**"One man, one very specific man, might be all that's stand between Humanity and the greatest threat in our brief existence..."** ME Best Triology of all time ME2 Best Game of all time ME2 Best Soundtrack of all time ME2 Best thing in the Sci-Fi Genre
I honestly want to see, if they ever get around to mass effect 4, that the illusive man was right and some major conflict breaks out between humanity and the other alien species.
"You seen it yourself - outbested all of them." "You are unique. Not in what you experienced, but in what you represent." "Despite what you think of Cerberus, of me...you are a valuable asset. For all of humanity. Be careful, Shepard "
"You never truly believed in us. Cerberus isn't just an organization or the people behind it. Cerberus is an idea. That idea is not so easily destroyed." man that line was delivered...
I'm more impressed by the times Shepard's conviction makes TIM pause for a moment. "You're idealism is....admirable, Shepard." That fact that even in private TIM still openly respected (maybe even admired) him/her makes me think some part of him always regretted losing Shepard as an asset. "No, I'm not writing Shepard off as a total loss yet."
And what idea is that? Seriously, did TIM ever tell us? Because, from what we get, their entire schtick is stuff like torturing kids to get better biotics, somehow, shoving Reaper Tech on people, getting killed by their experiments (thorian creepers, husks and rachni), and feeding colonists to Thresher Maws (to study the effect of feeding colonists to Thresher Maws, I guess?). If you stop to think about it, they only do mad-science or just pseudo-science, the moustache twilling villain kind. So, if Cerberus is an idea, then it's a really stupid one.
Illusive Man: Don't turn your back on me, Shepard! I made you! I brought you back from the dead! Shepard: And I'm going to do exactly what you brought me back to do. I'm gonna win this war, and I'll do it without sacrificing the soul of our species!
@@nathangordon4891 That was both his weakness and strength. It provided him strength in ME2, where he put it towards a plan he believed would be the best plan against the Reapers, even though (IMO) he was being indoctrinated at the time (When you get Jarvik, he said something along the lines of the people who believed they could conquer the Reapers being indoctrinated, and being the knife in the back of the Protheans). Then when the Reapers actually attack, they utilise the indoctrination to turn him into a ruthless leader that is causing humanity more harm than good.
The fact that so many ME fans see him as some tragic hero is, I think, a testament to how good of a villain Jack Harper is. He was always a human centric nut that simultaneously fought for human superiority while also being content with throwing away human lives. He was never a good person, yet his charisma and overall aura managed to convince people that he was a reasonable figure. Stellar writing on Bioware's part
@@basedkaiser5352 You make that argument from the exact same position White Supremacists made theirs' from. We aren't special because of our race, we aren't special because of our species, it is our sentience that gives our lives special purpose. Should another species with sentience be encountered, they would be our equals, and if they came with peaceful intent, it would be for the betterment of all sentient life to further the improvement of the futures of both species as part of the interstellar community.
One thing The Illusive Man said stuck with me. He told Shepard before the launching of the Suicide Mission that he was a valuable asset to all of humanity. He had no idea how right he was, and would be.
I would have to go with, Cerberus isn't just an organization it's an ideal that can't be so easily destroyed. It makes you think that maybe Cerberus in some fashion will be in the next game.
I hope they are. In a form of another organisation, with just hints connecting them to Cerberus. Or possibly hints pointing out that various, seemingly unrelated, human agents are operating according to one scheme. Never stating openly that Cerberus is still active.
Grey Hand Remember there are 2 or more active Cerberus cells. Cronos station is not only station that Cerberus have. Cerberus will exist as long as humanity exist.
@@bez_znaczenia of course. Cerberus is the other side of us, of humans. It is in our nature to be dominant and do things the way we see fit. Just look at the trilogy. Suddenly out of nowhere, this new race of aliens coming from their Sol System. They are thirsty for knowledge... perhaps too thirsty and they are adaptable. Maybe too adaptable. They might not be as hardened as krogans but they sure share some of their features. Namely the way they hate to be pushed around. And look at that. They already are talking and working for a representative in the Citadel. Those humans - wonderful creatures that can be batshit scary.
I'd like to think that he brought Shepard back not just to get the Collector Base, but also to keep the Reapers busy (be his shield), while Cerberus undisturbed would find a way to control them.
awdawdawdawdawd Well, this is just one the reasons about why i think that ME3 had wasted so much potential. The Collector base, as we mentioned before, and its technology could be reverse engineered by the Alliance to create new weapons against the Reapers (it has happened before with the Thannix cannon, that it is essentially a less-powerful,reverse-engineered version of Sovereign's laser cannon).
One of the mayor problems I have with ME3 is that you're railroaded to go back to the Alliance no matter what. if you were a renegade in ME2 and kept the Collector Base, then it would make sense that Shepard would rejoin Cerberus in ME3. Having Alliance/Cerberus branching paths in ME3 would had meant writing both factions on a more morally grey light though (which would had been awesome).
@@xenozilla0723 Honestly the branch should have started in ME2 - Cerberus and Alliance path for both games, with the option to switch sides at the beginning of ME3 if needed
Shepherd never liked Cerberus; he was always an Alliance soldier from the very beginning. Shepherd would never betray the Alliance. It's one of his core character traits.
friendly reminder that the Illusive man was not technically the bad guy untill Mass Shit 3, which made the character a lame Saturday-morning cartoon villain that when confronted in dialogue he must reply "Im right, you're wrong!" or "You wouldn't understand LOL".
its possible that illusive man had been indoctrinated by reapers ,while he was trying to control them . After all the cerberus soldiers were turned into husks
No, he was not wasted. In fact ME:3 succeeded in making Illusive Man into the new Saren, the guy you hate at the start, but then feel sorry for because you realize he was brainwashed.
You will be missed TIM. Story writers throwing you under the bus to get a second enemy on ME3 will not overlap the awesomeness of Cerberus and Tim in ME2.
an 11 year old comment... and it couldn't be more correct. I felt the same way. I always wanted dialogue options to get TIM to come back over. He shouldn't have ended up as a 1 dimensional adversary. He was way too smart for that kind of treatment.
On reflection, after many years, the only thing that Cerberus did that made sense in ME3 with their MO in ME2 was the attack on the citadel, to a certain degree. I say this considering that the attack on the citadel resulted in the Alliance getting the full support of the council after the attack, Cerberus become the public villain but the alliance ends up benefiting the most protecting humanity in the long term. Everything else they did undermined humanity.
@@alphabet2238Now that you said that I think BioWare missed a GOLDEN opportunity with Cerberus in ME3, imagine if after all Tim did was only for the Alliance and Shepard gain strength and support from other races since otherwise they wouldn't or something like that, that he was pushing Shepard forward and betting all his chips on him... Would be cool
@@mariogallo2293 That would've been great. Even if we didn't have the option to ally with Cerberus at least keep them as morally grey rather than just a textbook villain. I probably disliked what they did to Cerberus more than the rushed product of the ending.
"Don't turn your back on me, Shepard! I brought you back from the dead! I made you and your team!" "You may have brought us all together, but WE made it a team!"
The Illusive Man is one of, if not over all, my favorite character in the trilogy. As much as people bitched about them in ME3, I still liked what Bioware did with them. In fact, I'm one of the few to say ME3 is my favorite of the trilogy. What makes TIM such a prefect antagonist, not villain, is that he really does want what is best for humanity. He really sees himself as helping us out, he just never knew he was indoctrinated. In fact, in ME2, I trusted him enough to be completely shocked when I played ME3. I just felt so bad for him when I killed him, and those lines... "Earth... if only you could see it like I do, Shepard. It's so... perfect." Wonderful last lines that describe his whole character in one moment. He's just a perfect antagonist.
Completely agree with you my friend.TIM is my favorite one too,then Garrus.In Mass Effect 3 his personality changed into something...I dont know how to say,but it was so cool to see him interviing in the perfect moments to make the story most interesting.And yes,I am one of the few people who like Mass Effect 3 as much as Mass Effect 2.
I agree that Mass Effect 3 was the best of the series, if not for the ending. They told us that our decisions would change the entire outcome but in the end we just got to pick what colour the mass relays exploded in.
+AN Productions Yep, great lines. But that was the reason for his demise. For he and the reapers shared the same unquenchable zeal to attain perfection. But that's where they are wrong. Organism/synthetics can't be perfect. For a perfect society or universe will hold no adventure or curiosity. Contention is perfection but curiosity is imperfection. That's where breakthroughs and discoveries lie!!
"Cerberus is committed to the advancement and preservation of humanity. If the Reapers are attacking us, trying to wipe us out, Cerberus will stop them" fucking chills man
Did you know that Saren and The Illusive Man (Jack Harper) have met in the past (First Contact War) and both contacted with reaper artefact (blue eyes, understanding reaper language). And both died in similar way, suicide.
