MEN Ending Explained | Why I LOVE Alex Garland's New A24 Film
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- Опубликовано: 16 окт 2024
- In Alex Garland's new A24 dramatic horror, MEN, a young woman goes on a solo vacation to the English countryside following the death of her ex-husband. This stars Jessie Buckley and Rory Kinnear. Thanks for checking out my ending explained discussion for MEN. I'd love to hear your thoughts and theories on this dark film in the comments below!
Non-spoiler MEN review: • MEN (2022) Movie Review
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*****
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*****
My couch rating system:
5 - A must watch - do not pass this one up
4 - It's really good, you should see it
3 - It's OK - maybe good for a rental
2 - It's not that good and I wouldn't recommend it
1 - It's terrible and I definitely don't recommend it
0 - Cutting off a finger is better than watching this
#MEN #MENMovie #MenEndingExplained #A24
Here are my thoughts and interpretation:
So Harper is clearly going to this rental property to have a short getaway after the death of her husband. During the fight scene flashbacks she is both physically and psychologically abused (threats of suicide and trying to read her messages without her consent assuming she is saying bad things about him). In those scenes she expressed that she doesn't feel like she is able to live her life and be happy because of the toxicity of their relationship and his abuse. Being married to him is about him exerting control over her and keeping her for his own needs rather than a willing union of love between them.
As she enters the home she takes a bite of the apple (the forbidden fruit) symbolic of the knowledge of good and evil, also symbolic of knowing the "truth" or the true "nature" of something. The house itself is covered in red walls and surrounded by lush nature, trees, flowers and woods. The house is symbolic imagery of a womb (a safe place away from the outside world, feminine, healing energy). The world around her and the nature and trees are symbolic of life and living and being in the world itself. I feel like this represents the dichotomy of the two statues we see represented throughout the film. The green man statue is the nature of masculinity, also in paganism was a symbol of spring and rebirth of nature. The red, or possibly blood, color representative of the nature of femininity with the woman statue, as she is the rebirth of humanity. In the Bible the book of Genesis states that Adam is Hebrew for human and Eve is Hebrew for Life. I'll touch on the ending and how that makes sense later.
I feel like as she explored the surrounding forest and arrives at the tunnel she is expressing her own free will. She is exercising freedom to roam and explore. But she is a woman and in a patriarchal society, that is not allowed. That's not conforming to the control of men. She enters the cave, heavily evoking to symbolism of a vaginal canal and from that canal a figure is born, he is naked and instinctual and begins chasing her as nature's punishment for her embodiment of freedom. He is seeking to control her again by invoking fear in her for trying to be free. This ties back to the moment when she asked for a divorce from her husband in effort to reclaim hehe freedom and he punished her for it by threatening to kill himself and by punching her in the face and at the end of the film when she asks him what he wants he says "your love" as in he wants her to stay married to him so he can keep controlling her.
As she begins to interact w the other men and the boy in the town, while she doesn't seem to notice that they are all the same man, we are able to see that this form of manipulative, gaslighting, controlling, dismissive, repressive and violent nature is present to some extent in every man she encounters. The only people who seem to believe her fear is valid is the female cop and her friend Riley. The men she encounters in the town continuously blame her and down play her experiences and even override her autonomy (even in nice ways like when the landlord won't let her pay for her own drink). We can also see how this negatively effects the men though when the landlord says his father called him a failed attempt at a military man when he was only 7 years old.
As we enter the final act, she is terrorized in the house by loud noises banging on the outside walls, seeing the police man standing outside of her door staring at her, the bird flying through the window etc and it feels very evocative of the feeling of being penetrated or violated as the true nature of the patriarchal violence in the world begins to descend upon the womb space of the home. When the green man blows the dandelion at her (a symbol of blowing the dandelion and being promised that the one you love will love you back) one of the dandelion seeds enters her mouth. I feel like this represents her being in the green man's control again. I thought the imagery of the young boy with the bird and the women's mask on the face of the bird being pushed back and forth (looked very sexual) was particularly disturbing. Showing that these values of dominance and control and entitelment which he displayed throughout the film, were engrained within him from a young age. As the men penetrate into the home she does use very phallic ways of asserting her power. When the green man puts hand through the mail box (almost like a proposal) and then grabs her (his true intentions) she stabs him. Then when the priest tries to rape her she stabs him as well.
The finale of the film show the Union of the green man and the female statue and the ways in which men in a patriarchal society have used the fertility of women and specifically the control of that fertility, to perpetuate the power structure from which they benefit. Patriarchy begets patriarchy. Every man in this film embodies these traits in various forms to varying degrees and that is passed on from generation to generation, and women are only involved in so far as a vessel, or a canal, through which to birth the next patriarch. Passing down the ideology over and over again until eventually we see her husband. In this moment Harper has finally gotten to a point where she has to face the true nature of the patriarchal values that were instilled within her husband and ultimately corrupted their marriage. He admits to her that he wanted her love (a thinly veiled manipulative way of trying to control her) and continues to blame her for his death. She seems to be at peace though in this scene. Not because she agrees or believes what he is saying, but because she can finally see the truth. She has eaten of the fruit of the knowledge of good and evil and can finally be set free from the illusion and now understands and accepts that his death is not her fault. She no longer has to be "haunted" by him. She found the healing she needed and conquered her past.
All very good points. As I was watching the movie and seeing that she wasn't reacting to everyone looking the same, I just saw it as her thinking all men are the same, he might as well be the same person, or they're all parts of the same person
@@iSOBigD yea that was my thought as well that it was an artistic choice more so than an actual story element. She is just seeing all the men as the embodiment as the same toxic traits
@@indiajohnson4149 But I do wonder why all the men are not played by Paapa Essiedu/James. Or have Rory Kinnear play the boyfriend too. Since all the problems originated from the boyfriend, it would make sense all the men are played by one person. It seems stranges all the rebirth are the different Rory Kinnear character except the last one?
@Biden Cringe yes you do need permission to go through someone's private property. It's an invasion of privacy. And furthermore he was controlling her by trying to manipulate her into staying with her by threatening to kill himself. She wanted to get a divorce, in response to her decision he employed psychologically abusive strategies by saying she would be responsible for his death, and that she would live with that guilt forever, and that it would be her fault and saying she would rather see him dead than stay with him.... These are all attempts to control her behavior, to try to convince her to do what he wants, which was to not divorce him.
@@brianng8350 I am thinking that they chose to have Rory Kinnear play the other parts because it would not have made sense for her to go away to this other house and they open the door to her husband and her not have a reaction to that. Furthermore, I think it's clear that the "original man" is the green man, not the husband. So technically all the men are supposed to look like the green man, they're not all trying to look like Jeffery. Does that make sense? The green man is just manifested in all of these other men as the unhealthy, abusive, controlling, qualities are passed down through the generations. So it drives the message home that "all men" have these qualities to varying degrees because it's about a societal structure of power imbalance more so than an individual expression of that power imbalance. It's a critique on the societal structure of patriarchy not on the individual actions of men. So then her husband is the last incarnation of that power structure because he also has those qualities as they have been widespread and passed on to him as well.
I believe the scene in which Harper stabs the guys arm through the mail slot represents how the possible suicide isn't her fault. She may have planted the knife and made her husband feel this way but ultimately he is the one that went through with it. He's the one that pulled the knife through willingly and took his own life and Harper shouldn't be the one to blame for his irrational actions. This is also why I believe that scene was drawn out so long. Great filmmaking. Great movie. Great message. Let me know what you guys think.
I see this representation. she willingly causes the man injury and the man willingly injured himself- even more from the injury she caused him
It also reflects the scars her husbands received from his fall. We can clearly see his hand was almost split in two from the spike. Additionally, the men’s ankles break, which is also something we see happened to her husband
ah-ha, BUT, she willingly grabbed the hand that was shoved through the mail slot. the green man offered his hand to her, and she had every chance to run away or not grab his hand, but she DECIDED to grab his hand. then only after the hand squeezed her, did she stab the green man.
The hand she took was female. Perhaps she felt she could trust for this reason but was duped.
I love this take! My thought was that it represents the unyielding nature of men’s pursuits.
Did you notice how when the Vicar first enters the bathroom with Harper, he says he is a swan? Wondering if that is alluding to the Greek myth where Zeus turns into a swan and rapes Leda. I could see similarities to Helen of Troy, men going to war and turning violent/unhinged all over a woman who basically has no agency. Weird too how Leda is also Jessie Buckley's character's name in The Lost Daughter.
Ooh, I didn't catch that! Great observation and points!
Good observation!! I forgot about his comment!
I didn’t catch that either but I should have connected some dots when I heard Agamemnon’s name. I forget but didn’t he die by his wife’s hand naked while bathing?
