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Fuel Trims-The Wideband Air/Fuel Ratio Sensor, Operation and Diagnostics (A/F, AFR, UEGO)
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- Опубликовано: 4 авг 2024
- **Survey** www.surveymonkey.com/r/WellsTech
Due to increasing emissions standards on our modern day vehicles a more accurate and responsive way to measure the air/fuel ratio was required. In comes the air/fuel ratio sensor, or wideband oxygen sensor, or UEGO sensor, or whatever it may happen to be called by each specific vehicle manufacturer. These sensors have many different names, but their job is the same... Accurately monitor and inform the engine computer of the air/ fuel ratio. In this class we explain how a wideband sensor works, and how to diagnose it. Also, we have 2 different vehicles to perform tests on to show how these sensors function.
If you enjoyed the video please thumbs up, subscribe, and share with your friends. Thanks for watching! -Wells Tech Team
IMO, the best presentation you've ever given. Thorough and well demonstrated. Answered almost all of the basic questions that I had about these sensors. You're extremely good at giving these presentations, so keep up the good work, and thanks!!
Thanks! I really appreciate the kind words and positivity! Lovin it! Stay tuned, I have a lot more in store!
Mike Becker, Technical Services Instructor
Great, Great video Fantastic. You did a great job.To bad i missed it live, can't wait for some night classes. You guys at Wells are greatly appreciated more than you'll ever know, not by just me but thousands of techs who watch your videos but don't bother to comment which is fine. Just know we are glad you teach us you Mike and Fritz are awesome. THANK YOU!!!
Thank you so much Rags2Wrenchs! All of us here at Wells' really appreciate you kind words. We do this for all of you guys! Thanks for watching and commenting as well. Love getting the feedback.
Mike Becker, Technical Services Instructor
Love this video!! Watched it once...went out to the garage with scantool/pico in tow. Came back in... watched it again. when it clicked I almost jumped out of my seat.
Hey Michael, that's awesome to hear!!!!
Mike Becker, Senior Technical Instructor
Michael Mills
Something wrong with you and not the Car your working on. Check your Oxygen Sensor in your Backbox. Might running lean.
Fantastic information, and training! I am ASE Master Auto, Master Truck, and L1 certified with 35 years experience, but truly lacking on wide band knowledge. Thank you so much for this video, and your others. I'm using this to help train my students.
Hey Marc! Glad your lovin it! Thanks for watching. Use it all you want. Please share at will :)
Mike Becker, Technical Services Instructor
I came across this lesson looking to increase my limited knowledge on wide band sensors/AF sensors. I am a 25+ year ASE certified Master Technician and also L1 certified. I would like to thank you for such a well done lesson. I found it absolutely phenomenal! I feel more confident after this lesson that I can diagnose a fault in the AF system, but only time will tell.
Hey Jhousek1 I'm glad that our class was able to help! Always learning right? Thank you so much for the complements! Be sure to watch more of our stuff, and try to join us for a live one!
Mike Becker, Technical Services Instructor
Always learning right? Ha Ha like there was a choice LOL 😂👍🏽
Haha that is definitely one of my favorite parts about this industry....the never ending learning. Never a dull moment when cars are involved!
Mike Becker, Technical Services Instructor
Nice job Mike explaining how wide band sensors work. Thumbs up
Thanks Ozzstar!
Mike Becker, Technical Services Instructor
Very informative... thanks for passing the knowledge.... your videos are invaluable....
Thanks Mike!!
Mike Becker, Senior Technical Instructor
Nice presentation sir. Covered some good basics without going to deep. Technicians need to understand this quite 'difficult' subject. Keep it up! Thx
Thanks for watching Dylan!
Mike Becker, Technical Services Instructor
Your presentations are very professional, and invariably show that you have put a lot of good old fashioned hard work into each one. Thank you.
I can't watch scanner danner or pine hollow there all over the place pauses and umms mass confusion.
Excellent tutorial very informative thank you for your time and effort. Cheers
Thanks Ky HomeGarage. Glad you enjoyed the video!
Mike Becker, Technical Services Instructor
Thanks a lot Mike. Needed this seminar.
Hey Emmanuel, thanks for watching! Hope it helped :)
Mike Becker, Technical Services Instructor
10x for the video. I have 2016 Corolla 1.8L CVT, where both my AF and O2 sensors have 4 wires.
It's very common for Toyota to run the 4 wire AFR. Thanks for watching!
Mike Becker, Senior Technical Instructor
Mike & Fritz, great video as usual! Way to go! Keep it up!
Thank you much!!!
Mike Becker, Senior Technical Instructor
@@GoTechTraining
I have a question on a 04 Nissan quest on the front windband o2 it was a 6 wire sensor it had 2 ref voltage one steady at 2.6 volt the other references voltage was 3.10v but it was constantly changing 3.25 to 2.40 and it did this about 15 times in a second time period on my labscope with the sensor disconnected on the computer harness side connector
My head hurts! But in a good way, I need to watch this agen soon Great job
Hey Joseph! Thanks for watching! Sorry for the info overload, but RUclips is nice because you are free to watch it anytime. :)
MIke Becker, Technical Services Instructor
mike and fritz this series was excellent!
Thanks Drew! Glad you liked it! Next class we will be wrapping it up, May's class is onto something new...not sure what that will be yet.
Mike Becker, Technical Services Instructor
Your videos are fantastic!
Thanks J Hulin!
Mike Becker, Senior Instructor
Glad to see where the current vs voltage confusion comes from.
Hey Marc, thanks for watching!