Cerberus always has been an interesting faction. Such wasted potential in ME3 just to turn them into cannon fodder. I understand the Reaper's "divide and conquer from the inside" modus operandi needs to be felt in the game but to force it on Cerb whilst they spendt the entire second game building it up to be the only faction that gives a fuck about reapers is a little bit too much. It would have been so much better if they focused the entire "indoctrination and trechery" plot on the council and it's various races and members, insteading of shorthanding on Cerberus or just a few sidequests (like the crazed Hanar ambassador) All in all, i blame it on the rush and flurry of rewrites. Worth the 30$ IMO.
+Totally McMylastname If i recall correctly they switched the lead writer for ME3, resulting in changes in pacing and as you said, making cerberus cannon fodder with a (compared to the first two games) weak narrative and reason, as TIM is instantly indoctrinated and turns on you no matter what you do.
+Vicke Pee Under the influence of the Reapers shadow with the reaper heart/brain he installs in his base. Injecting with Reaper nanotech is the last straw that broke TIM's back. In ME1 various Cerb cells were portrayed as being somewhat ineffective, to put it mildly.
It was unavoidable, given the expanded universe's presentation. In one of the comics, he was exposed to a Reaper relic alongside Saren and began seeing visions of the Reapers' return. One would think Saren on the other hand was first exposed to indoctrination through Sovereign, but in truth he wasn't, as both of them had dealt with the relic from Shanxi. Due to lack of repeated exposure, the effects of the indoctrination appeared much, much later in the Illusive Man than in Saren but it was indeed unavoidable.
I definitely think having you work for/with Cerberus in ME2 was a masterstroke along with the introduction of TIM. Overall, he's got to be one of the best written characters in gaming, if not all visual media.
Random Garreh I'm new to the X-Files.... THAT'S WHO THE SMOKING MAN REMINDS ME OF OMG I COULD NEVER PUT MY FINGER ON IT. HE'S THE ILLUSIVE MAN HOLY CRAP.
EyeAr WeeTawTed we know enough... read Mass effect evolution its a 4 part mini series comic focusing on the illusive man and the first contact war (I think there was fighting)
The Conversations between the Illusive men and Shepard were the best in the whole ME Series in my Opinion. "We are committed to the advancement and preservation of Humanity" - Illusive Men
I really wish Bioware had made the Illusive Man an ally in Mass Effect 3 instead of an enemy. A split in Cerberus could have happened, and Jack Harper could have led any members who sided with him in support of Shepard while the other part unites under a new Illusive Man who fights against Shepard and their former leader.
+MrImastinker I wish that instead of spending half the game fighting other humans, we should have gotten that epic Reaper battle we were promised. It really should have been something like, the first half of the game only a few Reapers arrive, and we spend half the game fighting against the clock to prepare the galaxy. Then halfway through the game we get the actual Reapers, so there could be a sort of tonal shift where half the game is the Mass Effect 2 sorta "dark" tone, and then the rest of the game is Mass Effect 3's sorta "hopeful" tone.
+Cullen Bentley The reaper battle showdown with Harbinger was supposed to be a DLC. Bioware literally got screwed up after fan rage over the ending. Indoctrination theory is supposed to be canon!!! Oh, and Shep is still kickin and 'breathing' amidst the rubble...bad news for any reaper plan!!! So, cheer up!
+Zed Zamorin the indoctrination theory is not canon. I should know, I did some work on it. it was merely us fans grasping at straws trying to make sense of this shit heap bioware gave us. I mean, this is the same company behind jade empire, knights of the old republic, baldur's gate and so much more. surely there has to be some hidden plot twists! but sadly, mass effect 3 is just a bad game.
+Cullen Bentley Yep, but ME3 was not a bad game. Its just the ending. But that's for 'Hero saves the day and lived happily after' BS we've been fed by every game and movie! After all the crazy stuff Shepard pulled off, and to remain a legend, He MUST Die !!! (Harvy Dent's quote from Dark Knight, remember?) ;)
Despite the fact of his ruthlessness and power hunger nature, I highly respect this man - mostly because of his appearance, sense of style and mystery. Not mentioning the fact he brought Shepard back to life, giving by it hope for every single civilization living in our galaxy.
The Illusive Man: "Shepard..." Commander Shepard: "Illusive Man. I thought we'd be meeting face to face." The Illusive Man: "Unnecessary precaution. Not unusual for people who know what you & I know." Commander Shepard: "And what exactly is it that you & I know?" The Illusive Man: "That our place in the galaxy is more fragile than we'd like to think. That one man - that one very specific man - may be all that stands between humanity & the greatest threat of our brief existence." Commander Shepard: "The Reapers."
One of, if not THE best part of the Mass Effect trilogy was the Illusive Man. A man who was willing to do whatever it took to save humanity with the best of intentions. It's equally as tragic and, dare I say, heartbreaking when he realises that all of the innocent lives he exposed to the Reapers experimentations were as a result of himself being brainwashed by the Reapers. His plead to Shepard at the end of ME3 was so fucking gut-wrenching; "I only wanted what was best for humanity!" Let's hope Andromeda lives up to the original trilogy's legacy.
Andromeda was bad we all know this, so we must wait for another game (will be, they said that). After ME3 fully focused on Cerberus will be that what I waiting for.
you honestly make him look better and more complex than he is. replay the ME2 and ME3 and really think about what he says and look at it in context of everything what hes done. hes an idiot and cerberus a contradicting bunch of nonesensical spies (and later a bunch of stupid mooks to shoot) Hes already an idiot in ME2,really. he only gets the cool music,settings and camera perspectives.
Andromeda has garbage story, no argue about that. Main villan has generic syndrom of corypheus from DAI, there's nothing special about him... (but still overall this game had VERY FEW, NOT BAD "moments") i still think that whole "Andromeda" thing had potential but sadly it was wasted by too "teenager" and "stupid" approach... The only one thing that this game done quite right i guess is graphical views, enviroments etc... but all rest has just "fan fiction writing level" and a real bad one, sorry.
Dear TiM, we miss you more than you will ever know. I miss the easy days of working for Cerberus, putting together the best team that the Galaxy had ever seen. I miss fighting the good fight, saving Garrus and re-uniting with Wrex and Tali and Liara. I miss the days of good games, and moments like watching the new Normandy launch, or surviving the Suicide Mission through the Omega IV Relay. There is a dream that was Mass Effect, and you were a big part of it. I wish I could have saved you, like you saved us.
Years later and I still find myself listening to this, as well as all the other soundtracks... The Illusive Man is such a beautifully written character.
TIM is still one of the best characters ever put into a video game in my opinion. Him becoming a servant to the Reapers is still a major character assassination in my eyes.
I'll just quote Garrus: "There's that ruthless calculus again". If you didn't import a GOOD save from ME2, Shepard is forced to do much worse than have one girl sent for torture.
Agreed! What you need is a good fanfic. Allow me to suggest Mass Effect: All in the Details. It starts immediately before the first game (and so far they've just picked up Liara,) but with a few details changed, the world turns out differently.
@@journey95far49 ME1 already portrays them as a completely xenophobic sect. They were evil for the start because they didn't understand that strength comes from sharing with your peers. The whole point of ME2 is about recruiting allies from various background, which goes against everything Cerberus is built around, so they also are portrayed as being wrong in ME2...
@@journey95far49 I was sour on this for a long time. Since I replayed through the games a few months back, I ended up being okay with it. The Protheans went through the same scenario Javik states. TIM and his crew were a great balance between fighting the repears, their minions, and indoctrinated humans (Cerebus, at least influced by TIM).
I love this piece so much, one of my all-time favourites. So futuristic and cold, yet strangely meditative and comforting. For some reason, the first thing that comes to mind is TIM nonchalantly adjusting his blazer before sitting down and telling Shepard "Miranda and Jacob will brief you" with that hint of pride in his voice, putting everything into place to make Shepard feel like they're in good hands even though he knows his own intentions aren't so pure. To be completely honest, if you were to tell me that the afterlife consists of just sitting in TIM's chair, smoking and drinking bourbon on the rocks while gazing at that burning sun for all eternity with this playing in the background, I'd be totally fine with that.
The illusive man is such a great villain because in his oppinion he really thought he was the good guy in the sense that the ends justify the means. It's just so sad that he was slowly indoctrinated and that he ultimately betrayed the human race that he fought so hard to save.
+StarKeyStudios he did his best but reapers took his will who know,s what great chocies could he do for a short time Cerbures was indeed good guys but reaper effects slowly effected him!
