My DBD hot take is that a 60-minute match shouldn't count as a killer win. If you didn't kill the survivors, you shouldn't get rewarded for killing them. Technically they survived and evaded you for 60-minutes. But also, the survivors didn't technically escape, so they shouldn't be rewarded for escaping. BHVR should add a draw/tie result to the game
Until this video I thought that’s how it was! I’ve played DBD for years but never gone the full hour. That’s so crazy it counts as a killer win, I just assumed it was a tie. Adding this tie result would definitely help out a lot!
@@negentropyagent7337nope, no escape, just tie, he clearly said no escape for survivors, but killers didn't kill them, so they shouldn't get insta win, just a tie
I think the problem isn't the 3-gen style in itself but rather the hostage potential. If you are playing the game around a 3gen but still taking chases/killing people is one thing, but if you refuse to chase/hook and are actively aiming for the lockout time even if you had the chance to kill everyone before it that is when it becomes toxic Really cool to see Coco giving people the opportunity to give their side of spicy topics and encouraging actual conversation instead of just insults and unproductive behavior!
I agree. Here's how you fix this: After the 60 minutes, the match ends, and instead of considering the survivors failed and killing them, consider the killer failed (treat it as a killer DC), survivors escaped. That way killers can still try to 3 gen if they are in a very bad spot (not many hooks, survivors doing really well), but they can't straight up hold the game hostage and get their 4 kills that way. I think it's the only way, otherwise you will end up nerfing killers that shouldn't be nerfed, just because of a few players' toxic playstyle.
@@8_8787 They dont want to just leave, they want to win. They wont admit it though. It's so weird that instead of attempting to do gens and get downed, they'd rather run away and hide most of the time, then will say it's the Killer who's holding the game. The devs already said that Survivors who dont attempt to do gens are not progressing the game. Which is ban worthy, according one of their videos about 3 gens. Killers cant hold the game hostage, because the game will eventually end if Survivors actually try to do gens. Either they will open the door, or die. Either way the game ends, but, like I said, they want to win...and not just win, but have all of them escape so they can teabag at the exit gates and call you trash. If they lose, they'll dc and blame it on 3 gen, when they were the ones hiding the entire time, running on the empty side of the map, hopping in and out of lockers and windows. All you hear is back to back explosions from them doing that. I'm sure I'm not the only person who have ran into these types of Survivors. It's not fair that they can lie about being solo just to get Killers nerfed and we have no way of fighting it. Devs wont make swfs the focus due to players lying about playing solo. We can't really tell either because they can use 3rd party apps for talk. Get rid of balancing Killers around solo queue and focus on swfs, make it so they dont have to use 3rd party apps to communicate. That should make joining a team easier. Folks will claim that Survivor is not a team, but I beg to disagree. Survivors can heal each other, give each other faster gen progression, and pull each other off hook, all of that requires teamwork, does it not? So why cant we make it so solo is no longer a thing? The game is not 1 v 1,its 1 v 4. And as much as yall dont want the game to be competitive, you cant thank creators like Otz, and those who do deep dives into a game that's supposed to be casual. Some of you are lying and I wish more folks would be more honest about this. Have no one really considered any of this or were yall purposely ignoring it?
@@MrVIrginiaLUV "Killers can't hold the game hostage...." They 100% can, and is countlessly shown in a lot of videos. Not to mention a killer who just goes from gen to gen, kicking it with all gen regressing perks and never wanting to engage in CHASING SURVIVORS is 100% holding the game hostage. You're not wanting to participate in the ACTUAL game. (i.e. the ENTIRE POINT of dbd is for killers to find, chase and down survivors - if you disagree then you're just plain wrong, and if you don't WANT to find, chase and down survivors, then dbd is not the game for you and you should go play a different game - it's really simple).
My opinion on 1H 3gen trials is: i mean, if you actually sit the whole hour trying to break the master of 3gens then you're as insane as the 3 gen guy.
If I see a Singularity do this from the start of the game, I'll just go to the other side of the map and hang out there for the rest of the game. I don't need to break the 3-gen then. They wanna waste my time, fine. I'll go elsewhere. It's the same thing with when hackers would hold the game hostage and the only reason a 1 hour time limit was put into place. Ya'll here watching coconut, you know that's the only way to get people to stop. Force them to sit and be bored. I can play something else on my switch while they patrol their 3-gen for 40+ minutes
yeah this is exactly how I see it. I used to hack in DBD and i would make myself god mode when killers did this and just go afk and play something else... priceless watching them rage in post game about how im hacking lol @@ynglink
I used to hack in DBD strictly only to counter hacking killers/survivors if they wanted to be cheeky and pull out there rage hacks im going to make them upset at the fact they cant even kill me and then I take there game hostage for an hour @@brodiemorris2081
@@ynglink Tbh I rather go tot eh next game instead go to the killer and let him hook me, if he doesnt hook ill just hold shift and bleed out. As a solo q only I don't see the point in trying to crack a 3 gen for more then 15 - 20 min. If I wanted to play for an hour I would play league.
Nah, this isn't the case. They just don't have much empathy and take a higher competitive mindset into a pretty casual environment. It's like taking paintball guns to a laser tag game. It's more messed up and everyone's mad at you.
3-gen player: 3 gen is strategic and fun strategy that requires a lot of work and skill with little room for error. Also 3 gen players: *runs around ignoring the first half of the game to kick 3 gens over and over till the server crashes*
it is because they lie to themselves that they are having fun, its like face camping as bubba, its strategy and fun, no its fun to you cause you know its wasting the other persons time when they could be having fun
Zero self-awareness. He wants people to stop villainizing and remember that behind every character there's a real person, but doesn't seem to realize how he's willing to ruin the game for 4 other people because he doesn't want to learn how to play killer.
Kind of what I was thinking. "Think of the person on the other side of the screen" *while making four other players play a game 45 minutes past what they expected* I already feel like people who just bleed you out by slugging for 4 minutes until death are boring and showing the have no respect for other peoples' time. I feel bad if I've left somebody on the ground 60 seconds too long while I finished killing another survivor. Somebody who's willing to waste almost a whole hour of another person's time... That's a whole other level.
@@NotJarrod I'm fine with slugging when it makes sense, just not doing it out of spite or to waste someone's time. Also, one thing I don't get: If you get downed and there's no hook the killer can get you to, and you're wiggling, and the killer drops you. You can't crawl back out of range of hooks AND complain about being slugged to death. Crawl to a hook or just accept that if you're going to be spiteful, the killer can just let you bleed out.
To me it seems like he views everything the developers allows as fair game. What's not right is saying someone is a bad person and ruined the game for others even though they played completely within the rules of the game. Negativity should be kept in trials not in the end game.
@@HippieHeroTTV Give me a fucking break. So this person can theoretically hold every single match he ever plays hostage to the 1 hour mark and he's free from criticism because of it? You people are absolutely unreal.
Funny that you never see people trying to tell survivors how are they supposed to play. SWFS using third party software that gives them million times bigger advantage than anything killer can do, but somehow thats not a problem and killers just need to git gud ..... fking losers im i right ?
My biggest issue is the hipocrisy of him saying he just wants to be able to play the way he wants however that comes at the expense of all 4 other players' fun in his games. Shouldn't they be able to play the way they want too?
This goes right back to 4 man bully squads. they want to play the game the way they want too but at the killers expense. shouldnt the killer be able to play the way they want too? I see what you're saying, but what your saying goes both ways. What the killer does affects the survivors and what the survivors do affect the killer.
@@stevenzwiesler5104 you should watch Only A Ladd's response to this video. he says it very concisely: everyone is allowed to play like an jerkoff, but dont cry victim about it when you get treated like a jerkoff. roblox wants everyone to understand that there is a human behind every character playing the game, and then doesnt take that into consideration when he plays the most boring playstyle available. and if we take emotions out of it, 4 people getting upset is worse than 1 person getting upset; so technically and objectively speaking, the 4 man bully squad is more in the right than the 3 gen chess player. besides, if you have enough experience in the game, 4 man bully squads are the best cause they never do gens and they are satisfying to beat. the only real issue is when every match is a bully squad, but thats an sbmm/mmr problem.
He’s pretty much one of the only people doing this, do you really think that there’s a chance that the same 4 people are ever going to encounter him again?
He just wants to play the game how he wanted to exactly, it's not his job to make sure those other people have fun. No offense but get over yourself, do you stop at every single turn in life and make sure you aren't hurting anyone feelings for something you do? The answer for sure is no, nobody does and you will either way.
3-gens being seen as a complex strategy with little room for error is hilarious when they ignore a large portion of killer skill expression and prey on uncoordinated teams for easy wins. Killers who 3-gen from the start of every match also tend to get mad when they lose to coordinated teams.
I thought I was the only one who's eyebrows raised when they said that lol. Establishing a 3 gen at the beginning of the game and not doing anything other than defending those gens because your killer power / gen defense perks make it nearly impossible for anyone other than the most coordinated swfs to break it, does not require special skills or strategy lol.
Try to master a killer with a complex power so you can win - no skill, Kick gens for 60 mins and have less chases than the average 10 mins killer game - a ton of skill
they can do so much error and get away with it and it's not hard like chess, chess you need to think, this you are just a old homosapiens who kick the gen
Exactly, his analogy of “it’s like a chess match” is so flawed that it’s not even funny. for it to be a chess match you need to have both teams on equal ground in coordination then when asked how this applies to solo Q players he just says “welp too bad”.
I just had a sort of 3 gen situation earlier today. I was Wesker with call of brine and nowhere to hide (not specifically attempting to 3-gen, just picked those perks for slowdown and help with finding survivors). I had two survivors left and they’d gotten a gen really close to finishing, used call of brine to chase someone off of a gen and tried to hunt them down and hope that the other survivor would go back to the gen and I could get them too. But the two of them just ran away all the way across the map to the point where the gen has regressed all the way to zero and the last three gens had zero progress on them. Then I had to spend like 2 minutes wandering from gen to gen trying to find them, only to spot them hiding from me and doing basically nothing. If you ask me, holding a 3-gen is boring on both sides. Survivors don’t wanna see a killer patrolling the only remaining generators and regressing them all to zero, killers don’t wanna be helplessly scout the objectives only to see no one around. I dunno how exactly they should really fix this, but it’s clear that there’s a problem and I have hope in BHVR that they’ll find a decent solution considering how they fixed Skull Merchant and did a decent job with the anti-face camping mechanic.
Both sides are at fault here. Of course killers are never going to find survivors if all the killer is doing is predictably going from generator to generator. On the other hand, a survivor just mindlessly jumping on gens is going to get themselves killed, so it's in their best interest to not go to generators that killers are constantly sticking around.
@@NotJarrodLogically the best strategy would be to have someone take the killers attention so someone else can do the gen, right? your idea of what the best interest would be leads to no progress being done.
@@RedNayl if you're saying that it's not in your best interest as a survivor to actually escape the trial without being sacrificed, then I don't think your opinion holds much credibility to me. Tell me where "my idea" (even though I'm speaking about the general survivor role, not my own personal playstyle) is wrong at all? Your whole "leads to no progress being done" is exactly my point. Both sides are at fault because understandably, the survivors don't want to show themselves, and also understandably, the killer wants to stop them from completing gens. The whole idea being that, since both sides are so stuck in their ways of killers never leaving the gens and survivors not wanting to die, naturally it leads to a stalemate. Meaning things could be different if killers were less stubborn and left their gens for more than 5 seconds, and if survivors were willing to eat a little bit more risk. And as to the strategy of having somebody take the killer's attention... it makes it sound like you don't play much survivor because if you did, you would understand that the survivors don't control the killer like that. The killer chooses whether or not to chase, in this particular example. If survivor A is doing the beckoning emote to the killer while survivor B does a gen, there's nothing stopping the killer from just ignoring survivor A and continuing to patrol the 3 gen. It doesn't matter how much survivor A wants the killer to chase if the killer doesn't want to.
So what I’m hearing is they see it as a win cause the end screen gives them sacrifice bp so just make it so that both sides are given a tie since nobody really won. Survivors didn’t escape but also the killer didn’t really kill everyone. Maybe that discourages the enjoyment if in the end it’s just a tie
Bro that made me laugh, lmao. "What can players do to address this problematic playstyle?" "Maybe we should just let them quit the game sooner." Yes. That will of course make the game more fun to play. Especially because surrender votes are always unanimous and nobody ever disagrees within the vote.
Every strategy has a counter his just isn't commonly played so it's not known as well. Prove built to last hyper focus stake out potential energy overzealous and most importantly prioritizing breaking if 3 gens above all else at the start of the genre not when it's only 1 or 2 gens remaining.
@@NotJarrod Lol, this is not about fun, not about fun at all🤣I get his point, survivor mains love to laugh when the killers ragequit, but now when its their turn to suffer suddenly its not so fun anymore
This dude brings up 3 gen not being strong, it shows how he’s trying to cover up his own inadequate killer skills. He literally goes for the play style cuz there’s nothing an uncoordinated team can do against that. If stalling a game to server close is a win to you, you gotta look in a mirror and ask why it’s fun to waste 4 peoples time
I mean, people that play like this are just assholes that lack empathy skills lol. You understand it's not fun to play against, you know it ruins peoples matches/days, and you do it anyways because you have zero regard for how other people feel. It's incredibly childish and I'm glad BHVR is trying to do something about it.
People try to defend it by saying “I’m not responsible for someone else’s fun”, but there’s a massive difference between someone happening to get mad at how you play VS going out of your way to make people miserable. If you intentionally try to make people unhappy, that’s not you having a distinct playstyle you enjoy for gameplay purposes, you’re just an asshole who gets off to punishing random people.
@@vanillaseahorse4228I view it as protest, survivors need more to do and many killers cant do much against strong survivors. I play survivor and I often run non meta perks or no perks even in solo q and do quite well. It's tough because chase time and gen value on average sucks for killer which is why many use the same build. Killers need some perks to become basekit as well to help with gens.
I think that’s taking it too far tbh. If your day is ruined because of how somebody played a video game then I think a re-evaluation is in order. However, I do think that prolonging the match as much as possible with the intent of literally closing the server because of how long the match has gone on is ridiculous.
dude if i get stuck in a 3 gen scenario for longer than 30+ minutes im hitting them with an alt f4 tech real quick. it's not fun or interactive and it just turns into a neverending game of hide and seek which is dreadful and mundane
@@Clam_Chowder1995 I only play solo queue and everytime I go against people who purposely setup 3 gen from the start of the match in my experience it has always been unwinnable, it requires solo players to be as efficient as a swf and it's extremely boring. (my experience)
@@HippieHeroTTV can you please explain what is so fun and interactive about being stuck in a dbd match for nearly an hour if not that to just tap gens endlessly while the killer hits you and runs away so he can babysit his precious 3 gen that is nearly impossible to complete
@@tomatoes8631 it's pretty similar to what I enjoy in normal game prioritizing protecting vulnerable teammates, unhooks, time management going between different gens, small scale map rotations loops, timing great skill checks, working on heals, looping, using exhaustion perks effectively there is so many ways to improve myself in the game so it's nice every now in game to try and consciousnesly improve myself vs speed running every match and spending more time in lobby ques.
Of course! The solution isn't to remove 60-minute hostage games based around a 3-gen and a killer who refuses to chase, but to add a button so he can win faster. Makes total sense!
not really , the killer will still win for wasting 4 people's time because he is a vile person , and if he wants to waste 1 hour of 4 people , he has the option to do so , its just disguisting behavior if you are like this . im a killer main and thinking about playing 1 hour purely to make the survivors waste 1 hour , it would just make me a pretty sad person.
"i think you should recognize there's person behind the screen and not villainize them for how they play" "the survivors should be able to surrender to me, thats the only counter i can think of to how i play"
@@BTimes8You didn't, but I have other thoughts about your perspective. They could always remove the dc penalty and just give more points for the dc. Congrats you win. Everyone 'died'. I think, if you want to play the way you want, people can choose to not play with you like with any other activity. The surrender is just forcing people to play a game they aren't having fun a little less, but it's still the fundamental same thing.
like what another comment said, the solution shouldn't be to kill the survivors after sixty minutes. the killer did not kill them, it should not be a killer win. if it turns to a draw, then i'm sure less killers will do this playstyle and it involves nobody getting nerfed
@@self2999 except that solution would just create a new problem. Now if survivors are losing and want to troll the Killer they just need to evade them for 30 minutes and it's a draw, which is really not that hard.
@@gantref9202 Except the survivors don't win either in that case. A draw is a draw. Give everyone left in the game the "Pressure" event (it's like 5k points or something) and end it. No escapes, no nothing. Doesn't count for tomes, doesn't count for MMR. This heavily de-incentivizes it without punishing those that it happened to. You'll still have the occasional troll do it because people are awful at times, but there wouldn't be any footing to stand on with it being a "viable strategy". Especially since the game shut down is only a thing because of the cheater/hacker epidemic that DBD has.
@@ynglink there is no official win/lose of a game. Unless your advocating for a newly created status survivors can either die/survive or DC from a game. What status are you suggesting survivors have at the end of your idea?
I think this is unrealistic. There are enough people out there who like to waste other peoples time for the enjoyment they get of it of it alone, they wouldn't care. Also, making it a tie shouldn't, technically speaking, affect MMR. But in that case sweaty players who do this wouldn't up their MMR to match sweaty SWF's as often, leaving more of those 3 genners to casual teams...
That guys copium level is exactly how I imagined it for these type of players. He literally said "just give them a surrender button" because he knows damn well a solo team isn't gonna be able to do anything about it, and still cries about how unfair it would be if bhvr nerfed 3 gens because then he'd actually have to use his brain to win
I agree, I defend most playstyles but this is ridiculous. If I’m a survivor and I’m in a 3 gen match for over 40 minutes I’m just dc’ing at that point. This game is not that serious. I have no issues if a 3 gen is left over and the killer defends it because it happened by chance, but seeking out a 3 gen from the start of the match is just such a scummy way to play and isn’t a “chess match” at all.