The first thing he says when he enters the bathroom is "A shudder in the loins engenders there the broken wall, the burning roof and tower, and Agamemnon dead," which is a direct quote from the poem "Leda and the Swan" by William Butler Yeats. This is identified in the end credits.
I think he mentions Ulysses too... likening her echoes in the tunnel to that of the siren that lures his boat to the rocks. Also the Echo theme from Greek mythology. Echo would enable Zeus to cavort and rape through distraction and she was cursed into an echo. Temptation and distraction reoccurring themes.
She felt they had finally seen each other as he was falling, she was looking out and he was looking in. She went out there to heal and i think this movie is about the painful process of learning why your abuser is the way he is and that it’s not your fault despite what others say. The order of the birth showed how he became that way. From the not actually harmful natural state to selfish boy to self righteous and horny man to white knight nice guy to husband and so many other abusive men
Just saw the film earlier today. Your take on it really resonates with me. I feel like this movie can be interpreted as both a personal story of processing trauma as well as an allegory about toxic masculinity. Most discussion seems to revolve around the allegory, understandably so because that's the part that seems politically relevant. But there's a whole other component to this film, which is a personal story about healing from abuse. This movie's gonna stick with me for awhile.
yes.
I think it’s interesting that each birth is becoming more unnatural. It starts from where a vagina would be but each birth becomes weirder and crazier. I think it shows how you said that the men became that way over time. They weren’t born naturally as assholes but they learned somehow or another through religion/traditions/ etc. that it’s okay to treat woman poorly.
My first marriage was emotionally/psychologically abusive and my husband did try to kill himself after I left him. This movie felt so relatable and real to me. I was very scared of men for a long time after what I went through, but I was able to face my reality just like Harper.
lol no shit that's great
I think Geoffrey giving birth to all the men was a really creative way to show how the issues this movie is addressing are multi generational.
The same film can be made about Women.
@@sednasix6608 Can we please have a discussion about men’s problematic behaviour without it being a discussion about women’s and who’s worst?
@@Babyblue115 Really feels like we only discuss men's problematic behavior these days. When exactly are we allowed to discuss women's problematic behavior?
@@justin9744
It’s not allowed to be done right now because it doesn’t fit into the narratives and agenda they’re trying to push.
Bingo!
Great review mate .I would like to point out something no one noticed .During the conversation with her friend ,while she was holding her phone the camera points on her tiny tattoo in her hand.
This is a nordic rune called Berkana.The birch tree was a symbol of fertility in quite a few different myths from European folklore. Likewise, the shape of this rune implies a stylized female form. Berkana (also "Berkano") represents the universal idea of the Goddess and the powerful bond between mother and child. A powerful sense of nurturing, protection, support and creation are indicated by this rune. All of the feminine mysteries are contained in Berkana, as the traditionally male mysteries are contained in Uruz. As with Uruz, the gender-leaning of the rune does not necessarily mean that the rune applies strictly to a male or a female person -- and can also apply to a nuturing, supportive male.
Either a pregnancy or a new start in a person's life is indicated here -- or the fertility of a new business venture. Berkana indicates a fresh perspective, a good start. Aside from a physical birth, a rebirth, or a burst of creativity may be indicated. Berkana frequently refers to domestic issues and personal relationships -- particularly those involving emotional support, nurturing and "standing by" loved ones. Berkana can also represent a person who is a healer, whether a nurse, doctor, or other kind of medical practitioner. The energies of this rune are healing and life-giving.
And that is the role that her frend plays throughout the film. Her friend is also pregnant! Great catch!
I'm curious to know what you all think about the apples falling from the tree all at once? I'm not sure what caused that to happen, but to me it was a very literal symbol of the apple not falling for from the tree. Another show that the toxic nature of these men is passed through generations.
I thought it was more of a direct view of how men control the world. That man has all control in the little town they were in and the apples falling from the tree was just a flex. She has taken an apple from that tree earlier…
To me it was the kubler Ross 5 stages of grief. The colors too represent that. Red, green, blue, black.
The priest explaines it is in "man's" primitive "nature" to keep coming back to the woman for lust and the slit vagina (finger in the bench, slit in the sky universe like a vagina, he's arm split like a vagina with her head through the slit) her husband said his death will haunt her forever. So whatever injury she inflicts on the man he keeps forever with each new man coming after her. The arm and leg injury from the knife and car crash. Was the same exact injury her husband sustained from his fall. The acceptance stage is the final stage of grief when she's on the couch with him
LOVE THIS!!
She also stabs the man-deity through the mail slot!
I really enjoyed this analysis thank you. I have a different interpretation of the birthing sequence though. There is a line from that Landlord shortly before this sequence that I think is key. He speaks about his father telling him he is a 'failed military man' at the age of 7. I think the birthing sequence shows us that toxic men 'birth' toxic men through how they raise them. So they aren't so much aspects of James in this sequence as progenitors; James is the result of the cycle putting all these toxic traits in to him. I think the Green Man is there to represent paganism and nature, and therefore the cycle of life (expressed also through the deer corpses). He shows this is an eternal cycle.
Ooooh, I love this. I feel like that makes a lot of sense.
LOVE this!
@Biden Cringe literally nowhere in the movie does it imply anything about her not wanting kids lol. The details of their relationship are vague, but the point is clearly that he is manipulative to her. You're just projecting some "evil feminist" strawman onto the movie because you're mad at the message it was conveying. I think they could have added more details about what led their relationship to that point, but you're missing the whole thing if you don't realize it's about toxic masculine behavior and how it's perpetuated. All of the men represent different forms of this behavior, they are all played by the same actor, and all give birth to the next, finally leading to her husband. It's pretty clear symbolism imo
Biden Cringe ur cooked outta ur mind if u think it isn’t about male toxicity. It’s literally so obvious lmao
This is really great. The imagery of the dandelions also works with your interpretation.
Really enjoying reading everyones comments and points. I like how the film plays on various pathetic male archetypes. One thing I noticed is that some of the men in the village on one hand appear to be helpful but are ultimately hurtful towards Harper. For example, the law man, who on one hand is supposed to protect Harper but ultimately dismisses her concerns. Sounds familliar. The vicker, who on one hand is there to provide spiritual support but tells Harper it was her responsibility to forgive her emotionally (and physically) abusive husband. Then there's the 'Nice Guy' host Geoffrey, who does everything to accomodate Harper but freaks out and crashes her car when she tries to leave. Then there's the man baby "teenager," who doesn't make any attempt to appear helpful, but only sees Harper as an object and a difficult woman who won't play his game. It annoys him to see Harper prioritizing her agency. These are the hazards of life many women have endured over and over by men who don't take them seriously.
YES!
@Biden Cringe YES
@Biden Cringe I LOVE that you think that sounds like an insult 😂. Now that women can work, have bank accounts, and have rights without a husband, they're leading happy lives with or without men in them. (I'm more of a dog person, personally 😛).
Extra note: thank you for providing minutes of entertainment with your comments. You're a hoot and a half!
I love this!! Great take
Perfect!
Phew, the toxic comments abound here. We have a woman who is abused, stalked by a peeping tom, sexually assaulted, dismissed by police, and almost killed by a psychopath, and it's about society's refusal to see these events as anything other than HER fault. And y'all are kind of proving the movie's point.
The dangers of that is that it's that the way things have changed in our society now it doesn't relate that way. Women are empowered immensely now. The movie is exaggerating the old tropes of men especially in Cinema but compared to our current times it's crap. I mean look what just happened to Amber and Depp case. I bet people will act like that's an outlier when in fact it happens a lot. I get the message but hopefully it won't skew time in people's already delusional perceptions.
@@ThaMaven you do realise that was a defamation case, right? The case was to decide whether her writing the Op Ed had defamed him or not. The jury ruled in his favour. But it also ruled that his lawyer had defamed her. It was never a question of whether abuse took place - it did. On both sides, to degrees, perhaps. But he is not "innocent" in this.
@@leighsherval1023
What he means by “happens all the time” is the false claims of abuse.
@@leighsherval1023I think you've misunderstood. swaggo was talking about how it has been proven that amber heard lied. he is saying that women lie a lot
So the main point of the movie is victim blaming is bad?
It’s nice to hear a bloke who’s not giving a scathing review on this movie. So it wasn’t perfect so what? It’s refreshing to see a movie made from a woman’s perspective and the frustrations women still experience today. Practically being called hysterical for worrying about a man stalking her. Also as a Brit this movie is relatable, I have met all of these men.
Ah yes, the frustrations of being in the most privileged group of human beings in history.
@@rodericblack4657 ???
when james fell they showed his head which had a big wound, when james appears at the end his head is fine but she had the ax and she ended up breaking his head and killing him
Did she end up breaking his head or you saw another movie?
