Link To Drawings: drive.google.com/file/d/1Dy7A... A power lift and guide for the head of a round column mill. This fix will maintain horizontal alignment.
FWIW, when I had a Grizzly, I mounted a laser pointed on the headstock pointing to the opposite wall. I then made a plumb vertical line. The laser pointer was set on the plumb line at the start of every job. If I needed to move the head up or down to suit tool needs it was super easy to get back to zero
It always surprises me that people dislike any video really. Honestly, 99.9% of the people that comment on my videos are fantastic - Thank you very much.
Brilliant solutions to everyday problems without the need for many thousands of dollars worth of machinery. Thank you for your common sense workshop ideas made with machines that many home work shops already own.
Good approach to a problem, glad to see everything worked out without any major setbacks. Not only did you get repeatability you now have a power feed. Good job!
Very nice design. It's always interesting to see a moderately complex mechanical project undertaken and completed. Now you have a tool to keep your column in line and a power Z-feed.
hello Mark,nice job on the mill,enjoyed the video, thanks for sharing with us.i did something simular to mine what i did was drill and tapped the rack and tube and made a gib to fill the very tiny space in between the clamp and tube. it works just fine.see you next time. stay safe. my friend.
I tried do that and my rack flexed a lot! I had mine attached at the top and bottom and it didn't work at all. How many places did you attach it to the column?
I've watched a lot of machinist videos and for my money this is one of the most useful mods on this mill/drill as I've seen anywhere. The video work is also great. If I attempt to do this I'll try using 1" square stock instead of the roundstock to hold the head in index with the column I wouldn't be surprised but what your round stock is minutely flexing. Thanks for the project.
Thank you sir! I agree, the bar could flex a little. I would have used 1" rather than 3/4" but the bore in my lathe is 7/8". I like round for one reason. The contact area is very small on the Delrin blocks. This allows for firm contact without much friction. Square would work well but setting the slide blocks might be touchy.
@@WinkysWorkshop I agree with the contact area being smaller on round stock. Rather then Delren I'll use some small bearing I have and pre-load them a tad. After that, it will be good enough for my backyard shop!! Thanks again for the great video....
Excellent design Wink, I have been toying with the idea of a rod or bar and DTI to regain position when moving on the column. I have also been toying with a counterbalance to make cranking easier. You have addressed both ideas and executed the result with great success, I am looking forward to the plans when you draw them up. Good looking haircut and excellent finished project, cheers and thanks. PS, That wood based coordinate table for the press sure is working out well for you!
Thanks you sir - The link to the plans are now posted. Yeah... love the drill press table! I assume you mean the X Y table. The drill press is way easier to use than the drill mill and almost as accurate.
I will start with the seasons best to you and yours this holiday season my friend. Any time I see that little mill/drill I want one for myself. It has served you well as far as I can see and any tinkering you have had to do on it has been fairly minor. Yup on the 1/2 link or a plastic (UHMW ?) lined tensioner that wraps around a section of pipe just long enough for the chain to get the "climb" out of the chain. I used to adapt chains like this to multiple rollers in cedar sawmills that the bark would climb up on the sprockets so much it would break chains or bearing housings. Nasty problem easily fixed eh. It is always a nice visit to come and share what you have for us my friend. Good old no nonsense free problem or a go to machining for a cause. I just plain enjoy your posts my friend. Love that textured spray can paint my friend. It covers more bo-bo's than flat black and a grinder eh, LOL. eh, LOL. What a great addon to this for that piece of equip bud. There is always something to do to max the usability's to serve us. One machine to better the other. Not quite sure will be the end result of that remark will take us eh. Good seasons wishes to you and yours Winky. Onward eh ! Of course if you are bored you can wire in a couple proximity sensors that will take care of travels but yer a pretty sharp fella as it is eh, LOL.
Thanks for your feedback. I do agree with you and did not intended to criticize your well, neatly and professional presented modification. And rightly so mankind has manufactured and created wonderful projects that are still standing and still operation today with lesser machines. No doubt what you have made will perform better and it is more than others may have attempted. It is clear to see that you have significant skills. So again sharing this and hopefully I can see a further video from you in the future. By the way I like your clean workshop.
No worries, I didn't feel criticized, I basically agree with you. Thanks on the work shop. Aside from feeling a little crowded I love working in the shop. I've done woodworking all my life and always had some basic metal working tool but always had an interest in machine work. About 15 years ago I went from a job running a web offset printing press to being a troubleshooter/problem solver for the presses. That turned into learning some cad and designing a lot of machine improvements. After getting frustrated with the time it took to get our under manned machine shop to make parts for me I started accumulating my own machines. Now I'm retired... Now if I can imagine something I can usually build it... within reason of course. I remember telling my wife I was going to build a buckboard flyer. She said, are you a kid or what? I said, yeah, but now I have the tools time and to some degree the money make cool toys! If you haven't seen it you might like it. Check it out. ruclips.net/video/lPDv_33CV4o/видео.html
@@WinkysWorkshop Thanks for the kind reply, yes my wife thinks I am a kid as well and I do feel like a kid in the sweetshop when I am in my workshop. I am always happy to see the talent in our generation, and many young person could learn a lot by simply switching from gaming to the youtube channel like yours. I will check out the link you sent me. Kind Regards.
Ingenious solution, well executed! Adding a couple of micro switches would limit the upper and lower travel. Accuracy refers to a standard, precision refers to repeatability.
This is a very clever solution, and with this knowledge I am a lot more likely to purchase a round-column mill should I happen on the right opportunity. Thanks for sharing!
@@rolandjollivet38 I get that. Right now I can't justify the expense of a decent mill, but if I could find one that wasn't worn out for a few hundred $$, I'd buy it.
Your welcome. I love the power lift but check this out. www.hobby-machinist.com/threads/rf-30-clone-head-alignment-guide.84270/?fbclid=IwAR1IwD-s0KsZkKLHibNvD8dTI29B4nLtVADGwlp-uJfb0M9_v3zpz_JEY2s
I used to have the same milling machine as you. I had a £5 laser of the head of the machine and fired it across the garage onto the wall. I just had a vertical line drawn on the wall and put the laser dot back on the line if I had to raise or lower the head. Do to the length of the laser line any error is magnified so its easy to correct. Its an easy fix for the round column. Chris
11:39 I plan to do something like this. I have a JET mill but the castings look identical to your RF30. Thanks for providing the materials list and drawings!
Nice video and takes me back to my toolmaker days. The only thing I'd change would be to make the clamps a little sturdier side to side by triangulating the weld bases + increasing the vertical bar diameter and changing to a linear bushing instead of the delrin pad setup. The linear bushing could be mounted in a block with slotted adjustment in/out to tweak the alignment. It might help with repeatability.
I was going to go with the larger bar but my lathe bore is only 7/8" (to drill the ends). As for the delrin brackets. More rigid would probably be good but I think the pads work better. The amount of surface area is small so they can be tight against the bar without a lot of friction. There is some flexing but zero slop. The movement on the indicator is due to the the column clamp being loose while you move the head. Thanks!
Hi thanks for you channel and your great ways of coming up with simple solutions to problems. You have inspired me to use this ( guide bar ) idea on my drill press as it has a round column and loses alignment when you lower or raise the table . thanks again
You're welcome. The guide bar works better than expected on my mill and I love it! I also made a square column for my drill press that is amazing. It also have a harbor freight drill powered lift. Honestly... the guide bar might actually be the best approach. It's easier and less prone to error. I welded a round section to the top of my 4 x 4 column and got it perfectly aligned but if I had failed to get it straight and been of a fraction of a degree it would be a problem. ruclips.net/video/i4_FtMMMfDw/видео.html
Nice idea! I have had my head stuck on using threaded rod and a half nut... That chain drive idea is more simple and just as effective! Thus far i have been using the laser level approach.