Right?? Every time he answered I was like 'Oh FUCK all the way off, dude.' I mean you heard when he basically said if they ruined this for him he'd move to playing the next best busted thing that makes people miserable as if it was a punishment for not getting his way. And the irony in talking about how robust of a strategy it is, etc, when it's the same shit, different match. It was a whole lot of world salad just to say 'I like having more power than I should, don't fix things that are unequivocally busted'. Same kind of guy that gets any kind of power and abuses it, he's a whole 🚩. Including the fact that he continues to blame survivors for the 3 Gen situation yet admits he always chooses his 3 Gen from the start. 'It's a shame that everyone always thinks about that team eternal game with SM, they're only using the most perfect example of gens that I've never even seen [and they still got beat therefore it's okay (you know damn well he's thinking this)]. If you REALLY look at a 3 gen game, it goes by in 15 minutes.' NO. Four other generators go by in 15m or less because you CHOSE A 3 GEN FROM THE START. OH MY GOD. The ONLY difference between trying to break the 3 gen early and waiting until all the others are done is that on one hand you end the game with 4, maybe five gens done and more points. On the other, you might pop one gen and make fuck all for points. It is so disingenuous to sit around defending a 3 gen and then BITCH about the rest of the gens flying when you know damn well the 3 gen itself is what's holding the game hostage. 🤬
@@hyperboi4077 if the game is "not that serious" then why just dc cuz your not winning? I am just asking, if its an issue that the killer is trying to win as hard as they can but the game is not that big of a deal for you then why not just pretend to lose a chase close to the gens? That way, the killer most likely leaves you on the ground while you can just read a book or go on your phone waiting to bleed out since its "not that serious"
@@swedishketchup9600 this isn’t a case of the killer trying to win as hard as they can my guy. Dude in the video even states it’s not a comp strat because it’s not viable in comp games. This playstyle is counterable by a coordinated team with enough time and patience, but good luck trying to pull it off in solo q when survivors are not on the same level or are trying different things to break the 3 gen. And when I said I’m dc’ing I just meant that I’m not going to stay in a match like that. If the killer downs me and survivors don’t pick me up then I’ll do that. It’s not about getting out of the game because I’m not winning, it’s about getting out of the game because I have much more useful things I could do with an hour of my time.
One thing that this guy said that sticks out to me the most is when he said that the killer is a person as well who is trying to have fun (which I understand). And I want to say that the survivors are also people trying to have fun. And let’s face it the most fun thing to survivors is chase or helping their team. And I don’t think he acknowledged how un-fun it is for the survivors. I also didn’t hear him suggest making the 3 gen play style more enjoyable for survivors. Does he feel like other survivors should just give in and play regardless? I’m really trying to take in his point of view but I just am having a hard time doing so.
my take on the surrender option is that after say 20 minutes or however long the DC penalty should just be null and voided that way you dont have to rely on the other soloQ teammates to also vote for surrender, gets rid of the possible sandbag by voting no, and also lets the killer stay in the game and just continue what theyre doing without ending the game.
No hate to the guy but imagine saying your going to quit the game just because you can’t prolongue matches and 3 genning has been a core issue in every instant of the game for ages. It is never a fun experience for both sides in my opinion and is more prevalent in the comp scene. He might as well say oh I’m not winning matches anymore because of a boring strategy , Time to quit 😂. HUX might be nerfed which is annoying as it’s what the opposite to what he currently needs but we’ll have to see if they don’t and fix the 3 gen issue next year overall I can see where the guy is coming from but I believe chess isn’t something the majority of the community wants in dbd and why skull merchant ruined the game for most people he’s kind of restarting this cycle by showing his play style.
Some killers (speccially m1s which singularity counts as since he has all his power in the survivors hands) cant be played otherwise in high mm3. Either 3-gen or tunneling there aint no other way. Or play nurse. So attacking these strats and blaming the people for trying to win at the game is utter cringe and shows how the community deserves its own dissatisfaction. We alredy see tons of blights and nurses in soloQ thanks to whiney babys who throw tantrums the moment a weak killer has something going for them. Most recent proofs are the roadmap and trickster. Roadmap being a big "fuck you" for m1 killers with 3-gen anti mechanic and stbfl nerf, while trickster finally was strong in the PTB just to get utter nerfed again so they couldve aswell just left him be. As a killer i cannot choose to play whoever i want without knowing im gonna have a harder time with some killers than with others, there is no equal chance and many killlers are in bad spots. Hence why you see only the few same killers in rotation. and when playing soloQ, well, just yesterday we spawned with pig traps on. PIG... so unique to finally see a pig and guess what? My teammates instantly throw the game and act like entitled little babys because "muhh pig". Survivors say they dont want nurse all the time but they sure act as if they exactly only want nurse.
@@datboy038true we’re probably gonna get a 3rd skull merchant since knight can also sort of do this it sucks people want an optimised chess dbd when the average player wants around a 10min equal sided game
There’s a skill expression to the style but it’s very boring and based around hours in the game which shouldn’t count towards how you should regularly beat a kilelr at their gameplay
I play just solo queue. And I very rarely see a proper 3-gen killer. (meaning they pick 3 and defend them aggressively from the start) The vast majority of the time that the killer ends up with a tight 3-gen setup is because survivors just handed it to them. Where the survivors just mindlessly work the first gen they see without thinking of the bigger picture. I don't fault killers that then aggressively hold the 3 gen that the survivors handed them on a silver platter. Because of that, Deja Vu has been a staple in my perk lineup for a long time, even before the buff to it. Because right from the start, i can try to go work gens myself that will break it up and spread out the final 3.
I mention it till blue on the face, this is exactly it for me, every single one of my 3-gens is given to me, and it's irritating, I hate the playstyle but will defend a 3-gen if forced to, and it's funnier when I'm the bad guy for doing what I was forced to do lol
If he is gone from Dbd the game will only get better for everyone else Also, he even says no one likes 1 hour matches yet he plans to draw the game that long and wants to make survivors surrender after 10 min
If you enjoy 3gen playstyle - imagine for a second old hatch mechanics back. And every match you face map offerings and keys. I doubt you'll be pleased, man
23:37 you hit it on the head coco. Dbd was my main game for 4 years. Killer main, with about 20% of time spent surviving. I’ve played like six matches in the last two years. The problem with balance today is what it’s always been: *many* more people play surv than killer, and to keep PR in check and player counts up BHVR usually chooses to design in response to surv side complaints. That said, if anyone out there would like to do a data-driven analysis of the relationship between nerfs, buffs, and player counts, hit me up. I’m sad this game I spent so many hours with just isn’t fun for me anymore, but at least I can compile and analyze some data to see how much of what I feel / felt aligns with what we can track.
I agree with you. But I tend to think it's more the playerbase that has become the issue. Ever since MMR has been implemented, my games have greatly changed to people playing the least fun ways as possible. 3-gen is the lowest effort, highest reward option killers have now that tunneling and camping have base kit changes now.
I think that's the hidden cost here,@@ynglink Once you establish your design philosophy is 'placate survivors' you set expectations for current and new players that that's how you'll continue. If you deviate from that, everyone who's sticking around for that content / design choice will punish you for it - so it becomes a self-fulfilling prophecy, especially when you add in that bills need to be paid.
@@iantingen It's more of showcasing the core design issues of the game that create "feel bad" scenarios. This happens more often than not for both sides, even if they aren't detrimental to the actual game being played. It's why the game gets more negative comments than positive.
There is counterplay only in a coordinated swf. It's the exact same for tunneling blight or nurse with 4 slowdowns. Dbd has always been unfair I fail to see how 3 genning is any different.
because tunneling blight and OP nurse doesnt take 60 minutes, and at the very least the blight/nurse player gets rewarded for killing. 3 gen strats reward the a killer for not killing and punish a survivor team that survived the whole time.
And the only counterplay from the killer to a coordianted SWF is tunnelling blight/nurse. What's your point? Why is it everyone uses "but SWF is the only counter" when there is a killer strategy that's unfun and people want removed while never acknowledging the fact there isn't even counterplay for 95% of the killer roster for a decent SWF?
@@JCglitchmaster what percentage of killers games go against a swf? Be realistic. Maybe 10%? That feels generous too. I don’t think a swf should be the comparison standard for killer or survivor stuff.
@@JCglitchmasteryou’re not utilizing all your tools as killer if a swf is too much to handle. All killers are powerhouses in their own right but people have this mindset that they have to play nice and let everyone have fun. Tunnel, Proxy, Slug do whatever you need to win. Swf’s take advantage of the fact that killers try to “play nice” and use it against them. Unless you’re going against top tier players SWF’s can be countered. Even then, the amount of matches where this is the case is pretty low overall. The two strategies I absolutely hate though are 3-gen and hiding. Both strategies prolong the match and I’m just trying to play a game, if one match takes more than 40 minutes I’m out lol. I don’t care about winning that much.
My solution: if there is one generator left, given the 3 generators are in close proximity, if X amount of time (30 mins? Debatable) has passed now close proximity generators would be scattered throughout map.
I don’t know bro.. 1 hour is a long ass time for a single match, I’ve been in a situation where P90 Singularity played 3 gen without hooking us and it sucked. I feel bad if I leave my teammates and I really could get more xp/shard/bp playing more matches in that 1 hour. As a non-content creator or someone who has plenty of time to play DBD, 1 hour is so precious. Idk but Im pretty sure it’s pretty boring to 3 gen for killers too.. so just hook and win? So we can get to the next match 🤝🏻🙏🏻
Forcing four entire people to choose between 1. Melt your brain fighting for the gens 2. Go afk or 3. Straight up d/c is a lot more dickish than you think. No amount of mustache-twirling, "oh ho but you see its actually very thrilling and complex" excuses wasting this sheer amount of time, and ENJOYING IT 💀
@@hyperboi4077Well I don’t have a life, but still have responsibilities and most of the time I just want to crunch in a quick game like everyone else in my position. People like this 3 gen merchant need to stop holding people hostage for their own enjoyment. Find something else stimulating because 3 gens are mindless walking simulators.
@@Crispy_DAWGthen fucking dc, take the 50-second ban and get into another match. It's not likely at all you get into back to back hard 3 genners. And even if you do its even less likely the 2nd one won't kill you if for some reason you want to leave that match too. Like I don't understand that. If I had some shit I needed to do later or in the morning I'm not playing a game where other people can dictate my fun. Or I could you know control what I can and not stress over what I can't.
@@h445cry harder 😂😂. The overwhelming majority of hackers are survivors who hold killers hostage. You’re “being held” by your own stupidity. It’s the old saying of get good. You apparently aren’t. But you’re a damn good professional victim you waste of space
4:55 "If they're not gonna let me win, they should just be allowed to give up." isn't the killer supposed to......... kill? Make it so if the entity wins(endgame) the killer DOES NOT GET THE WIN! make a timeout a survivor win. Problem solved. The survivors did their job. They survived the killer. The killer failed their job. They did not kill. The entity should SHOULD be DISPLEASED by the killer. It makes NO SENSE
10:20 - No, he's completely wrong. The Killer's job is to sacrifice the survivors to the entity by putting them on the sacrificial hooks. You learn this shit Day 1. The survivors dying after an hour is a side effect of playing on dedicated servers (also so cheaters can't hold streamers hostage for too long). The devs chose to make the survivors die after an hour to encourage them to do generators (and thus interact with the killer) instead of hiding in lockers for an hour. In a perfect world with infinite bandwidth and no DC penalty the servers would be able to last indefinitely until all the survivors have either escaped or died, as they theoretically would if the trails happened in real life. I wonder what this guy would think if survivors automatically escaped after an hour instead of dying. Would he consider it a loss if all four survivors hid for an hour and magically escaped? If not why the fuck does he consider the survivors all magically dying after an hour a win? This so completely off base its not even funny.
Jesus, they make 3 gen-ing sound so deep when it’s so brain dead simple. You just walk between 3 gens and kick them if it has an ounce of progress. This dude gives singularity mains a bad rep
It's really simple - the fact is most people like winning. How do you do that with minimal effort? - by abusing different mechanics that require a higher amount of effort to counter those mechanics. In overwatch, it's playing Orisa into Reinhardt. In DBD, it's holding 3-gen hostage against uncoordinated teams. Both of these examples can be solved in higher/coordinated level of play, which usually leaves most of the casual playerbase furious about the topic - those mechanics are anything but a skill check for teams, but there are no teams in casual play.
"When defending a three gen, it's all about the decisions you make." You mean...lack of decision-making. Survivors run off from your three-gen...what decision do you make? Oh, just hit the gen and go back to playing a (mostly) AFK simulator game. Let's just face it...these are Killer players who play the game to the most basic and simple format as possibly can be: just defend the objective and let the prey come to you. But in a game that is marginally 95% solo queue players, these Killers truly are taking the Survivors hostage. Killer players have been desensitized to believe that every match is against Team Eternal, a 4-Man Bully Squad, etc. At this point, Deja Vu should become base kit for Survivors. And if a Killer kicks the same generator several times in a three-minute span, then that generator should automatically turn on, and a finished generator far across the map should turn off (by the Entity's doing). Now, your three-gen is ripped apart, because you refuse to chase Survivors and appease the Entity. And not to sound offensive here, but if this guy quits DbD because of the "three generator strat being removed," then I see this as a Win-Win. Honestly, who the fuck wants a match of DbD to go on for an hour? You have got to be trying way too hard at a video game...money is not on the line...you're not trying to win some famed e-sports cup or something. These Killers are just terrified of being humiliated with mind-games in chase. It all factors down into self-worth and self-esteem. They lack both.
So what should killers who don't 3-gen but are forced too because survivors pop like 4 gens in less than a minute get to remedy this? Everyone bitches about 3-gens and how they last an hour but when games last 6mins it's ok? lol I hate defending 3 gens, but bet your ass I'll defend one when I'm forced to by morons who can't pay attention.
@@XenoVT Honestly, you're a better Killer player if you play the game out rather than taking the match hostage. But people are always focusing on "did you kill all 4 Survivors? Did you out-mind-game them?" No one looks beyond a small, select scope. If Survivors give the Killer a three gen, that's fine and good. But if the Killer patrols it too hard, then the game should punish the Killer for "not appeasing the Entity" in its sport. Hence the strategy that "one gen turns on, another far off turns off." Besides, Killers are all using four perks that are gen regression and gen stall...you can hold any distance three gen with those perks, right?
@@XenoVT If the Killer starts ONLY defending the three gen, then the Killer has taken the match hostage, and yes, they should therefore be punished. Or would you prefer the Killer be punished for staying in a particular area the entire match, not leaving 3/4 generators? The "Surrender Button" is also this nitwits glorified idea of "an easy win" for playing brain dead and AFK most of the time. No...but if a Killer wants to "Surrender" for losing four gens and only focusing on one chase...by all means. Surrender for subpar skill. :D Look, I play both sides, I enjoy my Xeno/Wesker playtime, and I like to "get stuff done" as a Survivor. On either end of the story, holding a three generator is boring and tedious. I don't approve of it on either end - if Survivors do it to themselves, I don't feel a Killer should still hold it down and refuse to take chases; on the flip-side, as a Killer...I can't speak for three gens, because I refuse to play in that style - I chase, and I mind-game, and I'd rather the match end sooner rather than later. Besides, a lot of fun maps (to me) start with a general spawn of "three gen" and a lot of Killer players just outright refuse to leave that area, hold those gens hostage as hard as possible, and then the match takes upwards of 15, 20, 25+ minutes...that Killer should be punished for not playing by the Entity's game, and "sacrificing Survivors."
I could imagine devs doing a thing where say, once there are 3 gens left on the map, after a certain period of time, if no gens have been completed or have not reached 75% completion - then one of the three gens would "break" and one random gen on the map would pop up, ready to be repaired. Easily could add lore implications to this also.
They could also just clear the killer's score after the 1 hour and all survivors get some compensation. There would be a problem with cheater survivors holding the game hostage but at least this would deal with legitimate killers refusing to progress the game.
3 Gen solution idea: Killers who do this say it's because it's "like playing chess", well, chess has stalemates where both sides lose. Put that in to DBD. Killers didn't kill, survivors didn't escape, all 5 players die when the timer runs out. Hard loss for everybody. Also, the gens already have a solution available that the devs don't let us take advantage of- wheels and a push bar.haha Let the survivors move the gens around the map. Killers still see the auras of them so why not?
Yh it would work in a 3 gen situation. But the issue is that that would just build on the inequality between killers with high vs killers with low mobility. And although I dislike this 3 gen play style from people like this. If survivors actively 3 gen themselves (I.e the killer chases one person on one side of the map and the survivors just stay on the far side and work on gens. Then they should be punished late game.
@@benhayes5396 the thing is in the situations above its not survivors actively 3 genning themselves. The killer has decided on the 3 gen from the start, and even if the surviors leave the other gens alone and focus on the 3 gen being held they can't get it done bcause of the oppressive playstyle. As a survivor i ALWAYS bring deja vu and i actively only work on the middle gen of the 3 that are shown to me. But if a killer has made up their mind it doesn't matter.
3 gen idea: after the match goes on for 30-40 minutes a hatch spawns, it can be used once but afterwards endgame collapse activates. Endgame collapse also activates after the killer kicks the hatch. I know it might not fix everything but it's the only idea I have
@@plantozz1036 Yup, it was a 3 gen counter, but - since we are talking about fun here - its not fun for killers outside the 3 gen scenario when 4 survivors leave at 1 gen, or 3 survs at 2 gens etc. They made the right decision here.
@@MagicNash89 Exactly, the idea I had is it allows one survivor to leave the trial and then the hatch closes, but it initiates endgame collapse allowing the other survivors to leave as well
Add a new truly casual game mode (no rankings no mmr matchmaking) where: 1. survivors cant bring in items and iri offerings 2. killers cant bring iri addons or offerings Lastly: All perks are randomized and match timer is randomized between 15-25 minutes
“I think it’s incredibly unfair” that bhvr want to remove a hostage holding mechanic, well then I hope every cheater and their mother snipes this guy’s game and hold him hostage every waking second of his day. I’m sure he will feel differently
Yesterday I was held holstage for like 45min by a skull merchant with only 300hs. I have 2.5k and my other teammates were around 1.5-2k too. There was no skill involved, she started the match choosing a 3gen that were really close one from another, so she deployed a few drones on that side of the map, stayed around those 3gens and eventually we ended up dying because of the free injurees she gets now. So braindead and annoying. And at the end of the match, it wasn't enough with a 3k, so she slauged and slauged until she got the 4k. These kind of people take the fun out of the game, I hope when they nerf 3gen, they really quit playing the game, nobody will miss them.
Really sounded like he didn't want to say what it was bc he knows he already runs a non optimal strat that is only strong bc people haven't quite learned the counter yet
Dude, that is literally whole point of a 3 Gen eather the survivors surrender or they slip up make a mistake and get themselves killed. 3 gen is a good tactic
@@GCoffee2006 Btimes8's message is everyone should play how they want even when you're 3 genning. Remember there's always a person on the other side of the screen.
For this person I wish he would face old trolls who just hide for several hours and no interaction whatsoever with the other side. Also it seems more than boring to have these answers not being challenged once while the replies are cringe.
I really like this video format and if you do it again could you add at the beginning and end your initial and final thoughts about the interview and subject? I always like hearing what your opinions are on things in this game.