@@mickeymengistu6834 no she ends up killing him thats the whole point. it was her way of moving on, he obviously wasnt the real him more like a haunted memory. she didnt keep him around. at the end she finished the job. when he fell you could see all his wounds, when he reappears every wound is there except the big wound on his head
@@papinbala he said he needed her "love" and she ended up breaking him? Thats a funny way of showing love I guess but if he disappears no problem 😁
Good thoughts. I relate with everything you said. I will also mention the fact that there’s a clear metaphor for adam and even in the garden of Eden. When eve partakes of the fruit she is fallen and blamed for the fall of men. It’s even mentioned as a joke early in the movie. Her mistake supposedly is the cause men suffer.
MEN reminded me of MOTHER, which had lots of subliminal messages and meaning. I think this movie each male character represents either the main characters different emotions and feelings or her late husbands emotions and feelings. From anger, strange, kindness, spoilt like the creepy child wanting what he wants. Also the naked man represents nature, birth and reborn like a reincarnation. If anybody else knows more just let me know 🙂👍🏽
i thought of Mother! a lot while watching this!!
@@isabellemoorby5001 Yeah me too! especially after it spirals out of control in the third act. From being somewhat tied to reality to totally unhinged.
It reminded me of mother toooo
The Dandelion seed. It comes from a dead flower, gets deposited in the head of a dead deer. The concept that life and beauty can only come from death and decay. Maybe, the cycle of toxic masculinity for Harper died with the killing of James' birthed version and a new beginning can spring forth.
I think the rebirth scene shows how we try to go through different iterations of ourselves, but no matter how much we change the outside, we still carry the same wounds and scars with us, no matter how much we wanna ,,slip out of our skin“.
Very interesting take
Great thoughts on the meaning. I'll be the first to say that Rory Kinnear requires an oscar nomination for this film. Especially for his role as the vicar. But I assume the Academy won't touch this movie with a ten foot pole.
This was the worst movie I’ve ever seen in my life.
@@connorgreer157 because you either don’t understand it (and believe “don’t get it = bad”) or you don’t like the way the movie makes men look?
@@connorgreer157 no
I thought it sucked so bad
@@bloonzies I’m a woman and this movie was TERRIBLE it was as ridiculous as modern day feminism is. I have every right that a man has it’s all a joke
I do think it’s interesting how James was birthed feet first. To me it connotes the idea of his evilness being so inhumane, that he is not birthed naturally
This movie took a very heavy religious route, which IMO is what made it so good. Let's start from the top:
1. 3 minutes into the movie, before she even meets the owner of the house, she eats an apple. We all know what that means. While making introductory small talk with the landlord, he notices the half eaten apple and jokingly brings it up calling them "the forbidden fruit".
2. When the naked intruder is arrested at the house, the cop mentions at the bar later in the movie that he "didn't steal anything, except an apple."
3. Now the pre-Christian part: The idols displayed in the movie are called The Green Man and Sheela-na-gig. They are *_not_* two sides of the same coin, rather two very different representations of fertility and growth:
- Green Man represent rebirth, spring, a new chapter, pretty much the entirety of what the main character is going through. The scenes in the movie where she was enjoying the walk in the woods, looking at the trees, admiring the nature, all have to do with this idol.
- Sheela-na-gig is kind of a different story mainly because theologists/anthropologists have no idea what she symbolized. I take that back, they have ideas, just none of them are definite answers. Theories include pagan fertility goddess (IMO the most likely), idol to ward off evil spirits, and wouldn't ya know, the patriarchal explanation where the idol represents "a warning of lust, to not give into your desires. Women are evil, remember what Eve did...blah blah blah."
4. Herefordshire, where the movie takes place, has their own 1st century church with Green Man and Sheela-na-gig idols carved into the door. It's actually the church used in the movie. Not only that, but the tympanum (arch above a heavily decorated door) is carved with the _tree of life_ coming full circle.
5. Random but: The main character is Irish in real life. The Sheela-na-gig is an Irish mythological idol, but has also been discovered all across Europe.
You make good mythological points...I see two male energies coming together in this film:1) James (the husband and scion of Man as human), and the Green Man as an elemental male force of nature...From the moment she took a bite out of the Apple she drew the elemental force of that fertility god to her...From then on it attempted to approach her through the borrowing of the presence of the other males...In finding its reference points to the female protagonist it only has as sources the concepts of each of those males and most devastatingly -- the pervasive and powerful memory of her deceased husband...The Green Man -- being a fertility god -- keeps birthing the males as archetypal models to present to the woman as fertility avatars...She rejects all approaches until James is brought forth...In reality this entity is an amalgamation of the Green Man's interpretation of James and the sheer primal drive of the entity known as the Green Man...What the woman does next is a matter of speculation -- she either conquers and destroys the Green Man's last avatar or she communes with it in a reproductive sense...When her friend arrives the party is over...Either destruction was complete or new life came forth and disappeared to the forest...She smiles at her very pregnant friend as she holds on to and looks at a very tiny sprig of Green Man in a sense of either relief or afterglow...
The bit where the naked man was caught as well was interesting. After Harper took an apple from the tree, Geoffrey said something about forbidden fruit. Then, the naked man was found confused around the apple tree, giving an impression of Adam and Eve and a reference towards the birth of man
biblically its the man who gives his rib to give birth to the woman, then the woman persuades the man to eat the apple.
@@papinbalaexactly! Geofry comments, forbidden fruit . Then Harper says “oh God..” Then he cuts her off to say he was joking. Like it was more God playing a joke on eve. I think the underlying theme is that even the bible was written by men.
@@MistaNimbus the bible was written by men yes, the only thing that was written by God were the 10 commandments on tablets which were given to moses. But i dont think the underlying theme was that even the bible was written by men, this is obvious every book in the bible has an author, there is no revelation here to unpack, its basic knowledge. Me personally i dont see a clear message here, its up for anyones interpretation
The naked man represents rebirth . The rest of the men represents each personality that her x showed. I loved this movie once i put it all together...brilliant
See most people dont want to figure things out. I had a good idea going in just needed a few more folks to verify my opinion
Yes! I hadn't even gone that direction and it makes so much sense. My spouse and I saw it on the 20th and we are still talking about it. And I floated this idea to him and he said "Oh yeah, that's perfect"
@@davidcarney1827 Exactly, and the main character is represented by the Sheela-na-gig and Irish pre-Christian mythology as well.
I was reading that some people saw the people in the movie as different toxic archetypes. The boy is the way children are socialized to behave / treat girls. The vicar is the person of authority that abuses that power. The nice guy that owns the villa is just that - a nice guy (the sort of person who does nice things for women and then expects emotional labor or more often, affection, as repayment).
I wanted it to sort of fit the view that all of the men are aspects of the ex husband but other than being an emotional manchild who resorts to violence I didn't see it *explicitly* but this is a movie, not a documentary/tv show so it still definitely can work. It would conclude that the ex husband, who started off blaming his wife of all these misdeeds was actually emotionally manipulating her and in truth put her through an emotionally abusive relationship
One last thought from reading comments is that a lot of men are reacting defensively to this movie. The movie doesn't attack men as a category - there is an explicit "villain" in this movie so why would a random audience member feel attacked?
I think they feel attacked because they’re invested in misogyny and feel it benefits them , this takes the form of “misogyny doesn’t exist” and so any attempt to expose it , as this movie does, they attack. Even tho the movie shows very clearly ways the patriarchy hurts men, they are blind to that
@@abigailv5347 spitting facts
@@abigailv5347 or maybe it’s because of arguments like this lol. You don’t even have an example of a criticism and yet look how easily you chalk it up to malice.
@@waynedurning8717 the comment section is rife with examples of ppl being defensive, like how you’re being right nnow w
@@abigailv5347 How is it "hurting" us?
I can't stop thinking about the phone glitches and the end reveal that the friend is pregnant which follows a bunch of obscene births.
Also think they missed an opportunity to isolate Harper further by having a female emergency line operator and a female police officer. Would have liked for them to be men to make the experience even more surreal.
I took note of that too. I think the reason the emergency operator and police officer were female were to show that women were the only ones to show empathy/truly to try help her
@@scout4106 Yes I agree. Also anything that was positive and beautiful in the movie was reflected by a female character: i.e. her appreciation of nature, the beautiful piano playing, her friendships, her voice and echoes in the tunnel, her friend in the end appearing pregnant. Harper is calmly examining the beauty of the leaf at the very end (after I think giving James the axe literally and figuratively), hopefully that energy overcomes all toxicity.
