I read books of two professors in Korean. Now I am reading them in English. And, that is why I start to study English again at 42. I really envy people who are good at English. Because they can understand the professors efficiently. I assure you, next year I will make sure I understand 100%.
I often think about all the poems and all the songs, all the books and all the movies that i have not been able to fully enjoy because of the language barrier. But ignorance is bliss as they say!! Good luck on your resolution, would you mind updating me on your progress?
Good luck dear friend! I know that feeling! Some 20 years ago, I had thought the same….. how good would it be if I could exactly communicate my thoughts and feelings in English. Because non fluency kept me from saying several things I wanted to. And saying just the bare essentials isolated me from my colleagues; they thought I was no fun to be with. Reading English books by referring to dictionary all the time, also killed the continuity and pleasure of reading. But now I enjoy reading English books than the ones in my native language. Writing everyday has helped me a lot. It gave me the freedom to edit till I am happy with its construct and clarity, and time to find the exact words etc. Slowly that clarity reflected in my speech too. And…. I used to see movies too. Happy to hear your one-year-resolution. Hope you achieve it. Good luck!!! 💪💪💪❤️
it's an incredible conversation! I could go out and stop people on the street asking them to watch. Many people need to have access to this ideas, point of views. Thank you!!!
I really liked when Michael asked Yuval about making Sapiens into a graphic novel, and why. This was quite subtle but highlights the problem Michael is trying to tackle. I highly respect both thinkers and admittedly have been following both down their respective rabbit holes at different times and forgot about the other. I'm going to take this and try to think of what both are trying to say and see how they overlap simultaneously.
It's like Yuval alluded to: people are bottom feeders. We'd rather watch a Tik Tok video than spend nearly an hour and a half listening to two older men talk to each other in seated position (especially the 125 people that gave it a thumbs down as of 7/18/21).
Thank you for a great conversation; shading light on Education and persuasion, the importance of values to a democracy and why manipulation is counterproductive. On the one hand we have Politics and Economics, and on the other we have Science. We can make a better arrangement to transform a culture for Humanity through Recognition , Honour and Esteem which are an integral part of Society.
Good for you. When, however, people feel relief, rather than, let's say, interest, fascination, respect, etc, when in the echo-chambered, mutual-admiration society of, indeed, impressive minds, who are cushy, elite profs who represent only part of the "thought," that's one of the problems.
@@wescolumbus621 1st comment from a critical thinker. 🙏 I know of Sandel from Dr Lyell Asher talking about him in his mind blowing presentation called 'How Colleges are Becoming Cults on Peter Boghossian's YT channel.
Wonderful discussion gentlemen... and a discussion which finished on a knife-edge. You guys have to get together again and continue your discussion on the point at which you finished. I look forward to that day. Thank you both, for taking the time to explore the issues you covered and for posting this video, so that we (the viewers) could benefit.
Thank you so much sister Lucile Woodward for your appreciation to me and my comments We need to change ideas with learned friends around the globe blessings
What a privilege to hear this conversation at the comfort of my home. Gives me hope for humanity to hear intelligent, respectful, argumentative discussion to ponder even further. Thank you!
The power of wholesome and thoughtful discourse and debate on full display. Thankfully we have still have access to minds and thinking of these exemplary role models. Thanks to all who make this possible.
What an intellectually stimulating discussion! I have much respect for both speakers. I like the fact that they’re talking about how to spread the scientific and philosophical discourse to a broader audience. That’s what academics should really think about. I wish more people would watch this!
As with all Americans no matter how brilliant, they somehow can’t seem to take the discourse beyond their country... And as with intellectuals from outside of America so wonderfully shown by Yuval’s discourse here, are more globally aware and encompass the US as part of a whole and not just treat it as a whole ...and Sandel was clearly lacking a bit there ... brilliant talk as always ..
They're both paradoxically missing the insight of what most historically and still promenantly drives American Capitalism, it's American culture, and that stems from a simple concept. America is for now and has been a place for "dreamers" from anywhere to gather and do their thing more openly, more freely, and with less tax and restriction than from anywhere else. This simple freedom to gather among fellow adventurers the desire for which 70 million not all white populist voters can still relate post election compels what on the surface to a globalist seems myopic, and narcissistic. But, for no better WHY is there in the American capitalistic archeological record than America's love of gambling and lottery, where everyday on some new and hopeful chance you're a new millionaire, not just for the wealth or fame of it, but the honor and respect as Yuval knows well that comes with the prize. And since politicians lay bedfellows to the promise of equality in democracy, with the hope comes the well paved downsides of capitalism''s wealth and consequential social inequalities levels below no Party leader or wealth tax can ever change in my view. We carelessly forget Las Vegas can make you rich, but it's still surrounded by a desert.
@@RJay121 I got lost in what you were trying to say. Then I read: "We carelessly forget Las Vegas can make you rich, but it's still surrounded by a desert." That's great. Perhaps you could have just said that?
It's very possible that, rather than lack of perspective, what we're watching is very careful language from the brilliant American prof. in what is an increasingly silencing academy and culture.
@@wescolumbus621 OK I could agree. But what little sense to dodge away from a the most fundamental historical and initiating driver behind the secular colonial conquest of America. The 1619 Project debate today for example puts money and creed as founding fathers. Considering the contemporary issues little has meaningfully eliminated that view entirely, but like religion the book is always better than the movie. But who reads anymore lol.😂. I welcome your reply
@@wescolumbus621 yeah that is possible ... it is very clear that woke culture” from the extreme left seems to be taking over the whole of Western and alarmingly American Academia. We do get the feeling that anything that moves even slightly away from the far left ideological narrative is being silenced. Maybe you are right there.
I am so impressed by and like Yuval's idea of Nationalism that enables us to help and love each other in huge number beyond physical possibility, such as whom we will never bump into in the course of our life. It is exactly the sense our society has lost in Japan.
Actually, like that idea,distribution of services that are needed and therefore should be provided is the ideal of the socialism. So BI is controversial because it allows using money to be accepted without any question, thinking. We actually should care about the sharing of services, not money. So we can say Yuval extract a good idea from socialism.
