is like that though, his life truly is complicated. Then, as an adult, he is the best ❤
I want to like Logan but I can't because I resist liking frat boy jerk sons of multiple millionaires whom the world is just too easy for. He's not awful though. Apart from his dickish affluenza at times. There's worse, but I don't disapprove of him as a character or a love interest, because it's realistic Rory ended up with someome from the privileged circle she's apart of. And she shows she can be just as much an entitled asshole as any of them, for all her claims of being sooo not like them. So writing wise, it's totally appropriate. Oh no the Jess/Rory relationship was doomed for failure. Jess wasn't ready. He just didn't know how to be a good boyfriend/partner. Again though. It's good writing. It's interesting writing. I think both Rory and Jess learned a few things, which doesn't seem like it's for the better - but it kind of was. Jess needed to lose something he valued(despite being awful at doing so) to get his shit together. It takes awhile, but eventually his experiences in Stars Hollow, mainly his relationships with Rory and Luke - to decide enough is enough. He had to change to make his life better. I don't know. I guess the reason Jess works for me is that he's got one of the more interesting story arcs and actually does grow a lot. I find it easier to sympathize with him sometimes even compared to Rory as an adult in my 30s compared to when I was 15 watching this show for the first time. He's such a jerk, but I get why. He fucked up, but he also got fucked over and still managed to make a life for himself without a mom, grandparents, townsfolk ect. running behind him with safety nets to catch him, unlike with Rory. I don't know she ever reaps the worst consequences of her mistakes, but that's not unrealistic for the situation she occupies in life.
He gets better, but he is a jerk right now, not good for Rory. I don't think he is in a good place to date somebody or anybody. He should focus on becoming better as a person, not dating at all. What I love about him is more about his relationship with Luke and how it will develop, because I just love when someone who has no stable family finally finds a person who becomes their true family. Luke will become a real dad to Jess and that is the relationship I enjoy.
You are very right about Jess. The thing is and I found with multiple watches is that Rory is just at that lustful state of her teenage years. She had it good with Dean yes, despite his tendencies that pushed her away, but he wasn't mentally stimulating enough for her. Jess came in and had the looks and brains. As I see it there are 4 pillars to attraction: Personality, Interests, Intellect, and Physical. Jess has a pretty horrible personality as of right now, but that is being eclipsed by Rory's desire for his Intellect, Interest and Physical aspects. Dean has Personality and Physical, and interest was there with tending to her social events she holds dearly in town, but he lacked the intellect to match and engage her with. Also with his jealousy his personality was being muddled as a good guy for being jealous. This is a phase for Rory, as unfortunate as it is, but she needs to go about it and learn and may I say be hurt by it because she needs to understand since her mother didn't create the best example for her to learn from. Not saying Lorelai is bad at being a mother for not having a stable relationship, but she didn't really talk to her daughter about being with people and figured she wouldn't be into that, thus avoiding the notion of handling jerk men and that potential. Hope you do an episode on Jess meeting Emily later. That was a good moment.
you are absolutely right, Jono! The problem with Jess is that he doesn’t understand what it means to date Rorry. He sees his relationship with Rorry as something isolated between the two of them. However, Rorry doesn’t just read books, she’s social in town and Jess doesn’t understand that if he wants to be with her, he hast to be with every part of her. I assume you’ve already seen all of season three, but I believe Luke has a conversation similar to this with Jess around the time he meets Rorry‘s grandmother.😜 I wish I could say this episode is Jess’s lowest point, but it’s not 🫠 it’s actually quite incredible to see what just will become, though we have to wait until season seven to see it and it’s only just a glimpse 🙄
I don't hate Jess; I just knew there was something off about him and I still don't know how to explain it. I agree with how you explianed the character development with Jess scenes. That was very well put.
@@00AgentKrabieyeah, I don’t hate Jess either, I just found him hella annoying because of the surly attitude. I understood why he had it, but it was still hella annoying and it didn’t serve him well. I didn’t find the fact that he was mean to everyone except Rory to be an attractive trait at all. Rory has friends and family outside of Jess that she cared about, so of course she’d want him to at least act civil around them. I was glad to see that he managed to grow up some in later episodes, but that didn’t mean that I also thought that he was a great match for Rory, especially once she hit college. It takes more than just some common interests to make for a good relationship, and at the point, Rory and Jess were already on divergent paths.
I’m Team “A Character You Haven’t Met Yet,” but I think the reason so many people are Team Jess comes in two parts: 1) He grows a lot in the coming seasons, and I think a lot of people focus on that side of him. His development helps him to be a better partner OVERALL, not even just for Rory necessarily. 2) Jess is a great example of the “bad boy with a heart of gold and dark hair” archetype. The girlies LOVE IT.
We actually never see them together as a couple again. He does grow a lot and becomes better but as we never see them together when they're older, we don't actually know if they would work well as a couple afterwards.
@@emilysimon6239 YES... I personally don't understand why so many people are 'team somebody-Rory-dated-in-HIGH_SCHOOL-or-college'... Please, Rory, just move on and date some great new somebody after you've finally matured.
Here's my thing: none of Rory's boyfriends were "the one." Dean's was the best first boyfriend a girl could hope for, and I am biased because my husband treats me the way Dean treated Rory without the possessiveness. Jess is a great character because he's fun to watch and he does grow (mostly off screen because he was supposed to get a spinoff that never happened) but you are right; he was terrible at being a boyfriend. I know you haven't reached out yet, but Logan is terrible, too. Rory devolves as a character and he doesn't do anything to help her stabilize, he's in his own pit of misery and acting out and I don't think he helps her the way she influences him, plus he doesn't pass that test you mentioned where he treats other people as well as he treats Rory (and that doesn't include the drama of A Year in the Life). The biggest problem with both Lorelei 's and Rory's relationships is that they have to be drama filled, and as the series goes on there needs to be more and more drama, and it needs to be bigger and better, and to do that the long-term relationships suffer. What's really sad is that Rory is a year older than me; she graduated high school in 2003 and I did it in 2004. I identified with her because she was quiet and bookish (even though she's a classics nerd and I'm a fantasy nut). I'm happy to announce that I went the opposite direction she did: guy who sucked to guy who didn't suck as bad to awesome guy. I got the guy who shared some interests with me (like Jess) and brings me out of my shell/comfort zone (like Logan) and who treats me kindly (like Dean). I think it's really telling what people find important in a relationship based on which boy Rory dated
@@theresabaschal5061 yeah. I guess it does!! I suppose I should backtrack a bit. When I was watching The Resident, I knew I’d seen that guy before but I liked that character. I’m not sure if it just came to me or I’d rewatched some Gilmore Girls before I realized WHERE I recognized him from. Now I’m watching The Good Wife and I don’t trust him again. That makes sense since he’s about the same age & he’s got that same smug, “Do you even KNOW who my father is?” young master of the universe-thing going on.
Being really physical in public to your girlfriend as a red flag is SUCH a great insight, and thank you so much for sharing that!! So many younger girls and boys need to hear that, it's not a status symbol to have a partner that you are s active with.
I wish you would have covered the conversation between Jess and Rory about her staying friends with Dean. Jess handles that conversation in a very calm and rational way. You can see her expecting him to ro get jealous and blow up at her and she is surprised when he takes it so well. I think it's important to realize that she expects a bad reaction because that's what Dean would have given her. Yeah, teen Jess sucks as a boyfriend a lot of the time but in some ways he is better than Dean just like in some ways Dean is better than Jess. My main issue with the Jess hate is that people seem to automatically say Dean=Best Boyfriend Ever and Jess=the absolute worst when really they both sucked in their own ways and did okay in other areas. I just want a blanced critique where EVERYONE has both their strengths AND weaknesses acknowledged.
Jess is my favourite out of Rory's love interests, but as like a "down the line end game, later" and also as a whole character. That absolutely does not mean he's a good boyfriend, because he's not. Like you say, he has no idea what a healthy relationship even looks like! I think you're very right in your reading of him, only scene where I think you're maybe slightly seeing him differently that me is in the first scene of discussion here. Like you mention, Jess is used to a lot of pda, and so him kissing her in front of the market doesn't seem like a deliberate "let's do it right in front of Dean" moment to me. Also him wanting to show off the relationship feels more like a "I want the whole world to know we're together because I like you so much and I'm happy" which he would have trouble saying in that many words lol, but that's how it comes across to me at least, and not so much treating her like a trophy. I think the love and care he has for Rory is real and deep, but he has absolutely no clue how to handle it and what to do with it. And so he doesn't act like a good boyfriend when he is finally with her.
Recommendation for reaction: Once upon a time 2011, it is a TV show with very complex and complicated characters. It is really good for analysis and family therapy. Especially characters like Regina, Rumplestiltskin , Jefferson or Tinkerbell.
I'm team Jess. However, I 100% agree that he was a really bad boyfriend in the teen years. What I like is he not only worked hard to better himself but he really was good for Rory in so many ways. The older he gets the better he gets. I love when a person can go from a hurting, broken person to healed and productive. But we have a while to get there.
My only thought to Jess not wanting to go to the carnival: the town has been really turned off by him and rude. They felt this way before he had a chance to do something wrong. They were proven right later, but the relationship between him and the town was rough. I wouldn't want to go to the carnival just to not be judged all night, whether I deserved it or not.