Presumably implying that she's having a son, continuing the cycle
The female police officer is there and reports that the nude vagrant is mostly harmless. That is important because Harper trusts females and sees them as right. So for the movie it establishes that the vagrant is harmless. In fact in all aspects the men around her are actually harmless. Harper is the one that makes them threatening. It's pathological. That's the lie. So much so that James was also harmless. Which likely means he probably did not jump off the balcony and was pushed. That's the real monster so to speak. However she sees all men as contemptible and something to be controlled. It's why they are all portrayed as the same in the movie.
@@metatechnologist Except that James was actually harmful and violent to her. And the vicar tried to strangle her while molesting her, the other characters were breaking into the house and not for a tea party.
I'm wondering if her friend that arrives at the end being pregnant had anything to do with the visual imagery in the film or why Harper decided to leave her husband. It seems that her husband was blindsided by the divorce and said "you're not divorcing me, you're divorcing who I've been in the last year." Im wondering if her friend getting pregnant triggered something in herself, realizing what she had to look forward to herself. Through that lense, the birthing cycle of her husband's characteristics seems to click!
The movie never goes into saying what the issue was between James and Harper, but with the fertility sculpture and the multiple rebirth and the friend being pregnant, maybe James cheated or he was impotent?
@Biden Cringe wat?
Great analysis! Just saw the movie tonight. You are bang on for a lot of the interactions that Harper had.
The face on the stone carving in the church is of the Green Man, a spirit of the woods in UK folklore. So that definitely gave this a slight suburban Wicker man vibe.
The biggest take away from this movie is when a woman just needs to self reflect and heal it is hard for her to do so, because all of the men around her want something from her. They constantly make demands of her because they feel they are more important. Even at the end when the rental agent is talking about how he has to step in to save her, even though she's just been attacked, he makes it about him. How his father treated him and made him feel inadequate.
Thank you for saying, "I don't get that mindset - but I do know it's prevalent." A lot of people just say they disbelieve to the point of... Well, just not believing us?
The Green Man - pagan myth of rebirth/spring - is depicted by the naked man, symbolized on the church alter.
His face is typically half human half tree.
He pays respect to life cycles of nature, depicted by the decomposing deer.
He symbolizes the fertility of the earth.
Perhaps this movie is critiquing the idea of a male deity for birth/rebirth. Perhaps it's suggesting even deities can be influenced by their gender psychology.
That's the same conclusions I drew from watching this movie once
@@Naturegirl1976 gnus
Perhaps that baptismal font with the green man on one side and the woman giving birth on the other expresses the duality of creation, where man has to enter and leave by the female gate and the female has to become the gate for creation to happen. Individually both are limited, only in the duality can creation occur.
🧠
I’ve read reviews on this film, and my god its really really sad. People literally walked into a horror film expecting something not scary or traumatizing. That’s kinda the point. The visuals of this film were beautiful. The sounds and soundtrack were beautiful. The symbolism and tying together of everything was very well done. I feel like all the negative reviews come from smooth brains that can’t understand something unless it is blatantly stated outright.
I thought the film was visually stunning and the story that was there was interesting, however a lot of the symbolism and metaphors were just there to be there. Some of it was very interesting and thought provoking (the men in the village sharing the same face, the birthing scene towards the end, the statue alter thing in the church for example). But beyond those 3 examples I feel like the rest of the symbols served little to no purpose it was very random in the context of the story. As a film student much of the film felt like what a classmate of mine would make when they wanted to make something “experimental”
I feel like this film would have worked a million times better as a short rather than a feature because there came a point where it felt like they had run out of substantive metaphors that worked within the context of the rest of the film and so to negate this they started throwing more random symbols (that with context could have been really interesting) in to pad for run time. I’m a fan of thought provoking filmmaking that incorporates symbols within the story. But symbols without context or purpose doesn’t read as thought provoking, it comes across as pretentious. And that’s my main take away from this, it was a visually stunning film with an interesting premise, that just fell short to its own pretentiousness. Call me smooth brain all you want lol.
So far I've only seen men making reviews of this film and telling us what it means. Ironic? You make so many valid points but don't mention the lady police officer who was full of understanding, with her most important line "he seems harmless". She represents the woman in authority given to her if she complies, i.e the naivety of women. The vicar of course is the religious advisor, appearing to stand for good against evil, classically a male role, who has hidden intentions. I thought it was a wonderful film and Rory Kinnear is a great actor. It gave me a few flashbacks to watching The League of Gentlemen. (Mostly I kept thinking "what a beautiful house") : )
Finally got a chance to sit and pay attention to this today. I think you're spot on about everything except the woodsy guy. I think he was/is the personification of toxic masculinity who only showed up once Harper made herself known near the tunnel. She was having a private moment of joy, and it woke him up causing him to chase after her and ruin it.
Loved your take on this. Earned a sub for sure.
Agreed except one thing, the guy in the tunnel that wakes up is most likely not the naked guy. The guy in the tunnel is clearly wearing a jacket/robe of some sort. May even be the vicar.
@@Pikaroth Oh, I didn't notice that! I just assumed it was the same person. I'll have to watch again.
@@jimmymcgreason The first time that I saw it, I, too, thought it was the same guy (the naked guy). However, I read somewhere (forgot where) that the guy in the tunnel clearly was wearing clothing, and it was most likely the vicar. I re-watched it obviously, and sure enough, the guy in the cave, to me at least, does clearly appear to be in a jacket or robe of some sort. I think the naked guy was hanging out in the abandoned house she passed before the field and did not follow her from the cave. But yeah, check it out and see what you think!
I feel you truly explained every character and the storyline/plot exactly how I interpreted it completely!!! Bravo, thank you!
Excellent review!
I think you might be interested to check out more about the folklore and biblical references in the film.
Namely the Green Man, Who is a symbol of rebirth and Sheela na-gig.
I laughed so hard when the cop said they had to release him. It could take place in NYC as they let all the Criminals out. Thanks to the policies
@Edwin I don't know. There's a lot of blaming women in the church. More traditional Christians don't believe abuse of any kind is justification for divorce, only that the man should learn to be more Christ like and the woman to forgive him. Belief It or Not did a whole video on that side of Christianity.
@Biden Cringe I don’t see how she was abusing him.
Brilliant review. I loved this film. Couldn't get her echo call in the tunnel out my head for days, creepy!
She doesn’t see the first Man until she eats the apple, which we then learn is the “forbidden fruit” / fruit of knowledge, opening her eyes to the evil of man.
There is also a subtle hint to this when she briefly plays the piano, which she claimed to have no ability to do at the beginning of the film.
YES! I totally forgot to touch on the whole "original sin" idea and how Eve (and then all women) is demonized for eating the forbidden fruit and causing the downfall of man... but Adam used his own free will to take the fruit. There's so much to unpack just in that portion. Great observation!!
The apple does not fall far from the tree. I really thought the last frame of the movie would be her cutting down the apple tree but I'm much happier with what we got.
I'm afraid I don't see your point in regards to the piano. She eats the fruit as soon as she enters the house and says she doesn't play piano during the tour, and then twenty or so minutes later she's on the piano. I personally don't see how those two connect since it appeared more like she was just lying to Geoffrey so he wouldn't ask her to play for him.
I’m liking this one!
@@spudman1734 I was about to say this.
She is a liar to me and will say anything
Your analysis earned an instant follow from me. Thank you for reading this film at a deeper level.
This movie has been running through my head for a bit and I’ve thought about some of its themes and ambiguity.
One thing I realized was in regards to whether her husband jumped to his death or not.
When Harper is on the phone with her friend for the first time she tells Harper a small little fact about the elephant being the only animal that cannot jump, which to me implies that her husband did intentionally jump to his death. Just a thought. I love these types of movies and I am sure I’ll be dissecting this one for awhile. Might even go see it again.
Ah, nice catch on the elephant bit.
@Biden Cringe I don’t think so, seeing as she says elephants are the only animal that (can’t) jump, implying the jumping of her husband from the balcony. But that’s just my thoughts on it.
@MasterOnion North there was a lot off about Harper. But others keep ignoring it.
@MasterOnion North It wasn't her story though in the flashbacks, it was what actually happened. We don't see why he fell, but he did threaten that he will kill himself. If anything, she was still gullible at this point that she still considered his death could've been accidental, that she still gave him the benefit of the doubt. In the end though, she wasn't having it anymore and just accepted that he was a toxic man; recalling all his "forms" giving birth to each other in quick succession, like a snake shedding its skin. His final form as James is just a reveal to the viewer that it was him all along, just in different abusive forms such as a nice man (Geoffrey), or a religious righteous man (the Vicar), sometimes an immature bigot (the teenager) etc. I think the green man is his first form, blowing the dandelion seeds as to how he made her fall for him in the first place, and was also the one who "proposed" through the door before turning violent. Also, I don't think any of it happened, what we see in the end is her sitting outside covered in blood, and her crashed car with some blood stains on the floor. No sign of Geoffrey or anyone's body. It might be that she hurt herself getting over the trauma and accepting that it wasn't her fault.
