I’ve been enjoying using Sigewinne and not many people talk about what you said 👀 What I like about Sigewinne is I can choose who to on-field instead of needing to stay as Kokomi which helps me be more creative with the teams!
Good analysis, just some points I wanna bring: 1 - I think vertical investment on Furina such as her C2 is not as impactful as people think as a "tie breaker" and it might even give Kokomi an advantage. Sigewinne flat damage buff just scales based on Furina's Crit and DMG%, and while you do get some more DMG% due to faster stacks on C2 and more max stacks at C1, Furina C2 does helps ST healers more than AoE healers, and it would allow Kokomi getting max Furina stacks before even going on field, which means she gets to use the full buff for the full time. The flat damage buff gap from Sigewinne from going Furina C2 from C0 should be much smaller than the personal damage gap from Kokomi using C2 vs C0 Furina. My Furina is C2 and I can say that I often max out her stacks before the second Kazuha swap usually. 2 - In Single Target you would be able to follow rotations without having any issues since ST fights have tanky enemies, so reapplying VV and having to adapt rotations like you do in multi-wave content (which gives Sigewinne a practical advantage) stops being an issue. Kokomi should quite significantly outscale Sigewinne in strict ST situations like bosses. 3 - I think using Sucrose here is being somewhat of a handicap for Kokomi, since Sucrose requires more field time and has longer cooldowns, which is not an issue for Sigewinne variants, but is for Kokomi variants as it usually requires in the jellyfish expiring, and awkward rotations. 4 - Not related to damage, but something I don't see anyone bringing in comparisons, is that Kokomi also brings in additional IR and significantly better tanking potential due to having ST healing on top of AoE healing.
The account I used does not have Kazuha and is more reflective of how someone plays for 4 years choosing to invest in their fav characters. The Kazuha showcase is on my main account in the previous vid! As for vertical investment, I will cover that in the next two vids: One that shows some rough maths and another showing gameplay. I will just say: Don't understimate that Sigewinne buff! It really starts adding with constellations. As for single target vs multi-wave...idk. Let's do some more testing since it feels like it could be enemy specific.
@@KokomiClan Hey thanks for the reply! I don't exactly underestimate Sigewinne buffs assuming you mean they scale very well with *her own constellations*, as C1R1 Sigewinne has about triple DPS contribution to the team as C0R0, and that's when Sigewinne gets very very competitive and arguably better, with C2 being where she starts absolutely blasting Kokomi out of the water. But C0 Kokomi vs C0 Sigewinne should be a Kokomi win unless we start speaking about C6 Yelan/Furina, where their damage is so overwhelming that on fielding Kokomi does start being a DPS loss. Otherwise I don't see it being that impactful, as it's a flat damage increase which means that the strongest the unit gets, the weakest the buff becomes percentage-wise (as overall the damage increase remains the same since it's, well, flat, benefitting only from extra DMG% sources and Crit sources, which is not common to find in constellations, just in Signature weapons). For Furina, the buff is equallying at about ~20% more damage for Furina at any investment threshold and C2 Furina or not (and Furina alone in Mono Hydro, and I think that due to her C2 HP scaling, Sige buff drops to a 15% if she's C2) assuming 63k HP Sigewinne (which would mean 2HP/2HP set and no Clam damage and no further buffs from the new healing set). On fielding Yelan is very whatever in terms of DPS gain since the team has too much DMG% buffs already, and Yelan buff is a ramping buff, meaning that in average, Yelan gets ~25% DMG bonus, which should translate to ~10% more damage on Yelan. We have Mono Hydro calcs where we see Yelan adn Furina doing 500k damage, so 20% more damage for Furina and 10% more for Yelan would be 150k DPR. I think we can both agree that outside of multi-wave content, where Kokomi cannot be on fielded reliably, Kokomi personal damage is significantly higher than 150k, likely at about 400k-500k according to previous sheets and sims, so DPR gap between Kokomi and Sigewinne should be on the 200k-300k margin. Also an argument I see being thrown around a lot is that the Sigewinne version can do 2 Yelan Es while Kokomi variants only do 1 E, that's also false as the best Mono Hydro rotations throw an additional Yelan E at the end of Kokomi's burst before Furina buff and Yelan burst expires.
This is a really good analysis of their kits and are very much in line with the conclusions that I came to as well. Each character has their relative strengths and weaknesses and that's as it should be. Overall, this is a good thing as this gives you the flexibility to set up comps specifically to do things the way you want these teams to perform. Plus, Sigewinne's ability to buff off-field damage is a very welcome feature which opens up new approaches to combat. Plus, there is nothing stopping you from running crazy comps like: Furina, Nahida, Sigewinne and Kokomi or swapping out Nahida with Sucrose.
It never fails to amuse me a Furina in Co-op waiting for my zzzwinne to get her to full to then use the Q skill.... Some other downsides to the melusine is that she works better in single player combat. While Kokomi is great on both. This is a monohydro (technically a hydro swirl comp), so, will we see an analysis on off-field damage dealers? Because for me there is no doubt, the melusine wins in that regard against Kokomi. Which is with whom I've paired her so far.
nice analysis of the advantages and weaknesses of each option!
