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A Look at Whom Gods Destroy (Star Trek)
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- Опубликовано: 5 апр 2024
- Opinionated Star Trek Episode Guide looks at the story of the time Kirk met one of the great military minds of Starfleet after he had gone mad. Well, one of the times, anyway.
I love that you put a Bot Break in the middle of the Shatner breakdown scene. You could have decided that we got the gist of it after 20 seconds or so of shouting. But no, you decided we needed the full Shatner, and I appreciate that.
The contrast between the gentle bot music and Shatner was even greater
I still think he did well in that scene, hoping to never see it again.
I blame the people who handed him the script... Just consider, how well would you do.
I love the idea of Star Trek having a general insanity cure. Phasers start being built with an extra "Insanity cure" setting that just shoots out a little dart.
"Don't you understand, Captain? Once I've fed all of the colonists into this ancient computer, we shall live on as one Immortal consciousness, a glorious-"
*thwp*
"Ow! Treachery! You cannot stop what has begun! You... will... what the hell am I doing?"
[into communicator] "Honey, it's Garth! I'm coming home!"
Shakespeare can only really be appreciated in its original Klingon
Nonsense. The Klingons copied it off the Romulans.
Who knew Marta worked in Klingon
@@DefinatelyNotAI Marta works in any language...
Very nuanced acting by Shatner.
And people say he's not capable of nuance.
Holy warp nacelles, Bruce ! Kirkman gets it on with Batgirl !
Can we appreciate for a moment the artistry of this Wheelbarrow Imitator and his act...then compare it to the fact that Voyager couldn't afford a dang juggler.
Shatner going full ham is never not hilarious AF.
Nice Star Trek Beyond reference.
4:16 A thick, juicy slab of Shatner ham. Just what I needed to start my day.
I do applaud the writing staff for having the restraint to place their lunatic asylum on a planet named Elba II, but to *not* have an inmate dressed as Napoleon.
"Spock and I haven't done a three-some since Risa!" I almost spat my coffee on that one!
Add in that she's Batgirl, and I think that one quip launched a thousand fan-fics.
"Even Bones can see through this."
Ouch, sick burn on the good Dr. McCoy.
Whom Gods Destroy was an episode of Star Trek referenced in Shatner’s book Star Trek Memories. Leonard Nimoy didn’t like the way Spock was written in this episode one bit, specifically, the scene where Spock is holding a phaser and watching Kirk fight with imposter Kirk near the end of the episode. Being a half Vulcan well versed in logic and using his mind is what the character is all about. However, Spock just sits there with his phaser and watches the two men duke it out. It was because of this, Leonard Nimoy went over producer Fred Freiberger’s head and wrote to Douglas Cramer, the president of Paramount Television that he wasn’t really any good at playing dummies, and if they wanted Spock to be a dummy on the show, he needed help. Maybe if they could send him films of actors playing idiots like Dagwood Bumstead or some other sort to help him out. Freiberger was not pleased with Nimoy writing such a letter to Doug Cramer, but Nimoy felt he had no other choice because he felt Freiberger wasn’t listening to him about his concerns about how Spock was handled in the final season of Star Trek.
For often mind control, shapeshifters and clones come up in the franchise, a secret handshake protocol really should be implemented fleet-wide...
Different specific protocols though. Because if everyone knows the same, finding out what it is becomes really easy.
@@bthsr7113 I would have thought that was obvious. They should also update their codes periodically (though perhaps at irregular intervals) for added security.
But I suppose it _would_ cause a lot of episodes to have never happened...
That He-Man joke was practically internet archeology.
I always liked this episode. How would I act if I met my hero and that hero had gone off the deep end? Kirk, the legend meeting his equal from another generation. It must have been so tough for Kirk.
I was not ready for what happened at 6:43 there... lol! XD
Certainly not even in the top 50% of episodes but it's still entertaining.
Steve Inhat as Garth is wonderful and Shatner has some effective "low key" performances.
Forget the Axanar joke, the Beyond joke makes me laugh more.
8:20
Oh man that Axanar joke...
Must be something before my time, since I’ve googled Axanar and all that comes up is Star Trek fan films related to this episode/character.
