Duanjian, the Chinese Short Sword- Chinese Swords and Swordsmanship Series
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- Опубликовано: 23 фев 2020
- Scott M. Rodell, noted teacher and authority on Chinese Swords and Swordsmanship, discusses Qing period Chinese Duanjian or short swords. The cousin of the long, full length jian, these short swords are largely overlooked by practitioners today but played an important role in Qing society.
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I'm not a Chinese arts practitioner but what the longer & shorter versions remind me of in a way is a European saber vs cutlass/hanger.
Although they were developed for different reasons, the concept of a longer & shorter version of a sword design meant for different situations is the same.
Great video!
Also there are weapons in Europe that look like very short swords (arming swords usually) or very long daggers. I've seen versions with 17 inch blades & there about. They too generally are ignored by historians....lol but they are probably for similar reasons to the shorter jian (?) An about town weapon that is big enough to use as a sword, but short enough to be convenient to wear.
Asa-Punk aka Åsa-Punk at Vinland Suður Short swords deserve much more credit than they do now, considering they were significant armaments popular among both civilians and military.
thanks Scott. I always remember your comment on one of my early efforts at a dao. "A little too duan…". It made me laugh. I had taken too much length off, and it handled (still does, its in my closet) like a big knife rather than a sword. I had not learned about military standardization and the fact that many daos were part of the imperial arsenal and the fittings were badges of rank, while the jian were usually weapons and status symbols for wealthy. I presume that a jian during the late Ming and through the Qing would have been like having a hanger (short saber or hunting sword) for a gentleman in the English Colonies in the 1700s. I think the "too duan" dao I made would make a formidable weapon for a riverboat bandit (like a bowie knife was in the US at that time). Thank you for putting such information out to the public, and taking time to train people in the martial history of Chinese swords and swordsmanship and the martial nature of taijiquan. There is a large body of myths to dispel and information to pass, and you are uniquely qualified to present this info.
It has been a real pleasure working with you. And yeah, there is a real difference better a big knife and a short sword.
Great video Laoshi! I'm going to have to get a duanjian now. I'd love to see a video on the Dao. You dispelled the "dojo lore" on the Jian in the previous video I think doing the same for the Dao would be great.
Thanks. You won't regret getting a duanjian for your personal training.
Fantastic video series!! These few videos provide all of the information (and more) that I had to spend countless hours reading thru forum posts back in 2005-06, to acquire.
The duan jian was my favorite, although my first custom sword, from John Lundemo, was a dao, my second was a European style short sword that was similar to a duan jian, in it's characteristics. It has a stiff, flattened diamond blade of 23" and the blade profile is very similar to the Butterfly duan jian, being broader at the base and tapering toward the tip. I think the Butterfly duan jian is the first I've seen with that type of taper.
Thanks, we have another new video out this Monday and another scheduled for 2 weeks after that...
Thanks, never get tired of hearing that. We've another new video out this Monday...
I like shortswords that are so solid they dont bend one bit (increased weighy but strength too)
The wakizashi of jian!
I like these!!
@Michael_S_K indeed, it's a false comparison. But it is the "dots" my brain connects, so to speak. :)
The short cousin, I like that. Edge geometry would be an interesting topic for a video.
I think a video on Dao/Shield usage would be cool.
Great idea, I have an antique Rattan Shield, so why not. Thanks for the suggestion.
@@scottm.rodellgrtc2969 What about Jian and shield? You showed artwork depicting Jian and Shields.
How about the Chinese Longsword, the two handed Jian for a future video?
Why not, I have access to two...
@@scottm.rodellgrtc2969 Will be great, shuang shou jian.
Great video. Incredibly informative.
Your sword collection is just unbelievable. They are beautiful.
Beautiful table and sword stand as well.
Thank you for taking the time to make such an awesome video.
Very informative video as usual, thank you! As a Chinese and martial arts practitioner myself, I really appreciate Mr. Rodell can preserve and inherit such invaluable Chinese cultural heritages and teach people worldwide about them.
Thanks for your support, I genuinely appreciate it.
Really interesting and nice to hear both the context and traits related to each of the weapons.
Great to see a truthful historically accurate Chinese sword based documentary using actual antiques. It's a nice change of pace over the flood of floppy bendy non historical based blades that are so common in Chinese sword schools nowadays
Thanks for your support Ian.
Thanks Ian.
Another great vid Laoshi.
Thanks. What do you want to see next? We are planning to shoot some basics of Jianfa shortly.
@@mugenGRTC excellent idea! I would love to see your thoughts on the dao. There is an interesting spectrum that many are not aware of. I look forward to the next, what ever it may be.
@@wujinaut, seems several people are interested in something on the dao (Chinese saber), thinking of one on the different types wielded during the Qing dynasty.
A point on the 7 star symbolism on swords, in taoist rituals the 7 stars are a symbol used to ward off evil spirits and misfortune, as is the jian, so probably that warding off evil/protection is what they are going for.
Nice one Scott, many thanks. Still waiting for the dao video... :-)
Three people asked for that so far, so perhaps that will start moving to the front of the line.
Brilliant as always Laoshi!
