Finally!! A video that clearly states what is in a leaner's best interest depending on how involved theyd like to be. I also love the bluntness of stating what features can be more appreciated after gaining experience, and the fact that yall are going to address vibe & aesthetic. It's like yall could read my mind on what I wanted to know!
Finally! A presentation that includes discussion on how easy it is, or difficult to refill an onboard water reservoir. Should have also discussed water quality: some machines use on board filtration to reduce calcification of the machine. Other's don't. And of course, there are plumbed -in options for water treatment - at extra cost. This issue of water quality and treatment could be the subject of another video!
As a engineering (by training), i think it was a bit misleading of what PID is and what it does. The most simple way of explaining PID is just temperature control. But to understand the difference i would say its precise control of the temperature of the boiler. A normal boiler is binary and turns off or on as its above or below the set point. This basic form of control will cause your temperature to swing up and down and can vary significantly. A PID boiler on the other hand can anticipate overages and dips and maintain a steady temperature. Much like how you can set and forget your car on cruise control. In practice this means your normal boiler temperature range can vary 2-10 degrees. With a (properly tuned) PID boiler youre likely decreasing that range to a tenth of a degree. All the other stuff is just bonuses because now you have a computer and you might as well use it at that point for additional features.
The only thing I would add to that is that you cannot easily drop the temperature during an extraction unless you mix in cold water like a Decent machine does. A PID alone will not help you with this.
Great videos! Me and my sister want to start a coffee trailer, which double boiler models would you recommend for someone who certainly isn’t a beginner but isn’t very well rounded with experience either.
Avoid both. You'd want a machine that has the capability to pull shots between 8-10 bar pressure generally. If you're only getting 5-bars on a machine without flow control then your grind size is way too coarse.
When you set the temperature on the PID of a HX machine, you're setting that for the boiler which is used for steaming milk. The brew temperature is related and directly effected but it's not setting a specific brew temp. Does that make sense?
The "D" in SBDU stands for "dual" but "espresso only" means only one activity, single. So if you don't want/need any steaming, you can look at machines without that option, like the ECM Puristika.
Meh, your better off buying a good quality second hand machine with out a PID and installing one yourself, it really is a game changer and it is a substantially cheaper way to get a machine which matters since you have to spend big a on a good quality grinder.
Once you get used to properly foaming milk, I have no idea why you would want to go back to steaming. Also, many modern machines use thermoblocks rather than boilers to heat the water. Decent, for example. Is that a Lelit in the background? Looks very nice.
Taste milk that has been steamed versus milk that's been microwaved. Forgetting any foaming, if one can't taste the difference then I suggest one also not spend more than $100-250 on an espresso machine. A Nespresso or pressurized machine using pre-ground coffee is what I'd suggest for that consumer.
@espressomatic we still don't understand what you're saying. What do you mean properly frothing milk over steaming milk? ...and you mentioned microwaving vs steaming but you don't actually say what you're talkin about. If you use a steam wand to properly texture milk, you're steaming the milk no matter how hot you make it, whether you go all the way to Breaking the milk or just barely warm it.
PID is an adjustment to turn on the heating element based on the input to the PID… and it has nothing to do with the temp display FYI. Showing the current temp is merely a temp display… not a PID.
If you can flex your budget like $200... the LUCCA A53 Mini is pretty unbeatable. Otherwise, checkout the Rancilio Silvia Pro X or the Profitec Pro 500!
Thanks for the heads up. Could you tell me what happened also where abouts do you live? I am in Japan and have concerns about potential service for a machine. Please be detailed in your reply. Thank you so very much. This process is overwhelming, and the information is appreciated.
Hi Teresa, feel free to chat in on our website with any questions! Our many coffee professionals would be more than happy to assist you :) clivecoffee.com/
![Felix "Unfair" | [Stray Kids : SKZ-PLAYER]](http://i.ytimg.com/vi/Oswujxm2Ag0/mqdefault.jpg)
Finally!! A video that clearly states what is in a leaner's best interest depending on how involved theyd like to be. I also love the bluntness of stating what features can be more appreciated after gaining experience, and the fact that yall are going to address vibe & aesthetic. It's like yall could read my mind on what I wanted to know!
Finally! A presentation that includes discussion on how easy it is, or difficult to refill an onboard water reservoir. Should have also discussed water quality: some machines use on board filtration to reduce calcification of the machine. Other's don't. And of course, there are plumbed -in options for water treatment - at extra cost. This issue of water quality and treatment could be the subject of another video!
