10 Most Aggressive Fandoms That I've Encountered on Booktube
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- Опубликовано: 10 июл 2024
- Mike talks about 10 fandoms that have been loud and proud in the comments in his time as a content creator.
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#MikesBookReviews #Top10 #AggressiveFandoms 
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Hey Bookworms! Let it be known that aggressive doesn’t always mean negative. It can mean passionate, too. I hope I was able to get that across, since I’m part of all these fandoms as well.
Before anything else i just want to say i really like the books from the authors. But alot but not everybody but still ALOT of the Tolkien and Malazan fanbase is the most aggresive annoying pretentious and disrespectful fanbases i had the misfortune of interacting with. They both act as if there favorite books are the greatest while thinking to themselves that every other book series is somehow "inferior". these two do more to push people away from reading or checking out these books. Philip Chase is an prefect example of what a malazan fan should be.
Thank you for the content
Tolkien got ideas from other things for his work just like people get ideas from him.
Patrick's king killer books are like ordering a pie and finding out it has no filling lol I think that's part of the reason it's taken this long he has no idea how to do a story .
I'm 40 and not very familiar with manga/anime, just some titles now and then. But if I can recommend one manga/anime to You, I'd say try Shingeki no Kyojin (Attack on Titan). I did not read the original manga, but seen the pages and I think just go with anime for extra visuals/music. Anime is just heading towards its end but watching previous seasons, You would be in good place to catch up. Storytelling - masterpiece, compelling characters, universal themes. And very vocal fandom ;)
The ending of the Attack on Titan comic (manga) was so bad that it retroactively soured me on the series as a whole.
@@lsdeann_3293 That's debatable. With time came acceptance.
“I’m not the fing cliff notes guy” should be your new tag line for every video. Haha
I laughed so hard at that line lmao
My absolute favorite thing about your channel is that you DON'T harp on authors and how they're supposedly terrible people. I can't watch other channels who do that!
And I never will.
I definitely hear you on your comment on HP Lovecraft. I'm black and he wouldn't have been fond of me at all, but there's still works that I enjoy and want to read. I believe you can separate the work from the author. It's one thing to read and enjoy a piece work and another to support all actions of someone who's been proven to not have been that great of a person. These days in light of cancel culture, I do feel we lump the two together and get very cutthroat about it.
Lovecraft is also long dead so there isn't the additional moral quandary of financially supporting someone you may find detestable.
@@pootispants As a person who can't support artists who are awful people (like J.K. Rowling) I'd never thought about this. Maybe I can purchase a Lovecraft book and not have second thoughts about it.
@@DanielaLoteroTapias They do still print them, but it's also been long enough since Lovecraft's death that his published works (but not his letters) have passed into public domain (at least in Canada, USA, and the EU for sure). If you're on the fence but want to give it a try you can download them for free with a clear conscience.
If only it were always this easy. There's a handful of authors I also enjoy that have said questionable things (Dan Simmons, Orson Scott Card, etc.) and I don't feel like lining their pockets either. It's easy enough for me to separate an author from their work if their ideas don't bleed through, but not so easy for me to justify its purchase.
Look into the history of lovecraft. You have a great vid about him on weaponised nerd rages channel. He later apologised for the way he looked at black people but you also have to consider everything he went through from his childhood to adulthood
@@DanielaLoteroTapias why is jk rowling a bad person?
Did not expect Dresden Files to be number 1, that's a shame people jumped down your throat about it. As something of a huge Dresden fan myself, I loved your coverage of the series.
I tried listening to the audiobook of the first one and the narration was horrible. His cadence was weird and his incessant breathing into the mic took me out of it
"I never said I was the fuckin' cliffnotes guys!" Oh man, that got me laughing hahaha
I somehow missed reading The Catcher in the Rye when I was young. I tried it when my older daughter was reading it to keep her company, and I have seldom been more bored by a book. Hard to say if I would have liked it when I was in high school, when I thoroughly enjoyed Moby Dick and The Scarlet Letter (two books that seem to scar a lot of people). It's funny you experienced the Dresden Files fandom that way. So far, I've found them to be incredibly helpful, but then I've only done spoiler free reviews on the first four books. Always good to hear your take, Mike!
Omg thank you. Makes me feel a hell of a lot better knowing someone who teaches around this stuff (I think? Lol) that catcher in the rye was SO boring. I'm open minded when it comes to every book or series but when I got done with it I often wondered what did I just read or did I even gain anything??? 😄
@@drock3309 Since I’m a medievalist, it’s not in my wheelhouse, but I’ve read plenty of examples of excellent modern literature that I found engaging. The Catcher in the Rye wasn’t one of them.
@@PhilipChaseTheBestofFantasy thanks for the clarification! I've watched your channel a bunch but I don't think I ever got around to any videos of you talking about what you do haha
@@drock3309 No worries, and thanks for watching any videos on my channel!
I'm so disappointed to hear that Dresdin Files fans treated you poorly. Jim Butcher is such a cool guy and watching you talk to him and talk about his books was so much fun for me and it breaks my heart that other fans did that to you.