Mike Becker, Senior Instructor
I have only watch 3 of your videos so far and I am liking the and your answer is B
Hey Robert, thank you! You are correct, the answer was B.
Mike Becker, Senior Technical Services Instructor
there is absolutely an awesome video
Thanks Wes!
Mike Becker, Senior Technical Services Instructor
Very comprehend video and very informative, thanks a lot i appreciate the knowledge you deliver. I would be very pleased to watch also diagnostic process from test light to voltage drop and harnesses cable intergity/continuity. 🙏👍
Good job guys
Keep em coming
Thanks AIrman! We will, you keep watching!
Mike Becker,Technical Services Instructor
Mike you make good informational videos.
Hey Steven, you make good informational comments! Thanks :)
Mike Becker, Senior Technical Instructor
Watch diagnose dan If u want to learn something
I appreciate your explanation. Tks
Hi Theodros,
You're welcome, thanks for watching!
~Ryan Wilsing
I love this channel
Master tech right bere... El Paso TX... greeat stuff mann... thats wat im talkin bout.. biggest fan right here...
Hey Oscar, glad you are loving our classes! Do you mind editing your comment to get rid of the profanity please! I'd rather not have to delete it. I want to keep the comment section clean for any of our younger viewers. Thanks!!!
Mike Becker, Technical Services Instructor
Wells Vehicle Electronics Absolutely... no problem... keep it up... this is amazing... seriously... thank you so much for your time.
Oscar, thank you soooo much! I really appreciate this! :) You keep watching, we'll keep making training my friend!!!
Mike Becker, Technical Services Instructor
i got no spark on 1999 cheavy express 2500 5.0 van check coil ign modoule starting to think it mite be cpu
Good explanation
Amazing!!! Really great video about a subject that there's not tons of information out there.
Just a question, instead of measuring voltage couldn't you measure amperage on the signal wire with an amp clamp?
Thanks a ton man! Hopefully this year i'll have another one on this subject :)
Mike Becker, Senior Technical Instructor
You really need an inductive clamp that can measure into the microamps. The pico's clamp they are using isn't sensitive enough.
Hello Professor Mike,
I have replaced the intake gasket, on the corolla 2000 CE, it sounds better yet the lean code P0171 still come up and a pending code P0125 THROTTLE POSITION SENSOR.
The fuel trims read 5.5 long term, idling and the short term are reading _12 idling; when accelerating the short term goes down to 0 towards the + between 0.1 and .5; when Decelerating, short term goes to 00 and down towards the -10 and -12 range.
When high speed driving the long term climbs to 39.35 at 50 miles per hour. Short term climbs to the + 5 to = 7 range. Decelerating it drops to -9 to - 12.
O2 sensor drops to .3 rising to 100 to 700 when idling. acceleration it rises above .900.
Is the gasket torqued enough and should I torque more after the engine is hot?
Is UN-metered air coming in from the exhaust flange bolts on the down pipe?
Is it the exhaust manifold gasket, did not see smoke however with open air vents gases are detected inside the helm.
I used a high temperature gasket sealant and locktite to intake bolts.
I did not disconnect the battery cable while working on the car, the check engine light is always there does not change when driving with wide open throttle.
What else is there to do?
Respectfully
AG
Also was wondering if using a loop wire at the a/f sensor wire to go on your low current clamp would give a better resolution so you can actually see the low milliamp. Seen someone do this but can't seem to find it anymore. I will try this next time I'm fooling around with the Pico scope. Great job.
Hey James, thanks for watching. I am unable to show your other comment because of the link in it. RUclips doesn't like links in comments and it flagged it as spam. As for the wire loop, you might be able to do that, but what about interference. being that we are measuring such a small amount, I would think interference would be a problem. Picking the signal from the noise. I could be way off, I haven't done it myself. But another question is, who is going to take the time to do that when they have the info available on their scan tool? That is part of the reason I didn't get into manually reading the mA on the signal during the class. I'm sure it is possible to do...but why, when the scanner gives you that info. It just takes more time. I would love to hear your thoughts on this James. Can you think of a time when you would want to see the mA on a scope/meter instead of on the scanner? I love going over stuff like this. I will definitely be addressing this in our next TechConnect episode. Thank you!
Mike Becker, Technical Services Instructor
Thank you
Thanks for watching!
Mike Becker, Senior Technical Instructor
Hao Oto nghe hiểu hết ko bạn minhd hiểu có 60% ah
Really good video. Try cutting back on the okays.
Okay. haha yeh, I have gotten a bit better with it.
Mike Becker, Senior Technical Instructor
Mike, what is the white stuff on the tip of an old O2S1? It's supposed to be normal. Is it ash? from a bit of oil burn?
👍 thank you
Thank you for watching and commenting!
Mike Becker, Senior Technical Instructor
thx really thx for this thank you
Hey Sweet Jordan, thanks for watching!
Mike Becker, Senior Instructor
The check engine light came back while open throttle 70 miles per hour.
Long term was 8 and short trims _14 to -9, sometime zero when in
acceleration; when coasting short trims went from 0 to -14 fluctuating
up and down. This may look like poor fuel delivery and injectors not
opening. Bought a real fuel gauge tester, reading about depressurizing
fuel system and disconnecting open circuit sensor. The fuel regulator on the corolla 2000 is on the fuel pump . The fuel filter is on the bottom on car not inside the engine compartment. I have not electrically test the relay fuel nor the fuel regulator. Micheal love your videos and how you teach, the incentives to learn and how much fun, I am having with your team.