As a engineering (by training), i think it was a bit misleading of what PID is and what it does. The most simple way of explaining PID is just temperature control. But to understand the difference i would say its precise control of the temperature of the boiler. A normal boiler is binary and turns off or on as its above or below the set point. This basic form of control will cause your temperature to swing up and down and can vary significantly. A PID boiler on the other hand can anticipate overages and dips and maintain a steady temperature. Much like how you can set and forget your car on cruise control.
In practice this means your normal boiler temperature range can vary 2-10 degrees. With a (properly tuned) PID boiler youre likely decreasing that range to a tenth of a degree.
All the other stuff is just bonuses because now you have a computer and you might as well use it at that point for additional features.
Very nicely explained
The only thing I would add to that is that you cannot easily drop the temperature during an extraction unless you mix in cold water like a Decent machine does. A PID alone will not help you with this.
YAAAS!♡
dig the vibe
When I'm ready to purchase a machine, I am ABSOLUTELY going with your company :)
Love this - thanks!
Wonderful, thank you 🙂
Glad you enjoyed it!
Wonderful... Thank you so much..
Great videos! Me and my sister want to start a coffee trailer, which double boiler models would you recommend for someone who certainly isn’t a beginner but isn’t very well rounded with experience either.
Hey! I would reach out to our commercial/wholesale manager, Paul, at paul@clivecoffee.com
Whats the difference between a 20 bars machine and a 5 bars machine?
Avoid both. You'd want a machine that has the capability to pull shots between 8-10 bar pressure generally. If you're only getting 5-bars on a machine without flow control then your grind size is way too coarse.
@clivecoffee What about 6 or 6.5 bar machines?
E61 for shiny and chrome (ref Mad Max)
So basically, in a HEX machine, like the Profitec 500 for example, the temperature have to be set separately for steaming and brewing?
When you set the temperature on the PID of a HX machine, you're setting that for the boiler which is used for steaming milk. The brew temperature is related and directly effected but it's not setting a specific brew temp. Does that make sense?
@@clivecoffee That makes perfect sense. Now I get it.
So even with a thermometer on the head , controlling brew temp will only be a trial and error thing on HX machines with a PID
What would be your recommendation for a SBDU for espresso only?
The "D" in SBDU stands for "dual" but "espresso only" means only one activity, single. So if you don't want/need any steaming, you can look at machines without that option, like the ECM Puristika.
Meh, your better off buying a good quality second hand machine with out a PID and installing one yourself, it really is a game changer and it is a substantially cheaper way to get a machine which matters since you have to spend big a on a good quality grinder.
Once you get used to properly foaming milk, I have no idea why you would want to go back to steaming. Also, many modern machines use thermoblocks rather than boilers to heat the water. Decent, for example. Is that a Lelit in the background? Looks very nice.
What do you mean about properly foaming milk?
Taste milk that has been steamed versus milk that's been microwaved. Forgetting any foaming, if one can't taste the difference then I suggest one also not spend more than $100-250 on an espresso machine. A Nespresso or pressurized machine using pre-ground coffee is what I'd suggest for that consumer.
What does this mean lol
Not overheated of overfrothed to the point of breaking up the fat globules so it separates.@@NoZenith
@espressomatic we still don't understand what you're saying. What do you mean properly frothing milk over steaming milk? ...and you mentioned microwaving vs steaming but you don't actually say what you're talkin about.
If you use a steam wand to properly texture milk, you're steaming the milk no matter how hot you make it, whether you go all the way to Breaking the milk or just barely warm it.
PID is an adjustment to turn on the heating element based on the input to the PID… and it has nothing to do with the temp display FYI. Showing the current temp is merely a temp display… not a PID.
Can you help me, please, to choose the best machine under $2100 pro consumer
If you can flex your budget like $200... the LUCCA A53 Mini is pretty unbeatable. Otherwise, checkout the Rancilio Silvia Pro X or the Profitec Pro 500!
11:42
How to choose an expresso machine?
Let me check my wallet and see what it says.
Tried to order machine from you, nothing, but bad experience. Poor job.
Thanks for the heads up. Could you tell me what happened also where abouts do you live? I am in Japan and have concerns about potential service for a machine. Please be detailed in your reply. Thank you so very much. This process is overwhelming, and the information is appreciated.
Hey :) We'll always try to make a situation right. Send an email over to support@clivecoffee.com and we'd be more than happy to support you.
@Clive Coffee I emailed on the 7th. My email is Flyingkaba...plz reply
@clivecoffee @clivecoffee. Thank you for your videos. I would like an advise for a good grinder and single boiler espresso. Thank you
Hi Teresa, feel free to chat in on our website with any questions! Our many coffee professionals would be more than happy to assist you :)
clivecoffee.com/