Phaetus Dragon High Flow Hotend Review - High Hopes or Phaeled Flow?
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- Опубликовано: 18 ноя 2020
- Happily Impressed with this hotend, zero issues and will eat anything I've fed it so far without issue.
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Your analysis and the way you explain things are FANTASTIC.
Glad they produce a quality product, I've got the dragonfly coming in now.
First time seeing one of your videos, it was refreshing to get an actual thoughtful opinion on the over all pros and cons of a design instead of "urr benchy look" without any mention of if the slicer was tuned etc. That earns not just subscription but the real prize, notifications; all lol.
instablaster
Fanatic video 👍
I have just bought one, prior to this video I am afraid to say.
Thanks for sharing 👍😊
Glad you like it, makes me feel better about using this hotend as it has mixed reviews. I bought one not too long ago, planning on attaching it to my delta, going to print a new effector for it from a particularly stiff and relatively cheap Nylon I found. Problem is that I appear to be the first one that is doing this with my particular printer so there really aren't any mounting solutions I was happy with so I designed one from scratch, taking advantage of hard mount and the fact that you don't need to hold on to the heater block with a wrench to take the nozzle off so I'm integrating a cooling duct into the effector. Actually about ready to do my first test for the new effector probably tomorrow. I'll probably end up making a sock mold too eventually, they do wear out and the sock design could use some minor improvements.
Nice video.
I appreciate you pointing out the one handed nozzle changes.
hotends like the Dragon that have the fixed indexing struts to prevent heater block rotation during nozzle change are worth their weight in gold.
Real. Love my Hemera but the block being able to rotate drives me mad. Never lines up with the rest of the setup either so it looks goofy.
Love your vids man. Sometimes I'm not even considering the product/project but I'l still watch. Keep it up.
Great review, thanks! Got a link for that torque wrench you use for tigthening the nozzle?
Great review, thanks. Also looking for their newer dragonfly review as other mention. It seam promising.
I have a dragonfly on the way
Video suggestion: Video about stepper motor options for voron would be great, I see many discord questions regarding that.
I second that. Extruder is important, especially at high speeds.
I think you found your niche, that review was on point.
Just bought the standard flow for my switchwire. Should be here in about 4 days. Might get to push plastic in a week!
Hi Nero, thanks for reviewing this hotend, I'm interested in getting one but the link in your description wasn't working for me.
Would appear the hotend is no longer carried on bangood
Good lord, I printed that Splicer mask in the 3 piece configuration and I think just the bottom two halves took over 8hours each. That’s very impressive
Been using one of these for a while with a .4mm cht nozzle. After tuning pressure advance it gives great prints.
Thanks for the info! I'll be ordering a high flow now. What is the nifty hardware for the nozzle swap??
That new Cura dynamic slicing that manages the thickness of plastic even with thicker nozzles probably even gave this hotend a quality boost.
Nice video, I like that hotend. Did you get a chance to order Carbon fiber yet?
That's a nice phaeeluusss there Nero.
Hello, thanls for the review and the work on the voron builds.
I'm planing to buid a voron v0.1, is it possible to use this hotend on it ? Thanks
Another question what hotend are you using. I'm contemplating upgrading my hot end to from an original e3dV6 I got ages ago and it's served me well but it's passed its day. I'm very tempted to get a high flow triangle labs dragon however I only print on a 0.5 nozzle (occasionally 0.4 or 0.6) do you think I would benefit from getting a high flow variant on an Ender 3 pro switch wire, with the intention of super fast high quality prints or is that a fantasy and I won't ever get to push the standard flow on a 0.5 nozzle on a switch wire so just go standard flow for easier print settings (less ozzing etc)?
nice vid link to the Nozzle wrench please
I've got two incoming. One for my Voron V0 (also incoming) and the other for my prusa i3 Mk2.5s Bear.
What was that hot end tool you used at 6:55 to unscrew and screw in the hot end?
Do you know if the Hotend fits in the Prusa mk3s+, because I think pusa has a slightly modified version of the v6
between this and Phaetus dragonfly BMO hotend which one do you prefer? does it help with printing ABS, nylon, PETG for beginners like me who only rely on recommended settings of ultimaker?
