The Old North: British Celtic Kingdoms in the North of England (Hen Ogledd)
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- Опубликовано: 2 май 2024
- Before the Romans arrived and conquered Britain in the 1st century AD, and after they were sent packing in the 5th century AD, the Britons lived in the lands we now divide into England, Scotland and Wales. Most of the time in our modern view of history we consign these "Celtic" peoples to Scotland, Wales and Cornwall after the Anglo-Saxon Invasion, ignoring the existence of independent British kingdoms that continued to hold out against the invaders for hundreds of years. While those in the south were soon swamped by the newly arrived Angles, Saxons, Jutes and Frisians, a swathe of land from the Dee to the Clyde was known as the Hen Ogledd, the Old North, and remained a bastion of British resistance right up until the Norse arrived in the 8th century. The legacy of these northern Britons of the Gododdin, Strathclyde, Rheged, Cumbria and Elmet can still be seen all around us in the north, from the dialects, place names and archaeology to the culture itself.
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Love watching these videos, I'm a Hungarian immigrant to England and I feel privilaged having got used to British accents as well as geography and cultural background that I can fully follow everything in this video intrigued, I plan to become a British citizen in some years but it could only feel right if I really cared for this country's culture and history. My first plan for after corona is tripping around the entirety of Britain and talk to people in bars so I could develop the ability to distinguish clearly between British accents cheers and high have a nice day
English people themselves aren't even this interested in their own history, anyhow I plan on doing that exact same thing when I get myself a driving license and a car.
@@cheegan some of us are.. but I'll admit, not many others
@@yahdudeist No we aren't lol
@@cheegan I believe Young Americans are the same way. Not knowing, or caring about their history.
Welcome to England! Glad to have you
Brilliant video. Native Welsh speaker here (Mother tongue). Just a rather picky, fussy point to make: “Hen Ogledd” isn’t necessarily Old Welsh. In modern Welsh, the beginning of words are mutated depending on the word that comes before them. “Hen” (old) is one of these words. So, “Hen (old) + Gogledd (north) = Hen Ogledd (Old North). “Hen + dyn (man) = Hen ddyn (Old man). There are numerous examples of course! Just to add to the complexity, “hen” is one of only a few adjectives that comes before the noun. (Others being “prif” (main) and “hoff” (favourite). I’m sure there are others, but I can’t think off the top of my head). It’s usually the other way round. Other than that your pronunciation is very good!
These Connections between Northern England and Wales Should be taught Both Celtic Today
Also the description of “Y Gododdin” as “The ‘Y Gododdin’” as I’m sure “Y” meant “the” in old welsh as it does in new. Like saying “The The Bible.”
@@1000dannycawley Have you seen the Last Kingdom about Uthread of Uthread saying that the Kingdom Of Northumbria was totally Anglo Saxon what a load of carp it was fully Briton.
So instead of beautiful house you'll say "house beautiful" or "wood green" and so on... Interesting, like in Romanian language... Thanks for that!
It's from the common Brythonic root language we shared, that's partially why the western folks tend to understand each other easier, we aal taak syem way like eh :-)
When York is 'down there' you know your north.
100000% hahaha
Where is the north anyway ruclips.net/video/ENeCYwms-Cc/видео.html
@@RatelHBadger Too far for you to come ...arsehole
@@Ionabrodie69 how do you figure that? What caused that hostility?
Anything south of the Tyne is southern... map men is awesome btw 👌🏻✌🏻
I find it fascinating that the kingdom of Strathclyde remained essentially Welsh (British) for centuries after the other kingdoms fell.
Also that the Cumbric language persisted in the form of a few fossilised numbers in an ancient agricultural counting system. Amazing.
The Etymological roots of Giffnock where I grew up just outside of Glasgow is partially Brythonic - 'The Scottish Gaelic name for Giffnock is Giofnag and is of partially Brythonic and Gaelic origin. 'Cefn' (i.e. 'Giff') comes from the Brythonic meaning 'ridge' and the Gaelic cnoc (i.e. 'nock') meaning "hill". In Gaelic, oc or og is a diminutive, and thus when added to cefn gives Giffnock the meaning of "Little Ridge"'
@@grahamyoung3433 where do the Celtics origin from? Are there romantic peoples? Are Germanic?