XXXXX @Rita Gerard BE SERIOUS, IF WE ARE INFORMED, THEY UP TOP, DON.T HAVE.T EASY! WE ,MUST BE IN STUPIDITY AND IN BIG NO.S, TO LET THEM PROFIT FROM US, THE CONSUMERS! DID U C THE OLD MOVIE:"THEY LIVE"!??
@@ritabruce5159 ,u did not get her point!?? , yes, is not food, but she wan.s to know as well, here.n Europe, is consideret a humanright to be educated, not only to highschool, but till we can stay in univerisity! U call that college!
What a wonderful conversation. Thanks for sharing. An absolute pleasure to hear the great minds of our century exchange ideas in a dignified atmosphere.
This is indeed an excellent analysis. For over a decade I have been contemplating new concepts for an authentic democracy. This brings all sectors on board to help in defining an ethos and ensuing approach for governance of a nation. Power no longer resides with any individual or political party but with an assembly of genuine representatives who deliberate and ultimately vote on best policy. This has resulted in a recently completed book "Democracy - a new beginning" - deadly serious but for a general readership. I am an Emeritus Professor of Physics at a UK university and hopefully have been able to bring some new thinking to the dilemmas and weaknesses of Western democracy, that both of you articulate so well.
This is terrific. Does my heart (and mind) good to know that discussions like this are going on somewhere! Us humans could be heading for the cliff, which would be tragic when such good sense and knowledge exists among us. Thank you Yuval and Michael!
Thank you for this wonderful conversation with Michael Sandel. I have recently read his new book and found it very enlightening and helpful towards understanding the dynamics of the present left/right orientation of the citizens of the USA.
Wonderfull conversation. Thanks to both. Yuval, You know what is what is common happening in Brazil, Peru, Australia, Europe, USA , Israel....? Is rapid change. We are living in times of huge rapid change due to new technologies. I think there are people that are more resistant to change than others ( maybe biological reasons), but they are going to buy the stories that tells them ""they are trashing our traditional values""
Thank you both for sharing this interesting conversation! I think that Michael's opinion about what caused the wave of populism very insightful. In my view, left-wing populism is also popular in some countries and is also associated with the feeling of resentment and lack of place in the neoliberal economy. For example, in Ukraine, we have a leftist populist government. Their popularity is based on leftist ideas such as fighting oligarchs, stopping the war, ending poverty, inclusivity for Russian-speaking population. They don't mention LGBT or migrants at all since it is not even part of the widespread discussion in society. But, otherwise, I think they play on the exact same feelings of the working people who feel robbed by wealthy oligarchs.
One of the most enlightening conversation on political and social discourse available today. Deep gratitude and thanks to Michael Sandel and Yuval Noah Harari.
Thank you very much Yuval for sharing this excellent conversation with Michael! I'm from Brazil, and I partly disagree with what you said. I do not have pet parties or politicians, I do not believe there is a good side and a bad side, I believe that unfortunately there are people who are not looking for the good of the population (even if this is the "flag they carry"). I do not know how much Yuval you have been following the political scenario in Brazil, but I ask that you do not build your discourse based purely and simply on the press. I would like to suggest that you do conversations like this with Brazilians to better understand the sides and the real situation.
Many thanks to both of the genius who participate in this conversation, I believe within the roots for the deep changes we are facing are the lack of control to the elites whose main interest is money and power and have developed the tools to have politicians aligned to their benefit, second the deterioration of family structure wit women being forced by the economic to leave their children in the hands of institutions which have raised a confrontation within the families by challenging parents right and autority to make things worse economic model is very agressive and people is always missing material things
Really phenomenal insights into democracy, threats to it, populism. Making us to realize the need of learning different discourses together, and to relate them to current scenario. Fully of wisdom,a guideline, a motivation and making everybody to get involved to learn and contribute towards "common good".
Finally I found your channel ❤️❤️❤️❤️❤️❤️your work WOW absolutely beautiful legendary and you literally changed my life my experience of everything is now self aware I'm a monkey I interpret the world within spectrum of a narrow parameters be them waves of sound we can hear to spectrum of light and color we can see and I'm learning about 11 dimensions of in physics and yeah thanks you for your absolutely enlightening everything each interaction with you be it pod cast video lectures interview your insights are enormously helpful and have changed my life in all the best ways ❤️❤️❤️❤️❤️❤️
Great going Yuval, instead being interviewed and repeating the same thing again, you decided to pick like minded intellectuals and discuss important issues. Wonderful 👍
I've loved watching professor Michael Sandel's famous set of philosophy lectures that are online. I'm also fascinated by professor Harari's ideas about having a more united world that transcends countries or nations, and enjoyed reading his 21 lessons for the 21st century. Seeing both of them here, having a debate about these ideas... Priceless! Thank you guys. We love it. 🙏❤️ Now... At around 1:08:00 a fascinating discussion happens about our failures to make political and societal transformations despite our ability to push science forward. There seems to be a conflict between what professor Sandel and Harari say. Professor Sandel says we used to be better at politics and worse in science, but that trend has reversed now. Professor Harari disputes that, referring to the agricultural revolution as an example. First, I'd guess that professor Sandel could be thinking about the last couple centuries, and maybe that explains the apparent conflict between them. Second, I'd suggest that we're not as fast in science either, as we'd like to be, and there is room for improvement, but perhaps that too is a result of our political ineptness. There are a few reasons for this ineptness. First, the 20th century was defined by war, and war forces certain political transformations, like everything that FDR did to accelerate the war machine and speedy development of nuclear technologies. We need this mentality in peace time as well, but politics in peace time tends to tilt towards conservation and stagnation. Second, science and technology move at exponential rates, and our politics isn't structured around that, i.e. it can't keep up with the pace. Third, our education system also needs to improve. When you see the most successful companies being founded by university dropouts, it would suggest that perhaps we're not doing enough to connect and cooperate between academia and industry, or even our elementary and high school systems. Regarding which is better, to genetically improve our IQ or transform our politics: a fascinating question is whether there is such a thing as "insufficient IQ to even comprehend the important messages of science?!" I don't think things are that grim! But when you have more intelligent people, it may be easier to explain to them the importance of science. Having said that, I still think there are perfectly intelligent people who are unable to accept things like evolution! And for this reason, I certainly agree that politics, culture, history, philosophy, and science education work hand in hand and are both needed to support a society based on reason.
