I am a registered psychologist who works with trauma. Thanks for the work you two are doing! I appreciate your positivity. I also think I need you to say that abuse is never okay a bit more here. Less giving the benefit of the doubt and more advocacy for children. Also, when you cover topics like abuse, I think you may want to add a comment like, “If you have experienced abuse, here is a hotline where you can access support.” I hope this helps!
Please remember, though, that some children had been removed by warren j from their birth parents prior to the raid. It was already a very bad situation.
When Jeffs had the young children taken from their mothers in the middle of the night and sent to Texas that was way worst than them being taken by authorities yet it was looked at as them being honored for getting to go to Zion.Which is worst?
In the keep sweet documentary they said that the records located explicitly detailed sexual interactions with warren and young girls sometimes with other wives present. He even asked for a plastic covering to be put on the bed in order to “protect the mattress from what goes on there”. My guess is the recording had more than what was played to protect the dignity of the 12 year old.
I remember reading when this was happening that the reason they ended up separating the kids from their parents was because the parents were told not to cooperate with law enforcement and refused to say which kids belonged to which parents. This was partially because they didn’t want the authorities to know which kids belonged to underage mothers. Eventually the parents were persuaded to cooperate and the children were united with their parents.
I don’t comment much on You Tube but I want to say that my husband and I get so excited when we see you have a new video out. I love your hearts for each other and for people in general. You are both just delightful. Blessings to you and your family 😊
Thank you both for presenting your perspectives on what you heard in the recording. It's so often the case when you're dealing with communities and something that sounds obviously one way to someone on the outside can come across completely differently to someone who knows the context, any "secret language" or inside references, etc. And it can go both ways - something that sounds really suspicious from the outside can sound normal from an inside perspective, but also something that seems benign from the outside can sound suspicious to someone familiar with hidden meanings. So your perspective is very valuable and interesting.
How strange to have a prison named Purgatory! Thanks so much for doing these great videos. After watching the series I was very interested to see your take on the recording. I was very uncomfortable with the idea of listening to that particular crime. How quickly after moving out did you determine Warren was guilty. What was that realisation like?
I just finished reading Rachel Jeff’s book and she talks about how Warren himself took children of all ages away from mothers. He took her away from her children multiple time’s, once when she had an infant. The mothers never knew how long it would be or if they would ever be reunited and many times they were not.
My cousin was a deputy prison warden and since he was in the state system first he was sent to St George then to TX. That was because the federal government wanted people with no historical ties to the LDS church in positions to make clear decisions. Their feeling was that even if the person wasn’t LDS, the fact they grew up surrounded by people who were would make them more sympathetic to his plight. So my Long Island raised, Republican, marine veteran was sent out to be the voice of reason.
I recently found your channel, I’m on a binge trying to start from the beginning, loving the story’s and I love Melissa’s questions , thank you for sharing Sam. Love from 🏴
I’ve studied so much about the LDS and FLDS. I love getting more insight on everything that happened. I love how respectful you two are. 😊 I enjoy your videos
The alter-like bed…..too awful to imagine with the children. I don’t believe the rest of the recording could or should be released. To hear the young girls actual rape would of been pornographic in nature. Poor baby girl. Thank you for your insight Sam and Melissa.
@@justindakota2968 Also equally horrendous is all the anti-abortion virtue-signalers who have never adopted and vote against programs that provide for womens healthcare and or want to do away with any tax funded programs that help unwanted kids an orphans. It seems that life is only an issue for these people when it's a few cells but as soon as they're born the self-righteous pretend they don't exist and say.. not my tax dollars! Might want to let that sink in.
Not sure if someone has already commented this, so I apologize for any redundancy. But there is more to that tape. Warren’s daughter, Rachel, was featured on “Escaping Polygamy,” and they got a lot more into those details. And even that mini-doc didn’t feature the whole thing. It’s repulsive and is definitely not something that could be confused.
That is good to know! We are going to start reviewing more documentaries that will hopefully give more insight into that tape. It seemed like there had to have been more in order for a conviction, it was just so odd that they didn't share more of it in this documentary.
There is more of the tape in the documentary Prophet's Prey and Rebecca Musser discusses it in detail in her book "The Witness Wore Red." She was working with the police and listened to the tape before the trial.
@@GrowingUpinPolygamy for the conviction they also had the DNA Evidence because he had a child with an underaged girl. The recording was not the only evidence.
I don’t know if it makes sense to say that people at YFZ didn’t know that Warren was marrying underage girls. I would believe it about those in Short Creek because they were mostly in the dark, but most of the people who were sent to YFZ were either wives and family of Warren, or wives and family of Merril Jessop and Wendell Nielsen and other elite bishops (Allen Keate, Michael Emack, etc) because all of these men either married underage girls themselves, were the fathers of these underage girls, or both.
Love your channel. I grew up in the Seventh-day Adventist (SDA) church. A fundamentalist offshoot from this church was the “Branch Davidian” cult in Waco, TX. The full name was “Branch Davidian Seventh-day Adventists”. When the Waco siege first started and federal agents were killed by followers of David Koresh, the national news media was using this full name. The mainline SDA church had their attorneys contact the media and demand they stop using the full name and they quickly became just the “Branch Davidians” in the news. Having grown up SDA myself. I was telling anyone that would listen, “The government is going about this the wrong way! They are fulfilling Koresh’s prophecy to his followers and confirming and strengthening their belief in him!” Interestingly for me, growing up in the mainline SDA, we were taught that the government would someday come after us too, because of our unique doctrines, namely sabbath keeping (strict sabbath observance from sunset Friday evening to sunset Saturday evening, the Jewish Sabbath). Even though I had left the mainline SDA church several years before Waco, I remember thinking, is the government going after the Branch Davidian SDA first and the mainline SDA church will be next? I quickly dismissed this because I no longer believed in the SDA church, but it was my initial, gut reaction after being raised SDA.