@@barryhessel6078 The Celts originated from Iberian but note only the Celtic elite, their families and warbands are from Iberia. The dominant culture doesn't relate to the people. Also, Celtic is a distinct branch of Indo-European just like Romance and Germanic languages are Indo-European. For example, French is a Romance language, German is a Germanic and Welsh is a P-Celtic language that is divided from Proto-Celtic. It's neither Romance nor Germanic.
Also on the ethicity of peoples, Elmet was a Celtic Kingdom but genetically the native peoples outnumbered the Celtic invaders. Studies are in the early days but so far they've found 60% of people surveyed from Yorkshire have DNA dating back to the end of the Ice age which is unique to other British ethnicities. The women surveyed carry distinct genes dating back 9400 years, the assumption is that the DNA comes from the peoples that lived on the coast of Doggerland. However, the males in Yorkshire carry DNA not as old as the women dating back 4000 years to the first Indo-European farmers who came over and took native women as wives/mates. As farms produced more food women had more children and began to genetically outnumber the native male hunter population helping to preserve the male genes of the farmers.
The genes associated with these farmers are from multiple tribes but the majority are found in germanic populations as they moved west a lot stopped in germanic areas while others continued to Britain, likely because of rich soil they picked Yorkshire as a place to settle in large numbers contributing to making the population of Yorkshire insular to other males populations in Britain as others other genetic lines were replaced with Celtic male genes for example. This shows how a population can be ethically distinct but still accept and be accepted by a dominant culture without being totally slaughtered or revolting. And how other peoples are slaughtered in mass or are outcompeted by invaders completely wiping out ethnic lines. But ethnicity has nothing to do with a people's chosen culture. The Celts for 1000years were a successful ethnic ruling elite and because of this, their culture spread far and wide... until challenged.
I remember some years ago I was at a cash machine in Glasgow and the language options were English Welsh and Spanish, surely for different reasons, but later on when I’ve learned about the Old North that memory came back and Welsh seemed appropriate haha. While I support protecting Scottish Gaelic I would also encourage teaching Welsh in the Strathclyde area as the alternative to an extinct yet fairly similar Brythonic.
Barry Hessel the Celts are neither Germanic or Romance people's.
Their language although Indo European is quite distinct. That alone is enough evidence of the difference from the other two.
They may have originated around the Black sea and migrated to Europe,which the ruled for a time.
Thank you! As someone born in the south of Wales I've been frustrated at the lack of info on the Celtic Britons of this time period. Sad that written examples of the Cumbric language were all lost. This is the first video on RUclips I've seen on the subject, wonderfully done. V good job on all the pronunciation too ;)
Thank you so much! I started learning more about the Celtic peoples of the period because of my interest in their traditional enemies the Anglian Northumbrians but I'll be sure to put more up about them in future!
History With Hilbert Thankyou again, hope things go well for you mate.
The pronunciation is awful and very anti Welsh. One eyed English version of history.
@@timothyphillips5043 how?
@@finnianquail8881 Do you mean why?
The majority of my heritage is from the British isles, including Gwynnedd, and as an American, I'm thankful that you made this. I appreciate all I can find.
🙄
@@Ionabrodie69 Whats with the eye roll lol
@@Slapnuts9627Because I felt like it … 🤷♀️
@@Ionabrodie69 Why that face? We're more English than half the people in London
@@dominicgrandon7955 And what exactly defines English?
As an Englishman I would like more funding and encouragement for the Celtics languages special Wales , saying that I would also like to encourage a more Anglo Saxon English
Anglo Saxons spoke Old English. The Geordie accent includes Old English words as well as Norse.
We English were taken over by the invaders and made to speak there Germanic Language after the Brythonic Kingdoms fell.
Carly Wilson..No more than 30% of the average Englishman’s blood is Norman or Anglo-Saxon the rest is original Brythonic. Contrary to popular belief they didn’t get pushed out of England they stayed put and absorbed newcomers. All that changed was the language and some new customs.
Bandichod Madabandichod. Germanic people aren’t from Germany the Germans are a Germanic people. The Celts are from southern Germany and Central Europe.
We wouldn't have needed the funding if English people didn't impose law's for centuries forbidding our language being spoken. Oh remember the Welsh Not to?
As a Welshman today I love being able to translate some of that old poem especially the line 'Trychwn a thrychant' which now would be 'Tri (Three) cwn (Dogs/hounds) a tri (Three) cant (Hundred)' so has hardly changed.
Tri cŵn a thri chant?