I absolutely love your channel and your energy. I'm like you and try and stick to the positive. Now more than ever, there's enough negative around without me adding to it. Keep doing what you, Mike. My job is super stressful right now and your videos are welcome breath of fresh air for me!
Walk in the light 😀
Good on you, Mike. I found your channel because I was sick of being preached to by the booktubers I used to follow. I much prefer people who can separate the art from the artist and are capable of nuanced thought.
I miss those spoiler reviews so much! Reading Dresden files along side them made me love the series even more ☺️
You're a brave man Mike.
The lovecraft fandom is actually insane. I remember one time in high school I brought at the mountains of madness into school to read at break time and the teacher took it away from me and said that kind of book is banned in school because lovecraft is offensive to people of colour. I paid actual money for that book and I was never given it back.
The crazy thing is Lovecraft probably had bad views but not much worse than the average person back then. He just seems to have become a bogeyman, a figure for people to rally against.
With no Lovecraft, there’s no Bloodborne. That alone justified his existence as far as I’m concerned!
Their is alot of Lovecraft-esque opinions on the POC side that no one likes talking about but if its a white person than its offensive
That doesn't sound like Lovecraft fandom, that sounds like someone vaguely aware of Lovecraft and his xenophobic/racist views taking it out on a student.
Wait, are you calling the people who want to ban Lovecraft his fandom? I mean, in a way it's a fanatical obsession, but that's not how that word usually works. That sucks your own faculty stole from you though.
What things/passages in any of Lovecraft's works are offensive to people of color, actually? I have not read all of Lovecraft, but I have read the most famous of his works (including ATMOM) and in what I read, there doesn't seem to be anything offensive, though its been a while and maybe I missed something? If there is nothing, then this was as ludicrous as people getting rid of the HP books that enchanted them in their childhood and forbidding their own children the wonderful experience they themselves had, all b/c Jo was stupid enough to open her mouth and get involved in the Culture Wars and political issues of the day.
When she said that Dumbledore was gay (years after the books and movies came to an end) in spite of the fact that there is absolutely nothing to explicitly support that fact in the movies or books, (and believe me, people have combed the texts) the world loved her. Now that she has said remarks that a lot of people don't like--and, conversely, there is also nothing in her books to support the views she stated; there is no trans-- or homophobia in her works) everyone throws her under the bus.
I think the whole Dumbledore family is really effed up and their backstory comes right out of a GRRM novel, but I don't jump to any conclusions from that. I thought it was great drama. And I certainly didn't think it said anything about her.
Now another interesting case is George Lucas and Stepen Spielberg. But this post would drag on for another 3 paragraphs so I'll stop here.
I always thought the POINT of Catcher In The Rye was that Holden was utterly fucking intolerable. Whoops.
I unashamedly love Brandon Sanderson, Way of Kings still might be my favorite book. But yes he is not infallible. For me Rhythm of War just wasn't what I as a fan wanted, a large chunk of the book focused on a character I just didn't care about. My kids love his YA books so I enjoy reading those to be able to talk about them with the kids. He does do a great job of engaging his audience in social media and being transparent about the writing process and he does seem to listen to the fanbase.
What character was that?
@@jsmith7888 I believe it was Venli with the POV chapters I didn't care for but it's been a while since I read it. I really wasn't that interested in the singers/listeners and wanted to get back to the humans :)
I was a little disappointed with RoW as well, but it was actually the opposite for me, lol. I was sympathetic to the singers like Venli and Rlain, since it was their home that was taken from them by the humans. I thought Venli was fascinating because of a certain event in Oathbringer and wished we learned more about the culture of the singers. I was told RoW was going to be Eshonai and Venli's book, but instead we got an overwhelming amount of chapters from Navani who was just barely a side character in the previous books. It was very jarring, and got annoying to read chapter after chapter of Navani who I couldn't have cared less about. I mean, Adolin and Shallan were missing from an entire chunk of the book. So yeah, definitely my least favorite of the SA.
I think Sanderson is *A* king of modern fantasy, not *THE* king of modern fantasy. That being said, I appreciate his professionalism as a writer and the consistency of his work.
@@janhavi1977 same man who cares about Navani? and her discovery of voice of roshar I didnt get why it was important
She's just a woman who love to be part where power circulation occurs
Apparently many liked her romance arc but how come your brother's wife likes you is this common in US or something
**grabs popcorn**
Your reviews of dresdon files are what got me into the series. I loved looking forward to watching each video after I finished a book.
Yep, fans can be passionate. Combine that with the anonymity of the internet and they can be savages. Great video Mike.
Mike I loved your coverage of the Dresden Files, especially your spoiler reviews. That was where I got to really see the things that you liked. I was more thrilled with your reaction of astonishment or disbelief to things that could only be discussed in the spoiler review. It is unfortunate the Fandoms are ruining discussions about said fandoms.
I never talk about books I don’t like. I started reading more because I felt that I would benefit from it. Gaining general knowledge, increasing my vocabulary, mono-tasking and generally becoming a better reader. I read a lot of different types of works. And I never give a bad review, I never even talk about books that I don’t like. It is a waste of time. I do recommend books I like.