I thought that was wrong too, that all the children were ripped away. The one mom told her son not to be separated from his sister. I've had a few priesthood blessings, myself, so I understand that. By the way, my right ear is doing much better, it might just still have some ear wax in it, but the ringing is much better. Christians call the Holy Ghost, the Holy Spirit, it's the same thing. I was able to become Christian after leaving Mormonism, took a while, but I like the community.
Sure it was horrible to have all of the children taken away from the mothers on the ranch, but the show made it seem like many of the children were not with their biological mothers there. The church had already taken the children away from their mothers.
yes one bio mom was in another state and they brought her to ranch so she could claim her children back. they told her to lie and say she was there the whole time. her kids didn't even know who she was!!
I'm very curious if there is a bed at the top of every LDS temple? I'm from Kansas City and we have a LDS temple near my parents house and an RLDS temple in Independence.
No, there is not. Every temple has a baptistry, endowment rooms, celestial room, sealing rooms, dressing rooms and restrooms. Some also have cafeterias and assembly rooms. The Salt Lake City temple has additional meeting rooms for the quorum of the twelve apostles to meet together. There are 3D models of the salt lake temple and the Washington DC temple that you can google pictures of.
Naomi needs extensive reprogramming. She is a very sad and pathetic person who still can’t see the evil she helped perpetuate. Not sure why she was never arrested and put on trial for aiding and abetting.
Still tears me up thinking about the moms and their kids being torn away from each other like they were. I remember the headlines when it all went down too.
That is what we have heard. We will be reacting to the Netflix doc that has more of the recording as well as possibly doing a reaction to the full recording if we can find it.
It started out sounding, like a "normal" blessing, but as the recording progresses Jeffs' breathing becomes very heavy as he continues to speak. As the blessing continues his speaking becomes very breathy, and he talks about how the women should be excited and exciting to their husband and about the "object' that the women participating are 'handling". I believe that's why it gives off a very explicit vibe, and sounds as if he's engaged in more than just speaking his blessings over them.. I could be wrong, that's just my opinion.
Thank you for sharing your thoughts, my heart fell when I watched the show and the police went into their temple. I was LDS and know how sacred the temple is. I understand that is how they got the records that helped put Warren away but seeing how it effected the people who had no idea what was going on. Thank you again
They not only "went in", they busted open the heavy door with a ram rod, and then dynamited the vault to get to the secret records. After all, they felt they had enough probable cause to make it a crime scene, and that is the very reason they were able to seize ownership of the entire town several years later, and evict all the residents.
I also wanted to add, I want to respect the choice of my two LDS friends who are still in the church. The one interestingly or enough is still not married, don't know why. The other is happily married with 4 kids, one amazingly is in high school. It's like where has the time gone? Melissa, I really want to crimp my hair like yours.
The girl that called...was there no child abuse still going on? Do they give priesthood blessings to girls??? Never heard of that. Maybe Naomi didn't know the full extent of what went on?
I was only able to watch the first episode of this series, so am looking forward to the one on Netflix. Hoping it is good and representative of the facts and what it was really like. Looking forward to both your thoughts about it as well. 😊
Thank you for sharing your experience. Mike King, Profiling Evil, was on the government end and he did a follow-up with one of the remaining "leaders". It was very sad to see the homes, school, and church sitting in ruins. All the hard work destroyed.
This is probably the most random comment you’ll ever get lol however? It’s a shame Warren decided to preach insanity. He has such a calming/intoxicating voice and way of speaking. He would’ve killed it doing guided sleep meditations on RUclips. 🤷🏻♀️😅🤣
It's interesting you say that because he has the complete opposite effect on me! The sound of his voice makes me feel like something awful is about to happen any minute now!
Just finished watching Elisa Wall on Mormon Stories. She said they did find the young girl in the Texas compound. Is she mistaken or did I mishear her? Anyway, I really enjoy your commentary. Very insightful and informative.
When I heard the audio in this I didn’t hear much of it expect it was weird but I read Rachel’s Jeff’s book and watched her episode of escaping polygamy and the abuse he did to her so he’s where he should be. I struggle with Naomi cause I don’t understand why she wasn’t charged but I also feel she was a victim and under a spell
Great videos! I watched like 4 tonight haha what did you think of the Netflix documentary? Was that an accurate depiction? Or would you say there were things that weren’t accurately represented or missing?
Thanks for sharing! I’m thinking about Joseph Smith married Kimball as 14 years old. I never knew about it till found out few years ago. Warren Jeff and Joseph Smith similar but many members of LDS confused 😕. But I have seen the polygamist came my home town when I grew up and learned about the mainstream LDS Denied about this historical. Thanks again :)
I am sure that blessing sounded pretty normal but I have no doubt we could have been doing awful things at the same time... definitely not a huge stretch to think of the sick things he was capable of & changing the rules to suit his desires.
Hi Sam & Melissa, I was watching a documentary called "Sons of Perdition" or something like that and was wondering if Sam was one of the young men in that documentary? One of the young men resembles him and was just curious. Thank you for letting the world into your lives. I have learned a lot from you both.
Growing up in a Christian church (which I am no longer a part of - or any church) I always found it creepy how involved ANY church gets into peoples’ sexuality: from masturbation to sexual orientation to marriage. Even though we didn’t have priesthood “blessings” given in my childhood church, I just think it is very inappropriate for any clergy to be all up in peoples’ private business. It’s always a way to control a congregation because all people are sexual and it’s easy to infuse a person with guilt about natural human urges from a very young age. So I think that people are responding to WJ’s “blessing” as creepy because they are responding to the fact that he is a predator. They are responding to the fact that he was thinking about grooming his targets with each blessing bestowed upon his victims. If your instincts haven’t been clouded by your own indoctrination of church (pick any denomination), or from having been targeted and groomed by a sexual predator then you will much more quickly recognize a predator. If your instincts have been dulled with brainwashing and any and all versions of “keep sweet” you will likely perceive the predator like a wolf in sheep’s clothing. Make no mistake, the boys raised in this are victims as well. If not of sexual assault, they were certainly being controlled by one man for his own sick purposes. I am a former member of the Lutheran church and I was also a sex crime investigator for many years here in Canada. This is just my observation after many years of studying cults and religions as well as interviewing many predators.