I think the reason many people excuse Jess’ behavior in the context of the show before he becomes a better person/character is largely because of Luke. We associate a lot of the traits he has with Luke (not wanting to participate in town events, generally having a dislike and disagreeable nature to others), and we know that Luke generally has a good heart so we subconsciously give Jess those traits too, or are convinced that he will spontaneously end up like that because “he’s a younger Luke” or “because it’s a show”.
Jess is not a great high school boyfriend. Saying you’re team Jess is knowing who he becomes. Also, by A Year in the Life I am solidly Team Jess is too good for Rory
Yes same team!!! Too good for Rory. She truly belongs with Logan, they deserve each other. I also despise the idea that Jess is Rory's Luke. These comparisons are just so annoying
I would rather have a boyfriend like Jess who says he doesn’t want to go to something cuz it’d be a bad time for him than be with Dean who yells at me for not going to all his games or acting like a brat while I’m trying to buy books.
@@X_MissMary_X 😭😭 lol yea i just don’t even see what “ journey” or “growth” people say jess has. he has maybe 2 scenes and people just like the yale line. he pretty much acts the exact same in the later seasons
It's true there's not a lot of him past S4. But even by the end in S4 you can see him beginning to change/get a clue. A big part of that is that's be called out by...hmm *checks notes*....oh yeah, everyone! And he realizes his words had a direct negative affect on Luke and I think he does realize he went way too far there. Though....he's not really entirely wrong. Luke is great, but he really can be self righteous and pig headed. Luke's my favourite, don't get me wrong! But by the time AyitL roles around. He's a reasonable, cool guy. He really does offer Rory some of the best advice she gets at that point in her life. *whispers* don't know if we can say that about Logan.....
Also, if you are ever looking for new show ideas, I think it would be really interesting to see a Therapist Reacts Raw to Crowley and Aziraphale in Good Omens. Either their overall respective toxic relationships with Heaven and Hell, their couple of fights in the first season, or their big fight at the end of the second season. It would be interesting to see how you interpreted their conversations and the ways they talk all the time but rarely understand each other fully.
I don't get that impression at ALL from Jess saying "I want to flaunt it". I got that he's been pining for Rory for months and he wants to celebrate finally being able to show how he feels, and not having to hide his feelings. I didn't get that he wanted to flaunt it to DEAN specifically, but to shout his feelings and happiness from the proverbial rooftops. I don't think that's even slightly a red flag.
Okay, I get where you’re coming from in the second part and I agree. However, I read the kissing scene outside of Dose's completely differently, and yeah, surely in part it's cause I'm a very physical partner. But I mean, the first part, when he says "I wanna flaunt it", I always interpreted it like "Yeah, I'm in a relationship with you and I want other people to know cause I like being in a relationship with you". Nothing red-flaggy to me about a boyfriend that wants to be public with his girlfriend - granted the fact that Rory was being pretty public with Dean before. And about the kissing just to spite Dean, I really don't think that's the case. He was walking, he met his girlfriend by the road, wanted to say hi to his girlfriend, it all happened in front of Dose's casually. And OF COURSE he's gonna say "He's a big boy, he can handle it" when his girlfriend shows concern for her ex-boyfriend's feeling cause... well, he's a jealous teenage boy, what did you expect? Surely, he doesn't extend grace, but I don't think most people would, in this situation. Then you go on saying how he’s not the best at accepting Rory’s boundaries… I disagree again. A little bit of perplexity is completely natural since Rory is showing a new boundary that doesn’t align with the ones of her previous relationship. He saw his girlfriend being pretty affectionate with her previous boyfriend, if I’m not mistaken this scene happens after a pretty passionate public kiss (granted, it was night, but not that late!), I can understand him being “What’s the deal?” all of a sudden. And then, even if he clearly doesn’t share her beliefs and the need she feels to protect Dean (that’s the only reason, mind you, she expresses she’s not on board with the PDA), he still goes on and respects her boundary. Am I missing something? (Sorry for any mistake, English is not my first language, I do my best!)
I think we have to talk about how Dean is possessive and a little misogynistic too. Like I get Jess is not a good match for Rory as a teen but so as Dean
Personally, I dislike Jess a lot as a teen. I agree i have compassion for him, but I more so agree with Jono that he shouldn’t be someone who Rory dates. He treats her badly, he leaves her hanging all the time, stops putting effort into the relationship, the party thing was way out of line and we all need to accept that. He’s a jerk to his uncle, to her mother, to Lane. He changes, he really does- But at that point; I no longer believe Rory is someone who matches him. Not too good or too bad for each other, but genuinely she and him are just not the kind of people who can get along and be together. I think it’s important to stop teaching girls “deep down, he’s a good man!”. I’ve seen too many women be dragged through the mud for so long with that sort of mindset, I’m being totally honest here. He does deserve to change and grow and his healing is really a lovely character arch. He’s complex and relatable and that’s why we love him, but that doesn’t mean he didn’t treat rory like crap. He did. He does, so many times. The show does a good job of showing how each man impacts rory. I think Dean’s impact is overlooked a little, Jono, and that’s maybe part of the issues. For me, Jess is a shit head and i wouldn’t want my kid to date him either. But Dean? The anger issues, the jealousy, the deals he makes her make just to do stuff with her. The obsession is also traumatising. Dumping her when she’s not ready to say I love you is a huge pressuring problem. Personally, Dean reminds me of my much more nefarious and underhanded exes who seem good until you see how bad the damage they do is. He yells at her, he teaches her relationships are about bargaining your way into compromise in a manner I find weird and upsetting. He is always mad at her, every damn episode he’s mad at her. College, mad. Debutant ball, mad. I love you not being said back, mad. He yells at her all the time, it’s very upsetting tbh. Personally, I feel like sometimes Dean you give more forgiveness than Jess. Maybe that’s not exactly true, but sometimes I’d like to see these episodes also talk about how Rory is impacted. How she acts in response, how you see her change, etc. Honestly, I’d like less focus on the boys and more focus on the Gilmore Girls.
I first watched Gilmore Girls while I was with my ex and didn't really see the parallels at that time. But now that I'm several years out from the toxic relationship I had with that person, Jess just reminds me more and more of him. It's hard to watch the show again now after having been through the things I went through. The coldness, the jealousy, the rudeness to my friends and family, the unwillingness to do fun things with me because he just "didn't want to" or because it "bored him," the "I already have you so I don't have to try anymore" mentality...just all of it hits really close to home.
I agree that Jess is great for Rory in later seasons, but Im Team Logan because he actively improved himself for Rory before and while they were together.
Logan has no regard for her boundaries when it matters most. And he does not supportively push her to better herself. No thanks. All the relationship teach Rory important lessons. But none off the relationships where long term keepers
@@anainesgonzalez8868I pretend YitL doesn't exist but also. . .Rory is equally terrible. She literally cheats on a guy, that is the butt of the joke the entire season, with Logan who is engaged.
On the topic of romantic relationships (specifically marriages) I'd love to see a video about Sookie and Jackson, because I love them, but I also have a feeling that there would be feedback from a therapist if they saw one
Jess was not the only jerk at the carnival. He was the only one in the group who never decided to take responsibility for a younger child, and yet the two who did agree to watch her left him to do it. And yes, his outburst was inappropriate, but he had repeatedly expressed distress and told Dean to start watching his sister before he told her to stand in the street. Jess clearly was not used to being around kids younger than him, had only agreed to go to the carnival, and yet the two who were used to kids didn't try to intervene at all. They left him to drown on his own, and he lashed out.
I am not a fan of Rory and Jess together, but I do have to defend him some in the first scene. From his confusion when Rory pulled him to the side, I don't believe he was deliberately trying to kiss her where Dean would see. He just happened to run into her there. Afterwards, he didn't care, but I don't think he was making a point of doing it. I will not defend the "now that I have you I don't have to do anything" part. Indefensible.
I'm rewatching GG again and this version of Jess makes me wanna scream, especially the scene where he tries to pressure Rory into having sex. That alone would be a reason to run, so no, you're definitely not too hard on him. I really hope you will cover Dean's marriage at some point!
I'm glad you brought that up because that was the biggest red flag moment I was thinking of. Yes, he was going through his own stuff, but absolutely no excuse to treat her like that.
I don’t think Jess was the best boyfriend but I also don’t think he was the worst either. I think he found Rory and just wanted to love her in this little bubble. Kids who feel unwanted or unloved by parents usually are always on the defense and have trouble with not being selfish. He’s gonna put what he wants first because he thinks no one else really cares about what he wants or that’s been his experience. And Jono you are 100% right about him not accepting influence. He’s not there yet. But I don’t villainize him for being rude to Clara cause honestly that girl gets on my last nerve every time I watch this episode. Some people just don’t have the patience for kids or don’t like kids and that’s fine. I don’t see Jess as quite as terrible because I’ve known so many Jesses that didn’t need to be written off they just needed a LOT of patience from those around them. Didn’t date any though 🤷🏻♀️
I agree with all the red flags you highlighted from Jess. But also the fact that Rory doesn't call him out on his red-flag behavior is in itself a red flag!
You’re spot on, but Rory knew what she was getting. She just couldn’t help herself. I don’t think she was totally wrong in her assessment of him, but Lorelai wasn’t wrong either. I think he had the potential to be a good boyfriend, he just couldn’t overcome his issues at this stage. I’d love to see your take on Last Week Fights, This Week Tights
I absolutely love these videos and conversations! As an aspiring counsellor, I've always veered more toward the idea of individual forms of therapy, particularly surrounding mental health and/or abuse, but watching these types of videos is giving me a proper interest in the relationship/mediation/couples/family stuff, because of the dynamics and questions being asked and ideas being discussed! I love it!!! So entertaining and also informative (and motivating). I ADORE this channel, as well as Cinema Therapy. Thank you so much for all that you do!