I deeply honour and admire these two thinkers! YET, it feels like they have one very big difference: while Prof. Sandel approaches the matter from the US and the West perspective and current situation, while Prof. Harari tries to understand why it is so global, despite many differences between the West and the rest of the world, so to speak. Am I missing something?
No. Yuval is more of a philosopher than Sandel is so takes on an Everyman perspective. I wasn't impressed with Sandel, to be honest, but I think Yuval has it exactly. His last two points were spot on.
@@rainmanjr2007 I have listened to Sandel's lectures on political philosophy. He does consider himself as a philosopher, but I definitely agree on the fact that Yuval has better touch with what's going on globally and makes very relevant points.
This is such an important conversation. I can only hope that 1 politician in 100 would listen and take note at very least. We cannot fix everything, and nor can politicians. What we need is for those who hold a mandate to act with accountability and with care. They are paid by the public to make certain decisions on our behalf, not based on our 'consumer-style preference' but taking a long-term view and dealing with what is urgent. It goes beyond party politics.
I wish I could understand all of the topics they spoken. Unfortunately my English still not enough to understand these magnificent people. Peace and love to world. 😊
Michael Sandel, one of my heroes, he taught me how to think in many ways, listened to his Justice course about 3 times. Great conversation! One eyebrow widening think though. I can't believe someone with the intellect of Yuval attributes tribal thinking, the division of society, looking at compatriots as enemies, only with the populist right. Since the intellectuals on the extreme left have been doing the same thing, for a while now, identifying the enemy as the heterosexual white cisgender male. Yet all we heard was populist right, populist right. I guess political biases and blind spots take as prey even the best of us.
I think the problem we all have is that in order to understand things, we tend to generalize every thing we want to understand. Generalizations put to much noise in our conversations. It's a language trap we continuosly fall in. Maybe there are SOME right populists that fuels tribal division, and those are the one taken by account by Yuval (and he generalize on all right populists). And maybe there are SOME left populists that commit the same harm to society. Yet both, Yuval and you are generalizing (In your case, referring to all of "the left intellectuals" and not distinguishing them from all of those who does not think that heterosexual white cisgender male are the enemy). When we add the word "SOME" to avoid the generalization made by both of you, both sentences become more accurate and less offending to the people that feel included in or represented by those groups (left and right). Therefore, it results in less noise in the conversation. Lastly, in my opinion, I think that even when you are right, that at least some left intellectuals (or lots if you want better) drive the society towards division, Yuval refers to the right populists as the main responsible for tribal thinking, because right populists have had waaay more power to influence in society than left intellectuals. I think it's not necesary to explain further more on this point. Thank you for your thought, and for bringing up mine. I agree in every word with your last sentence.
@@elmundodefer I tried to avoid the generalisation you mention (although maybe I should have done a better job), by inserting the word 'extreme'. Intellectuals on the extreme left (regarding cultural issues). I don't know how we could measure which have had a bigger influence on general oppinnion, the extreme populist right, or the other. It certainly seems to me that in the last 5 years or so, the later has had more power in mainstream media. But I guess it depends on where one looks :) If I continuously read The Guardian or NY Times articles, it will certainly reinforce my assumption, but if I go to a Trump rally, then I see the other side of things, the populist influence. Regardless, thank you for your reply
@@vargas0897 definitely the word extreme would have fitted like charm there. You are right in the difficulty on measuring the influence of extremists from both sides. I assumed the right ones were the more influent since they have put a president in the whitehouse. Just 5 years ago Trump's campaign including actors playing him punching mexicans, opened (or widened ) the gap and brought the conversation to main stream. No wonder why the conversation kept on since then. Trump benefited from the controversy that he and his marketing gurues generated. And obviously media benefits with controversy as well. independently of the side they choose. Anyway I think it is no coincidence that you put the begining of left media feeding the gap among tribes just five years ago. I think is a natural reaction to Trump's provocative move back then and since then. However, I doubt that left media have happily shown and supported a show with a person punching a heterosexual cis male because it is the enemy. I would say the mainstream media have had more than enough with condemning every Trumps' feeding gap sayings and acts. (as I don't really consume american mainstream media, I could be absolutely wrong on this! :D) The surprising fact (that Juval points out) is the amount of supporters that someone with such a hate speech as Trump punching mexicans, can still have 5 years later even with mainstream media hitting him restless throughout these years. This confirms what you said: Politics biases and blind spot us all.
@@elmundodefer I did use the word 'extreme'. Read my very first comment. That's what I was trying to explain in the beginning of my second comment. You are right, I am not aware of any depiction of a cisgender white male being punched because he is the enemy. I was refering to the constant rhetoric of high standard mainstream publications (like the NW Times, Guardian etc), that white cisgender men, and also those with right leaning political views, are to be condemned, are racist, opressive, privileged, contemptible. Because this has been going on even more than 5 years, I think it contributed very much to the Trump's popularity. People really got fed up of being vilified. Mainstream media made the mistake you described. Generaliasing. The sad part is, it is continuing even now. And with this, they are giving munition to those, that are in extreme populist movements.
@@vargas0897 Oh, you did include the word "extreme"! Sorry, my bad. And absolutely yes, it's totally sad what biased generalizations from mainstream media can make to society. It's an unstoppable snowball. Because on one hand, there is just the market pushing them to continue saying whatever sells good (if they have been saying what you point out, there's definitely a market willing to hear that. And it will grow bigger if media keeps on feeding it). And on the other hand, they, the journalists and influencers get influenced themselves as well, so they get more convinced of what they are saying. Sadly, I'm afraid the gap and hate among citizens will do nothing but grow for a good while. Maybe when the ones that are fed up with crossed fire become a mayority, there will appear some politician or media group that wants to capture their attention and lower the tone. Hopefully. But be caution, because it would be most likely someone trying to just get the new group's money or vote. That's the invisible hand's system! Thank you for the chat!!