I’ve been enjoying using Sigewinne and not many people talk about what you said 👀 What I like about Sigewinne is I can choose who to on-field instead of needing to stay as Kokomi which helps me be more creative with the teams!
Good analysis, just some points I wanna bring:
1 - I think vertical investment on Furina such as her C2 is not as impactful as people think as a "tie breaker" and it might even give Kokomi an advantage. Sigewinne flat damage buff just scales based on Furina's Crit and DMG%, and while you do get some more DMG% due to faster stacks on C2 and more max stacks at C1, Furina C2 does helps ST healers more than AoE healers, and it would allow Kokomi getting max Furina stacks before even going on field, which means she gets to use the full buff for the full time. The flat damage buff gap from Sigewinne from going Furina C2 from C0 should be much smaller than the personal damage gap from Kokomi using C2 vs C0 Furina. My Furina is C2 and I can say that I often max out her stacks before the second Kazuha swap usually.
2 - In Single Target you would be able to follow rotations without having any issues since ST fights have tanky enemies, so reapplying VV and having to adapt rotations like you do in multi-wave content (which gives Sigewinne a practical advantage) stops being an issue. Kokomi should quite significantly outscale Sigewinne in strict ST situations like bosses.
3 - I think using Sucrose here is being somewhat of a handicap for Kokomi, since Sucrose requires more field time and has longer cooldowns, which is not an issue for Sigewinne variants, but is for Kokomi variants as it usually requires in the jellyfish expiring, and awkward rotations.
4 - Not related to damage, but something I don't see anyone bringing in comparisons, is that Kokomi also brings in additional IR and significantly better tanking potential due to having ST healing on top of AoE healing.
The account I used does not have Kazuha and is more reflective of how someone plays for 4 years choosing to invest in their fav characters. The Kazuha showcase is on my main account in the previous vid!
As for vertical investment, I will cover that in the next two vids: One that shows some rough maths and another showing gameplay. I will just say: Don't understimate that Sigewinne buff! It really starts adding with constellations.
As for single target vs multi-wave...idk. Let's do some more testing since it feels like it could be enemy specific.
@@KokomiClan Hey thanks for the reply!
I don't exactly underestimate Sigewinne buffs assuming you mean they scale very well with *her own constellations*, as C1R1 Sigewinne has about triple DPS contribution to the team as C0R0, and that's when Sigewinne gets very very competitive and arguably better, with C2 being where she starts absolutely blasting Kokomi out of the water. But C0 Kokomi vs C0 Sigewinne should be a Kokomi win unless we start speaking about C6 Yelan/Furina, where their damage is so overwhelming that on fielding Kokomi does start being a DPS loss.
Otherwise I don't see it being that impactful, as it's a flat damage increase which means that the strongest the unit gets, the weakest the buff becomes percentage-wise (as overall the damage increase remains the same since it's, well, flat, benefitting only from extra DMG% sources and Crit sources, which is not common to find in constellations, just in Signature weapons). For Furina, the buff is equallying at about ~20% more damage for Furina at any investment threshold and C2 Furina or not (and Furina alone in Mono Hydro, and I think that due to her C2 HP scaling, Sige buff drops to a 15% if she's C2) assuming 63k HP Sigewinne (which would mean 2HP/2HP set and no Clam damage and no further buffs from the new healing set).
On fielding Yelan is very whatever in terms of DPS gain since the team has too much DMG% buffs already, and Yelan buff is a ramping buff, meaning that in average, Yelan gets ~25% DMG bonus, which should translate to ~10% more damage on Yelan. We have Mono Hydro calcs where we see Yelan adn Furina doing 500k damage, so 20% more damage for Furina and 10% more for Yelan would be 150k DPR.
I think we can both agree that outside of multi-wave content, where Kokomi cannot be on fielded reliably, Kokomi personal damage is significantly higher than 150k, likely at about 400k-500k according to previous sheets and sims, so DPR gap between Kokomi and Sigewinne should be on the 200k-300k margin. Also an argument I see being thrown around a lot is that the Sigewinne version can do 2 Yelan Es while Kokomi variants only do 1 E, that's also false as the best Mono Hydro rotations throw an additional Yelan E at the end of Kokomi's burst before Furina buff and Yelan burst expires.
This is a really good analysis of their kits and are very much in line with the conclusions that I came to as well. Each character has their relative strengths and weaknesses and that's as it should be. Overall, this is a good thing as this gives you the flexibility to set up comps specifically to do things the way you want these teams to perform. Plus, Sigewinne's ability to buff off-field damage is a very welcome feature which opens up new approaches to combat.
Plus, there is nothing stopping you from running crazy comps like: Furina, Nahida, Sigewinne and Kokomi or swapping out Nahida with Sucrose.
Great analysis for mono hydro
It never fails to amuse me a Furina in Co-op waiting for my zzzwinne to get her to full to then use the Q skill....
Some other downsides to the melusine is that she works better in single player combat. While Kokomi is great on both.
This is a monohydro (technically a hydro swirl comp), so, will we see an analysis on off-field damage dealers?
Because for me there is no doubt, the melusine wins in that regard against Kokomi. Which is with whom I've paired her so far.