It's ironic that the saxons called us foreigners 😂😂
The Red-Eyed Baron they weren't immigrants they were invaders
Sorry to crash your ultra-nationalist right-wing party, but in the same sense humans are invaders everywhere.
Also, 'us'? You really believe in national purity after society pretty much hit the reset button after the Industrial Revolution?
Nationalism is the new opium of the masses...
dynamiths86 I'm Korean and Welsh so I would hardly call my self pure or a ultra nationalist 🤣🤣
Also opium how old are you? it's cocaine these days my dude 😅😅
dynamiths86
sorry to crash your ultra lefty rant 😅😂
Brilliant, Dan Ti!
it's really awesome being a welsh speak and being able to interpret all the old names of British places, despite the fact many are oblivious to all the rich history we have as an ancient island, in some respects I really wish a new 300 movie is made of a true great feat and sacrifice of real men, would be an awesome film, great video as always, keep up the good work!
Yeaassssssss!
Awesome video, I have researched the Hen Ogledd for years. Great to see you've done a video on this lesser know part of Britains history and a massive part of the Norths heritage. Why this is never taught in schools in the North, (particularly in Cumbria) is a crying shame. Great work
Yup it is sad that the Celtic heritage is forgotten in Cumbria. Most Cumbrians today don't know and are surprised when you tell them. The only people who know this are in the isolated west coast where many still use the old Celtic counting system
@@theodorekaczynski1683 interestingly this counting system is still used across Northern England in older shepherding communities
Up until my father's time (but unfortunately no more as far as I know) there was a child's rhyme still being taught in Lancaster (North Lancashire) and the surrounding area. My dad had mostly forgotten it when he told me but what he did remember included counting in what I had always assumed was nonsense words.
But after watching this I now know that these were Celt remnants. My dad couldn't really remember it very well, having not heard it since he was a very small boy in the 1930s so unfortunately I remember even less. But the "numbers" were something like Ayan, Tan, Tedda, Medder, pimb, sheh, shot, hot (or hoht), noya, day. That might be quite inaccurate as I am remebering something told to me in the 90s by somebody who heard it in the 30s.
Apparently this was a well used rhyme (possibly about fish and a cat?) amongst very young children but as I say it doesn't seem to have survived past my dad's generation.
I so wish I he had recalled it better and that I had written it down!
That's fascinating, never heard of it relating to a fish and a cat. Have you read this? en.m.wikipedia.org/wiki/Yan_Tan_Tethera
arcanics1971: English contains many “Celt remnants”, some intact. For example, “eight days” is Brythonic, as is the pronunciation of the English alphabet. “Rock” is Celtic, as is “Door”. I’ve already mentioned “cam” and “ooze”, “Mum” and “Dad”. Many personal names are Celtic: eg Brian, Colin, Deirdre, Imogen, Muriel. Of course there are many more. “Alan” is Eastern Iranian (for “Iran”) but entered English via Breton.
Ethan Dienert: after 1066, the Earls and their entourages in several of the regions where these were in use, were themselves Bretons, and some of them were known to be shepherds in their spare time (that’s how Wensleydale cheese was invented). So they could well have understood and even encouraged these numerals.
The cat part might be cattera? That's 8 in the Lancashire dialect version of sheep-counting. 1-20, according to my Great Grandma via my Dad: Yan, tan, tethera, methera, pimp, teeza, leeza, cattera, horna, dik, yandik, tandik, tetherdik, metherdik, bumpit, yanabumpit, tanabumpit, tetherabumpit, metherabumpit, jigot.
No idea on the fish front, though!
I came across a reference to something similar to what you have mentioned a few years ago in a book about Cumbrian family history. The author was talking about the ancient brythonic language, fragments of which had survived the Norman Conquest and been passed down through the centuries. Here's a link which explains it completely: en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Yan_Tan_Tethera
I'm relieved to hear this... been trying to educate people most of my life about this! Bless you
Seriously interesting video. Thanks for taking the time to do this, brilliant stuff!
The poetry of Aneuryn and Taliesyn were written in the North, using the same bardic system with rules that we use today.Brythonic peoples had a common culture which everyone understood universally from Cornwall to Hadrian wall.It was a culture that was seldom written down,but learned and recited by bards who were schooled for this sole purpose..Of course rhyme makes learning a lot easier and thus the system prevailed,as did the place names the further west you go in England.Great video though and I'd love to see more on this topic 👍
What are ripping great vid keep them coming. Even though my family left those Isles 400 and some odd years ago, the history there absolutely fascinates me and I study all I can about it. And your channel is a huge help doing that thanks again!👍👍
Thank you for your support, really happy to hear you're enjoying my content!