Thanks. What do you want to see next?
@@scottm.rodellgrtc2969 I would be interested in a discussion on the blade geometry of period jian. I understand that earlier blades may have had a different geometry which was not necessarily the best for "cutting" but was good at percussive or "hacking" cuts and that later blades became more suited for cutting. Also in the republic period there are swords which employ ricassos and this as far as I know was not very common before this period. Some talk about these features and their functions would be very interesting.
@@Xingyiacademy, that's a brilliant idea. I would probably need the lads to do up some graphics for me. But that shouldn't be that difficult.
Really cool
Thanks. What do you want to see in the future?
Thanks.
@@mugenGRTC in the future, I would love to see a video on the Dandao/Miaodao that I remember seeing you talk about in other videos. I personally practice historical European martial arts and I practice with the Spanish greatsword (Montante). I'm a pretty tall guy, and a sucker for big swords. The Dandao/Miaodao is my favorite changdao
@@camrendavis6650, thanks for the input. We have done several Miaodao/Dandao videos, the most recent was: ruclips.net/video/okgUdVX2qrk/видео.html I am also working on an online course: threeislandsmedia.com/
@@camrendavis6650, We did several Miaodao/Dandao videos, most recently- Miaodao Steel Swordplay: ruclips.net/video/okgUdVX2qrk/видео.html
Incredible pieces. I wonder why the Chinese loved double bladed weapons so much as opposed to a single blade, especially for a short sword.
I carry machetes around, similar in size to those jian. Its a nice size.
Excellent video. Thank you!
Thanks Mark. Hope we see you at a seminar this year. We missed you...
Nice! This is first time I learn that there are shorter cousin of Jian.
This episode is easy to digest, to the point explanation and educational.
Great Works Laoshi Scott!
Thanks brother.
Your videos are very informative. I enjoy your academic approach to the Chinese martial arts weapons. I hope to train with you some day.
Thanks for your support Andrew. Have your heard about the online Academy: www.chineseswordacademy.com/
@@scottm.rodellgrtc2969 I have. I am giving it serious thought. I would like to speak with you before signing up.
@@aphyder83, If you are in the US, give me a call at Great River Taoist Center...
Very interesting Laushi!! Can you do a video series on the Dao or Daofa? Trying to piece together Baguazhang's historical fencing and your thoughts on the matter would be greatly appreciated!
Certainly, I was thinking of a side by side comparison of the different types of dao (sabers) in use during the Qing. Thanks for your input.
I own a duanjian now and I was serieusly flabbergasted by the fact that this dagger sized blade actueely fully feels like a sword. I own daggers aswell and they mostly have no cut in them, the have very little flow because the blade is often to licht, and you kind of want to put in a icepick grip and keep it there to start stabbing with. This weapon is not like that it has clearly a nice cut, it flows better then almost anything else I own including licht weapons like whips and stuff, and it makes you want to twirl it around switching between icepick grip and hammer grip cutting and trusting while it fly's around like a butterfly in your hand. It's a beautifull feeling to have and a most have if your gone train with it. I train with around 23 weapons over multiple fighting systems that says something!
I never really cared for wooden weapons, but what you say makes sense. I am going to look up wooden swords now. 👍
Please, don't forget to take time to relax. I worked at a box store in America for 13 years and was forced to retire.
Our daughter put me in the hospital with a blood sugar of 662, I was there for 7 days. There is a normal limit of what your work load is but I kept adding on to it until I was doing twice my normal work load. I just kept on going and going and it almost killed me.
I had no help, the young people that they hired wouldn't help me at all. So watch your work load, it is really easy to slip into over working.
Thanks for your concern. Building the new online Academy has been demanding, but it will make it easier for everyone coming to the in person seminars (coming back soon...).
Excellent video. Looking forward to more.
Thanks Poney.
Thank you, Laoshi! I learned a great deal.
Thanks, always nice to hear that.
A look at the Taiji spear in practical application would be interesting.
Great idea, thanks. At the moment, we are concentrating on sword, but spear would be good...
Thanks for the lesson, you really know your stuff!
Great video Laoshi! Can you do a training video on the Willow Leaf Sabre?
This was just wonderful! I learned so much! Thank you!
Wonderful! So informative, while thoroughly entertaining. A real pleasure! Many thanks.
I love antique swords from around the world, but it's hard to find English language resources on the Chinese ones. More closeups of the various parts of any antiques (showing things like the cross section, thickness and distal taper, as well as the details of the grips) and maybe some age estimates would be much appreciated.
I really enjoyed this video! I subscribed to your channel and plan o watch all your videos and practice with your training videos. I love the professionalism you display. I’m also wondering if you plan on making any videos about Han Dynasty Jian swords.
Yes, we just released a new video on the Qing New Army Saber, more on on the way...
Do you have any plans to talk about the balancing of jian?
I was thinking about an episode on choose a proper practice jian and I would certainly discuss POB there. Thanks for your input.
Well presented. Very informative. Would love to see some shuang shou jian material on here sometime as well.
Thanks, that is on the to do list.
Very interesting video!
Thank you, Sir
Our Pleasure, thanks for your support!