I see the plant guy as a metaphor for the family tree - passing down all the bad things from man to man, continuing the cycle
The ‘forced chivalry’ of Geoffrey was a good observation. I also think it’s likely Harper was pregnant, and escaping London to debate on the future of the pregnancy
big Roe vs wade fan i am guessing?
@@hum-dinger2453 is this a UFC thing?
This was a really great analysis. Definitely subscribing!
I adored this film. The central themes is all about toxic masculinity, incel’s and the lengths men will go to to uphold misogyny and control women. I cannot get over how good this movie is.
It was well executed and the acting is great. A lot of tired tropes…..yes, yes, men are all the same.
We are all terrible and abusive, got it, got it.
Who was the incel character?
Anyway, the message of the movie was a little vapid but it was delivered in a thought provoking and skillful way.
I enjoyed it.
@@johnnyripple8972 I believe the owner of the home is the incel.
@@vanitysmirror
Could be.
I didn’t really see it that way, just as him being awkward and putting on a phony front.
But, you could well be right.
The Agamemnon reference is not to the character itself, but to the poem "Leda and the Swan" by W.B. Yeats which draws parallels between Leda/Harper/Victim and Swan/Vicar/Rapist. There is also a reference to Harper being a Siren and the Vicar being Ulysses in another poem. And the stone planter is a reference to the "green men" or Irish/British/etc. "old men of the forest. The other status is a sheela na gig.
I applaud them for making daring films. Amazing cast. However, It feels heavy handed with the symbolism. I think if it was more subtle, you would have had a winner.
Agreed, I also think that if they hadn't had a scene where her husband punches her in the face, there could/would have been some interpretations to show that even though "MEN" in this story are horrible, their existence of NEEDING a woman's approval to even have a life worth living is extremely sad and sympathetic (maybe pitiful is a better word)...
I think they could have made the themes of the movie stronger had that scene not existed, as it sorta excluded the types of men who would never physically assault anyone, as opposed to being able to paint a broader brush to encompass all men, showing our "evil" and "pitiful" natures as tragically one in the same and being applicable to all of us as opposed to the small % that are easily identifiable as the bad eggs.
Made me feel like The Green Knight with the symbolism near the end
Here are several things I picked up from this movie:
The opening shot is orange, and every scene with James is orange
- orange is a color of autumn, autumn represents change and the end
- autumn sometimes symbolizes change or the end before death (winter)
- Harper is ending the relationship, and at the end Harper's perspective changes
Harper wears pink in most of the movie
- link represents love, youth, feminimity, tenderness, care
Harper is surrounded by greenery
- green represents growth, renewal, healing, birth, rebirth
The house
- someone else said here that the house represents the womb!
- the men constantly barging into the house or trying to is like a man trying to "barge" into a woman
- the walls are red, and red also represents love, hate, anger, power
The stone in the church:
- has a man and woman back-to-back
- stones represent permanence, stability, grounded to the earth
Someone else said the tunnel represents a vaginal canal
- this is a space Harper is comfortable in until she sees someone at the end of it. That someone comes into the tunnel, invading her space
- the tunnel echoes, and echoes signify repitition (repitition emphasizes meaning), cycles, and going back-and-forth (like Harper thinking of James)
The pond nature-shot:
-water symbolizes life and reflection
- the water eventually ripples
- this shot happens when Harper is walking around. Harper is still thinking about her life, *reflecting about her causing James to die*
The crow in the house:
- breaks through a window, which is a *destruction of escape,* hope, and an alternative path
- crows represent death. A man threw a crow into the house, a threat of death or to use death
- the "little" boy playing with the crow and then not believing Harper with her knife is a clear connection to the boy *playing with death*
- the boy using the bird as a toy with the woman mask on it signifies men using women as toys or for pleasure
Harper eats from an apple tree
- apples connect to the Tree of Knowledge of Good and Evil
- Harper sees the truth after eating tbe apple, but copes with it througout the movie
- "Eve"
The Naked Man
- follows, grabs, stalks, and blows dandelion seeds at Harper
- also eats from the apple tree
- "Adam"
- Eventually becomes both the man and woman from the stone in the church
- Dandelions:
- blowing them is like "getting your wish"
- in Greek, "Taraxacum" is a combo of words that mean disorder and remedy
- the flower itself represents life, so the puffball must symbolize immaturity or growth??
After the bar scene:
- Harper continues to look behind her. Behind her is a graveyard. This likely reminds the audience that she is *still* looking back at her past with James and what happened
Each man that invades her space is representative of a deadly sin
James- Greed
Rude boy- Gluttony (interchangeable with James??)
Naked Man- Envy (he doesn't have what Harper has)
Geoffrey- Pride (chivalry)
The cop- Sloth (doesn't do his job)
Man from the bar- Wrath (is mad for unknown reasons)
The vicar- Lust (for obvious reasons)
Very well thought out! Thank you for sharing this!!
Excellent
Just saw this so I might be late to the party. This film was a direct reference to women, and the weight of hundreds, if not thousands of years of oppression. The biblical references of Adam and Eve from the beginning of this picture were prominent throughout the film. I believe this was meant to draw highlight on the society that we live in, with respect to women and how men have always treated them.
The entire film is about control. Throughout our society and history we’ve seen men use their power to make women give in to their needs and wants. We’ve also seen men go out of their way to be a gentleman whilst removing women counterparts from the ability to make their own decisions, as if they’re void of the ability to make decisions altogether. The bar scene brought these motifs to light when Harper isn’t even allowed to order a drink for herself without a man to buy it for her. Knowing all of this, no matter how hard men try, they cannot replace or accept the notion that without women they would not be alive.
These notions draw about the outline for the film, and also the inspiration for what Alex Garland is trying to put highlight on. The first sequence in the films shows Harper arriving at the country house after a devastating sequence of events with her husband. Immediately after arriving, Harper sees a tree bearing fruit, which compels her to eat an apple off it. After meeting Jeffrey, he even remarks on this! Then after showing her the house and explaining the amenities, Harper goes on a walk alone. During the walk she’s encountered by a naked man who follows her back to the house.
This is a direct reference to Adam and Eve. Adam and Eve were both born naked, and it was Eve who decided to eat the fruit off the tree, which ultimately was cause for her sin. Ultimately, this could be a reason or motivation for why the naked man following her never hurts her. Instead everytime he’s seen around her he seems like he wants to be close to her, much like a man seeks a female companion. If Adam and Eve were the beginning of procreation between man and woman, then all this has to be a direct reference to the title of the film, and the oppression that women face.
Even the fact that all Rory Kinnear’s characters are the same draws highlight on the fact that all men are the same! The fact that Harper doesn’t realize this speaks to the notion that all men are the same and bear a similar face. As a man watching this film, from a women’s perspective it’s very easy to see and feel the isolation and terror women must feel in certain mens presences. Another thing I found interesting was the world that Alex Garland portrays in this film is errant of women. Only 3 women appear in the entire film and one of them you don’t see in the flesh til the end! I could go deep into the subliminal messages involved in this film, but ultimately this was a film about women and the oppression they face daily.
Fantastic watch and I can’t wait to own this film and see Alex’s future works!
"and the weight of hundreds, if not thousands of years of oppression"
Women were never oppressed. You're basically being tricked into being sexist towards men.
@@rodericblack4657 whoa, easy there… it’s just a movie. Was just drawing highlight into women’s history and the inner narrative told throughout the story, which parallels the characters and motifs in the film. That’s the story the director chose to tell, not me. Never once did I ever take a side or say I think for or against anything. I was merely saying what I got from the film. Interesting though you’d make a claim that women were NEVER oppressed! How about the 19th amendment or women’s suffrage to name a few? Ring a bell? 🤣🤣🤣
…deletes comment after realizing what a complete moron they are… 🤣🤦🏾♂️🙄
Saw so many interpretations of this movie, yours is the only one that actually made any sense!
A huge "Thank you" to the reviewer and many who have shared their comments. I watched the film earlier today. I left the theatre feeling lost. I appreciate the time so many invested to share their insights and observations. NOW, some of the symbolism in the movie makes sense. I would not watch it again, but I am better prepared to explain why others might want to see the film. This movie will be shown in movie appreciation courses. Well done.