Hello, is difference betweeen normal and high flow only the throat? Could I buy both throat and change it when I need to use large diameter nozzle?
Bought this how did you stop the heat creep?
do you think i'd get any print quality improvements coming from a volcano to a dragon? even for 0.4mm normal prints.
because other wise i'm getting like 2 volcanoes that always have a different nozzle (0.6 0.4) and making an easily hot swappable mount for them (easy to do so) and i'd have 40$-30$~ still left in my account. i can even get a third for 0.8 :P
i used to have one tool on my printer be 0.4mm and the other be 0.6 and it was heaven to choose your nozzle size using a button in prusaslicer, however during PVA prints or simple multi color ones prusa slicer kept nagging me about nozzle sizes (I have a tool changer)
What torque printed wrench is that? And I have a Dragon on the way for my V1 build.
What thermistor or temp sensor are you using or would you recommend? I am going to be using Phaetus Dragon v2 w/ BMG clone in direct drive. I'm going to be connecting to skr mini e3 v2.0. I already found a heater cartridge - 24v 64w, and ordered HT-NTC100K thermistors... I'm not sure but I've seen ppl use P100 thermistors but have to go thru all kinds of way too technically difficult process for a beginner noob to electronics etc. It would include adding a daughter board or amp. The guide I seen uses the E3d thermistor amp for super volcano if I'm not mistaken. Anyway, if anyone can give advice for the most accurate high temp thermistor compatible with BTT SKR Mini E3 V2.0 and Phaetus Dragon Hotend V2? Thanks.
What is the tool used at 7:04? Is that torque regulated? Seems very convenient for nozzle changes.
I have this hotend with the bmg kit for my v0.1 and for the life of me I cannot get it to print right. It will either over or under extrude with the same petg same settings between two of the same print. it is driving me nuts. Any suggestions on how to tune it better?
wait can I cold tighten my nozzles if I get a bi-metallic heatbreak?
also does hardened steel cold tighten too?
Hey, recently got a Voron 2.4 and a phateus dragon high flow hotend to go with it and I'm having some printing issues. Mind sharing your slicer settings?
Where did you buy this? I'm in the US and I can't find one now
Thanks for the video! One question about the torque wrench, how much nm you apply? 1.5nm? More?
Thanks
Ive had this wrench for awhile now. Its set for w.e the recommended torque the slice mosquito nozzle requires as thats what i made it for
you got a video about that nozzle wrench ?
What size nozzle diameter ships with the dragon high flow
Do you have feelings about the mosquito magnum vs dragon hf?
9:10 so dragon is better because can be cold tightened, what about v6 with bi-metal? Cant be also? 🤔
Hello ,
I was in the process of changing my hotend on the dragon and I accidentally shaved the screws that hold the heatblock to the hotend .. I searched everywhere and can't find those screws or atleast their size anywhere 😢. Can someone please tell me where to find those thing screws ? Or atleast their size
how do u connect the phaetus to a ender 3 ?
How much newton got that torque wrench
I don't see a link for the Dragon High Flow?
How do you find the GT2 belt fit with the larger corner radius on the gear teeth when the nozzle goes above 0.4mm? I find I have to use 0.4mm nozzle to make GT2 gear teeth but maybe you have a good tuning tip that allows good belt engagement with larger nozzles?
The piece was printed more as a quality test of rapid direction changes for an outer wall more than anything. in Use I do recommend sticking with a .4 nozzle for those.
@@CanuckCreator Thanks, glad there isn't a trick I should be using. I have been running a volcano on 0.6mm for years but your recent videos inspired me to start some long overdue upgrades and maintenance. Switched back to 0.4 for some of the parts I'm planning to make. Keep up the good work!
Hey!
You mention you're happy with your Chinese V6, any link you could share?
Triangle labs v6
I'm going to put one of these on cr-10s Pro. Kind of like putting $3,000 rims on a $500 Honda Civic.
I have threee these on my printers now - my two with enclosure jam up all the time - heat creep I think - having to open the doors is not a solution. Tried a blower fan - worked 100% but too big to close the doors on my Voron. Tried two 4010 fans together on my Tevo - same deal - reliable if I dont close the doors. My opinion - it just doesn't get enough airflow around the cooling fins.
