Vintage HST Action back in 1989
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- Опубликовано: 12 сен 2024
- With nothing much to capture at the moment, I was searching through my archive material and came across this old footage of HST's working across South Wales. Still powered by the much missed Paxman Valenta engines, you see many examples. At Neath you sea the HST that was involved in a terrible crash at Ladbroke Grove a short while later, and the leading car seen heading West out of Neath was fitted with one of the unsuccessful Mirrlees MB190 engines.
The HST is a masterpiece and is still going strong after 40+ years. It's sad that after these and the Class 91s (which are also awesome) are eventually replaced, there may never be any more great British built trains on our lines.
I totally agree Ash, they've given sterling service for so many years and will be sadly missed.
I mentioned it before when you uploaded some of this video,a rare capture of 43168,Mirlees power !
Stunning work
Thanks very much for your continued support...Regards...Bob
I've always thought the Swallow livery suited the HSTs particularly well, a lot smarter than many of the liveries they've had since. I bet if someone told you 25 years ago that these sets would still be in active, everyday service in 2015 you'd think they were a lunatic. Great machines, truly worthy successors to the Deltics, et al. Cheers for uploading.
I totally agree, that Swallow Livery was their best by far....they've been on of the great success stories of the modern railway development in recent years....Regards...Bob
***** Aha! Someone dare mention the Deltics'. Still going strong with their original power units (well same type, I mean). Coming from the LMS region (Lancashire) I rather missed out on the pleasures of the A4s, Deltics and HST 125s - electrification of the western main line saw off such delights. It is only coming on to these wonderful videos that I can fully appreciate the 125s - and for me, harking back to my 'steam' childhood, the 125 seems as futuristic in its 'swallow' livery as anything since - how dare one say its old! Seriously, many thanks, Bob, you too, Bombadilian for your 'bang on' comments - regards, Bill
Thanks very much for your comprehensive and well thought out comments Bill...how refreshing.....Regards...Bob
Thanks for sharing Bob. I still love the screaming sound of the Valenta Paxman engines. Brings back many memories from my youth. They run past my mums back garden near the Cockett Tunnel, but the newer engines just don't sound as loud, which pleases my mother no end lol.
Wonderful comments Richard...Thanks very much...Bob
Great video Bob, these Valenta engines have a sound all of their own and quite unique. The trademark high pitched whine is much is evidence but the roar off the engines when powering up is also pretty impressive! Great viewing, thanks, Ken
Thanks Ken, they always had that distinctive scream, that disappeared from 2007 onwards.... they may be more efficient now, but like the first generation diesels, had a very distinctive sound....Best wishes...Bob
Fantastic watch Robert, thanks. Really enjoyed it an got some good scenic tips too! Dave
DaveClass47 Thanks very much Dave...much appreciated...Bob
What a great selection Bob, those Valenta engines were something special and its good that you captured them in service. The HST was without doubt a great success story and are still our most comfortable trains
Who's have thought Austin, when these images were captured 25 years ago, that they would still be around in 2014 and still doing such sterling work...Best wishes...Bob
Thanks for posting this. I remember as a child being fascinated by these awesome machines. Passing through King's Cross has certainly lost something when these were retired.
+Lenny Crane My pleasure Lenny, they lost so much of their character when they were re-engined in 2007/08....Bob
+Robert Masterman t
Thanks Bob. Meant to ask earlier, what was the drawback of the replacement engine? Was it just the noise or was there a genuine performance issue? I was an aircraft engineer before heading down the management trail, the old jet engines are just the same as this. A JT9D vs a Trent 500, no comparison.
The new German Built engines are more powerful, and quieter Lenny, but that distinctive scream was very much part of their character, that is missed the most. They are still performing top class duties after 40 years in service, so a wonderful concept and design....Regards...Bob
Thanks for putting this video back on. I've been looking for it but couldn't find it! Some great footage of the HST especially with the MB190 engine....
My pleasure, I decided to take off many of my older uploads when I started to use HD Cameras, if I remember correctly it was you that explained to me about the MB190 the last time it was uploaded.....Best wishes...Bob
Superb footage Bob. Not been on YT for a while so this was a refreshing video to watch.