By far my favourite video you've ever made!
Glad you enjoyed it!
Fantastic and in depth. An overlooked piece of history. Thank you so much for making this video
I've only just come across this but thank you so much. It's a period and area of our history that has fascinated me for years and which I have studied (to a certain degree) but it's great to see such an informative and effective video about it out there!
Thank you, Hilbert, for a very informative video.
Fantastic video, as always very well researched and presented. Great to learn about my celtic heritage as a fellow geordie! Thanks again from Australia
Thank you so much!
Superb, family all from Fife and Aberdeen - Grandmothers maiden name being Penicuik - got a little heart flutter when you used it as an example. Big respect, this represents many, many hours of work - first the research then the pronunciation!!! Liked and subscribed, my Northern Brother!!
Thank You. Looks brilliant!
Last year i was in Wales. What a beautifull and interesting County. I wanted to visit Wales because my favorite player comes from Wales, Gareth Bale. I was in Cardiff in his Sportsbar "Elevens". A special beautiful Town. .i'm from Germany and next year i travel to Wales again. Love it. ❤
Regina Eickmann country not county not part of England though they think we are subjects
go to yorkshire
Well done, Hilbert! You did an admirable job explaining a complicated subject that can be confusing for viewers who are unfamiliar. But everyone should be familiar with the story of the Celtic Britons. 🐻🐉
Thank you very much, I'm glad you thought so!
Great video! Lots of interesting information I knew bits about but you have fleshed out in more detail.
I hadn’t thought to look at other place names from outside of Wales to see the welsh/similar welsh words that make up the name.
I am definitely going to have to take a look at your other content to see what else I can learn about celtic Briton
Been watching your videos for a minute now and I know whenever I come across one, I'm in for a good time. I really enjoy learning about the isles and its rich history. I have ancestors and family still from all across those islands and even though if never had a chance to visit, with your videos it gives me a chance to imagine what a remarkable and magic place it is. Top notch work dude. Greetings from Kansas.
Thankyou so so much for this! I have been trying to find out more about the Celtic period of the South Lancashire region which i call home for so long and could hardly find anything! and now i find out we were Pengwyns of Pengwern! xD
Excellent video, as always, Hilbert! Always like to hear those old languages being spoken, as it reminds us of the days before Romance & Germanic languages held sway in Europe. Always brings to mind for me hearing the differences between Hebrew as spoken between Yemenites, Ashkenazim, & Israeli (Modern) speakers.
This video is brilliant and answered a few questions for me. Great work. Very interesting watch
This is a great channel I just subscribed. I already watched the Picts, Celts and the Gauls. My mother's family is from Edinburgh and my father is from Belfast Antrim County, Northern Ireland. My mother's grandmother is Welsh and I really enjoyed learning more about the history. Keep up the great video's. 👍
I’m proud to be Welsh, CYMRU AM BYTH❤️🏴
Another fantastic vid dude! Learning a lot from your content about my own country
Thank you for watching!
I am born and bred in southern Cumbria and I always find it difficult to find information about these things. Thank you, and a great video!
Thank you for taking the time to do all the research and connecting the dots so to speak. Its important to remember the Ancients.
Thank you for a very informative and interesting video! Cheers from Sweden
Just found your channel and I love it! I just missed the national anthem of the Netherlands
._.
Awesome vids, can tell you put a lot of time and effort into the research
omg, so much info in just 22 min, will have to watch a few times over... you could (and one day maybe will) make a whole university course from this. "professor hilbert" sounds awesome. thank you so much!
You should do some of the obscure kingdoms of the south and midlands too like the Hwicce (an interesting Anglian/British kingdom that followed the rites of the British church and probably still retained elements of Roman civilisation beyond the kingdoms surrounding it), Caer Gloui, Caer Baddan and Caer Ceri. The Hwicce seemed to have been the pivot on which Mercian and Wessex supremacy was balanced. Very interesting.
I imagine the people of the border began to see more in common than difference after the Anglo Saxons converted. After 100 years of wars, raids, famine and God knows what else on the borders they must have traded and mingled for survival. With Rome sending a handful of missionaries to convert perhaps curious Saxons sought out the British church? Guess we'll never know, which is frustrating.