The core issue with the 3-gen setup is, I believe, a fundamental design flaw which has mostly to do with the extreme assymmetry present in the game- both between the killers and survivors, but also between different killers. Fundamentally, the game is one centered around time. For each second the killer spends, the survivors can "spend" 4- they have 4 people acting at once, and the killer is alone. The survivors need to spend a cumulative minimum of 450 seconds to do 5 gens (although this is reduced by perks and items, and increased when multiple survivors work on the same gen- though not by nearly as much with certain perks; and of course they need time to move between gens or do other things). The killer needs to spend their time chasing down and killing survivors- which inherently forces at least 1 survivor to waste their time not achieving the objective. At its core, that means the killer always loses after a small handful of minutes unless they do something to eat away at the time of the other survivors. This is why its so important to harass survivors, to hook, to kick gens, try and chase multiple people at once. Generically its referred to as "pressure" and noone in a given match feels that pressure more than the killer whose entire job is to create it. They are constantly on an invisible, unpredictable countdown clock to losing the game and they have to make every single minute action count to push that timer back whilst simultaneously achieving their own objective. This is why perks which dramatically reduce or increase the amount of time that needs to be spent on gens are typically hated by both sides- it can swing things dramatically in one side's favor by no small margin. Killing a survivor outright is one of the best ways to do this- it not only progresses your own objective, but also removes a quarter of the total amount of time the survivors can get and makes it so that chasing or harrying a survivor is removing a third of their available time rather than a fourth. This is why games can spiral to a killer win so easily after the first kill, because suddenly the survivors have so much less to work with- especially if they are having to spend time healing health states to extend chases or rescue one of their teammates off a hook in order to buy back their now very finite amount of time. This is also why highly mobile or ranged killers are the best, because they minimize the amount of time the killer needs to spend on finding and chasing survivors- they are simply the most time efficient by far. So, then why is 3genning so bad? If killing a survivor is one of the best ways to swing time in your favor, then why would anyone do anything else? 1- While one of the best, it is not *the* best. Many killers and perks have ways to consistently harry multiple survivors at once, rendering the "relative benefit" of killing one minute in comparison. Although it doesn't progress the objective, it does buy you more overall time than trying to kill someone does (slugging, for example, is in fact better than hooking for buying time because it disables a survivor for a far longer period and it takes much more time from other survivors to pick them up unless they wait- which wastes even more time- and doesn't get forced into fixed stages) 2- Difficulty. Killing a survivor is not easy. In fact it is very difficult in most cases (assuming an even remotely fair matchup in terms of skill/experience). Not to mention that it requires hooking a survivor usually 3 times, which means usually a minimum of 3 potentially long chases plus a lengthy period of picking up and then carrying and hooking (which is itself risky thanks to flashlights, stuns, and certain perks). As opposed to slugging which carries no risks and takes no extra time after a down. You buy more time overall, and get to use your time more efficiently. 3- Killing is not required. Precisely because of hostage situations being toxic, the game has a hard time limit. Unfortunately, it favors the killer as it is far easier for a survivor to hold a game hostage by permanently hiding and never doing gens than it is for a killer who has to do stuff like complicated and difficult 3gen camping strategies. Meaning that the killer's *most reliable* path to victory is to stall games out by only ever using the most time efficient actions. Slug, rarely hook, get hits to force healing and don't commit unless the down is quick n easy, and kicks gens/utilize gen regression. For 60 minutes. If odds of victory are all one cares about, then this is the winning strategy that is proven to devastate survivor's mental game possibly leading to a shorter, easier victory regardless. The core reason why this strategy is even viable to begin with is mostly because of the fact that gens even can regress at all. If, for example, only one gen could be repaired at any given time and only one survivor could work on it, but there was some kind of safety mechanic that the other survivors could work on to "protect" the repairing survivor, that would give the killer more incentive to actually chase and kill other survivors while working against their clock to remove the protection and enable them to actually stop the objective. Furthermore, perks which allow gens to regress (and by extension, perks which shorten the amount of time needed to repair) exacerbate the issue dramatically. They allow killers to functionally delete progress and survivors to make games unwinnable for the killer. VHS's objective has none of the same issues as DBD. Progress is permanent- both in terms of the "damage" done to the killer and in the progress towards building a weapon that survivors can make- and also easy to get (with several points for making the different types of weapon spawning throughout the maps) and no real way to dramatically alter how long it takes to achieve it. Furthermore, there is a skill contest involved with actually achieving progress in that the killer and armed survivors have to attack and dodge one another- which allows both to simultaneously progress their objectives and deny their opponents without resulting in a stall. But that is only one way in which the overall problem can be avoided. Generators as they are in DBD are fundamentally broken, they make stalling a viable strategy and the only way to correct this would be a dramatic rework to either every single regression and repair perk in the game to no longer do those things (and the removal of kicking, or the changing of it to limit how much it can actually do such that it can never net-negative and delete progress wholesale) or rework gens wholesale into an entirely new kind of objective.
As much as I would like to see a surrender system, my previous time playing League knows that NO ONE will agree to a surrender even if every single piece of evidence says they'll lose.
But most people often did. Also they can make it so you just get replaced by a bot when you surrender. Match goes on for anyone who wants it. If 4 survivor bots, killers insta wins.
On one hand setting out to stall a game indefinitely is a pain. On the other, some maps force you 3 gen. There's a difference between wilful gen kicking bs and being forced to fall back to it on a map like Sanctum. Whatever this roadmap solution is, I hope it doesn't affect the latter. Otherwise you're just being punished for bad map design.
Imagine for a moment things were the other way around. Survivors win if they survive for an hour in game. Now imagine survivors using a stealth style to avoid the killer for an hour playing Blendette with quick and quiet, urban evasion, Distortion and Spine Chill. And imagine that their proposed solution was "Add a surrender button for killers." You can bet this guy would go nuts. He's just asking for quicker free wins so he doesn't have to wait an hour for his free win. Honestly it's just as bad as the old key-3-man escapes. Except at least those didn't last an hour.
I was once playing as a Doctor for a quick match. I sent us to RPD because I had no more Jigsaw map Offerings and The RPD map was the only one small I had dispite as me being a killer Main I despise RPD, to Which I got Matched up with I think was a three or two man Swf. I ran Skill Check Doctor with Lullaby, Overcharge , Merciless Storm, and Distressing for bigger terror radius, combined with both Calm series which made my incoming presence heard miles before I arrive. Then As the Match progress the Survivors ended up unknowingly 3 Genned themselves, with all 4 of them STILL alive, so it was not looking good for me in the slightest even with the 3 gen. With two generators on the west wing on the top floor in a single hallway and down the stairs a generators sat in the locker room. I spent probably 8 or more minutes fighting to keep those generators from falling to them, and these were decent survivors, so they applied heavy pressure to the remaining generators I was not currently in positions to stall. to say It was Stressful would be an understatement. I had to keep using static Blast to make the survivors go mad to make them fail skill Check which with overcharge made them lose 5% more progress, with my lullaby gone that's all it could do. Eventually the survivors made mistakes and I slowly regained momentum killing them off, and eventually I got the Win. While I won that Match, It was a lot more taxing on my stress level then what I anticipated going in. Then one of the Survivors then messaged me Saying I only won due to overcharge, (Which to be honest It saved my Behind several times) And that the game was forever sided and said I quote " Your Overcharge Sucks along with your Doctor" To be honest I feel bad for them, given that I brought them there to RPD and used the skill check build, but at the Same time It was one of those Horse Race situations where both sides are Neck to neck and the outcome would be determined depending on who slips up first. But that Match was the most intense and Stressful Match I ever played as the Doctor ever, and I was not even trying to do a 3 gen strat, just using a skill check build on Tiny maps.
Surrender button would just encourage killers to play like this even more. Damn I would love to go for personal attacks against this guy, but i'm holding back.
this kind of person just want attention their missing daddy didn’t gave them. They do this in one game, when it’s patched, they go for another game and so on. It’s attention seeking and nothing else
It is a common misconception among killers that survivors believe the 3-gen "strat" is OP. Although we find it boring, that does not imply that we find it to be OP. What makes it boring? The counter play for it is boring. Chasing is the most entertaining aspect of Survivor. Therefore, it can become very monotonous very quickly when your playstyle or strategy is centered around holding a 3 gen and not chasing. However, the absolute number one reason the 3 gen "strat" is despised is because you have to play through a match that lasts more than 30 minutes every time you come across it. I've only played against this "strat" once in a solo queue, it was against The Skull Lady of course. We ended up getting to 1 gen because she pretty much refused to chase anyone outside of her 3-gen. We spent like 10 - 15 minutes trying to brake her 3-gen before I finally gave up because of how bored I was and just wanted to move on to the next match. I let her down me so she could hook me, but she decided not to hook me, and instead decided to bleed me out for the whole bleed out timer while protecting her 3 gen. It's not like she had anything to fear since I was on death hook, so while I was waiting to bleed out, I just tabbed out and started watching RUclips. After that match, every 3-gen killer I come across, I either dc or just go afk until that match is over.
I think the proper solution to both sides being able to hold the game hostage is having a second goal for survivors. Typically 3 or 4 gening is the way killers hold the game for long periods of time, so after the third gen pops there should be a way to for instance, search the map for hatch and have a special key spawn in basement that requires survivors to take a penalty like having their location revealed by killer instinct and be exposed to get out of a special chest. And so survivors can’t just hide all game, they become revealed by killer instinct after not doing any objectives for a period of time.
@@2bepower694 yeah, though then again, I do think over half the killer roster needs a proper buff. I don’t think killers like Nurse, Blight, Spirit, Wesker or Chucky would really care.
This is not holding the game hostage though, as confirmed by BHVR. Same thing with slugging for 4k or hiding in a 2v1 scenario, these things are not considered holding game hostage in BHVR's eyes That being said, I really don't understand what he means by mistakes being a huge impact on 3 gen setups and calling it more "complex" is just downright delusional. If you go into a game already with a strategy in mind (3 gen) and its such a simplistic strategy too, then there is no way this is more complex than playing a "normal" game of DBD. In games where you don't hold a 3 gen the margin for error is significantly lower, as you don't have anything at all to fall back on. On top of that you have to constantly make snap decisions that hugely impact the game, like what chases to take, when to leave a survivor, what gens to kick etc. In 3 gen all you have to do, is make sure that the 3 gens you chose are guarded, that's your number 1 priority, which is way simpler and easier to do. And I say this as someone who loves to play against 3 gen setups (as survivor). Also whats the difference between a surrender button and just giving up as survivor now... if you don't like to play against a 3 gen, just go to the killer and get out, issue resolved
He just doesn't want to believe that the 3-gen strategy is a strategy for braindead players because he doesn't want to admit that he is one of these. No, he is a smart player who plays in so difficult and intellect ways that one mistake can ruin everything.
Probably just means that by immediately conceding the entire map except those three gens, the game pretty much starts at the 3 gen, so if he does screw up badly enough to lose a gen, it's straight to end game. I guess an analogy might be something like if quadrupled the size of the skill check zones and disabling the auto failure when forced off during one, but failing a skill check incapacitated you for the rest of the match. Ridiculously easy to not fail them to the point where virtually nobody ever would unless they're like, distracted IRL or something, but technically devastating if it does happen.
hes talking about high risk high reward, for him its a reward but i think going into a match with the active intent to 3 gen setup is the epitome of boring... and if i wanted to play chess id fricking play chess lmao
@@liandre9035 I never said killers need to play skillfully, but being in an interview with coconut and straight up claiming that 3 gen is one of most difficult and risk taking strategies in the game is just downright delusional. I love playing against 3 gen myself as I like the long stretched gameplay that comes from it +the fact that it is way easier to pip as survivor if killer is holding 3 gen. Also the idea that survivors can accidentally 3 gen themselves is also dumb, if the killer wants to hold a 3 gen he will, so it really doesn't matter what other gens you finish at that point.
I am a killer main that never plays survivor. I don't set up a three gen at the start and hold it ever in a game. Sounds lame but I am worried this could ruin the game. But I didn't camp and I thought the anti camp was going to change. But it doesn't seem to have much of a change.
You SHOULD play survivor, at least once in a blue moon. If you don't see what they've gotta also deal with you're gonna have any otherwise good balance ideas skewed by bias toward your role.
@@MementoMori7777 I am biased about dbd for sure. I did play survivor when I first started to figure out some of the maps and really just what is supposed to happen. Now my wife is the only one that plays survivor. As long as the devs don't ruin the game I'll be happy.
You know the person have deep issues when they pay real money to play a character and just run around in circles kicking gens so they can get something from their pathetic life
The problem with this playstyle is the gamemode it is used in. DbD is a casual game, if your strategy requires optimal gameplay, it's no wonder most people will complain. Majority of players enjoy the casual gameplay they don't wanna sit through 40+games simply because the killer decided to do that one specific thing. If there were a competetive mode and it were done there I wouldn't complain but the comp scene would die right quick
If bhvr wants to discourage this play style, make it so the killer doesn’t get a win for it (maybe a tie) or make it harder for killer after X amount of time (maybe make hatch spawn). If survivors take advantage of the late hatch spawn by hiding, make hiding over long time harder. It’s not about removing it all at once. It’s about discouraging it so with time there is less of it. Also, when killer bot on DC?
The problem is that Behaviour sees this game as hockey, not chess. And hockey doesnt have a stalemate or draw. One side HAS to win. Thats a huge problem in the way they view this game
@@FinestFantasyVITo be fair, it would be hard to determine what would be a 'tie' because of how the game is played. The Killer is supposed to kill, and the Survivors escape. Like, what would be the in-between of that? 2 kills and 2 escapes? The Survivors that died would feel like they lost, the ones that didn't would consider it a win, and the Killer could feel either way.
@@FinestFantasyVI In big hockey leagues, there is no absolute time limit but, in smaller leagues during season games, there is a time limit where the game cannot continue. If neither team achieves the goal of having more points than the other, it’s a tie. In parallel, DBD has an absolute time limit where results must be determined. If killer has to kill survivors as their goal and survivors has to escape as their goal. A game where neither team achieved their goal would be a tie. But of course, there is other solutions such as forcing end game as an overtime. And any solution would basically be a rework of a game mechanic in the end.
The best bet would make it a tie, giving anything like auto hatch spawn after amount of time just punishes killers who are forced to defend a 3-gen the survivors gave them.
@@GuillaumePerronNantel I'm assuming the Killer would have to kill all survivors in this imagined scenario to avoid a tie? Let's face it: both sides will still complain. The Survivors would argue they weren't killed, so they won, and the Killer would feel like any kills they did get are being ignored, and/or the Survivors haven't 'escaped', so why would it be a tie? The community would have to make concessions that they just won't agree to, I think
you did not watch the whole video lol he said several times he wants a system where they wont take an hour and multiple things about how you can play around or make changes to help but you think he likes to take a hour? no thats not the point man
Ultimately, people play in a way that is most fun for them. Sometimes having that fun is to make the game unbearable for the others playing it, but I don’t think that’s appropriate to label every strategy you don’t like as. I personally hate playing games like this as survivor. It’s grueling and feels like a constant battle where nothing you do really matters, but I can see why a killer would like to play that way for more than “I want everyone here to suffer”. Micro managing everything around you and having the endurance to keep that up over an hour must feel rewarding. A one man ship patching up the holes to keep afloat. There is a skill to this strategy as it does require you to manage the gens around you over long periods of time. I don’t think I could keep up with that over that long let alone having fun with it, but someone else might. I’m not saying that this strategy is healthy because hell I hate going against it, but I’m glad there’s a way to play that makes people most happy. It sucks that what someone finds most fun sometimes causes others to get the short end of the stick and I don’t have any solution to give, but I hope changes that happen make it more fun for others without making the strategy boring for those who like it.
If I could add one thing to the game it would be a surrender vote is kind of wild. It’s not an awful idea but the idea that the top of someone’s wishlist isn’t balancing to make things more interesting and is just a way for 80% of the players to give up. I’m a killer main but I do sympathize a lot with the survivors, be the killer you want to play against.
This guy 100% has got some struggles irl and wants to take out his frustration out on other people. Maybe he gets bullied by his peers and feels powerless in real life. Truly happy people don’t feel the need to make others miserable 🤷🏻♂️
Ah yes '15' minutes....just to finish 1 gen.....for one of the best dbd teams with coms. So what about randoms? Id hate the only option he can think of is 'add surrender' so....how about something in game that can counter you rather then telling us to just quit?
Man, the lengths people go to hold the opposing team hostage for a default win only shows how lacking they are at the regular game. At that point, you've won but at what cost?
They should make it so when It pushes like 10-20 minutes you can forcefully disconnect without getting a penalty because I’m not getting banned from queue because I didn’t wanna play a 40 minute match
If your genuine response to “How can people counter your play style?” Is “They should just give up” And you have the audacity to say it’s completely valid and should be allowed to stay I’m sorry but I think you’re wrong on all accounts and if you leave when it’s gone I’m not going to miss you
I've actually played against coconut and Ralph (not stream sniped, saw their names hopped on twitch and said gg wp!). I remember each match and was screaming and laughing the entire time because it was a challenge and sooo much fun! Also, i died, duh... I've been held hostage by skull merchant types and went and USED the toilet, watched twitch, ate food and finally laughed from the relief that it was over. I'm assuming...well...ok, assuming the singularity has yet to receive a "great game, well played! That was so much fun!" Probably the opposite. Also, his response to "what if the devs change your exploit because 99.98% of the community HATE it?" Is to keep doing it in a different way. That's not someone who gets enjoyment from fun. He gets enjoyment from others suffering. I have a surrender button. It's refuse to pressure gens, stand on the hill and watch you play a 5 person game by yourself.
your statement is so faulty "that's not someone who gets enjoyment from fun" how the fuck is he enjoying it if he doesn't consider it fun, are you fucking 12? you are not the arbiter of what is "fun" you cant hold him at a stake and say he is enjoying from others suffering like half the player base isnt, they might not be doing the same thing as him. But to phrase it as hes the only one in this god forsaken community that enjoys messing with someone who made the mistake of launching up the game is absolutely asinine. He is a representation of the games community at its worst, dead by daylight stopped being about enjoying the game and it became about how to win by any means necessary after the balancing. Dont hate the player, Hate the game XD
From people suffering? Damn so when Killers get bodied without any physical way to fight back, it's "cope and seethe" but when it's survivors then it's evil? You're literally the embodiment of "The Bullies are 7, and the Bullied is 1, therefore, the Bullied is wrong."
@@Cynwale nah, I've just been playing this game way too long! Lol I just "dislike" seeing the "top" survivors getting carried by swf with seal team 6 perk layouts and comms and not top (like otz, coconut,tofu,etc.) but 7/10 Killers playing like they're actually a psycho, bloodthirsty, obsessed maniacs that must force pain on survivors. I mean c'mon games are for fun, I thought? Don't worry though, no one is going to understand anyone's actual thoughts and opinions through RUclips comments...
@@hopefulhank Your answer is acceptable, I'd say it's better than what I mostly see on Internet. But to one understanding, gameplays differs and vary a lot, bullying someone, is not gameplay, it's virtually targeting someone to harass this person and making him have a bad time. In your argument, you say that some Killers have fun being absolute maniacs that tortures other players for fun. It can happen, but they're trolls, isolated. SWF on the other hand, is not. When an SWF play to win, totally fair, nothing to say, but when they have too much fun persecuting the Killer, (At this point in my comment, just knows I forgot what I wanted to write.) it's something terrible that is actively compared to 3Gen or Tunneling etc... when in fact, it is not at all the same, since one of them is about being evil for fun, and the other is about winning the game. See what I'm trying to say? The dude in the video, he's playing to win, and Survivors want to win, but they're not ready to accept defeat when their skillset is not sufficient to beat a 3Gen, if Killers cannot beat a super SWF, they'll continue playing till they lose, which takes usually 8 minutes after they save the weak link multiple times, while for Survivors, they have the choice to play more smartly and agressively when there's a 3Gen or Tunneler, but for some reason, they consider that it's the duty of the Killer to lose for them.