Thanks K nice to hear from you again....Hope you have a great 2015...Best wishes...Bob
I remember HSTs being introduced and initially being excited at seeing them, then I realised that all the loco hauled trains on the London-South Wales line had gone, so you'd only see type 4 diesels on the cross-country trains ( I would wait till around 6pm at Cardiff to hopefully see a Peak on the Newcastle). Then, units took over everything. OK, so they're more efficient and cost effective for the TOCs, but IMHO they're more cramped and less comfortable than 'proper' trains. Having said that, I was walking the dog a week or so ago and a Cross-Country HST went past and it still had Valenta power units. Made me fell (almost) nostalgic.
There have been so many changes to motive power in recent years, leaving many units being without character. I'm not aware that there are any Valanta engined HST's left operational in the UK, the last ones were the Network Rail yellow HST and Grand Central's units...Many thanks....Bob
Hard to believe its 25 years ago with these HST`s Bob , that shot at Brynna she sure was moving good ...you do well with these archive vids ..nice to look back but makes us realize time flies by ...Dave
I know Dave, where has it all gone.....thanks as always for watching....Bob
Excellent video Robert, very interesting to see my favourite train as a child growing up in South Wales and still here now. I'm 25 and was born in 1990. Even at about 3-5 years old I was very taken with the HST's, and still going strong today albeit in First Great Western livery which I like a lot, but I do miss the sound and smoke of the Paxman engines..
Stuart Simmonds They've been an immensely successful design Stuart...I do miss the Valenta Power units, whilst they are more efficient nowadays, they just don't have that exciting scream...Bob
Those engines sound so nice. Even if they are irritating and extremely high pitched, it just sound really nice to listen to.
It really was in their character, those Valenta engines were wonderful to hear...Thanks for your comment.
@@robmasterman thanks. I was and never probably will be able to see a hst ever again. I did have a 1 odd moment when 2 power cars (on in the blue Pullman livery) passed me, but that’s pretty much it. Replacing a hst with an iet is like replacing a pacer with a cardboard box on rail wheels
Incredible footage of the Mirrless Blackstone MB-190. Love the engine and it's the best in my opinion. Shame about the life expansion of this experimental engine.
Thanks for uploading.
Thanks very much, it's a shame that the quality isn't better, but I felt the rare content made it worthwhile...Regards...Bob
I designed the engine control system for the power cars that had Mirrlees engines. I traveled about in them for many months. The drivers loved them as they had a higher power than the others.
@@billhall8745
What was the main reason, those engines never made it for production?
@@PaxmanValentaClass43 The engines worked well, had more power than the Paxman but access for maintenance was difficult. Even just to change the starter motor was a mammoth task due to lots of other bits needing to be removed. It was heavier than the Paxman which BR did not like. They did manage to cover a high mileage. There is a Haynes Manual for the HST125 which gives the history of all that went on during the lifetime. There is a section in it for the Mirrlees MB190. Drivers loved them due to the extra power and higher speed.
@@billhall8745 Thank you very much for the info.
I’m guessing the engines were scrapped.
A fantastic snapshot of an historic part of British railways - Thanks for posting.
Oscar Wylder Thanks Oscar, I'm glad you've enjoyed it...Bob
Thank Heavens for your archived movies, Bob. It was great to see and hear the Valenta powered HSTs again. They were a brilliant concept- British Rail certainly could produce some pretty good trains. The first one that I ever saw passed through Reading at speed whilst I was waiting for my train to Cardiff to depart, and I thought wow- what was that? I did notice in the final shots that there was more seating with tables in those days. My most recent journey in a HST was in an airline type seat, which does nothing to make a train journey enjoyable any more. Anyway, please keep the old movies coming......Mervyn
When they first came on the scene Mervyn, it was a follow on from the old Blue Pullman sets. They've provided sterling service over the years, and hopefully will continue to do so for many years to come.....the issues with the seats was well spotted, and you're quite right, there is less room in the current version....Best wishes...Bob
Love that sound. Reminds me of the Rolls-Royce RB211/Trent aeroplane jet engine spooling up on takeoff.
That's a new one Luke, thanks very much for your comment.
They seemed to be a lot quicker off the mark back then. I guess TOCs encourage drivers to step up the power more gradually these days!