These are the ancestors of Elon Musk,
Elon Musk's 22cd Great Grandfather,
Owain Gwynedd ap Gruffydd, King of Gwynedd & the legends of King Arthur & Gruffuydd Maelor
I understand the Hwicce territory was more or less the present-day Herefordshire, Glos, Worcs and Warks, so I'm not surprised they held such sway on the balance of power. A vast forest that stretched from the Severn across nearly to Oxford took its name from them, Wychwood, (Hwiccewode?). All that remains of it is a few square miles near Chipping Norton in NW Oxon. Interestingly three W. Oxfordshire villages, Ascott-under-Wychwood, Milton-under-Wychwood and Shipton-under-Wychwood now stand in miles of open rolling agricultural land but would've originally been within the forest, literally under the Wychwood.
@@stox-sj2pe There's a Wychwood brewery too.
Hen Ogledd still means old north, some Welsh letters at the beginning of words mutate depending on the context of the words use, gogledd is the word for north, used in this context with 'hen' the mutation for 'g' is it's removal, as it's a soft mutation.
Enjoyed the video thanks for sharing!
Very much enjoyed that. Thank you.
Great video. Really interesting and being a ‘Lancashire Lass’ I appreciated this often overlooked story. Thank you! 👍☺️
I love how all the kings mentioned in this video were all featured in Age of Empires II when you played against a Briton or Celtic AI Player
What a game though!
AOE is so good for that stuff. All of the AI are named after significant characters from history, you can learn a lot by playing a bot game and looking up the names of who you're against.
a nice video , I do applaud your use of the vocabulary of the welsh words, which is always a feat :P...well researched and presentated, the only part I think I would have a slight[and I mean slight] issue would be when you mentioned cornwall [but didn't highlight it on the map] , as I think viewers who are not from the UK [and some that are perhaps ? :D] , wouldn't know where that county might be :D...other than that slight , I think it was a excellent video which highlights a lot of history , that even I was unaware , I was missing . well done [bows] :P
Thank you so much, really glad you enjoyed it! Thanks for the suggestion, I'll be sure to highlight it a bit more in the next one because it's a good point!
This is like the perfect example of constructive criticism. :)
@@TomatoToMaToes69 , it was part of the Old North though.....
Fascinating, thank you!
I love history ! Great video, amazing information. Keep up the research. 😁
I like how you pronounce things by putting on an accent. Makes me smile when you're doing the Welsh stuff.
Its weird listening to Welsh as an Irish person it sounds very familiar but its still completely incomprehensible.
I worked for a while in Ireland and heard the news on tv in Gallic weird sounded a bit like Welsh but couldn't understand the words but somehow managed to get the gist of some of it it was cool though!peace and love to my Celtic cuz
I came home drunk once and accidentally put S4C on the TV. I thought someone had spiked my drink!
To my mind the closest matching word is the word for Island. Innis= ynys
I feel the same about Irish as a welsh speaker it sounds so familiar & homely. Both beautiful languages....
We aren't Same Celts or culture unlike the scots
Great vid. Very informative. Beautiful languages.
Great video. Thanks, I was educated today and that's always a good thing.
I'm from Cumbria and it's sad that not many Cumbrians know about our Celtic roots. Only the extremely isolated and poor west coast around Workington and Whitehaven uses the numbering system. They used to use it in the central lakes too, but the agricultural locals there were slowly pushed out by an influx of rich southerners moving in due to tourism.
Very good, a most neglected part of our history. Just to nit-pick, as far as I am aware the Gododdin did not 'descend' from the Votadini, they WERE the Votadini. It's just that 'Votadini' was the Roman word for the tribe and 'Gododdin' the Brythonic word. Also, I am not sure they were 'planted' by the Romans, rather they were there already and simply became a Roman client tribe to help protect the north against Pictish raids. Regarding 'Y Gododdin', my understanding is that the force that fought the A-S at Catraeth was a coalition featuring elements from throughout 'Y Hen Ogledd' and possibly from what is now Wales, not just the Gododdin. In addition, Catraeth did not mean 'the end of the Gododdin' as they were finally defeated at the siege of Din Eidyn over 20 years later. Also, as you say, elements of the Gododdin, under Cunedda, moved to North Wales (although well before Catraeth) essentially to defend that area from Irish raiders and founded the Kingdom of Gwynedd. In a way, therefore, it could be said that the essence of the Gododdin continued. Indeed, as you will be aware, the men of Gwynedd under Cadwallon ap Cadfan, in alliance with Mercia, succeed in defeating the Northumbrians, under Edwin, at Hatfield Chase around 633 AD and then ravaged Northumbria in an attempt perhaps to regain 'Y Hen Ogledd'. Their defeat by Oswald at Heavenfield (633/34) effectively ended 'Welsh' ambitions in the North.