Thank u as always both, if the Davos men cannot deduct from where we stand now that a “win win” is impossible w out sacrificing not thru the tax loop holes of “philanthropy” but by paying a far higher tax after 70 + years of decreasing their fair share they will never comprehend it
Big fan of both here. I have Sandel’s picture on my wall and Yuval’s books on my shelf. Two points: 1. The first part of the conversation from Sandel’s position was rooted in the American society, and since Yuval hasn’t been immersed in this situation much, this big system of problems was a bit hard to convey. 2. A lot of what the philosopher and the historian are talking about are about psychology, or the human mind. For example, why could resentment of foreigners possibly be traced back to social/economic inequality? Why tribal agreement on solidarity could come before agreement on facts and science (Sandel’s point)? These are nowhere near rational problems, because we are dealing with the human brains where rationality only takes a small part. We need to bring Kahneman and Sapolsky here.
Wholeheartedly agreed. I'm starting to think that all human political, organizational and societal decisions should be informed by up-to-date behavioural biology and neuroscience, and find it appalling that in 2024 it's still not the case. I am a Sapolsky fan, so there's that :D
Thank you Yuval and Michael, for this very good discussion cum political lesson. Both of you obviously have brilliant, well intended minds, especially given that you both want to inform and thereby empower the average person. From my international socialist (Trotskyist) perspective you both affirm the need for and validity of a political science, the likes of which was made available to humanity some time ago thanks to a scientific, revolutionary Karl Marx. The point Yuval makes at 35:45 about nationalism is just as relevant to the concept of internationalism and probably a lot more appropriate, given our recently globalised world. The answer to a lot of the pertinent questions raised is international socialism and the formation of federations of united socialist states throughout the entire planet ie; forms of governance and productivity that place meeting the social and cultural needs of society over and well above the need for profit and privately owned wealth.
Such a great conversation. Both Michael and Yuval are a gift to humanity. I am very curious to know more about what Yuval talks about at the very end, where he mentions that technology in modern times is a danger to humans...Time is running out as he says.... and we will lose as humans in the end, if we allow algorithms and AI to take over. Will be interesting to hear more about this in another conversation.
I appreciate the engaged conversation. I would add, as education was pedaled, the cost of education skyrocketed as well as student loan debt. Do you think there was a calculation in pedaling education and the rise in student debt?
2 года назад
11:50 That was also the case here in Chile... With "La Concertación" (center-left coalition).
Absolutely. I get the sense that Yuval is flailing about for answers and in many cases is actually obfuscating the issues. I don’t find him clear-minded enough.
Amazing conversation between two of the undoubtedly greatest minds of our time. That said, I think Harari, as much as I admire him, didn't address the fundamental problem posed by Sandel, which is that our meritocratic rhetoric and our obsession with certification is doing a great deal of damage to democracy, through the idea that society's problems will be solved by creating "opportunities" to study and grow, rather than creating material conditions in which work is dignified and people can live happy lives regardless of their credentials and profession, or how they fit into our notion of "merit".
Thanks. Well put. I came to this conversation following Harari However it was Sandel who really opened my eyes here. It appeared Harari didn’t really hear (as you put it) “the fundamental problem posed by Sandel”
Sandel's critical analysis and incisive arguments explain very well the current crisis of ultra right-wing authoritarian populism.Sandel is humble. Glad to hear Harari repeat his arguments again.
It's really a privilege to get access to these conversations and learn from great minds.
Indeed, man we’re blessed!
You might like my channel too ♡
I completely Agree, 2 people who can translate complex theories, problems and issues into a language that is digestible by most of us.
@@stevesmith8522 yes slavoj Zizek too
@@TheR4Z0R996 p
I read books of two professors in Korean. Now I am reading them in English. And, that is why I start to study English again at 42. I really envy people who are good at English. Because they can understand the professors efficiently. I assure you, next year I will make sure I understand 100%.
I often think about all the poems and all the songs, all the books and all the movies that i have not been able to fully enjoy because of the language barrier. But ignorance is bliss as they say!! Good luck on your resolution, would you mind updating me on your progress?
Good luck dear friend! I know that feeling! Some 20 years ago, I had thought the same….. how good would it be if I could exactly communicate my thoughts and feelings in English. Because non fluency kept me from saying several things I wanted to. And saying just the bare essentials isolated me from my colleagues; they thought I was no fun to be with. Reading English books by referring to dictionary all the time, also killed the continuity and pleasure of reading. But now I enjoy reading English books than the ones in my native language. Writing everyday has helped me a lot. It gave me the freedom to edit till I am happy with its construct and clarity, and time to find the exact words etc. Slowly that clarity reflected in my speech too. And…. I used to see movies too. Happy to hear your one-year-resolution. Hope you achieve it. Good luck!!! 💪💪💪❤️
@@AA-rn9nw wow!
Keep learning, I'm sure you'll be able to understand English very well soon if you persist! It's NEVER late to learn new things!
All the best
it's an incredible conversation! I could go out and stop people on the street asking them to watch. Many people need to have access to this ideas, point of views. Thank you!!!
Devil devil devils
I really liked when Michael asked Yuval about making Sapiens into a graphic novel, and why. This was quite subtle but highlights the problem Michael is trying to tackle. I highly respect both thinkers and admittedly have been following both down their respective rabbit holes at different times and forgot about the other. I'm going to take this and try to think of what both are trying to say and see how they overlap simultaneously.
Great point!!!👍
Time stamp please
I can't believe that I watched this for free, Thank you so much!
Wow. Imagine if this received the millions of views it deserves.
I've been sharing it.
@@ronkrate609 Nice, keep it up!
They need to have CardiB moderating or something
It's like Yuval alluded to: people are bottom feeders. We'd rather watch a Tik Tok video than spend nearly an hour and a half listening to two older men talk to each other in seated position (especially the 125 people that gave it a thumbs down as of 7/18/21).
@@MC-br1gk so right
Thank you for a great conversation; shading light on Education and persuasion, the importance of values to a democracy and why manipulation is counterproductive. On the one hand we have Politics and Economics, and on the other we have Science. We can make a better arrangement to transform a culture for Humanity through Recognition , Honour and Esteem which are an integral part of Society.
Thank You for giving us a wide range of global thing by sharing these conversansions🌻
Two dignified acdemics engaged in respectful discussion. What a relief!
No I like it when there is more arguments.
Good for you. When, however, people feel relief, rather than, let's say, interest, fascination, respect, etc, when in the echo-chambered, mutual-admiration society of, indeed, impressive minds, who are cushy, elite profs who represent only part of the "thought," that's one of the problems.