Oh, Man!! I can’t wait until you find out where Rory swipes her VCard!! I think that With literally every “Rory & Boys” video! What I think with EVERY GG video is that I wish you’d dig in to or at least kinda touch on the other Mother-Daughter relationship dynamic in the Show- Lane & Mrs.Kim!! They’re essentially the foils to Rory & Lorelei in their polar opposite relationship (Mrs Kim is Super Strict & deeply religious while lane is Secretly & incredibly benignly rebellious) The dynamic between the two is both amusing and fairly unhealthy. In particular, I’d love to see how you react to how Mrs. Kim reconciles her daughter moving out of the house and into an apartments with her (all Male!!) Band. I think you might also get a kick out of seeing the dynamic in the band & Lane’s role therein. The side characters are the real gold in this show!!
Even though I'm a Jess fan, I have to say I agree with the points being made in this video. But, it's supposed to be funny too. "Does this belong to you?" and "Go stand in the middle of the street and wait for me. I'll be right back." is absolutely hilarious to me. Love every bit of it. 😂👌 Hope you can laugh about it too, even though it would be red flags in real life. 😇
Young Jess is sooo bad, man. I'm so glad you are pointing those things, because as a teen I felt really strange, cause all my girl friends were team jess and I was like "cmon, this guy is rude towards her MOM"
It's not unusual. Because girls and women are raised with the unspoken responsibility to manage the emotions of men and boys around them, so there is a big longing to see tropes where "he can be fixed". Because in reality it rarely goes that way and if it does, then that's by burning through the unpaid labour of several women before you first. Since their male peers will often do little (or make it worse) to nothing (in "best...?" case) to "raise them right", while often being the ones with the most influence. The "bad boy" longing trope is basically a trauma response to the heaps over heaps of sexism in reality. And they often also - tragically - show more care than the real life boys/men, too. The bar is that low. We are picking it up off the ground now and giving responsibilities back, because our survival now depends less on our "fixing the men in our lives" and "making due with what is"-skills. (>_
I agree with you about teenage Jess. Without giving away too many spoilers, I will say that he eventually grows up and gets massive character development if that makes you feel any better. Adult Jess is why we love Jess.
Jess is my favorite character and I absolutely love his character arc. I honestly believe he is one of the most well-written characters on the show. That being said, I love his character because of his growth, and that only happens because he starts out by being a jerk and then grows and matures. People confuse loving a character due to his well-constructed arc, acknowledging his flaws and all, with shipping him with Rory because that's one of his main relationships on the show.
It's so weird to me how everyone is like "Dean was so possessive" - Dean came to the town gatherings, Dean had a good relationship with Lorelai, Dean hung out with Rory and Lane, and Rory also did things on her own. If he was actually possessive, he would have wanted Rory for himself all the time... Jess is the one who just wants to be alone with Rory without having anything to do with anyone else, even though it's important to Rory that he gets involved with her family as well.
I wanted them to work and for Jess to step up as a boyfriend because they are intellectually compatible but emotionally, relationally, and in terms of lifestyle, they are opposites. He is dysfunctional and needs to grow a lot more to be able to show up in the relationship properly. I hoped for it, but was always disappointed.
The point I am missing is... he was ALWAYS like that. He never liked Stars Hollow. He never wanted to take part in any town activities. He was always nice to her and rude to EVERYBODY else (including her mother and his own uncle). She decided to be with him knowing that. Was he supposed to magically change once they were together? That doesnt happen. People do not magically change. And you should not start dating someone expecting that person is going to change everything you do not like about them. If you do not like the person, do not date the person. If you do, maybe that person will agree to change certain things once you are together, but that is a process and that takes time.
I was waiting for the party scene (where Jess wants to go further with Rory) to be used as well in this, but those cuts show the case where Jesse's jerkness is more subtle and could be missed... I wish I saw this video few years back, very educative ❤
Yeah Jess is a big jerk. However that little sister is not sooo innocent and she knows exactly what she was doing when she said “you can go with me and dean” she’s a child but she’s doing it on purpose and dean is no doing anything to tell his little sister to stop. He’s letting her be annoying to Jess because he’s too chicken to do it himself in-front of Rory. They are all behaving badly. He’s saying crappy things but what Dean is letting his sister get away with is wrong. And Rory is also just completely missing the mark and no even realizing that maybe it’s not such a good idea to be hanging out with your ex boyfriend and his little sister. You know? I mean dean is just walking along and he sees Rory and Jess and he just allows his little sister to run up to them like it’s no big deal. He doesn’t have to hide but he should have told Clara out of respect for him to leave them alone. No one here is mature though.
That's also what I got from this scene. She wasn't that innocent and was also trying to annoy Jess on purpose. Also, Dean was clearly getting back at Jess, kind of the same way Jess would mess with and get in between Dean and Rory when they were together. They were all behaving like immature teenagers (and kid).
I will never understand the Team Jess crowd. Yeah, he's better later, but he was SO bad when they were teens it was unreal. He got mad at her for not sleeping with him at Kyle's party. Not to mention, Rory the high achiever acted like she was bored with Dean intellectually yet Jess flunked out of high school. I honestly feel like the Dean storyline should be a cautionary tale to girls, don't let the nice guy who loves you go for the "more exciting guy". Yes, obviously Dean made major mistakes later, but I'm talking about the high school years.
After I ended things with a guy my freshman year of high school, he quickly started up with another girl who he would make out with in the back of one of our classes. It weirded out everyone in the class. (Suffice it to say this was not something I'd been a fan of doing.) Ironically enough, I always refer to this guy as being just like Dean.
From what I remember watching years ago as a teen/young woman: I really liked Dean, he was very sweet and felt bad for him when they broke up. I think I liked Jess because of the passion, as much of his jerkiness was annoying, with Jess, it felt like it was something else out of the world of alchemy and attraction. And the fact that he left made him feel like the one who got away. I also liked Logan because he brought out something different from Rory, she was not the always mature young woman, 18 going on 40. With Logan, Rory could be a brat. I think why Jess stood out to me of the three, was narratively speaking Jess is kinda like Luke and we had all that Lorelei and Luke going on, and Rory and Jess felt like a mini Lorelei and Luke. Then when Jess came back all grown up, you could see the nostalgia of the “what if” and everything. I do think out of the three, adult Jess has the most potential. But teen Jess was a jackass. Also, isn’t Jess being a jerk to Dean’s little sis because she is Dean’s? I don’t remember if he was that unpleasant to everyone else or just anyone related to Dean. Insecurity is awful.
Sure it is easy to call out the red flags because we get a focused camera on them and the content is witty and funny Gilmore Girls style. I agree it is obvious that Jess is not a good boyfriend. I am glad you referenced a book worth reading but then what are the steps to setting boundaries that will lead to an appropriate exit from the relationship. Or even a pivot. Because you rightfully point out that Jess has a lot of learning to do and he is not going to learn it in a bubble. He needs clear boundaries from people who care about him.
I don't mind light PDA, but there is a point where it is no longer consensual. I have a consent link and, yes, consent means everyone involved. And if light PDA strays, you're now unwillingly including the public.
Okay remember back in an earlier video when you were all about how Lorelei didn’t apologize appropriately to Luke and I said Luke also doesn’t apologize to Lorelei at all when she had been expressing concerns about Jess and Rory and Luke ignored her concerns??? Now you’re seeing why it matters that Lorelei was really not Team Jess. He gets worse before he gets better, and Lorelei is completely justified in her concerns about him.
I think that this video is so interesting because it highlights how we let other peoples attractiveness overshadow their red flags and allow them to impact us negatively 👌👏🙌
My problem is Jess's lack of consent the whole time he's courting Rory. He could've charmed her without showing up at her house when he thought her mom was gone for the weekend.
Honestly... I would've been annoyed if the writers made Jess the perfect boyfriend...it's inevitable that a guy that behaves like him would be a crappy boyfriend and a massive jackass.
My American fiancé hated public display of affection when we started dating. I'm Mexican and it PDA in engraved in me. Over time he got used to it, although he says I wore him down. Jonah, "don't date fixer uppers" is I think the best dating advice I have ever heard. Thanks for this channel, being in a relation with someone of another language and culture is tricky sometimes, ur advice had helped me a lot on the past. BTW, u r Right about Jess 😊
THANK YOU! finally someone else sees all his red flags, i hope we get part 2,3 and 4 of this topic cause there are so many other scenes where he's just the worst boyfriend ever (in my opinion)
I can't wait to hear your take on both Lorelei and Rory relationship choices & mindset in season four. I love Gilmore Girls, but that season is always a hard watch for me.
I was never team Jess and this is why. I was Team Logan, which as I’ve gotten older is also a bit problematic, but I liked their vibe. She didn’t really have any suitable partners honestly. None. Jess is a possessive jerk. You nailed this one!!