@@starwarsnerd100 The controversy was that the guy in charge of the Axanar fan film started trying to monetise it by selling Axanar-branded merchandise.
This provoked CBS into not only smacking this attempt down but imposing draconian rules on future Star Trek fan films that made producing them far more difficult.
@@zephyr8072 Ah, thanks for clearing that up, I assumed Chuck was making a reference to a failed company or band or something that coincidentally had the same name.
@@starwarsnerd100 So what you thought then was true, from a certain point of view...
Garth probably met Archer and his sanity quickly began to drop.
It makes me wonder what happened when the Founders met other shape shifting races? Like Garth or Martia from Star Trek 6. Would they ally or see them as solid-ish?
A Changeling, a Chameloid and an Allasomorph walk into a bar...only the bar turned out to be a Vendorian! Buh-dum-bump!
I suspect the Dominion would not be fond of shape shifters outside of their sphere of influence, in much the same way that countries with nukes aren’t usually too happy about others nations getting the bomb.
Garth was probably Archer's protégé.
6:33 6:33 n
6:55 : Was wondering how long you would go without a He-Man reference 😂
All we need an Axanar series.
i mean hayden is a great actor
Just not in the prequel. But i blame Lucas. He got wooden performances out of almost everyone. But particularly him and Natalie
I recommend to the both of you to watch the restored Revenge of the Sith lightsaber fights that Hayden did with the stunt actor for Dooku. It's incredible.
Hayden's done much better as Anakin in recent times.
Pretty good
Hayden had his moments in the prequels, to call him bad is very unfair. He was dealing with the kind of clunky dialogue that made even Samuel L. Jackson a plank of wood in some scenes.
*"LORD GARTH!!!"*
I love this episode and appreciate it showing the Federation still had problems with mental health despite being a paradise. NuTrek upsets me since PTSD and suicidal urges are so prevalent in the new shows (Capt. Shaw, Seven of Nine, Dr. Hugh Culiber, and Picard's mother) but treats all their problems with really simplistic solutions. It's like mental health doesn't exist in Star Trek now.
Careful someone is bound to request you review Adam West Batman episodes, or the movie.
Do Adam West Batman!
I’d be happy to be annoyed by Yvonne Craig any day.
Maybe it's because I love the camp, but I kinda love this episode.
LOL THE HEMAN THING HAHHAHAHAHA! :D
I SAID HEY
WHAT'A GOIN ON
Star Trek: TOS has a real problem with clothes. There is the transporter changing people's clothes in "Mirror, Mirror." And then in this episode Garth's clothes change along with his body when he shape-shifts. And if you weren't entertained by Yvonne Craig's dance in that skimpy outfit, check your libido, man.
I tend to forget early Star Trek's weird ideas of penal colonies full of mentally ill people like they're a bunch of space lepers... Odd choice. Especially when said crazy Captain Garth (who, let's face facts, isn't AS nuts as Janeway) goes and blows up his green girlfriend... And then is cured and it's like "YAY! Sure he murdered people, but now he's no longer crazy! That's great huh?!"
This episode is PURE camp and nuanced acting is the best
.. I think I need a nap because I kept misreading " _let's face facts_ " as " _let's space farts_ " x.x
Janeway would probably feed Garth to the Harogen and sell tickets to the show.
If crimes were committed due to mental illness and the illness was cured why would they be held? Perhaps for balance they would have some period being required to work in the field catching the others to cure before they do more harm
I'm so very glad Lower Decks turned the tables on this outdated, horrid trope.
1960s sadly are gonna be 1960s...
Still think that "Captain Garth" was meant to be the main antagonist for season 1 Discovery before someone in the studio said "hey, you know what the kids love... The mirror universe" and thus created Lorca... Might also explain why they got reeeeeeally pissy with the axanar fan film as it (possibly) originally veered too close to the earlier premise for discovery.
I don’t think a company needs extra reason on top of “potential copyright violation” to explain why they’re so pissed off. That’s usually reason enough to get them up in arms.