I use a mag-base laser level on the head, and pointed at a tiny silver spot on the far wall, to keep the head aligned when raising or lowering. I can keep it within a few arc minutes fairly easily.
mount a mirror (ideally surface silvered) on the far wall then you increase the accuracy even more and don't have to turn round to check. Random unrelated fact, years ago as a kid I visited a place that turned train wheel rims and they projected a shadow of the wheel rim onto the factory wall and there were marks on the wall to act as a gauge.
that laser sounds like a great idea and maybe use in conjunction with the vertical bar as a check. My problem is that I have my Mill on casters. But maybe two lasers, one on column and one on the head and just need to keep them pointed so that they are aimed so that they maintain a consistent distance apart?
Perfect timing. With the cooler weather, I will be working on upgrades for my "Precision" 3.0 mill. DRO and x power feed are almost done and the column issue was next on the list.
Cool... I'll have a link to the drawings and parts list posted in the next few days. I'm not sure it will be the same but at least it's a starting point.
Boy, you have spent a lot of time and money on that modification. Great job my friend. I just use a dial indicator with a magnetic base and It is dead nuts accurate every time. I think since round column mills have been around for 40+ years, the manufactures always had in mind a simple dial indicator for alignment was much cheaper and they did not have an inherent problem that a lot of people keep pushing with alignment of the head. Should not be an issue at all. Keep up the good work!
Time yes but I think it was less than $80 bucks with some surplus steel. It's mostly about speed and convenience. I love it. This may seem ridiculous but I'm thinking about a cam lock for lock down bolts for the head.
excellent video and design. I have the same mill (circa 1998 made in Taiwan) and have been looking at different solutions, and i think yours is best. I dont have welding setup, but should be able to do in aluminum and socket head cap screws. BTW, love your "pre-OSHA" shop!
Pre-OSHA? Funny. I have a lot of open belts and gears. If I had a employee I would probably look at things a little different. Adding the guide bar and lift on my mill was a lot of work but very worthwhile!
Thanks for sharing!!! Great project. You could loosen one and tight the other nuts on your u- bolts to walk your clamps around but your very close anyway.
Gday, this it a brilliant fix to a frustrating problem, I’ve lost count at the amount of times I’ve screwed up and had to realign everything, pain in the ass, take care. Cheers Matty
I like how you modified the table to power drive. About the travel, perhaps fit off switches at the top of max travel and at the bottom of max travel. The switches will stop the drive motor and so stop the quill. Thanks for sharing.
@@alanddeb2 - I doubt they will ever wear. I used to work for a printing company and we had gears made is Delrin meshing with steel. I've see the delrin break but the metal gears wore out long before the Delrin.
I am thinking about using something similar on my mill also. I was thinking about using a linear rail and bearing attached to top and bottom brackets and then making an adapter to attach to the crank on the rack, that will attach to a lovejoy coupling and AC stepper motor to move head up and down. I'm thinking the linear rail and bearing would provide more free range of motion while keeping the mill head from moving side to side? Whats your thoughts on this?
I like the drive idea and the concept of the alignment rig. I think the vertical rod needs to be larger, high precision ground rod, and the brackets a bit more rigid. Great idea.
I would have made the bar larger but my lathe bore is only 7/8". I think everything is more that strong enough to keep things in alignment BUT it would be nice if the clamps were near impossible to move and used a 1.75" bar. That way I could leave the head clamp slightly loose without fear of head movement. It would be great to eliminate the need to clamp and un-clamp the head.
Good try to make an inferior machine perform as it should. Tried this with similar unsuitable equipment, however learned to put my effort in to buying well engineered machinery. If you are lucky to have this equipment best use it for basic machining. Thanks for this video it is a good lesson to help others.
Of course a full size mill would be great and if machine work was much more than a hobby I'd sell this mill and get a good one. With that being said, this mill does fairly good with a lot less cost. Your advise would be good if I was 20 or 30 years old. I'm retired... it's a hobby. Of course if I see a good deal on a small mill I may get.
Good approach. I own practically the same machine sold by Harbor Freight except mine is a rarity in that it has a gearbox on the right side of the head that powers the quill. I am a mechanical designer by profession and already have designed a similar approach but have yet to make it happen. I plan on installing the guide bar on the right side. On the left side I plan to install a reversible electric motor also but will have the control switch on the right side near the pinch bolts that tighten the head to the column. I hate having to loosen the bolts then go around the other side to crank the head up or down then go back to the pinch bolts to tighten them. This wastes a lot of time. For the motor, I will integrate a clutch that will slip if I bottom out top or bottom.
With the motor lift its not too bad going to the other side but I like your idea. The slip clutch is also great. I've been thinking about a power head lock. like some kind of cam lock operated with an air cylinder on the lock down nuts. It sounds lazy but I still avoid moving the head sometimes and move the table instead.
I made something similar, but bolted a bracket to the cast base and into the top of the column (needed the extra height). The follower is opposed ball races. Since I put a VFD driven 3ph motor on it, I do not need to get into the top cover any more, so I used the spare space to take the power supply to my Z axis drive (DC) motor.
Nice upgrade.. I solved the problem a different way... I started watching Craigslist... I found a Bridgeport with powered feed on three axis & a DRO it was listed cheap... I was the first respondent & got it for $1000.... Then I sold my RF mill on Craigslist for $750... Not quite as creative but I love the results....
Yep, you did good. I'd got deal like that in the past but larger mills always seem to have a negative... way too big, 3 ph, need a ton of work, 1000 miles away etc. I did get my South Bend 11 for $100 but put a lot of hours into restoring it. Nice lathe and worth the effort however.
@@WinkysWorkshop It is 3 ph but I already have a VFD & I did wind up driving 700 miles round trip.... So yeah it had extra challenges... But I'm happy with the result... LOL
FWIW... I tack welded the gear track on mine. It still wiggles a bit but not a crazy amount. I still need to improve on it so this video helps with ideas. Thanks
Yeah... I clamped mine firmly and was shock at how much the rack flexed. Pinning the rack between the teeth worried be but welding might work well if there is enough clearance.
I just got one of these mills and like the idea but i think i'm going to go with simpler by making locking brackets like you have to just lock in the gear bar...it will act like your outer guide rod. maybe some minor error but i'm not too concerned .. great idea none the less, and power feed sure is nice
Yeah this was a fairly involved project. If you use your rack you will get a lot of flex in the rack. At minimum you need two bolts at the bottom and top to hold the rack to the column. You may also need to drill and pin the rack in the middle as well. One reason I went with power was to reduce the influence of the crank and improve the accuracy.
@@WinkysWorkshop It would indeed,but even one of the poly-vee belts used to drive vehicle ancillaries or washing machines would work well I think. Certainly plenty of grip from a 1/2" or 5/8" wide pooy-vee.
Excellent!!! I've got one of these mills (mine is a Rong-Fu RF-30) and the biggest 2 problems are the limited Z travel without moving the head, and the head pivoting when trying to take a heavy cut, but this idea could potentially solve both! I am thinking I may duplicate this, but with a ball bearing linear guide rail, a cheap 100:1 gear drive motor, and limit switches top and bottom... I too have been somewhat confused with the metric diameter screws using standard thread pitch... in standard size tapped holes...
Mine is also an RF30 sold by Enco. First, you don't really need a bearing but if you use one be sure you use one that is adjustable, otherwise you will have movement. Second, good luck finding a cheap gear motor. You might find one but it will be low voltage. If you find a cheap 120V gear motor please let me know. In hindsight I wish I had used a larger diameter guide bar but the one I used was the largest I could drill in my lathe. I've had problems with my head slipping while milling too but I still lock the head firmly. I worry about the clamps slipping or the bar flexing. If you make it stout enough you might get by with just leaving the head snug. It would be nice to not have to lock and unlock the head when you make a move. I do this while drilling but not milling.