Have you guys watched Prophet’s Prey, it’s a documentary about Warren Jeffs and Flds. I think that would be a good one. Also Under the Banner of Heaven on Hulu. It’s dramatized version of the story based on the book.
I agree. Under the Banner of Heaven is super intense. I have to approach every episode like I am about to watch a horror movie. Ugh. My heart is racing just thinking about it.
There must have been evidence that he did have sexual relations with underaged girls by the babies and the fact that their DNA would show he was the father, right?
Apocalyptic cults with a leader/prophet that predicts the government will come after them are an interesting study. Whether it is Warren Jeffs, David Koresh, Jim Jones, etc.
I recently found your channel and am binging your videos and I just love you guys!! ❤ I have no personal experience with the FLDS or Mormonism and I just know what I’ve learned from RUclipsrs like you 😊 and plenty of documentaries I’ve watched but I have to say though, that if that is what a “typical priesthood blessing” sounds like, I am even more appreciative that I have never experienced that. That recording is very cringe and the fact that he mentions the bed and the bed isn’t a normal blessing thing I think shows it probably wasn’t a normal blessing you are used to. Plus, I think Warren Jeffs is very cunning and he knew he’s being recorded (only by audio) so he knew exactly what to say and how to word it to cause doubt if needed. Since there is DNA proof that he fathered children with underage girls I think that’s enough evidence that he didn’t have the best intentions with those “blessings”….you guys are awesome! Keep doing what you’re doing!! I’ve learned a lot about FLDS and Mormonism, and you have provided me a different and more caring point of view towards the people in those groups. 😊
I thought the same thing with the recording when I heard it in Keep Sweet on Netflix! It definitely felt…weird…but initially it just sounded like a blessing. I will add that in the Keep Sweet documentary they did include the sounds of Warren moaning which made me believe it was sexual. But after the second episodes reaction and you guys talking about how he was acting kinda deranged, I wonder if it was sexual at all or just more of the weird behavior. He definitely did a lot of messed up stuff and deserves every single day he spends on prison. I have to believe there was stronger evidence for the convictions, solely for concern of the legal system coming back in twenty years to question the conviction.
Ugh, I had an entire reply typed that got deleted for some reason! But yeah, the documentaries that have used the clip of the audio only play segments from either Warren talking at the beginning or the one or two times Merrianne speaks. The full tape is around 20 minutes long. If you look up ‘scribd merrianne jessop’ you can find the audio transcript of it and I think that makes it more clear that it’s more than just a blessing. There’s like two or three times where it’s just several minutes of him breathing heavily, or when he tells Loretta, another one of his underage wives and Merrianne and Naomie’s niece, to distract Merrianne. I definitely think the full audio was probably a lot more damning than what the documentaries play.
Yes the Netflix series shows there was something very strange going on. Two of the former FLDS women are convinced it was a rape. Why else was there a bed there?
I agree that there would have had to be more to it than what was shared on this specific documentary. We may look up the full recording and do a reaction to that, and I know that the Netflix documentary also has some of it shared, which we will be reacting to next week.
Maybe the priesthood blessing with his child bride sounded ***ual is because everything Warren Jeffs says just sounds slimey and makes your skin crawl.
Most people when they leave one church or realign choose something simular. It may not make since to most. But people usually try to stay close to what seems familiar to you. Not me but most people do
Melissa - You are totally right and thanks for the compliment. I have had a super sore throat this week due to allergies and it has made my voice super low and raspy. Glad to hear it only improved the sound haha ;)
Good point that we didn't cover in our video. That may deserve it's own video. Honestly, it's not surprising he did whatever he wanted in the name of "blending in". It is just so sad that his entire community was being so oppressed in order to be "worthy" of him, not knowing the awful things he was doing.
While I agree that the bits of recording we heard in the documentary leave room for doubt on whether it was a sexual encounter at that moment - I would hazard a guess we did not hear the entire recording. They said multiple jury members were brought to tears at the end of the recording, and those snips were not something I think most people would cry about. Additionally, the recording felt halting to me, like they weren’t playing it in its entirety but just bits here and there. I really have strong doubts on if Naomie has moved on from Warren. Her smiling talking about him and some of the things they did…the way she phrased things….maintaining his innocence…I don’t know. I think she enjoyed her position of power and if Warren got out would take it back in a heartbeat.
You can reach out to us by email at growingupinpolygamy@gmail.com or by our PO box that is listed at the bottom of our video descriptions. =) We'd love to hear from you! =)
i was wondering if they didnt play the whole recording on the documentary. because im not familiar with those blessings at all and it didnt seem to prove any sort of sexual things. so im wondering if there was more in the video that we didnt see
Thanks for another great video! Love the content. Great to see a true POV. Can someone direct me to a video where Sam and Melissa talk about what their current religious beliefs are? Are the LDS or?
I thought Sam left the LDTS before Warren Jeffs started really making changes. But in this video he said he was still very much involved in the LDTS community. Or did I misunderstand? I thought he left before Warren Jeffs was arrested
You contend that there were many innocent parents who were separated from their children. That even young children were removed when the worry was underage marriages. And that children and wives had names that they went by that conflicted with their legal names. But in retrospect it seems reasonable that all of the children should have been removed from the "ranch" since even adults within the ranch had no knowledge of their situation or their rights. They may have been told that their marriages were "legal" and that they had no rights to their own autonomy. And that innocent parents may eventually give their underage children over to an illegal underage marriage. It seems reasonable to consider the "ranch" as one home since the families were assigned to abodes and did not have ownership or even rented their dwellings, everything was controlled by the leader, Warren Jeffs, including their right to stay on the ranch and their autonomy over their children.