Currently trialling a 9 blade 4010 fan with higher static pressure....
Cant find a Facebook group to discuss it.
Thanks for the review
Could you explain how choose between SF and HF dragon ?
HF is to print at high speed ?
But HF version is able to print at low/medium speed ?
Yes, more explanation/comparison of standard and high-flow would be greatly appreciated.
So what are the differences between the Phaetus Dragon and the TL Dragon? Sounds like the the heater block is a slightly different shape. Are they different metal composition as well? Do any of those minor differences make a difference to you? Would you expect identical results from a TL high flow Dragon?
I have a standard flow TL, and the Phaetus HF, as far as comparisons, they are so closed it`ll be hard to disntinguish.
The phaetus may have a SLIGHT lead in build quality and a cooler box that it came in.
Hi @Nero 3d, great content. High flow vs standard, in general, would you say the high flow can do everything the standard can if tuned? I'm thinking future proofing and I'd like all possibilities, including < 0.4 nozzle if the need ever arrives.
Thanks!
I'd like this answered as well
@@4rdzlla my limited understanding... You can run the high flow in standard setups, but it will make your life more difficult, retraction I think was the big problem. I don't have experience, just what I've read.
@@dustinrange661 so it's safe to say if I ever plan to try .8 nozzle. High flow is the way to go to speed up my prints.
Although how much detail can .8 nozzle print
@@4rdzlla it's not just nozzle size, it's more the combination of that plus speed. It's my understanding a standard flow will work in most cases till you start increasing speed. You will know when you need a high flow if your extruder gears start slipping on the filament.
I don't have experience with it, but I'm interested in large nozzle to speed up functional or prototype parts. Rough draft. If you're only doing decorative figures, a bigger nozzle might not ever be wanted. Who knows
Now is no longer avaible, I'm really sad
Bought a high flow and had major clogging issues ? "Cold end" seems to get really hot and then just clogs up? Any help would be appreciated.
More powerful fan on the heartbreak, I switched from a 4010 to. Powerful 4020 (maglev)
which thermistor did you use/suggest for this hotend? thinking more about dragon.
I personally just use bulk beta 3950s off ali. Got a a bunch of em awhile back
where is everyone getting these little torque wrenchs for the nozzle
Where did you get that torque wrench for your nozzles?
They are printed I believe. On Thingiverse.
Is there a e3d volcano mount and fan duct for the afterburner?
I believe theres been a modded version for it.
Have you seen Slice Engineering is enforcing their patent and getting rid of the Dragon hotend?
I think it is already discontinued. Glad that i bought mine. I am just not sure if I find spare parts if needed
Yeah that never happened, lol
Thanks god here in Asia I can still buy a Dragon. Half the price with superb performance
@@nakajimakuro where do you buy?
Coool , but im using 10k acel and 400mm/s every line ,of course i never get those speed with little object , but its cool print fast , using e3d volcano titan on ender3😊, i can print 0.1mm layers with o.4 mm nozzle , peak speed is 235-240mm/s
Where did you get that torque wrench for the nozzle?
it's printed, you can find it on thingiverse
First off I need that Torque wrench, Second is there any difference between the Triangle labs version and this one?
As far as i can tell Phaetus is the originally dragon manufacturer, and looking between it and the TL dragon i have, it appears to be either the same to "slightly" better build quality
I think Triangle Labs is the primary manufacturer and Phaetus outsources to them to build, or they share a manufacturer somehow.
Does this use the thermistor and heater size that E3D uses?
Yes
How would you rank it compared to lets say a triangle labs spider ( mosquito clone) that's exactly the same price
I havent had experience with the the mosquito clone so i cant comment on it
how much do these weigh
Would the boron nitride paste improve the performance on the dragon?
I dont believe it would contribute in any significant measurable way, as the heater cart is clamped in the dragon
Hi! Any issues with printing PLA? I have read a couple of forum posts of people mentioning that as an issue, where because of the way the heatsink is designed and without beefed up cooling, PLA will expand and clog the hotend.