@@WinkysWorkshop yeah after I commented I finished watching and saw that you were only getting about .001” over approximately 5” of travel, that seems quite excellent with just cold rolled round stock as your shaft and delrin ‘bearing’! Maybe I will just duplicate your design straight across. I’ve found quite a few options for 120v worm drive motors, as usual, they’re straight from China, but will go well on a Chinese mini mill.
@@gallupcustomknives2293 - Aside from the time it takes I don't have a problem buying from China. You could pay a higher price in the US but you might be buying the same gear motor. The derin is just two flat pads. I clamped them to the shaft and then tightened the lock downs. The surface area is so small you can run them tight without too much friction. The .001" was over about a 5 inch travel but that is still good if you ask me.
It's very nice. I'm a little worried about the gears though. I move the head a lot more than I used to not that it has a motor drive. Now I need a push button lock down the head.
Yet another clever solution to a daily pain. I have a 8" spacer under the ram of my Bridgeport, and I am continuously running the knee up and down with the manual crank. Too bad I couldn't incorporate this to my mill .
Make a drill motor adapter for the knee... Fun simple project : ruclips.net/video/-4t8g8AensE/видео.html (I certainly hope that Mr. Winky doesn't mind me throwing a bone to Tublecain!) I made these to make my X & Y handles on my round column mill "Power feed". With a slow drill, it made big improvement to final finish passes!
You may be getting some flex from the crank handle travel bar attached to the milling machine's pipe. The bar with the notches in it. Just tack weld it in strategic locations and if you ever want to get rid of it or sell it you can just grind off the tack welds. Those bars are only stuck in at the top and bottom collars giving some horizontal or lateral movement.
I've thought of doing this to mine. I figure if i work out the minimum and maximum heights i'm likely to need i can weld the remaining of the rack bar top and bottom to the pipe.
It will flex (a lot). For this to work well the rack needs to be attached to the column about every 3 inches. .001" rack movement translates to .006" or .008" at the spindle.
It may just be me, but I hate square corners, even with a small radius on them. I would definitely make that lower right hand corner really rounded off or contoured around the spring housing. Can't wait till you put up the links to plans and materials so I can try to build one for my RF-31.
Just posted the plans. Hopefully they are good enough for most to use. The biggest concern is differences in mills. Rong Fu made several variations over the years. You are right about the corners! Thanks
Excellent again! May give it a go on my round column mill... On another subject, do you have any video with info re the coolant system for your Mill? I need to add one to my Mill. Is it cooling as well as lubrication that is required during milling?
The coolant I use is called Koolmist. It's about $40 per gallon but you dilute is a bunch, I think 15:1. There are many options for sprayers but get one with both air and coolant valves, some just control the air.
I've made a lot of my machines with power drives and found that wind screen wiper motors do a very good job, they are an angled drive and geared, also cheap
Great design! I see another design is screwed down the racks on top and bottom to keep column in line. That might fix the issue there and then add the power feed as you did.
I tried doing that. The two problem I had was that the rack flexes. It would have to be pinned every 3 inches to stop the flexing and you would have to pin it through the teeth. Second the amount of slop in the channel the rack is in is huge. I could not figure out how to eliminate this slop.
Hi Winki, you might could put a adjustable Clamp across the two angles holding the Deleon. That way you could tighten the Delrin against the Bar a little tighter.
Only with a small long end mill. Unless you take very small amounts the mill will deflect. If you want an accurate slot go with an undersized mill. While cutting a slot one side of the mill is climb cutting and this is not ideal.
I have an OLD Craftsman drill press I need to do this to. The only problem would be, when I want to use it like a radial drill 😉 That part of it does come in handy once in a while, but cranking the head up or down to use a different tool on the same location would be easier.
I leave it off for a couple of reasons. First, it rattled terribly and second, to loosen or tighten the draw bar it helps to grab the pulley. I just got tired to lifting the cover. It would be fairly easy to trim the covers for the modification. Also, some of the newer mills have a plastic cover that might not rattle.
Hey Winky, I found the other video, with the DRO , and where you kept the depth stop, what brand of caliper did you use ?, as it seems to have the readout facing the right way for this application, verses standard calipers, thanks very much.
THANK YOU, I too bought a similar mill drill Mine is a Tiawan built central machine. Now im frying to see what taper or collets the machine uses. Any advise sought Thanks
Think I might have put some half moon shapes in the delrin, or 1/4 moon might be a better description. The extra surface area might be nice to have and keep the bearing surfaces from wearing out to quicly.
The goal of keeping zero alignment is a good one. Seems like a simple dial indicator and brackets on the column and mill head would suffice. Zero like a vice tightening and tapping with dead blow.
Suffice maybe... but what a pain. I used to do that all the time. Occasionally I would get lucky but locking the head moves everything. With the guide bar it is very consistent, usually less than .002". Admittedly, working in a factory setting most my life probably ruined me. The extra minute or two it took me to align the head bothered me a lot
I enjoy your projects, most satisfying. Please clarify your testing of the accuracy with the dial indicator. Does the column have a flat spot along the length where the dial indicator is referencing? If not, then is this test correct for checking radial movement of the mill head?
I had the quill fully extended and locked. The indicator was on the side of the quill. The exposed quill is about 6-inches long. This test tells me if the quill stays aligned with the column as it moves. The indicator is on the curve (left side) of the quill. Of course I am assuming the quill is parallel to the column on the other axis (very close I'm sure) and if it is this is the best way to test. Maybe the only way.
Hot tip (I think), I used #25 chain, the sprockets are smaller for the same number of teeth. It's nowhere near straining the chain or sprocket, the forces involved are low. I went with a 1:6 gear ratio, 12 tooth small and 72 tooth large sprocket. I could have used a larger input (small) sprocket to make the head move faster, but I'm happy with the speed. I just set the small sprocket the right distance away to tighten the chain, so I didn't need an idler sprocket to take up the slack.
Very nice job as usual, with your various mods to your machines. Good Ideas to do similar on my RF30 Round Column Mill. What gear ratio's did you use, & what are the gears off . Keep up the good work. Thanks
That is a clever fix to a problem many of suffer with. Winky your results are better than you were talking about in the video, you were using a .0005 test indicator and calling each mark a thousand.
@@WinkysWorkshop The results are about as good as one could hope for. It was a definitely a interesting video. There is always so many things to be learned from your videos. Thanks for all the time that you spend on them.
Did you consider directly driving the worm shaft with the drill? Why the choice to go with sprocket layout? Did it create less torque forces that could influence side movement?
It takes a lot of torque to turn the worm. Way more than a drill has at very low speed. Side movement was not an issue plus it has a guide bar to stop movement.
Lock the rack to the column with countersunk bolts. Have a *third* collar ride on the plate along the column. Make the notch square, but round off its corners so that they don't dig into the rack's metal surface.
That would work but the rack would have to be bolted fairly often. Also the amount of metal at full depth of the teeth is not really adequate to counter bore. I considered pinning the rack but was a little worried I would not get it straight.
Thanks! Mine came with the reverse. I bought it used. It looks original but I could be wrong. I almost never use the reverse. Of course if I didn't have it I would need it
Hi Winky! I'm getting ready to build a version of your height adjust/head immobilizer thanks so much for the video and the plans! I have a couple of questions if you have time to answer. Is email or asking in the channel preferred? Thanks!
Pretty cool system, but maybe not the "ultimate fix"? After some years of frustration with my round column mill, and being uninterested in putting that much effort into one, I decided to buy a knee mill. Still may not be the ultimate as a nice Deckle or Maho would be way further up there, but way better...... BTW, if you know anyone that wants a round column mill, I may know a guy? Good videos, keep them coming.