This documentary was so hard to watch. I cannot stop thinking about the abuse the little girls suffered. The horrific violations and to be told this is all for your own good, to be able to go to heaven. I am so angry at that psychopath!!
I think those who leave feel betrayed by Warren...I think that switching to LDS made members feel like they would be able to keep the purity they would get them into heaven...
This is just something I've always wondered about. Have y'all seen any pictures of the temple that was built in Texas? Sam, seeing as you've been through the LDS temple, did you notice any similarities or differences? Also I remember in a video I listened to recently hearing you say the FLDS doesn't do any of the temple stuff because they believe they weren't considered worthy since they didn't have a temple. But I had heard in a documentary a while back that they had something called an endowment house where they would do the temple ceremonies until the temple was built. I'm assuming I have something scrambled but do you have any insight?
Thank u guys for everything u guys have said and done to make people realize that there is weirdos out here and these girls didn't even have a chance at life yet or forever for the ones that don't exscape warren needs to rott in hell for the things he has done to these women and kids and for the mom's to not do nothing is crasy
I might have remembered the recordings part wrong, but I thought there a fair chunk of silence at one point and then was lots of heavy breathing 🤔 if so, that’s probably why people think it was sexual. Again. I may be remembering another documentary about this and just be remembering this wrong 😑
I just want to reply to your comments, and respectfully I hope, but to maybe give an outsider’s point of view. I know you said you don’t justify Warren Jeffs’ actions, but to me that’s what it sounded like, saying what you heard sounded like a blessing and there was nothing sexual, it sounded to me like you were defending Jeffs. So it’s my belief that there was a lot more to the audio. I read that some of the jurors were really traumatized by what they heard and I would assume that they aren’t going to put that kind of content in full in any TV show or documentary. But secondly, Jeffs is a pedophile, he doesn’t need to talk sexually in order to abuse a child. Many pedophiles don’t. Often the child is thanked, asked how they feel, and made to think it’s a good thing. All things Warren Jeffs did. I’m not sure what you were hoping to hear in order for you to believe the evidence. Warren Jeffs is not a good man. He hid behind religion in order to carry out his evil fantasies without question. He doesn’t believe in God. He used fear to control. I’ve watched a lot of your shows, and I find them informative, but on this occasion I was surprised by what I felt was a defense of Jeffs and a downplaying of the abuse of children.
I've never really thought about it much but the similarities between trump & Warren Jeff's is very similar their mindset & "following" & wanting to be the total leader. & not caring about the evidence that's shown they're guilty but their followers won't believe it
I get that question all the time how are you feeling? But it's usually after a service like a massage, blessing, drugs in er, and many more. I do agree that without any prior knowledge about LDS and F LDS they kind of fumbled all of this. If you don't investigate ask questions look into history some things may look completely different than others and if you can't tell those apart you're going to make a spaghetti traffic jam a very very big mistake that will impact all of those who were affected.
I have no personal experience in LDS and FLDS. From having an interest in human behaviour and listening to Mormon Stories and Jordan & Makay: I thought the same myself: it mostly sounded like a blessing. The bright white in the LDS temples and FLDS Zion Temple looks suspicious. I have only watched the Netflix documentary which had the same recording. Great feedback 👍
We are going to be reacting to the Netflix documentary next week, but it's interesting that it had the same recording and sounded the same there as well. The temples are white in order to appear "clean and pure" so that the Lord and his Spirit can preside there. Very symbolic, so I can see why that would seem odd. Thank you so much for watching!
I watch the three girls that have a show on Sundays on how to help these girls escape and I feel sorry for some of these girls I just want to hold them and let them know it ok I would Love to meet the three girls or Rachelle Jeff's I would love to meet her
I am a registered psychologist who works with trauma. Thanks for the work you two are doing!
I appreciate your positivity. I also think I need you to say that abuse is never okay a bit more here. Less giving the benefit of the doubt and more advocacy for children.
Also, when you cover topics like abuse, I think you may want to add a comment like, “If you have experienced abuse, here is a hotline where you can access support.”
I hope this helps!
Please remember, though, that some children had been removed by warren j from their birth parents prior to the raid. It was already a very bad situation.
When Jeffs had the young children taken from their mothers in the middle of the night and sent to Texas that was way worst than them being taken by authorities yet it was looked at as them being honored for getting to go to Zion.Which is worst?
In the keep sweet documentary they said that the records located explicitly detailed sexual interactions with warren and young girls sometimes with other wives present. He even asked for a plastic covering to be put on the bed in order to “protect the mattress from what goes on there”. My guess is the recording had more than what was played to protect the dignity of the 12 year old.
They do.
I agree !
I remember reading when this was happening that the reason they ended up separating the kids from their parents was because the parents were told not to cooperate with law enforcement and refused to say which kids belonged to which parents. This was partially because they didn’t want the authorities to know which kids belonged to underage mothers. Eventually the parents were persuaded to cooperate and the children were united with their parents.
I don’t comment much on You Tube but I want to say that my husband and I get so excited when we see you have a new video out. I love your hearts for each other and for people in general. You are both just delightful. Blessings to you and your family 😊
Thank you so much!
Thank you both for presenting your perspectives on what you heard in the recording. It's so often the case when you're dealing with communities and something that sounds obviously one way to someone on the outside can come across completely differently to someone who knows the context, any "secret language" or inside references, etc. And it can go both ways - something that sounds really suspicious from the outside can sound normal from an inside perspective, but also something that seems benign from the outside can sound suspicious to someone familiar with hidden meanings. So your perspective is very valuable and interesting.
How strange to have a prison named Purgatory! Thanks so much for doing these great videos. After watching the series I was very interested to see your take on the recording. I was very uncomfortable with the idea of listening to that particular crime. How quickly after moving out did you determine Warren was guilty. What was that realisation like?
I just finished reading Rachel Jeff’s book and she talks about how Warren himself took children of all ages away from mothers. He took her away from her children multiple time’s, once when she had an infant. The mothers never knew how long it would be or if they would ever be reunited and many times they were not.