I'm so here for this, really early apparently. When I first saw the title, the first thing I thought of was Brandon Sanderson's fandom. Which I am a part of, but the overall aggressiveness of his fandom has put me off of his writing a bit. I think cult-like with a very aggressive tendancy to defend his writing from any and all criticism would be an apt description. It's gotten to the point where his fans are non-ironically building shrines to him. Good on them if it makes them happy, I guess, but it's kind of creepy to me. I've decided to start reading his books in as much of a vacuum as I can so that the overly defensive and obsessive fandom doesn't impact my enjoyment. Which is a shame, because he really is a lovely person who I'm sure would be dissappointed in how some of his fanbase behaves at times.
And you know what else, Rhythm of War was a bad book. It was overly long and repetitive, and the Cosmere level stuff was thrown in there all willy-nilly, and the tonal shifts between serious/tragic and goofy silliness gave me whiplash.
Yeah. I actually rate the Stormlight Archive's quality in basically their release order. One and two, amazing. Three and four, meh.
@@AK-rq1cz I also rate SA in publication order. Altho I did like OB.
I honestly find the fandom generally very welcoming unless you have an unpopular opinion. The #FuckMoash movement, for example, is getting too out of hand. It's ok to hate a character subjectively, but to rationalize your hatred by making it seem like even the slightest bit of sympathy or understanding towards Moash is somehow a crime against humanity is ridiculous.
I think if Sanderson was marketed more as a "The best YA fantasy author adults can also appreciate" or "The strongest introduction into adult fantasy" instead of always "THE BEST FANTASY AUTHOR OF ALL TIME, HANDS DOWN!" the fandom probably wouldn't get the negative reactions that upset them. They are setting people up to be disappointed who have a history of reading a lot of fantasy. I read fantasy my whole life, starting with D&D choose your own adventure books as a kid, then Drizzt and Dragonlance as a teen, into First Law and GRRM as an adult, and I just found the hype disproportionate to what I found in the actual books.
I absolutely agree, I find I encounter the "you're reading it wrong" high and mighty attitude quite often there.
I always appreciate your honesty!
Agreed. Love Sanderson, but you get shunned if you say his works are anything less than perfect.
But... they are perfect :P
What you are saying about the Anti-Lovecraft fans is absolutely true. I am a huge fan of Lovecraft's stories and mythos and I swear I cannot bring up his stories online outside of Lovecraft circles without at least one person mentioning his issues. I am not diminishing the fact that he held very horrible beliefs, but I do not understand why he specifically is under attack so hard now. There are a ton of famous equally problematic authors and I don't know why it is just Lovecraft that gets this treatment. I have never seen people so aggressive from the get-go and so quick to call someone a racist or racist apologist for simply disagreeing with how his body of work should be treated. There is also so much energy put into hating him, I have seen books, things in TV shows, games, etc. that focus on his problematic aspects. It's just all very strange to me.
This hits hard within my core lol. Fandoms are the reason I don't talk about some books I've read or I'm reading at the moment. I don't get why people waste energy on tearing people down for an opinion 🤣😂.
Agree with you there! I think it is perfectly fine to have your opinions. I'm glad to see someone with discernment. You're never mean about it. Always love watching your reviews!
Some people are not secured in their own opinions and want others to have the same opinion to validate theirs. Love your content Mike, keep it up!!!
Your engagement is going to be huge on this! Lol
Also, I agree a little with your name of the wind take. I liked the book, but the characters were a little flat and the plot felt like just explaining the magic system. However, I really enjoyed the second one and I think it's better than the first. Though I think im the only one to say that lol.
Great video Mike! Sanderson got me reading again. But I feel the same about RoW and Mistborn Era 2. Wasn't sure if I was missing something or if they just veered so far from what I wanted. Keep up the good work
I agree with so much here, thank you for sharing! Made me subscribe just because of shared opinions - always nice to find another with similar tastes.
Geez 😞one of the reasons I don’t even want to identify as part of a fandom is the crazy hive mind mentality I’ve noticed in most groups. The beauty of the Arts is that we are all diverse and can have differing perspectives. That’s what makes things interesting. Really sorry to hear you had to go through these weird and extreme responses Mike! Love your spoiler and spoiler free reviews you’ve done on the channel! 🙂
Good stuff, Mike. It’s easy for people to spew toxic comments from behind a screen. Love hearing your opinions. Keep at it!
The wheel of time spoiler reviews were my favorite. Right after each book I had to see what my man mike had to say
Totally agree with you on the anti- Lovecraft crowd.
Didn't expect The Dresden Files to be the top one. Now I'm feeling really self-conscious because I may have been guilty of posting something about the series in the spoiler talks, sometimes when discussing that series I go really deep and it may come off as something I don't mean. I really hope I'm not one of those that left a bad impression on Mike.
SAME! Yikes I really hope my passion didn't present as me being a know it all ass 💔
@@s.miklaski2286 When you spend time on the Dresden subreddit discussing the series, you kinda get used to the deepest discussions about the series, that's what I love about it so much. Sometimes I forget that not everyone that read the story decided to go deeper into it.
They're great books to read a first time and you can get a lot just from your first read through, but you only start to grasp the bigger picture (and why people love it so much) once you reread it a couple of times and caught up on some WoJ's for context that are harder to be written in the books because of Harry's POV.