@@Cynwale we agree on swf...I've been solo q survivor main since clown and this reminds me of Old legion walking backwards in chase to bleed out type of "winning". I'm not good enough to play killer and I'm serious about that. I am however decent at survivor since it's been really my only game of choice for YEARS! I can argue against swf all day and gladly will but the video is about 3 gen...and I'm making a stew of cheap killer tactics in my comments but it's killing the game...for me at least. Solo q will not win against 3 gen, even admitted/pointed out in the interview. Solo q will not win when tunneling out the weaker survivor forcing a 3v1. Not just because a 3v1 but injured, second/death hook survivors (especially "weaker/baby") more freely waste pallets leaving dead zones for more experienced survivors to have nothing. Killers know this and use it...This is what bothers me with current killer "strats". Like if the killer thinks they're LeBron then why do they only want to play against 5th graders? In my experience of red rank/rank 1/ like everyday almost for 4 hours at least, the moment the killer doesn't get the pallet from me or I vault safely they leave...to use the strat of take out the weak link. And when I see this I'm immediately bored and actually refuse to play (my comment about being on the hill watching the killer patrol). I'm not crying because I'm not getting chased (even though it's chase or gens) or ignorant of the fact I'm the obsession and there's stbfl, it's the blatant avoidance of me and no attempt to because the chase may last longer then 30 seconds and that could mean the scale tips to survivors "winning". There's only like 6 killer mains and 4 survivor mains who make their living off playing this game! The rest of us play for enjoyment and I don't see why it becomes this MUST.WIN.THIS.MATCH...AHHHH. lol I deleted and retyped and re deleted this message 3 times so what was said was said lol. I watch these spooknjukes videos of salty swf quiting because one died at 4 gens and I didn't' know of this problem because Im solo survivor main. So what I'm mad over may be caused by these type of people. On behalf of survivors I apologize for this but I refuse to play chess when it's tag and has always been tag.
I held a 3 gen a couple months ago for 59 minutes as pig on coldwind. I think although it is his playstyle, he is wrong, it is about the perks you use and how good you can manage and make judgement calls on holding the gens. You have to also mindgame and be aware of the pattern they hop back on gen. Because when you kick they are more than likely hiding around the corner to tap it or do it. And you have to notice when that happens so you keep an eye on it. Somehow i held it but i also didn't use perks for it or a killer for it. My stealth made it easy to identify what time they would go back on the gen. In my match i was being extremely aware of what gens they would hop on together. I had a good 3 gen and my stealth made it easy to make them paranoid ig so that made it work. I played like that once, that's when i was tired of losing over and over and over so i started to play very slow just so i could win. I normally play by snowball but without snowball perks, because i think that is fun
I think for me, one of the biggest changes I'd make is make it so neither side is rewarded for a game going till the server shuts down. Personally I feel a game hitting the hour mark should just be a wash for all the players. No bp gained, no pips gained, no pips lost, literally just a full wash. Killers get more control over the pace of the game, but survivors aren't completely helpless to the flow of a game. And that's maybe all that's needed. I don't really know how you 'address 3 genning' without some fundamental mechanic changes or adding in something specifically to deal with 3 genning, either by adding a perk, or an item that's built to do it. I did see the suggestion once for deja vu or a new toolbox add-on with the specific purpose of transferring a 0% progress gen and a random 100% progressed one, and make it usable only once per match (not even per survivor, just, once, period) that would stop survivors from trying to reroll to a strong defendable gen, but I don't really know if I like this solution. I also once saw the suggestion of deja vu's gen speed bonus stacking every time a gen got done if the same 3 gens were highlighted. Ie: 3 gens pop and suddenly you're getting like a 9% gen speed on those 3 gens and that sort of discourages the 'pick a 3 gena t the start' play. But I feel like this would be abusable, and people would start not addressing 3 gens just to stack this up competitively so...I don't know, it's hard. But unless you're doing it to annoy, I don't think anybody likes hour long games.
I feel like by just changing the spawns of some of the generators they could drastically decrease the effectiveness of 3-gen scenarios. Some maps will literally spawn 3 generators right next to each other just begging to be 3-gen’d.
Food for thought: What if instead of one of the sides winning it would be a draw instead? And each side would get the minimum reward? If the game lasts too long 🤔
I want to take the time to ask everyone. 1: If this game is truly casual, why do we have SBMM? SBMM is a competitive aspect of DBD where you get matches against people on your own skill level, or close to it right? Why does the term "Skill" even exist in a casual / party game? 2: If DBD is casual, why do people create tier lists? To determine which killers have the highest chance of winning correct? based on what they offer in a match right? So, if this community is casual why do they care about what killer is the strongest? You are just playing for fun, right? 3: If DBD is casual, why do both Survivors and killers use what we call "The Meta?" To have the highest chance of winning right? If this community was truly casual meta perks would not exist because no one would care about what the best builds are because you are just playing for fun because this is a party game right? 4: If DBD is casual, why does the community create tournaments for the game? Last I remember tournaments is where people go to compete with one another for a prize right? What is casual about that? 5: If DBD is casual, when you win or lose, why do so many people in this community message you GGEZ? They are stating that the match was easy for them because you did not provide enough challenge for them, right? If you play in a way people don't like on this game, they will tell you to "get good" and that goes for both winning and losing. So, why are casuals telling you to "get good" in a party / casual game? 6: If this game is casual, why do so many care about how you play the game? Killers hate gen rush and Survivors still do it right? Why? Because it works. No killer likes a 3-5 minute match but it is all about fun right? Fun for who? From what I see Survivors have no issue with doing something the killer don't like but yet when the coin gets flipped the entire community that mostly is made up by Survivor players have a huge issue when the killer is not playing how the Survivors want the killer to play. Killers don't like 3-5 minute matches, and Survivors don't like 30-60 minute matches. So, Survivors don't mind 3-5 minute matches because they got to 100% destroy the killer in a short amount of time while t-bagging the killer on the way out, and that was fun for them, and the community has no issue with that. But if the killer is providing any kind of resistance, or challenge, everyone seems to have a problem with it and cries to the heavens for a nerf. Do you not see a problem with this picture? From my pov this looks like blatant bias. From what I see the community only seems to care about the fun of one side. Have you ever just taken the time to wonder why killers play the way they do? Why do killers tunnel? To get a Survivor out of the match as fast as possible because they found a really bad Survivor on the team. This is not a scum of the earth move, it is called smart play. Don't suck as Survivor and the killer will not tunnel you. Killers tunnel for the same reason good Survivors rush gens. Tunneling is the killer version of gen rush. A killer forcing a 3 gen is not a scum of the earth move, once again it is smart play that requires a strategy. 3 gen strats has counterplay, sadly solo que do not have the teamwork to stop such things unless you magically get paired with 3 good Survivors that rotate on gens. 3 Gen strats are not a killer being op issue, it is a bad teamwork issue coming from Survivors and no one wants to accept that fact. Survivors prefer to blame everything but themselves for how strong a killer gets in a match, while knowing the killer only becomes as strong as you allow it to become. If the Survivor team sucks even low tier killers look like gods. If the Survivor team is good, they can make even the best killers look like shit. If you think I am just being some bias killer main look up DBD League, look at all the comp matches that take place in this "Casual / Party Game."
If there would be any vote, it would have to be for a Tie in case of a stalemate. In line with that, the game should end with a tie and as such the players should be rewarded with the points received up to that point, no escape bonus and no sacrifice bonus. BHVR intending to add a voice comms feature is what I've been calling for since Jan. '21 when I picked this game up again and have put in over 2k hours since.
It’s literally a dunning kruger effect moment. He talks about how “survivors just give up and don’t try”. Yeah because they’re solo queue and can’t communicate making it impossible. This just feeds into his god complex because he can pub stomp solos and then he justifies doing it by saying “Oh well I still lose to good teams though”
@@Tensixeight1I doubt most of the time they go into the game with the sole intent of ruining ppl’s day. I think that they know they will and they’re just fine with it because they’re playing how they want
@Smoke13211 i doubt they're actually going into the game to make people miserable. That's the outcome, but how do you know they don't genuinely enjoy the playstyle? I feel like this is a problem with a lot of this community. You're so quick to assume that the other side is trying to make your game miserable. Obviously, there will be some who are doing that. But not all of them. Probably not even the majority.
I was hoping to hear your side of the discussion after the call. I understand where hes coming from and gaving to fall back on 3 gens myself and facing them many many times i get where hes coming from but i think hes thinking far too one sided. 3 genning does make the match into a nail biter where every situation shifts the balance and it is beatable no matter what killer is doing it. For him to give the smug yeah they need a surrender button means hes thinking of it all in the term of endurance more then gameplay, where i will win given enough time so just give up so it happens sooner, and that rubs me the wrong way. Personally i think the counter or fix to 3 genning should be a end game collapse situation. Once you pass a 30 minute grace period either the gates are powered or the hatch spawns and end game proceeds the way it normally does. If your 30 minutes into a match clearly the killer and the survivors are too evenly matched and starting the end game scenario is only logical to push a conclusion where both sides still have a chance at clutching a victory.
The problem with this is that if 4 survivors are still alive chances are at least 3 will escape. Survivors could just run some insane hiding perks and hide all game forcing the end game collapse after 30 minutes and get a free W. This playstyle shouldn’t reward anyone and if we want to avoid these scenarios then both sides need to lose.
their advocacy for a surrender vote rather than meaningful changes to make it so killer cant hold a match for a full hour is deeply telling. they just want to see the win screen over and over again, its not about actually outplaying the opponents.
What angers me with these people is that they take advantage of uncoordinated players. People not knowing how to play against it is because most people play solo Q. Which is the lowest point in the food chain while swf makes the game not fun for everyone
I can't help but agree with the oppressive nature of rare play styles. I've recently started using hag with 4 hex perks and it's BRUTAL for survivors. Especially after I figured out how to get efficient devour hope stacks. It's not that I'm particularly good, it's just that no one seems to know how to counter her traps anymore.
@@hyperboi4077 agreed, I bring the hex perks to balance it a little more. If they don't cleanse totems, they get punished. If they cleanse totems, they are kinda punished with hallowed ground. My main point was that hag is stronger than she should be simply because no one plays her. She absolutely can be an oppressive 3 gen killer with her teleporting. I mean come on she gets 10 traps and a base 40m range. Which can be increased dramatically.
@@grimreaper8575 yeah I watched a not so great hag make a come back on a ttv I watch recently. She was protecting one hex totem all game and they got all but one gen done with only one hook and they threw so hard because they didn’t know how to play around her traps. I think that the niche aspect of going against a killer like that does make them inherently stronger.
bro says blight and nurse for 3genning, i bet he never played them cuz the 1 time he did he probably got 0 downs cuz ability actually takes the slight bit of effort to use xDDD
Agreed, people jump on hour long 3-genning games, yet trying to play a round only to have 3 pop in less than a minute and barley get to have a game is ok.
yeah they are not responcible for others enjoyment of the game but when you are making the game worse for everyone and keeping them in a match for an hour it's just scummy no matter how 'fun' it is for them, they should just go play against bots so other people don't have to suffer for his enjoyment. or just play against others who want to play against that cause most lobbys are solo q or swf who just want to enjoy the game
@@theoneshotfan150 if the survivors hate it so much they can just give up and surrender. If the game goes to 60 minutes it means both sides were pushing toward that goal. The few times I faced a 3 gen SM I just let her kill me, my time is way more valuable than playing that game out.
@@gantref9202 Doesn't that just reward people for playing in an unhealthy way (gameplay wise). This would popularize 3-genning from the beginning of a match as most people wouldn't want to add another 30+ minutes to the game, especially if they're in solo-q. Having people constantly quitting matches will make them eventually just stop playing the game and cause the playerbase to drop relatively quickly. Surrender votes really aren't the option here. DBD isn't a competitive game, regardless of how many people want it to be. This guy wants to play sweaty, he should go find people to play with that want that type of game. It's the same thing I did when playing Commander/EDH in Magic the Gathering. You tailor how you're gonna play with the people you sat down in the game with. If they're not experienced, you're only gonna cause a bad time and push them away from the game you like and they'll avoid playing with you specifically. It's the same reason certain killers have a much higher disconnect rate. Same thing happened during the over/brine + eruption meta when it was clear what was going on. MMR was one of the first things that caused people to start playing hyper-sweaty (on both sides) and if we continue having this mindset throughout the game and saying it's okay and "git gud", the playerbase will leave. I find myself playing less of both side pretty regularly because of this. Most of my games, survivor or killer, are full of meta choices (from SWFs to early 3-gens, to the same couple of perks every game). Make the game more stale.
@@ynglink In general I agree with most of what you say, but as of yet I have yet to see a good solution to this type of extreme 3 genning that wouldn't lead to/enable other problamatic behavior or just a straight up nerf to Killers. Also, I just don't think this will become a popular strategy (aiming for the 60 minute timer) anymore. With the nerf to COB/OC/Eruption a few patches ago it just isn't as easy to pull off anymore. The effort to reward just isn't there as it's not a super simple brain dead strategy anymore. Add to the fact that it requires effort that you need to play a single match for 60 minutes and I think the pool of players that are willing to engage in this strategy are pretty limited.
Even tho, if you are not am coordinated team the chances of you breaking the 3-gen are minimal if the killer has more than half functional bran. This playstyle should not be as strong as it is, because if you know what you are doing as a kille and is using the right perks and with the true intent on holding the game “””hostage””” for one entire hour just for the 4k its not really that cool. And I’m not an survivor main. Im actually an killer main. I know how unfun 3-gen is on both sides because just going around and kicking gens for 1 hour straight is everything but skilful
My DBD hot take is that a 60-minute match shouldn't count as a killer win. If you didn't kill the survivors, you shouldn't get rewarded for killing them. Technically they survived and evaded you for 60-minutes. But also, the survivors didn't technically escape, so they shouldn't be rewarded for escaping. BHVR should add a draw/tie result to the game
Honestly? Agreed.
You might be on to something
Until this video I thought that’s how it was! I’ve played DBD for years but never gone the full hour. That’s so crazy it counts as a killer win, I just assumed it was a tie. Adding this tie result would definitely help out a lot!
So we are giving survivors a 3rd way to "escape"? Nah dude.
@@negentropyagent7337nope, no escape, just tie, he clearly said no escape for survivors, but killers didn't kill them, so they shouldn't get insta win, just a tie
I think the problem isn't the 3-gen style in itself but rather the hostage potential. If you are playing the game around a 3gen but still taking chases/killing people is one thing, but if you refuse to chase/hook and are actively aiming for the lockout time even if you had the chance to kill everyone before it that is when it becomes toxic
Really cool to see Coco giving people the opportunity to give their side of spicy topics and encouraging actual conversation instead of just insults and unproductive behavior!
Why do Survivors get to run away from doing gens and hide, and how is that not holding up the game?
I agree. Here's how you fix this: After the 60 minutes, the match ends, and instead of considering the survivors failed and killing them, consider the killer failed (treat it as a killer DC), survivors escaped. That way killers can still try to 3 gen if they are in a very bad spot (not many hooks, survivors doing really well), but they can't straight up hold the game hostage and get their 4 kills that way.
I think it's the only way, otherwise you will end up nerfing killers that shouldn't be nerfed, just because of a few players' toxic playstyle.
@@8_8787 They dont want to just leave, they want to win. They wont admit it though. It's so weird that instead of attempting to do gens and get downed, they'd rather run away and hide most of the time, then will say it's the Killer who's holding the game.
The devs already said that Survivors who dont attempt to do gens are not progressing the game.
Which is ban worthy, according one of their videos about 3 gens.
Killers cant hold the game hostage, because the game will eventually end if Survivors actually try to do gens. Either they will open the door, or die. Either way the game ends, but, like I said, they want to win...and not just win, but have all of them escape so they can teabag at the exit gates and call you trash. If they lose, they'll dc and blame it on 3 gen, when they were the ones hiding the entire time, running on the empty side of the map, hopping in and out of lockers and windows. All you hear is back to back explosions from them doing that. I'm sure I'm not the only person who have ran into these types of Survivors. It's not fair that they can lie about being solo just to get Killers nerfed and we have no way of fighting it.
Devs wont make swfs the focus due to players lying about playing solo. We can't really tell either because they can use 3rd party apps for talk.
Get rid of balancing Killers around solo queue and focus on swfs, make it so they dont have to use 3rd party apps to communicate. That should make joining a team easier. Folks will claim that Survivor is not a team, but I beg to disagree. Survivors can heal each other, give each other faster gen progression, and pull each other off hook, all of that requires teamwork, does it not? So why cant we make it so solo is no longer a thing? The game is not 1 v 1,its 1 v 4. And as much as yall dont want the game to be competitive, you cant thank creators like Otz, and those who do deep dives into a game that's supposed to be casual.
Some of you are lying and I wish more folks would be more honest about this. Have no one really considered any of this or were yall purposely ignoring it?
playing the game i bought in a way i want = toxic 🤣🤣🤣 how about let me spend my money how i want little monkey
@@MrVIrginiaLUV "Killers can't hold the game hostage...."
They 100% can, and is countlessly shown in a lot of videos. Not to mention a killer who just goes from gen to gen, kicking it with all gen regressing perks and never wanting to engage in CHASING SURVIVORS is 100% holding the game hostage. You're not wanting to participate in the ACTUAL game. (i.e. the ENTIRE POINT of dbd is for killers to find, chase and down survivors - if you disagree then you're just plain wrong, and if you don't WANT to find, chase and down survivors, then dbd is not the game for you and you should go play a different game - it's really simple).
My opinion on 1H 3gen trials is:
i mean, if you actually sit the whole hour trying to break the master of 3gens then you're as insane as the 3 gen guy.
If I see a Singularity do this from the start of the game, I'll just go to the other side of the map and hang out there for the rest of the game.
I don't need to break the 3-gen then. They wanna waste my time, fine. I'll go elsewhere.
It's the same thing with when hackers would hold the game hostage and the only reason a 1 hour time limit was put into place. Ya'll here watching coconut, you know that's the only way to get people to stop. Force them to sit and be bored.