Agreed
yesss
@@wescolumbus621 1st comment from a critical thinker. 🙏 I know of Sandel from Dr Lyell Asher talking about him in his mind blowing presentation called 'How Colleges are Becoming Cults on Peter Boghossian's YT channel.
Extremely important, extremely intelligent, extremely clearly stated--listening to you is an education in itself! Thank you, Professors!
Thoughtful discourse, intelligent, respectful and argumentative discussion. What a wonderful conversation.Thank you!
Thank you both so much for this fascinating conversation and already looking forward to the sequel
Thanks Yuval, thanks Michael. It is a good intellectual conversation. Both of you shared a lot of excellent ideas. Keep it up...
A fascinated conversation. Revolutionary, I would say. Thank you.
Wonderful discussion gentlemen... and a discussion which finished on a knife-edge.
You guys have to get together again and continue your discussion on the point at which you finished.
I look forward to that day.
Thank you both, for taking the time to explore the issues you covered and for posting this video, so that we (the viewers) could benefit.
Very educational and inspiring conversation. Thank you both.
Wonderful intelligent open minded ! Thank you 🙏🏼
Thank you so much sister Lucile Woodward for your appreciation to me and my comments We need to change ideas with learned friends around the globe blessings
What a privilege to hear this conversation at the comfort of my home. Gives me hope for humanity to hear intelligent, respectful, argumentative discussion to ponder even further. Thank you!
The Harvard professor is such a humble guy
They should write a book together called: "The Tyranny of Sapiens"
haha
sounds boring lol
Haha
rsrsrs
😂
The power of wholesome and thoughtful discourse and debate on full display. Thankfully we have still have access to minds and thinking of these exemplary role models. Thanks to all who make this possible.
Totally agree, Rachid.
A very important and interesting conversation...carried out with great respect for each other...a must listen.
Very instructive conversation. I really enjoyed it. Hope we hear more on the topic from these two great minds. Wish them a happy and long life.
What an intellectually stimulating discussion! I have much respect for both speakers. I like the fact that they’re talking about how to spread the scientific and philosophical discourse to a broader audience. That’s what academics should really think about. I wish more people would watch this!
Waiting for the next conversation session. Thank you very much 🙏
I cannot like it more. Two of my much-respected favorites in such an academic and respectful conversation. This sparks hope for the future.
Sparks ⚡️ Jesus
Thank you to both speakers. Enjoy the pleasant and enlightening discussions.
As with all Americans no matter how brilliant, they somehow can’t seem to take the discourse beyond their country... And as with intellectuals from outside of America so wonderfully shown by Yuval’s discourse here, are more globally aware and encompass the US as part of a whole and not just treat it as a whole ...and Sandel was clearly lacking a bit there ... brilliant talk as always ..
They're both paradoxically missing the insight of what most historically and still promenantly drives American Capitalism, it's American culture, and that stems from a simple concept. America is for now and has been a place for "dreamers" from anywhere to gather and do their thing more openly, more freely, and with less tax and restriction than from anywhere else. This simple freedom to gather among fellow adventurers the desire for which 70 million not all white populist voters can still relate post election compels what on the surface to a globalist seems myopic, and narcissistic. But, for no better WHY is there in the American capitalistic archeological record than America's love of gambling and lottery, where everyday on some new and hopeful chance you're a new millionaire, not just for the wealth or fame of it, but the honor and respect as Yuval knows well that comes with the prize. And since politicians lay bedfellows to the promise of equality in democracy, with the hope comes the well paved downsides of capitalism''s wealth and consequential social inequalities levels below no Party leader or wealth tax can ever change in my view. We carelessly forget Las Vegas can make you rich, but it's still surrounded by a desert.
@@RJay121 I got lost in what you were trying to say. Then I read: "We carelessly forget Las Vegas can make you rich, but it's still surrounded by a desert." That's great. Perhaps you could have just said that?
It's very possible that, rather than lack of perspective, what we're watching is very careful language from the brilliant American prof. in what is an increasingly silencing academy and culture.
@@wescolumbus621 OK I could agree. But what little sense to dodge away from a the most fundamental historical and initiating driver behind the secular colonial conquest of America. The 1619 Project debate today for example puts money and creed as founding fathers. Considering the contemporary issues little has meaningfully eliminated that view entirely, but like religion the book is always better than the movie. But who reads anymore lol.😂.
I welcome your reply
@@wescolumbus621 yeah that is possible ... it is very clear that woke culture” from the extreme left seems to be taking over the whole of Western and alarmingly American Academia. We do get the feeling that anything that moves even slightly away from the far left ideological narrative is being silenced. Maybe you are right there.
I am so impressed by and like Yuval's idea of Nationalism that enables us to help and love each other in huge number beyond physical possibility, such as whom we will never bump into in the course of our life.
It is exactly the sense our society has lost in Japan.
You're right Yuval : knowledge must be shared in a friendly way. Just like a good meal with friends...
Wonderful people.
Actually, like that idea,distribution of services that are needed and therefore should be provided is the ideal of the socialism. So BI is controversial because it allows using money to be accepted without any question, thinking. We actually should care about the sharing of services, not money. So we can say Yuval extract a good idea from socialism.
Knowledge is not food. Think about the difference in the process of thinking and digestion and hopefully you will see the difference.
XXXXX @Rita Gerard BE SERIOUS, IF WE ARE INFORMED, THEY UP TOP, DON.T HAVE.T EASY! WE ,MUST BE IN STUPIDITY AND IN BIG NO.S, TO LET THEM PROFIT FROM US, THE CONSUMERS! DID U C THE OLD MOVIE:"THEY LIVE"!??
@@ritabruce5159 ,u did not get her point!?? , yes, is not food, but she wan.s to know as well, here.n Europe, is consideret a humanright to be educated, not only to highschool, but till we can stay in univerisity! U call that college!
If a prerequisite for a Nobel prize is to simplify complex topics, then Nobel prize to Dr. Noah.
Agreed :) and if he has simplified things even more in his new comic novel, it must be awesome
@@papergaery5257 .. it is awesome. My pre-teen kids love it. We read it together on Saturdays.
He is already eligible...In fact he is beyond Nobel
@@ArielBerdugo will check it out 😎👍
@@kallachi729 nice one😄
Brilliant writers and brilliant speakers!