@@LightningRaven42 100% agree!
Keep up the good work! Don't let the haters get you down.
Never do.
Mike, just tell us. This was secretly a rant video to blow off some steam 😂
Really enjoy listening to your opinion on everything!
The Dresden fanbases devotion to accuracy is a part of the fandom that Butcher himself encourages. Watch or listen or read his interviews and his interactions with his fans. When he is not intentionally obscuring something to protect his plots, he goes into Tolkien-level detail on stuff in the books with the fans. And he makes it payoff in the books, where single details from one book get called back to sometimes 10 books later.
Keep up the good work Mike! What good is a booktuber if they are afraid to give an opinion. I always find you very fair and respectful, even if you don't really like something.
Same, it's why Mike's is one of my autowatch channels.
Wheel of Time fans when you disagree with someone about a minor thing. May the light shelter you if you don't like Egwene...
you clearly don't walk in the light if you don't like egwene
@@Isaiah_McIntosh I bathe in the light 😇 But on a serious note. There was a huge change in her character when Sanderson took over. She instantly became rude and all her decisions weren't very bright. I like her og character (Robert Jordan's). But Sanderson's version left a bad taste in my mouth.
Try not liking Rand 🤦♀️
Or worse, Nynaeve. Loving Nynaeve to death is the new, totally obligatory thing.
Hating on Gawyn and Rand.
Sorry, but that's really not, my thing. How things got so backwards, I don't entirely get it.
@@laurienesdahl6817 , oh, it's very "in" not to like Rand.
Bland Rand is one of the new basics.
I am so hurt and shocked that the Dresden Files is on this list. I am also a new fan but it has quickly become my favourite series (I am one of the ones who listens to the audiobooks on repeat) and it means so much to me. The fact talking about this series brought anyone any amount of stress (even tangentially through its fans) is horrible.
I am so so so sorry you had a negative experience with other fans.
I know you!! I just shared one of your Dresden vids.
@@Demonreached Hi! I hope you're enjoying the Dresden Files :)
Your Dresden series is what brought me to your channel and I thought your interview with Jim Butcher was fantastic. I shouldn't be surprised how a vocal percentage of the fan base treated you, though. A bit disappointed in my fellow fans.
As for One Piece, I've never read the manga either but I love the anime. Well, the English dub anyways (I have difficulty following any show with subtitles). I stopped around episode 628 (at the end of the Punk Hazard story line) sometime last year but will definitely continue watching.
Finally, I had no problem reading all four books of the Inheritance Cycle, but I can definitely see why some wouldn't have enjoyed it all that much.
Keep up the good work Mike, we love what you do. You are allowed to have an honest opinion and we can just take it with a grain of salt if from time to time if we don't like it. Don't let the haters break your stride.
LOL You got me with the final one... Didn´t exptect it at all. Actually I thought that if DF wasn´t at the beginning then it wouldn´t be in the list at all. I thought it was a chill community, not as intense. I love so much that series and love talking about it, but I´ve never enccountered a similiar situation to what you described. I might be too naive, though... Well, happy to be part of the chill section of the DF fans.
Brandon Sanderson reads very young adult. I feel like if I had read his books when I was a bit younger, I would have become a big fan but his books are just kinda ok for me.
Glad someone said it!
that’s how I feel about Wheel of Time, I just know 14-16 year old me would have been mind blown
They are super YA. Even stormlight to a degree. *very mild SA spoilers* Like when Kaladin finally meets Shallan and they joke about her stealing the boots felt straight from a Disney movie. Not even saying it is a bad thing. Avatar is in my top 5 TV shows and it has a very similar tone, but it would be nice if people were given those expectations going in. I will say his aversion to sex related things but comfort with sometimes shocking violence also comes off a little strange to me.
Sanderson is both an easy read (even his large books) and there’s places you know his books won’t go from outset. Maybe I just read to much grimdark days but those both sound like YA qualities to me. Not all YA has to be paranormal teen romance.
I very much like Sanderson but calling his writing YA does make a lot of sense.
@@ducky36F lol neither of those things are "YA". I read a lot of grimdark too but Sanderson isn't YA. We shouldn't normalize the thought that anything where the book is not beheading people and drinking the blood is not "adult" enough. There are spectrums of adult content same as anything else.
100% agree on Catcher in the Rye. I’d call Holden a c*nt, but he doesn’t have the warmth or the depth.
I appreciate your honesty in your reviews. I don’t need to just watch fanboys gush over their favs. You even pointed out some negatives in Dune which you said was your favorite novel.
Ironically I only found you because you did read One Piece. The whole reason I looked up this video was because you mentioned it in a OP video you did. It's fascinating how fans can be positive and negative. On another note, I read the first Kingkiller book when it came out and remember being impressed with how well the author showed the MC's arrogance. The dude was all it will take three days (or something, it's been a long time since I read the bk) to tell his story compared to the one day (night?) others had. But like by the end of the bk it really didn't feel like his story warranted three days, and I remember being so impressed at how the author showed this. In hindsight I question if that was his intent or not but I never did pick up the second bk lol.