I’m not exaggerating when I say this: Mass Effect 2 had by far the best soundtrack, characters, voice acting and gameplay in all of gaming history. There’s something about this game that stands out far beyond any other game; the music is ominous, at times uplifting, and extremely moving. The violin in this takes the cake and you feel the power in it. You feel the decisions you make and the actions of every character in this game far more than any other game; by far the absolute best in gaming.
too bad it was the beginning of ME downfall, it focused a lot on sidestories and forgot it had a main plot to deal with with made it look more like a spinoff than a main installment (no mention of reapers until Arrival dlc)
I was getting along with TIM in ME2 so it was disappointing that ME3 started out with Shep having created a fallout between the two. Dammit, didn't want that to be the canon course of ME2 but I get that the developers can't account for everything and needs to force certain paths.
Agreed! You need a good fanfic. I suggest Mass Effect: All in the Details. The game constantly presents a lot of false dichotomies, but if you can change just a couple of little details, the galaxy comes out better. (The fic starts immediately before the first game, and so far they just picked up Liara.)
I always wanted to side with Cerberus and do what's best for human kind. It pained me to fight them as I figured we were on the same team essentially. It pained me even more to find that the wise and seemingly very rational and sane leader of them had been indoctrinated. I always thought the illusive man was above all the random political bullshit and knew better than you, but no longer I guess. I hate that he becomes a simple villain you can kill, but at the same time everything has to come to an end eventually, and had a lot of fun playing through it all and would probably do it again sometime, so can't really complain ^^
He was always a simple villain. He was just a charismatic and pragmatic one. TIM is a gifted orator who does a fantastic job of justifying his actions. When you look past all that, the facts themselves are hard and simple. He has no qualms about killing humans. He has no qualms about preforming horrific experiments on them, even before indoctrination. He treats everyone beneath him as expendable, and is overall a ruthless and terrible human being. Shepard knows this. That's why he/she never fully buys into his crap. It's possible to agree with some of his STATED methods, and even give them the benefit of the doubt. But in the end Shepard never fully trusts him, or Cerberus.
Tourettesguyfan102 Well you may be right, I just usually end up eating it up raw whenever he says something. Politicians could definitely learn something from this game :p
Mia Gadegaard Well, he has one thing going in his favor. He believes in what he's doing. I don't think for one second he, unindoctrinated, believes that what he's doing is for all mankind. It's for Cerberus For himself.. But he believes in that. That comes through in his speeches, and makes it sound as though he truly thinks it's for all of humanity.
There really should be an option to join TIM in ME3. I don't buy the shit when renegade Shep working with cerberus turns himself to the alliance (why would he do that) and Illusive man is reduced to a generic bad guy. One thing I liked about witcher 2 is that you were given a choice to go with the elves or with the humans, the same should be in ME3 Alliance or Cerberus.
Ive played Arrival DLC and I still see no explanation apart from "Suddenly Shepard decides to go to Hackett". The point is, while paragon Shepard would work with TIM because there was no other option, renegade Shepard would continue working with Cerberus out of preference.
If you are okay with terrorism, manipulation, corruption, mass murder, brainwashing and genocide then sure he's a great dude lol. For me he's similar to Hitler with his ideas and is no different from his old buddy Saren with his racism, prejudice and hatred towards aliens. He's basically just a fascist extremist. Cerberus was never a good or a trustworthy organization no matter how much charisma and intelligence he has. His soundtrack is amazing, mysterious and soothing but that doesn't make me like him or his persona. He's still in the wrong regards to everything. Basically just your corporative egotistical douchebag. The only thing Shepard owes him is his life but he didn't even ask to be brought back. Cerberus did that on their own with their vast wealth and funding they have as a company but it was Liara who really saved your life by recovering Shepard's dead corpse.
*THE ILLUSIVE MAN:* A necessary precaution. Not unusual for people who know what you and I know. *SHEPARD:* You might be the reason I'm still alive, but that doesn't mean I trust you.
In my opinion Cerberus is amazing fraction, Illusive Man too. ME1 - Secret evil organization. ME2 - Powerful organization with good goals, with golas for humanity. ME3- Organization with good goals, but with wrong methods. Humanity First! Sad truth, you want to do something good, you will be perceived as evil. Yes their methods wasn't good, but goals was good. Sometimes I want to finish ME2 that Shepard will die, so Cerberus can do what they always wanted without problems. And I want ME with Cerberus as protagonists, in time ME3 in Andromeda or after ME3, no matter which, I want this alike I want Illusive Man revived.
No matter what you tell or show me about Cerberus. They aren't villains, they are grey heroes. They wanted and want to help humanity whatever the cost. The heroes which humanity need, but don't want them. Sad. But so true.
@@bez_znaczenia I agree with you they were willing to do what ever it took but their greed go the better of them and they fell to mind control just like the masses on planet earth today in the real world. The people are easily mind controlled into little slaves willing to do the bidding of evil people in name of something they think is a good cause. Some great qutoes to always remember in life. "A man willing to give up freedom in exchange for security deserves neither." Adams "Its all bullshit and its bad for you." GC 2008 “The unexamined life is not worth living” - Socrates "Cowards die many times before their deaths; the valiant never taste of death but once." William Shakesphere
+dragonieprayer I'd buy it. i mean. he must have known he would get indoctrinated so he might have created a clone of himself and manipulated it. his backround make him sound like a very calculated person.
its possible that Reaper indoctrinated the illusive man ,while illusive man was trying to control reaper for welfare of human. The cerberus soldiers were turned into husks
it would be awesome for some indie devs to work with bioware for a spin-off to see the illusive man's past. I think it would be a heavy story and choice-making game rather than an action game. I doubt the ''illusive'' man ever used brute force to get to where we see him in mass effect, more like manipulations and sabotage and of course, control....
Gotta love the Illusive Man. It is so great with villians that isn't just evil, but actually have their own goals and motives. That is what makes the Illusive Man great. He doesn't see himself as evil, but he simply does what no one else would dare to do, to achieve his goals.
The Illusive Man, another pawn for the Reapers. As they desperate for hope, a light at the end of the tunnel, the Reapers became a saint to them and walked them to despair where their minds drown in false hope and dreams. The Reapers took their shape and destroyed what they stand for. Saren and TIM are victims and despite their intentions, they lose. It's clear now more than ever, you can't reason with a tiger when your head is in its mouth. We destroy them or they destroy us.
TIM is and will remain one of my absolute favorite villains in media. When he stared into the abyss, he blinked, but didn’t stop moving forward even if all he had left was blind confidence that he was doing the right thing. He’s the monster that humanity needed, and he accepts that role - his downfall is inevitable and I think he understands that, right up until he blindly stumbles into indoctrination and just a few subtle nudges - he’s already sacrificed so much, what’s a few more people when we’re talking the entire civilization and the opportunity to catapult humanity into the future with Reaper Tech… talking him down on the citadel with paragon is heart wrenching because you see that he understands what he’s done, he’s no longer just a monster, he’s come a hair’s breadth away from annihilation and he uses the last of his strength to finally stop. Brilliant character.
Kevin Spacey would play the Illusive Man perfectly in a Mass Effect film. Martin Sheen is getting to old, and Spacey is a perfect replacement because he has the looks, charisma, and on screen presence.
Kevin Spacey could totally pull off The Illusive Man. I'd rather see Patrick Stewart play The Illusive Man though. He's got a lot of experience playing parts sitting down in chairs. Plus, Stewart would probably love playing a hero/villain. Just have to get him a wig.
Coolest MF in the entire galaxy, he wanted to do everything to save humanity. Such a shame ME3 ruined him and made him a power-hungry lunatic who seems to care only about himself.
Actually, the idea of a powerful organization getting indoctrinatd was there since mass effect 1 codex, so it is nice to see that same idea being developed through him
I do not understand why there are some who believe that the illusiveman was already indoctrinated in mass effect 2. When you think about it for a moment, it's utterly illogical. the collectors were a useful tool for the reaper, if the illusiveman had already been indoctrinated, the reapers would not have let it happen that together with shepard he delayed the time of the invasion. the illusiveman just made a big mistake in the end, believing that the scientific achievements of cerberus would be enough to control the reapers. he tried to make the contact and thus invited the reapers to enslave him.
he was indoctrinated all along... Indoctrination doesnt mean you instantly start to do exactly what reapers want and make stupid choices. The indoctrination clouded his judgement. If you listen to the prothean VI it also tells you the same thing happened in their cycle with a splinter group thinking they could control the reapers for their own good, but they were indoctrinated all along. Same thing with cerberus, you can hear it from TIMs voice at the end of me2 when he wanted Shepard to save the collector base. He just became more desperate and the indoctrination overcame him in me3, making him take all those extreme actions. The reapers want to create division and TIM had come in to contact with reaper artifacts a long time ago, so its pretty obvious.