I ship Rory and Jess for endgame but you’re right-currently he is not it but he will grow and change and I’m betting you’ll cry especially in regard to the Luke/Jess relationship it ends so good! So I’m currently studying social work and my first internship was at a therapy office I even gave therapy (under supervision.) When I watch this show now I’m more so struck with Rory-she gets a lot of hate I’m not ok with but I’m looking through her entire arc through a mental health lens my take is this: Rory and her mom had a very emeshed relationship where Loreali stonewalled Rory whenever she didn’t go along with her mothers plan. She also was not securely attached which is why we see similar patterns in her relationship choices after she and Dean break up for the first time. She consistently chooses people who don’t treat her well and who are avoidant. I believe this goes back to her model of her mom’s relationships as well as her relationship with her father.
That sound the alarms segment brought back some serious ick in my stomach, been there so many times. It was the worst to realize they were lying the entire time for a conquest. I don't know why so many people think that's acceptable behaviour or where they even learned to do it. I volunteer for a domestic abuse charity, it was this week we were discussing that we can have empathy for what people have been for, and co-existing to that to not accept poor behaviour as you said.
I 100% agree with Jonathan on the whole public displays of affection. A little kiss, hug or hand holding just fine but anything more gets awkward IMO. One of my exs would happily grope and kiss me like Jess does in public and in front of our mutual friends. I told him it made me uncomfortable but he didn't see an issue with it. I think it was his way of showing his feelings for me, but deep down I think it was partly him showing off to others. For anyone out there that does this as a couple and both parties are happy about it, then fine you do you, but nah not for me thanks.
You're right! I think the obsession with Jess is that he and Rory have great screen chemistry. I love watching them interact, but he's still a terrible boyfriend.
I love Jess but I’ll always say I love him for who he becomes, not as a boyfriend. He was a bad boyfriend because he was too immature and not ready. When he’s an adult, he might have made a better boyfriend, but I don’t think the timing was ever right for him and Rory. I will say though Rory is wasn’t perfect either and did make her own mistakes in their relationship. Not that she didn’t have good reason to be insecure and also she was a teenager too, but I do want to remember both are equally immature teenagers at this point.
I think I've been in similar situations. It feels like it's more of trauma oriented need to bind the other to oneself, or another inability to comfortable within one own self, which unfortunately, at worse leads to codependency. At least it can lead to codependency...
Love the Jess truth talk. People are so obsessed with him when he is a horrible guy, not just boyfriend. Literally ghosts his own girlfriend and disappears because he doesn’t wanna finish high school… And i don’t understand how people think se turns out into this amazing guy, when he just matures and finds a job for himself. That doesn’t make him incredible, just a better version from the shit show he was to everyone around him. Maybe thats why the difference seems so drastic to people
I absolutely cannot wait for you to see more of Jess's behavior and get your reactions 😬and I hope you continue this series because when Rory gets to college and there's Marty 😶and THEN Logan 🙀 hoo boy
I’m team Jess but it’s not because he’s great, it’s because he and Rory are cut from the same cloth. And fyi, Jesse gets better but he doesn’t turn into a saint or anything.
As a fan of this show. I am totally with you on Jess at this point in the story. I cheered when Luke pushed him in the lake because I wanted to do that so many times (metaphorically). Jess does grow as a person but it takes years in the school of hard knocks for him to become a decent human. Side note: with the exception of Dean, who was a very good first boyfriend, Rory develops some abysmal taste in men. Seriously, walking red flag factories.
I agree, and it gets worse for awhile. Also, consider taking a look at Crazy X Girlfriend as I think you’ll love it. A blind react to one of the songs? I’d recommend either “This Session Is Going to be Different” or “Antidepressants Are So Not a Big Deal”
I would love for you to address why and how you think Rory chooses her partners - and I do mean chooses, because she CLEARLY pursues Dean, Jess and Logan - the unachievable ("you got the new kid?"), mysterious, commitment-phobic/married/engaged, or mean guys. While "is he good enough for Rory" is a valid question, if we're not infantilizing Rory, we should talk about how she shows up in her relationships (not just romantically). If we're talking power dynamics, I think Jess and Rory are at pretty equal levels considering he's older and has dated more, but Rory is Stars Hallow's golden child and Luke loves her like a daughter. I don't see her as a victim as some seem to, but I would love for you to get into it if I'm wrong.
My theory: we recreate the past in an attempt to win and fix it. Christopher was not stable enough for Lorelai to choose him and build a life with him. Rory, subconsciously, may be choosing insecure, immature men to rectify the past. Again, on an emotional level, not a conscious or rational one. I don't think she knows she's doing it.
@@MendedLight Makes sense to me! It does seem like all of these characters are acting our of similarly emotional states and searching for what's most familiar (even did Dean did it - wanting a trad wife because that's what his mom is)
Jess and Rory suffered from the same fate as Rachel and Joey in friends; much more compelling to watch the will they/wont they of them getting together than they are to watch as a couple. I was roughly Rory's age when this came out and they seemed like relatable characters, teens trying to figure themselves out and grow up. PS would love some focus on Rory and Paris' friendship this season.
I think a lot of it is age and maturity. I loved Jess when I was a teenage girl because he was deep and intellectual and had a rough past. As an adult, I see a lot of toxic behavior that would not fly. I would adore an episode about how media teaches girls it is their job to save the broken boys, if that were ever possible!
Being abused does not give one permission to abuse.
Exactly
💯 factsss
Exaclty. I might feel sorry for you, but never condone your bad behaviour.
could not agree more
Say it louder for the people in the back!
Jess is the textbook definition of “ok, that explains why you are the way you are but it doesn’t excuse it.”
True
I love that you're out here calling Jess out on his behavior. Because he does get better, off screen. But I don't know what it is in the fandom. Maybe I see the show differently because I was closer to Lorelai's age at the time that I finally got around to watching Gilmore Girls, and more invested in her relationships than Rory's. But for some reason, people like to go around saying that Jess was the best boyfriend Rory ever had, when he wasn't. He really wasn't. There is a lot of room to say that he grew up to become the best person out of the bunch (personally I don't think we see enough of Dean in YITL to know how much he may or may not have grown from his past mistakes), but someone becoming a better person after you date them does not retroactively make them a good partner at the time that you were together.
THIS.
Yes!! Completely agree!
But I think the issue isn't really about that.
Looking at a lot of different fandoms, I think many people see characters as very black and white, even in retrospect. And so they talk about them like that.
This character turned out bad? They were horrible all along!!! That character ends up great? They were the sweetest cinnamon roll right from the beginning!!!
It's like they just ignore the amount of character development any of them went throught to end up the way they are now and just warp their former good or excuse their past awful behaviour by any means to fit the new narrative of "They are good/bad and they've always been. We've just been blind"
I'm not gonna lie. Jess is my favourite of all three guys. But he was definitely the worst bf. It was inevitable that it would fail because Jess lacked the tools at that time. He had too much existing baggage which he wasn't ready or equipped to deal with yet.
Dean had his flaws. I see that more now than I ever did at the time. Still, I think to a certain extent you have to realize the writers don't always see exactly what it is they are presenting on screen without their own biases being projected onto the characters. I don't think they intended to write Dean the way the modern fandom sees him, not to the same extent. He definitely got too posessive, too black and white, too angry at times. And yeah it's not great that Lorelai literally doesn't see any of this at any point. It would have been a good thing for an adult in Dean's life to give him some perspective there. We don't see that at any point. That's the unfair thing about Dean and getting a read on him. Unlike with Jess and Logan we never meet Dean's parents. The impression is that he's from a stable family. But we don't know how his parents helped him through certain things or what their influence was on...things that will be coming later. But the early 2000s vs the mid 2020s audience....there's gonna be some clashes there which weren't probably meant to be taken as severely as we might take it now
Logan I can never empathize with as much as Jess(not to say I don't at all I'm not heartless) but that guy got away with so much because daddy could throw money at every problem. Logan messes around at school? Np. Just pay big bucks to get him into the next prep school until he gets kicked out of that one too. Jess fucked up, but he had to figure it out himself eventually. Logan has some redeeming qualities though, sure.
Logan is meant to be an older Tristan in many ways(I believe they said Tristan was meant to be a long term love interest for Rory but with the actor leaving they went in a different direction until they created Logan later.
I used to watch it when I was little and I didn't like Jess lol, then I got to watch it all when I was 17 and still didn't like Jess... Now I tend to watch it as a comfort show being 25 and now I actually dislike Jess when he's a teenager. I didn't have a strong opinion about him before.
I think we are obsessed with Jess from later seasons. We love the arc they created for him.
But we do agree this stage of the game, he is awful. But am surprised at how the writers made him this toxic at first.
And while he was a jerk to Rori, some of his best storylines were with Luke.
Definitely agree that at this point in the series, Jess is a walking red flag. A lot of the growth he does is *after* they break up. I'm going to be very interested to see what you have to say about Logan though, because I feel like he has a lot red flag behavior (especially when it comes to pushing boundaries) that isn't necessarily as immediately as obvious as Jess
Oooh I agree with you 100%.
And to be honest, i never liked Jess or Logan 🤷♀️ Dean was okay and perfect for her first boyfriend, but that didn't last. So I don't like either of her love interests by the end of the show 😢
He has a very rough moments even after they break up. It is interesting because as you watch the show you can understand why he is like that though, his life truly is complicated.
Then, as an adult, he is the best ❤
I want to like Logan but I can't because I resist liking frat boy jerk sons of multiple millionaires whom the world is just too easy for.
He's not awful though. Apart from his dickish affluenza at times. There's worse, but I don't disapprove of him as a character or a love interest, because it's realistic Rory ended up with someome from the privileged circle she's apart of. And she shows she can be just as much an entitled asshole as any of them, for all her claims of being sooo not like them. So writing wise, it's totally appropriate.