Ok, so this is not a GDI engine. This is just a standard system. You should be able to test your fuel pressure with key on engine off, as well as engine running. Fuel pressure spec is 44-50 psi. But I don't think you are having a fueling issue honestly. You long terms are positive and your short terms negative. This brings your total trim near 0. Are you certain your intake manifold gaskets aren't leaking when this engine is cold?
Mike Becker, Technical Services Instructor
It is also possible that even though you cleaned the MAF sensor it still could be giving you problems. MAF sensor and intake gaskets are the 2 most common complaints for lean concerns on this 1.8L engine.
Mike Becker, Technical Services Instructor
Hello Mr. Micheal,
Wow, I checked for vacuum leaks using water on start up engine was cold, it took 5 mins, while diagnostic tool was connect to the car's computer.
secondly, attached a vacuum gauge it read 22 lbs steady never dropped.
The MAF sensor, voltage readings when idling was 800 mili volts, when it warmed up completely temp 180 degrees, it dropped down to .0300 mili volts. On acceleration it wnt up pass 1.000 volts. I do not know if the wire in the mass air flow sensor is heating -up to maintain air flow temperatures and lbs per cell.
At this junction or impasse, one needs a professional to guide, so I have my corolla repair Manuel yet its so vast and wide the information that one can get lost in the details. The main principals I need to re-visit as you pointed out to me. Perhaps I should replace the MAF sensor. Yet it could be working too.
I am not certain, however this 17 year old car has over 100,000 miles is it possible the car needs new parts. I am pausing to absorb all the information and to re-think this next step about testing the fuel pump.
Thanks, for pointing the way, gasket leaks are all tight however I suspect the exhaust manifold joint maybe allowing air into the exhaust
pipe and the oxygen sensor is just there behind that joint.
Respectfully, AG
Alex, instead of checking with water, I would recommend testing with some sort of fuel source. You saw in our videos when we check our intake gasket with propane right? That's what I would use, either propane or brake cleaner. The watch the fuel trims...see if the 02 sensor responds rich, and the fuel trims go negative. This would indicate the fuel getting into the engine and being burned.
Mike Becker, Technical Services Instructor
Tech #1 is correct
Sorry the answer was tech B.
Mike Becker, Senior Technical Instructor
Dear Many Thanks
All these are great but best for flex fuel be lamda. But this info here great foundation to start for diag.
learnt loads
Hi Jamie,
Thanks for watching!
Ryan Wilsing
regular o2 sensor will read lean on misfire due to sensing unburned o2, even if there is excessive fuel in the mix. is the AFR sensor "fooled" the same way?
Hi Mike awesome class thank you. Quick question, I think, I keep having problems with all corolla from 2002-2005 on a lean condition; I didn't want to be a part changer but had no choice and still didn't work . Change every possible sensor, smoke test and fuel pump ect. Reset light and every three month it comes back, check every good corolla from 2002 to 2005 and weird they all had lean code but in pending. Check it out yourself you'll believe me. Any ideas? When do you know when a car uses the downstream 02 sensor for fuel trim? Oh I'm thinking about sending it to reprogram the ecm, maybe?
Edas, how about intake gaskets? You check those?
Mike Becker, Senior Technical Services Instructor
Wells Vehicle Electronics thank you for replying yes I all ready check that, I smoke test it and sprayed it with brake clean when the engine was hot and cold
Hi Edas did you ever get to the solution of your problem with the corolla?
Current and direction can be measured with a galvanometer at the sensor leads. The meter must be wired in series.
Can i measure heater circuit resistance with just a multimeter? My vw golf has open circuit code for heater on a/f sensor. But looking at it it seems like pins are totaly out of their place. Cant determinate wich one is heater and what are trim resistors.
Yes, you can. Many sensors the heater circuit uses the same colors for each circuit.
Mike Becker, Senior Technical Instructor
Well's I love your program, very educative, please how do I identify wide band oxygen sensor from the narrow band?
Hey Ngoh Martin, thank you very much! The easiest way would be to look in the vehicles service information or in a parts catalog. It can be hard to identify wideband vs narrowband just by visually looking at the sensor.
Mike Becker, Senior Technical Instructor
@@GoTechTraining Prodessor Mike on how can a person identify between wideband N narrow band besides looking at service info. Is it just possible to look at scan data on enhanced side and see what the volts are. Ex. Toyota u will see 3.3 and automatically know it has to be a wideband. I'm thinking because like u said ur standard narrow band u will normally see ur typical 0 to 1 volt. THANK U MIKE
@@jasonc.4683 as long as sensor is not dead or defective. But I find even with the luxury of factory scan tools going onto one of our reputable online parts suppliers (or OEM) will show the correct part and naming. Also if there are 2 banks, the other may have a reading on its s1 that will give you the info you need.
If you subtitle your videos, you will have a lot more subscribers! Thank you !
Wells Vehicle Electronics At 22:50 if the A/F sensor output to the PCM is always at a set voltage (let's say 3.3V) and only changes the amperage then I think we are still able to check its function with a DVOM or oscillloscope using an AMP clamp.
Hey Argeny, the amp readings on these is minuscule. Sometimes in the single digit miliamps. Most amp clamps aren't sensitive enough for that.
Mike Becker, Senior Technical Instructor
Oh I get it, thank you for the answer Mike!