This movie felt like all the things women complain about men doing. That’s why all the men where the same actor as I felt it was to show that all men are the same. No matter who she ran into in the town they all wanted to have sex with her. The ending to me was an example of what men truly want which is the power to give birth. Men hold ever lever of power in society except the ability to create life and not having that power drives them mad. I also think it shows that men having kids on their own without a women may be doomed to raising the same monster. Garland made a horror movie about the things women go through and deal with on a daily basis
Excellent walkthrough and dissection of the film’s narrative. Very well articulated. You’ve got a new subscriber.
Thank you, I appreciate that!
2 new subs
The tunnel scene blows my mind through the roof. Not only during the scene but also when the movie ends and you have a better understanding of who the man is.
Harper finds a tunnel in a beautiful forest. She enters the tunnel with a view of the other end of the forest. The tunnel is pitch black and mysterious. Harper plays with the acoustics of the tunnel and makes music and brings herself joy. A moment later we see the man at the end of the tunnel. The movie implies he was there the whole time. He stands. A tunnel that echoes the smallest noise. He makes no sound. He does not introduce himself. He starts to sprint towards her. Harper then starts to leave going back the way she came.
Later in the movie, we find that the man is naked and may represent some form of god. Going back to the tunnel scene, this knowledge that he may be a god reframes the tunnel scene.
To me, the tunnel represented life. A dark and mysterious path with beauty at the end. At the end of the tunnel is our godlike figure who observes Harper from where he sits in silence.
The tunnel represents a vagina, the naked man comes out of the tunnel, represents birth, fear and pain that arises from birth
I did notice he looked broad shouldered like he was wearing a suit or blazer but is he not supposed to be the naked man in the next scene? Imma rewatch it tomorrow to make sure.
I can see how all of the men in the movie were forms of James haunting her which led to her wanting the divorce to begin with. Makes so much sense to me when put that way
What she liked about James was probably the character that was helpful, carrying her bags, showing her around, being genuinely nice
All the things she didn’t like about James were all the other characters in the movie. Dismissing her feelings, blaming her for their actions and treating her like an object etc
Thank you so much for the review
I like this take.
She did not like that Geoffrey "the nice guy" at all. She made fun of him to her friend and lied to him twice. So many people miss that part.
The first thing that came to my mind at the final scene when her pregnant friend showed up was: "she's got insane and killed the first guy...". So there's something still present in the society that leads us to blame women, even after all the horror they've been gone throught... This movie is just perfect.
Love your video!
After doing some of my own research, I found that the “nature man” is a personification of that stone face carving. Historically it has been called “green man” and carvings have been found all throughout Europe; some dating back to second century C.E. These carvings were eventually adopted by Christian churches. The real meaning of the carvings are unclear, as it was first made when an official language had not yet existed and this could not be recorded, but many believe it is a symbol of unofficial paganism in alliance with official religion.
I’d also like to share my opinions on “the birthing” scene. I think it represents generational trauma and how toxic masculinity is passed down generation to generation; each one more pathetic and wrongfully entitled than the last, which is why the first body is the nature man (the most primal of all the men) and the last body is James. He is the modern man-child, an example of how men feel entitled to everything a woman has and is.
Let me know what you think!
No not even close because if you seen the movie and you seen the scene with her friends shows up at the end it lets you know everything that happened didn't really even happen.
I think you’re right Peyton . I think it’s also an interesting point that as the rebirths happen, they are more and more violently destructive to the host. The first is an ordinary vaginal birth and it ends in the bloodbath everyone remembers
You are correct ...I'd also look up SHEELA NA GIG... 12 or 13 the century Irish(?) sculptures of woman spreading vulva and a huge inspiration per the director ...puts things in perspective
I like this
I literally just got home from the theaters seeing this movie and I won't lie it left me quite perplexed as I was walking out to go home. I was expecting a bit more of a clear-cut answer to what exactly was going on and felt I didn't receive it, but after listening to your review I now have a bit more of an appreciation for the movie and understand what was the point was being driven home. Would I recommend this one to a friend, no, but it was an interesting watch.
I'm glad it helped! And I totally get still not wanting to recommend this. And just because we can appreciate something doesn't mean we like it, right LOL!
I mirror your sentiments. And what about the pregnant friend???
My modest contribution to this centres on the opening and closing song LOVE SONG written by Lesley Duncan. The opening is sung by Lesley whilst the closing song by Elton John.
Has the male voice secured the final say?
I definitely think the green man is the representation of nature, he himself is not inherently hostile, but his lack of boundaries, being bare naked, and trying to enter her home, and his “natural” form brings forth the more toxic traits that have hurt and continue to hurt women in their lives, the need for control, the rage, the lust, the hate, all born from a “natural” place for men, from which they place the blame for it onto women, when truly all they’re doing is leeching off of women for their own desires, much like the maggots on the doe…
The movie is to showcase the modern world and its high standard of living created by men. The city, house, bar, car, technology is because men came together to create the society in which she is haunted by. She created her own hell by believing in the idea that women are created more equal than men.
@@bullhorn2208 I’d say it’s more a showcase of the failures of the society of men, they have the control, they feel they’re owed it, but it wasn’t men who created this society, it wouldn’t function without women after all. It’s this same feeling on privilege that’s makes men turn sour when they feel they don’t get what they think they’re owed, sparking violence towards those who they perceive as weaker, much like how even the “nice” one turned sour as soon as he didn’t get what he felt was owed by the woman. Women owe nothing to men, the fact that we’re all still alive today is in spite of men, the people who aren’t defined by a society that enforces rigid gender norms to get a sense of control over people.
@@bullhorn2208 We found the misogynist everybody! Did you even watch the movie? 🤦♀️
@@hotarubinariko i watched the movie and he's not wrong. Why is everything women disagree with dismissed as mysoginy?
@@ricardoh87 I mean he literally ends his statement implying women aren't equal to men. I guess that's not considered misogyny anymore? And it's only dismissed as misogyny when you're talking in a misogynistic manor. You can interpret the movie however you want but I don't think the message was "men are Gods for creating a high standard of living and woman can handle her inferiority. " maybe that's not how that was intended but that's how it reads.
I know you rate things with units based on couches, however, I personally believe you should used units based on munchies. It would fit more with your channel name. Great analysis, as always. Keep up the great work.
Alex Garland is amazing! I read a review that said that this movie wasn't representative of women's experiences and basically was terrible. I really like him so I was disappointed, and had low expectations. But wow. I related so much! It was really well made and terrible at the same time. During the priest scene where he blamed her for creating his experience of lust I was yelling at the screen, I really related to that as a survivor of sexual abuse and harassment. I really loved the birth scenes as gross as they were because I feel that that is in a sense how many men approach a lover, as a second / substitute mum, and they bring all of that baggage (good or bad) with them. In seeking love selfishly like a baby they become monsters because they are not babies, they are big and strong and sexually mature. That combination of wounded child and all the capacities and inclinations of a mature adult is dangerous. I know a lot of people might feel it would undo the work of this film but in the interests of empathy it would be nice to see Garland do a sister piece to this showing how women are monsters. For we are all capable of being monsters, and only the very meekest among us has not been that to someone at some point.
Nah women are perfect :D
This video was awesome I think you're completely correct. I loved the way you explained everything. I was able to easily follow along with everything you said. Instant new sub! ☺️
My hypothesis: she found out she was pregnant with a son and gave herself an abortion. Why she was alone at the end with the blood stained dress. Why her friend showed up pregnant The scene with the multi-birth was representing that she saw all men as the same and continually breeding themselves as oppressive towards women. I also believe this means She wasn’t a reliable narrator and she just saw all the men as the same without questioning it as a sort of delusion. She was also cursed by her husband which I don’t feel like was touched on
🤯
Thanks for your view on this film, i found that you helped me understand the most out of all the rest of the explained videos
Even with all the explanations given I still hated this movie. I was expecting more than what I got.
Sad
After watching I searched to help me with an understanding of the ending. I've watched several but this is the simplest but also allows me to think further and deeper but got me on the right track. Thanks
Great analysis. I thought this movie was a masterpiece when I left the theater, and now I like it even more. That's the most scared I've been in the theater in years, truly haunting visuals. And the way they captured toxic masculinity without feeling contrived. Then Geoff Barrow killing that soundtrack. It was incredible
'without feeling contrived' - they make all of the M£N played by the same actor, if that's not 'contrived' then what is?
@@helvete_ingres4717 like you said, it's called "Men". It's not called "Man".
@@helvete_ingres4717 I didn't even realize they were all the same actor until the end. I knew something felt odd and familiar but couldn't put my finger on it it was so subtle
You really need to watch more movies if you thought that was scary lol
@@superbadisfunmy what did I miss that's scarier than the first half of this movie? I will concede a bit and say that, after he stuck his hand through the mail hole, it became more funny than scary.