It's made in Poland but thats all is says on it. I bought it 25 years ago at a garage sale. It's a great vise but the back jaw moving is not a good concept. You can not clamp a bar with it hanging down below the vise because it hits the bench.
Have you seen Bruce Whitham's version. It fits on the right side with no interference from the pulley on up travel. He sells kits for it. I have copied it for my older RF30.
I just watched. There is many ways to fix this issue although I think I like mine a little better. The only advantage I see to his design is that you can swing the mill to one side if needed but so far I have never need to do this. Hos might also be slightly cheaper although probably not if you include buying calipers. I also saw a guy use a laser to align the head. If you ask me, if I have to critically align the head after moving it the laser is the easiest and very accurate as long as you mill is level and bolted to the floor. Thanks for the info, I like seeing how other resolve issues.
Hi Winky, really enjoy all your videos, just a question on mill, or mill drill selection, I am trying to decide on a mill, or mill/drill machine , and have researched them a fair bit , the round column like yours seem to be fairly heavy duty machines, only other feature they lack in a comparable square column machine is digital depth readout on the quill, is this a big problem? I dont mind that most machines like yours in this video are 220 volt, I have it in my shop for my welding machines, thanks, and thanks for posting the video.
I think it boils down to how much money you want to spend. I would absolutely buy a mill and avoid the round column. They do make mill drills with a dovetailed column but they are still higher priced than the RF 30s. My choice would probably be a Precision Mathews for a new mill or find an old full size mill. With that being said, my round column mill works well and it fit my budget when I bought it. Plus its a LOT smaller that a bridge port or the likes... also single phase.
If you want head alignment during raising and lowering the head on your round column mill but without the power feed there's a fix. It's described in issue 18 of Model Engine Builder magazine (September October 2008) pages 32 to 33. It uses the rack as the alignment bar and fixes top and bottom of the rack. A close fitting slide is fitted to the head to limit play.
First off, thanks for the info. However, I tried this... this seems good but it is not an ideal fix. The rack is close to the pivot center and the leverage the head has on the rack flexes the rack.... and not just a little! The rack is only 1/4" think at the bottom of the teeth. It could work but the rack would need to be pinned to the column at least every 3 inches. My biggest concern about going this direction would be getting the rack positioned perfectly. It's hard to move a pin. Then there is the issue of drilling between the teeth on the gear. To be strong enough you would probably want to used a 1/4" pin and to do so you would also be removing part of the tooth. Maybe not a big deal but it would weaken the tooth. Also, trying to drill in a V (created by the rack teeth) might be tricky. There are a few other ways to fix this issue but in my opinion the rack is last on my list.
The unit had its disadvantages, if I'd really spent the time on it I should have, I would have had a lot more contact area top, bottom and a pair of sliding guides. The whole thing had to be removed to free up the bottom of the column every time I cut gears to allow me to fit a lower support bearing on the cutter arbor. I've found a workable and simpler solution to limited travel is in tooling length - long centre drills and stub length screw machine drills and stub reamers. Lets me set up tooling of roughly the same length. I'm tempted by vertical axis power feed for a boring head.
@@avelingdx - I've done the same with the stub drills and have a video on making the long center drill. Of course that was long before this current fix.
I too needed to cut a large radius curve. Rather than make/buy a big flycutter, I mounted the workpiece on my rotary table, and used a normal end mill.
The delrin works very well. There is almost no force on the delrin and the contact area is very small so friction is not an issue. However... It would be nice to leave the head unlocked slightly and and move the head with the motor as needed without locking or unlocking. A bearing would be better for handling this lateral load. I actually do this while drilling but not for milling.
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I like it. You are getting the most possible out of your machines by using thought instead of money. A resource often MORE valuable than money.
I now have a Well Index which is a very good mill but honestly the round column mill was fairly good in comparison.
FWIW, when I had a Grizzly, I mounted a laser pointed on the headstock pointing to the opposite wall. I then made a plumb vertical line. The laser pointer was set on the plumb line at the start of every job. If I needed to move the head up or down to suit tool needs it was super easy to get back to zero
That works... I saw a youtube video where the guy did this
I use the very same system works great
Really why would anyone do a dis - like. Mean spirited I guess. This is a great idea.
It always surprises me that people dislike any video really. Honestly, 99.9% of the people that comment on my videos are fantastic - Thank you very much.
Haters got hate.
I just leave them to there sad lonely lives.
Anyway sweet vid, great idea.
@@domaves4043 = Yep... Thanks!
They're mad because they have no mill or skill.
Brilliant solutions to everyday problems without the need for many thousands of dollars worth of machinery. Thank you for your common sense workshop ideas made with machines that many home work shops already own.
Thanks! Yes, I'd say that most people that have a mill already have the other tools needed to do this.
instablaster...
Good approach to a problem, glad to see everything worked out without any major setbacks. Not only did you get repeatability you now have a power feed. Good job!
Very true! Thanks for the comment.
I knew you were going to do something about your mill head at some point . Very nicely done ......and functional . Thanx for sharing .
Thanks 👍
Very nice design. It's always interesting to see a moderately complex mechanical project undertaken and completed. Now you have a tool to keep your column in line and a power Z-feed.
Yes, thanks
My friend has the same mill. I sent him a link because I think your idea is great. I agree with Allan below, a chain guard is a must.
Tell your friend to check back in a few days and I'll have a link to the drawings posted.
Thanks for taking the time to do the video and drawings. Great project and great execution all away around.
Thank you sir. I wish the plans would work for all version of this mill but at least it provides a starting point.
hello Mark,nice job on the mill,enjoyed the video, thanks for sharing with us.i did something simular to mine what i did was drill and tapped the rack and tube and made a gib to fill the very tiny space in between the clamp and tube. it works just fine.see you next time. stay safe. my friend.
I tried do that and my rack flexed a lot! I had mine attached at the top and bottom and it didn't work at all. How many places did you attach it to the column?
I've watched a lot of machinist videos and for my money this is one of the most useful mods on this mill/drill as I've seen anywhere. The video work is also great. If I attempt to do this I'll try using 1" square stock instead of the roundstock to hold the head in index with the column I wouldn't be surprised but what your round stock is minutely flexing. Thanks for the project.
Thank you sir! I agree, the bar could flex a little. I would have used 1" rather than 3/4" but the bore in my lathe is 7/8". I like round for one reason. The contact area is very small on the Delrin blocks. This allows for firm contact without much friction. Square would work well but setting the slide blocks might be touchy.
@@WinkysWorkshop I agree with the contact area being smaller on round stock. Rather then Delren I'll use some small bearing I have and pre-load them a tad. After that, it will be good enough for my backyard shop!! Thanks again for the great video....
@@YourOldDog , Yeah, some the the linear bearings have a preload adjust, that would be good.
Excellent design Wink, I have been toying with the idea of a rod or bar and DTI to regain position when moving on the column. I have also been toying with a counterbalance to make cranking easier. You have addressed both ideas and executed the result with great success, I am looking forward to the plans when you draw them up. Good looking haircut and excellent finished project, cheers and thanks.
PS, That wood based coordinate table for the press sure is working out well for you!
Thanks you sir - The link to the plans are now posted. Yeah... love the drill press table! I assume you mean the X Y table. The drill press is way easier to use than the drill mill and almost as accurate.
I continue to find your videos informative and fun to watch . Thanks for making them!
Thanks Ben and your welcome.
I have 2 of those mills. Was thinking of a way to try to do what you have done. great job. Thank you for your time and God Bless.
Thanks, you too!