Oh no the Jess/Rory relationship was doomed for failure. Jess wasn't ready. He just didn't know how to be a good boyfriend/partner. Again though. It's good writing. It's interesting writing. I think both Rory and Jess learned a few things, which doesn't seem like it's for the better - but it kind of was. Jess needed to lose something he valued(despite being awful at doing so) to get his shit together. It takes awhile, but eventually his experiences in Stars Hollow, mainly his relationships with Rory and Luke - to decide enough is enough. He had to change to make his life better.
I don't know. I guess the reason Jess works for me is that he's got one of the more interesting story arcs and actually does grow a lot. I find it easier to sympathize with him sometimes even compared to Rory as an adult in my 30s compared to when I was 15 watching this show for the first time. He's such a jerk, but I get why. He fucked up, but he also got fucked over and still managed to make a life for himself without a mom, grandparents, townsfolk ect. running behind him with safety nets to catch him, unlike with Rory. I don't know she ever reaps the worst consequences of her mistakes, but that's not unrealistic for the situation she occupies in life.
At least Logan knew who he was and what he was about and was always upfront about it
I'm Team Logan all the way xD
He gets better, but he is a jerk right now, not good for Rory. I don't think he is in a good place to date somebody or anybody. He should focus on becoming better as a person, not dating at all. What I love about him is more about his relationship with Luke and how it will develop, because I just love when someone who has no stable family finally finds a person who becomes their true family. Luke will become a real dad to Jess and that is the relationship I enjoy.
It is so nice
"I'm gonna have empathy and compassion for all of that while still calling him out on his bull$h!+."
Yes! Call out that bullshit lol
Thank you, haha!
Mmmkay!!!! 😂
You are very right about Jess. The thing is and I found with multiple watches is that Rory is just at that lustful state of her teenage years. She had it good with Dean yes, despite his tendencies that pushed her away, but he wasn't mentally stimulating enough for her. Jess came in and had the looks and brains.
As I see it there are 4 pillars to attraction: Personality, Interests, Intellect, and Physical.
Jess has a pretty horrible personality as of right now, but that is being eclipsed by Rory's desire for his Intellect, Interest and Physical aspects. Dean has Personality and Physical, and interest was there with tending to her social events she holds dearly in town, but he lacked the intellect to match and engage her with. Also with his jealousy his personality was being muddled as a good guy for being jealous.
This is a phase for Rory, as unfortunate as it is, but she needs to go about it and learn and may I say be hurt by it because she needs to understand since her mother didn't create the best example for her to learn from. Not saying Lorelai is bad at being a mother for not having a stable relationship, but she didn't really talk to her daughter about being with people and figured she wouldn't be into that, thus avoiding the notion of handling jerk men and that potential.
Hope you do an episode on Jess meeting Emily later. That was a good moment.
Jess is Rory's worst boyfriend, but BEST ex-boyfriend.
Rory and Jess love-time and Jono be like: "Ah S**t, Here We Go."
Lol. Accurate.
you are absolutely right, Jono!
The problem with Jess is that he doesn’t understand what it means to date Rorry. He sees his relationship with Rorry as something isolated between the two of them. However, Rorry doesn’t just read books, she’s social in town and Jess doesn’t understand that if he wants to be with her, he hast to be with every part of her. I assume you’ve already seen all of season three, but I believe Luke has a conversation similar to this with Jess around the time he meets Rorry‘s grandmother.😜
I wish I could say this episode is Jess’s lowest point, but it’s not 🫠
it’s actually quite incredible to see what just will become, though we have to wait until season seven to see it and it’s only just a glimpse 🙄
This!!
very well explained :)
I don't hate Jess; I just knew there was something off about him and I still don't know how to explain it. I agree with how you explianed the character development with Jess scenes. That was very well put.
@@00AgentKrabieyeah, I don’t hate Jess either, I just found him hella annoying because of the surly attitude. I understood why he had it, but it was still hella annoying and it didn’t serve him well. I didn’t find the fact that he was mean to everyone except Rory to be an attractive trait at all. Rory has friends and family outside of Jess that she cared about, so of course she’d want him to at least act civil around them. I was glad to see that he managed to grow up some in later episodes, but that didn’t mean that I also thought that he was a great match for Rory, especially once she hit college. It takes more than just some common interests to make for a good relationship, and at the point, Rory and Jess were already on divergent paths.
I’m Team “A Character You Haven’t Met Yet,” but I think the reason so many people are Team Jess comes in two parts:
1) He grows a lot in the coming seasons, and I think a lot of people focus on that side of him. His development helps him to be a better partner OVERALL, not even just for Rory necessarily.
2) Jess is a great example of the “bad boy with a heart of gold and dark hair” archetype. The girlies LOVE IT.
We actually never see them together as a couple again. He does grow a lot and becomes better but as we never see them together when they're older, we don't actually know if they would work well as a couple afterwards.
@@emilysimon6239 YES... I personally don't understand why so many people are 'team somebody-Rory-dated-in-HIGH_SCHOOL-or-college'... Please, Rory, just move on and date some great new somebody after you've finally matured.
agree: "I’m Team “A Character You Haven’t Met Yet,” "
Been looking for this team. Yeah, all of them had a problem in their own way, and rory needs to do some maturing of her own now.
Here's my thing: none of Rory's boyfriends were "the one." Dean's was the best first boyfriend a girl could hope for, and I am biased because my husband treats me the way Dean treated Rory without the possessiveness.
Jess is a great character because he's fun to watch and he does grow (mostly off screen because he was supposed to get a spinoff that never happened) but you are right; he was terrible at being a boyfriend.
I know you haven't reached out yet, but Logan is terrible, too. Rory devolves as a character and he doesn't do anything to help her stabilize, he's in his own pit of misery and acting out and I don't think he helps her the way she influences him, plus he doesn't pass that test you mentioned where he treats other people as well as he treats Rory (and that doesn't include the drama of A Year in the Life).
The biggest problem with both Lorelei 's and Rory's relationships is that they have to be drama filled, and as the series goes on there needs to be more and more drama, and it needs to be bigger and better, and to do that the long-term relationships suffer.
What's really sad is that Rory is a year older than me; she graduated high school in 2003 and I did it in 2004. I identified with her because she was quiet and bookish (even though she's a classics nerd and I'm a fantasy nut). I'm happy to announce that I went the opposite direction she did: guy who sucked to guy who didn't suck as bad to awesome guy. I got the guy who shared some interests with me (like Jess) and brings me out of my shell/comfort zone (like Logan) and who treats me kindly (like Dean).
I think it's really telling what people find important in a relationship based on which boy Rory dated
@@theresabaschal5061 Logan is SO bad that I have a hard time watching that actor on different shows.
@@sarahhopper8891 I guess that's a sign he is a very good actor! Too bad the part was so awful!
@@theresabaschal5061 yeah. I guess it does!!
I suppose I should backtrack a bit. When I was watching The Resident, I knew I’d seen that guy before but I liked that character. I’m not sure if it just came to me or I’d rewatched some Gilmore Girls before I realized WHERE I recognized him from. Now I’m watching The Good Wife and I don’t trust him again. That makes sense since he’s about the same age & he’s got that same smug, “Do you even KNOW who my father is?” young master of the universe-thing going on.
Being really physical in public to your girlfriend as a red flag is SUCH a great insight, and thank you so much for sharing that!! So many younger girls and boys need to hear that, it's not a status symbol to have a partner that you are s active with.
Absolutely!!
I wish you would have covered the conversation between Jess and Rory about her staying friends with Dean. Jess handles that conversation in a very calm and rational way. You can see her expecting him to ro get jealous and blow up at her and she is surprised when he takes it so well. I think it's important to realize that she expects a bad reaction because that's what Dean would have given her. Yeah, teen Jess sucks as a boyfriend a lot of the time but in some ways he is better than Dean just like in some ways Dean is better than Jess. My main issue with the Jess hate is that people seem to automatically say Dean=Best Boyfriend Ever and Jess=the absolute worst when really they both sucked in their own ways and did okay in other areas. I just want a blanced critique where EVERYONE has both their strengths AND weaknesses acknowledged.
^^^ THIS!
he acts fine in the moment but he CLEARLY isn’t okay with it based on the way he acts.
Jess is my favourite out of Rory's love interests, but as like a "down the line end game, later" and also as a whole character. That absolutely does not mean he's a good boyfriend, because he's not. Like you say, he has no idea what a healthy relationship even looks like!
I think you're very right in your reading of him, only scene where I think you're maybe slightly seeing him differently that me is in the first scene of discussion here. Like you mention, Jess is used to a lot of pda, and so him kissing her in front of the market doesn't seem like a deliberate "let's do it right in front of Dean" moment to me. Also him wanting to show off the relationship feels more like a "I want the whole world to know we're together because I like you so much and I'm happy" which he would have trouble saying in that many words lol, but that's how it comes across to me at least, and not so much treating her like a trophy.
I think the love and care he has for Rory is real and deep, but he has absolutely no clue how to handle it and what to do with it. And so he doesn't act like a good boyfriend when he is finally with her.
Recommendation for reaction: Once upon a time 2011, it is a TV show with very complex and complicated characters. It is really good for analysis and family therapy. Especially characters like Regina, Rumplestiltskin , Jefferson or Tinkerbell.
life time content only by Regina and Rumplestiltskin xD but yes, agree. that would be a fabulous series for the 'gets therapized'
@@AstoriaHestia Definitely. These people are messy. The family is messy just as much as Thor and Loki or maybe even more.