I find the ominous and unnerving things scary, cause it's closest to real fear. Jump scares, "spooky men" like Candyman or Jason, overtly supernatural stuff like a Blair Witch, none of that is scary to me. So, what's left?
I liked the little moment with the falling apples. "The apple doesn't fall too far from the tree". Toxic masculinity breeds toxic masculinity; sometimes, it's an ongoing generational cycle.
i love that her friend saw the aftermath, showing that the toxic side of men is also totally apparent to her as well
Two things I still don't understand:
- There were several creepy interruptions of a man (?) screaming while she was talking to her friend. Also, she gets a creepy message from her friend's phone from the 'man' that he knows where she is.
- Her friend shows up pregnant at the end. We didn't get any signs her friend was pregnant until the very end after the disgusting birthing sequence before that, which makes me think it was a reveal of some significance to the events that happened before.
Obviously her friend played a big role in the movie but I don't know what was her purpose yet?
The message could be indicative that part of these events were in her head. AngryJoeShow talked about this stuff in depth so I recommend his video. I think the pregnancy of her friend is just a red herring but who knows
Great take on the movie. Still one of the weirdest movies ive ever seen.
LOL! I totally get that!!
To me it was about a woman who cannot escape men's selfishness and demands to fulfill his wishes...his abuse. ...no matter what she does...all men are same and when you get rid of one another will follow...they are the same and that's why most men were played by same person.
I appreciate your thought process, but would like to add - I think there are a lot of male reviewers out there who are talking about the MEN in this movie as 'other men,' basically 'not all men' thinking. But that's part of the fallacy; even in your review, you mentioned how you wouldn't let the men in the pub talk to your female friend, which isn't too far from the nice guy 'help' offered by Geoffrey. I don't say this to slam you, but to point out how insidious toxic masculinity is, how it pervades all of us and how we view the world, and it is part of this reason why Harper ended up seeing all men as variations on the same face.
LOL. So it would be toxic to protect a woman in a bar when a very creepy malevolent man is trying to harass her? You’ve done drunk the kool aid bro.
“I hated the movie. But I think it’s a masterpiece?” is my thoughts on the movie and should be the quote on the box of the film.
I really want to know who actually died in the end, whose blood it was. Was it really Jeffrey's? There would be no reason for all of his characters to be at the house that night so I think after he began checking the perimeter and the plant man blew dandelions in Harper's face it at that point became unreliable/symbolic. Also her sister/friend being pregnant could play a part in influencing any hallucinatory visions (the birthing scene). The film also seems to be implying that all men are the same - each changing but with the same injuries and different skin.
One thing Jeffery did do in the beginning was when he mentioned her being a woman/lady and not to flush certain toiletries or whatever he said - like a she wouldn't know that.
A few things I didn't get was why when she was asked by Jeffrey if she played the piano she said no, but told her friend yes, and we find out she clearly could play. And one other thing - when she was on the phone with her friend and she said she would "take that axe and chop the guys..." and Harper herself did not know there was an axe behind her and had to ask "what axe?". Her friend could have seen it during the phone tour (I don't remember if she got to that room in the tour). The phone glitching and showing what looked to me like a screaming face was another thing that I could not piece together, as well as the harassing text messages. And why was the sister/friend not alarmed in the slightest to see Harper's car was wrecked? And she didn't seem to either 1) see the naked man in plain sight during the phone tour or 2) did not acknowledge him/see him/or knew who/what he was.
The plant man reminds me a tiny bit of the man from The Wailing.
@Biden Cringe The interesting thing about this movie is that your view of the opposite sex and the world will definitely impact what you take away from it. Because I got the complete opposite message!
@MasterOnion North the director confirmed That Everything That happens in the films is real she didnt imagine anything
@MasterOnion Northwhat's Up for interprétation is the meaning of the events
@Biden Cringe I do think your interpretation is interesting. And how many people will attack you in the comments and gloss over her lying. But Garland put that in there for a reason. Honestly would make the movie more interesting than men bad, patriarch, etc. etc. it beat over your head.
@Biden Cringe She lied because the landlord was making her uncomfortable by being passive aggressive and digging into her personal life and just generally being pushy. The landlord represents the type of men who are unaware if they are making a woman feel uncomfortable. Take that scene in the bar. He insists on buying her a drink despite her repeatedly refusing, showing he doesn't care to let her make her own decisions. Then he keeps talking, mostly to himself, and never gives her a chance to reply, as if what she says doesn't matter.
Harper lied about the piano at the beginning because she didn't want to keep talking to the landlord but also didn't want to appear rude. He would likely ask her to play for him even if she didn't want to. Some men don't understand when they are pushing boundaries and women lie to get out of a conversation so they don't seem rude when they turn down a man who's pushy.
Lying because someone feels uncomfortable and wants to escape from a conversation doesn't make them a bad person. Interesting that you decided to judge her character on that one point and went with "She's a crazy liar who can't be trusted" even though she never shown to be lying again in the movie. Maybe a sense of nuisance and a minimum of 2 braincells are need for viewing this movie.
Ironically, you are re-enforcing the toxic masculinity traits they showed in this movie. Assuming that people who attack you over your *self proclaimed* (correct) analysis are all bad people shows how immature and insecure you are. Like "You don't agree with my *totally correct opinion* cause you're a terrible person, totally not because my opinion is just stupid." Maybe the movie triggered a bit of insecurity there?
I've also noticed that most of the men look EXTREMELY similar. There were heavy Adam and Eve vibes from this movie; especially when she eats the apple off of the tree at the beginning, and we get the shot of the grounds keepers face as he watched her do it.
All the men were played by Rory Kinnear 😂
@@Trump20-24years yeah which fortifies the theory.
I just got home from seeing MEN at the independent community cinema where I work. I was really curious to hear what people made of it, so I did a search on RUclips and found a few explanation videos. Yours has been my favorite. I shared it to our Facebook group for Cinema Arts Centre Members and Friends. I hope it sparks discussion.
I love your take and I love hearing you explore these themes. You are doing exactly the work the film is asking people to do.
Just like it is the job of white people to examine our own behaviors, beliefs, and conditioning regarding race, and to dismantle racist systems and structures, it is up to men to examine misogyny and sexism and dismantle those systems within society and within themselves.
I think that's the work this film aims to facilitate. Your analysis really gives me tremendous hope for this work...although this didn't seem like hard work for you. You seem to totally get it.
I also agree that they are all James for the exact reason you state.
I just subscribed to your channel and look forward to hearing your take on more movies.
You're right except for the race part. North America is not the only place white people exist and referring to us as a monolith is not fair or right.
my first thought after i watched it was that all the different men was her abusive boyfreinds different abusive traits and at the centre of it all was him giving no excuse but to blame himself for his actions and his behaviours. I felt like it was a look into domestic abuse and the tools of the perpatrator that he uses to get what he wants.
I really loved this film. Having all of the men in the village played by the same actor (and, therefore, having the same exact face) was brilliant. However, it made me take note of why James, the man who undeniably caused her the most trauma, was meant to look so different from the other men. I think this is because even if a man appears to be "not like other men," in the end, he is.
Also, I loved her transition of emotions from utter fear to complete pity as the births were happening. You can see her realize what is happening. She moves from perceiving the men as terrifying/threatening to completely pathetic.
It makes sense because the values ingrained in men in our culture are just sh*tty and it doesn't matter how they appear outwardly, a lot of them harbor pretty similar, harmful ideas.
The way man (humanity) tries to dominate (Mother) Nature is something to take note of within the symbolism of this movie. 🍁🍎🌳
Love your take! I noticed a lot of other “reviewers” totally diss on this movie being totally confused as was I, but I wasn’t quick to judge the film just because I couldn’t 100% understand it. Timeless art is something that can be discussed and interpreted forever and that’s fun to me!
YES! I love it when I first don't understand something because then it provides an opportunity to dive into it more and try to decipher what the meanings were. Even if I end up not liking the film, to better understand the message at least gives me a concrete reason why. Plus, if a film can create a conversation, then that's a huge win in my book!
Who do y’all think was screaming when Harper came out of the pub?
I haven't seen the film yet, but Agamemnon - high king of the Greeks - sacrificed his favourite daughter to the gods in order to keep his oath of military obligations in Troy and guarantee success for all the Greeks (it's key to understand that he was on good terms with her, but put his masculine duties ahead of his familial responsibilities). Obviously his wife Clytemnestra has serious objections. In vengeance for this act Clytemnestra kills Agamemnon upon his return home after the war. Essentially, his actions pushes her to something like madness.
Sounds like the reference has something to do with violence against women and female psychological pain.
100%! The entire narrative is about that, well said!!
There's a line about being a "failed military boy" or something like that that may have some relevance to this. I don't wanna say much though since you haven't seen it yet.