@@starwarsnerd100 true enough, but there's also an added issue regarding royalties and a history with star trek productions of fans claiming to have thought of an idea first and the main production "stealing" the idea from them without compensation. There's a BTS commentary from one of the production team from start trek TAS who was confronted by a fan who told him "you guys should do another tribble story". When the TAS episode with tribbles came out that fan tried to claim royalties for supposedly giving them the idea (despite the story having already been written and animated before the fans interaction ever happened). It's also why IP holders refuse to accept fan fiction or fan scripts. If anything can be tied back to anyone / anything outside the production it's a major legal issue (and disco season 1 had its own issue with the tartrgade and the game tartrgade)
"He is to Kirk what Kirk is to another era."
...Captain Garthcher.
It must have been so much easier to write science fiction back in the day. All you need to do is come up with some magical BS alien or technology and not have to worry about fans yelling at you about how this thing worked why the alien would exist that way.
I love reading SF from the 1950s and earlier, and there is an innocence and hopefulness that doesn't exist in today's SF.
@@BTScriviner true, that utopia Gene thought we’d get to is slowly crumbling. We’ll be lucky if we make it to Aliens (movie) level of society at best now days.
If you think pedantic fans are new, you will be very surprised if you look up the early fanzines from the era.
@@JosephDavies it's not that new if you go back and read some of these old 70s sci-fi magazine journals they have some of the same kind of energy as people on Twitter today. And especially if you fast forward to the early 90s and early internet forums people were literally sitting death threats to Will Wheaton. They've always really existed they just didn't have the outlets that they do now.
@@badman3000 That's literally what I said.
The “what’s chuck going to indulge in madness today?” Meter is so off the scale it broke again
I called this, Pimp Stick. My family laugh when I tell the story.
This episode doesn't remind of "Dagger of the Mind" so much as any of the number of episodes where Kirk was stuck on a planet, including "The Omega Glory" (and this is certainly better than that), with the Enterprise unable to help him, except this time Spock was with him. There were only seven episodes left, so why is it improbable that Kirk and Scott agreed on a password after the other times he'd been captured on a planet. Also, considering that when you watch season 3 seven days a week, it seems like a crewman is falling in love every other episode, I liked that Marta got blown up. You mean Kirk didn't turn her? The first time I saw this, that was a shock.
8:30 I still refer to CBS's crackdown on Star Trek fan projects as "The Axanar Incident".
'I am Lord Garth.' I never understood why lord in pop culture is shorthand for bad guy.
American culture is inherently suspicious of anyone claiming nobility. Because America was founded as a land ruled by commoners. Rather unique at the time.
If this perspective exists outside of the US, then I can only assume it's because that mentality spread over time as the hereditary nobility class (mostly) fell away.
Shatner should have won an Oscar for ST VI.
I'd say it has more a feeling of Wild Wild West, but that's probably splitting hairs.
Batgirl as an Orion Slave Dancer (and plagiarist) is just a trip, but I am glad Lord Garth got his pubes. Overall, I'd say this was an enjoyable outing.👍
What are you talking about "Shatner never won an acting award" He won 2 Emmys for Outstanding Performance for Boston Legal.
That's not what I said.
@@sfdebrisred6555 Fair enough, no, you did say Screen Actors Guild Award. That being said, i'd argue that SAG awards are more pats on the back for being such a darn good sport, like the Oscars, than actual awards for doing great work. Whereas Emmys actually have to be earned through hard work and talent. Although that seems to be a thing for most TV awards over movie awards. A few actors have gone out there saying they are far more proud of their Emmys and BAFTA's than their Oscars.
Bravo Chuck. I assumed the list of crimes was just a bit of humorously specific randomness. I should have known better.
Hey! I am a taxi driver and I'm not criminally insane! At least I don't think I am... 😂
Ah yes, the episode that trivializes mental health... kind of, though maybe not intentionally. But safe to sat, this miracle treatment is not a universal cure all, regardless of what Gene envisioned, given a lot of what went on in later series. And... it's interesting how universal benevolence fell away to tell more stories to actually confront the problems in a more understanding way.
Too bad they didn't have this treatment or Picard's mom lmao.
Picard’s dad probably wouldn’t let her have the meds.
@@MrRobot1984 He had the same "life is too convenient" philosophy as Robert, with modern 24th century life's replicators and transporters and free effective mental healthcare...