What a wonderful conversation. Thanks for sharing. An absolute pleasure to hear the great minds of our century exchange ideas in a dignified atmosphere.
Please have another conversation soon. Thank you.
Great discussion. 👌
This was such an intriguing and eye opening conversation from both speakers! Thank you
This is indeed an excellent analysis. For over a decade I have been contemplating new concepts for an authentic democracy. This brings all sectors on board to help in defining an ethos and ensuing approach for governance of a nation. Power no longer resides with any individual or political party but with an assembly of genuine representatives who deliberate and ultimately vote on best policy. This has resulted in a recently completed book "Democracy - a new beginning" - deadly serious but for a general readership. I am an Emeritus Professor of Physics at a UK university and hopefully have been able to bring some new thinking to the dilemmas and weaknesses of Western democracy, that both of you articulate so well.
This is terrific. Does my heart (and mind) good to know that discussions like this are going on somewhere! Us humans could be heading for the cliff, which would be tragic when such good sense and knowledge exists among us. Thank you Yuval and Michael!
A great conversation. Thankyou both of you profs for uploading it on RUclips.
I felt like the conversation was just warming up at the hour mark! Could have listened to many more hours!!
Agreed. The world needs these precious minds
Prof.Dr. Sandel, Prof.Dr. Harari THANK YOU !!!
How profound and helpful... thank you both for an excellent discussion....
Wow! I am doing the "Justice" course on EdX and look forward to listen to this!
Same!.
He is a stooge of elite of States.
@@xendit1635 who is?
Thanks so much for such a genuine conversation--not two people just making their points but actually listening and interested in each others ideas.
Brilliant convo please have another updated one
Thank you for this wonderful conversation with Michael Sandel. I have recently read his new book and found it very enlightening and helpful towards understanding the dynamics of the present left/right orientation of the citizens of the USA.
Thank for doing this and making it public. A humble fan!
These people are a delight, we need them more visible and more promoted.
This is what I needed to hear and from all the comments I read I'd say I'm in good company, thumbs up.
Simplifying the situation may go something like this: those who have want to control those who have not, to protect what they have.
Thanks to both of you for enlightenment.
So excited to get an access to your books, i
Great!!🤩🤩 Two of my most favourite teachers of political theory in our times!!
Wonderfull conversation. Thanks to both. Yuval, You know what is what is common happening in Brazil, Peru, Australia, Europe, USA , Israel....? Is rapid change. We are living in times of huge rapid change due to new technologies. I think there are people that are more resistant to change than others ( maybe biological reasons), but they are going to buy the stories that tells them ""they are trashing our traditional values""
Yuval Harare makes my brain open up and feel there is great hope in this world with great minds such as his.
Hope is in heaven
Wonderful and insightful talk and very much looking forward to the next conversation!
Thank you both for sharing this interesting conversation! I think that Michael's opinion about what caused the wave of populism very insightful. In my view, left-wing populism is also popular in some countries and is also associated with the feeling of resentment and lack of place in the neoliberal economy. For example, in Ukraine, we have a leftist populist government. Their popularity is based on leftist ideas such as fighting oligarchs, stopping the war, ending poverty, inclusivity for Russian-speaking population. They don't mention LGBT or migrants at all since it is not even part of the widespread discussion in society. But, otherwise, I think they play on the exact same feelings of the working people who feel robbed by wealthy oligarchs.
What a brilliant and fascinating conversation, many things to think about!
Just watched this after Beavis & Butthead and I'm so much more grateful for both now. Forwarded it to friends & family.
“Great minds with great ideas usually share in the midst of their persecution” ~ Jeremy Aldana
Thank you, thank you for speaking out loud and making sense. A bowl of fresh air
One of the most enlightening conversation on political and social discourse available today. Deep gratitude and thanks to Michael Sandel and Yuval Noah Harari.
Thank you very much Yuval for sharing this excellent conversation with Michael! I'm from Brazil, and I partly disagree with what you said. I do not have pet parties or politicians, I do not believe there is a good side and a bad side, I believe that unfortunately there are people who are not looking for the good of the population (even if this is the "flag they carry").
I do not know how much Yuval you have been following the political scenario in Brazil, but I ask that you do not build your discourse based purely and simply on the press. I would like to suggest that you do conversations like this with Brazilians to better understand the sides and the real situation.
I am honor to hear this talks of the greatest professor. Thank you.
Many thanks to both of the genius who participate in this conversation, I believe within the roots for the deep changes we are facing are the lack of control to the elites whose main interest is money and power and have developed the tools to have politicians aligned to their benefit, second the deterioration of family structure wit women being forced by the economic to leave their children in the hands of institutions which have raised a confrontation within the families by challenging parents right and autority to make things worse economic model is very agressive and people is always missing material things
Yes this is absolutely a privilege. What a great respectful discussion. Loved it. Thank you for doing this.
Really phenomenal insights into democracy, threats to it, populism. Making us to realize the need of learning different discourses together, and to relate them to current scenario. Fully of wisdom,a guideline, a motivation and making everybody to get involved to learn and contribute towards "common good".
Vote GOP- for the freedom of individuals
Finally I found your channel ❤️❤️❤️❤️❤️❤️your work WOW absolutely beautiful legendary and you literally changed my life my experience of everything is now self aware I'm a monkey I interpret the world within spectrum of a narrow parameters be them waves of sound we can hear to spectrum of light and color we can see and I'm learning about 11 dimensions of in physics and yeah thanks you for your absolutely enlightening everything each interaction with you be it pod cast video lectures interview your insights are enormously helpful and have changed my life in all the best ways ❤️❤️❤️❤️❤️❤️
Two classy history profs/authors discussing a very important topic. Thanks!
All show and pretense
As akways, both FANTASTIC!!!! THANK YOU!!!!!!👍🤗🥂🥬🥝💐🍊🍑🍑🍋🍋🍋🍋🍋🍇🍓
Great conversation) I got so much pleasure and enjoyment from it.
enjoyed the conversation thank you for everything
Thank you very much. You make me think about a lot.
Great going Yuval, instead being interviewed and repeating the same thing again, you decided to pick like minded intellectuals and discuss important issues. Wonderful 👍
Why did the center left move away from their traditional base? It’s almost as if they forgot that the purpose of politics is to represent the people.