I will start with the seasons best to you and yours this holiday season my friend. Any time I see that little mill/drill I want one for myself. It has served you well as far as I can see and any tinkering you have had to do on it has been fairly minor. Yup on the 1/2 link or a plastic (UHMW ?) lined tensioner that wraps around a section of pipe just long enough for the chain to get the "climb" out of the chain. I used to adapt chains like this to multiple rollers in cedar sawmills that the bark would climb up on the sprockets so much it would break chains or bearing housings. Nasty problem easily fixed eh. It is always a nice visit to come and share what you have for us my friend. Good old no nonsense free problem or a go to machining for a cause. I just plain enjoy your posts my friend. Love that textured spray can paint my friend. It covers more bo-bo's than flat black and a grinder eh, LOL. eh, LOL. What a great addon to this for that piece of equip bud. There is always something to do to max the usability's to serve us. One machine to better the other. Not quite sure will be the end result of that remark will take us eh. Good seasons wishes to you and yours Winky. Onward eh ! Of course if you are bored you can wire in a couple proximity sensors that will take care of travels but yer a pretty sharp fella as it is eh, LOL.
Thanks for the compliment!
Thanks for your feedback. I do agree with you and did not intended to criticize your well, neatly and professional presented modification. And rightly so mankind has manufactured and created wonderful projects that are still standing and still operation today with lesser machines. No doubt what you have made will perform better and it is more than others may have attempted. It is clear to see that you have significant skills. So again sharing this and hopefully I can see a further video from you in the future. By the way I like your clean workshop.
No worries, I didn't feel criticized, I basically agree with you. Thanks on the work shop. Aside from feeling a little crowded I love working in the shop. I've done woodworking all my life and always had some basic metal working tool but always had an interest in machine work. About 15 years ago I went from a job running a web offset printing press to being a troubleshooter/problem solver for the presses. That turned into learning some cad and designing a lot of machine improvements. After getting frustrated with the time it took to get our under manned machine shop to make parts for me I started accumulating my own machines. Now I'm retired... Now if I can imagine something I can usually build it... within reason of course. I remember telling my wife I was going to build a buckboard flyer. She said, are you a kid or what? I said, yeah, but now I have the tools time and to some degree the money make cool toys! If you haven't seen it you might like it. Check it out. ruclips.net/video/lPDv_33CV4o/видео.html
@@WinkysWorkshop Thanks for the kind reply, yes my wife thinks I am a kid as well and I do feel like a kid in the sweetshop when I am in my workshop. I am always happy to see the talent in our generation, and many young person could learn a lot by simply switching from gaming to the youtube channel like yours. I will check out the link you sent me. Kind Regards.
Take it from someone with 3/8" missing off their thumb - be very careful with fingers near chains. Made my heart skip a beat.
Fortunately, at least on a daily basis, my hand is on the trigger of the drill.
@@WinkysWorkshop Buy plastic...make cover. Your fingers will thank you and Allan's thumb will thank you.
Cheers from NC/USA
Ingenious solution, well executed! Adding a couple of micro switches would limit the upper and lower travel. Accuracy refers to a standard, precision refers to repeatability.
Love the micro switch idea!
This is a very clever solution, and with this knowledge I am a lot more likely to purchase a round-column mill should I happen on the right opportunity. Thanks for sharing!
Cool. thanks!
I seriously wouldn't. Rather get a chinese square column and mod it for smoother travel. Round column is a true curse
@@rolandjollivet38 - Now that I modified mine I like it but I tend to agree with you. I'd rather have a small knee mill. Hard to find
@@rolandjollivet38 I get that. Right now I can't justify the expense of a decent mill, but if I could find one that wasn't worn out for a few hundred $$, I'd buy it.
Very well done Mark! Looks like I have a new (another?) winter project! Thanks for the drawings!
Your welcome. I love the power lift but check this out. www.hobby-machinist.com/threads/rf-30-clone-head-alignment-guide.84270/?fbclid=IwAR1IwD-s0KsZkKLHibNvD8dTI29B4nLtVADGwlp-uJfb0M9_v3zpz_JEY2s
Winky's Workshop Indeed.
I’m the first comment after the original post.
I used to have the same milling machine as you. I had a £5 laser of the head of the machine and fired it across the garage onto the wall. I just had a vertical line drawn on the wall and put the laser dot back on the line if I had to raise or lower the head. Do to the length of the laser line any error is magnified so its easy to correct. Its an easy fix for the round column. Chris
I saw a youtube video on that. Maybe not as fast but a very accurate way to keep things aligned.
11:39 I plan to do something like this. I have a JET mill but the castings look identical to your RF30. Thanks for providing the materials list and drawings!
No problem 👍
Nice video and takes me back to my toolmaker days. The only thing I'd change would be to make the clamps a little sturdier side to side by triangulating the weld bases + increasing the vertical bar diameter and changing to a linear bushing instead of the delrin pad setup. The linear bushing could be mounted in a block with slotted adjustment in/out to tweak the alignment. It might help with repeatability.
I was going to go with the larger bar but my lathe bore is only 7/8" (to drill the ends). As for the delrin brackets. More rigid would probably be good but I think the pads work better. The amount of surface area is small so they can be tight against the bar without a lot of friction. There is some flexing but zero slop. The movement on the indicator is due to the the column clamp being loose while you move the head. Thanks!
Hi thanks for you channel and your great ways of coming up with simple solutions to problems. You have inspired me to use this ( guide bar ) idea on my drill press as it has a round column and loses alignment when you lower or raise the table . thanks again
You're welcome. The guide bar works better than expected on my mill and I love it! I also made a square column for my drill press that is amazing. It also have a harbor freight drill powered lift. Honestly... the guide bar might actually be the best approach. It's easier and less prone to error. I welded a round section to the top of my 4 x 4 column and got it perfectly aligned but if I had failed to get it straight and been of a fraction of a degree it would be a problem. ruclips.net/video/i4_FtMMMfDw/видео.html
Nice idea! I have had my head stuck on using threaded rod and a half nut... That chain drive idea is more simple and just as effective!
Thus far i have been using the laser level approach.
Thanks. The laser works great, just a pit slower.
I use a mag-base laser level on the head, and pointed at a tiny silver spot on the far wall, to keep the head aligned when raising or lowering. I can keep it within a few arc minutes fairly easily.
I've seen that done and it;s a good approach. Very accurate.
mount a mirror (ideally surface silvered) on the far wall then you increase the accuracy even more and don't have to turn round to check. Random unrelated fact, years ago as a kid I visited a place that turned train wheel rims and they projected a shadow of the wheel rim onto the factory wall and there were marks on the wall to act as a gauge.
@@mfx1 - Cool!
that laser sounds like a great idea and maybe use in conjunction with the vertical bar as a check. My problem is that I have my Mill on casters. But maybe two lasers, one on column and one on the head and just need to keep them pointed so that they are aimed so that they maintain a consistent distance apart?
Perfect timing. With the cooler weather, I will be working on upgrades for my "Precision" 3.0 mill. DRO and x power feed are almost done and the column issue was next on the list.
Cool... I'll have a link to the drawings and parts list posted in the next few days. I'm not sure it will be the same but at least it's a starting point.
@@WinkysWorkshop Looks pretty much identical. Much easier fix than Cuppa Joe's
@@mikesgarage394 I agree, I like the VFD and all but that a lot of work and expense too.
Boy, you have spent a lot of time and money on that modification. Great job my friend. I just use a dial indicator with a magnetic base and It is dead nuts accurate every time. I think since round column mills have been around for 40+ years, the manufactures always had in mind a simple dial indicator for alignment was much cheaper and they did not have an inherent problem that a lot of people keep pushing with alignment of the head. Should not be an issue at all. Keep up the good work!
Time yes but I think it was less than $80 bucks with some surplus steel. It's mostly about speed and convenience. I love it. This may seem ridiculous but I'm thinking about a cam lock for lock down bolts for the head.