If you read the Comics you would learn that the Illusive man has known about the reapers and been working with reaper tech for half a century or maybe even more. been a while since I read. He developed ways to become Immune from Indoctrination but in the end I think he's lust for control led him down the path to become more susceptible to become Indoctrinated. How sad that the person the most resistant to Indoctrination destroyed himself in the end. Such a great Character
@@MistahJay7 As far as i know an artifact gave him a vision after the turians catched him. That pretty much turned him from Jack Harper to The Illusiveman. In the game it's pretty clear, that he tried to make contact with the reapers in order to test his new weapon. Even his doctor told him, that he is taking a huge risk. In the end he actually ask the reapers to controle him. the tests were not sufficient , but at least he was always halfright, just like shepard. That's what makes him so great too. because he is not that typical overpowered asshole who does bad things just because he can do so.
Sooo much feels here...haha, I can't even describe why I love these games so much...for me, Mass Effect is one of the best game series ever made!!! I have goosebumbps everytime I listen to any of these soundtracks O.o
He was right, controlling them is better than destroying them. Destroying them puts everyone back in the stone age, makes it impossible to travel across the galaxy and means that inevitably some reaper robot species will rise again. Illusive man's methods were just not ethical, but clearly superior to the idealized soldier attitude.
just an edit from his story line. Before founding Cerberus, the Illusive Man was known as Jack Harper, a mercenary and part of a special group under the command of General Williams. During the First Contact War, Harper served on Shanxi, and in the later days of the war, he, Ben Hislop and Eva Coré were responsible for the capture of a turian general named Desolas Arterius. After heading back to General Williams' command compound, they analyze turian troop movement patterns and determined that they were looking for something. Upon interrogating the captured turian, Jack discovered that Desolas was searching for an artifact. After capturing Desolas' forces, Jack questions Desolas further; Desolas merely tells Harper to be careful about what he is looking for, as he might just find it. After leaving Eva in charge of the prisoners, Jack and Ben head into the cave where the artifact is located.
You want to make this much cooler, have him become increasingly cybernetic as the vid plays and extend it. make it a slow process too. That would be trippy.
Божественная мелодия! Великолепная игра! И прекрасный Мартин Шин в образе Иллюзив Мэна! / Divine melody! Great game! And the beautiful Martin Sheen as the Illusive Man!
He is an excellent villain. He devoted his entire life, founded an entire organization, sacrificed millions of lives and his OWN HUMANITY to further the cause of the human race. And in the end, his ambition gets turned around on him by the Reapers, and he ending up destroying much of what he only wanted to help. A very tragic, and very well written character.
![46 - Mass Effect Score: Vigil [extended]](http://i.ytimg.com/vi/IitCQCaKi3E/mqdefault.jpg)
_"We're at war. Nobody wants to admit it, but humanity is under attack..."_
**"One man, one very specific man, might be all that's stand between Humanity and the greatest threat in our brief existence..."**
ME Best Triology of all time
ME2 Best Game of all time
ME2 Best Soundtrack of all time
ME2 Best thing in the Sci-Fi Genre
_"Commander Shepard."_
Its actually true when you think about it. Chain of events linked to divide us using race and religion, something is going on.
I honestly want to see, if they ever get around to mass effect 4, that the illusive man was right and some major conflict breaks out between humanity and the other alien species.
"You seen it yourself - outbested all of them."
"You are unique. Not in what you experienced, but in what you represent."
"Despite what you think of Cerberus, of me...you are a valuable asset. For all of humanity. Be careful, Shepard "
"Shepard...you're making a habit of costing me more than time and money..."
+SuperMissile "Sorry, I'm havin' trouble reading you. Gettin' alotta bullshit on this line..."
+Hanzzo Ezekiel "Don't turn your back on me, Shepard! I made you, I brought you back from the dead."
+Simon -Ghost- Riley "Joker, lose this line."
Shepard it's a new day & we have you to thank for our deliverance. That's what he said during my playthrough.
We did the right thing. You don't have to try and make me feel good about it.
"Shepard...that's my chair"
"We'll bang okay?"
Damn, I forgot all about that.
it's "you're in my chair"
"That's my spot."
Correction: Shepard, you're in MY chair!
"You never truly believed in us. Cerberus isn't just an organization or the people behind it. Cerberus is an idea. That idea is not so easily destroyed." man that line was delivered...
Martin Sheen did a great job
The Illusive Man is Kreia as written by someone who never understood what Kreia stood for.
"Beneath this mask there is more than flesh. Beneath this mask there is an idea, Mr. Creedy, and ideas are bulletproof."
I'm more impressed by the times Shepard's conviction makes TIM pause for a moment.
"You're idealism is....admirable, Shepard."
That fact that even in private TIM still openly respected (maybe even admired) him/her makes me think some part of him always regretted losing Shepard as an asset.
"No, I'm not writing Shepard off as a total loss yet."
And what idea is that? Seriously, did TIM ever tell us? Because, from what we get, their entire schtick is stuff like torturing kids to get better biotics, somehow, shoving Reaper Tech on people, getting killed by their experiments (thorian creepers, husks and rachni), and feeding colonists to Thresher Maws (to study the effect of feeding colonists to Thresher Maws, I guess?). If you stop to think about it, they only do mad-science or just pseudo-science, the moustache twilling villain kind.
So, if Cerberus is an idea, then it's a really stupid one.
Illusive Man: Don't turn your back on me, Shepard! I made you! I brought you back from the dead!
Shepard: And I'm going to do exactly what you brought me back to do. I'm gonna win this war, and I'll do it without sacrificing the soul of our species!
Joker, loose this channel.
I'm gonna win this war --- Without sacrificing the soul of our species = are not logial :/
You just had to shoot the kid didn't you!?!?!?!?
elock1277 If you shoot kid, he tell us "So be it!" with Reaper voice. Indoctrination Theory another evidence.
Bez Znaczenia or if you refuse indoctrination theory is my canon and I chose destroy + sheperd being alive
"I tried, Shepard"
I was so sad at that moment, cried some
Me too at some point. Exactly like when Legion sacrificed himself.
Right?? I cried for both TIM and Saren...
He was believe in humanity until the last breath.
jaraweiat As terrible as his methods were, the illusive man always did what he thought was right, even at the end
@@nathangordon4891 That was both his weakness and strength. It provided him strength in ME2, where he put it towards a plan he believed would be the best plan against the Reapers, even though (IMO) he was being indoctrinated at the time (When you get Jarvik, he said something along the lines of the people who believed they could conquer the Reapers being indoctrinated, and being the knife in the back of the Protheans). Then when the Reapers actually attack, they utilise the indoctrination to turn him into a ruthless leader that is causing humanity more harm than good.
The fact that so many ME fans see him as some tragic hero is, I think, a testament to how good of a villain Jack Harper is. He was always a human centric nut that simultaneously fought for human superiority while also being content with throwing away human lives. He was never a good person, yet his charisma and overall aura managed to convince people that he was a reasonable figure. Stellar writing on Bioware's part
As if human supremacy is a bad thing.
@@basedkaiser5352 If it comes at the expense of the other races and not naturally then yes it's bad.
@@treacherousjslither6920 human supremacy is never a bad thing.
@@basedkaiser5352 You make that argument from the exact same position White Supremacists made theirs' from. We aren't special because of our race, we aren't special because of our species, it is our sentience that gives our lives special purpose. Should another species with sentience be encountered, they would be our equals, and if they came with peaceful intent, it would be for the betterment of all sentient life to further the improvement of the futures of both species as part of the interstellar community.
plus I'd say Martin Sheen's performance managed to really sell the character.
The Illusive Man gets the best background music and girls
best villein music
+Hackett yes he does so where is Shepherd
+josue betances And you forgot those characteristic BLUE EYES !!!
Zed Zamorin how could I forget I am not worthy
+Zed Zamorin You mean the eyes of Indoctrination?
One thing The Illusive Man said stuck with me. He told Shepard before the launching of the Suicide Mission that he was a valuable asset to all of humanity. He had no idea how right he was, and would be.
I would have to go with, Cerberus isn't just an organization it's an ideal that can't be so easily destroyed. It makes you think that maybe Cerberus in some fashion will be in the next game.
I hope they are. In a form of another organisation, with just hints connecting them to Cerberus. Or possibly hints pointing out that various, seemingly unrelated, human agents are operating according to one scheme. Never stating openly that Cerberus is still active.
Grey Hand Remember there are 2 or more active Cerberus cells. Cronos station is not only station that Cerberus have.
Cerberus will exist as long as humanity exist.
@@bez_znaczenia of course. Cerberus is the other side of us, of humans. It is in our nature to be dominant and do things the way we see fit. Just look at the trilogy. Suddenly out of nowhere, this new race of aliens coming from their Sol System. They are thirsty for knowledge... perhaps too thirsty and they are adaptable. Maybe too adaptable. They might not be as hardened as krogans but they sure share some of their features. Namely the way they hate to be pushed around. And look at that. They already are talking and working for a representative in the Citadel. Those humans - wonderful creatures that can be batshit scary.