Maybe its where the votes were?
very pertinent dicussion especially given the current global economic crisis resultant from the pandemic. Stimulating indeed Yuval and Micheal.
Exposition of brilliance in a single Talk - worth listening, a next level conversation....
I've loved watching professor Michael Sandel's famous set of philosophy lectures that are online. I'm also fascinated by professor Harari's ideas about having a more united world that transcends countries or nations, and enjoyed reading his 21 lessons for the 21st century.
Seeing both of them here, having a debate about these ideas... Priceless! Thank you guys. We love it. 🙏❤️
Now... At around 1:08:00 a fascinating discussion happens about our failures to make political and societal transformations despite our ability to push science forward.
There seems to be a conflict between what professor Sandel and Harari say. Professor Sandel says we used to be better at politics and worse in science, but that trend has reversed now. Professor Harari disputes that, referring to the agricultural revolution as an example.
First, I'd guess that professor Sandel could be thinking about the last couple centuries, and maybe that explains the apparent conflict between them.
Second, I'd suggest that we're not as fast in science either, as we'd like to be, and there is room for improvement, but perhaps that too is a result of our political ineptness.
There are a few reasons for this ineptness.
First, the 20th century was defined by war, and war forces certain political transformations, like everything that FDR did to accelerate the war machine and speedy development of nuclear technologies. We need this mentality in peace time as well, but politics in peace time tends to tilt towards conservation and stagnation.
Second, science and technology move at exponential rates, and our politics isn't structured around that, i.e. it can't keep up with the pace.
Third, our education system also needs to improve. When you see the most successful companies being founded by university dropouts, it would suggest that perhaps we're not doing enough to connect and cooperate between academia and industry, or even our elementary and high school systems.
Regarding which is better, to genetically improve our IQ or transform our politics: a fascinating question is whether there is such a thing as "insufficient IQ to even comprehend the important messages of science?!"
I don't think things are that grim! But when you have more intelligent people, it may be easier to explain to them the importance of science.
Having said that, I still think there are perfectly intelligent people who are unable to accept things like evolution! And for this reason, I certainly agree that politics, culture, history, philosophy, and science education work hand in hand and are both needed to support a society based on reason.
Anyone like sandel that thinks merit is tyrannical- deserves to be laughed out of a job
Could you put these conversations in podcast format please?! For those of us who dont have unlimited data
You can download in mp3 RUclips videos just getting the audio!
I deeply honour and admire these two thinkers! YET, it feels like they have one very big difference: while Prof. Sandel approaches the matter from the US and the West perspective and current situation, while Prof. Harari tries to understand why it is so global, despite many differences between the West and the rest of the world, so to speak. Am I missing something?
No. Yuval is more of a philosopher than Sandel is so takes on an Everyman perspective. I wasn't impressed with Sandel, to be honest, but I think Yuval has it exactly. His last two points were spot on.
@@rainmanjr2007 I have listened to Sandel's lectures on political philosophy. He does consider himself as a philosopher, but I definitely agree on the fact that Yuval has better touch with what's going on globally and makes very relevant points.
This is such an important conversation. I can only hope that 1 politician in 100 would listen and take note at very least. We cannot fix everything, and nor can politicians. What we need is for those who hold a mandate to act with accountability and with care. They are paid by the public to make certain decisions on our behalf, not based on our 'consumer-style preference' but taking a long-term view and dealing with what is urgent. It goes beyond party politics.
It's a wonderful conversation for growing knowledge about the world's creations. Thanks Mr Harari
I wish I could understand all of the topics they spoken.
Unfortunately my English still not enough to understand these magnificent people.
Peace and love to world. 😊
Michael Sandel, one of my heroes, he taught me how to think in many ways, listened to his Justice course about 3 times. Great conversation! One eyebrow widening think though. I can't believe someone with the intellect of Yuval attributes tribal thinking, the division of society, looking at compatriots as enemies, only with the populist right. Since the intellectuals on the extreme left have been doing the same thing, for a while now, identifying the enemy as the heterosexual white cisgender male. Yet all we heard was populist right, populist right. I guess political biases and blind spots take as prey even the best of us.
I think the problem we all have is that in order to understand things, we tend to generalize every thing we want to understand. Generalizations put to much noise in our conversations. It's a language trap we continuosly fall in. Maybe there are SOME right populists that fuels tribal division, and those are the one taken by account by Yuval (and he generalize on all right populists). And maybe there are SOME left populists that commit the same harm to society. Yet both, Yuval and you are generalizing (In your case, referring to all of "the left intellectuals" and not distinguishing them from all of those who does not think that heterosexual white cisgender male are the enemy).
When we add the word "SOME" to avoid the generalization made by both of you, both sentences become more accurate and less offending to the people that feel included in or represented by those groups (left and right). Therefore, it results in less noise in the conversation.
Lastly, in my opinion, I think that even when you are right, that at least some left intellectuals (or lots if you want better) drive the society towards division, Yuval refers to the right populists as the main responsible for tribal thinking, because right populists have had waaay more power to influence in society than left intellectuals.
I think it's not necesary to explain further more on this point.
Thank you for your thought, and for bringing up mine. I agree in every word with your last sentence.
@@elmundodefer I tried to avoid the generalisation you mention (although maybe I should have done a better job), by inserting the word 'extreme'. Intellectuals on the extreme left (regarding cultural issues). I don't know how we could measure which have had a bigger influence on general oppinnion, the extreme populist right, or the other. It certainly seems to me that in the last 5 years or so, the later has had more power in mainstream media. But I guess it depends on where one looks :) If I continuously read The Guardian or NY Times articles, it will certainly reinforce my assumption, but if I go to a Trump rally, then I see the other side of things, the populist influence. Regardless, thank you for your reply
@@vargas0897 definitely the word extreme would have fitted like charm there. You are right in the difficulty on measuring the influence of extremists from both sides.
I assumed the right ones were the more influent since they have put a president in the whitehouse. Just 5 years ago Trump's campaign including actors playing him punching mexicans, opened (or widened ) the gap and brought the conversation to main stream.
No wonder why the conversation kept on since then. Trump benefited from the controversy that he and his marketing gurues generated. And obviously media benefits with controversy as well. independently of the side they choose.