I can play something else on my switch while they patrol their 3-gen for 40+ minutes
yeah this is exactly how I see it. I used to hack in DBD and i would make myself god mode when killers did this and just go afk and play something else... priceless watching them rage in post game about how im hacking lol @@ynglink
@@tom4208imagine hacking in a party game 😭😭😭
I used to hack in DBD strictly only to counter hacking killers/survivors if they wanted to be cheeky and pull out there rage hacks im going to make them upset at the fact they cant even kill me and then I take there game hostage for an hour @@brodiemorris2081
@@ynglink Tbh I rather go tot eh next game instead go to the killer and let him hook me, if he doesnt hook ill just hold shift and bleed out. As a solo q only I don't see the point in trying to crack a 3 gen for more then 15 - 20 min. If I wanted to play for an hour I would play league.
Coco is surprisingly good at interviewing people. Would love to see more of this format
It feels like an interview with a serial killer
It really ain't that deep
Right? What a weirdo
@Darksage5555 it kinda is if you think about it. I can bet massive money this guy isn't receiving love irl nor touching grass.
bro you need to watch actual serial killers
Nah, this isn't the case. They just don't have much empathy and take a higher competitive mindset into a pretty casual environment.
It's like taking paintball guns to a laser tag game. It's more messed up and everyone's mad at you.
3-gen player: 3 gen is strategic and fun strategy that requires a lot of work and skill with little room for error.
Also 3 gen players: *runs around ignoring the first half of the game to kick 3 gens over and over till the server crashes*
it is because they lie to themselves that they are having fun, its like face camping as bubba, its strategy and fun, no its fun to you cause you know its wasting the other persons time when they could be having fun
youve never three genned in your life lol
@@azurefoxbh9280 i have 3 genned in my life, it tis not fun
@@Gragel_Fragel right except for the fact that my reply wasnt directed at you hence they lack of an @
Zero self-awareness.
He wants people to stop villainizing and remember that behind every character there's a real person, but doesn't seem to realize how he's willing to ruin the game for 4 other people because he doesn't want to learn how to play killer.
Kind of what I was thinking. "Think of the person on the other side of the screen" *while making four other players play a game 45 minutes past what they expected*
I already feel like people who just bleed you out by slugging for 4 minutes until death are boring and showing the have no respect for other peoples' time. I feel bad if I've left somebody on the ground 60 seconds too long while I finished killing another survivor. Somebody who's willing to waste almost a whole hour of another person's time... That's a whole other level.
@@NotJarrod I'm fine with slugging when it makes sense, just not doing it out of spite or to waste someone's time.
Also, one thing I don't get:
If you get downed and there's no hook the killer can get you to, and you're wiggling, and the killer drops you. You can't crawl back out of range of hooks AND complain about being slugged to death.
Crawl to a hook or just accept that if you're going to be spiteful, the killer can just let you bleed out.
To me it seems like he views everything the developers allows as fair game. What's not right is saying someone is a bad person and ruined the game for others even though they played completely within the rules of the game. Negativity should be kept in trials not in the end game.
@@HippieHeroTTV Give me a fucking break. So this person can theoretically hold every single match he ever plays hostage to the 1 hour mark and he's free from criticism because of it? You people are absolutely unreal.
Funny that you never see people trying to tell survivors how are they supposed to play. SWFS using third party software that gives them million times bigger advantage than anything killer can do, but somehow thats not a problem and killers just need to git gud ..... fking losers im i right ?
My biggest issue is the hipocrisy of him saying he just wants to be able to play the way he wants however that comes at the expense of all 4 other players' fun in his games. Shouldn't they be able to play the way they want too?
This goes right back to 4 man bully squads. they want to play the game the way they want too but at the killers expense. shouldnt the killer be able to play the way they want too? I see what you're saying, but what your saying goes both ways.
What the killer does affects the survivors and what the survivors do affect the killer.
@@stevenzwiesler5104 you should watch Only A Ladd's response to this video. he says it very concisely: everyone is allowed to play like an jerkoff, but dont cry victim about it when you get treated like a jerkoff.
roblox wants everyone to understand that there is a human behind every character playing the game, and then doesnt take that into consideration when he plays the most boring playstyle available. and if we take emotions out of it, 4 people getting upset is worse than 1 person getting upset; so technically and objectively speaking, the 4 man bully squad is more in the right than the 3 gen chess player. besides, if you have enough experience in the game, 4 man bully squads are the best cause they never do gens and they are satisfying to beat. the only real issue is when every match is a bully squad, but thats an sbmm/mmr problem.
He’s pretty much one of the only people doing this, do you really think that there’s a chance that the same 4 people are ever going to encounter him again?
He just wants to play the game how he wanted to exactly, it's not his job to make sure those other people have fun. No offense but get over yourself, do you stop at every single turn in life and make sure you aren't hurting anyone feelings for something you do? The answer for sure is no, nobody does and you will either way.
3-gens being seen as a complex strategy with little room for error is hilarious when they ignore a large portion of killer skill expression and prey on uncoordinated teams for easy wins. Killers who 3-gen from the start of every match also tend to get mad when they lose to coordinated teams.
I thought I was the only one who's eyebrows raised when they said that lol. Establishing a 3 gen at the beginning of the game and not doing anything other than defending those gens because your killer power / gen defense perks make it nearly impossible for anyone other than the most coordinated swfs to break it, does not require special skills or strategy lol.
Try to master a killer with a complex power so you can win - no skill, Kick gens for 60 mins and have less chases than the average 10 mins killer game - a ton of skill
they can do so much error and get away with it and it's not hard like chess, chess you need to think, this you are just a old homosapiens who kick the gen
The most crazy thing is peaple defending these guys. They are losers in real life. Get a life! Pathetic mindset
Exactly, his analogy of “it’s like a chess match” is so flawed that it’s not even funny. for it to be a chess match you need to have both teams on equal ground in coordination then when asked how this applies to solo Q players he just says “welp too bad”.
I just had a sort of 3 gen situation earlier today. I was Wesker with call of brine and nowhere to hide (not specifically attempting to 3-gen, just picked those perks for slowdown and help with finding survivors). I had two survivors left and they’d gotten a gen really close to finishing, used call of brine to chase someone off of a gen and tried to hunt them down and hope that the other survivor would go back to the gen and I could get them too. But the two of them just ran away all the way across the map to the point where the gen has regressed all the way to zero and the last three gens had zero progress on them. Then I had to spend like 2 minutes wandering from gen to gen trying to find them, only to spot them hiding from me and doing basically nothing.
If you ask me, holding a 3-gen is boring on both sides. Survivors don’t wanna see a killer patrolling the only remaining generators and regressing them all to zero, killers don’t wanna be helplessly scout the objectives only to see no one around. I dunno how exactly they should really fix this, but it’s clear that there’s a problem and I have hope in BHVR that they’ll find a decent solution considering how they fixed Skull Merchant and did a decent job with the anti-face camping mechanic.
I would argue that what happened to you has nothing to do with the 3 gen aspect, rather the hiding aspect.
Both are problems either way. @@shabader7400
Both sides are at fault here. Of course killers are never going to find survivors if all the killer is doing is predictably going from generator to generator. On the other hand, a survivor just mindlessly jumping on gens is going to get themselves killed, so it's in their best interest to not go to generators that killers are constantly sticking around.
@@NotJarrodLogically the best strategy would be to have someone take the killers attention so someone else can do the gen, right? your idea of what the best interest would be leads to no progress being done.
@@RedNayl if you're saying that it's not in your best interest as a survivor to actually escape the trial without being sacrificed, then I don't think your opinion holds much credibility to me. Tell me where "my idea" (even though I'm speaking about the general survivor role, not my own personal playstyle) is wrong at all?
Your whole "leads to no progress being done" is exactly my point. Both sides are at fault because understandably, the survivors don't want to show themselves, and also understandably, the killer wants to stop them from completing gens. The whole idea being that, since both sides are so stuck in their ways of killers never leaving the gens and survivors not wanting to die, naturally it leads to a stalemate. Meaning things could be different if killers were less stubborn and left their gens for more than 5 seconds, and if survivors were willing to eat a little bit more risk.
And as to the strategy of having somebody take the killer's attention... it makes it sound like you don't play much survivor because if you did, you would understand that the survivors don't control the killer like that. The killer chooses whether or not to chase, in this particular example. If survivor A is doing the beckoning emote to the killer while survivor B does a gen, there's nothing stopping the killer from just ignoring survivor A and continuing to patrol the 3 gen. It doesn't matter how much survivor A wants the killer to chase if the killer doesn't want to.
So what I’m hearing is they see it as a win cause the end screen gives them sacrifice bp so just make it so that both sides are given a tie since nobody really won. Survivors didn’t escape but also the killer didn’t really kill everyone. Maybe that discourages the enjoyment if in the end it’s just a tie
Make it a safety pip with no BPs for anyone. That's gonna become so disliked so fast, no one's gonna do it. True waste of time reward.
4:25
-anything survivors can do to counter your gameplay?
-so dbd should add a "surrender" button
The absolute audacity xD
Bro that made me laugh, lmao.
"What can players do to address this problematic playstyle?"
"Maybe we should just let them quit the game sooner."
Yes. That will of course make the game more fun to play. Especially because surrender votes are always unanimous and nobody ever disagrees within the vote.
Every strategy has a counter his just isn't commonly played so it's not known as well. Prove built to last hyper focus stake out potential energy overzealous and most importantly prioritizing breaking if 3 gens above all else at the start of the genre not when it's only 1 or 2 gens remaining.
@@NotJarrod Lol, this is not about fun, not about fun at all🤣I get his point, survivor mains love to laugh when the killers ragequit, but now when its their turn to suffer suddenly its not so fun anymore
i did not call that counterplay
This dude brings up 3 gen not being strong, it shows how he’s trying to cover up his own inadequate killer skills. He literally goes for the play style cuz there’s nothing an uncoordinated team can do against that. If stalling a game to server close is a win to you, you gotta look in a mirror and ask why it’s fun to waste 4 peoples time
You are free to quit the game and go do something productive. If anything hes helping people not to waste time playing stupid game :D
@@psychotropnilachtan8869Why are you wasting your time on a “stupid game”’s content creator 💀
orrrr i play 3gen singularity because its fun
@@BTimes8 bro has fun ruining everyone elses fun. sign of a bad person.
its just a game its not that deep@@hyperion6187
I mean, people that play like this are just assholes that lack empathy skills lol. You understand it's not fun to play against, you know it ruins peoples matches/days, and you do it anyways because you have zero regard for how other people feel. It's incredibly childish and I'm glad BHVR is trying to do something about it.
100% agree. Playing a game that's meant to be fun, just to ruin someone else's fun is incredibly childish. People need therapy for certain
People try to defend it by saying “I’m not responsible for someone else’s fun”, but there’s a massive difference between someone happening to get mad at how you play VS going out of your way to make people miserable.
If you intentionally try to make people unhappy, that’s not you having a distinct playstyle you enjoy for gameplay purposes, you’re just an asshole who gets off to punishing random people.
@@vanillaseahorse4228I view it as protest, survivors need more to do and many killers cant do much against strong survivors. I play survivor and I often run non meta perks or no perks even in solo q and do quite well. It's tough because chase time and gen value on average sucks for killer which is why many use the same build.
Killers need some perks to become basekit as well to help with gens.
I think that’s taking it too far tbh. If your day is ruined because of how somebody played a video game then I think a re-evaluation is in order. However, I do think that prolonging the match as much as possible with the intent of literally closing the server because of how long the match has gone on is ridiculous.
Nobody should stop playing a game in a way they interpret fun just to make someone they never met hsppy
He unironically said, "If both sides properly played the match, it'd be over in 15 minutes"
dude if i get stuck in a 3 gen scenario for longer than 30+ minutes im hitting them with an alt f4 tech real quick. it's not fun or interactive and it just turns into a neverending game of hide and seek which is dreadful and mundane
That's subjective I find it very fun and interactive
@@Clam_Chowder1995 I only play solo queue and everytime I go against people who purposely setup 3 gen from the start of the match in my experience it has always been unwinnable, it requires solo players to be as efficient as a swf and it's extremely boring. (my experience)
@@HippieHeroTTV can you please explain what is so fun and interactive about being stuck in a dbd match for nearly an hour if not that to just tap gens endlessly while the killer hits you and runs away so he can babysit his precious 3 gen that is nearly impossible to complete
@@tomatoes8631 it's pretty similar to what I enjoy in normal game prioritizing protecting vulnerable teammates, unhooks, time management going between different gens, small scale map rotations loops, timing great skill checks, working on heals, looping, using exhaustion perks effectively there is so many ways to improve myself in the game so it's nice every now in game to try and consciousnesly improve myself vs speed running every match and spending more time in lobby ques.
@Clam_Chowder1995
lol add a surrender vote, this guy cant be serious.
"how do we counter this playstyle?"
"you stop playing"
add a timestamp to me saying giving up is a countee
@@BTimes8 sure 4:40
i said this is a way for casual players to avoid matches where they cannot win, skipping past what i said before that is very uncool@@madness1383
Of course! The solution isn't to remove 60-minute hostage games based around a 3-gen and a killer who refuses to chase, but to add a button so he can win faster. Makes total sense!
if server closes because of the hour, no one should win.
You know he'd still do it and consider it a win in his mind.
not really , the killer will still win for wasting 4 people's time because he is a vile person , and if he wants to waste 1 hour of 4 people , he has the option to do so , its just disguisting behavior if you are like this . im a killer main and thinking about playing 1 hour purely to make the survivors waste 1 hour , it would just make me a pretty sad person.
i don t see something wrong here
@@Tensixeight1noone forced you to stay till The end. Just admit you cant break 3gen and go to next game. You survivors do that to yourself.
@@HaiShamanhow about the killer admits they can't kill anyone with normal methods?
"i think you should recognize there's person behind the screen and not villainize them for how they play" "the survivors should be able to surrender to me, thats the only counter i can think of to how i play"
timestamp to me saying that?
@@BTimes8 ruclips.net/video/ar-8dUyGpkI/видео.html It isn't word for word, but it was said.
@@BTimes8You didn't, but I have other thoughts about your perspective.
They could always remove the dc penalty and just give more points for the dc. Congrats you win. Everyone 'died'.
I think, if you want to play the way you want, people can choose to not play with you like with any other activity. The surrender is just forcing people to play a game they aren't having fun a little less, but it's still the fundamental same thing.
not all survivors , he specificaly said "casual players" around whom game is balanced around , swfs can defeat those playstyles in those 10 minutes
@BTimes8 That's pretty much exactly what you said. Add in the term "casual players" and it's almost word-for-word.
like what another comment said, the solution shouldn't be to kill the survivors after sixty minutes. the killer did not kill them, it should not be a killer win. if it turns to a draw, then i'm sure less killers will do this playstyle and it involves nobody getting nerfed
This and set the timer to Thirty minutes. A trail shouldn't even take 20 minutes
@@self2999 except that solution would just create a new problem. Now if survivors are losing and want to troll the Killer they just need to evade them for 30 minutes and it's a draw, which is really not that hard.
@@gantref9202 Except the survivors don't win either in that case. A draw is a draw.
Give everyone left in the game the "Pressure" event (it's like 5k points or something) and end it. No escapes, no nothing.
Doesn't count for tomes, doesn't count for MMR. This heavily de-incentivizes it without punishing those that it happened to. You'll still have the occasional troll do it because people are awful at times, but there wouldn't be any footing to stand on with it being a "viable strategy". Especially since the game shut down is only a thing because of the cheater/hacker epidemic that DBD has.
@@ynglink there is no official win/lose of a game. Unless your advocating for a newly created status survivors can either die/survive or DC from a game. What status are you suggesting survivors have at the end of your idea?
I think this is unrealistic. There are enough people out there who like to waste other peoples time for the enjoyment they get of it of it alone, they wouldn't care. Also, making it a tie shouldn't, technically speaking, affect MMR. But in that case sweaty players who do this wouldn't up their MMR to match sweaty SWF's as often, leaving more of those 3 genners to casual teams...
“If they got rid of 3 gen I’d probably stop playing” ok good.
i feel like those people who play the 3 gen strat only plays 3 gen and only that gen and not playing other playstyle
This guy is not a "dbd player", he's just a user
That guys copium level is exactly how I imagined it for these type of players. He literally said "just give them a surrender button" because he knows damn well a solo team isn't gonna be able to do anything about it, and still cries about how unfair it would be if bhvr nerfed 3 gens because then he'd actually have to use his brain to win
Awareness 100
I agree, I defend most playstyles but this is ridiculous. If I’m a survivor and I’m in a 3 gen match for over 40 minutes I’m just dc’ing at that point. This game is not that serious. I have no issues if a 3 gen is left over and the killer defends it because it happened by chance, but seeking out a 3 gen from the start of the match is just such a scummy way to play and isn’t a “chess match” at all.
Right?? Every time he answered I was like 'Oh FUCK all the way off, dude.' I mean you heard when he basically said if they ruined this for him he'd move to playing the next best busted thing that makes people miserable as if it was a punishment for not getting his way. And the irony in talking about how robust of a strategy it is, etc, when it's the same shit, different match. It was a whole lot of world salad just to say 'I like having more power than I should, don't fix things that are unequivocally busted'. Same kind of guy that gets any kind of power and abuses it, he's a whole 🚩.
Including the fact that he continues to blame survivors for the 3 Gen situation yet admits he always chooses his 3 Gen from the start. 'It's a shame that everyone always thinks about that team eternal game with SM, they're only using the most perfect example of gens that I've never even seen [and they still got beat therefore it's okay (you know damn well he's thinking this)]. If you REALLY look at a 3 gen game, it goes by in 15 minutes.'
NO. Four other generators go by in 15m or less because you CHOSE A 3 GEN FROM THE START. OH MY GOD. The ONLY difference between trying to break the 3 gen early and waiting until all the others are done is that on one hand you end the game with 4, maybe five gens done and more points. On the other, you might pop one gen and make fuck all for points.
It is so disingenuous to sit around defending a 3 gen and then BITCH about the rest of the gens flying when you know damn well the 3 gen itself is what's holding the game hostage. 🤬
@@hyperboi4077 if the game is "not that serious" then why just dc cuz your not winning?
I am just asking, if its an issue that the killer is trying to win as hard as they can but the game is not that big of a deal for you then why not just pretend to lose a chase close to the gens?
That way, the killer most likely leaves you on the ground while you can just read a book or go on your phone waiting to bleed out since its "not that serious"
@@swedishketchup9600 this isn’t a case of the killer trying to win as hard as they can my guy. Dude in the video even states it’s not a comp strat because it’s not viable in comp games. This playstyle is counterable by a coordinated team with enough time and patience, but good luck trying to pull it off in solo q when survivors are not on the same level or are trying different things to break the 3 gen.
And when I said I’m dc’ing I just meant that I’m not going to stay in a match like that. If the killer downs me and survivors don’t pick me up then I’ll do that. It’s not about getting out of the game because I’m not winning, it’s about getting out of the game because I have much more useful things I could do with an hour of my time.
This guy needs a new game to play. It will never be that deep ever.
maybe it is and youre just bad at the game.
@@notknownlogic4161 what?
Ignore the child babies, @themeadowsgroupchat9454. Most of us agree.