I'd like to think that he brought Shepard back not just to get the Collector Base, but also to keep the Reapers busy (be his shield), while Cerberus undisturbed would find a way to control them.
"Anyone can destroy, but great civilizations do more.You know that,it's why you kept the Collector base intact."
La Las >keeping the Collector base
You what.
Harbinger Reaper
Hello Harbinger.
This is a quote of your favorite pawn TIM.
La Las Oh, he was a bloody idiot that messed with things far beyond his comprehension. In the end, we had no use for him.
La Las too bad it had zero impact on me3. I too saved the base
awdawdawdawdawd
Well, this is just one the reasons about why i think that ME3 had wasted so much potential.
The Collector base, as we mentioned before, and its technology could be reverse engineered by the Alliance to create new weapons against the Reapers (it has happened before with the Thannix cannon, that it is essentially a less-powerful,reverse-engineered version of Sovereign's laser cannon).
One of the mayor problems I have with ME3 is that you're railroaded to go back to the Alliance no matter what. if you were a renegade in ME2 and kept the Collector Base, then it would make sense that Shepard would rejoin Cerberus in ME3. Having Alliance/Cerberus branching paths in ME3 would had meant writing both factions on a more morally grey light though (which would had been awesome).
If they had enough funding maybe they could’ve done it for MELE’s 3
@@xenozilla0723 Honestly the branch should have started in ME2 - Cerberus and Alliance path for both games, with the option to switch sides at the beginning of ME3 if needed
Shepherd never liked Cerberus; he was always an Alliance soldier from the very beginning. Shepherd would never betray the Alliance. It's one of his core character traits.
I know this is supposed to be the theme for the villain but I find it relaxing.
It seems to be the general ME theme, but with dissonances. It plays wonderfully.
friendly reminder that the Illusive man was not technically the bad guy untill Mass Shit 3, which made the character a lame Saturday-morning cartoon villain that when confronted in dialogue he must reply "Im right, you're wrong!" or "You wouldn't understand LOL".
IMO, i think this theme is relaxing precisely because the villain is cold and calculating. It's how calm he is that makes it so much more evil...
I listen to this when I go to sleep, seriously
Curious enough, I found this very indoctrinating... too much relaxing and the mind begins to lose focus...
The music kinda represents the illusive man's mysterious and complex mind.
Anyone else think the illusive man was wasted in Mass effect 3?
no more than the rest of the game was
I believe in Indoctrination Theory, this theory is still alive after all. BioWare never said that this theory is false.
its possible that illusive man had been indoctrinated by reapers ,while he was trying to control them .
After all the cerberus soldiers were turned into husks
No, he was not wasted. In fact ME:3 succeeded in making Illusive Man into the new Saren, the guy you hate at the start, but then feel sorry for because you realize he was brainwashed.
Yeah, he should have been an ally in ME3
You will be missed TIM. Story writers throwing you under the bus to get a second enemy on ME3 will not overlap the awesomeness of Cerberus and Tim in ME2.
an 11 year old comment... and it couldn't be more correct. I felt the same way. I always wanted dialogue options to get TIM to come back over. He shouldn't have ended up as a 1 dimensional adversary. He was way too smart for that kind of treatment.
Well said!
On reflection, after many years, the only thing that Cerberus did that made sense in ME3 with their MO in ME2 was the attack on the citadel, to a certain degree. I say this considering that the attack on the citadel resulted in the Alliance getting the full support of the council after the attack, Cerberus become the public villain but the alliance ends up benefiting the most protecting humanity in the long term. Everything else they did undermined humanity.
@@alphabet2238Now that you said that I think BioWare missed a GOLDEN opportunity with Cerberus in ME3, imagine if after all Tim did was only for the Alliance and Shepard gain strength and support from other races since otherwise they wouldn't or something like that, that he was pushing Shepard forward and betting all his chips on him... Would be cool
@@mariogallo2293 That would've been great. Even if we didn't have the option to ally with Cerberus at least keep them as morally grey rather than just a textbook villain. I probably disliked what they did to Cerberus more than the rushed product of the ending.
"The true goal of Cerberus is to bring cigarettes to every world in galaxy" - Illusive Man, probably
"Don't turn your back on me, Shepard! I brought you back from the dead! I made you and your team!"
"You may have brought us all together, but WE made it a team!"
People always ask "Who is Illusive Man?" but never "How is Illusive Man?"
underrated question
Dead
Why is illusive man?
But we did find out where is Illusive Man
Would love a game based on the Illusive man
TIM one of the best tragic heroes in Mass Effect.
I felt bad shooting him. He was a very influential character on me.
bozdra you don't have to shoot him, all you have to do is to either use charisma (paragon) or intimidation (renegade) on every encounter with him
I wanted to, but it still felt bad.
Good to know you guys likes me.
kkkkkkkkkk
The Illusive Man is one of, if not over all, my favorite character in the trilogy. As much as people bitched about them in ME3, I still liked what Bioware did with them. In fact, I'm one of the few to say ME3 is my favorite of the trilogy. What makes TIM such a prefect antagonist, not villain, is that he really does want what is best for humanity. He really sees himself as helping us out, he just never knew he was indoctrinated. In fact, in ME2, I trusted him enough to be completely shocked when I played ME3. I just felt so bad for him when I killed him, and those lines... "Earth... if only you could see it like I do, Shepard. It's so... perfect." Wonderful last lines that describe his whole character in one moment. He's just a perfect antagonist.
OMG SPOILERSSSSSSSSS!!!! >_
Completely agree with you my friend.TIM is my favorite one too,then Garrus.In Mass Effect 3 his personality changed into something...I dont know how to say,but it was so cool to see him interviing in the perfect moments to make
the story most interesting.And yes,I am one of the few people who like Mass Effect 3 as much as Mass Effect 2.
I agree that Mass Effect 3 was the best of the series, if not for the ending. They told us that our decisions would change the entire outcome but in the end we just got to pick what colour the mass relays exploded in.
+AN Productions Yep, great lines. But that was the reason for his demise. For he and the reapers shared the same unquenchable zeal to attain perfection. But that's where they are wrong. Organism/synthetics can't be perfect. For a perfect society or universe will hold no adventure or curiosity. Contention is perfection but curiosity is imperfection. That's where breakthroughs and discoveries lie!!
I also think ME 3 was the best of the trilogy, but It's really close.
"Cerberus is committed to the advancement and preservation of humanity. If the Reapers are attacking us, trying to wipe us out, Cerberus will stop them" fucking chills man
Did you know that Saren and The Illusive Man (Jack Harper) have met in the past (First Contact War) and both contacted with reaper artefact (blue eyes, understanding reaper language). And both died in similar way, suicide.
+Fi Skirata Did you know this counts as a massive spoiler
+cokeheadbenny For a 4 year old game, though...
+cokeheadbenny its not a spoiler, you can shoot him instead.
+63Limar lol now that is a spoiler. is it just me or does anyone else enjoy guning him down.
Ruvik Payne I feel pity for him, for the story that went south with their "Cerberus are bad!" attitude in the third game.
Illusive man resurrected Shepard. Illusive man is directly responsible for stopping the reapers.
Not if Liara didn't give Shepard's body to Cerberus.
Cerberus always has been an interesting faction. Such wasted potential in ME3 just to turn them into cannon fodder. I understand the Reaper's "divide and conquer from the inside" modus operandi needs to be felt in the game but to force it on Cerb whilst they spendt the entire second game building it up to be the only faction that gives a fuck about reapers is a little bit too much. It would have been so much better if they focused the entire "indoctrination and trechery" plot on the council and it's various races and members, insteading of shorthanding on Cerberus or just a few sidequests (like the crazed Hanar ambassador)
All in all, i blame it on the rush and flurry of rewrites. Worth the 30$ IMO.
+Totally McMylastname If i recall correctly they switched the lead writer for ME3, resulting in changes in pacing and as you said, making cerberus cannon fodder with a (compared to the first two games) weak narrative and reason, as TIM is instantly indoctrinated and turns on you no matter what you do.
+Vicke Pee Under the influence of the Reapers shadow with the reaper heart/brain he installs in his base.
Injecting with Reaper nanotech is the last straw that broke TIM's back.
In ME1 various Cerb cells were portrayed as being somewhat ineffective, to put it mildly.
+M van dongen And really, as per his lore he was affected by something looooong ago. Coincidentally Saren was there too.........
+Totally McMylastname indeed
It was unavoidable, given the expanded universe's presentation. In one of the comics, he was exposed to a Reaper relic alongside Saren and began seeing visions of the Reapers' return. One would think Saren on the other hand was first exposed to indoctrination through Sovereign, but in truth he wasn't, as both of them had dealt with the relic from Shanxi. Due to lack of repeated exposure, the effects of the indoctrination appeared much, much later in the Illusive Man than in Saren but it was indeed unavoidable.