Yes! The actress for Regina didn't like how abu$$ive her character was to Henry in the first season that she insisted it gets changed for season two
@@aliiciia555 but thb Snow is... well, her arc is special. S1 Snow and S4 Snow aren't even related to each other anymore xD
@@AstoriaHestia they are very different people, I guess they wanted to add some drama, but it painted her in a negative, unrealistic way.
I'm team Jess. However, I 100% agree that he was a really bad boyfriend in the teen years. What I like is he not only worked hard to better himself but he really was good for Rory in so many ways. The older he gets the better he gets. I love when a person can go from a hurting, broken person to healed and productive. But we have a while to get there.
My only thought to Jess not wanting to go to the carnival: the town has been really turned off by him and rude. They felt this way before he had a chance to do something wrong. They were proven right later, but the relationship between him and the town was rough. I wouldn't want to go to the carnival just to not be judged all night, whether I deserved it or not.
I think the reason many people excuse Jess’ behavior in the context of the show before he becomes a better person/character is largely because of Luke. We associate a lot of the traits he has with Luke (not wanting to participate in town events, generally having a dislike and disagreeable nature to others), and we know that Luke generally has a good heart so we subconsciously give Jess those traits too, or are convinced that he will spontaneously end up like that because “he’s a younger Luke” or “because it’s a show”.
Jess is not a great high school boyfriend. Saying you’re team Jess is knowing who he becomes. Also, by A Year in the Life I am solidly Team Jess is too good for Rory
Yes same team!!! Too good for Rory. She truly belongs with Logan, they deserve each other. I also despise the idea that Jess is Rory's Luke. These comparisons are just so annoying
😒
I would rather have a boyfriend like Jess who says he doesn’t want to go to something cuz it’d be a bad time for him than be with Dean who yells at me for not going to all his games or acting like a brat while I’m trying to buy books.
Ditto!
never agreed with someone more. my brain exploded the first time i watched rory leave dean for jess annoying self 😭
I've come to love Jess and his journey, but I literally cheered when he left at the end of this season the first time I watched the show
@@X_MissMary_X 😭😭 lol yea i just don’t even see what “ journey” or “growth” people say jess has. he has maybe 2 scenes and people just like the yale line. he pretty much acts the exact same in the later seasons
It's true there's not a lot of him past S4. But even by the end in S4 you can see him beginning to change/get a clue. A big part of that is that's be called out by...hmm *checks notes*....oh yeah, everyone! And he realizes his words had a direct negative affect on Luke and I think he does realize he went way too far there. Though....he's not really entirely wrong. Luke is great, but he really can be self righteous and pig headed. Luke's my favourite, don't get me wrong!
But by the time AyitL roles around. He's a reasonable, cool guy. He really does offer Rory some of the best advice she gets at that point in her life. *whispers* don't know if we can say that about Logan.....
Also, if you are ever looking for new show ideas, I think it would be really interesting to see a Therapist Reacts Raw to Crowley and Aziraphale in Good Omens. Either their overall respective toxic relationships with Heaven and Hell, their couple of fights in the first season, or their big fight at the end of the second season. It would be interesting to see how you interpreted their conversations and the ways they talk all the time but rarely understand each other fully.
I don't get that impression at ALL from Jess saying "I want to flaunt it". I got that he's been pining for Rory for months and he wants to celebrate finally being able to show how he feels, and not having to hide his feelings. I didn't get that he wanted to flaunt it to DEAN specifically, but to shout his feelings and happiness from the proverbial rooftops. I don't think that's even slightly a red flag.
I dunno. It's right in front of the grocery store where Dean is currently working a shift. He knows what he's doing.
🎉 Another Gilmore Girls video ❤
So glad you enjoy them!
He's not until he lecturers Rory back to college and shows his maturity into an amazing man in later seasons. Must have done some therapy.
SPOILERS
Okay, I get where you’re coming from in the second part and I agree. However, I read the kissing scene outside of Dose's completely differently, and yeah, surely in part it's cause I'm a very physical partner. But I mean, the first part, when he says "I wanna flaunt it", I always interpreted it like "Yeah, I'm in a relationship with you and I want other people to know cause I like being in a relationship with you". Nothing red-flaggy to me about a boyfriend that wants to be public with his girlfriend - granted the fact that Rory was being pretty public with Dean before. And about the kissing just to spite Dean, I really don't think that's the case. He was walking, he met his girlfriend by the road, wanted to say hi to his girlfriend, it all happened in front of Dose's casually. And OF COURSE he's gonna say "He's a big boy, he can handle it" when his girlfriend shows concern for her ex-boyfriend's feeling cause... well, he's a jealous teenage boy, what did you expect? Surely, he doesn't extend grace, but I don't think most people would, in this situation. Then you go on saying how he’s not the best at accepting Rory’s boundaries… I disagree again. A little bit of perplexity is completely natural since Rory is showing a new boundary that doesn’t align with the ones of her previous relationship. He saw his girlfriend being pretty affectionate with her previous boyfriend, if I’m not mistaken this scene happens after a pretty passionate public kiss (granted, it was night, but not that late!), I can understand him being “What’s the deal?” all of a sudden. And then, even if he clearly doesn’t share her beliefs and the need she feels to protect Dean (that’s the only reason, mind you, she expresses she’s not on board with the PDA), he still goes on and respects her boundary. Am I missing something?
(Sorry for any mistake, English is not my first language, I do my best!)
Jess's best growth has nothing to do with Rory, and I love that. But you'll be waiting a very long time 😅
I think we have to talk about how Dean is possessive and a little misogynistic too. Like I get Jess is not a good match for Rory as a teen but so as Dean
Oh, it's coming.
Personally, I dislike Jess a lot as a teen. I agree i have compassion for him, but I more so agree with Jono that he shouldn’t be someone who Rory dates. He treats her badly, he leaves her hanging all the time, stops putting effort into the relationship, the party thing was way out of line and we all need to accept that. He’s a jerk to his uncle, to her mother, to Lane. He changes, he really does- But at that point; I no longer believe Rory is someone who matches him. Not too good or too bad for each other, but genuinely she and him are just not the kind of people who can get along and be together.
I think it’s important to stop teaching girls “deep down, he’s a good man!”. I’ve seen too many women be dragged through the mud for so long with that sort of mindset, I’m being totally honest here. He does deserve to change and grow and his healing is really a lovely character arch. He’s complex and relatable and that’s why we love him, but that doesn’t mean he didn’t treat rory like crap. He did. He does, so many times.
The show does a good job of showing how each man impacts rory. I think Dean’s impact is overlooked a little, Jono, and that’s maybe part of the issues. For me, Jess is a shit head and i wouldn’t want my kid to date him either. But Dean? The anger issues, the jealousy, the deals he makes her make just to do stuff with her. The obsession is also traumatising. Dumping her when she’s not ready to say I love you is a huge pressuring problem. Personally, Dean reminds me of my much more nefarious and underhanded exes who seem good until you see how bad the damage they do is. He yells at her, he teaches her relationships are about bargaining your way into compromise in a manner I find weird and upsetting. He is always mad at her, every damn episode he’s mad at her. College, mad. Debutant ball, mad. I love you not being said back, mad. He yells at her all the time, it’s very upsetting tbh. Personally, I feel like sometimes Dean you give more forgiveness than Jess. Maybe that’s not exactly true, but sometimes I’d like to see these episodes also talk about how Rory is impacted. How she acts in response, how you see her change, etc.
Honestly, I’d like less focus on the boys and more focus on the Gilmore Girls.
Such great thoughts! I'll definitely pivot to give you more of the ladies.
I first watched Gilmore Girls while I was with my ex and didn't really see the parallels at that time. But now that I'm several years out from the toxic relationship I had with that person, Jess just reminds me more and more of him. It's hard to watch the show again now after having been through the things I went through. The coldness, the jealousy, the rudeness to my friends and family, the unwillingness to do fun things with me because he just "didn't want to" or because it "bored him," the "I already have you so I don't have to try anymore" mentality...just all of it hits really close to home.
I agree that Jess is great for Rory in later seasons, but Im Team Logan because he actively improved himself for Rory before and while they were together.
Can't wait to cover that!
Logan has no regard for her boundaries when it matters most. And he does not supportively push her to better herself. No thanks. All the relationship teach Rory important lessons. But none off the relationships where long term keepers
Did he though? No shade but Logan imo was NOT a good partner. He had some good moments but he didn’t treat her well especially in ‘A year in the Life’
@@SCordova19as adults he is the worst in my opinion
@@anainesgonzalez8868I pretend YitL doesn't exist but also. . .Rory is equally terrible. She literally cheats on a guy, that is the butt of the joke the entire season, with Logan who is engaged.
None of Rory's boyfriends were good boyfriends........I said what I said 😂
On the topic of romantic relationships (specifically marriages) I'd love to see a video about Sookie and Jackson, because I love them, but I also have a feeling that there would be feedback from a therapist if they saw one
Will do!
Jess was not the only jerk at the carnival. He was the only one in the group who never decided to take responsibility for a younger child, and yet the two who did agree to watch her left him to do it.
And yes, his outburst was inappropriate, but he had repeatedly expressed distress and told Dean to start watching his sister before he told her to stand in the street.