My cousin was a deputy prison warden and since he was in the state system first he was sent to St George then to TX. That was because the federal government wanted people with no historical ties to the LDS church in positions to make clear decisions. Their feeling was that even if the person wasn’t LDS, the fact they grew up surrounded by people who were would make them more sympathetic to his plight. So my Long Island raised, Republican, marine veteran was sent out to be the voice of reason.
I recently found your channel, I’m on a binge trying to start from the beginning, loving the story’s and I love Melissa’s questions , thank you for sharing Sam. Love from 🏴
Welcome! Glad you found us! And thank you!
If this was only a "blessing" what was the need for the bed and "wifes" holding the girl down?
Exactly!
I’ve studied so much about the LDS and FLDS. I love getting more insight on everything that happened. I love how respectful you two are.
😊 I enjoy your videos
The alter-like bed…..too awful to imagine with the children. I don’t believe the rest of the recording could or should be released. To hear the young girls actual rape would of been pornographic in nature. Poor baby girl. Thank you for your insight Sam and Melissa.
Also abortion in this country is horrendous. So many crimes against humanity.
@@justindakota2968 Also equally horrendous is all the anti-abortion virtue-signalers who have never adopted and vote against programs that provide for womens healthcare and or want to do away with any tax funded programs that help unwanted kids an orphans. It seems that life is only an issue for these people when it's a few cells but as soon as they're born the self-righteous pretend they don't exist and say.. not my tax dollars! Might want to let that sink in.
So so awful. I am so sad for those little girls
Not sure if someone has already commented this, so I apologize for any redundancy. But there is more to that tape. Warren’s daughter, Rachel, was featured on “Escaping Polygamy,” and they got a lot more into those details. And even that mini-doc didn’t feature the whole thing. It’s repulsive and is definitely not something that could be confused.
That is good to know! We are going to start reviewing more documentaries that will hopefully give more insight into that tape. It seemed like there had to have been more in order for a conviction, it was just so odd that they didn't share more of it in this documentary.
There is more of the tape in the documentary Prophet's Prey and Rebecca Musser discusses it in detail in her book "The Witness Wore Red." She was working with the police and listened to the tape before the trial.
@@GrowingUpinPolygamy Maybe out of respect for the young girl, and could be that because legally she was so young that it could not be fully shared...
@@auntkissy5082 I recall reading that it was that, plus the fact that we as the audience can never un-hear it once it’s been heard. It’s disturbing.
@@GrowingUpinPolygamy for the conviction they also had the DNA Evidence because he had a child with an underaged girl. The recording was not the only evidence.
I don’t know if it makes sense to say that people at YFZ didn’t know that Warren was marrying underage girls. I would believe it about those in Short Creek because they were mostly in the dark, but most of the people who were sent to YFZ were either wives and family of Warren, or wives and family of Merril Jessop and Wendell Nielsen and other elite bishops (Allen Keate, Michael Emack, etc) because all of these men either married underage girls themselves, were the fathers of these underage girls, or both.
Love your channel. I grew up in the Seventh-day Adventist (SDA) church. A fundamentalist offshoot from this church was the “Branch Davidian” cult in Waco, TX. The full name was “Branch Davidian Seventh-day Adventists”. When the Waco siege first started and federal agents were killed by followers of David Koresh, the national news media was using this full name. The mainline SDA church had their attorneys contact the media and demand they stop using the full name and they quickly became just the “Branch Davidians” in the news.
Having grown up SDA myself. I was telling anyone that would listen, “The government is going about this the wrong way! They are fulfilling Koresh’s prophecy to his followers and confirming and strengthening their belief in him!”
Interestingly for me, growing up in the mainline SDA, we were taught that the government would someday come after us too, because of our unique doctrines, namely sabbath keeping (strict sabbath observance from sunset Friday evening to sunset Saturday evening, the Jewish Sabbath).
Even though I had left the mainline SDA church several years before Waco, I remember thinking, is the government going after the Branch Davidian SDA first and the mainline SDA church will be next? I quickly dismissed this because I no longer believed in the SDA church, but it was my initial, gut reaction after being raised SDA.
I thought that was wrong too, that all the children were ripped away. The one mom told her son not to be separated from his sister. I've had a few priesthood blessings, myself, so I understand that. By the way, my right ear is doing much better, it might just still have some ear wax in it, but the ringing is much better. Christians call the Holy Ghost, the Holy Spirit, it's the same thing. I was able to become Christian after leaving Mormonism, took a while, but I like the community.
Sure it was horrible to have all of the children taken away from the mothers on the ranch, but the show made it seem like many of the children were not with their biological mothers there. The church had already taken the children away from their mothers.
Thank you so much!!!
yes one bio mom was in another state and they brought her to ranch so she could claim her children back. they told her to lie and say she was there the whole time. her kids didn't even know who she was!!
Yes. I so agree!
I'm very curious if there is a bed at the top of every LDS temple? I'm from Kansas City and we have a LDS temple near my parents house and an RLDS temple in Independence.
No, there is not. Every temple has a baptistry, endowment rooms, celestial room, sealing rooms, dressing rooms and restrooms. Some also have cafeterias and assembly rooms. The Salt Lake City temple has additional meeting rooms for the quorum of the twelve apostles to meet together. There are 3D models of the salt lake temple and the Washington DC temple that you can google pictures of.
Naomi needs extensive reprogramming. She is a very sad and pathetic person who still can’t see the evil she helped perpetuate. Not sure why she was never arrested and put on trial for aiding and abetting.
I was hoping you would do a review of Keep Sweet.
Still tears me up thinking about the moms and their kids being torn away from each other like they were. I remember the headlines when it all went down too.
I agree, but the irony is, FLDS tore apart families constantly within the community.
@@NancyCronk and they couldn't be sure they were even being taken to "Zion" they could have been taken anywhere!
There’s lots of heavy breathing and grunting in the full recording… it certainly doesn’t sound like a “normal” priesthood blessing.