Now that I would like to see. Faster unlock and lock would be a plus👍
@@jeffl.oliverson6690 I'll be doing variation of what this guy did at some point. ruclips.net/video/VmdSBvipJpQ/видео.html
excellent video and design. I have the same mill (circa 1998 made in Taiwan) and have been looking at different solutions, and i think yours is best. I dont have welding setup, but should be able to do in aluminum and socket head cap screws. BTW, love your "pre-OSHA" shop!
Pre-OSHA? Funny. I have a lot of open belts and gears. If I had a employee I would probably look at things a little different. Adding the guide bar and lift on my mill was a lot of work but very worthwhile!
Thanks for sharing!!! Great project. You could loosen one and tight the other nuts on your u- bolts to walk your clamps around but your very close anyway.
Very true... I just thumped them with a hammer. Thanks
Always enjoy your videos!
Thanks you!
Gday, this it a brilliant fix to a frustrating problem, I’ve lost count at the amount of times I’ve screwed up and had to realign everything, pain in the ass, take care. Cheers Matty
It certainly is a pain. The power lift is nice too. I've had one on my drill press for a long time and love it. Thanks for watching!
I like how you modified the table to power drive. About the travel, perhaps fit off switches at the top of max travel and at the bottom of max travel. The switches will stop the drive motor and so stop the quill. Thanks for sharing.
Cool idea!
I like your channel. Always clever ways of solving problems
Glad you like them! Thanks
Winky, great fix. I have a similar machine. Very impressive and clever. Thanks for the post.
Cool, thanks
I like it! Great job! Seems you just have to keep an eye on the delrin wear pads and you are golden!
I'll probably need to adjust them once or twice but after they wear a little I suspect they will stop wearing. Delrin is tough stuff.
@@WinkysWorkshop Just machine them with the same contour as the round rod they travel on. Problem solved...
@@alanddeb2 - I doubt they will ever wear. I used to work for a printing company and we had gears made is Delrin meshing with steel. I've see the delrin break but the metal gears wore out long before the Delrin.
Very cool! Great job on your project and the video! Thanks for sharing.
Thanks! It made the mill a lot more user friendly
I am thinking about using something similar on my mill also. I was thinking about using a linear rail and bearing attached to top and bottom brackets and then making an adapter to attach to the crank on the rack, that will attach to a lovejoy coupling and AC stepper motor to move head up and down. I'm thinking the linear rail and bearing would provide more free range of motion while keeping the mill head from moving side to side? Whats your thoughts on this?
So you got around to it. I still haven't finished mine but putting it on the left side is a better idea for sure.
I agree, aside from the handle there is a lot more room. It was a lot of work but total cost was less than $150 so thats not too bad.
I like the drive idea and the concept of the alignment rig. I think the vertical rod needs to be larger, high precision ground rod, and the brackets a bit more rigid. Great idea.
I would have made the bar larger but my lathe bore is only 7/8". I think everything is more that strong enough to keep things in alignment BUT it would be nice if the clamps were near impossible to move and used a 1.75" bar. That way I could leave the head clamp slightly loose without fear of head movement. It would be great to eliminate the need to clamp and un-clamp the head.
Good try to make an inferior machine perform as it should. Tried this with similar unsuitable equipment, however learned to put my effort in to buying well engineered machinery. If you are lucky to have this equipment best use it for basic machining. Thanks for this video it is a good lesson to help others.
Of course a full size mill would be great and if machine work was much more than a hobby I'd sell this mill and get a good one. With that being said, this mill does fairly good with a lot less cost. Your advise would be good if I was 20 or 30 years old. I'm retired... it's a hobby. Of course if I see a good deal on a small mill I may get.
Good approach. I own practically the same machine sold by Harbor Freight except mine is a rarity in that it has a gearbox on the right side of the head that powers the quill. I am a mechanical designer by profession and already have designed a similar approach but have yet to make it happen. I plan on installing the guide bar on the right side. On the left side I plan to install a reversible electric motor also but will have the control switch on the right side near the pinch bolts that tighten the head to the column. I hate having to loosen the bolts then go around the other side to crank the head up or down then go back to the pinch bolts to tighten them. This wastes a lot of time. For the motor, I will integrate a clutch that will slip if I bottom out top or bottom.
With the motor lift its not too bad going to the other side but I like your idea. The slip clutch is also great. I've been thinking about a power head lock. like some kind of cam lock operated with an air cylinder on the lock down nuts. It sounds lazy but I still avoid moving the head sometimes and move the table instead.
Great tinkering once again. Great job.
Thanks again!
Well done Winky, you fitted a square peg in a round hole and no brute force was used.
Ha... thanks!
I made something similar, but bolted a bracket to the cast base and into the top of the column (needed the extra height). The follower is opposed ball races. Since I put a VFD driven 3ph motor on it, I do not need to get into the top cover any more, so I used the spare space to take the power supply to my Z axis drive (DC) motor.
I'd love to have the FFD!
Nice upgrade.. I solved the problem a different way... I started watching Craigslist... I found a Bridgeport with powered feed on three axis & a DRO it was listed cheap... I was the first respondent & got it for $1000.... Then I sold my RF mill on Craigslist for $750...
Not quite as creative but I love the results....
Yep, you did good. I'd got deal like that in the past but larger mills always seem to have a negative... way too big, 3 ph, need a ton of work, 1000 miles away etc. I did get my South Bend 11 for $100 but put a lot of hours into restoring it. Nice lathe and worth the effort however.
@@WinkysWorkshop
It is 3 ph but I already have a VFD & I did wind up driving 700 miles round trip.... So yeah it had extra challenges... But I'm happy with the result... LOL
FWIW... I tack welded the gear track on mine. It still wiggles a bit but not a crazy amount. I still need to improve on it so this video helps with ideas. Thanks
Yeah... I clamped mine firmly and was shock at how much the rack flexed. Pinning the rack between the teeth worried be but welding might work well if there is enough clearance.
Nice job and some good camera work also. I am thinking about doing this on my PDM30 mill.
Thank you sir!
I just got one of these mills and like the idea but i think i'm going to go with simpler by making locking brackets like you have to just lock in the gear bar...it will act like your outer guide rod. maybe some minor error but i'm not too concerned .. great idea none the less, and power feed sure is nice
Yeah this was a fairly involved project. If you use your rack you will get a lot of flex in the rack. At minimum you need two bolts at the bottom and top to hold the rack to the column. You may also need to drill and pin the rack in the middle as well. One reason I went with power was to reduce the influence of the crank and improve the accuracy.
That worked out very well. I reckon either a vee belt or ribbed flat belt would also work as well as the chain drive.
A timing belt would be great!
@@WinkysWorkshop It would indeed,but even one of the poly-vee belts used to drive vehicle ancillaries or washing machines would work well I think. Certainly plenty of grip from a 1/2" or 5/8" wide pooy-vee.
Outstanding build!
Thanks you sir!
I have the Grizzly g1000. Pretty much the same mill. I have been wanting to do this! Now you need to add limit switches and it will be the bomb!
Thanks... If somebody else was going to operate the mill it would be a must. Hopefully I won't forget and run the head off the top of the column! Ha
@@WinkysWorkshop lol
Excellent!!! I've got one of these mills (mine is a Rong-Fu RF-30) and the biggest 2 problems are the limited Z travel without moving the head, and the head pivoting when trying to take a heavy cut, but this idea could potentially solve both! I am thinking I may duplicate this, but with a ball bearing linear guide rail, a cheap 100:1 gear drive motor, and limit switches top and bottom... I too have been somewhat confused with the metric diameter screws using standard thread pitch... in standard size tapped holes...