Jess clearly was not used to being around kids younger than him, had only agreed to go to the carnival, and yet the two who were used to kids didn't try to intervene at all. They left him to drown on his own, and he lashed out.
I am not a fan of Rory and Jess together, but I do have to defend him some in the first scene. From his confusion when Rory pulled him to the side, I don't believe he was deliberately trying to kiss her where Dean would see. He just happened to run into her there. Afterwards, he didn't care, but I don't think he was making a point of doing it.
I will not defend the "now that I have you I don't have to do anything" part. Indefensible.
I'm sorry but the way he talks to/about Dean's sister is so funny 😭 and it's obvious her feelings aren't hurt
Another great video. I REALLY hope you cover the party episode later in the season.
Please do This Is Us, I would really love to see you break down the family dynamics and the struggles of each character.
I'm rewatching GG again and this version of Jess makes me wanna scream, especially the scene where he tries to pressure Rory into having sex. That alone would be a reason to run, so no, you're definitely not too hard on him.
I really hope you will cover Dean's marriage at some point!
I'm glad you brought that up because that was the biggest red flag moment I was thinking of. Yes, he was going through his own stuff, but absolutely no excuse to treat her like that.
I don’t think Jess was the best boyfriend but I also don’t think he was the worst either. I think he found Rory and just wanted to love her in this little bubble. Kids who feel unwanted or unloved by parents usually are always on the defense and have trouble with not being selfish. He’s gonna put what he wants first because he thinks no one else really cares about what he wants or that’s been his experience. And Jono you are 100% right about him not accepting influence. He’s not there yet. But I don’t villainize him for being rude to Clara cause honestly that girl gets on my last nerve every time I watch this episode. Some people just don’t have the patience for kids or don’t like kids and that’s fine. I don’t see Jess as quite as terrible because I’ve known so many Jesses that didn’t need to be written off they just needed a LOT of patience from those around them. Didn’t date any though 🤷🏻♀️
I agree with all the red flags you highlighted from Jess. But also the fact that Rory doesn't call him out on his red-flag behavior is in itself a red flag!
100%.
You’re spot on, but Rory knew what she was getting. She just couldn’t help herself. I don’t think she was totally wrong in her assessment of him, but Lorelai wasn’t wrong either. I think he had the potential to be a good boyfriend, he just couldn’t overcome his issues at this stage.
I’d love to see your take on Last Week Fights, This Week Tights
I absolutely love these videos and conversations! As an aspiring counsellor, I've always veered more toward the idea of individual forms of therapy, particularly surrounding mental health and/or abuse, but watching these types of videos is giving me a proper interest in the relationship/mediation/couples/family stuff, because of the dynamics and questions being asked and ideas being discussed! I love it!!! So entertaining and also informative (and motivating). I ADORE this channel, as well as Cinema Therapy. Thank you so much for all that you do!
Oh, Man!! I can’t wait until you find out where Rory swipes her VCard!! I think that With literally every “Rory & Boys” video!
What I think with EVERY GG video is that I wish you’d dig in to or at least kinda touch on the other Mother-Daughter relationship dynamic in the Show- Lane & Mrs.Kim!! They’re essentially the foils to Rory & Lorelei in their polar opposite relationship (Mrs Kim is Super Strict & deeply religious while lane is Secretly & incredibly benignly rebellious) The dynamic between the two is both amusing and fairly unhealthy.
In particular, I’d love to see how you react to how Mrs. Kim reconciles her daughter moving out of the house and into an apartments with her (all Male!!) Band. I think you might also get a kick out of seeing the dynamic in the band & Lane’s role therein. The side characters are the real gold in this show!!
I love seeing Doc so fired up over Jess, lol. Your passion has actually changed my mind on this one!
Jess is Rory’s worst boyfriend. He gets better, but not while he’s the boyfriend
SERIES REGULAR Jess was not great. Special Guest star Jess is great because he finally had to be accountable to himself
I love how at 7:50 Jono gives the most dad response.
Would love to see you react to Rory's relationships with Logan, Dean and Jess in the revival!
Okay I could have REALLY used this talk when I was in my early 20's!!
Me patiently waiting for your thoughts on the episode “Keg! Max!” 🤣
Even though I'm a Jess fan, I have to say I agree with the points being made in this video.
But, it's supposed to be funny too. "Does this belong to you?" and "Go stand in the middle of the street and wait for me. I'll be right back." is absolutely hilarious to me. Love every bit of it. 😂👌
Hope you can laugh about it too, even though it would be red flags in real life. 😇
Young Jess is sooo bad, man. I'm so glad you are pointing those things, because as a teen I felt really strange, cause all my girl friends were team jess and I was like "cmon, this guy is rude towards her MOM"
It's not unusual. Because girls and women are raised with the unspoken responsibility to manage the emotions of men and boys around them, so there is a big longing to see tropes where "he can be fixed". Because in reality it rarely goes that way and if it does, then that's by burning through the unpaid labour of several women before you first. Since their male peers will often do little (or make it worse) to nothing (in "best...?" case) to "raise them right", while often being the ones with the most influence.
The "bad boy" longing trope is basically a trauma response to the heaps over heaps of sexism in reality. And they often also - tragically - show more care than the real life boys/men, too. The bar is that low.
We are picking it up off the ground now and giving responsibilities back, because our survival now depends less on our "fixing the men in our lives" and "making due with what is"-skills. (>_
I agree with you about teenage Jess. Without giving away too many spoilers, I will say that he eventually grows up and gets massive character development if that makes you feel any better. Adult Jess is why we love Jess.
You are spot on about Jess. He comes dead last in my GG boyfriend ranking. I can’t wait to see you react to the next highlights in Jess’ arc!
This show definitely has a lot of relationship dynamics to unpack
I've never seen Gilmore Girls, but you're 100% right. Just because you love someone doesn't mean you have to have a romantic relationship with them.
Jess is my favorite character and I absolutely love his character arc. I honestly believe he is one of the most well-written characters on the show. That being said, I love his character because of his growth, and that only happens because he starts out by being a jerk and then grows and matures. People confuse loving a character due to his well-constructed arc, acknowledging his flaws and all, with shipping him with Rory because that's one of his main relationships on the show.
Jess was a terrible boyfriend, wouldn't wish him on the worst enemy. But once he matured, he was an awesome friend. Shame Rory wasn't. 🤷🏻♀
It's so weird to me how everyone is like "Dean was so possessive" - Dean came to the town gatherings, Dean had a good relationship with Lorelai, Dean hung out with Rory and Lane, and Rory also did things on her own. If he was actually possessive, he would have wanted Rory for himself all the time...
Jess is the one who just wants to be alone with Rory without having anything to do with anyone else, even though it's important to Rory that he gets involved with her family as well.
I wanted them to work and for Jess to step up as a boyfriend because they are intellectually compatible but emotionally, relationally, and in terms of lifestyle, they are opposites. He is dysfunctional and needs to grow a lot more to be able to show up in the relationship properly. I hoped for it, but was always disappointed.
The point I am missing is... he was ALWAYS like that. He never liked Stars Hollow. He never wanted to take part in any town activities. He was always nice to her and rude to EVERYBODY else (including her mother and his own uncle). She decided to be with him knowing that. Was he supposed to magically change once they were together? That doesnt happen. People do not magically change. And you should not start dating someone expecting that person is going to change everything you do not like about them. If you do not like the person, do not date the person. If you do, maybe that person will agree to change certain things once you are together, but that is a process and that takes time.
I was waiting for the party scene (where Jess wants to go further with Rory) to be used as well in this, but those cuts show the case where Jesse's jerkness is more subtle and could be missed... I wish I saw this video few years back, very educative ❤
after Gilmore Girls i want jonno to react to Marvelous Mrs Maisel
Yeah Jess is a big jerk. However that little sister is not sooo innocent and she knows exactly what she was doing when she said “you can go with me and dean” she’s a child but she’s doing it on purpose and dean is no doing anything to tell his little sister to stop. He’s letting her be annoying to Jess because he’s too chicken to do it himself in-front of Rory. They are all behaving badly. He’s saying crappy things but what Dean is letting his sister get away with is wrong. And Rory is also just completely missing the mark and no even realizing that maybe it’s not such a good idea to be hanging out with your ex boyfriend and his little sister. You know?
I mean dean is just walking along and he sees Rory and Jess and he just allows his little sister to run up to them like it’s no big deal. He doesn’t have to hide but he should have told Clara out of respect for him to leave them alone. No one here is mature though.
That's also what I got from this scene. She wasn't that innocent and was also trying to annoy Jess on purpose. Also, Dean was clearly getting back at Jess, kind of the same way Jess would mess with and get in between Dean and Rory when they were together. They were all behaving like immature teenagers (and kid).
I want Jono‘s reaction at 5:22 as a giant oil painting.
Jono reaction at 5:23 says it all! 😂
Yes it does! Seriously, Jess!
I never liked Jess, the whole bad guy attitude screams insecurity and it's a turn off
Ditto for me, at least at this point. Excited to see what happens.
Jess is so great because it led him to lead an incredible roll in This Is Us
I will never understand the Team Jess crowd. Yeah, he's better later, but he was SO bad when they were teens it was unreal. He got mad at her for not sleeping with him at Kyle's party. Not to mention, Rory the high achiever acted like she was bored with Dean intellectually yet Jess flunked out of high school. I honestly feel like the Dean storyline should be a cautionary tale to girls, don't let the nice guy who loves you go for the "more exciting guy". Yes, obviously Dean made major mistakes later, but I'm talking about the high school years.