You wonderfully covered the whole subject.
excellent video, hearing the lullaby was awesome
2:28 Gogledd is welsh for north, but when you put “hen” (meaning “old”) in front it mutates by losing the first G, becoming Hen Ogledd. So, when just saying north/northerner, there is no mutation and the word is contracted to Gog or Gogs.
Amazing! Trying to learn more about the 6 tribes of the Celts. I've lived in the UK, visited Cornwall, the Cornish language felt so familiar as if deep in my 'junk' DNA I remembered it... 4 yrs later got a DNA test and came up Briton (now part of France) 55.5%, and celtic England, Welsh, Cornwall... Unfortunately sites like ancestry don't give you the breakdown like 23andme where they pin point Britany, FR, not the same as the rest of FR at all. Thank you for the info, so much to learn!
Fantastic video. Subscribed now x
great work, thanks very much
Proud to be of Northumbrian heritage. The Anglo-Saxons certainly were warriors.
As a younger man in the 80's, I spent a lot of time getting my hands on any British Isles literature I could: Anything Irish, Welsh Scottish, and English history, myth, folk and fairy tales, the older the better. I found while reading Tolstoy's Quest for Merlin, there were these books called the Four Ancient Books of Wales (W.F. Skene's works) and I had to have it. This was in the 80's so it wasn't readily available like it is today, so I got both English and Welsh versions from an Arthurian lit prof from the University of Illinois, and with a bunch of quarters spent an hour or so copying them at a Kinko's. Stories called The Battle of Arfderydd, the Battle of the Trees (Gad Goddeu) from the Book of Taliesin. The Dialogue of Merlin and Taliesin. Some of the earliest and outside the normal references for Arthur are found here (reference as "Arthur's men at Longborth"). If you can get these, they are wondrous. If anyone knows the current consideration of the relevance of these works or can recommend more up to date translations and/or interpretations, please let me know.
So good, I watched it again. Love this period of history exactly in the region you illustrated.
Facinating and well presented
My ancestors come from the Pengwern/Mercia area. If you're interested, in future videos you could call the area north of Gloucestershire and south of Lancashire the West Midlands.
Love the videos. I am trying to learn to read and speak Welsh and while finding it quite challenging, there is no point in trying to read about history if I can't pronounce anything.
Well done, always very well researched your videos.
Thank you for these wonderful videos. I learn so much and enjoy the animations.
The one question I have
Are you planning on doing a video on the Kingdom of Dal Riata?
Thank you! And definitely that's something I'm planning!
Great video! Would also love to see a video about the history of bretons and brittany
Thank you! I'll have more videos on similar topics soon!
History With Hilbert sounds good!
Can you do a Newcastle history video, enjoy your content because I think it’s a generally overlooked area in the history books.
Very Interesting Hilbert,Love what you do.
Thank you so much!
As always, wonderful stuff
Just to clear up an apparent confusion regarding Ogledd and Gogledd. Hen Ogledd means Old North in modern Welsh just as much as in old Welsh. Gogledd and Ogledd are the same word. G, when a soft mutation is applied, disappears.
There are, incidentally, those of us who believe that the main reason the term "Brythonic" is used instead of "Old Welsh" to describe these people and their language is that the English don't like to admit that the Welsh were there first.
The English would love the world to believe they have indigenous rights to Britain rather than being Jonny-come-latelies of the last millennium, sure. There are several good reasons for not calling the Hen Ogledd « Welsh », the first being that it's a somewhat disparaging English word. Linguistically, the language split into Cumbric, Cymraeg, Kernowek and Brezhoneg and other dialects and politically the people were divided into several different kingdoms with loyalties being based on the clan level. It would be just as wrong to call people from Saxony 'English'. We need a collective term for people who lived in Britain before the English arrived - ooh look! « Briton ».
But surely everyone spoke Brythonic before the Romans arrived, then Old Welsh was invented using a combination of Brythonic and Latin?