Wells Vehicle Electronics
Is any way to send U a short video from my scanners so maybe u will able say what is ok. Or what is wrong
Huge hot question
I have a 2006 350z that I have modified the car. I recently installed long tube ISR performance headers and the 02 sensor bung is moved about 12 inches down stream making it impossible to find a 02 up stream sensors to be long enough pig tails I have bought to many of them cut and splicing. With wideband sensors are so finicky on voltages I cant get a good splice. My question is who can I contact to have special AF sensors made for me with 12 inches longer pig tails? Also no one makes a extension that fits my car. I paid 700 bucks for these headers and will do anything to keep them but budget is tight now. Car is throwing g code PA200 can you help me
nice! im confused but getting an idea, im sure i will have to replace the cats on my 4runner
Anything that I can clear up? Catalytic converters are never a cheap venture. I hope you're certain before you go replacing them!
Mike Becker, Technical Services Instructor
Wells Vehicle Electronics my 02 bank 2 sensor and bank 1 sensor 2 both read 3+ volts, long term fuel trip 99%. !!! I will pull the sensors out and double check them. Vehicle has 220k miles. I have a few pics of the readings I got while the car was warm. If you have a email you could suggest an option
can you tell me...if you have no service info available...is there any visable diffrences between the narrow n wide band sensors.. or do we just check sensor voltages with a scan tool to determine which one we have
Shauns Auto Repair, I'd say that it's best not to use visuals to judge the sensor in this case. I would look at voltages to give a better idea....but remember, not all widebands watch voltage. Call a parts dept and see what they say? Many times the will be listed as differently than a standard 02.
Mike Becker, Technical Services Instructor
Thanks very much
Hello
May I ask a question
I'm trying to install long pipes with catalytic converter for my hellcat
But I don't want to tune computer for long pipes and cath
Would my new equipment set any codes and why
Thank you
Almost impossible to say. It's like the exhaust gas may be different at the new measurement points. This could lead to slow response codes. Maybe your best bet will be to check and see what others have done in a similar situation on a forum or something.
Mike Becker, Senior Technical Instructor
So as of this comment, year 2020, do you know if narrow band O2 sensors are becoming less and less used on vehicles in favor of the wide band sensors? Pre and Post cats? Thanks!!!!!
Hey Fred, great question. As of today, wide bands are favored for the front sensor. Narrow band sensors still find themselves post cat and most every model. Due to the catalytic converter chemically changing the exhaust, you don't get a true a/f ratio reading and therefore is hard for manufactorers to justify the added cost of a wideband post cat.
Mike Becker, Senior Instructor
So how do you identify the wide ban sensor from the regular O2s ?
The easiest way is with a scanner.
Mike Becker, Senior Technical Instructor
At 30:05, You said about the resistor "is for man. 'discrepancies'" can you elaborate a little bit more about that? I heard different versions for the reason to be there. Tx.
When a sensor is built it's almost impossible to maintain a perfect level of resistance. Almost every circuit board we make here is "actively trimmed" meaning the circuits start a little high on resistance and are trimmed to meet the spec. These sensors are the same. The car demands very tight tolerances, so the sensor needs to be "trimmed to spec"
Mike Becker, Senior Technical Services
Hello Mr. Mike,
I forgot to tell you that I used the propane torch the wrong way. I
placed it around the edges of the manifold gasket; nothing happened
;then I pulled the vacuum from the brake vacuum, nothing happened; Now, I
did not place it inside the intake manifold, through the air intake
throttle, did not know how to seal the propane into the throttle body
and block the incoming air from air filter plenum. So I think I was
doing it all wrong.
I am beginning to see what you are seeing with trims and gasket leaks
its making sense. If there is a gasket leak, it (engine) has a strange
sound like a slight audible engine combustion sound , the muffler is not
muffling it sufficiently.. There are no holes in exhaust system
I remember in your video, the propane was in the intake and air hose where the MAF sensor lives was removed. If you can remind me I will try again to do it correctly.
This great detective work!
respectfully,
AG
Alex, watch this video we just did at about the 19 minute mark we show you how to check the intake gaskets with propane. I think this will help. ruclips.net/video/BlcWBZ-iaTY/видео.html
Mike Becker, Technical Services Instructor
I'm getting a P0113 on a 2002 Hyundai Elantra (slow to respond). Is it lazy and needs to be replaced ? AND is it a 02 or a A/F, how does one know ?
Mike, why aren't you measuring the 450mv current on these wide band sensors rather than voltage? Can one not make jumper cables and put an amp clamp round the wire?
I think I'm talking rubbish here. I meant the milliamp current. However it seems you have answered this already. Great video by the way. Thank you.
at ~ 36:30 you state that B14 minus B24 is about 450mv, my math say's it's 550mv , what am I missing?
Hey Stan, yep you're right. My match sucks...haha! Gotta love teach live :)
Mike Becker, Senior Technical Instructor
i always rode around with my primary a/f sensor unplugged after i got the heater code but i have a KTUNER ecu [[ kpro for 05-06]] so it was already tuned and ran fine without it now that i did a TSx swap i guess the intial start up needs the 02 sensor because its suck on 14.7 on the tuner app and says OL_FAULT, Plus both fuel trips read 0 at all times
if i go past 5% tps the car stalls out will this on sensor cause all these problems where i cant even get the car out the bay door
Hi James,
I'm not sure how the tuner operates the engine management system. But on a OEM vehicle the o2 sensors are not used on start up as they can not produce a signal until they warm up. I'm assuming it is defaulting to 14.7 a/f ratio because that is stochiometric or the target a/f ratio for gasoline. From my experience the o2 or A/F ratio sensor will not cause this issue and there may be another fault in the system.
I hope this helps, thanks for reaching out!