Marvelous! Thank you for making another great informative video.
Would there be another video about "Jian"?
What about Ming jian?
Looking forward to you next video!
Did you catch the video we made about Qing Jian_ ruclips.net/video/WUmT1SN8J04/видео.html.
Was thinking of one on Ming Jian, I would have to use a lot of historical illustrations, but it can be done.
@@scottm.rodellgrtc2969 Yes, I watched the one about Qing Jian right after it was posted! I also left the follow comment: Thank you for making and sharing this video! After watching it, I have a small question. It seems like most of the jians nowadays are around 100cm at full length. Which is more the standard of Ming Dynasty (三尺) 3 feet. And most of them with welded steel blade are around 1kg to 1,3kg. Does it mean that most jians are too long and heavy? And therefore to my experience uncomfortable to handle?
@@scottm.rodellgrtc2969 Would be really wonderful if you could do that. Although, I can't wait to see it, please take your time to make it. I will be patient, haha.
@@sunny0928, Thanks, without a serious sponsor willing to fund these at the tune a several thousand each, we depend on volunteer labor. Fortunately, several of my students are pros. So we can maintain high quality.
Very interesting. I have a question. At what point does a long dagger actually become a short sword? Does it have to do with it's balance and how it feels to wield it?
"Kill demons, get rid of evil." Words to live by.
if you go to Shanghai you need to see my sword collection. all the special heritage of my ancestors, the oldest is the sword of the two turtles from the song dynasty that ancestor Zhao has two turtles on his sword made of gold
Any plans for a Rodell duan jian or duan dao?
That's an interesting idea, I wonder if there would be enough interest? At the moment I am working with a forge on a Rodell Cutting Miaodao...
@@scottm.rodellgrtc2969 Oh very nice! it is definitely a question of enough interest. It's hard to say. A lot of production forges don't make short swords. That could be due to lack of interest, or there could be a lack of interest or even knowledge *because* forges don't make them.I know I would want one, though that would definitely be a further down the road situation.
@Michael_S_K Not my usual area, but if you can line up a manufacture like say, Remington or Winchester, I'll see what we can do. It would have to be a Qing style matchlock though ;).
Scott, I'd consider getting one if you designed one. But I know your blades are well rated.
Chung jian and duan jian... This is important since the typology for jian is very hard to find
Have you seen- ruclips.net/video/WUmT1SN8J04/видео.html
@@mugenGRTC i actually recommended this to my circle
@@arpioisme thanks, we appreciate the support!
There is a legend about a famous sword forge with a name related to the seven stars I think. Interesting that it says long quan because the forge I think is said to be there.
Being that a Jian is a double bladed sword, why does most practice forms go through space as if its a single edge weapon.
The first short sword with 7 star may be a religion sword, religion sword for taoism ritual, ritual sword usually are shorter and with 7 star, 2nd sword is a religion ritual sword it written on the sword itself 斩妖 mean demon slaying
I'd love to put that demon killing sword to work.
Hey Scott, would you ever consider working with Han-era Jian? They're significantly longer and narrower and I would love to see you handle them as opposed to the usual broader, shorter Ming/Qing era blades
Thanks for the question. The short answer is no. The Han period was thousands of years ago and we simply have no real idea how they wielded their swords. I prefer to work with the teaching passed on to me by the living tradition.
Wow! Beauties!
can you make a video about paidao (single handed hudiedao)?
We are thinking of an episode on the Tengpai (Rattan Shield) and would probably include the Paidao in that. Thanks for your input.
and also I would like to see bian and jian mace or just ordinary mace
@@SonKaneOf Those aren't weapons we train, but I did cover them in my latest book: Ming Chinese Military Swordsmanship- www.amazon.com/dp/B08479KYT1/ref=sr_1_1?keywords=Ming%20Chinese%20military%20swordsmanship&qid=1580067546&s=books&sr=1-1&fbclid=IwAR3tXgDt3XU7kd5qfXCNtMqsJCAlza3JC38OXGFAWbnV-WzYCeU1KGPR-Xo
Your movements are so smooth and look pleasing! What is the kind of shirt on you?
Rodell Laoshi is wearing a traditional Chinese jacket.
Were these ever wielded with a dagger in the off hand?
I have never seen any period record or form that does. Keep in mind that the way one moves, the distance and timing typically employed in jianfa, keeps one out of dagger distance. There were however schools that used throwing daggers. If you are interest in Jianfa, you might like to join the wait list for my upcoming online courses: threeislandsmedia.com/jianfa
@@scottm.rodellgrtc2969 interesting, we try to get into close and sometimes extremely close range even with swords. :)
@@adrianjagmag, to be adaptive, jianfa generally keep a certain distance.
@@adrianjagmag, to stay free to be adaptive, we generally keep a certain distance in jianfa.
No, but some shorter jian and dao were meant to be used in pairs. Double dao is much more common than double jian though.
Five ways to improve your sword practice.
Great idea.
Very Good Idea. Thanks.
Duan Jian sword?
do you actually do sparring to test your techniques out?
Indeed we do. Full contact swordplay is the focus of our program.