One of the best villains in gaming history.
+Randy Marsh And Vaas Montenegro too, Farcry 3. He was PLAIN CRAZY!!!
+Zed Zamorin "Did I ever tell you the definition... of insanity?"
Randy Marsh hes not a villan he is an idealist
He is a grey hero.
Martin Sheen played the part splendidly
I definitely think having you work for/with Cerberus in ME2 was a masterstroke along with the introduction of TIM. Overall, he's got to be one of the best written characters in gaming, if not all visual media.
he's also a copy of the Smoking Man from the X-Files, lmao.
smoking man and elusive man, my bffs
Random Garreh I'm new to the X-Files.... THAT'S WHO THE SMOKING MAN REMINDS ME OF OMG I COULD NEVER PUT MY FINGER ON IT. HE'S THE ILLUSIVE MAN HOLY CRAP.
And yet we still know so little about him, 10/10 character
EyeAr WeeTawTed we know enough... read Mass effect evolution its a 4 part mini series comic focusing on the illusive man and the first contact war (I think there was fighting)
One of the best and complex villians of alle time
One of the strongest characters in gaming from the best sc-fi game of all time.
The Conversations between the Illusive men and Shepard were the best in the whole ME Series in my Opinion.
"We are committed to the advancement and preservation of Humanity" - Illusive Men
I really wish Bioware had made the Illusive Man an ally in Mass Effect 3 instead of an enemy.
A split in Cerberus could have happened, and Jack Harper could have led any members who sided with him in support of Shepard while the other part unites under a new Illusive Man who fights against Shepard and their former leader.
+MrImastinker I wish that instead of spending half the game fighting other humans, we should have gotten that epic Reaper battle we were promised. It really should have been something like, the first half of the game only a few Reapers arrive, and we spend half the game fighting against the clock to prepare the galaxy. Then halfway through the game we get the actual Reapers, so there could be a sort of tonal shift where half the game is the Mass Effect 2 sorta "dark" tone, and then the rest of the game is Mass Effect 3's sorta "hopeful" tone.
+Cullen Bentley Mass Effect 3 could of easily been my favourite game of all time. So much miss opportunity's.
+Cullen Bentley The reaper battle showdown with Harbinger was supposed to be a DLC. Bioware literally got screwed up after fan rage over the ending. Indoctrination theory is supposed to be canon!!! Oh, and Shep is still kickin and 'breathing' amidst the rubble...bad news for any reaper plan!!! So, cheer up!
+Zed Zamorin the indoctrination theory is not canon. I should know, I did some work on it. it was merely us fans grasping at straws trying to make sense of this shit heap bioware gave us. I mean, this is the same company behind jade empire, knights of the old republic, baldur's gate and so much more. surely there has to be some hidden plot twists! but sadly, mass effect 3 is just a bad game.
+Cullen Bentley Yep, but ME3 was not a bad game. Its just the ending. But that's for 'Hero saves the day and lived happily after' BS we've been fed by every game and movie! After all the crazy stuff Shepard pulled off, and to remain a legend, He MUST Die !!! (Harvy Dent's quote from Dark Knight, remember?) ;)
Despite the fact of his ruthlessness and power hunger nature, I highly respect this man - mostly because of his appearance, sense of style and mystery. Not mentioning the fact he brought Shepard back to life, giving by it hope for every single civilization living in our galaxy.
Strength for Cerberus is strength for every human. Cerberus is Humanity.
The Illusive Man: "Shepard..."
Commander Shepard: "Illusive Man. I thought we'd be meeting face to face."
The Illusive Man: "Unnecessary precaution. Not unusual for people who know what you & I know."
Commander Shepard: "And what exactly is it that you & I know?"
The Illusive Man: "That our place in the galaxy is more fragile than we'd like to think. That one man - that one very specific man - may be all that stands between humanity & the greatest threat of our brief existence."
Commander Shepard: "The Reapers."
'Good to see your memory is still intact. How are you feeling?'
@@naomigallacher7384 ...
Lol it's "a necessary precaution"
Unecassary precaution makes no sense in that context
One of, if not THE best part of the Mass Effect trilogy was the Illusive Man. A man who was willing to do whatever it took to save humanity with the best of intentions. It's equally as tragic and, dare I say, heartbreaking when he realises that all of the innocent lives he exposed to the Reapers experimentations were as a result of himself being brainwashed by the Reapers. His plead to Shepard at the end of ME3 was so fucking gut-wrenching; "I only wanted what was best for humanity!"
Let's hope Andromeda lives up to the original trilogy's legacy.
Hes the hero that humanity deserves, but not the hero humanity needs right now. So we'll chase him, sick the dogs on him.
Andromeda was bad we all know this, so we must wait for another game (will be, they said that). After ME3 fully focused on Cerberus will be that what I waiting for.
Well... guess what, Andromeda was a complete utter trash.
you honestly make him look better and more complex than he is. replay the ME2 and ME3 and really think about what he says and look at it in context of everything what hes done. hes an idiot and cerberus a contradicting bunch of nonesensical spies (and later a bunch of stupid mooks to shoot) Hes already an idiot in ME2,really. he only gets the cool music,settings and camera perspectives.
Andromeda has garbage story, no argue about that. Main villan has generic syndrom of corypheus from DAI, there's nothing special about him... (but still overall this game had VERY FEW, NOT BAD "moments") i still think that whole "Andromeda" thing had potential but sadly it was wasted by too "teenager" and "stupid" approach... The only one thing that this game done quite right i guess is graphical views, enviroments etc... but all rest has just "fan fiction writing level" and a real bad one, sorry.
Dear TiM, we miss you more than you will ever know. I miss the easy days of working for Cerberus, putting together the best team that the Galaxy had ever seen. I miss fighting the good fight, saving Garrus and re-uniting with Wrex and Tali and Liara. I miss the days of good games, and moments like watching the new Normandy launch, or surviving the Suicide Mission through the Omega IV Relay. There is a dream that was Mass Effect, and you were a big part of it. I wish I could have saved you, like you saved us.
Years later and I still find myself listening to this, as well as all the other soundtracks... The Illusive Man is such a beautifully written character.
Yes, only in ME2 and sometimes in ME3. He could be a more beautiful written character. In ME3 his potential was wasted.
The Stannis baratheon of mass effect, he deserved a much more honorable plot than the writers gave him.
TIM is still one of the best characters ever put into a video game in my opinion.
Him becoming a servant to the Reapers is still a major character assassination in my eyes.
It looks like he has a mustache in the thumbnail lol.
@ITz Ramzi and brandy*
kinda wished that you could side with TIM in ME 3, such a great character.
Sadly, you can't, but each time I choose the Control option, I feel like I'm paying homage to him.
Nemui Desu shepard would never join a guy that send orders to capture jack torture her and use her to kill shep
I'll just quote Garrus: "There's that ruthless calculus again". If you didn't import a GOOD save from ME2, Shepard is forced to do much worse than have one girl sent for torture.
not side,but as ally it's what should have been
Agreed! What you need is a good fanfic. Allow me to suggest Mass Effect: All in the Details. It starts immediately before the first game (and so far they've just picked up Liara,) but with a few details changed, the world turns out differently.
The Illusive Man was such an interesting character, I wish ME2 had found a more natural way to get Shepard to co-operate with him.
I liked working for Cerberus, shame they went completely evil in ME3.
@@journey95far49 ME1 already portrays them as a completely xenophobic sect. They were evil for the start because they didn't understand that strength comes from sharing with your peers. The whole point of ME2 is about recruiting allies from various background, which goes against everything Cerberus is built around, so they also are portrayed as being wrong in ME2...
@@journey95far49 I was sour on this for a long time. Since I replayed through the games a few months back, I ended up being okay with it. The Protheans went through the same scenario Javik states. TIM and his crew were a great balance between fighting the repears, their minions, and indoctrinated humans (Cerebus, at least influced by TIM).
I love this piece so much, one of my all-time favourites. So futuristic and cold, yet strangely meditative and comforting. For some reason, the first thing that comes to mind is TIM nonchalantly adjusting his blazer before sitting down and telling Shepard "Miranda and Jacob will brief you" with that hint of pride in his voice, putting everything into place to make Shepard feel like they're in good hands even though he knows his own intentions aren't so pure.
To be completely honest, if you were to tell me that the afterlife consists of just sitting in TIM's chair, smoking and drinking bourbon on the rocks while gazing at that burning sun for all eternity with this playing in the background, I'd be totally fine with that.
The illusive man is such a great villain because in his oppinion he really thought he was the good guy in the sense that the ends justify the means. It's just so sad that he was slowly indoctrinated and that he ultimately betrayed the human race that he fought so hard to save.