I'm pretty sure the people of kingdoms such as Rheged and Elmet didn't refer to themselves as Welsh either... The language and culture of Northern England may have been anglicised but the people that live in these areas still maintain Brythonic culture to some extent and most definitely the genetics. The term Brythonic is used to differentiate linguistic differences in other Celtic languages within the British Isles. The term Welsh is Anglo Saxon in origin so if choice of words is an issue that should be the most heinous crime going
.. I’m English and from the NORTH... we consider anyone further south than Scotch corner a Southerner.. .I’d love to chop the border there. 🏴🖕
@@Ionabrodie69 Northern Independence? :-)
Can't wait until you cover the welsh and cornish/dumnonni
I hate how quick people are to brush away British history. The British isles have ancient, mysterious, and rich histories and cultures, no less rich than any other corner of the world. As an American whose heritage traces back to the original settlers, I take great pride in my British roots, as much as I take pride in being an American, and I feel a brotherly love not just for my kindred across the Atlantic, but also up North in Canada, and in Australia and New Zealand. May the Anglo-sphere stay strong and may our cultural ties and friendship forever endure !
I came across the video while reading Vanished Kingdoms by Norman Davies featuring a long chapter on Hen Ogledd and while working my way through my first couple of Welsh lessons on Duolingo and it's just lovely how it all clicks together 8)
Nice video Hilbert :) what are your thoughts on the 'treachery of the long knives?'
the Anglo Saxons coming in and calling the locals foreigners is actually pretty based lmao
awesome keep it up your the best
Thank you so much for your support!
Brilliant video!
It is worth noting, that while Elmet lost "York" early on. It survived long after the other Hen Ogledd (within England) fell, due to the kingdom moving into the Pennines.
I was going to mention this too. The name Elmet survives as well in West & North Yorkshire. Barwick in Elmet & Sherburn in Elmet just two of the towns retaining the ancient name for the area.
Aye yous are right, they seem to have held out in the hill country for quite a while longer and in some of the places names round about. Even in York itself they use the name Elmet for several businesses if I'm not mistaken.
03germas A
My understanding is that Elmet 'fell' in around 616/17 AD having been invaded by Edwin of Northumbria. Rheged at least survived much longer. Also, I thought York was part of Deira.
Who else learned a lot of this stuff already playing the tutorial islands in Crusader Kings?
A nice video showing again that History is more complicated than you think, but also more interesting!
I also noticed, although i only know a few words of it, similarities between Welsh and Breton (spoken in Brittany), especially with the counting system. It reminded me of the fact that they descend from the Britons who fled after the Germanic invasions. Could you make a video about it since it's somehow related? And maybe talk about what happened to the Britons who ended under Germanic rule?
Ab-so-lute-ly mar-ve-llous (both latin words rather than germanic!!). This is my favourite RUclips channel. I'll be patreoning soon. Fab, fab, fab. Two Darlingtonians, living in la Narbona (Agathé Tyché) since 1989. My English classes begin with 2 hours based on your history and Langfocus's language videos.
I have a lot of British heritage. I love learning about this stuff!
@Gísiu Wulf I have heritage from Ireland, Scotland, Wales, and England so that's why I just said British because my family was all over the British Isles
Happy Easter!
If you don't wish me a happy Easter in return, don't even worry about coming back to work because you're fired.
地球の天皇ジュリアン Happy Easter (:
Hahahahahaha, I like your sass, boss.....happy Easter.
地球の天皇ジュリアン
"Emperor Julian of Earth".
Cool name :)
Thank you all. Haha
Happy Easter
Excellent video!!!
This was brilliant, thanksbuddy. Hadn't realised Swaledale & Teesdale had such a Celtish connection.
Might explain my red hair. ..I live on the edge of Teesdale..
Great video, always like your analysis of Wales/Welsh/Celtic history. Do you have any plans for a Welsh kingdoms v Vikings. They seemed to do better than some of the other kingdoms at that time.
Thank you so much! Yes something like that is on the cards, very neglected topic if you asked me.
www.academia.edu/36313974/Welsh_Resistance_in_the_Viking_Age.docx
Thanks Hilbert keep the Celts a live.
Thanks for your support!
@@historywithhilbert146 this is amazing, my family comes from Ireland and goes to scotland then to wales and now England, so its brilliant to know about them in more detail, you you do more on minor towns and settlements like leicestershire, corieltauvi is hardly ever spoken about and would be great if you could do so, also leicester was one of the first to mint coins
Very interesting indeed it highlights a different angle of intertwining history of our island's
Thanks for taking the time. My irish/ scotch whisky roots are smiling.