Yep, go watch the Netflix doc and see what y’all think
That is what we have heard. We will be reacting to the Netflix doc that has more of the recording as well as possibly doing a reaction to the full recording if we can find it.
It started out sounding, like a "normal" blessing, but as the recording progresses Jeffs' breathing becomes very heavy as he continues to speak. As the blessing continues his speaking becomes very breathy, and he talks about how the women should be excited and exciting to their husband and about the "object' that the women participating are 'handling". I believe that's why it gives off a very explicit vibe, and sounds as if he's engaged in more than just speaking his blessings over them.. I could be wrong, that's just my opinion.
Thank you for sharing your thoughts, my heart fell when I watched the show and the police went into their temple. I was LDS and know how sacred the temple is. I understand that is how they got the records that helped put Warren away but seeing how it effected the people who had no idea what was going on. Thank you again
They not only "went in", they busted open the heavy door with a ram rod, and then dynamited the vault to get to the secret records. After all, they felt they had enough probable cause to make it a crime scene, and that is the very reason they were able to seize ownership of the entire town several years later, and evict all the residents.
yes horrible. but in fairness they did those things because the people wouldn't unlock the doors
I think Jeffs activities already desecrated it but I did feel bad for the families who watched their treasured temple be entered by outsiders.
@@katherineadamson3512
Correct. There is no treasure in desecration.
Thanks for sharing this with us. Congratulations on the 20K!
Huh? Okay, you're talking subscribers, not dollars.
I also wanted to add, I want to respect the choice of my two LDS friends who are still in the church. The one interestingly or enough is still not married, don't know why. The other is happily married with 4 kids, one amazingly is in high school. It's like where has the time gone? Melissa, I really want to crimp my hair like yours.
The girl that called...was there no child abuse still going on? Do they give priesthood blessings to girls??? Never heard of that. Maybe Naomi didn't know the full extent of what went on?
I was only able to watch the first episode of this series, so am looking forward to the one on Netflix. Hoping it is good and representative of the facts and what it was really like. Looking forward to both your thoughts about it as well. 😊
Thank you for sharing your experience. Mike King, Profiling Evil, was on the government end and he did a follow-up with one of the remaining "leaders". It was very sad to see the homes, school, and church sitting in ruins. All the hard work destroyed.
Thank you for sharing!
Thank you for watching!
there's a transcript of it. at one point he told her to say it feels good. and then he asks her and she answers feels good. I don't know
This is probably the most random comment you’ll ever get lol however? It’s a shame Warren decided to preach insanity. He has such a calming/intoxicating voice and way of speaking. He would’ve killed it doing guided sleep meditations on RUclips. 🤷🏻♀️😅🤣
Hahahahaha Imagine how difficult it was for me to stay awake in church meetings!
I think his voice is absolutely creepy!!! I get goosebumps!!
It's interesting you say that because he has the complete opposite effect on me! The sound of his voice makes me feel like something awful is about to happen any minute now!
Yes I agree I think his voice is creepy not relaxing at all
Just finished watching Elisa Wall on Mormon Stories. She said they did find the young girl in the Texas compound.
Is she mistaken or did I mishear her?
Anyway, I really enjoy your commentary. Very insightful and informative.
When I heard the audio in this I didn’t hear much of it expect it was weird but I read Rachel’s Jeff’s book and watched her episode of escaping polygamy and the abuse he did to her so he’s where he should be. I struggle with Naomi cause I don’t understand why she wasn’t charged but I also feel she was a victim and under a spell
Great videos! I watched like 4 tonight haha what did you think of the Netflix documentary? Was that an accurate depiction? Or would you say there were things that weren’t accurately represented or missing?
When you watch the Netflix series, I wonder if you'll see Sam's sister since it looked like they showed some shots of all of Roulon's wives.
Thanks for sharing! I’m thinking about Joseph Smith married Kimball as 14 years old. I never knew about it till found out few years ago. Warren Jeff and Joseph Smith similar but many members of LDS confused 😕. But I have seen the polygamist came my home town when I grew up and learned about the mainstream LDS Denied about this historical. Thanks again :)
Your microphones sound SO good!!!!
Thank you! We were so happy that they worked out so well!
Theres another doc series I think you should watch keep sweet pray and obey it’s new it just came out on Netflix not that long ago
We are going to start reacting to that next week! =)
I am sure that blessing sounded pretty normal but I have no doubt we could have been doing awful things at the same time... definitely not a huge stretch to think of the sick things he was capable of & changing the rules to suit his desires.
Absolutely.
Where and when is your st George event?
It is on Sunday June 26th at 1pm in the conference room at The Switchpoint. =)
I hope you’ll do a review of Netflix’s Keep Sweet as well.
I agree!! But it’s such a traumatic show, I totally understand if Sam in particular needs a break first.
They did a review on keep sweet about a month ago. It’s the 6 or 7 video down the list. I hope this helps
@@TeresaBranham That was the Discovery Plus one. Netflix has a new one called Keep Sweet, Pray and Obey.
We are going to start reviewing that one next week, so stay tuned! =)
Just wondering...Is there a bed in every temple where blessing ceremonies take place...
There is definitely more to the recording. It was enough to cause jurors to cry. It was a 14 minute tape.
Hi Sam & Melissa, I was watching a documentary called "Sons of Perdition" or something like that and was wondering if Sam was one of the young men in that documentary? One of the young men resembles him and was just curious. Thank you for letting the world into your lives. I have learned a lot from you both.
I was not in that documentary but my cousin was and he actually has the same name as me haha.