+StarKeyStudios The best villains are the 'grey' ones who think they are doing the right thing and go to any end to see it through
+StarKeyStudios he did his best but reapers took his will who know,s what great chocies could he do for a short time Cerbures was indeed good guys but reaper effects slowly effected him!
EVEN WHEN THE REAPERS OWNED HIM HE WAS STILL RIGHT, THE REAPERS CAN BE CONTROLLED
Yeah, he was a tragic character, really. He was also one of my favourites in the whole series.
Most villains are the heroes of their own stories.
"Strength for Cerberus is strength for every human! Cerberus is humanity!
Shepard: Martin Sheen...we meet at last.
*This theme starts playing.*
Shepard: I sense something... illusive.
I’m not exaggerating when I say this: Mass Effect 2 had by far the best soundtrack, characters, voice acting and gameplay in all of gaming history. There’s something about this game that stands out far beyond any other game; the music is ominous, at times uplifting, and extremely moving. The violin in this takes the cake and you feel the power in it. You feel the decisions you make and the actions of every character in this game far more than any other game; by far the absolute best in gaming.
it also has a nice mix of like sci fi, mystery, horror, action, and emotion all rolled into one. my favorite of the trilogy, easily.
@Journey 95 I agree Mass Effect 2 is the perfect definition of a sequel done right.
too bad it was the beginning of ME downfall, it focused a lot on sidestories and forgot it had a main plot to deal with with made it look more like a spinoff than a main installment (no mention of reapers until Arrival dlc)
ME1 was by far the best in music department.
@@norseca542 Yeah, the main story wasn't that good, unfortunately. It was an expansion of the Mass Effect universe.
Strength for Cerberus is Strength for Humanity.
Unpopular opinion: Illusive Man was the coolest character of the franchise.
*franchises
"Don't turn your back on me, Shepard! I made you, I brought you back from the dead."
I could never turn back on him, but ME 3 is stupid so I must.
"And I'm gonna do exactly what you brought me back for. I'm gonna win this war, and I'll do it without sacrificing the soul of our species."
“Цербер это не его штаб-квартира, это даже не его сотрудники. Цербер - это идея, а идею нельзя так просто уничтожить!”
Джек Харпер (The Illusive Man)
I was getting along with TIM in ME2 so it was disappointing that ME3 started out with Shep having created a fallout between the two. Dammit, didn't want that to be the canon course of ME2 but I get that the developers can't account for everything and needs to force certain paths.
Agreed! You need a good fanfic. I suggest Mass Effect: All in the Details. The game constantly presents a lot of false dichotomies, but if you can change just a couple of little details, the galaxy comes out better. (The fic starts immediately before the first game, and so far they just picked up Liara.)
I'll give it a read when I get the time.
I always wanted to side with Cerberus and do what's best for human kind. It pained me to fight them as I figured we were on the same team essentially. It pained me even more to find that the wise and seemingly very rational and sane leader of them had been indoctrinated. I always thought the illusive man was above all the random political bullshit and knew better than you, but no longer I guess.
I hate that he becomes a simple villain you can kill, but at the same time everything has to come to an end eventually, and had a lot of fun playing through it all and would probably do it again sometime, so can't really complain ^^
He was always a simple villain. He was just a charismatic and pragmatic one. TIM is a gifted orator who does a fantastic job of justifying his actions. When you look past all that, the facts themselves are hard and simple. He has no qualms about killing humans. He has no qualms about preforming horrific experiments on them, even before indoctrination. He treats everyone beneath him as expendable, and is overall a ruthless and terrible human being.
Shepard knows this. That's why he/she never fully buys into his crap. It's possible to agree with some of his STATED methods, and even give them the benefit of the doubt. But in the end Shepard never fully trusts him, or Cerberus.
Tourettesguyfan102 Well you may be right, I just usually end up eating it up raw whenever he says something. Politicians could definitely learn something from this game :p
Mia Gadegaard Well, he has one thing going in his favor. He believes in what he's doing. I don't think for one second he, unindoctrinated, believes that what he's doing is for all mankind.
It's for Cerberus For himself.. But he believes in that. That comes through in his speeches, and makes it sound as though he truly thinks it's for all of humanity.
Tourettesguyfan102 I think it's worth pointing out that even his voice actor thinks the Illusive Man's an absolute scumbag.
Going all fascist isn't what's best for humanity.
The Illusive Man is one of my favorite antagonists in any game or movie I've seen simply due to his nuanced complexity.
"Strength for Cerberus is strength for every human"
"Cerberus is humanity"
-Jack Harper- - Illusive man
Here is a thought for everyone... The Illusive Man was the one who saved humanity... If he never brought our commander back... What would happen.
The sadness in the score adds a subtlety of loss, a silence of a hero long suffocated by ironically heroic sentimentality.
Mass Effect Legendary Edition has made me return here after many years.
Same he's too much of a grey area character to be called an antagonist but my favourite character in any game ever
We've never left. 😮
@@JockoJonson17 I will certainly return when Mass Effect 5 drops, that is for sure :)
I play this music when I have an important call
.
Illusive Man !
Long live Humanity !!
Don't you mean "Yomanuity"?
#HumanityFirst
There really should be an option to join TIM in ME3.
I don't buy the shit when renegade Shep working with cerberus turns himself to the alliance (why would he do that) and Illusive man is reduced to a generic bad guy. One thing I liked about witcher 2 is that you were given a choice to go with the elves or with the humans, the same should be in ME3 Alliance or Cerberus.
Ive played Arrival DLC and I still see no explanation apart from "Suddenly Shepard decides to go to Hackett". The point is, while paragon Shepard would work with TIM because there was no other option, renegade Shepard would continue working with Cerberus out of preference.
Agreed! The game inflicted a lot of false dichotomies. If you're a reader, I suggest the fanfic Mass Effect: All in the Details.
Exactly, I want a alternate story, when we will still working for Cerberus, OR remake ME3 completely.
I want to emulate that elegance, style and aura
Real
I am probably preaching to the choir here but...
The Illusive Man was never a villain, change my mind.
If you are okay with terrorism, manipulation, corruption, mass murder, brainwashing and genocide then sure he's a great dude lol. For me he's similar to Hitler with his ideas and is no different from his old buddy Saren with his racism, prejudice and hatred towards aliens. He's basically just a fascist extremist. Cerberus was never a good or a trustworthy organization no matter how much charisma and intelligence he has. His soundtrack is amazing, mysterious and soothing but that doesn't make me like him or his persona. He's still in the wrong regards to everything. Basically just your corporative egotistical douchebag. The only thing Shepard owes him is his life but he didn't even ask to be brought back. Cerberus did that on their own with their vast wealth and funding they have as a company but it was Liara who really saved your life by recovering Shepard's dead corpse.
*THE ILLUSIVE MAN:* Commander Shepard...
*SHEPARD:* Illusive Man. I thought we'd be meeting face-to-face...
*THE ILLUSIVE MAN:* A necessary precaution. Not unusual for people who know what you and I know.
*SHEPARD:* You might be the reason I'm still alive, but that doesn't mean I trust you.
*THE ILLUSIVE MAN:* You need to put your personal feelings aside. Humanity is up against the greatest threat of our brief existence.
In my opinion Cerberus is amazing fraction, Illusive Man too.
ME1 - Secret evil organization.
ME2 - Powerful organization with good goals, with golas for humanity.
ME3- Organization with good goals, but with wrong methods.
Humanity First!
Sad truth, you want to do something good, you will be perceived as evil.
Yes their methods wasn't good, but goals was good.
Sometimes I want to finish ME2 that Shepard will die, so Cerberus can do what they always wanted without problems.
And I want ME with Cerberus as protagonists, in time ME3 in Andromeda or after ME3, no matter which, I want this alike I want Illusive Man revived.
No matter what you tell or show me about Cerberus. They aren't villains, they are grey heroes. They wanted and want to help humanity whatever the cost.
The heroes which humanity need, but don't want them.
Sad. But so true.
They are only extreme nacionalists= Fascists
@Crohns Disease amen to that brother.
@@bez_znaczenia I agree with you they were willing to do what ever it took but their greed go the better of them and they fell to mind control just like the masses on planet earth today in the real world. The people are easily mind controlled into little slaves willing to do the bidding of evil people in name of something they think is a good cause.
Some great qutoes to always remember in life.
"A man willing to give up freedom in exchange for security deserves neither." Adams
"Its all bullshit and its bad for you." GC 2008
“The unexamined life is not worth living” - Socrates
"Cowards die many times before their deaths; the valiant never taste of death but once." William Shakesphere
Single greatest thing I've ever heard - be it movies, TV series or games.