After I ended things with a guy my freshman year of high school, he quickly started up with another girl who he would make out with in the back of one of our classes. It weirded out everyone in the class. (Suffice it to say this was not something I'd been a fan of doing.)
Ironically enough, I always refer to this guy as being just like Dean.
Yikes!
From what I remember watching years ago as a teen/young woman:
I really liked Dean, he was very sweet and felt bad for him when they broke up.
I think I liked Jess because of the passion, as much of his jerkiness was annoying, with Jess, it felt like it was something else out of the world of alchemy and attraction. And the fact that he left made him feel like the one who got away.
I also liked Logan because he brought out something different from Rory, she was not the always mature young woman, 18 going on 40. With Logan, Rory could be a brat.
I think why Jess stood out to me of the three, was narratively speaking Jess is kinda like Luke and we had all that Lorelei and Luke going on, and Rory and Jess felt like a mini Lorelei and Luke.
Then when Jess came back all grown up, you could see the nostalgia of the “what if” and everything.
I do think out of the three, adult Jess has the most potential.
But teen Jess was a jackass.
Also, isn’t Jess being a jerk to Dean’s little sis because she is Dean’s?
I don’t remember if he was that unpleasant to everyone else or just anyone related to Dean.
Insecurity is awful.
Sure it is easy to call out the red flags because we get a focused camera on them and the content is witty and funny Gilmore Girls style. I agree it is obvious that Jess is not a good boyfriend.
I am glad you referenced a book worth reading but then what are the steps to setting boundaries that will lead to an appropriate exit from the relationship. Or even a pivot. Because you rightfully point out that Jess has a lot of learning to do and he is not going to learn it in a bubble. He needs clear boundaries from people who care about him.
This episode is so validating. I couldn’t understand why so many people loved Jess.
I don't mind light PDA, but there is a point where it is no longer consensual. I have a consent link and, yes, consent means everyone involved. And if light PDA strays, you're now unwillingly including the public.
Okay remember back in an earlier video when you were all about how Lorelei didn’t apologize appropriately to Luke and I said Luke also doesn’t apologize to Lorelei at all when she had been expressing concerns about Jess and Rory and Luke ignored her concerns???
Now you’re seeing why it matters that Lorelei was really not Team Jess. He gets worse before he gets better, and Lorelei is completely justified in her concerns about him.
I think that this video is so interesting because it highlights how we let other peoples attractiveness overshadow their red flags and allow them to impact us negatively 👌👏🙌
My problem is Jess's lack of consent the whole time he's courting Rory. He could've charmed her without showing up at her house when he thought her mom was gone for the weekend.
right as always king. cant wait for you to get to season 5
Honestly... I would've been annoyed if the writers made Jess the perfect boyfriend...it's inevitable that a guy that behaves like him would be a crappy boyfriend and a massive jackass.
My American fiancé hated public display of affection when we started dating. I'm Mexican and it PDA in engraved in me. Over time he got used to it, although he says I wore him down. Jonah, "don't date fixer uppers" is I think the best dating advice I have ever heard. Thanks for this channel, being in a relation with someone of another language and culture is tricky sometimes, ur advice had helped me a lot on the past. BTW, u r Right about Jess 😊
THANK YOU! finally someone else sees all his red flags, i hope we get part 2,3 and 4 of this topic cause there are so many other scenes where he's just the worst boyfriend ever (in my opinion)
I can't wait to hear your take on both Lorelei and Rory relationship choices & mindset in season four. I love Gilmore Girls, but that season is always a hard watch for me.
@@alia-4147
Is that the one with Dean and Sammy Davis Jr. singing Candy-Man on the radio???
(Trying to avoid spoilers)
I was never team Jess and this is why. I was Team Logan, which as I’ve gotten older is also a bit problematic, but I liked their vibe. She didn’t really have any suitable partners honestly. None. Jess is a possessive jerk. You nailed this one!!
I ship Rory and Jess for endgame but you’re right-currently he is not it but he will grow and change and I’m betting you’ll cry especially in regard to the Luke/Jess relationship it ends so good!
So I’m currently studying social work and my first internship was at a therapy office I even gave therapy (under supervision.)
When I watch this show now I’m more so struck with Rory-she gets a lot of hate I’m not ok with but I’m looking through her entire arc through a mental health lens my take is this: Rory and her mom had a very emeshed relationship where Loreali stonewalled Rory whenever she didn’t go along with her mothers plan. She also was not securely attached which is why we see similar patterns in her relationship choices after she and Dean break up for the first time.
She consistently chooses people who don’t treat her well and who are avoidant. I believe this goes back to her model of her mom’s relationships as well as her relationship with her father.
That sound the alarms segment brought back some serious ick in my stomach, been there so many times. It was the worst to realize they were lying the entire time for a conquest. I don't know why so many people think that's acceptable behaviour or where they even learned to do it. I volunteer for a domestic abuse charity, it was this week we were discussing that we can have empathy for what people have been for, and co-existing to that to not accept poor behaviour as you said.
I’m enjoying these reactions while I patiently wait for Rory’s college years.
I 100% agree with Jonathan on the whole public displays of affection. A little kiss, hug or hand holding just fine but anything more gets awkward IMO. One of my exs would happily grope and kiss me like Jess does in public and in front of our mutual friends. I told him it made me uncomfortable but he didn't see an issue with it. I think it was his way of showing his feelings for me, but deep down I think it was partly him showing off to others. For anyone out there that does this as a couple and both parties are happy about it, then fine you do you, but nah not for me thanks.
You're right! I think the obsession with Jess is that he and Rory have great screen chemistry. I love watching them interact, but he's still a terrible boyfriend.
I love Jess but I’ll always say I love him for who he becomes, not as a boyfriend. He was a bad boyfriend because he was too immature and not ready. When he’s an adult, he might have made a better boyfriend, but I don’t think the timing was ever right for him and Rory. I will say though Rory is wasn’t perfect either and did make her own mistakes in their relationship. Not that she didn’t have good reason to be insecure and also she was a teenager too, but I do want to remember both are equally immature teenagers at this point.
I think I've been in similar situations. It feels like it's more of trauma oriented need to bind the other to oneself, or another inability to comfortable within one own self, which unfortunately, at worse leads to codependency. At least it can lead to codependency...
Love the Jess truth talk. People are so obsessed with him when he is a horrible guy, not just boyfriend. Literally ghosts his own girlfriend and disappears because he doesn’t wanna finish high school…
And i don’t understand how people think se turns out into this amazing guy, when he just matures and finds a job for himself. That doesn’t make him incredible, just a better version from the shit show he was to everyone around him. Maybe thats why the difference seems so drastic to people
I absolutely cannot wait for you to see more of Jess's behavior and get your reactions 😬and I hope you continue this series because when Rory gets to college and there's Marty 😶and THEN Logan 🙀 hoo boy
I’m team Jess but it’s not because he’s great, it’s because he and Rory are cut from the same cloth.
And fyi, Jesse gets better but he doesn’t turn into a saint or anything.
As a fan of this show. I am totally with you on Jess at this point in the story. I cheered when Luke pushed him in the lake because I wanted to do that so many times (metaphorically). Jess does grow as a person but it takes years in the school of hard knocks for him to become a decent human. Side note: with the exception of Dean, who was a very good first boyfriend, Rory develops some abysmal taste in men. Seriously, walking red flag factories.
I agree, and it gets worse for awhile. Also, consider taking a look at Crazy X Girlfriend as I think you’ll love it. A blind react to one of the songs? I’d recommend either “This Session Is Going to be Different” or “Antidepressants Are So Not a Big Deal”
I would love for you to address why and how you think Rory chooses her partners - and I do mean chooses, because she CLEARLY pursues Dean, Jess and Logan - the unachievable ("you got the new kid?"), mysterious, commitment-phobic/married/engaged, or mean guys. While "is he good enough for Rory" is a valid question, if we're not infantilizing Rory, we should talk about how she shows up in her relationships (not just romantically). If we're talking power dynamics, I think Jess and Rory are at pretty equal levels considering he's older and has dated more, but Rory is Stars Hallow's golden child and Luke loves her like a daughter. I don't see her as a victim as some seem to, but I would love for you to get into it if I'm wrong.
And yes, you're right that Jess is a bad guy 90% of the time 😂
My theory: we recreate the past in an attempt to win and fix it. Christopher was not stable enough for Lorelai to choose him and build a life with him. Rory, subconsciously, may be choosing insecure, immature men to rectify the past. Again, on an emotional level, not a conscious or rational one. I don't think she knows she's doing it.
@@MendedLight Makes sense to me! It does seem like all of these characters are acting our of similarly emotional states and searching for what's most familiar (even did Dean did it - wanting a trad wife because that's what his mom is)
Jess and Rory suffered from the same fate as Rachel and Joey in friends; much more compelling to watch the will they/wont they of them getting together than they are to watch as a couple. I was roughly Rory's age when this came out and they seemed like relatable characters, teens trying to figure themselves out and grow up. PS would love some focus on Rory and Paris' friendship this season.
I think a lot of it is age and maturity. I loved Jess when I was a teenage girl because he was deep and intellectual and had a rough past. As an adult, I see a lot of toxic behavior that would not fly. I would adore an episode about how media teaches girls it is their job to save the broken boys, if that were ever possible!
I concur! I feel like this has been too prevalent in YA media aimed at girls, even though it's gotten a lot better over the years.