Anyway I think it is no coincidence that you put the begining of left media feeding the gap among tribes just five years ago. I think is a natural reaction to Trump's provocative move back then and since then. However, I doubt that left media have happily shown and supported a show with a person punching a heterosexual cis male because it is the enemy. I would say the mainstream media have had more than enough with condemning every Trumps' feeding gap sayings and acts. (as I don't really consume american mainstream media, I could be absolutely wrong on this! :D)
The surprising fact (that Juval points out) is the amount of supporters that someone with such a hate speech as Trump punching mexicans, can still have 5 years later even with mainstream media hitting him restless throughout these years.
This confirms what you said: Politics biases and blind spot us all.
@@elmundodefer I did use the word 'extreme'. Read my very first comment. That's what I was trying to explain in the beginning of my second comment. You are right, I am not aware of any depiction of a cisgender white male being punched because he is the enemy. I was refering to the constant rhetoric of high standard mainstream publications (like the NW Times, Guardian etc), that white cisgender men, and also those with right leaning political views, are to be condemned, are racist, opressive, privileged, contemptible. Because this has been going on even more than 5 years, I think it contributed very much to the Trump's popularity. People really got fed up of being vilified. Mainstream media made the mistake you described. Generaliasing. The sad part is, it is continuing even now. And with this, they are giving munition to those, that are in extreme populist movements.
@@vargas0897 Oh, you did include the word "extreme"! Sorry, my bad.
And absolutely yes, it's totally sad what biased generalizations from mainstream media can make to society. It's an unstoppable snowball. Because on one hand, there is just the market pushing them to continue saying whatever sells good (if they have been saying what you point out, there's definitely a market willing to hear that. And it will grow bigger if media keeps on feeding it). And on the other hand, they, the journalists and influencers get influenced themselves as well, so they get more convinced of what they are saying.
Sadly, I'm afraid the gap and hate among citizens will do nothing but grow for a good while. Maybe when the ones that are fed up with crossed fire become a mayority, there will appear some politician or media group that wants to capture their attention and lower the tone. Hopefully. But be caution, because it would be most likely someone trying to just get the new group's money or vote.
That's the invisible hand's system!
Thank you for the chat!!
Thank u as always both, if the Davos men cannot deduct from where we stand now that a “win win” is impossible w out sacrificing not thru the tax loop holes of “philanthropy” but by paying a far higher tax after 70 + years of decreasing their fair share they will never comprehend it
Big fan of both here. I have Sandel’s picture on my wall and Yuval’s books on my shelf. Two points: 1. The first part of the conversation from Sandel’s position was rooted in the American society, and since Yuval hasn’t been immersed in this situation much, this big system of problems was a bit hard to convey. 2. A lot of what the philosopher and the historian are talking about are about psychology, or the human mind. For example, why could resentment of foreigners possibly be traced back to social/economic inequality? Why tribal agreement on solidarity could come before agreement on facts and science (Sandel’s point)? These are nowhere near rational problems, because we are dealing with the human brains where rationality only takes a small part. We need to bring Kahneman and Sapolsky here.
Wholeheartedly agreed.
I'm starting to think that all human political, organizational and societal decisions should be informed by up-to-date behavioural biology and neuroscience, and find it appalling that in 2024 it's still not the case.
I am a Sapolsky fan, so there's that :D
Yuval, THANK YOU!
LOVE LISTENING TO YOUR TALKS!
Thank you Yuval and Michael,
for this very good discussion cum political lesson. Both of you obviously have brilliant, well intended minds, especially given that you both want to inform and thereby empower the average person. From my international socialist (Trotskyist) perspective you both affirm the need for and validity of a political science, the likes of which was made available to humanity some time ago thanks to a scientific, revolutionary Karl Marx. The point Yuval makes at 35:45 about nationalism is just as relevant to the concept of internationalism and probably a lot more appropriate, given our recently globalised world. The answer to a lot of the pertinent questions raised is international socialism and the formation of federations of united socialist states throughout the entire planet ie; forms of governance and productivity that place meeting the social and cultural needs of society over and well above the need for profit and privately owned wealth.
Such a great conversation. Both Michael and Yuval are a gift to humanity. I am very curious to know more about what Yuval talks about at the very end, where he mentions that technology in modern times is a danger to humans...Time is running out as he says.... and we will lose as humans in the end, if we allow algorithms and AI to take over. Will be interesting to hear more about this in another conversation.
I appreciate the engaged conversation. I would add, as education was pedaled, the cost of education skyrocketed as well as student loan debt.
Do you think there was a calculation in pedaling education and the rise in student debt?
11:50 That was also the case here in Chile... With "La Concertación" (center-left coalition).
#mantappp ini, kedua oerang ini saya sdh baca bukunya.
Silahkan terjemahkan @YuvalNoahHarari,
Yuval, my hero, one of the greatest mind of our times!
delusion is a strange thing
Jesus is mine’s
Kindly add subtitles for the sake of hearing impaired
I like Yuval a lot and never heard of Sandel, but 15 min into this convo I realized Sandel is schooling Yuval on this issue.
just watch the whole Harvard - Justice lecture series ;)
Absolutely. I get the sense that Yuval is flailing about for answers and in many cases is actually obfuscating the issues. I don’t find him clear-minded enough.
Loved this one.... Well done gentlemen.
Such a pleasure to listen to this... ❤
Amazing conversation between two of the undoubtedly greatest minds of our time. That said, I think Harari, as much as I admire him, didn't address the fundamental problem posed by Sandel, which is that our meritocratic rhetoric and our obsession with certification is doing a great deal of damage to democracy, through the idea that society's problems will be solved by creating "opportunities" to study and grow, rather than creating material conditions in which work is dignified and people can live happy lives regardless of their credentials and profession, or how they fit into our notion of "merit".
Thanks. Well put. I came to this conversation following Harari
However it was Sandel who really opened my eyes here. It appeared Harari didn’t really hear (as you put it) “the fundamental problem posed by Sandel”
Brilliant and very deep conversations of immense importance to human society 👏
Sandel's critical analysis and incisive arguments explain very well the current crisis of ultra right-wing authoritarian populism.Sandel is humble. Glad to hear Harari repeat his arguments again.
If you can identify the movement’s of the political parties, and they ideas , so is making it much easier to find the possibilities!