Oh my gosh! Finally, someone else who read Tolkien before the movies and was absolutely fine about dropping Tom Bombadil in the movie version! My sister and I have debated this one often. :~)
I was fine with it too. I had only read the first book by the time Fellowship came out, but I realized at 13 that they had to cut some pieces out to make the movie fit in under 3 hours. Bombadil really didn't drive the plot forward in anyway, and omitting his part didn't affect the story. That was still my greatest movie theatre experience in my life. Even though the theatre was so full I had to sit in the first row and got a creak in my neck from angling my head up to see the screen for over two hours. It was just magical. That was the Star Wars for my generation.
I'm the biggest Tolkien fan ever, books first only and always...
And I can admit that Peter Jackson actually did Aragorn's character arc better than Tolkien did. In the book he's really a flat character, he's perfect from the beginning. But in the films he grows in confidence from self-doubt to strength. Also I feel like I'm admitting a really dirt secret, but when I reread LotR I skip the Sam/Frodo/Gollum parts. Just so boring.
I almost had a heart-attack when you said: "No Tom Bombadil? I couldn't care less!" He's one of my favourit charakters... 😂😥
People need to understand that there are currently 4 flavors of SW fan: stans that will take anything that is SW related, mouseketeers that guard Disney "canon" with their life, Lucasites that refuse to accept 7-9, and us old fucks that gave up on Lucas when he ignored the EU for his own (imo shitty) vision.
So yeah there's a lot of toxicity, gatekeeping, and mud slinging everywhere. Nobody can open their mouth without other factions trying to piss in it.
Ha ha this is perfectly described
Oh, and another thing! Regarding HPL. I agree that you should be able to separate the author and the work, though I guess everyone has their limit and I can respect that. I really enjoy many of his stories and you cannot ignore his impact on the genre. When discussing him I used to say what you just said. Until a friend of my pointed out that "But you know, it can be hard to separate an authors personal view from his work when those views becomes a prominent part of the work". So when I re-read a few short stories, I realized those views was quite visible at times. Do I still love his stories? Yes. But I also cringe a bit when he describes certain groups of people. And if I reviewed his work (which I won't because I'm lazy) I'd feel compelled to mention those elements of the story. Anyway, I prefer acknowledging that and keep reading and discussing rather than stop reading his work pretend he's never existed. I think Matt Ruff's "Lovecraft Country" does an excellent job of discussing and deconstructing those issues.
Bonus unpopular opinion: Dresden is the most overrated series out there. I'll duck and cover now.
I agree with you on the Dresden statement. Have never Lovecraft but still want to check it out.
Great video Mike!
I've read the Eragon books, the Sanderson books, Wheel of Time, the Lotr and I would consider me a part of the fandom, but I agree with you that they and their adaptations are not perfect
I"ve read the Name of the Wind and watched Star wars, I'm not considering me a part of the fandom. I've not read Dresden files yet
I don't read manga and I'm not interested in One Piece
I love that people are encouraging and excited about their favorite books, but it is sad when they don't understand that that we might enjoy different things
Wow, a lot of comments here! Just wanted to send my appreciation for having an honest channel. Always enjoy it.
On the topic of Sanderson, I think there’s a certain amount of fanboyism when it comes to creators who are interactive on these platforms (RUclips, Reddit, Etc). Krystoff for example. It’s as if they are afraid the writer will see their criticism and never autograph their shoe.
Mike I've been watching you channel for a year since Moid mentioned you, you know the ginger guy with the empty gun holsters!!!, I've never said it before, and I don't know why, you're a great narrator. Your voice and how you talk about books is just cream, and the actual content is lit. You're great. I now you don't like them but why don't you give a shot ar audiobooks? I'd love to hear you read long fantasy books
I’m still waiting for Audible to call.
Just made me laugh. "I never said I was the fuckin cliff notes guys." You are great.
Defending Catcher in the Rye is a full time job for me 😭😭😭
Watching this video waiting for a name drop..... Love you Mike!
Great video, Mike! Yeah, the old discussion about separating the artist from the art. Fortunately I can do so, or else I couldn't enjoy HPL's stories. And btw in this regard, the LOTR trilogy was produced by Harvey Weinstein. So does it make the movies unenjoyable?
As a huge One Piece fan, I apologize to Mike for rude behavior of my fellow fans. Mike comes off as a very polite guy and it is disheartening to hear that he was treated rudely.
I’m really glad I read all of one piece. I think it’s a thrilling adventure with a lot of heart, and I think watching your channel you might find a lot there to like. It’s millions of fans tend to be young, and many of them don’t seem to recognize there’s other stories you can like more, or that there’s parts of one piece that are frustrating and worth critiquing. I don’t feel like interacting with that fanbase at all on RUclips in particular.
They are certainly passionate.
As a Dresden fan, I love that you still enjoy the series in spite of some of us, thank you for holding up the mirror.
Thank you for all you do!
Thanks Mike for your view on Lovecraft. It truly is about the story. And he was great at the story.
Great video
This gonna be spicy!!!! 🌶
I personally understand where you are with the Inheritance Cycle. I did finish it, but I felt it went down hill starting with the second book. I absolutely loved Eragon. I also agree with you on Catcher in the Rye. I felt that way at 16, and when I re-read it, I felt the same way as an adult.