~Ryan Wilsing
I thought that for the catalyst to work properly, the mixture had to fluctuate around 14.7. With the classic lambda sensor, the mixture fluctuates between rich and poor. Rich to have CO for the reduction of NOx to N2 and CO2. Lean to have O2 for oxidation of the CO to CO2. The mixture is kept at 14.7 with an AFR probe. How can the catalyst work well with such a system? What do you think about this? How mesure the current of the AFR sensor with a scope. I think the current is too low for mesuring with an Amp clamp. Thank you very much for this video.
Hey Geri, 14.7:1 is the best emissions AFR. You are right, the computer will vary that to keep the catalytic converter hot and happy. As far as measuring AFR with a scope...good luck. The mA's are very very low. You can watch some slight voltage changes to see it working, but you won't be able to directly judge a/fR from that. I suggest using a scan tool to see what the computer sees.
Mike Becker, Senior Technical Instructor
@@GoTechTraining Thank you for the answer. It's still not clear to me. With the AFR probe there are no constant fluctuation I saw. My conclusion WAS the catalyc converter can't work properly with a constant AFR of 14.7:1. For a good working catalyc converter there is a need for a fluctuation. Like I said: rich to have CO to reducing NOx to N2 and CO2 and lean for oxidation of the CO to CO2. Maybe I'm old school. Do you think constant 14.7 : 1 the catalyc converter works for more than 90%? I must tell you I have no experience with AFR probes. I have to work on it. Many thanks. Geri from Flanders.
Geri, the fluctuation happens inside of the PCM. There's an ASIC chip in there that is computing the a/f ratio. You won't be able to see it...except for on a scan tool. And even then, these sensors are so fast you may not see it.
Mike Becker, Senior Technical Instructor
@@GoTechTraining Thank you very much for the answer. One of this days I gonna test a car witch an AFR probe. I can't wait. Automotive technics they are a passion.
would you do a show on 97 f150 5.4 02 sensors and maf flow rates
Hello Mr. Mike tech,
I performed the propane test on the intake throttle manifold on the Toyota corolla 2000 it reads 00 to -5,-7 then -14 to -25 as propane increased the shorterm was -25 engine stalled. The more negative the short term fuel trims reads the richer the engine is, does this mean its an intake gasket? I will attempt to use a Halloween smoke machine to see the leaks. Will block the intake air hose with latex glove to prevent smoke from escaping into the maf bins. Have not check for fuel gauge pressure yet.
Hope the smoke machine works out for ya. But being that you saw a HUGE change when applying propane, I think you are safe to pull that intake manifold off and inspect those gaskets. I bet there are pretty shot.
Mike Becker, Technical Services Instructor
ok Tech mike, that is a walop of a confirmation, thank you. The smoke machine is a disco party machine once a load of smoke went into the manifold I followed up with air could not see anything is it possible that the exhaust manifold gasket is leaking too? Should I replace both gaskets? I will now attempt to do a fuel test.
Being a floating ground it sort of makes the o2 sensor appear as a current shunt which makes sense as to why you dont see the voltage change at the sensor
Great video!
Why not put an amp clamp and measure the amps on the sensor signal wire? Positive means lean and negative amps means rich
Nate A, wideband AFR's are SUPPPPPER low current. At the time I did this video I did not have an amp clamp that went that low. I do now and will be showing that in a future video :)
Mike Becker, Senior Technical Instructor
@@GoTechTraining
Looking forward. keep doing those great videos!
Sure Mr teacher
When I pulled the vacuum line, the o2 sensor voltage dropped down to zero; is this normal? Toyota corolla 2000 has a lean code 171. No vacuum leaks all gaskets where checked with water when cold. The direction now is fuel injectors and fuel pressure and fuel regulator. Its overwhelming. I have not check MAP; O2 UPSTREAM AND INTAKE AIR CONTROL AND PCV. IT VERY COMPLEX.
Alex, if you pull a vacuum hose you introduce a large amount of un-metered oxygen into the engine. This will make an excessive amount of oxygen flow past the O2 sensor, therefore causing the voltage to drop very low, around 100mV. If it is going all the way to 0 you may have an issue with the sensor. An O2 sensor should operate between 100 and 900mV.
Mike Becker, Technical Services Instructor
tech B because the heater is to activate the sensor quickly TAKING LESS TIME TO WORK. It will work later when when exhaust is very hot able to detect lean and rich.
Hey Alex, Tech B is correct. On a wideband sensor the heater MUST be active for the sensor to work. It will not function later when the exhaust gets hot like a standard O2 sensor does. These sensors must be up around that 1500 degree mark to function.
Mike Becker, Technical Services Instructor
Unfortunately I can't see your second response
I will ask again
I would like to upgrade upper pulley (3.35 factory to 3.17) it will give from 1 to 2 PSI additionally
Would the engine be able to compensate by adjusting fuel trims?
I know some people had this update, they said on 91 gas (factory tune) they have 5°knock, would 93 octane be able to fix 5° knock?
Thank you I really appreciate your time
What do you mean by "fix 5 degrees knock?" Like the timing was retarded 5 degrees to counter knock? Fuel trims aren't really the big player here. The knock sensor is. If the fuel ignites and causes knock due to the higher cylinder pressure then the knock sensor will report and the ECM will retard timing. Best bet would be to have any changes done documented and programmed into the ECM accordingly. That way ignition and fueling are dialed in.
Mike Becker, Senior Technical Instructor
@@GoTechTraining
Yes exactly with 91 octane (factory tuning) addition of 1-2psi of boost will reward timing by 5°
What do you think 93 octane will resolve that, or I will need to use boostane to make like 95 octane
Thank you
My car is throwing code po420. I replaced the cat. It didn't work. The freeze frame showed front o2 was 0v, rear o2 was 0.33v. The other Bank front and back both sensors were 0v. What could my problem be?