Mine is also an RF30 sold by Enco. First, you don't really need a bearing but if you use one be sure you use one that is adjustable, otherwise you will have movement. Second, good luck finding a cheap gear motor. You might find one but it will be low voltage. If you find a cheap 120V gear motor please let me know. In hindsight I wish I had used a larger diameter guide bar but the one I used was the largest I could drill in my lathe. I've had problems with my head slipping while milling too but I still lock the head firmly. I worry about the clamps slipping or the bar flexing. If you make it stout enough you might get by with just leaving the head snug. It would be nice to not have to lock and unlock the head when you make a move. I do this while drilling but not milling.
@@WinkysWorkshop yeah after I commented I finished watching and saw that you were only getting about .001” over approximately 5” of travel, that seems quite excellent with just cold rolled round stock as your shaft and delrin ‘bearing’! Maybe I will just duplicate your design straight across. I’ve found quite a few options for 120v worm drive motors, as usual, they’re straight from China, but will go well on a Chinese mini mill.
@@gallupcustomknives2293 - Aside from the time it takes I don't have a problem buying from China. You could pay a higher price in the US but you might be buying the same gear motor. The derin is just two flat pads. I clamped them to the shaft and then tightened the lock downs. The surface area is so small you can run them tight without too much friction. The .001" was over about a 5 inch travel but that is still good if you ask me.
@@WinkysWorkshop exactly. You read my mind on that last bit
Nice job! I've always had that problem with my mill.
It's very nice. I'm a little worried about the gears though. I move the head a lot more than I used to not that it has a motor drive. Now I need a push button lock down the head.
Great job and brilliant explanation...
Thanks David.
Thanks for sharing, very cool mods.
Glad you like them! Thanks
Yet another clever solution to a daily pain. I have a 8" spacer under the ram of my Bridgeport, and I am continuously running the knee up and down with the manual crank. Too bad I couldn't incorporate this to my mill .
Adapters can be bought or made to use a 1/2 inch drill for the knee feed. Commercial knee feed units are also available.
Harbor Freight drills are cheap! Thanks for watching!
Make a drill motor adapter for the knee... Fun simple project : ruclips.net/video/-4t8g8AensE/видео.html
(I certainly hope that Mr. Winky doesn't mind me throwing a bone to Tublecain!) I made these to make my X & Y handles on my round column mill "Power feed". With a slow drill, it made big improvement to final finish passes!
You may be getting some flex from the crank handle travel bar attached to the milling machine's pipe. The bar with the notches in it. Just tack weld it in strategic locations and if you ever want to get rid of it or sell it you can just grind off the tack welds. Those bars are only stuck in at the top and bottom collars giving some horizontal or lateral movement.
I've thought of doing this to mine. I figure if i work out the minimum and maximum heights i'm likely to need i can weld the remaining of the rack bar top and bottom to the pipe.
It will flex (a lot). For this to work well the rack needs to be attached to the column about every 3 inches. .001" rack movement translates to .006" or .008" at the spindle.
Cool video, nice piece of engineering, and yes why would someone dislike,
Thanks!
It may just be me, but I hate square corners, even with a small radius on them. I would definitely make that lower right hand corner really rounded off or contoured around the spring housing. Can't wait till you put up the links to plans and materials so I can try to build one for my RF-31.
Just posted the plans. Hopefully they are good enough for most to use. The biggest concern is differences in mills. Rong Fu made several variations over the years. You are right about the corners! Thanks
Great idea, well done!
Thanks, so far its worked well.
Wonderful work 👏
Thanks, it really makes the mill more user friendly.
Excellent again! May give it a go on my round column mill...
On another subject, do you have any video with info re the coolant system for your Mill? I need to add one to my Mill. Is it cooling as well as lubrication that is required during milling?
The coolant I use is called Koolmist. It's about $40 per gallon but you dilute is a bunch, I think 15:1. There are many options for sprayers but get one with both air and coolant valves, some just control the air.
I've made a lot of my machines with power drives and found that wind screen wiper motors do a very good job, they are an angled drive and geared, also cheap
I think the wiper motors would be great but they also require a power supply. I could be wrong but I think the $30 drill is cheaper.
Hi Winky, yes understand I buy the Motor for about £9 and the power supply for £12 must be 12v and about 7amps
It's around 12 kg force required to wind the head up.
@@workshopcarnival6011 - I actually check that. That sounds about right. I think I came up with 3-1/2 foot lbs
Great design! I see another design is screwed down the racks on top and bottom to keep column in line. That might fix the issue there and then add the power feed as you did.
I tried doing that. The two problem I had was that the rack flexes. It would have to be pinned every 3 inches to stop the flexing and you would have to pin it through the teeth. Second the amount of slop in the channel the rack is in is huge. I could not figure out how to eliminate this slop.
Great job!
Thanks
The Winkster nailed it great idea
Ha... Thanks!
Hi Winki, you might could put a adjustable Clamp across the two angles holding the Deleon. That way you could tighten the Delrin against the Bar a little tighter.
I actually did that and then tightened it down. So far it hasn't worn that I can tell.
Hi, Do you ever have trouble when milling slotted holes, say 3/8 inch, with the mill bit runnung off and the slot becoming less than parrarell??
Only with a small long end mill. Unless you take very small amounts the mill will deflect. If you want an accurate slot go with an undersized mill. While cutting a slot one side of the mill is climb cutting and this is not ideal.
I have an OLD Craftsman drill press I need to do this to. The only problem would be, when I want to use it like a radial drill 😉 That part of it does come in handy once in a while, but cranking the head up or down to use a different tool on the same location would be easier.
Yeah... I put a square column on my drill press. It had a hand crack for a while but now I have a drill to power it. Best thing I ever did!
Really like this! Great fix to an annoying problem. One question- do you leave the top pulley cover off, or have you adapted it so it still fits?
I leave it off for a couple of reasons. First, it rattled terribly and second, to loosen or tighten the draw bar it helps to grab the pulley. I just got tired to lifting the cover. It would be fairly easy to trim the covers for the modification. Also, some of the newer mills have a plastic cover that might not rattle.
Hey Winky, I found the other video, with the DRO , and where you kept the depth stop, what brand of caliper did you use ?, as it seems to have the readout facing the right way for this application, verses standard calipers, thanks very much.
I bought it from All Industrial PN 30072
@@WinkysWorkshop Thanks for the quick reply.
THANK YOU, I too bought a similar mill drill
Mine is a Tiawan built central machine. Now im frying to see what taper or collets the machine uses. Any advise sought Thanks
Mine is R8. As far as I know they are all R8
Nice Job, great idea
Thanks!
Think I might have put some half moon shapes in the delrin, or 1/4 moon might be a better description. The extra surface area might be nice to have and keep the bearing surfaces from wearing out to quicly.
You might be right although Delrin wears very well. The good thing is that it only takes a minute to adjust.
The goal of keeping zero alignment is a good one. Seems like a simple dial indicator and brackets on the column and mill head would suffice. Zero like a vice tightening and tapping with dead blow.
Suffice maybe... but what a pain. I used to do that all the time. Occasionally I would get lucky but locking the head moves everything. With the guide bar it is very consistent, usually less than .002". Admittedly, working in a factory setting most my life probably ruined me. The extra minute or two it took me to align the head bothered me a lot
I enjoy your projects, most satisfying. Please clarify your testing of the accuracy with the dial indicator. Does the column have a flat spot along the length where the dial indicator is referencing? If not, then is this test correct for checking radial movement of the mill head?
I had the quill fully extended and locked. The indicator was on the side of the quill. The exposed quill is about 6-inches long. This test tells me if the quill stays aligned with the column as it moves. The indicator is on the curve (left side) of the quill. Of course I am assuming the quill is parallel to the column on the other axis (very close I'm sure) and if it is this is the best way to test. Maybe the only way.
Brilliant work
Thanks!
They re 1/4-20 et. al. screws because the OEM designs for the Tiawanese factories to build, were Murican contract NRE types.