I would say it's much much deeper this game has multiple play styles comp scenes hundreds of thousands of perk combos and rng
Sounds like a skill issue
This guy just gets pleasure from keeping survivors hostage lol
Exactly what I was thinking. It's like the tiniest bit of power he can have over people and he craves it
It's fun
One thing that this guy said that sticks out to me the most is when he said that the killer is a person as well who is trying to have fun (which I understand). And I want to say that the survivors are also people trying to have fun. And let’s face it the most fun thing to survivors is chase or helping their team. And I don’t think he acknowledged how un-fun it is for the survivors. I also didn’t hear him suggest making the 3 gen play style more enjoyable for survivors. Does he feel like other survivors should just give in and play regardless? I’m really trying to take in his point of view but I just am having a hard time doing so.
By the time he hits a combo of 39 wins the guy with 200 has already played. An additional 100+ games
my take on the surrender option is that after say 20 minutes or however long the DC penalty should just be null and voided that way you dont have to rely on the other soloQ teammates to also vote for surrender, gets rid of the possible sandbag by voting no, and also lets the killer stay in the game and just continue what theyre doing without ending the game.
Profile picture is all I needed to see.
I think this guys pfp tells us all we need to know.
fr🤣🤣guy is psychopath
Me when I have severe autism and can't tell when someone's PFP is a joke:
No hate to the guy but imagine saying your going to quit the game just because you can’t prolongue matches and 3 genning has been a core issue in every instant of the game for ages. It is never a fun experience for both sides in my opinion and is more prevalent in the comp scene. He might as well say oh I’m not winning matches anymore because of a boring strategy , Time to quit 😂. HUX might be nerfed which is annoying as it’s what the opposite to what he currently needs but we’ll have to see if they don’t and fix the 3 gen issue next year overall I can see where the guy is coming from but I believe chess isn’t something the majority of the community wants in dbd and why skull merchant ruined the game for most people he’s kind of restarting this cycle by showing his play style.
Why would he care if his opponents are having fun though. And also if he enjoys it and it’s taken out then yeah why would he continue to play
Some killers (speccially m1s which singularity counts as since he has all his power in the survivors hands) cant be played otherwise in high mm3. Either 3-gen or tunneling there aint no other way. Or play nurse.
So attacking these strats and blaming the people for trying to win at the game is utter cringe and shows how the community deserves its own dissatisfaction. We alredy see tons of blights and nurses in soloQ thanks to whiney babys who throw tantrums the moment a weak killer has something going for them. Most recent proofs are the roadmap and trickster. Roadmap being a big "fuck you" for m1 killers with 3-gen anti mechanic and stbfl nerf, while trickster finally was strong in the PTB just to get utter nerfed again so they couldve aswell just left him be.
As a killer i cannot choose to play whoever i want without knowing im gonna have a harder time with some killers than with others, there is no equal chance and many killlers are in bad spots. Hence why you see only the few same killers in rotation. and when playing soloQ, well, just yesterday we spawned with pig traps on. PIG... so unique to finally see a pig and guess what? My teammates instantly throw the game and act like entitled little babys because "muhh pig". Survivors say they dont want nurse all the time but they sure act as if they exactly only want nurse.
@@datboy038true we’re probably gonna get a 3rd skull merchant since knight can also sort of do this it sucks people want an optimised chess dbd when the average player wants around a 10min equal sided game
There’s a skill expression to the style but it’s very boring and based around hours in the game which shouldn’t count towards how you should regularly beat a kilelr at their gameplay
@@datboy038it’s probably why more low tier killers are going to suffer even after 3 gen changes
I play just solo queue. And I very rarely see a proper 3-gen killer. (meaning they pick 3 and defend them aggressively from the start) The vast majority of the time that the killer ends up with a tight 3-gen setup is because survivors just handed it to them. Where the survivors just mindlessly work the first gen they see without thinking of the bigger picture. I don't fault killers that then aggressively hold the 3 gen that the survivors handed them on a silver platter. Because of that, Deja Vu has been a staple in my perk lineup for a long time, even before the buff to it. Because right from the start, i can try to go work gens myself that will break it up and spread out the final 3.
I mention it till blue on the face, this is exactly it for me, every single one of my 3-gens is given to me, and it's irritating, I hate the playstyle but will defend a 3-gen if forced to, and it's funnier when I'm the bad guy for doing what I was forced to do lol
All these goobers who support this play style coming out of the woodworks in the comments
😂very that. No shame
If he is gone from Dbd the game will only get better for everyone else
Also, he even says no one likes 1 hour matches yet he plans to draw the game that long and wants to make survivors surrender after 10 min
grow up
@@notknownlogic4161bro what?
because he hates bloodpoints or spending them. 1 match per hour= less time spend spending bloodpoints
Im fine with him!😆Let him stay, as long as toxic SWFs exist so can he, why not, its a game, you had a match where you lost - move on
I like an occasional 1hr game it's good for cardio self improvement and bp lol. Your argument just completely broke.
If you enjoy 3gen playstyle - imagine for a second old hatch mechanics back. And every match you face map offerings and keys. I doubt you'll be pleased, man
Lol he would switch to survivor and do that every time
23:37 you hit it on the head coco.
Dbd was my main game for 4 years. Killer main, with about 20% of time spent surviving. I’ve played like six matches in the last two years.
The problem with balance today is what it’s always been: *many* more people play surv than killer, and to keep PR in check and player counts up BHVR usually chooses to design in response to surv side complaints.
That said, if anyone out there would like to do a data-driven analysis of the relationship between nerfs, buffs, and player counts, hit me up.
I’m sad this game I spent so many hours with just isn’t fun for me anymore, but at least I can compile and analyze some data to see how much of what I feel / felt aligns with what we can track.
just play nurse 🤡
I agree with you.
But I tend to think it's more the playerbase that has become the issue. Ever since MMR has been implemented, my games have greatly changed to people playing the least fun ways as possible.
3-gen is the lowest effort, highest reward option killers have now that tunneling and camping have base kit changes now.
I think that's the hidden cost here,@@ynglink
Once you establish your design philosophy is 'placate survivors' you set expectations for current and new players that that's how you'll continue.
If you deviate from that, everyone who's sticking around for that content / design choice will punish you for it - so it becomes a self-fulfilling prophecy, especially when you add in that bills need to be paid.
@@iantingen It's more of showcasing the core design issues of the game that create "feel bad" scenarios. This happens more often than not for both sides, even if they aren't detrimental to the actual game being played.
It's why the game gets more negative comments than positive.
"Behind every screen is a person behind it." says the person making 4 other people miserable in a game
"i don't compete in tournaments but i do compete at myself to try and improve the way i play" by 3 genning okay bud
"If your skilled play doesn't get you to win, was it really a skilled play in the first place?" - Patrick
Thanks BHVR
Yeah..I was really trying to hear his opinions but alot of them had holes in them.
@@pablopenguin24thank god patrick got fired from bhvr's compagny . This guy was horrible for dbd's balance and he was talking nonsence .
@@thedutywarlord264 Did he really? I didn't even hear about that. 🙏🏽
Love to see crying survivormains❤
There is counterplay only in a coordinated swf. It's the exact same for tunneling blight or nurse with 4 slowdowns. Dbd has always been unfair I fail to see how 3 genning is any different.
Because you can choose to die?
because tunneling blight and OP nurse doesnt take 60 minutes, and at the very least the blight/nurse player gets rewarded for killing. 3 gen strats reward the a killer for not killing and punish a survivor team that survived the whole time.
And the only counterplay from the killer to a coordianted SWF is tunnelling blight/nurse. What's your point? Why is it everyone uses "but SWF is the only counter" when there is a killer strategy that's unfun and people want removed while never acknowledging the fact there isn't even counterplay for 95% of the killer roster for a decent SWF?
@@JCglitchmaster what percentage of killers games go against a swf? Be realistic. Maybe 10%? That feels generous too.
I don’t think a swf should be the comparison standard for killer or survivor stuff.
@@JCglitchmasteryou’re not utilizing all your tools as killer if a swf is too much to handle. All killers are powerhouses in their own right but people have this mindset that they have to play nice and let everyone have fun. Tunnel, Proxy, Slug do whatever you need to win. Swf’s take advantage of the fact that killers try to “play nice” and use it against them. Unless you’re going against top tier players SWF’s can be countered. Even then, the amount of matches where this is the case is pretty low overall.
The two strategies I absolutely hate though are 3-gen and hiding. Both strategies prolong the match and I’m just trying to play a game, if one match takes more than 40 minutes I’m out lol. I don’t care about winning that much.
My solution: if there is one generator left, given the 3 generators are in close proximity, if X amount of time (30 mins? Debatable) has passed now close proximity generators would be scattered throughout map.
I don’t know bro.. 1 hour is a long ass time for a single match, I’ve been in a situation where P90 Singularity played 3 gen without hooking us and it sucked. I feel bad if I leave my teammates and I really could get more xp/shard/bp playing more matches in that 1 hour.
As a non-content creator or someone who has plenty of time to play DBD, 1 hour is so precious. Idk but Im pretty sure it’s pretty boring to 3 gen for killers too.. so just hook and win? So we can get to the next match 🤝🏻🙏🏻
Forcing four entire people to choose between 1. Melt your brain fighting for the gens 2. Go afk or 3. Straight up d/c is a lot more dickish than you think. No amount of mustache-twirling, "oh ho but you see its actually very thrilling and complex" excuses wasting this sheer amount of time, and ENJOYING IT 💀
Exactly, I have no life and I am still not committing that much time to a single match.
@@hyperboi4077Well I don’t have a life, but still have responsibilities and most of the time I just want to crunch in a quick game like everyone else in my position. People like this 3 gen merchant need to stop holding people hostage for their own enjoyment. Find something else stimulating because 3 gens are mindless walking simulators.
@@Crispy_DAWGthen fucking dc, take the 50-second ban and get into another match. It's not likely at all you get into back to back hard 3 genners. And even if you do its even less likely the 2nd one won't kill you if for some reason you want to leave that match too. Like I don't understand that. If I had some shit I needed to do later or in the morning I'm not playing a game where other people can dictate my fun. Or I could you know control what I can and not stress over what I can't.
@@garasb660 nah, fuck that. i'm tired of victims being asked to penalize themselves so idiotic griefers can keep griefing
@@h445cry harder 😂😂. The overwhelming majority of hackers are survivors who hold killers hostage.
You’re “being held” by your own stupidity. It’s the old saying of get good. You apparently aren’t. But you’re a damn good professional victim you waste of space
4:55 "If they're not gonna let me win, they should just be allowed to give up." isn't the killer supposed to......... kill? Make it so if the entity wins(endgame) the killer DOES NOT GET THE WIN! make a timeout a survivor win. Problem solved. The survivors did their job. They survived the killer. The killer failed their job. They did not kill. The entity should SHOULD be DISPLEASED by the killer. It makes NO SENSE
agreed
10:20 - No, he's completely wrong. The Killer's job is to sacrifice the survivors to the entity by putting them on the sacrificial hooks. You learn this shit Day 1. The survivors dying after an hour is a side effect of playing on dedicated servers (also so cheaters can't hold streamers hostage for too long). The devs chose to make the survivors die after an hour to encourage them to do generators (and thus interact with the killer) instead of hiding in lockers for an hour. In a perfect world with infinite bandwidth and no DC penalty the servers would be able to last indefinitely until all the survivors have either escaped or died, as they theoretically would if the trails happened in real life.
I wonder what this guy would think if survivors automatically escaped after an hour instead of dying. Would he consider it a loss if all four survivors hid for an hour and magically escaped? If not why the fuck does he consider the survivors all magically dying after an hour a win? This so completely off base its not even funny.
“Just put in a surrender button” yeah cause even against teams that know they can’t break the 3-gen he can’t kill them by chasing and hooking😂
Jesus, they make 3 gen-ing sound so deep when it’s so brain dead simple. You just walk between 3 gens and kick them if it has an ounce of progress. This dude gives singularity mains a bad rep
I really wish the devs will nerf this playstyle in the ground so this guy and the other 9 will quit the game.
Agreed. Worst playstyle.
It's really simple - the fact is most people like winning.
How do you do that with minimal effort? - by abusing different mechanics that require a higher amount of effort to counter those mechanics.
In overwatch, it's playing Orisa into Reinhardt.
In DBD, it's holding 3-gen hostage against uncoordinated teams.
Both of these examples can be solved in higher/coordinated level of play, which usually leaves most of the casual playerbase furious about the topic - those mechanics are anything but a skill check for teams, but there are no teams in casual play.
"When defending a three gen, it's all about the decisions you make."
You mean...lack of decision-making. Survivors run off from your three-gen...what decision do you make? Oh, just hit the gen and go back to playing a (mostly) AFK simulator game. Let's just face it...these are Killer players who play the game to the most basic and simple format as possibly can be: just defend the objective and let the prey come to you. But in a game that is marginally 95% solo queue players, these Killers truly are taking the Survivors hostage. Killer players have been desensitized to believe that every match is against Team Eternal, a 4-Man Bully Squad, etc.
At this point, Deja Vu should become base kit for Survivors. And if a Killer kicks the same generator several times in a three-minute span, then that generator should automatically turn on, and a finished generator far across the map should turn off (by the Entity's doing). Now, your three-gen is ripped apart, because you refuse to chase Survivors and appease the Entity.
And not to sound offensive here, but if this guy quits DbD because of the "three generator strat being removed," then I see this as a Win-Win. Honestly, who the fuck wants a match of DbD to go on for an hour? You have got to be trying way too hard at a video game...money is not on the line...you're not trying to win some famed e-sports cup or something.
These Killers are just terrified of being humiliated with mind-games in chase. It all factors down into self-worth and self-esteem. They lack both.
👏👏👏👏 best comment so far
So what should killers who don't 3-gen but are forced too because survivors pop like 4 gens in less than a minute get to remedy this? Everyone bitches about 3-gens and how they last an hour but when games last 6mins it's ok? lol I hate defending 3 gens, but bet your ass I'll defend one when I'm forced to by morons who can't pay attention.
@@XenoVT Honestly, you're a better Killer player if you play the game out rather than taking the match hostage. But people are always focusing on "did you kill all 4 Survivors? Did you out-mind-game them?" No one looks beyond a small, select scope.
If Survivors give the Killer a three gen, that's fine and good. But if the Killer patrols it too hard, then the game should punish the Killer for "not appeasing the Entity" in its sport. Hence the strategy that "one gen turns on, another far off turns off." Besides, Killers are all using four perks that are gen regression and gen stall...you can hold any distance three gen with those perks, right?
@@dubeusgames so killers should be punished for a survivors mistake? At that point just use the guys logic of just give killers a surrender button lol
@@XenoVT If the Killer starts ONLY defending the three gen, then the Killer has taken the match hostage, and yes, they should therefore be punished. Or would you prefer the Killer be punished for staying in a particular area the entire match, not leaving 3/4 generators?
The "Surrender Button" is also this nitwits glorified idea of "an easy win" for playing brain dead and AFK most of the time. No...but if a Killer wants to "Surrender" for losing four gens and only focusing on one chase...by all means. Surrender for subpar skill. :D
Look, I play both sides, I enjoy my Xeno/Wesker playtime, and I like to "get stuff done" as a Survivor. On either end of the story, holding a three generator is boring and tedious. I don't approve of it on either end - if Survivors do it to themselves, I don't feel a Killer should still hold it down and refuse to take chases; on the flip-side, as a Killer...I can't speak for three gens, because I refuse to play in that style - I chase, and I mind-game, and I'd rather the match end sooner rather than later.
Besides, a lot of fun maps (to me) start with a general spawn of "three gen" and a lot of Killer players just outright refuse to leave that area, hold those gens hostage as hard as possible, and then the match takes upwards of 15, 20, 25+ minutes...that Killer should be punished for not playing by the Entity's game, and "sacrificing Survivors."
I could imagine devs doing a thing where say, once there are 3 gens left on the map, after a certain period of time, if no gens have been completed or have not reached 75% completion - then one of the three gens would "break" and one random gen on the map would pop up, ready to be repaired. Easily could add lore implications to this also.
THISSS bro ur genius. theres nothing wrong w it either
They could also just clear the killer's score after the 1 hour and all survivors get some compensation. There would be a problem with cheater survivors holding the game hostage but at least this would deal with legitimate killers refusing to progress the game.
“Nobody enjoys an hour on both sides” why do the strat then?? 😂
I read "Comforting a 3 Gen Singularity Player" at first. Maybe they do just need some love.
3 Gen solution idea: Killers who do this say it's because it's "like playing chess", well, chess has stalemates where both sides lose. Put that in to DBD. Killers didn't kill, survivors didn't escape, all 5 players die when the timer runs out. Hard loss for everybody.
Also, the gens already have a solution available that the devs don't let us take advantage of- wheels and a push bar.haha Let the survivors move the gens around the map. Killers still see the auras of them so why not?
honestly the ability to push the gens is a super interesting one. I'm a killer main and i kind of like the idea
@@ameladolnz7784 Thanks! It'd def change the gameplay a bit, and open up a diff variety of perks for both sides too if the devs did it right.
Yh it would work in a 3 gen situation.
But the issue is that that would just build on the inequality between killers with high vs killers with low mobility.
And although I dislike this 3 gen play style from people like this. If survivors actively 3 gen themselves (I.e the killer chases one person on one side of the map and the survivors just stay on the far side and work on gens. Then they should be punished late game.
I LOVE the stalemate idea even as a killer. But problem is Behaviour sees this game as a hockey and they dont have draws there
@@benhayes5396 the thing is in the situations above its not survivors actively 3 genning themselves. The killer has decided on the 3 gen from the start, and even if the surviors leave the other gens alone and focus on the 3 gen being held they can't get it done bcause of the oppressive playstyle.
As a survivor i ALWAYS bring deja vu and i actively only work on the middle gen of the 3 that are shown to me. But if a killer has made up their mind it doesn't matter.
3 gen idea: after the match goes on for 30-40 minutes a hatch spawns, it can be used once but afterwards endgame collapse activates. Endgame collapse also activates after the killer kicks the hatch.
I know it might not fix everything but it's the only idea I have
Bring back old hatch
That was a 3 gen counter
@@thesteampunkmachine9077 but that was an easy way to escape for 4 swf ppl too so its good for survivor and bad for killer its not the real solution
@@plantozz1036 Yup, it was a 3 gen counter, but - since we are talking about fun here - its not fun for killers outside the 3 gen scenario when 4 survivors leave at 1 gen, or 3 survs at 2 gens etc. They made the right decision here.
@@MagicNash89 Exactly, the idea I had is it allows one survivor to leave the trial and then the hatch closes, but it initiates endgame collapse allowing the other survivors to leave as well
Add a new truly casual game mode (no rankings no mmr matchmaking) where:
1. survivors cant bring in items and iri offerings
2. killers cant bring iri addons or offerings
Lastly: All perks are randomized
and match timer is randomized between 15-25 minutes
“I think it’s incredibly unfair” that bhvr want to remove a hostage holding mechanic, well then I hope every cheater and their mother snipes this guy’s game and hold him hostage every waking second of his day. I’m sure he will feel differently
Dude exactly what I was thinking. I don't encourage cheating or cheaters but I would support them bullying this guy and his abhorrent playstyle
In other words this guy has nothing better to do but ruin a game for multiple other people. He sounds awesome...