So far no issues
Since the link to Banggood is dead I purchased one from Triangle Labs. Do you think it's of equal quality?
They are both made by the same company
@@CanuckCreator oooh. Haha ok, thank you. I thought it was different because the heater blocks are different.
Which is superior? Phaetus or Mosquito? Or are they equal in performance?
I never noticed a difference, they produce the exact same prints with exact same reliability. With the dragon you don't have to use the boron nitride paste, which makes me prefer the dragon over the mosquito (and it's much cheaper)
can it print fanless?
asking as i start watching
I tried to use your affiliate link but it doesn't work, I will wait a few days and try again in case you can fix it.
I believe banggood no longer carries jt
what nozzle does this use?
Comes with a .4mm plated copper nozzle. Uses standard v6 format nozzles
what torque wrench is that you have? i printed one like that at 3nm but that seems way to hard to torque nozzles on
That is a small wrench
@@nife3557 no it's def one of these I'm just curious what torque level he uses, www.thingiverse.com/thing:2613057
probably a 1nm one, I think slice wrenches are 1nm
The thingiverse listing for that wrench also has a calibration lever you can use with a kitchen scale. Print a wrench thats above your target torque and then snip off wings of the internal rotor until you've achieved your desired torque :)
The V6 is yesterday's tech that won't go away fast enough. When it came out it was great but the lack of continued innovation hurts E3D. The new mosiquito and dragon hotends are the future using new materials that allow us to print with all metal hotends and reduced jams, achieve higher temps, all while saving space. If you had told me before I took a chance on a mosquito clone that there was a difference in extrusion quality and final print results from an expensive hotend I'd have laughed. I'm not laughing now. I run a 24/7 print farm with 7 machines and reliabilty along with quality is extremely important to compete in this business. I've changed all of my machines over to the mosquito now and I couldn't be happier with it.
How's the print farm? Are you still running the mosquito or did you switch to one of the newer systems like Revo or Rapido?
i purchased the Dragon high flow for use with a 0.6mm nozzle on a MK3S.
so where the V6-style free-rotation adapter mount meets the main anodized aluminum heatsink frame, there is a small divot on top of the heatsink where the adapter mounts and the PTFE tube mates against. However, the mating is not like V6, which uses tapered/chamfered edge mating. The Dragon's PTFE mating area is flat. Since the Dragon does not ship with a PTFE tube of its own (also its collet is not compatible with Prusa w/o mod) the fact that this difference is not document is bad, but worse still, I it may be a critical design flaw.
I did not realize this on my first install, and after a week of (heavy) service, it fell victim to a heatcreep clog failure while printing ABS-T @ 245C on a 110C PEI bed in an enclosure. I would not have expected this b/c your review said it should be fine with a 40x10mm fan
It took me a while to figure out where the clog was. Low and behold, A disk had flattened itself in the divot space(presumably as the extruder kept pressing down on it),
resulting in a clog which cannot be removed by a cold-pull. You have to remove the free-rotation adapter mount, then get *the entire heatsink* ripping hot enough to extract the filament.
So I did that. Then custom-cut a PTFE tupe for it. And reinstalled it. Figured I'd start it off with something easy. Why not PLA @ 215/60?
On "load filament", it didn't even make it down to the nozzle. immediately clogged again right after a laborious teardown.
Its just ironic because I thought the Dragon would be my savior. I thought finally I can print above 275 in an enclosure without causing a heatcreep clog. Finally I would be able to print CF/glass-filled nylon. Finally an end to loosened heatbreaks leaking molten plastic everywhere, resulting in a totaled hotend.
I thought the Dragon would be the end nights lost to unscheduled E-axis teardowns.
I thought wrong.
Swap out the hotend fan. The stock mk3 fan is very anemic and the source of a large % of heatcreep issues at higher temps
@@CanuckCreator which one do you recommend swapping to?
How does the quality compare to the Mosquito?
Build advantage to thr slice mosquito. And advantage in support. But function and print quality are within margin of error imo
@@CanuckCreator The Dragon has a build advantage over the Mosquito?