I think you're right Tim, not so much prevado these days...Bob
Kinda disagree since HST125’s with the newer engines don’t take as long to clear the platforms usually.
Always good to see HST footage like this. I was on the first ever HST to Kingswear...1986?
They always had a presence back then Chis...good on you travelling on them back in 1986....Bob
*Thank you Bob for this beautiful historic video.*
Greetings
_Günter_
My pleasure Gunter, it is good to hear from you again...Best wishes...Bob
That was great Bob...just love those Valenta Engines...They had more character than the ones these Days.....Well worth watching...best wishes...Steve.
Totally agree Steve, not quite the same today...best wishes...Bob
As a very young child the 1990's I'd see these marvelous Valenta screaming HST's in their INTERCITY livery pass by and depart from my doorstep on a near daily basis and loved their screaming loud engines when I wasn't supposed to back then! How has time really flown in 25 years??
Like, many things we see daily, you don't appreciate them until they've gone...Thanks for watching....Bob
And many thanks for uploading my childhood nostalgia back again :)
These shots may be old, but they sure stir the memories. I still like the look of skilful shots at dusk or even in the dark!
Thanks Rob, your support is appreciated as always...Best wishes...Bob
The MB190 sounds very similar to an MTU but better it’s shame they didn’t stick with that Engine also love the Paxman Valenta sounds
A real fan...Thanks very much for your comments.
Robert Masterman No problem
I designed the engine control system for the power cars that had the MB190 engines. I think BR only did it to put pressure on Paxmann to sort out their engine problems
@@billhall8745 It sounds higher revving than a Class 60 but still with the distinctive HST sound from the auxilliaries e.g. the turbo / traction motors etc.
Don't see many these days, good video. Matt
Since being re-engined in 2007, they've lost a great deal of their character Matt.....thanks again...Bob
Well Bob, who'd have thought after all these years the HSTs would still be the mainstay of some of our frontline services. And the Valentas certainly had a unique sound, I almost miss them! Mind you, they weren't always appreciated when going past my house at 5 in the morning. Keith
I know Keith, time flies doesn't it. I must say that they sounded much better then than they do now, even at the bottom of the garden...Regards...Bob
Great Archive footage there Bob, Those Valentas still give me the goose bumps every time I here them. Pity they have all gone now.I have a video posted up somewhere featuring one of the last HST,s fitted with these engines it was filmed at Northallerton with a Buffer set belonging to Grand Central, I believe they have all been re- engined with MTU,s now, still sound nice but not as good...............John
Thanks John, these familiar sounds are missed by many...whilst the new engines fitted from 2007 onwards may be quieter and more efficient, they don't have the same character....Best wishes...Bob
I miss the sound of a Valenta throttling up, and the Swallow livery too for that matter! Just goes to show how much sound plays in the appeal of a loco, 43s just aren't the same anymore.
They certainly aren't ...thanks for watching...Bob
Those Mark3 coaches were marvellous. Even Irish Rail bought a fleet of these coaches in 1984 with electric doors instead of slam doors and were taken out of service in 2009 after been replaced by the brand new 22000 Class Intercity Railcars (which are awful) and were scrapped in 2014. At least the original 1975 coaches are still around in Britain but sadly started going to the scrapyards in 2020.
Indeed Philip, unfortunately although these Mark3 HST coaches have provided a great service over the last 40 years, unfortunately rust has become a real problem, resulting in so many being withdrawn and scrapped this year.
@@robmasterman Can't expect any great trains to last forever. The A Stock were the best trains ever on London Underground which served for 51 years from 1961 to 2012.
Back in the days of British Rail when they did four power cars with Mirrlees MB190 engines I designed the engine control system. I traveled about on them for quite some time. I wish that I had taken some video although I can't remember if I had my portable Technicolor video recorder or if I was still using 8mm film back then.
What a wonderful thing to have been involved with Bill, and thanks for sharing your experiences with me.
@@robmasterman The drivers loved the Mirrlees engine with the higher power. There was a time when I was in the trailing power car with an inspector. The train got up to 143mph. The inspector was not happy about it and went to see the driver. I don't know what the outcome of that was. When I was given the spec to design the engine control system there was no mention of a speed limiter so when a Power car with a Mirrlees engine was in use, the overspeed prevention was not present.