Yesterday I was held holstage for like 45min by a skull merchant with only 300hs. I have 2.5k and my other teammates were around 1.5-2k too.
There was no skill involved, she started the match choosing a 3gen that were really close one from another, so she deployed a few drones on that side of the map, stayed around those 3gens and eventually we ended up dying because of the free injurees she gets now. So braindead and annoying. And at the end of the match, it wasn't enough with a 3k, so she slauged and slauged until she got the 4k.
These kind of people take the fun out of the game, I hope when they nerf 3gen, they really quit playing the game, nobody will miss them.
This guys idea of a counter for this play style is for the survivors to “surrender”???
Yup, im glad these people dont balance the game at all. Absolute braindead take
thats not what he said. the counter is just not being doodoo.
@@thriix1865I think you need your pacifier. You're getting grumpy.
Really sounded like he didn't want to say what it was bc he knows he already runs a non optimal strat that is only strong bc people haven't quite learned the counter yet
Dude, that is literally whole point of a 3 Gen eather the survivors surrender or they slip up make a mistake and get themselves killed. 3 gen is a good tactic
As a P4 Singularity main i don’t support that 3Gen Singularity main
Then ur bad lol get good
@@liveloveminnesota i play how i want
@@liveloveminnesotabro liked his own comment 💀
@@kaiokentimes00 yes
@@GCoffee2006 Btimes8's message is everyone should play how they want even when you're 3 genning. Remember there's always a person on the other side of the screen.
The roblox pfp was enough for me dog 💀
For this person I wish he would face old trolls who just hide for several hours and no interaction whatsoever with the other side. Also it seems more than boring to have these answers not being challenged once while the replies are cringe.
I really like this video format and if you do it again could you add at the beginning and end your initial and final thoughts about the interview and subject? I always like hearing what your opinions are on things in this game.
The core issue with the 3-gen setup is, I believe, a fundamental design flaw which has mostly to do with the extreme assymmetry present in the game- both between the killers and survivors, but also between different killers.
Fundamentally, the game is one centered around time. For each second the killer spends, the survivors can "spend" 4- they have 4 people acting at once, and the killer is alone. The survivors need to spend a cumulative minimum of 450 seconds to do 5 gens (although this is reduced by perks and items, and increased when multiple survivors work on the same gen- though not by nearly as much with certain perks; and of course they need time to move between gens or do other things). The killer needs to spend their time chasing down and killing survivors- which inherently forces at least 1 survivor to waste their time not achieving the objective. At its core, that means the killer always loses after a small handful of minutes unless they do something to eat away at the time of the other survivors. This is why its so important to harass survivors, to hook, to kick gens, try and chase multiple people at once. Generically its referred to as "pressure" and noone in a given match feels that pressure more than the killer whose entire job is to create it. They are constantly on an invisible, unpredictable countdown clock to losing the game and they have to make every single minute action count to push that timer back whilst simultaneously achieving their own objective. This is why perks which dramatically reduce or increase the amount of time that needs to be spent on gens are typically hated by both sides- it can swing things dramatically in one side's favor by no small margin.
Killing a survivor outright is one of the best ways to do this- it not only progresses your own objective, but also removes a quarter of the total amount of time the survivors can get and makes it so that chasing or harrying a survivor is removing a third of their available time rather than a fourth. This is why games can spiral to a killer win so easily after the first kill, because suddenly the survivors have so much less to work with- especially if they are having to spend time healing health states to extend chases or rescue one of their teammates off a hook in order to buy back their now very finite amount of time. This is also why highly mobile or ranged killers are the best, because they minimize the amount of time the killer needs to spend on finding and chasing survivors- they are simply the most time efficient by far.
So, then why is 3genning so bad? If killing a survivor is one of the best ways to swing time in your favor, then why would anyone do anything else?
1- While one of the best, it is not *the* best. Many killers and perks have ways to consistently harry multiple survivors at once, rendering the "relative benefit" of killing one minute in comparison. Although it doesn't progress the objective, it does buy you more overall time than trying to kill someone does (slugging, for example, is in fact better than hooking for buying time because it disables a survivor for a far longer period and it takes much more time from other survivors to pick them up unless they wait- which wastes even more time- and doesn't get forced into fixed stages)
2- Difficulty. Killing a survivor is not easy. In fact it is very difficult in most cases (assuming an even remotely fair matchup in terms of skill/experience). Not to mention that it requires hooking a survivor usually 3 times, which means usually a minimum of 3 potentially long chases plus a lengthy period of picking up and then carrying and hooking (which is itself risky thanks to flashlights, stuns, and certain perks). As opposed to slugging which carries no risks and takes no extra time after a down. You buy more time overall, and get to use your time more efficiently.
3- Killing is not required. Precisely because of hostage situations being toxic, the game has a hard time limit. Unfortunately, it favors the killer as it is far easier for a survivor to hold a game hostage by permanently hiding and never doing gens than it is for a killer who has to do stuff like complicated and difficult 3gen camping strategies. Meaning that the killer's *most reliable* path to victory is to stall games out by only ever using the most time efficient actions. Slug, rarely hook, get hits to force healing and don't commit unless the down is quick n easy, and kicks gens/utilize gen regression. For 60 minutes. If odds of victory are all one cares about, then this is the winning strategy that is proven to devastate survivor's mental game possibly leading to a shorter, easier victory regardless.
The core reason why this strategy is even viable to begin with is mostly because of the fact that gens even can regress at all. If, for example, only one gen could be repaired at any given time and only one survivor could work on it, but there was some kind of safety mechanic that the other survivors could work on to "protect" the repairing survivor, that would give the killer more incentive to actually chase and kill other survivors while working against their clock to remove the protection and enable them to actually stop the objective. Furthermore, perks which allow gens to regress (and by extension, perks which shorten the amount of time needed to repair) exacerbate the issue dramatically. They allow killers to functionally delete progress and survivors to make games unwinnable for the killer. VHS's objective has none of the same issues as DBD. Progress is permanent- both in terms of the "damage" done to the killer and in the progress towards building a weapon that survivors can make- and also easy to get (with several points for making the different types of weapon spawning throughout the maps) and no real way to dramatically alter how long it takes to achieve it. Furthermore, there is a skill contest involved with actually achieving progress in that the killer and armed survivors have to attack and dodge one another- which allows both to simultaneously progress their objectives and deny their opponents without resulting in a stall. But that is only one way in which the overall problem can be avoided.
Generators as they are in DBD are fundamentally broken, they make stalling a viable strategy and the only way to correct this would be a dramatic rework to either every single regression and repair perk in the game to no longer do those things (and the removal of kicking, or the changing of it to limit how much it can actually do such that it can never net-negative and delete progress wholesale) or rework gens wholesale into an entirely new kind of objective.
As much as I would like to see a surrender system, my previous time playing League knows that NO ONE will agree to a surrender even if every single piece of evidence says they'll lose.
But most people often did.
Also they can make it so you just get replaced by a bot when you surrender. Match goes on for anyone who wants it. If 4 survivor bots, killers insta wins.
On one hand setting out to stall a game indefinitely is a pain. On the other, some maps force you 3 gen. There's a difference between wilful gen kicking bs and being forced to fall back to it on a map like Sanctum. Whatever this roadmap solution is, I hope it doesn't affect the latter. Otherwise you're just being punished for bad map design.
YOU NAILED IT - IT’S A BAD MAP DESIGN ISSUE ONCE AGAIN
Imagine for a moment things were the other way around. Survivors win if they survive for an hour in game. Now imagine survivors using a stealth style to avoid the killer for an hour playing Blendette with quick and quiet, urban evasion, Distortion and Spine Chill. And imagine that their proposed solution was "Add a surrender button for killers." You can bet this guy would go nuts. He's just asking for quicker free wins so he doesn't have to wait an hour for his free win.
Honestly it's just as bad as the old key-3-man escapes. Except at least those didn't last an hour.
I was once playing as a Doctor for a quick match. I sent us to RPD because I had no more Jigsaw map Offerings and The RPD map was the only one small I had dispite as me being a killer Main I despise RPD, to Which I got Matched up with I think was a three or two man Swf. I ran Skill Check Doctor with Lullaby, Overcharge , Merciless Storm, and Distressing for bigger terror radius, combined with both Calm series which made my incoming presence heard miles before I arrive. Then As the Match progress the Survivors ended up unknowingly 3 Genned themselves, with all 4 of them STILL alive, so it was not looking good for me in the slightest even with the 3 gen. With two generators on the west wing on the top floor in a single hallway and down the stairs a generators sat in the locker room. I spent probably 8 or more minutes fighting to keep those generators from falling to them, and these were decent survivors, so they applied heavy pressure to the remaining generators I was not currently in positions to stall. to say It was Stressful would be an understatement. I had to keep using static Blast to make the survivors go mad to make them fail skill Check which with overcharge made them lose 5% more progress, with my lullaby gone that's all it could do. Eventually the survivors made mistakes and I slowly regained momentum killing them off, and eventually I got the Win. While I won that Match, It was a lot more taxing on my stress level then what I anticipated going in. Then one of the Survivors then messaged me Saying I only won due to overcharge, (Which to be honest It saved my Behind several times) And that the game was forever sided and said I quote " Your Overcharge Sucks along with your Doctor"
To be honest I feel bad for them, given that I brought them there to RPD and used the skill check build, but at the Same time It was one of those Horse Race situations where both sides are Neck to neck and the outcome would be determined depending on who slips up first. But that Match was the most intense and Stressful Match I ever played as the Doctor ever, and I was not even trying to do a 3 gen strat, just using a skill check build on Tiny maps.
Surrender button would just encourage killers to play like this even more. Damn I would love to go for personal attacks against this guy, but i'm holding back.
this kind of person just want attention their missing daddy didn’t gave them. They do this in one game, when it’s patched, they go for another game and so on. It’s attention seeking and nothing else
Behaviour should just make a different game mode for once. It's been the same mode for over 7 years now
Definitely agreed the 5 gen mode is beyond boring at this point.
It is a common misconception among killers that survivors believe the 3-gen "strat" is OP. Although we find it boring, that does not imply that we find it to be OP. What makes it boring? The counter play for it is boring. Chasing is the most entertaining aspect of Survivor.
Therefore, it can become very monotonous very quickly when your playstyle or strategy is centered around holding a 3 gen and not chasing. However, the absolute number one reason the 3 gen "strat" is despised is because you have to play through a match that lasts more than 30 minutes every time you come across it.
I've only played against this "strat" once in a solo queue, it was against The Skull Lady of course. We ended up getting to 1 gen because she pretty much refused to chase anyone outside of her 3-gen. We spent like 10 - 15 minutes trying to brake her 3-gen before I finally gave up because of how bored I was and just wanted to move on to the next match. I let her down me so she could hook me, but she decided not to hook me, and instead decided to bleed me out for the whole bleed out timer while protecting her 3 gen.
It's not like she had anything to fear since I was on death hook, so while I was waiting to bleed out, I just tabbed out and started watching RUclips. After that match, every 3-gen killer I come across, I either dc or just go afk until that match is over.
I think the proper solution to both sides being able to hold the game hostage is having a second goal for survivors. Typically 3 or 4 gening is the way killers hold the game for long periods of time, so after the third gen pops there should be a way to for instance, search the map for hatch and have a special key spawn in basement that requires survivors to take a penalty like having their location revealed by killer instinct and be exposed to get out of a special chest. And so survivors can’t just hide all game, they become revealed by killer instinct after not doing any objectives for a period of time.
sounds good on paper but it would nerf all killers pretty hard. unless that option would only beome available after lets say 20 minutes of play time.
@@2bepower694 yeah, though then again, I do think over half the killer roster needs a proper buff. I don’t think killers like Nurse, Blight, Spirit, Wesker or Chucky would really care.
This is not holding the game hostage though, as confirmed by BHVR. Same thing with slugging for 4k or hiding in a 2v1 scenario, these things are not considered holding game hostage in BHVR's eyes
That being said, I really don't understand what he means by mistakes being a huge impact on 3 gen setups and calling it more "complex" is just downright delusional. If you go into a game already with a strategy in mind (3 gen) and its such a simplistic strategy too, then there is no way this is more complex than playing a "normal" game of DBD.
In games where you don't hold a 3 gen the margin for error is significantly lower, as you don't have anything at all to fall back on. On top of that you have to constantly make snap decisions that hugely impact the game, like what chases to take, when to leave a survivor, what gens to kick etc. In 3 gen all you have to do, is make sure that the 3 gens you chose are guarded, that's your number 1 priority, which is way simpler and easier to do.
And I say this as someone who loves to play against 3 gen setups (as survivor). Also whats the difference between a surrender button and just giving up as survivor now... if you don't like to play against a 3 gen, just go to the killer and get out, issue resolved
He just doesn't want to believe that the 3-gen strategy is a strategy for braindead players because he doesn't want to admit that he is one of these. No, he is a smart player who plays in so difficult and intellect ways that one mistake can ruin everything.
Probably just means that by immediately conceding the entire map except those three gens, the game pretty much starts at the 3 gen, so if he does screw up badly enough to lose a gen, it's straight to end game. I guess an analogy might be something like if quadrupled the size of the skill check zones and disabling the auto failure when forced off during one, but failing a skill check incapacitated you for the rest of the match. Ridiculously easy to not fail them to the point where virtually nobody ever would unless they're like, distracted IRL or something, but technically devastating if it does happen.
Yeah the killer is supposed to play skillfull we know. No skill required from survivors to NOT 3-gen themselves.
hes talking about high risk high reward, for him its a reward but i think going into a match with the active intent to 3 gen setup is the epitome of boring... and if i wanted to play chess id fricking play chess lmao
@@liandre9035 I never said killers need to play skillfully, but being in an interview with coconut and straight up claiming that 3 gen is one of most difficult and risk taking strategies in the game is just downright delusional. I love playing against 3 gen myself as I like the long stretched gameplay that comes from it +the fact that it is way easier to pip as survivor if killer is holding 3 gen.
Also the idea that survivors can accidentally 3 gen themselves is also dumb, if the killer wants to hold a 3 gen he will, so it really doesn't matter what other gens you finish at that point.
I am a killer main that never plays survivor. I don't set up a three gen at the start and hold it ever in a game. Sounds lame but I am worried this could ruin the game. But I didn't camp and I thought the anti camp was going to change. But it doesn't seem to have much of a change.
You SHOULD play survivor, at least once in a blue moon. If you don't see what they've gotta also deal with you're gonna have any otherwise good balance ideas skewed by bias toward your role.
@@MementoMori7777 I am biased about dbd for sure. I did play survivor when I first started to figure out some of the maps and really just what is supposed to happen. Now my wife is the only one that plays survivor. As long as the devs don't ruin the game I'll be happy.
You know the person have deep issues when they pay real money to play a character and just run around in circles kicking gens so they can get something from their pathetic life
@@Insanity-vv9nn tell us how you really feel.
@@MementoMori7777Advice survivor only mains need to take as well, it's irritating lol
We played CS2 together while you were editing this video. Had to come see it after that game lol
The problem with this playstyle is the gamemode it is used in.
DbD is a casual game, if your strategy requires optimal gameplay, it's no wonder most people will complain.
Majority of players enjoy the casual gameplay they don't wanna sit through 40+games simply because the killer decided to do that one specific thing.
If there were a competetive mode and it were done there I wouldn't complain but the comp scene would die right quick
If bhvr wants to discourage this play style, make it so the killer doesn’t get a win for it (maybe a tie) or make it harder for killer after X amount of time (maybe make hatch spawn). If survivors take advantage of the late hatch spawn by hiding, make hiding over long time harder. It’s not about removing it all at once. It’s about discouraging it so with time there is less of it.
Also, when killer bot on DC?
The problem is that Behaviour sees this game as hockey, not chess. And hockey doesnt have a stalemate or draw. One side HAS to win. Thats a huge problem in the way they view this game
@@FinestFantasyVITo be fair, it would be hard to determine what would be a 'tie' because of how the game is played.
The Killer is supposed to kill, and the Survivors escape. Like, what would be the in-between of that? 2 kills and 2 escapes? The Survivors that died would feel like they lost, the ones that didn't would consider it a win, and the Killer could feel either way.
@@FinestFantasyVI In big hockey leagues, there is no absolute time limit but, in smaller leagues during season games, there is a time limit where the game cannot continue. If neither team achieves the goal of having more points than the other, it’s a tie.
In parallel, DBD has an absolute time limit where results must be determined. If killer has to kill survivors as their goal and survivors has to escape as their goal. A game where neither team achieved their goal would be a tie.
But of course, there is other solutions such as forcing end game as an overtime. And any solution would basically be a rework of a game mechanic in the end.
The best bet would make it a tie, giving anything like auto hatch spawn after amount of time just punishes killers who are forced to defend a 3-gen the survivors gave them.
@@GuillaumePerronNantel I'm assuming the Killer would have to kill all survivors in this imagined scenario to avoid a tie?
Let's face it: both sides will still complain. The Survivors would argue they weren't killed, so they won, and the Killer would feel like any kills they did get are being ignored, and/or the Survivors haven't 'escaped', so why would it be a tie?
The community would have to make concessions that they just won't agree to, I think
"it's unfair that they want to stop people being held in a match for an hour+" what a degenerate hahaha
you did not watch the whole video lol he said several times he wants a system where they wont take an hour and multiple things about how you can play around or make changes to help but you think he likes to take a hour? no thats not the point man
Ultimately, people play in a way that is most fun for them. Sometimes having that fun is to make the game unbearable for the others playing it, but I don’t think that’s appropriate to label every strategy you don’t like as.
I personally hate playing games like this as survivor. It’s grueling and feels like a constant battle where nothing you do really matters, but I can see why a killer would like to play that way for more than “I want everyone here to suffer”.
Micro managing everything around you and having the endurance to keep that up over an hour must feel rewarding. A one man ship patching up the holes to keep afloat. There is a skill to this strategy as it does require you to manage the gens around you over long periods of time. I don’t think I could keep up with that over that long let alone having fun with it, but someone else might.
I’m not saying that this strategy is healthy because hell I hate going against it, but I’m glad there’s a way to play that makes people most happy. It sucks that what someone finds most fun sometimes causes others to get the short end of the stick and I don’t have any solution to give, but I hope changes that happen make it more fun for others without making the strategy boring for those who like it.
If I could add one thing to the game it would be a surrender vote is kind of wild. It’s not an awful idea but the idea that the top of someone’s wishlist isn’t balancing to make things more interesting and is just a way for 80% of the players to give up. I’m a killer main but I do sympathize a lot with the survivors, be the killer you want to play against.