@@ErlendDavidson I would say the slice has the advantage
@@CanuckCreator Thanks.
Can someone please tell me if there is a difference between the phaetus and the trianglelab dragonhotend? Also, trianglelab has a v2 version
I am wondering which one to buy but it seems the triangle labs one is hard to get?
@WU LYU thanks for the reply! I ordered both hotends to test them out! Both should arrive next week. I will try to give an update on this asap
@WU LYU just make sure then the mounting mechanism fits for your ender 3!!
I will use them hotends on my 2 prusa mk3s+ with the standart grove mount
@WU LYU iam also using the hero me on my ender 3! This should work just fine!
@WU LYU thats cool but i had to disassemble the whole printer anyway so i was just able to assemble it as usual :p i replaced all extruder parts from PETG to ASA to make it more heat resistent!
@WU LYU iam building a heated enclosure, thats why i replaced all petg parts with asa!
About your warping ploblem, you could try to cover the printer with a cardboard box or a binbag to keep the warm air inside! Also, print as slow as possible to reduce warping. I would recommend asa over abs since it should warp less
where can you buy nozzles for the dragonn high flow? Do they use volcano nozzles?
rip dragon
I think copper is better at collecting heat, but aluminum is better at getting rid of it. I believe the thin heat break helps more. Just my 2 cents.
get 404 error in link
£70-£80 for a clone though ?
Is it considered a clone though?
The heatbreak concept is the same maybe, but the rest is different no?
@@ManIkWeet I guess it’s sort of a clone ? They do look pretty good quality. Do you know if it’s a drop in replacement for an E3d V6 ? I’m half tempted to try one.
@@roscoe3dp470 I don't know for sure, but it looks like the groove mount option is for E3D users. Maybe have to mess with z-offset though.
It's really, really good though.
So the Phaetus is theft of another companies IP. So the price is less than a third of the Mosquito. Does that make it ok? Reminds me of Chinese companies steeling the BLTouch IP and selling it as the 3D Touch.
The only thing they share design wise is the bi-metallic heat break which as far as I am aware, Slice does not have a patent on
Get off the gas. Have you set the hotends side by side? They are not the same. It's a byproduct of a V6 mating with a mosquito. I don't see why people want to keep crying about this? Don't buy it. I'll buy a $70 hotend all day that'll run with a over priced $200 one. Dammit. Hate it when I waste my time commenting on dumb shiii
I disagree. Hotends are not the same. V6 and the likes love to clog themselves way more often. In fact, in my experience the Dragon hotend never clogged, whereas the V6 and Volcano clogged once a day. Sure, you can tune it as in learn to drive the Trabant, but why would you want to do so...
this is a clone of a clone wow. trianglelab dragon was the original "clone" iirc and that is a mixed amalgamation/clone of a slice mosqito and an e3d v6.
phaetus was few days/weeks before trianglelab
Phaetus appears to be the "original manufacturer" actually
You are wrong. Phaetus is the original, the others are the clones.
a good high flow hotend has close to 0 stringing, if your hotend strings it's a piece of crap🤣 either it's badly designed and it's too long and loose, or you need too much heat to have it flow out
dragon is looking good! but the quality at speed doesn't on that benchy, pretty decent! any hotend can print good, the thing is how fast can it print good, my old anet a8 hotend could print good and at pretty high speed (120mm/s) with cranked temps to 220c, all hotends are the same at "regular" speeds, good hotends only shine when pushed to their limits, there you see one being much different to the other, and for batch production that matters a lot, being able to print 5x faster and at the same quality brings the bread home
I'd love to have a voron to slap my Nova on, that machine looks sweet!
OK then shill.
I have an Anet a8 as well. Would love to have the firmware and slicer settings you are/were using to get 120mm/s
Ill watch your build videos but your reviews are bad. No direct comparison vs the other brands at all, no real evidence, and your comments seem to be very misleading and dishonest. After watching this video and another review that you did for hotends I started looking into purchasing either a slice engineering or phaeutus hotend and found that they are both shit companies with shit products. People are going to be buying these based on your suggestions and when they can’t get them to work they are going to think that this is something they are not made for. You’re doing the community a huge disservice for personal gain.