How do you induce an lean condition in an car which uses an MAP sensor alone, no MAF sensor?
How do you test to see which wire is bad going to the sensor
Can i have one question : Why we don't use the voltage at Nernst cell to determine A/F Ratio but we need to use Pumping current instead ??
Thanks !!
Hi, the voltage associated with the nearnst cell will only display rich or lean, about over below 450mv. Just like a normal 02 sensor. it cant tell HOW rich or lean. That's where pumping current comes in. The current required to achieve stroicemetric determines the actual A/F ratio.
~Mike
@@GoTechTraining Sorry for late response , i understood now .
Appreciate for the answer !!
What do you think are the potential causes for a lean STFT (hovering around +3) and a rich LTFT (staying around -9) at the same time at idle?
Both STFT and LTFT would stay at those levels at idle for a long time.
Another clue is that when the RPM is pushed to 2.5K, the situation reverses where the STFT would drop down to a rich condition (about -3) and the LTFT would shoot up to a lean condition (+4).
Since the STFT + LTFT is within +/-20, the engine would not throw a code.
Regardless, this would be an interesting scenario for fuel trim analysis.
Nhat, there's so many things it could be. The issue is so slight and not setting a code at this point. I'm not sure I would spend too much time on it at this point. Could be something simple, like a dirty MAF sensor or a skewed a/f ratio or 02 sensor. Again, it's so slight you may end up chasing around finding nothing at this time.
Mike Becker, Senior Instructor
@@GoTechTraining Thank you for the response. It's just a curious scenario where the STFT is saying lean while the LTFT is saying rich.
The problem is that the diagnostic would show oxygen sensor 2 (downstream) faults for both bank 1 and bank 2. And when it gets bad enough it would throw an engine light for bank 2 catalyst operating below a threshold (P0420).
The problem seems to disappear after a series of trials and errors on the suspected components.
- I started with replacing bank 2 downstream o2 sensor.
- Then replacing the MAF.
- Then putting in a new engine air filter.
- The problem finally went away after removing and cleaning the throttle body. I don't know if the disconnecting of the battery while cleaning the throttle body or the actual cleaning of the throttle body solved the problem. The throttle body was pretty clean to start with.
hei .
I have problem to get the information from best way to get the correct information i fix many mark cars . thnaks
Hey Mohannad, We use Alldatapro and Identifix for our service information. If they are available to you I highly recommend them. They are both a service that you pay for monthly.
Mike Becker, Senior Technical Instructor
Wait. I understand that power functions of a device work off wattage so voltage times amps - power -
So a drop in voltage is an increase in amperage.
But then why does fluke state a drop in voltage is a drop in current like the traditional VIR table.
Can anyone explain this
I have a problem.. P219b code fuel balance on gmc terrain i did replace spark plug and i replace intake gasket after that p219b light on
Hi Jhone, how are the oxygen sensors working? How are the fuel trims?
Mike Becker, Senior Instructor
I found the problem boss
Oxygen sensor is doing fine also the fuel trim
Mike, this one is your masterstroke ... Almost everyone I know is bamboozled by 5-wire widebands, especially if the scantool doesn't lead them by the nose to a diagnosis ... I've had 2 faulty widebands that threw no code, including no code on the factory tool! Go figure. The manufacturer confirmed a fault using the super hi-tech unplug it test. But using a scope both showed a fluctuation in the what should be a constant 450mV between the ref and floating ground. Also, the scope can show a fault on the pump circuit wire, which will - as you have shown - display a fluctuating V as the circuit pumps current to adjust to rich and lean conditions ... I reckon that means ignore all the factory literature that says you can't test a WB with a scope and only a scantool ... I think you need both, as usual. Really well done Mike!
Wow Alex, thank you for the kind words! I really appreciate that. Widebands are one of the most misunderstood sensors for sure. As for watching that current pumping line for voltage....sure you can see fluctuations in the voltage, meaning fluctuations in the current. But that only works for 5 wires, not the 4 wire like was on our Lexus. I'm not sure if you can relate that voltage change directly to A/F ratio. Maybe there is a conversion...Thanks for the comment Alex!
Mike Becker, Technical Services Instructor
Why is my car b1s1 wide band reading -128ma countinuosly? Please
19:59 so you're telling me that the pcm is getting an o2 reading based on how much output is being sent to the sensor for the sensor to create lambda within itself? Or am I crazy?
The A/F ratio sensors goal is to maintain the internal chamber at stoichiometric. This is done by pumping O2 ions in and out. Therefore there is a current draw to run the pump. The computer measures that current draw to determine how rich or lean the engine is. Does that make sense?
Mike Becker, Technical Services Instructor
👍 👍 THANKS MIKE
Thanks Sm Ms!
Mike Becker, Senior Technical Instructor
Gracias por toda la información una sugestión si pudieran hacer a los fabricantes de autos a cerca de los códigos generales en vez hacer directo que sensores están malos ejemplo lean or air ratios ellos puede hacer esto si quisieran así cuando ponemos nuestros scanners ban a decir que sensor está malo gracias los aprecio mucho y si pueden mandarme una camiseta seria agradecido profundamente coló gris talla 2x lol gracias Juan
Talk about Toyota AF\R sensor and Prius hybrid
Mark, I cover the Toyota AFR in another class detailing widebands.
Mike Becker, Senior Technical Instructor
2009 vzw beetle has 3 sensors
Can anyone explain why when I play this in firefox the video is completely out of sync, but it's fine in edge? Just spent 10 minutes trying to view the images while listening lol
Joe: answer A is correct
Sorry, the correct answer is B. A wideband sensor needs to be SUPER hot in order to work. Hotter than standard exhaust temps. Therefore having the heater functioning is VITAL!