@@billhall8745 Sounds like the cause of the problem with these engines.
That lovely scream I do miss, Bob! Lovely shots of it in one of my favourite liveries it carried, Intercity Swallow. Wonder what happened at Neath where it pulled away then stopped again.....
Thanks Justin, the train was stopped for late passengers, something that wouldn't happen today...Bob
the mirlees sounded a bit like an mtu. got any more videos of that one?
+Adam Bell Unfortunately not Adam...at least not as far as I know...Bob
+Robert Masterman such a shame, sounded quite good that engine shame they didnt adopt these more
I would like to know more abut what happened to the Mirlees sets. I designed the engine governor/control system. I traveled about on the four of them for quite some time when they first went into service but lost touch with them later.
Some good stuff there. Poignant that the first shot showed 43011, which was lost in the southall crash. Have you seen that just one power car has been re engined with a valenta? Prototype 43000, or 41001 is up and running, and sounds glorious!
Thanks very much John, I've seen uploads of the HST prototype, and it both looks and sounds superb...they've done an excellent job with it...Bob
A vintage Robert Masterpiece, love these vintage videos. Regards John
That's kind of you to say so John....regards....Bob
good old video Bob,i remember them screaming past my mom and dads house on a week end in Tenby may be they still do? i think they came from London , I always wanted to ride lol, I like the shot of it pulling the bank hill
Thanks David, they still run from London to Pembroke Dock through Tenby on Summer Saturdays....Bob
Some classic images to enjoy here Bob. So important to have such records of one of the best British progressive designs to come along.
They've been an extremely successful design Mike, and still going strong, although their future is somewhat less certain, with the growth of electrification.....Bob
Some excellent shots there Bob,do you play a VHS tape and record to a DVD then transfer to the computer? Regards Chris.
This footage was captured on Hi8 tape Chris, transferred to DVD, then brought into Corel for further processing before uploading to RUclips....hence the loss of picture quality....Bob
Robert Masterman It's very good Bob.
Despite all the comments, I have to say I like seeing all the different liveries today. But at least the coaches weren't blue/grey. That was the worst ever livery! It seems these aging units can still give a good account of themselves, which is good for the railway. Looking back at your old footage I am glad the stations have improved. The whole system seems to be cared for now.
Thanks Keith, twenty five years ago things were very different from now, and things are generally much the better for the improvements made since then....Regards...Bob
any footage of the mirlees equipt hsts anywhere ? wondering if the leading powercar in one of the clips was a mirlees engine definately wasn't a paxman
One of the clips in this video, I believe the one at Neath heading West was identified as being a Mirrless Blackstone MB-190......Regards....Bob
I designed the engine control system for the Mirrlees MB190 power cars. I traveled about on them for quite some time but I never thought to do some video.
when i hear a valenta, i scream almost as loud as one XD
Once heard, they were never forgotten...the HST's were never the same after 2007, when their engines were changed.
@@robmasterman spitting facts
Gosh they were noisy weren't they.
Would you thought 25 years ago that they'd not only still be in service on the Western Region for the foreseeable future, but they'll be starting a whole new area of operation in Scotland in a few years time.
Wasn't sure if I'd still be around, let alone the mighty HST's Andrei...truly magnificent machines for sure....Best wishes....Bob
U been doin this a while then :)
Started photography in 1962 Matthew :o)....Bob
Blimey :O
I could watch and listen to these machines all day. Love the Swallow livery and the Exec liveried power cars. I want a swallow HST for my 00 gauge layout (check out my channel - my November Update 2 features my Blue/Grey HST with real sound). Some great camera work too. I've subbd to you channel to see more from your archives. Please feel free to comment and sub to my channel if you wish.
Kind regards
Dave
Thanks Dave, I'm delighted you've enjoyed it...I will check out your Channel tomorrow....Regards...Bob
brilliant trains for all these years and we are losing them to scots rail
I know, and they're looking forward to seeing them up there, apparently, Jeremy Hoskins is going to acquire a few sets for excursions John.
we will miss the hst's when they are gone they have done great for so many years in the UK the railway won't be the same without them
It's total madness John, but that's progress!.