Martin Sheen did an incredible job! Especially in the last scenes of ME3.
i was 12 when 2 came out and still bumping to this ost 11 years later lol
I want to see him again....I want the Illusive Man in ME4.
yea! Give him the lazarus project!
+dragonieprayer I'd buy it. i mean. he must have known he would get indoctrinated so he might have created a clone of himself and manipulated it. his backround make him sound like a very calculated person.
I just want a shadowy Cerberus again.
Perhaps he is the ''benefactor'' behind the andromeda initiative
I literally just unlocked those logs last night. As soon as they said "mysterious benefactor", my first thought was Illusive Man.
this track will be played at my funeral.... I will go out in style!
as we all must
The best OST of the entire mass effect Franchise.
Aye. ME2 was a solid score.
Not gonna lie..I love the plot of mas effect 2. Working for the Illusive man and Cerberus
Illusive Man was a great character.Too bad that his mind was fucked up in ME3
its possible that Reaper indoctrinated the illusive man ,while illusive man was trying to control reaper for welfare of human.
The cerberus soldiers were turned into husks
it would be awesome for some indie devs to work with bioware for a spin-off to see the illusive man's past. I think it would be a heavy story and choice-making game rather than an action game. I doubt the ''illusive'' man ever used brute force to get to where we see him in mass effect, more like manipulations and sabotage and of course, control....
Illusion: A Telltale Game Series
+The Cheekiest of Scrubs well...im sold...
+Georgie K. There's aa whole comic book about him. It'S really good.
+Georgie K. There's a comic book about him when he was still called Jack during the first contact war
+Cullen Bentley They should really make a Mass Effect game that is about the First Contact War.
Gotta love the Illusive Man. It is so great with villians that isn't just evil, but actually have their own goals and motives.
That is what makes the Illusive Man great. He doesn't see himself as evil, but he simply does what no one else would dare to do, to achieve his goals.
The Illusive Man, another pawn for the Reapers. As they desperate for hope, a light at the end of the tunnel, the Reapers became a saint to them and walked them to despair where their minds drown in false hope and dreams. The Reapers took their shape and destroyed what they stand for. Saren and TIM are victims and despite their intentions, they lose. It's clear now more than ever, you can't reason with a tiger when your head is in its mouth. We destroy them or they destroy us.
Hnads down, best game of the trilogy.
edit:
With best soundtrack.
TIM is and will remain one of my absolute favorite villains in media. When he stared into the abyss, he blinked, but didn’t stop moving forward even if all he had left was blind confidence that he was doing the right thing.
He’s the monster that humanity needed, and he accepts that role - his downfall is inevitable and I think he understands that, right up until he blindly stumbles into indoctrination and just a few subtle nudges - he’s already sacrificed so much, what’s a few more people when we’re talking the entire civilization and the opportunity to catapult humanity into the future with Reaper Tech… talking him down on the citadel with paragon is heart wrenching because you see that he understands what he’s done, he’s no longer just a monster, he’s come a hair’s breadth away from annihilation and he uses the last of his strength to finally stop. Brilliant character.
So much nostalgia upon listening to this... gah, I love Mass Effect with all my heart.
Kevin Spacey would play the Illusive Man perfectly in a Mass Effect film. Martin Sheen is getting to old, and Spacey is a perfect replacement because he has the looks, charisma, and on screen presence.
If they ever made a movie they should use Jon Bridell as the actor and dub his lines with Martin Sheens voice
Kevin Spacey could totally pull off The Illusive Man. I'd rather see Patrick Stewart play The Illusive Man though. He's got a lot of experience playing parts sitting down in chairs. Plus, Stewart would probably love playing a hero/villain. Just have to get him a wig.
marylain69 Ah, good choice.
Opened the replies just to see if this response was here (33hegemon's). Not disappointed.
Georgia Cunningham Lomax If Kevin Spacey was in it, they'd rename it Harass Effect.
Coolest MF in the entire galaxy, he wanted to do everything to save humanity.
Such a shame ME3 ruined him and made him a power-hungry lunatic who seems to care only about himself.
Desperation and Indoctrination will do that to you.
Actually, the idea of a powerful organization getting indoctrinatd was there since mass effect 1 codex, so it is nice to see that same idea being developed through him
“Shepard.” *draws smoke in a cool af way*
Illusive Man, I thought we’d be meeting face to face.
I do not understand why there are some who believe that the illusiveman was already indoctrinated in mass effect 2. When you think about it for a moment, it's utterly illogical. the collectors were a useful tool for the reaper, if the illusiveman had already been indoctrinated, the reapers would not have let it happen that together with shepard he delayed the time of the invasion.
the illusiveman just made a big mistake in the end, believing that the scientific achievements of cerberus would be enough to control the reapers. he tried to make the contact and thus invited the reapers to enslave him.
he was indoctrinated all along... Indoctrination doesnt mean you instantly start to do exactly what reapers want and make stupid choices. The indoctrination clouded his judgement. If you listen to the prothean VI it also tells you the same thing happened in their cycle with a splinter group thinking they could control the reapers for their own good, but they were indoctrinated all along. Same thing with cerberus, you can hear it from TIMs voice at the end of me2 when he wanted Shepard to save the collector base. He just became more desperate and the indoctrination overcame him in me3, making him take all those extreme actions. The reapers want to create division and TIM had come in to contact with reaper artifacts a long time ago, so its pretty obvious.
If you read the Comics you would learn that the Illusive man has known about the reapers and been working with reaper tech for half a century or maybe even more. been a while since I read. He developed ways to become Immune from Indoctrination but in the end I think he's lust for control led him down the path to become more susceptible to become Indoctrinated. How sad that the person the most resistant to Indoctrination destroyed himself in the end. Such a great Character
@@MistahJay7 As far as i know an artifact gave him a vision after the turians catched him. That pretty much turned him from Jack Harper to The Illusiveman. In the game it's pretty clear, that he tried to make contact with the reapers in order to test his new weapon. Even his doctor told him, that he is taking a huge risk. In the end he actually ask the reapers to controle him. the tests were not sufficient
, but at least he was always halfright, just like shepard. That's what makes him so great too. because he is not that typical overpowered asshole who does bad things just because he can do so.
@@mauricekeip6303 glory to Cerberus
@@AT-kj2vq Exactly
So mysterious and yet kinda tragic especially at the end of the track.
I love you Illusive Man !!! You're the best character, RIP :-(
Psaro maybe he back, because his popularity
Lucas Kazama I have hope. Game in ME2 ME3 or after ME3 time.
@Marco M For me this is an only logical way.
A great theme for a great character!
I love how mysterious he was, great character.
Ah finally. I've been looking all over for this soundtrack. Its quite...illusive.
such a great character, with a lot of depth, very well written!
Sooo much feels here...haha, I can't even describe why I love these games so much...for me, Mass Effect is one of the best game series ever made!!! I have goosebumbps everytime I listen to any of these soundtracks O.o
Well let's just make sure we don't lose him
The Illusive man is the definition of doing all the wrong things for all the right reasons.
You would be in for a wild ride. Great games, great story. Also, yes, best villain theme since the 'Imperial March'.
He was right, controlling them is better than destroying them. Destroying them puts everyone back in the stone age, makes it impossible to travel across the galaxy and means that inevitably some reaper robot species will rise again. Illusive man's methods were just not ethical, but clearly superior to the idealized soldier attitude.
just an edit from his story line. Before founding Cerberus, the Illusive Man was known as Jack Harper, a mercenary and part of a special group under the command of General Williams. During the First Contact War, Harper served on Shanxi, and in the later days of the war, he, Ben Hislop and Eva Coré were responsible for the capture of a turian general named Desolas Arterius. After heading back to General Williams' command compound, they analyze turian troop movement patterns and determined that they were looking for something. Upon interrogating the captured turian, Jack discovered that Desolas was searching for an artifact. After capturing Desolas' forces, Jack questions Desolas further; Desolas merely tells Harper to be careful about what he is looking for, as he might just find it. After leaving Eva in charge of the prisoners, Jack and Ben head into the cave where the artifact is located.
"Humanity is up against the greatest threat of our brief existence."
You want to make this much cooler, have him become increasingly cybernetic as the vid plays and extend it. make it a slow process too. That would be trippy.
After all this years, playing again the trilogy, despite the bads, thanking the goods, this is my favorite theme of all time.
Божественная мелодия! Великолепная игра! И прекрасный Мартин Шин в образе Иллюзив Мэна! / Divine melody! Great game! And the beautiful Martin Sheen as the Illusive Man!
He is an excellent villain.
He devoted his entire life, founded an entire organization, sacrificed millions of lives and his OWN HUMANITY to further the cause of the human race. And in the end, his ambition gets turned around on him by the Reapers, and he ending up destroying much of what he only wanted to help. A very tragic, and very well written character.
"You weren't a good man, Harper, but you had conviction."