Mike Becker, Technical Services Instructor
Is their any way if swapping to a wideband on my 3ltr Pajero 1994 would the computer know what to do with it
Hey Chirs, not sure what the reason is that you would do that. The computer would have no idea. The sensors are read completely different.
Mike Becker, Senior Technical Services Instructor
The engine is worked and I'm looking at getting a aem Piggy back ECU, but in the mean time I was trying to fix fuel consumption issues of 17ltr 100ks
With a factory PCM it won't do you any good. If you run something aftermarket that can make use of a wideband, then it may be a good idea. Good luck with your project Chris!
Mike Becker, Senior Technical Services Instructor
You know I think you make good videos. The issue I have with it is the whole :Do your Research" I have countless times researched for hours trying to find info on a lot of these vehicles and haves requested help with specs or what people see in the field to just be wasting my time and losing money. So every time I hear "do research" I just want to punch someone in the face.
Hey Phillip, thanks for watching! Sorry to hear you've run into issues with the research side of things. Sometimes that information is stuck behind a pay-wall to a service like AllData or Identifix.
Mike Becker, Senior Instructor
@@GoTechTraining I have alldata and prodemand.
A it will work when exhaust heats it up properly
Eric O?
Ain't he the guy who likes brake clean?
I mean, he has a sound effect for it, so yeh, i think so...haha!
Mike Becker, Senior Instructor
I have a lean code p0171 check engine light is always on, the cr run
fine and idles fine. air/fuel sensor fluctuates between 600 to 800 down
to 200. the fuel trim long term is 15 + and the shorterm fuel is -14.
Check for vacuum leak engine cold sprayed water all over intake manifold
, vacuum hoses , exhaust manifold, its normal. The air/fuel sensor
drop to zero volts when I pulled the vacuum hose from manifold . Does a
zero volt reading point to a faulty o2 sensor , its a 4 wire , on Toyota
corolla 2000 4 cyl CE 1.8l.
Now today I will check spark plugs and injectors, its repeated ticking
sound points to both injectors and spark. spark advance on the obd tool
reads 15 with a G letter . What does it mean?
I have not back probe the o2 sensor because I can not find its o2
specifications on voltage drop and I don't know if its a wide band or a
narrow band sensor.
I cant find the fuel regulator in the engine. And I need to inspect all
the vacuum hoses too. Its like being a medical doctor, I only have 150
hours of training with certificate from the 70s and learning all this
analysis with fancy digital scanners can be very expensive for just a
do-it yourself-er.
can I use a volt meter with an amp probe together on a o2 sensor signal
wire, instead of back probing?
Can I use the wave screen on the less expensive OBD scanner, to see wave
forms along with amp probe and wire clip , How do I set this up?
Alex, sounds like you have a ton going on here. I am out of the office now for the weekend so I can't get you any specs or anything until I'm back in my office on Monday. Now that being said, lets see if we can get this thing fixed before then. Your first paragraph has a HUGE clue on what is going on with your engine. Your LT fuel trim is 15+....and your negative is -14. This tells me the engine is running almost PERFECT at that point of testing. You have a 1+ total fuel trim. This is common when the intake gaskets have failed on these motors. Long terms adding fuel when cold, engine heats up, seals the intake leaks, and short terms correct because the problem is no longer present. Take a look at the fuel trims when this thing is stone cold. Watch the short terms. They will start at 0, and I would assume, stay around 0 or maybe go + for a little bit. Then as the engine gradually warms, you see those short terms start to tick down, -, back to that -14 mark. Let me know how this turns out ok? I'll do my best to keep in touch over the weekend.
Mike Becker, Technical Services Instructor
, I re-examined the mass air flow sensor took it out sprayed with
throttle fluid, clean metal surface of mounting screws because it had a greasy insulation from the di-electric grease, I place inside the pin
connectors. Removed the di-electric grease and place it back-in, drove in
wide open throttle for 7 miles and the darn thing corrected itself and
the check engine light went back to its cave.
The fuel trim in open
throttle all positive #'s, in the low numbers and the o2 sensor went from 0 to 900 and back down at idle. I pulled vacuum hoses out; o2 dropped to 0 volts. then I pulled one spark
plug, the engine turn-off. It should have kept running with one self created misfire, cylinder 4 was removed, I thought the engine would keep running? The oposite happened.
After a long ride, it re-adjusted, it began working again, no codes no engine check
lights, long-term fuel below 10 and shorterm bet 2 and -3.. The IAT
(IDLE AIR TEMP) WAS BET 90 AND 46.
I caused the problem, when I changed
the down pipe from exhaust manifold to the catalytic converter.
I
checked for exhaust leaks, it may be sucking a little bit of unmetered
air, through the joint; used finger to feel it, but nothing was pulling in
through the joint, where the spring bolts hold it together. I hear a pulse like ticking suspect the injectors or a weak fuel pump. I have a vacuum gauge that is 2 in 1 , a fuel and vacuum pump. I am afraid to mess with the high pressure fuel line and rails. I do not have adequate fuel guage with release valve, the I have is very cheap with plastic connectors one broke already.
If the fuel pump is suspect, I will not drive it until I can figure out how to properly do the fuel pressure test with a good fuel gauge.
I may have to replace all injectors and the fuel pump , the car has one hundred thousand, five hundred miles and it still runs well because it still has great compression.