The Harry Potter fandom (and the related drama) is the one that's most mentally tiring to me. Both the ones who have been hurt by Rowling's opinions, and the ones vehemently defending her, are just exhausting (for different reasons). I miss the Harry Potter I grew up with. Now the fandom is just a cesspit of pain and anger.
That is terribly sad. I haven't been part of the HP fandom in many years. I heard a bit about JKR saying some things that upset the trans community, but I didn't go looking for details. Honestly, I love the books and I would like to keep politics, even the authors opinions on her personal views, out of the story. IMO one has nothing to do with the other.
@@carriehasson3655 Yes, but I think it's hard to do that with Rowling. She as a person is just so intertwined with Harry Potter... I have a lot of friends in the LGBT+ community, and watching how much this hurts them is heartbreaking. On the other side you will get abuse and aggression hurled at you if you say anything remotely critical of Rowling.
I'm just so sick of it all at this point, and got rid of my HP books last time I went though my bookshelves.
I feel like the original fandom (myself included) are not part of the bunch that are anti-Rowling. I appreciate the art for what it is and love it still. It's not like I see and chat with Rowling on a daily basis or associate myself with her. Has nothing to do with the fact that Harry Potter is a masterpiece
I understand the disappointment you must feel being let down by a writer who was extremely important to you in your formative years, but the thing I don't understand is taking it out on people who still enjoy the series. Everyone has their own threshhold of seperating art and artist, and the energy it would take to convince someone not to love something is 1) almost always wasted and 2) could almost always be aimed at something far more constructive. The thing is, it's almost untenable to only like non-"problematic" authors, you are going to eventually, either unknowingly or consciously, support an author who has done or said bad things, and then you'll have to experience the cognitive dissonance of either excusing those actions, or drop the thing you like all together. It seems far easier to just let people enjoy what they enjoy with their relatively short time on this planet, and enjoy what you enjoy. If you think someone is horrible and evil, enjoy their art once they're dead, or pirate it or just read something else. You always have options. (p.s. not directed at the OP, since I realize I am using "you" a lot, just ranting in general)
Oh please. She made one mildly insensitive comment and supposedly the ”trans-community” (in actual fact a subset of them) was hurt. Spare me the crocodile tears.
The Egwene truthers are some of the most annoying folks you can run into. Mostly agree with you, good vid Mike.
She's the worst.
I left a Discord channel today because of the complete intolerance for me calling Nynaeve an arrogant bully. But some of the folks there spend way too much time completely pissing on most of the main male characters.
Yep, Egwene is a pompous ass and a bully. I wrote once about how I saw little difference between her and Elaida and got virtually stoned.
@@RichieRich20000 Most of the main male characters had far greater flaws. Mat fell in love with and married a slaver and Perrin is just a pussy whipped bitch who would have traded TG for that cunt wife of his. The whole point is to show that they were all deeply flawed imperfect people.
@@mikesbookreviews Sorry that you were blasted by saying what you felt. I have been a WoT reader since 1990s and one of those ppl who loved your journey. I didn't realize so many ppl jumped on you because of not liking Egwene. I don't like her either, although she was much better in the show. People are allowed to enjoy what they want, it's opinions! Jumping down your throat over it isn't cool. I for one am grateful to you for sharing your journey and your thoughts. I loved it and hope you will continue WoT season 2. Hoping it will be more episodes 1-4 instead of 5-8;-)
Wheel of Time fans
You can tell them what you don't like about the series, they'll agree with you, but still be angry with you
😂
Lmao
Excuse me. I’m in this comment and I don’t like it. Please delete. 😂😂🤣
Hey Mike so I don't know if you have done this or not but I am reading through the first six dune books and just finished messiah and I didn't know if you had any reviews for the individual books. Love your channel by the way, keep up the good work!
I remember that I didn't have as much a problem with Egwene as you did, but I totally overstood what you were saying. Don't let the haters get to you Mike! Just keep on saying what you think.
Also I'm sorry you had the Dresden experience you did, but for what it's worth, I LOVE spoiler reviews and would totally watch if you brought them back 😃
What would you say on the whole are the most positive or helpful fandoms you've encountered?
Dune, Red Rising, First Law
I love the Dresden Files beyond a reasonable measure, and I'm really sad to hear that "fans" of the series have treated you poorly. I can't imagine anything but wanting to discuss it with others along the lines of "Oh, and this scene! Can you believe that?!" with just utter enthusiasm. And I've watched your Dresden reviews. I disagreed with your opinion on a couple of them (most notably Summer Knight and Cold Days), but you said you didn't like the Fairy court stuff, an that's fair enough. I remember when I was watching your Dresden videos in order, and I saw the thumbnail for your Changes review, and I laughed out loud. "Oh, he got there" I thought.
Keep doing what you're doing. We're never going to agree 100%. I enjoy Mistborn Era II, and I like Stormlight's Lift. Infinite Diversity in Infinite Combinations, Mike.
Mike I really enjoy your insights and although I'm not a big fantasy fan I do enjoy hearing your thoughts . Right now I'm reading She by H.Rider Haggard I guess it would be considered lost world fantasy. I'm like you and the H.P. Hovercraft stuff it was a different time back then I don't get some of Lovecraft's stuff but I can appreciate it for opening the door for Stephen King.