Hilbert just took April Fools to the next level by posting a serious video about a poorly known topic on the 1st of April.
It was either that or make a video defending the historical accuracy of black vikings wearing horned helmets..
History with Hilbert a leak of a second Glorious
revolution aimed at absorbing the UK (or all of it outside Englnad) into
NL in order to keep it in the EU would've been very interesting. Though
maybe not very believable.
It's not poorly known but maybe not widely depends where you live
The Welsh language is beautiful, very enjoyable as usual, thank-you. I always thought Irish was the oldest recorded vernacular language Europe, through ogham and the epistola, Patrick's confession and other works on the the life of Column Cille.
The O Donnell's revered a book called the Catath or battle book, when the O Donnell army formed up for battle the book was brought out and carried around the entire Army three times before they went into battle, it still exists today and is held in Ireland, it was supposedly written in the sixth century.
@Crimthan Mor In Donegal Irish?
@tsean bean bocht..yes luckily some great books still exist..but it would be wonderfull if we could could discover what happened to the libraries at Iona ans Lindisfarme,and other great libraries created by the Gaelic peoples...I'm sure they weren't all destroyed by th vikings n others
The battle book. Love these stories
Of what you guys are into. That they carried a book three times around is such a Celtic thing to do. I love my Celtic ancestry and their unique stories and attitude towards life.
Especially interested in Queens Cartimandua of the Brigante.
The whole Roman and pre Roman Britain is my favourite,but much neglected. It's videos like this that inspire me to pursue their history.
Great video 👌👍diolch.
@@MrResearcher122 Yes Donegal ( Tír Chonaill)
@@jangowan5742 The book of kells was said to be made in Iona but I don't think it's really known.
Fantastic series of films and great to see something about the borders
Much better than the video I watched by history time...... You actually present us with facts and further research.
The traditional name of Arthur's father was Uther Pendragon. I don't believe Uther comes from Uhtred. It is usually thought to be Old Welsh.
I'd agree with you there, doesn't seem to be much reason for him to have a Germanic first name either.
History With Hilbert the actual name is Uther Pendragiau (a title, not a name)...Pendragon is a mix of Welsh and English done on purpose to muddy the waters.
"Uther" might also come from the old Brythonic word for "bear"... which is a perfectly believable war-title if you ask me. "The Bear" of Pendragon.
Thanks. I thought I remembered that but couldn't check any source.
MrMortull Yes, it actually meant Iron Bear. So full name in modern English would probably translate as Iron Bear, The Head Dragon.
Great video! But Cunedda is pronounced
kin-etha, don’t worry I though it was pronounced koon-etha.
Also ogledd and gogledd are the same word in the same state of history, the only difference is ogledd is gogledd with a consonant mutation (an odd part of welsh grammar)
Also those text are in old welsh, but with cumbric influences. We don’t have any complete text of cumbric as of currently.
Celt of Canaan Esurix - Thanks for pointing out the correct pronunciation of Cunedda (the "u" being pronounced as a "short i" (as in "fin" and "din") in modern Welsh, anyway. I love the Welsh language. I'm American with roots in Yorkshire, on my father's side, and Wales on my mom's side (Rees). This is a great video, and a great service to everyone with family roots and ties to the British Isles!
Ah thanks for the tip! Doing my best on the Brythonic pronunciation but it's still very limited!
Roger Quarton on my mother’s side I’ve got ancestry from all over the British isle, mostly from England, Scotland, and Wales (in that order)
Also most the English in me is from the northern parts, so I like to think I’m descended from some of those last Britons in England too...
Interesting!
Kenneth no less.
dude that poem was so beautiful it made me cry
Gogledd and Ogledd are the same word. Just the g can disappear in the beginning of the words in certain grammatical incidents.
The b, d & g + p, t & c (=k, always - except ch) are such sounds, which in the beginning of the word react to the word in front of them.
They can go softer: b>v (written f, thus ff means the f in other languages), d>dd (soft th) & g>- (zero) (like gogledd > ogledd) + p>b, t>d & c>g.
Also the ll(=lh), rh & m do this - they change to l, r & v(written f).
Further, they can go nasal: b>m, d>n & g>ng(of siNGer, not fin(g)-ger) + p>mh, t>nh & c>ngh - the last 3 with the h are like whispered versions of the more familiar ones.
And also the voiceless ones can go fricatives, 'raspy': p>ph (=our f), t>th (hard sound) & c>ch (as Loch in Scottish).