So this has me very excited about the new character I just made in our dual class game... I made a sorcerer/rogue, and 8 was already planning on taking magical trickster to get sneak damage on spells. I didnt realize that I could get those damage boosts that stack. Soooo ill be able to magic missile several enemies for 1d4+(2 x lvl +1)+ sneak attack, if I can catch them off guard or 8f theyre flat footed? Magic missile just became my favorite spell
Yes, the Arcane Trickster Rogue is one of my favorite gish builds right now for blending a martial and a caster, easily on par with WarPriest. We'll see how Magus compares when it comes out!
@@CollectiveArcana im definitely excited to see what changes they made after the playtest input. Also disappointed to realize that my little idea for sneak attack on magic missiles doesn't work, since there is no spell attack roll lol. Oh well. Split spell, and actual attack spells still makes for some nice sneak damage on multiple enemies
Sorry about that, quarantine has caused us to sacrifice the recording room (which has better sound) for our day job desks :(. We will try to figure something out going forward. Thanks for watching though!
I've looked at making a sorcerer before because I liked the flavor of it but I feel like the class is missing something, especially after first level. I really wished the bloodlines offered more abilities at later levels besides a couple more focus spells that require a feat to have. A few innate passive abilities for each bloodline would have been great. Also for the most part I don't like how blood magic works. Having a +1 benefit for only one turn and only after casting one of your bloodline spells just feels like it's too limited to be reliable (especially the ones that are just for a skill check), especially since it's the only main class feature you get at 1st level that isn't directly a part of your spellcasting or a proficiency.
I would like to see a passive constant effect based on the bloodline, that would be neat. But still, given how flavorful the bloodline spells are I do feel that you get alot of interesting tools as a sorcerer. I'm sure we'll get lots more fun stuff when Secrets of Magic drops this summer!
Keep in mind that taking class feats is exactly how all the class subclasses work. Druids need to take class feats for each of their druid circles for them to be meaningful. Wizards need to take class feats to progress their school discipline (though only one, sadly; that needs more work). Fighters spend class feats to specialize more in their combat style. Monks in their stances and such. I do think that the druid class uses the best model, with four clear subclass-based feat trees and relatively few other class feats. Other classes get VERY muddy with so many feats that ANYONE can take at ANY point, so it feels more like progressing your specialization comes at a cost. I also definitely agree with the bloodline abilities only lasting one round. Getting a +2 Will save is great.... but if it only lasts one round, that takes some REALLY finicky timing. Having the effect last a number of rounds equal to the spell level cast would be cooler.
@@colinsmith1495 I get that class feats are supposed to be how your character is defined, but a lot of the sorcerer class feats, especially the more unique ones, just don't really seem that impactful in helping to define a sorcerer by their bloodline as much as I would like. Most of the other casting classes pick some sort of subclass that comes with a character-defining feat at first level whereas the sorcerer subclasses just feel more like a flavor choice. Like, compared to the Oracle, which has a similar amount of variety of subclasses, actually manages to make them feel unique with the different mystery benefits and curses. I just wish the bloodlines felt more impactful than a handful of predetermined spell choices
@@jaxonsellers1126 Oh, I was just thinking along the lines of 'bloodline focus spells take a feat to gain'. Being focus spells, you can use them once per encounter, or more often once you get more focus regeneration. With that, they and the bloodline effect can add a lot of flavor to your sorcerer.
@@CollectiveArcana If I ever get around to making a Caster character, I'll take a closer look. Right now, all I've got is a West Marches style game. Hoping to find a proper campaign soon.
1E definitely gave MORE, but there's still some of that flavor. One thing I dislike about 2E is how much it just feels like there's LESS of EVERYTHING. And not just because it hasn't been published yet, it feels designed that way. I guess that's so a lvl 12 character doesn't have 10 different abilities to balance (less intimidating to new players), but at the same time that makes progression from lvl 7 to lvl 8 a LOT less meaningful.
@@skyler9643 What I mean is: FAR fewer metamagic feats, and adding any in means nudging out other options that are rather 'core class' in most cases. FAR fewer thematic elements of the bloodlines, of the oracle curses, of the deities, etc, and again adding any in would mean nudging out other options for the class. Far fewer ways to significantly customize races, too. The ancestry feat system provides a lot of options, but most of them seem far less than the alternative racial options of 1E. The backgrounds, similarly, give far less variability AND background inspiration than the Traits system of 1E. I like the IDEA of the Class/Ancestry feat system, but it's not built with much flexibility, and with so much 'core class' and 'core race' stuff built into it, there's not much room to ADD flexibility without giving up something MAJOR.
They’re great! I had a sorcerer one time who died as a kid, but lived and has an undead bloodline.
Thats really fun flavor!
Rolled up a snow goblin sorcerer with a blue dragon bloodline. He specializes in lightning spells. He is kind of fun.
I love it! Haha.