After thinking about this the Chinese make all the screws anyway, they probably had then in abundance
simple and very helpful nice work
Thanks
Hot tip (I think), I used #25 chain, the sprockets are smaller for the same number of teeth. It's nowhere near straining the chain or sprocket, the forces involved are low. I went with a 1:6 gear ratio, 12 tooth small and 72 tooth large sprocket. I could have used a larger input (small) sprocket to make the head move faster, but I'm happy with the speed. I just set the small sprocket the right distance away to tighten the chain, so I didn't need an idler sprocket to take up the slack.
You are probably right. I already had the sprockets. Good tip
Very nice job as usual, with your various mods to your machines. Good Ideas to do similar on my RF30 Round Column Mill. What gear ratio's did you use, & what are the gears off . Keep up the good work. Thanks
Check back tomorrow - I'll have the drawings posted later today with all the specs.
I like this idea. I need to do this to mine. new subscriber. thanks for sharing.
Thanks! Glad you liked it
Well done very beneficial idea
Thanks Philip.
👍👍😎👍👍. Cleverly executed. 👊👊
Thanks 👍
That is a clever fix to a problem many of suffer with. Winky your results are better than you were talking about in the video, you were using a .0005 test indicator and calling each mark a thousand.
Thanks, Yes you are correct on the indicator but the error is up to .001. But thats okay... I'm pleased with the results!
@@WinkysWorkshop The results are about as good as one could hope for. It was a definitely a interesting video. There is always so many things to be learned from your videos. Thanks for all the time that you spend on them.
@@andyZ3500s You are a kind person, Thanks!
Very good design. Now I have to watch the side of the road for an old free 10 speed bike fir my chaun and sprockets
Haha... that might work!
Did you consider directly driving the worm shaft with the drill? Why the choice to go with sprocket layout? Did it create less torque forces that could influence side movement?
It takes a lot of torque to turn the worm. Way more than a drill has at very low speed. Side movement was not an issue plus it has a guide bar to stop movement.
Lock the rack to the column with countersunk bolts. Have a *third* collar ride on the plate along the column. Make the notch square, but round off its corners so that they don't dig into the rack's metal surface.
That would work but the rack would have to be bolted fairly often. Also the amount of metal at full depth of the teeth is not really adequate to counter bore. I considered pinning the rack but was a little worried I would not get it straight.
great video, i have the same mill except mine doesn't have a reverse. Did you fit that and if so did you change motor or rewire old one .Thanks
Thanks! Mine came with the reverse. I bought it used. It looks original but I could be wrong. I almost never use the reverse. Of course if I didn't have it I would need it
Awesome, great video! I have the same Mill, may have to do this. Keep up the great videos. What size vise to you have on your Mill?
Thanks! I just posted a link to the plans. I think my vise is 5 inch but it will clamp over 10" when you move the jaws.
Hi Winky! I'm getting ready to build a version of your height adjust/head immobilizer thanks so much for the video and the plans! I have a couple of questions if you have time to answer. Is email or asking in the channel preferred? Thanks!
I'll do what I can to help you out. Winkysworkshop@GMX.com
Solid video mark have same mill /drill i think this is another replication i must do
Thanks, it works great. The only negative is the need to unlocking the head (or remembering to).
Pretty cool system, but maybe not the "ultimate fix"? After some years of frustration with my round column mill, and being uninterested in putting that much effort into one, I decided to buy a knee mill. Still may not be the ultimate as a nice Deckle or Maho would be way further up there, but way better...... BTW, if you know anyone that wants a round column mill, I may know a guy? Good videos, keep them coming.
HA... Yep, I totally agree. Thanks
Very nice addition to the mill!
Can you tell me the brand an type of the bench vise at 7:00 minutes?
It's made in Poland but thats all is says on it. I bought it 25 years ago at a garage sale. It's a great vise but the back jaw moving is not a good concept. You can not clamp a bar with it hanging down below the vise because it hits the bench.
Winky's Workshop Thanks!
A friend of mine has the same type. But we can’t figure out what type pf brand it is.
👍very nice modification,🇬🇧.
Thanks 👍
Have you seen Bruce Whitham's version. It fits on the right side with no interference from the pulley on up travel. He sells kits for it. I have copied it for my older RF30.
I just watched. There is many ways to fix this issue although I think I like mine a little better. The only advantage I see to his design is that you can swing the mill to one side if needed but so far I have never need to do this. Hos might also be slightly cheaper although probably not if you include buying calipers. I also saw a guy use a laser to align the head. If you ask me, if I have to critically align the head after moving it the laser is the easiest and very accurate as long as you mill is level and bolted to the floor. Thanks for the info, I like seeing how other resolve issues.
Hi Winky, really enjoy all your videos, just a question on mill, or mill drill selection, I am trying to decide on a mill, or mill/drill machine , and have researched them a fair bit , the round column like yours seem to be fairly heavy duty machines, only other feature they lack in a comparable square column machine is digital depth readout on the quill, is this a big problem? I dont mind that most machines like yours in this video are 220 volt, I have it in my shop for my welding machines, thanks, and thanks for posting the video.
I think it boils down to how much money you want to spend. I would absolutely buy a mill and avoid the round column. They do make mill drills with a dovetailed column but they are still higher priced than the RF 30s. My choice would probably be a Precision Mathews for a new mill or find an old full size mill. With that being said, my round column mill works well and it fit my budget when I bought it. Plus its a LOT smaller that a bridge port or the likes... also single phase.
@@WinkysWorkshop Appreciate the input, thank you.
@@kentdixon5716 Your welcome, good luck with your mill.
If you want head alignment during raising and lowering the head on your round column mill but without the power feed there's a fix. It's described in issue 18 of Model Engine Builder magazine (September October 2008) pages 32 to 33. It uses the rack as the alignment bar and fixes top and bottom of the rack. A close fitting slide is fitted to the head to limit play.
First off, thanks for the info. However, I tried this... this seems good but it is not an ideal fix. The rack is close to the pivot center and the leverage the head has on the rack flexes the rack.... and not just a little! The rack is only 1/4" think at the bottom of the teeth. It could work but the rack would need to be pinned to the column at least every 3 inches. My biggest concern about going this direction would be getting the rack positioned perfectly. It's hard to move a pin. Then there is the issue of drilling between the teeth on the gear. To be strong enough you would probably want to used a 1/4" pin and to do so you would also be removing part of the tooth. Maybe not a big deal but it would weaken the tooth. Also, trying to drill in a V (created by the rack teeth) might be tricky. There are a few other ways to fix this issue but in my opinion the rack is last on my list.
The unit had its disadvantages, if I'd really spent the time on it I should have, I would have had a lot more contact area top, bottom and a pair of sliding guides.
The whole thing had to be removed to free up the bottom of the column every time I cut gears to allow me to fit a lower support bearing on the cutter arbor. I've found a workable and simpler solution to limited travel is in tooling length - long centre drills and stub length screw machine drills and stub reamers. Lets me set up tooling of roughly the same length. I'm tempted by vertical axis power feed for a boring head.
@@avelingdx - I've done the same with the stub drills and have a video on making the long center drill. Of course that was long before this current fix.
I too needed to cut a large radius curve. Rather than make/buy a big flycutter, I mounted the workpiece on my rotary table, and used a normal end mill.
One of the other ways to skin the proverbial cat. Mike M,that would likely have been my first thought as to how to cut the arc portions out too.👍
My rotary table is wimpy and doesn't hold up well under load. Thanks
If you have a piece of Thompson shaft kicking around with a linear bearing would do the trick quite well.
The delrin works very well. There is almost no force on the delrin and the contact area is very small so friction is not an issue. However... It would be nice to leave the head unlocked slightly and and move the head with the motor as needed without locking or unlocking. A bearing would be better for handling this lateral load. I actually do this while drilling but not for milling.