Growing up in a Christian church (which I am no longer a part of - or any church) I always found it creepy how involved ANY church gets into peoples’ sexuality: from masturbation to sexual orientation to marriage. Even though we didn’t have priesthood “blessings” given in my childhood church, I just think it is very inappropriate for any clergy to be all up in peoples’ private business. It’s always a way to control a congregation because all people are sexual and it’s easy to infuse a person with guilt about natural human urges from a very young age. So I think that people are responding to WJ’s “blessing” as creepy because they are responding to the fact that he is a predator. They are responding to the fact that he was thinking about grooming his targets with each blessing bestowed upon his victims. If your instincts haven’t been clouded by your own indoctrination of church (pick any denomination), or from having been targeted and groomed by a sexual predator then you will much more quickly recognize a predator. If your instincts have been dulled with brainwashing and any and all versions of “keep sweet” you will likely perceive the predator like a wolf in sheep’s clothing. Make no mistake, the boys raised in this are victims as well. If not of sexual assault, they were certainly being controlled by one man for his own sick purposes. I am a former member of the Lutheran church and I was also a sex crime investigator for many years here in Canada. This is just my observation after many years of studying cults and religions as well as interviewing many predators.
Have you guys watched Prophet’s Prey, it’s a documentary about Warren Jeffs and Flds. I think that would be a good one. Also Under the Banner of Heaven on Hulu. It’s dramatized version of the story based on the book.
We will put those on the list!
I agree. Under the Banner of Heaven is super intense. I have to approach every episode like I am about to watch a horror movie. Ugh. My heart is racing just thinking about it.
Naomi bothered me with her attitude about her 12 year old sister and the other child who had a baby.
There must have been evidence that he did have sexual relations with underaged girls by the babies and the fact that their DNA would show he was the father, right?
Apocalyptic cults with a leader/prophet that predicts the government will come after them are an interesting study. Whether it is Warren Jeffs, David Koresh, Jim Jones, etc.
I recently found your channel and am binging your videos and I just love you guys!! ❤ I have no personal experience with the FLDS or Mormonism and I just know what I’ve learned from RUclipsrs like you 😊 and plenty of documentaries I’ve watched but I have to say though, that if that is what a “typical priesthood blessing” sounds like, I am even more appreciative that I have never experienced that. That recording is very cringe and the fact that he mentions the bed and the bed isn’t a normal blessing thing I think shows it probably wasn’t a normal blessing you are used to. Plus, I think Warren Jeffs is very cunning and he knew he’s being recorded (only by audio) so he knew exactly what to say and how to word it to cause doubt if needed. Since there is DNA proof that he fathered children with underage girls I think that’s enough evidence that he didn’t have the best intentions with those “blessings”….you guys are awesome! Keep doing what you’re doing!! I’ve learned a lot about FLDS and Mormonism, and you have provided me a different and more caring point of view towards the people in those groups. 😊
I thought the same thing with the recording when I heard it in Keep Sweet on Netflix! It definitely felt…weird…but initially it just sounded like a blessing. I will add that in the Keep Sweet documentary they did include the sounds of Warren moaning which made me believe it was sexual. But after the second episodes reaction and you guys talking about how he was acting kinda deranged, I wonder if it was sexual at all or just more of the weird behavior.
He definitely did a lot of messed up stuff and deserves every single day he spends on prison. I have to believe there was stronger evidence for the convictions, solely for concern of the legal system coming back in twenty years to question the conviction.
Ugh, I had an entire reply typed that got deleted for some reason!
But yeah, the documentaries that have used the clip of the audio only play segments from either Warren talking at the beginning or the one or two times Merrianne speaks. The full tape is around 20 minutes long. If you look up ‘scribd merrianne jessop’ you can find the audio transcript of it and I think that makes it more clear that it’s more than just a blessing. There’s like two or three times where it’s just several minutes of him breathing heavily, or when he tells Loretta, another one of his underage wives and Merrianne and Naomie’s niece, to distract Merrianne. I definitely think the full audio was probably a lot more damning than what the documentaries play.
Yes the Netflix series shows there was something very strange going on. Two of the former FLDS women are convinced it was a rape. Why else was there a bed there?
I agree that there would have had to be more to it than what was shared on this specific documentary. We may look up the full recording and do a reaction to that, and I know that the Netflix documentary also has some of it shared, which we will be reacting to next week.
Maybe the priesthood blessing with his child bride sounded ***ual is because everything Warren Jeffs says just sounds slimey and makes your skin crawl.
Most people when they leave one church or realign choose something simular. It may not make since to most. But people usually try to stay close to what seems familiar to you. Not me but most people do
"Assume nothing,
Question everything,
Trust no 1"
i think you could correct the statements after the interview with the CPS agent and learning what actually happened. just a thought, love your channel
Am I the only one that notices a change in Melissa's voice?
Idk its just me being weird, but i love lower voices on women LOL
Melissa - You are totally right and thanks for the compliment. I have had a super sore throat this week due to allergies and it has made my voice super low and raspy. Glad to hear it only improved the sound haha ;)
I would like to know your reaction of him partying up while on the run.
Good point that we didn't cover in our video. That may deserve it's own video. Honestly, it's not surprising he did whatever he wanted in the name of "blending in". It is just so sad that his entire community was being so oppressed in order to be "worthy" of him, not knowing the awful things he was doing.
And all of the people left behind were sending tons of cash that allowed WJ to party.
While I agree that the bits of recording we heard in the documentary leave room for doubt on whether it was a sexual encounter at that moment - I would hazard a guess we did not hear the entire recording. They said multiple jury members were brought to tears at the end of the recording, and those snips were not something I think most people would cry about. Additionally, the recording felt halting to me, like they weren’t playing it in its entirety but just bits here and there.
I really have strong doubts on if Naomie has moved on from Warren. Her smiling talking about him and some of the things they did…the way she phrased things….maintaining his innocence…I don’t know. I think she enjoyed her position of power and if Warren got out would take it back in a heartbeat.
Is there a good email to reach out to you guys, or is there a place I can find that information? 💖💖
You can reach out to us by email at growingupinpolygamy@gmail.com or by our PO box that is listed at the bottom of our video descriptions. =) We'd love to hear from you! =)
i was wondering if they didnt play the whole recording on the documentary. because im not familiar with those blessings at all and it didnt seem to prove any sort of sexual things. so im wondering if there was more in the video that we didnt see
They didn’t. In the Netflix documentary, the recording continues and you hear heavy breathing that can really only be heard one way 🤢
I have heard that there is more, and we are going to be reviewing some other documentaries that supposedly hear more.