Yes men bad.
Great breakdown of the film. Sadly I did not enjoy Garland’s latest project, but I will always support films doing different things, or having abstract story telling.
I think this movie was representing the cycle of toxic masculinity. The “knight in shining armor” guy talks about how his dad demeaned him when he was 7. So he was trying to prove himself. The birth after birth at the end was like the cycle of toxic masculinity perpetuating itself. One type which would birth another type which would birth another type. How every type on their own can be viewed harmlessly and dismissed, but when put all together, it’s terrifying. I also believe that they were all played by one guy and shown as her ex in the end because they represented the cycle he showed in their life.
First he was charming, then she had a hint at something scary, then he would have an outburst, then hide it with this sense of religion and try to justify his actions with that, and then would be dismissive of her, then be charming again and would cycle over and over.
I also think while it was doing all of that, she was also going through the cycle of her trauma. Everything was reminding her of that day he died. When the bird flies in the window we see the chair fall like when he flipped the chair. Multiple times we see the plant floating in air slowly which is what she breathed in when she screamed when she saw him, obviously the ankle and split arm are what she saw. Etc.
What I’m NOT sure of was the deal with her friend on the phone. How it would show a scary face when it would get staticky. How she was pregnant as well.. and how it was her number texting her what the guy said about being a B.
Made me curious if maybe she was pregnant with his kid and she was upset he died etc. she had an axe at the end we didn’t see her use.. maybe I’m the only one buy it felt like she was waiting to off her friend too.
That's a great point about the friend! And that's also a dark thought about waiting to use it on her friend... but I can also see it happening!
@@MoviesAndMunchies it would kind of go against what the movie was about. But considering the previous few minutes was a bunch of pregnancy and birth and then they make a point to show she’s pregnant I’m sure it means something lol
The axe is left up to the audience...did she use it on him or not? I figured she did as she's smiling at the very end. I saw the axe as a representation of her letting go of the misplaced guilt she felt by cutting off the rebirth cycle. In other words, not giving her love to someone who was underserving of it, getting pregnant, and becoming part of the toxic cycle. She used her power to stop the cycle and she finally realized at the end that it wasn't her fault. The stages of grief were also represented here...denial, anger, bargaining, depression and acceptance all made an appearance.
@@RuthieMicaela definitely up to interpretation since it’s obviously an analogy driven film. I just think most of it must have been in her head like it’s how she visually interpreted her drama. But we do see blood. So I’m curious who she actually killed or what her friend would see. Did she just kill the homeowner as she went crazy? Etc. Did she use the axe the way her friend intended during their conversation. Etc. Obviously there’s no straightforward answer to this I’m just curious lol.
@@KMReviews for sure! I think it was a mental breakdown and she probably acted on her hallucinations. Perhaps in her delusion she saw the homeowner as her husband, and used the axe as the friend suggested. But, who really knows! There are so many interpretations but hat's what made it great movie in my opinion 😊
Amazing analysis! Thank you for putting my thoughts into word
To be fair to Geoffrey, I'd lose my sense of shivelry if I'd just been hit by a car.
The stone plant face is called "the Green Man" the pagen diety of rebirth.
I'm curious about what actually did occur to leave her, and the house, covered in blood at the end.
I really enjoyed your ideas and analysis, as well as most of the commentary here from other viewers. (I'm always a little confused why people want to engage in conversations with others about a film that they think is garbage.) I wish, in your video, that you had more cutaways to shots and even short video clips (with or without sound) from the movie to illustrate your arguments. I know that's more work for you, so you can ignore me too. 🙃
I typically don't use videos from trailers or scenes unless a studio specifically gives me access and permission because my vids have been demonetized too often in the past. I do like to include the still images when I can... but sometimes there aren't a bunch available at the time of my recording. I appreciate the feedback, and I'm also glad you enjoyed the video!!
My friend and I interpreted the birthing as men likening their experiences to the pin and trauma of birth, an experience that is unique to women and incomparable to any experience men can have. Men centering the trauma upon themselves and trying to compare it to something so powerful and painful, when in reality the emotional pain of men don’t come even close to the experiences of women.
This is great!!
This is a good observation. I saw it as a visual of the "begets" process or perpetuity but your thoughts here are very true!
"Men don't come close to the experiences of women"... is that why men kill themselves at way higher rates?
So men's pain doesn't matter??
I don't think pain is essentially only to women, to think that is just kind of wrong.
@@elongatedmanforever1252 no one is saying the pain of men doesn’t matter. What we interpreted it as is the fact that men try to compare their experience to that of women who are often inherently disadvantaged in relationships because they may be seen as something for a man to possess instead of their own autonomous person. Harper wanted out of the relationship and James threatened her if she made a choice that was not beneficial to him. He held over her a sword on a piece of hair and she was damned to either stay in an abusive relationship or bear the responsibility of his death (of which she has no obligation to bear). The point of the movie is that women are not responsible for validating the emotions and perceptions of men, and the ways in which men abuse women psychologically (and physically) to reinforce that unrealistic expectation is what makes us men, as a singular entity, so terrifying to many women. Even if you yourself are a good man, the collective experience of women is conditioned to be that of cautionary and suspicious behavior for their own safety and autonomy as humans.
This movie had me in tears the first watch. It very much captures the death of an emotionally abusive marriage and how I felt after. This film felt like it was made for me at the time I saw it.
right should be titled bad marriage by woman who is constantly shocked by an idiot lol
If you noticed all those men personas had the same wounds, cuts and bone breaks that James had for when he felt off the balcony.
that’s what i noticed right away
@@gonzo2384 I just want to know if the whole 3rd act was real or it was all in Harper's head. All the Rory Kinnear characters converge and take turns attacking Harper in different ways?
Well done analysis. Appreciate your take on this film. Just a small thing, but I liked that by the end, Harper had resigned herself to the weirdness of the situation and the whatever-it-is. She doesn’t (continue) freaking out, as so many (mostly) female protagonists do in films. I wish more characters in horror films would, at some point, just accept that weird/supernatural things/monsters/villains exist and get on with the business of defending themselves.
I really enjoyed this movie. It was so scary and tense but also immensely beautiful. The visuals and sound design were phenomenal and the uncanny nature of the CGI’d kid’s face worked for me. It was so unsettling throughout.
I found the birthing scene to be such an interesting representation of generational trauma, religious trauma, and possibly even the trauma that white supremacy inflicts on the men who exist within it. White supremacy is fundamentally so anti-human that it insists men don’t feel and express themselves emotionally, requires them to always maintain control and power, and teaches that any show of vulnerability is deplorable. This seems like such a painful way to live. So for several iterations of this same man (beginning with God, The Green Man) to birth similarly wounded versions of himself and eventually give birth to Harper’s husband James, who is also bearing all of the same wounds, I felt it was an interesting commentary on how all of the toxicity of masculinity under white supremacy had lead to James being the kind of man he ended up being: abusive, manipulative, someone who uses Christianity to exert (or attempt to exert) control over another person and, at the end of the day, either a complete idiot (he slipped trying to climb back into their apartment after being kicked out) or a punk-azz b!tch who killed himself intentionally to inflict as much damage and trauma as possible onto Harper.
This was my favorite break down of the movie. Thank you
Good walk through, makes sense but I hated that movie I thought it was weird 😂
Great analysis. This is a great movie to watch a couple of times. On first viewing it can be jarring to encounter how different and interpretative the second half turns out to be, after having a start that seems to be a regular narrative. I think the film did a great job in that first half to put the viewer in the shoes of the helplessness and oppression that come from constant misogyny. By contrast the second half feels like a shock that comes out of the left field, but after thinking about it, it all ties up neatly. It's a powerful message.
Annihilation was my favorite movie of 2018, but Men was so meh to me.
I agree with everything addressed in this video but it came off so painfully obvious in the movie.
And any good will the movie had it lost me in the last 10 minutes.
I absolutely love this movie and your interpretation of the film. Do you believe this film has a biblical undertone with Harper’s bite of the forbidden fruit? Is the mockery of the church on a graveyard compound symbolic of something?
Just left the theatger and *was* very confused, you cleared up alot ! Thank you
I'm glad it helped!
The story can't be seen in the traditional way of a story. There are loops in logic that a lot of people try to explain away by setting symbolism around every corner. This isn't a story we're watching.... There isn't any sense in what is happening. We're not watching what is happening to this woman, this is an abstract piece of art given to us by the director, writer and amazing actors.
James demonstrates symptoms of bipolar disorder. Harper could be schizophrenic resulting from the trauma. PTSD and schizophrenia commonly co-occur and present similar symptoms. Maybe there's an underlying mental health theme going on too.