People who come at you foaming at the mouth because you don't enjoy the same things as they do with the same intensity could benefit a lot from simply considering that...that's okay! "To each their own" could bring them a lot of much needed internal peace. Fandoms being aggressive chase away a lot of potential newcomers, which is such a bummer.
100% agree with you on Catcher in the Rye
thumbs up for HP Lovecraft thoughts :) That's my opinion. One thing is the writing other is the person. I read books, don't read people. If I wanted to read people I would read non-fiction and I don't :D
Ouch. I'm probably biased but I think your Dresden reviews are some of the beat you've done. They're how I found your channel. But I know we can be a passionate bunch. I had no idea the push back was that bad. I hate that it affected how you review various series going forward. However, I know I will enjoy whatever content you provide. I always enjoy watching fellow nerds discuss books. I enjoy nodding along in understanding and taking notes for yet more authors to explore. I even enjoy when I disagree because other viewpoints are valuable and help me truly understand my own views.
Aggressive people can be awesome because of their dedication to the series that they follow but when they start to put people down and absolutely attack people because their might be a problem that someone has in that series is truly mind boggling.
Well MIKE! Let me tell you, man. Let me TELL you. If you ever, EVER disrespect something I personally love, you know what I’m gonna do?! I’m gonna…I’m gonna…
Probably keep watching and enjoying you talk, even about series I don’t care about or hearing your criticisms about things I DO like. And, I just MIGHT learn something? Grow as a person?
That’ll show ya ;)
😂
I’m a little surprised to see the LoTR community on the list, but then I remember that like a week ago the Tolkien Society got mad for someone tweeting a photo that was theirs, so it definitely exists.
Mike, when I go to a restaurant, I judge the waiter by what type of service they give....I don't ask his political beliefs nor do I sit in another section because I don't like his morales! So I agree 100%
One Piece... glad you mentioned it. I grew up with Manga, One Piece came after I got off it, I saw 10 episodes in a mid-season, I can see all the love it gets, it's such a huge story, but man, when you're an adult, it's hard to dumb down to this. I get all the love, but I was from the Dragon Ball era. That's it
I'm in my 50's and I started watching OP last year. Haven't read a single volume, but I did watch the whole series 'til I was up to date. I love it, but I can certainly see why others wouldn't.
Personal opinions / experiences with (some of) these fandoms below:
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The Inheritance Cycle: I've recently reread the books as an adult (now in my mid 20s), after reading it for the first time when I was around 12-13. I love the series, but I can see its flaws. The fandom is quite a devoted one, and whilst I don't count myself within that passionate devoted core, one thing I would love to see is a more accurate adaptation of the books to a movie or tv series. I think that with a bit of polishing, the world Paolini created could definitely translate well to that - he did write the books when he was very young, so it makes sense that there are issues with the writing that might make people not like them as much!
LOTR / Tolkein: I actually never got into LOTR. I tried reading the first book when I was around 15, and found it difficult to immerse myself into the world. When I would mention this to friends/family who were diehard LOTR fans, I'd get such an aggressive response from them, that it has actually put me off trying again. I've never seen the movies, I've never read the books.
Catcher in the Rye: This was one of the options for studying whilst I was in school, but my English group was given Of Mice and Men instead. From the comments the other English class had about the book...I still haven't read it!
StarWars: I have a similar relationship with StarWars as I do with LOTR. I couldn't get into the universe, and then the fans were so aggressive it just put me off trying later in life.
Cosmere / Sanderson: These have been on my TBR for a while, but I've definitely come across the "Sanderson is infallible" mindset, A LOT.
One Piece: my experience with the OnePiece fandom is EXACTLY the same as you. I have absolutely no interest in the series, have never picked it up, and the fans have been so aggressive (this time in a negative way) towards my preference of not reading the manga. If anything was going to persuade me to read it, that behaviour was definitely NOT it.
As a guy who loves Dressen Files so much to the point that I have it as my fav series of all time, it was no surprise when you had it as your nr1. In fact, I was actually hoping it would be coz I understand the fandom.
But even I wouldn't go to the lengths of doing what you said others did. That's just overdoing it for no reason
Yeah as a huge fan it does not shock me lol
Sorry you've experienced some pushback! I completely get it - I started a Harry Potter series on my channel that I was excited about, and then something happened that caused people to leave some pretty harsh comments. I'm not on Twitter, really, so I had no idea what they were talking about at first. I had to take the videos down because it was just rough. I still love the books, and I'm also one of those people that tend to separate art from the artist.
Yeah, it’s tough to talk about Potter these days without the conversation in the comments eventually devolving to that. Which sucks, since there is so much to talk about with that series.
Loved this video! As a 52 yr old woman who reads manga and sci fi…. I usually have no one around me to share my opinions with on what I consume. I usually just enjoy the stories by myself. If someone asks me what I’ve been reading and I say Lord of the Rings, and btw, I don’t like it very much, they usually just ignore me. So when I see a fandom go crazy, it kind of perplexes me. I suppose that they love whatever series so much that they want everyone to love it as much as they do. I love to hear different opinions on a book or movie that I happen to like. A criticism can bring a new insight into understanding the text. Oh I agree with One Piece. I tried to read it and…. Gave it up after a few volumes. It just wasn’t for me, and that was ok!