I want to say
thank you and I just can't believe its working well without the check engine light on. You guys are both engineers and techs dealing with a machine that behaves like the human respiratory system. All of you are like doctors interpreting complex blood chemistry indices to come up with a primary and secondary diagnosis, very scientific
and complex.
Mr, Micheal Becker and your associate professor Mr. Fritz, thank you for serving the country and the john does of the world. The only place, I feel freedom is inside, a well cared for car. Everything else is a major delusion.
I went to trade school as a teenager and was pursuing a science degree in physics. I work for 3 garages, every-time, I was told to lie to the customer and change parts for profits. I quit the moment this game of greed presented itself to me.
I help the elderly and young families, with their cars, for free during the 70's, as a service to the now poor middle class. It was just, one way to defend the constitution and its citizens. Wells techs you are my heroes, impeccable public servants, God bless.
Respectfully,
AG
Hey Alex, sounds like you did test a bunch. I would say the car should run on 3 cylinders. Kind of odd it died off. Maybe once it's running decent again it will run on just 3. Maybe it's running too poorly right now to maintain it running. I would say to check out fuel pressure. Is this a GDI engine? Check the scan tool and see if you have a data pid for fuel pressure. Many newer cars have them.
Thank you so much for the kind words! We are here for you! We love being able to help out everyone with learning how to fix their own cars! Thank you for all you do for the elderly and young families. It sounds like you are truly a blessing to your community!
Mike Becker, Technical Services Instructor
The scan tool obd has a pid parameter, it pulled up code 0171 and pending code random miss-fires on all cylinders. I never noticed this before. I never really learned to operate the scan toll perhaps. If it says random missfire could that be more the mass air flow sensor?
It's possible that the lean condition is causing the misfire, or the misfire is causing the lean condition. When the engine is running lean do the misfire counters go up? Or is it only intermittent? Watch the fuel trims and misfire counters. If the engine is running lean, but not misfiring at that moment I would address the lean condition and not the miss. If the only time the engine runs leans is when it's missing, then go after the miss before the lean code.
Mike Becker, Technical Services Instructor
What is PID?
PID stands for parameter identification. It's a value on a scan tool. Like coolant temperature or something like that.
Mike Becker, Senior Technical Instructor
great info thanks I have some home work for you guys ? can you do a video on Nitrogen oxide sensor please a lot of new cars are using this now most GDI System now have this and if you need more home work maybe some info on the new 3 wire 3 phase fuel pumps that some cars have most cars that' have this are Brushless Fuel Pumps
Stephen, what cars are you seeing NOX sensors on? As far as I knew, they are currently only on diesel models. Are you seeing these on gas motors? Also that brushless fuel pump is an interesting topic, and something we hope to cover! Thanks for the info my friend! Hope all is well on your side of the world :)
Mike Becker, Technical Services Instructor
Some of the new VW and Audi cars now have them and Mercedes ( CLS -350 ) use them all have Bosch GDI systems not Diesel !
Thanks for the info Stephen, i'll have to look into that. I wasn't familiar with that!
Mike Becker, Technical Services Instructor
Wells Vehicle Electronics Nguyen0'
Can somebody tell me what is fuel trim?
Hey Wang Jack, fuel trim is the computers adjustment to inconsistencies in the air/fuel delivery.
Mike Becker, Senior Instructor
add subtitles
Sorry - something is going wrong with this video - pictures start several minutes after talking; synchronisation is completely wrong! Please can you fix it?
how to w
ırıng dıgrams
Hey Ayham, we use Alldatapro and Identifix for our wiring diagrams.
Mike Becker, Senior Technical Instructor
how to alldata onlin
I have a P0135 code on my 05 Porsche cayenne and I have know idea what it means.
4:02
wide band sensor current dependent i think. sensor should be changed
State that rich or lean effect on engine rich I think eat fule if I'm correct lean no preformenc if I'm correct
That ENTIRE video was waaaaayyyyyy over my head. ☹
Hey, what can I help with to help you to understand?
Mike Becker, Senior Technical Instructor
but it's probably the best info out there.
Hey Alex, i bought a new 5 wires wideband oxygen sensor for my Volkswagen Golf Mk4 1.6 petrol. The problem is everytime if i reset the Ecu the fuel trims starts with 0 after some driving the long term goes to a fixed value -3% and stays there. And the short term only goes between 0 and -6% even if i create a large vacuum leak by taking the break hose off the Short term and Long term stays fixed rich at -3% The car is very slugish and i dont get any fault codes. Do you maybe know what the problem could be?
That's odd that it just stays there at a fixed value like that even after creating a vacuum leak. Those numbers are ok in terms of fuel trims, but you are noticing driveability issues? Makes me wonder if you scan tool is showing you the correct information. I would look at Mode 1 data and see if that tells you a different story in terms of your short and long fuel trims.
Mike Becker, Technical Services Instructor
Thanks for the reply.. I think the scan tool 100% okay i am using a original Fully Registered version of Vagcom on my laptop. The car is very slugish at different moments. And when i look at the short term value it goes to -18% it never goes to positive not even 1%
I heard from many people that they had never luck with Bosch lambdasensors, so i was thinking maybe this new Lambda could be faulty. Because the car was fine with the old sensor with 230.000 miles on it
It's possible the sensor could be faulty. If you never had a problem before the sensor, then installed a new one and now have a problem...i'd be looking close at the new sensor.
Mike Becker, Technical Services Instructor
ive just looked at Mode 1 the values are the same. i was thinking of an exaust leak before the Lambdasensor, Would the car go rich? if this happens?
I would expect to see the sensor go lean with an exhaust leak before the sensor. Extra oxygen=lean
Mike Becker, Technical Services Instructor