@@MrRobot1984 I believe it was already mentioned that she refused to take her meds, so it's clear that Robert wasn't entirely out of touch with medicine. The problem with already having the medicine and not giving it to her, means that the drama shifts from "mom hungs herself because she was losing her mind and no one could do anything" to "mom kills herself because the dad was an antivaxxer moron who though that bleach is better than modern medicine".
This episode was banned in the UK for many years
Hm, I could take time to deduce which Kirk is genuine... or I could just stun both and let Dr. McCoy sort that out.
What will happen next week? Tune in!
Same Kirk time!
Same Kirk channel!
this was the first episode of Star Trek I ever watched.
Wasn't Michael Knight's evil counterpart named Garth?
I know KITT's evil counterpart was named KARR...
Yes
He had a name?! I thought it was just the moustache.
@@613harbinger316 Like an evil moustache that possessed the heroic Michael Knight, or like Knight Rider's version of the Star Trek goatee for an alternate universe Michael Knight doppelganger?
I can buy a fun crossover between Star Trek and He-Man and The Masters of the Universe.
Surprised it hasnt happened yet considering Trek has done crossovers with X-Men, Legion of Superheroes, Green Lantern, Planet of the Apes, Doctor Who, and Transformers.
Garth Musk
Bots do not approve of this much ham!
While this isn't one of my favorite episodes, there is a certain amount of pathos here. Garth is insane, but at the end, what made Garth Garth appears to be gone. It's like when people taking antidepressants or other drugs for mental illness say being on them makes them feel "not them." Plus, I always feel sorry for Marta getting blown up. And yes, the acting is frequently over the top on the part of William Shatner and Steve Ihnat.
William shatners acting when he sees rlm
hah that Axamar joke
Is this THE campiest TOS episode of them all?
I’ll raise you Spock’s Brain and the Way to Eden.
@@myriadmediamusings I'll grant you that The Way to Eden is silly, but it still feels too "straight" (I don't mean that sexually). It felt like the establishment deliberately mocking the Flower Children/Hippie generation. Old Man Roddenberry shaking his fist at the mid/late-60s youth for going too far. It's always struck me as a reactionary, judgemental episode, that painted with a very broad brush, to damn the kids what were taking Gene's 1940s/50s revolution too far. It's a statement of an episode, first and foremost, with a clear lesson to the youth to not go too far with your disobedience.
Whom Gods Destroy rather features a party of over-the-top types dominating the square Starfleet officers for no reason and messing with them, threatening their traditional authority, but it doesn't seem to have a message, other than maybe just the most basic anti-authoritarianism (even if it is for the direct benefit of a senior officer with delusions of Galactic Supremacy). LORD GARTH being such a camp villain, Yvonne Craig as a sexy young woman without fear or self-doubt, both seductive and untrustworthy, seems like it's envisioned by an establishment afraid of the wild, unconventional sexuality of the youth, and yet unable to judge them specifically, just acknowledging the chaos and trying to survive to get away from it. Very mid/late 60s, when the grown men once-radical in their youth started to feel afraid of what the latest youth were up to. I don't know if this episode was meant to be a commentary by nominally-cool grown white men being unnerved by the radical 60s youth (much like the Paul Newman film "Harper"). But it feels like it was made by people who don't HATE the youth, but still fear them, or anybody who dares upset their newly-established 60s white man order. The lack of specificity makes it feel like it allows the "villains" of this episode to have more fun, be sillier. They aren't specifically representing something. Just, pure chaos. Disorder. Instability. To me, that makes these inmates much more internal. Whoever wrote this episode, for whatever reason, these "villains" feel more timeless than the very-specific "Space Hippies" of the The Way to Eden.
William Shatner has an Emmy or two...
I think there's a fan-made 60s Batman / Star Trek TOS crossover out there on RUclips.
TOS season three was largely crap but this was one of my favorite episodes. I can't watch it without poking holes in the plot and laughing at the over the top performances.
The asylum in this episode is giving off real Hannibal Lecter vibes
classic tos
Is this where the “shoot us both” trope started?
In a universe with stun settings, it is really just the way to go.
@@dupersuper1938 especially when the alternate setting disintegrates you like a dragon ball Z villain.
Kinda snooty video.