This guy 100% has got some struggles irl and wants to take out his frustration out on other people. Maybe he gets bullied by his peers and feels powerless in real life. Truly happy people don’t feel the need to make others miserable 🤷🏻♂️
truly happy people dont let a killer jam them in a game for 60 minutes only to give up and complain
@@kacecrimson8297 truly happy people don't play dbd lmfao
@@sauce_dude real and true
Nice projection bro. "This guy plays a game in a way I don't like, he must be a loser nerd who gets bullied IRL!!!1!"
the commenter above me mains skull merchant
Ah yes '15' minutes....just to finish 1 gen.....for one of the best dbd teams with coms. So what about randoms?
Id hate the only option he can think of is 'add surrender' so....how about something in game that can counter you rather then telling us to just quit?
Man, the lengths people go to hold the opposing team hostage for a default win only shows how lacking they are at the regular game. At that point, you've won but at what cost?
They should make it so when It pushes like 10-20 minutes you can forcefully disconnect without getting a penalty because I’m not getting banned from queue because I didn’t wanna play a 40 minute match
If your genuine response to “How can people counter your play style?”
Is “They should just give up”
And you have the audacity to say it’s completely valid and should be allowed to stay I’m sorry but I think you’re wrong on all accounts and if you leave when it’s gone I’m not going to miss you
🔥
I've actually played against coconut and Ralph (not stream sniped, saw their names hopped on twitch and said gg wp!). I remember each match and was screaming and laughing the entire time because it was a challenge and sooo much fun! Also, i died, duh... I've been held hostage by skull merchant types and went and USED the toilet, watched twitch, ate food and finally laughed from the relief that it was over. I'm assuming...well...ok, assuming the singularity has yet to receive a "great game, well played! That was so much fun!" Probably the opposite. Also, his response to "what if the devs change your exploit because 99.98% of the community HATE it?" Is to keep doing it in a different way. That's not someone who gets enjoyment from fun. He gets enjoyment from others suffering. I have a surrender button. It's refuse to pressure gens, stand on the hill and watch you play a 5 person game by yourself.
your statement is so faulty
"that's not someone who gets enjoyment from fun"
how the fuck is he enjoying it if he doesn't consider it fun, are you fucking 12?
you are not the arbiter of what is "fun"
you cant hold him at a stake and say he is enjoying from others suffering like half the player base isnt, they might not be doing the same thing as him. But to phrase it as hes the only one in this god forsaken community that enjoys messing with someone who made the mistake of launching up the game is absolutely asinine.
He is a representation of the games community at its worst, dead by daylight stopped being about enjoying the game and it became about how to win by any means necessary after the balancing.
Dont hate the player,
Hate the game XD
From people suffering? Damn so when Killers get bodied without any physical way to fight back, it's "cope and seethe" but when it's survivors then it's evil?
You're literally the embodiment of "The Bullies are 7, and the Bullied is 1, therefore, the Bullied is wrong."
@@Cynwale nah, I've just been playing this game way too long! Lol I just "dislike" seeing the "top" survivors getting carried by swf with seal team 6 perk layouts and comms and not top (like otz, coconut,tofu,etc.) but 7/10 Killers playing like they're actually a psycho, bloodthirsty, obsessed maniacs that must force pain on survivors. I mean c'mon games are for fun, I thought? Don't worry though, no one is going to understand anyone's actual thoughts and opinions through RUclips comments...
@@hopefulhank Your answer is acceptable, I'd say it's better than what I mostly see on Internet.
But to one understanding, gameplays differs and vary a lot, bullying someone, is not gameplay, it's virtually targeting someone to harass this person and making him have a bad time.
In your argument, you say that some Killers have fun being absolute maniacs that tortures other players for fun.
It can happen, but they're trolls, isolated.
SWF on the other hand, is not.
When an SWF play to win, totally fair, nothing to say, but when they have too much fun persecuting the Killer, (At this point in my comment, just knows I forgot what I wanted to write.) it's something terrible that is actively compared to 3Gen or Tunneling etc... when in fact, it is not at all the same, since one of them is about being evil for fun, and the other is about winning the game.
See what I'm trying to say?
The dude in the video, he's playing to win, and Survivors want to win, but they're not ready to accept defeat when their skillset is not sufficient to beat a 3Gen, if Killers cannot beat a super SWF, they'll continue playing till they lose, which takes usually 8 minutes after they save the weak link multiple times, while for Survivors, they have the choice to play more smartly and agressively when there's a 3Gen or Tunneler, but for some reason, they consider that it's the duty of the Killer to lose for them.
@@Cynwale we agree on swf...I've been solo q survivor main since clown and this reminds me of Old legion walking backwards in chase to bleed out type of "winning". I'm not good enough to play killer and I'm serious about that. I am however decent at survivor since it's been really my only game of choice for YEARS! I can argue against swf all day and gladly will but the video is about 3 gen...and I'm making a stew of cheap killer tactics in my comments but it's killing the game...for me at least. Solo q will not win against 3 gen, even admitted/pointed out in the interview. Solo q will not win when tunneling out the weaker survivor forcing a 3v1. Not just because a 3v1 but injured, second/death hook survivors (especially "weaker/baby") more freely waste pallets leaving dead zones for more experienced survivors to have nothing. Killers know this and use it...This is what bothers me with current killer "strats". Like if the killer thinks they're LeBron then why do they only want to play against 5th graders? In my experience of red rank/rank 1/ like everyday almost for 4 hours at least, the moment the killer doesn't get the pallet from me or I vault safely they leave...to use the strat of take out the weak link. And when I see this I'm immediately bored and actually refuse to play (my comment about being on the hill watching the killer patrol). I'm not crying because I'm not getting chased (even though it's chase or gens) or ignorant of the fact I'm the obsession and there's stbfl, it's the blatant avoidance of me and no attempt to because the chase may last longer then 30 seconds and that could mean the scale tips to survivors "winning". There's only like 6 killer mains and 4 survivor mains who make their living off playing this game! The rest of us play for enjoyment and I don't see why it becomes this MUST.WIN.THIS.MATCH...AHHHH. lol
I deleted and retyped and re deleted this message 3 times so what was said was said lol. I watch these spooknjukes videos of salty swf quiting because one died at 4 gens and I didn't' know of this problem because Im solo survivor main. So what I'm mad over may be caused by these type of people. On behalf of survivors I apologize for this but I refuse to play chess when it's tag and has always been tag.
I held a 3 gen a couple months ago for 59 minutes as pig on coldwind. I think although it is his playstyle, he is wrong, it is about the perks you use and how good you can manage and make judgement calls on holding the gens. You have to also mindgame and be aware of the pattern they hop back on gen. Because when you kick they are more than likely hiding around the corner to tap it or do it. And you have to notice when that happens so you keep an eye on it. Somehow i held it but i also didn't use perks for it or a killer for it. My stealth made it easy to identify what time they would go back on the gen. In my match i was being extremely aware of what gens they would hop on together. I had a good 3 gen and my stealth made it easy to make them paranoid ig so that made it work. I played like that once, that's when i was tired of losing over and over and over so i started to play very slow just so i could win. I normally play by snowball but without snowball perks, because i think that is fun
I think for me, one of the biggest changes I'd make is make it so neither side is rewarded for a game going till the server shuts down. Personally I feel a game hitting the hour mark should just be a wash for all the players. No bp gained, no pips gained, no pips lost, literally just a full wash. Killers get more control over the pace of the game, but survivors aren't completely helpless to the flow of a game. And that's maybe all that's needed.
I don't really know how you 'address 3 genning' without some fundamental mechanic changes or adding in something specifically to deal with 3 genning, either by adding a perk, or an item that's built to do it. I did see the suggestion once for deja vu or a new toolbox add-on with the specific purpose of transferring a 0% progress gen and a random 100% progressed one, and make it usable only once per match (not even per survivor, just, once, period) that would stop survivors from trying to reroll to a strong defendable gen, but I don't really know if I like this solution.
I also once saw the suggestion of deja vu's gen speed bonus stacking every time a gen got done if the same 3 gens were highlighted. Ie: 3 gens pop and suddenly you're getting like a 9% gen speed on those 3 gens and that sort of discourages the 'pick a 3 gena t the start' play. But I feel like this would be abusable, and people would start not addressing 3 gens just to stack this up competitively so...I don't know, it's hard.
But unless you're doing it to annoy, I don't think anybody likes hour long games.
I feel like by just changing the spawns of some of the generators they could drastically decrease the effectiveness of 3-gen scenarios. Some maps will literally spawn 3 generators right next to each other just begging to be 3-gen’d.
Food for thought: What if instead of one of the sides winning it would be a draw instead? And each side would get the minimum reward? If the game lasts too long 🤔
I want to take the time to ask everyone.
1: If this game is truly casual, why do we have SBMM? SBMM is a competitive aspect of DBD where you get matches against people on your own skill level, or close to it right? Why does the term "Skill" even exist in a casual / party game?
2: If DBD is casual, why do people create tier lists? To determine which killers have the highest chance of winning correct? based on what they offer in a match right? So, if this community is casual why do they care about what killer is the strongest? You are just playing for fun, right?
3: If DBD is casual, why do both Survivors and killers use what we call "The Meta?" To have the highest chance of winning right? If this community was truly casual meta perks would not exist because no one would care about what the best builds are because you are just playing for fun because this is a party game right?
4: If DBD is casual, why does the community create tournaments for the game? Last I remember tournaments is where people go to compete with one another for a prize right? What is casual about that?
5: If DBD is casual, when you win or lose, why do so many people in this community message you GGEZ? They are stating that the match was easy for them because you did not provide enough challenge for them, right? If you play in a way people don't like on this game, they will tell you to "get good" and that goes for both winning and losing. So, why are casuals telling you to "get good" in a party / casual game?
6: If this game is casual, why do so many care about how you play the game? Killers hate gen rush and Survivors still do it right? Why? Because it works. No killer likes a 3-5 minute match but it is all about fun right? Fun for who? From what I see Survivors have no issue with doing something the killer don't like but yet when the coin gets flipped the entire community that mostly is made up by Survivor players have a huge issue when the killer is not playing how the Survivors want the killer to play. Killers don't like 3-5 minute matches, and Survivors don't like 30-60 minute matches. So, Survivors don't mind 3-5 minute matches because they got to 100% destroy the killer in a short amount of time while t-bagging the killer on the way out, and that was fun for them, and the community has no issue with that. But if the killer is providing any kind of resistance, or challenge, everyone seems to have a problem with it and cries to the heavens for a nerf. Do you not see a problem with this picture? From my pov this looks like blatant bias. From what I see the community only seems to care about the fun of one side. Have you ever just taken the time to wonder why killers play the way they do? Why do killers tunnel? To get a Survivor out of the match as fast as possible because they found a really bad Survivor on the team. This is not a scum of the earth move, it is called smart play. Don't suck as Survivor and the killer will not tunnel you. Killers tunnel for the same reason good Survivors rush gens. Tunneling is the killer version of gen rush. A killer forcing a 3 gen is not a scum of the earth move, once again it is smart play that requires a strategy. 3 gen strats has counterplay, sadly solo que do not have the teamwork to stop such things unless you magically get paired with 3 good Survivors that rotate on gens. 3 Gen strats are not a killer being op issue, it is a bad teamwork issue coming from Survivors and no one wants to accept that fact. Survivors prefer to blame everything but themselves for how strong a killer gets in a match, while knowing the killer only becomes as strong as you allow it to become. If the Survivor team sucks even low tier killers look like gods. If the Survivor team is good, they can make even the best killers look like shit. If you think I am just being some bias killer main look up DBD League, look at all the comp matches that take place in this "Casual / Party Game."
If there would be any vote, it would have to be for a Tie in case of a stalemate. In line with that, the game should end with a tie and as such the players should be rewarded with the points received up to that point, no escape bonus and no sacrifice bonus. BHVR intending to add a voice comms feature is what I've been calling for since Jan. '21 when I picked this game up again and have put in over 2k hours since.
This guy is so cringe. He's actually convinced himself 3 gen holding is more complex with less margin for error.
It’s literally a dunning kruger effect moment. He talks about how “survivors just give up and don’t try”. Yeah because they’re solo queue and can’t communicate making it impossible. This just feeds into his god complex because he can pub stomp solos and then he justifies doing it by saying “Oh well I still lose to good teams though”
As a P90 Singularity that partakes in the chase playstyle, we do not accept that fake 3genner as part of our small community 😤
as a player who only plays survivor I also do not accept this fake 3genner as a part of our community
Accept the Singularity, become one with the generator, AI takeover is coming
3 genners going into the game with a mindset to make 4 other people's game as miserable as posible for 1 hour is just a vile person in my opinion.
@@Tensixeight1I doubt most of the time they go into the game with the sole intent of ruining ppl’s day. I think that they know they will and they’re just fine with it because they’re playing how they want
@Smoke13211 i doubt they're actually going into the game to make people miserable. That's the outcome, but how do you know they don't genuinely enjoy the playstyle?
I feel like this is a problem with a lot of this community. You're so quick to assume that the other side is trying to make your game miserable. Obviously, there will be some who are doing that. But not all of them. Probably not even the majority.
7:48 anyone knows where I can find the full video of that clip?
I was hoping to hear your side of the discussion after the call. I understand where hes coming from and gaving to fall back on 3 gens myself and facing them many many times i get where hes coming from but i think hes thinking far too one sided.
3 genning does make the match into a nail biter where every situation shifts the balance and it is beatable no matter what killer is doing it. For him to give the smug yeah they need a surrender button means hes thinking of it all in the term of endurance more then gameplay, where i will win given enough time so just give up so it happens sooner, and that rubs me the wrong way.
Personally i think the counter or fix to 3 genning should be a end game collapse situation. Once you pass a 30 minute grace period either the gates are powered or the hatch spawns and end game proceeds the way it normally does. If your 30 minutes into a match clearly the killer and the survivors are too evenly matched and starting the end game scenario is only logical to push a conclusion where both sides still have a chance at clutching a victory.
The problem with this is that if 4 survivors are still alive chances are at least 3 will escape. Survivors could just run some insane hiding perks and hide all game forcing the end game collapse after 30 minutes and get a free W. This playstyle shouldn’t reward anyone and if we want to avoid these scenarios then both sides need to lose.
"i'd probably stop playing DBD" WOOOOOOOOOOOOO MAKE THE 3 GEN SETUP IMPOSSIBLE
their advocacy for a surrender vote rather than meaningful changes to make it so killer cant hold a match for a full hour is deeply telling. they just want to see the win screen over and over again, its not about actually outplaying the opponents.
What angers me with these people is that they take advantage of uncoordinated players. People not knowing how to play against it is because most people play solo Q. Which is the lowest point in the food chain while swf makes the game not fun for everyone
I can't help but agree with the oppressive nature of rare play styles. I've recently started using hag with 4 hex perks and it's BRUTAL for survivors.
Especially after I figured out how to get efficient devour hope stacks.
It's not that I'm particularly good, it's just that no one seems to know how to counter her traps anymore.
There is a lot of counterplay for a 4 hex hag though. The same can’t be said for 3-gen.
@@hyperboi4077 agreed, I bring the hex perks to balance it a little more. If they don't cleanse totems, they get punished. If they cleanse totems, they are kinda punished with hallowed ground.
My main point was that hag is stronger than she should be simply because no one plays her. She absolutely can be an oppressive 3 gen killer with her teleporting. I mean come on she gets 10 traps and a base 40m range. Which can be increased dramatically.
@@grimreaper8575 yeah I watched a not so great hag make a come back on a ttv I watch recently. She was protecting one hex totem all game and they got all but one gen done with only one hook and they threw so hard because they didn’t know how to play around her traps. I think that the niche aspect of going against a killer like that does make them inherently stronger.
bro says blight and nurse for 3genning, i bet he never played them cuz the 1 time he did he probably got 0 downs cuz ability actually takes the slight bit of effort to use xDDD
This is mostly an issue regarding Gen speed and the inherant disadvantage set-up Killers (Trapper, Singularity, Demogorgon) have.
Agreed, people jump on hour long 3-genning games, yet trying to play a round only to have 3 pop in less than a minute and barley get to have a game is ok.
yeah they are not responcible for others enjoyment of the game but when you are making the game worse for everyone and keeping them in a match for an hour it's just scummy no matter how 'fun' it is for them, they should just go play against bots so other people don't have to suffer for his enjoyment. or just play against others who want to play against that cause most lobbys are solo q or swf who just want to enjoy the game
It's kinda hypocritical expecting people not to "villianize" them when they just know what they're getting the survivors into
@@theoneshotfan150 if the survivors hate it so much they can just give up and surrender. If the game goes to 60 minutes it means both sides were pushing toward that goal. The few times I faced a 3 gen SM I just let her kill me, my time is way more valuable than playing that game out.
@@gantref9202 Doesn't that just reward people for playing in an unhealthy way (gameplay wise). This would popularize 3-genning from the beginning of a match as most people wouldn't want to add another 30+ minutes to the game, especially if they're in solo-q.
Having people constantly quitting matches will make them eventually just stop playing the game and cause the playerbase to drop relatively quickly.
Surrender votes really aren't the option here. DBD isn't a competitive game, regardless of how many people want it to be. This guy wants to play sweaty, he should go find people to play with that want that type of game.
It's the same thing I did when playing Commander/EDH in Magic the Gathering. You tailor how you're gonna play with the people you sat down in the game with. If they're not experienced, you're only gonna cause a bad time and push them away from the game you like and they'll avoid playing with you specifically.
It's the same reason certain killers have a much higher disconnect rate. Same thing happened during the over/brine + eruption meta when it was clear what was going on.
MMR was one of the first things that caused people to start playing hyper-sweaty (on both sides) and if we continue having this mindset throughout the game and saying it's okay and "git gud", the playerbase will leave. I find myself playing less of both side pretty regularly because of this. Most of my games, survivor or killer, are full of meta choices (from SWFs to early 3-gens, to the same couple of perks every game).
Make the game more stale.
@@ynglink In general I agree with most of what you say, but as of yet I have yet to see a good solution to this type of extreme 3 genning that wouldn't lead to/enable other problamatic behavior or just a straight up nerf to Killers.
Also, I just don't think this will become a popular strategy (aiming for the 60 minute timer) anymore. With the nerf to COB/OC/Eruption a few patches ago it just isn't as easy to pull off anymore. The effort to reward just isn't there as it's not a super simple brain dead strategy anymore. Add to the fact that it requires effort that you need to play a single match for 60 minutes and I think the pool of players that are willing to engage in this strategy are pretty limited.
Even tho, if you are not am coordinated team the chances of you breaking the 3-gen are minimal if the killer has more than half functional bran. This playstyle should not be as strong as it is, because if you know what you are doing as a kille and is using the right perks and with the true intent on holding the game “””hostage””” for one entire hour just for the 4k its not really that cool. And I’m not an survivor main. Im actually an killer main. I know how unfun 3-gen is on both sides because just going around and kicking gens for 1 hour straight is everything but skilful