You know I’m just shocked that Naomi wasn’t charged as an accomplice in Warren Jeffs craziness ! Am I missing something here ?
Thanks for another great video! Love the content. Great to see a true POV. Can someone direct me to a video where Sam and Melissa talk about what their current religious beliefs are? Are the LDS or?
I thought Sam left the LDTS before Warren Jeffs started really making changes. But in this video he said he was still very much involved in the LDTS community. Or did I misunderstand? I thought he left before Warren Jeffs was arrested
You contend that there were many innocent parents who were separated from their children. That even young children were removed when the worry was underage marriages. And that children and wives had names that they went by that conflicted with their legal names. But in retrospect it seems reasonable that all of the children should have been removed from the "ranch" since even adults within the ranch had no knowledge of their situation or their rights. They may have been told that their marriages were "legal" and that they had no rights to their own autonomy. And that innocent parents may eventually give their underage children over to an illegal underage marriage. It seems reasonable to consider the "ranch" as one home since the families were assigned to abodes and did not have ownership or even rented their dwellings, everything was controlled by the leader, Warren Jeffs, including their right to stay on the ranch and their autonomy over their children.
This documentary was so hard to watch. I cannot stop thinking about the abuse the little girls suffered. The horrific violations and to be told this is all for your own good, to be able to go to heaven. I am so angry at that psychopath!!
I think he also said something about being naked didn’t he? In the recording. And wasn’t it a video recording not just an audio?
I think he said something about removing her robe
After Warren Jeffs was arrested did it make it easier to leave the flds?
I think those who leave feel betrayed by Warren...I think that switching to LDS made members feel like they would be able to keep the purity they would get them into heaven...
Wondering if you will also be commenting on the Netflix doc?
This is just something I've always wondered about. Have y'all seen any pictures of the temple that was built in Texas? Sam, seeing as you've been through the LDS temple, did you notice any similarities or differences? Also I remember in a video I listened to recently hearing you say the FLDS doesn't do any of the temple stuff because they believe they weren't considered worthy since they didn't have a temple. But I had heard in a documentary a while back that they had something called an endowment house where they would do the temple ceremonies until the temple was built. I'm assuming I have something scrambled but do you have any insight?
Sister Wives? I really like them, but their marriages are failing right now.
I watched the whole series so I could cancel my subscription, I have too many subscriptions right now.
Didn’t he tell her to remove her robe
Thank u guys for everything u guys have said and done to make people realize that there is weirdos out here and these girls didn't even have a chance at life yet or forever for the ones that don't exscape warren needs to rott in hell for the things he has done to these women and kids and for the mom's to not do nothing is crasy
Okay so you all have seen the i am not a prophet video. Suicide themes I did nor know. Too much in love with himself
I might have remembered the recordings part wrong, but I thought there a fair chunk of silence at one point and then was lots of heavy breathing 🤔 if so, that’s probably why people think it was sexual.
Again. I may be remembering another documentary about this and just be remembering this wrong 😑
I just want to reply to your comments, and respectfully I hope, but to maybe give an outsider’s point of view. I know you said you don’t justify Warren Jeffs’ actions, but to me that’s what it sounded like, saying what you heard sounded like a blessing and there was nothing sexual, it sounded to me like you were defending Jeffs. So it’s my belief that there was a lot more to the audio. I read that some of the jurors were really traumatized by what they heard and I would assume that they aren’t going to put that kind of content in full in any TV show or documentary. But secondly, Jeffs is a pedophile, he doesn’t need to talk sexually in order to abuse a child. Many pedophiles don’t. Often the child is thanked, asked how they feel, and made to think it’s a good thing. All things Warren Jeffs did. I’m not sure what you were hoping to hear in order for you to believe the evidence. Warren Jeffs is not a good man. He hid behind religion in order to carry out his evil fantasies without question. He doesn’t believe in God. He used fear to control. I’ve watched a lot of your shows, and I find them informative, but on this occasion I was surprised by what I felt was a defense of Jeffs and a downplaying of the abuse of children.
In Christian homes we are also taught that if you commit suicide you will go to hell
I've never really thought about it much but the similarities between trump & Warren Jeff's is very similar their mindset & "following" & wanting to be the total leader. & not caring about the evidence that's shown they're guilty but their followers won't believe it
I get that question all the time how are you feeling? But it's usually after a service like a massage, blessing, drugs in er, and many more. I do agree that without any prior knowledge about LDS and F LDS they kind of fumbled all of this. If you don't investigate ask questions look into history some things may look completely different than others and if you can't tell those apart you're going to make a spaghetti traffic jam a very very big mistake that will impact all of those who were affected.
I have no personal experience in LDS and FLDS. From having an interest in human behaviour and listening to Mormon Stories and Jordan & Makay: I thought the same myself: it mostly sounded like a blessing. The bright white in the LDS temples and FLDS Zion Temple looks suspicious.
I have only watched the Netflix documentary which had the same recording.
Great feedback 👍
We are going to be reacting to the Netflix documentary next week, but it's interesting that it had the same recording and sounded the same there as well. The temples are white in order to appear "clean and pure" so that the Lord and his Spirit can preside there. Very symbolic, so I can see why that would seem odd. Thank you so much for watching!
Has Sam been in a movie or on TV?
I watch the three girls that have a show on Sundays on how to help these girls escape and I feel sorry for some of these girls I just want to hold them and let them know it ok I would
Love to meet the three girls or Rachelle Jeff's I would love to meet her
Are you from the Warren jeffs group ?
Yes I am.
it was Warren that was self-righteous
Is 12 years of age the time to get a patriarchal blessing?
🦋🦋🦋🦋🦋
Vicki is so beautiful 😍