A shame because the first 60 volumes of OP are only the prologue
@@gilbertozambrano6182 I read a fair amount of volumes, I stopped after Tony Tony Chopper was introduced. Mainly because I wanted to know why they had a reindeer as part of the crew. To get there though was rough for me….it was a slog! I must say, the back stories of the characters are very good. I did enjoy those. Maybe some time in the future I’ll pick it up again when I have nothing to read. 😊
@@gilbertozambrano6182 I also read 50+ volumes of Kingdom and did not like it either! Why did I torture myself! That’s the other reason I stopped the One Piece…. A long lauded series that I was not enjoying… oh well.
@@moominkomet I gets way better shortly after in my opinion and a couple arcs later comes the Water 7 arc which is one of the best things I've ever read
Oh my God this is so funny! The way you talk about these fandoms has me laughing my ass off! 🤣 IT WAS HARRY WHO SCRATCHED HIS EYEBROW, NOT THOMAS! 🤣
Oooohhhh I love the Arrow season 2 shirt
I'm always surprised to see how some people are absolutely unable to accept that you have a different opinion than them on a matter. I can understand it can be frustrating to see someone not loving something that you cherish, and not understanding how that could be, but man, to each his own. I can be passionnate about some things, and I would really want the people around me to be passionnate about them too, but I can temper myself and tell myself to let people love what they love. It can be an interesting opportunity to discuss things with them, and they might make you see the other side of the coin.
It is a bit harder for me to separate the artist from the art. It's hard for me not that have that idea that that person did X terrible thing when I'm reading their book, or viewing their stuff. I'm still a big Lovecraft fan, though. I think it's easier for me to accept how he was because at the time he was alive, his views were more prevalent. We find them horrible nowadays, but I can put them in their historical context, and it lessens my discomfort. Still, while for example, I love some of the things in the short story "Herbert West : Re-Animator", I am made really uncomfortable by some part of that story, and it prevents me from recommanding it to friends, or from including it in a favourite list. But that's just me, and if people want to praise that story, I will respect it and won't go accusing them of being racist for it. If they can separate the man from the art, and view the racist text as only the view of the narrator, more power to them! They can enjoy the piece, while I can't.
It's a bit more difficult with modern creators. They live in the same world as I do, and if they entertain certain prejudices, it bothers me more. But again, I might discuss my discomfort with people who praise that person, and I will say that I do not wish to engage in that fandom because of it, but I would never force anyone to abandon a fandom because of my discomfort. It's their choice, and I will respect it, even if I don't agree.
I guess that's the key : respect. People are allowed to have an array of opinions, to have their likes and dislikes, to interpret things a certain way, and that's fine. I wish being passionnate about a subject wouldn't mean for some people that they forget this, and get very aggressive and protective of what they like or hate.
My friend where is the rest of your Berserk Review? Love your channel btw
You had me laughing so hard, I had to pause the video. I needed this tonight ( a good laugh)!!! The One Piece had me dying!!!! 🤣. I get raked over when I say I don’t care for Neil Diamond or The Smiths. The Smith fans especially!!! O M G. I hear “How can you be such a music lover and not appreciate The Smiths??!!!!” I also get raked by my female friends for loving horror movies so much. Especially older ones that are violent. I say the world would very boring if we all thought the same thing.
People can be *extremely* passionate about the stories they love
I'm a lifelong sci-fi and fantasy reader, but only started dipping into the fandoms during the pandemic. I am always surprised by the ownership part of it- where their interpretations are the only valid one and that the work is sacrosanct. I'm a big fan of some books and do engage, but I see that everything is up for interpretation based on our individual experiences. Don't people get that it would be boring if we all thought the same way.
I have my guess locked and loaded!
Ahh a glass ego has a million excuses when it breaks.
I've mostly been avoiding fandoms these days. I've had one too many bad experiences the past few years, and the fandom I'm actively a part of for fanfiction reasons has it's own fair share of aggressive fanatics. With that said, the past year I've gotten back into reading and certain people simply can't handle the idea that I dislike books that they adore (which I chalk up to insecurity). I liked the first half of "Mistborn" but not the second half, and I thought "The Way of Kings" was WAY too slow and didn't care for Shallan. I also didn't care for "The Name of the Wind", and I borderline hate "The Eye of the World" and am currently taking a break from it. I also didn't really like "Storm Front" which is normally right up my alley.
Those opinions have drawn the ire of a lot of fanatics, and I've been told more than once that I'm simply a fantasy hater, and unfortunately it's turned me off from reading any more fantasy. I still have a few more books on my to-read list, but between not liking the books or their fandoms, it has me a little turned off by fantasy at the moment.
"I never said I was the fucking Cliffnotes guys" hahahaha! I love that
I miss the spoiler reviews to be honest. It's such a great feeling to be excited about the ending of a book and then finally get to listen to the spoiler review that youve been being suggested on RUclips!
I admit the only comics I've ever read were Calvin and Hobbes.