So this has me very excited about the new character I just made in our dual class game... I made a sorcerer/rogue, and 8 was already planning on taking magical trickster to get sneak damage on spells. I didnt realize that I could get those damage boosts that stack. Soooo ill be able to magic missile several enemies for 1d4+(2 x lvl +1)+ sneak attack, if I can catch them off guard or 8f theyre flat footed? Magic missile just became my favorite spell
Yes, the Arcane Trickster Rogue is one of my favorite gish builds right now for blending a martial and a caster, easily on par with WarPriest. We'll see how Magus compares when it comes out!
@@CollectiveArcana im definitely excited to see what changes they made after the playtest input. Also disappointed to realize that my little idea for sneak attack on magic missiles doesn't work, since there is no spell attack roll lol. Oh well. Split spell, and actual attack spells still makes for some nice sneak damage on multiple enemies
Thank you for the videos. The sound was a little off in this one.
Sorry about that, quarantine has caused us to sacrifice the recording room (which has better sound) for our day job desks :(. We will try to figure something out going forward. Thanks for watching though!
I've looked at making a sorcerer before because I liked the flavor of it but I feel like the class is missing something, especially after first level. I really wished the bloodlines offered more abilities at later levels besides a couple more focus spells that require a feat to have. A few innate passive abilities for each bloodline would have been great.
Also for the most part I don't like how blood magic works. Having a +1 benefit for only one turn and only after casting one of your bloodline spells just feels like it's too limited to be reliable (especially the ones that are just for a skill check), especially since it's the only main class feature you get at 1st level that isn't directly a part of your spellcasting or a proficiency.
I would like to see a passive constant effect based on the bloodline, that would be neat. But still, given how flavorful the bloodline spells are I do feel that you get alot of interesting tools as a sorcerer.
I'm sure we'll get lots more fun stuff when Secrets of Magic drops this summer!
Keep in mind that taking class feats is exactly how all the class subclasses work. Druids need to take class feats for each of their druid circles for them to be meaningful. Wizards need to take class feats to progress their school discipline (though only one, sadly; that needs more work). Fighters spend class feats to specialize more in their combat style. Monks in their stances and such.
I do think that the druid class uses the best model, with four clear subclass-based feat trees and relatively few other class feats. Other classes get VERY muddy with so many feats that ANYONE can take at ANY point, so it feels more like progressing your specialization comes at a cost.
I also definitely agree with the bloodline abilities only lasting one round. Getting a +2 Will save is great.... but if it only lasts one round, that takes some REALLY finicky timing. Having the effect last a number of rounds equal to the spell level cast would be cooler.
@@colinsmith1495 I get that class feats are supposed to be how your character is defined, but a lot of the sorcerer class feats, especially the more unique ones, just don't really seem that impactful in helping to define a sorcerer by their bloodline as much as I would like. Most of the other casting classes pick some sort of subclass that comes with a character-defining feat at first level whereas the sorcerer subclasses just feel more like a flavor choice.
Like, compared to the Oracle, which has a similar amount of variety of subclasses, actually manages to make them feel unique with the different mystery benefits and curses.
I just wish the bloodlines felt more impactful than a handful of predetermined spell choices
@@jaxonsellers1126 Oh, I was just thinking along the lines of 'bloodline focus spells take a feat to gain'. Being focus spells, you can use them once per encounter, or more often once you get more focus regeneration. With that, they and the bloodline effect can add a lot of flavor to your sorcerer.
They are fun. For time I had a sorcerer champion.
A classic combo that works as well as ever in 2e! Great way to get that bit of spellcasting that people miss from Paladin.
Bloodlines definitely don't feel as cool as they did in 1E. I liked all those weird and whacky abilities.
Don't overlook the Bloodline Spells. The mechanics are a bit different, but growing tentacle arms and crazy stuff like that is still there!
@@CollectiveArcana If I ever get around to making a Caster character, I'll take a closer look. Right now, all I've got is a West Marches style game. Hoping to find a proper campaign soon.
1E definitely gave MORE, but there's still some of that flavor. One thing I dislike about 2E is how much it just feels like there's LESS of EVERYTHING. And not just because it hasn't been published yet, it feels designed that way. I guess that's so a lvl 12 character doesn't have 10 different abilities to balance (less intimidating to new players), but at the same time that makes progression from lvl 7 to lvl 8 a LOT less meaningful.
@@colinsmith1495 I think its because less choices are locked into “archetypes” and more are in the class feats personally.
@@skyler9643 What I mean is: FAR fewer metamagic feats, and adding any in means nudging out other options that are rather 'core class' in most cases. FAR fewer thematic elements of the bloodlines, of the oracle curses, of the deities, etc, and again adding any in would mean nudging out other options for the class. Far fewer ways to significantly customize races, too. The ancestry feat system provides a lot of options, but most of them seem far less than the alternative racial options of 1E. The backgrounds, similarly, give far less variability AND background inspiration than the Traits system of 1E.
I like the IDEA of the Class/Ancestry feat system, but it's not built with much flexibility, and with so much 'core class' and 'core race' stuff built into it, there's not much room to ADD flexibility without giving up something MAJOR.