Great to hear Detective Amaral's thoughts as it shows that he is a highly skilled detective. This is exactly why the McCann PR machine went to enormous efforts to discredit and undermine him.
My take is that I do not personally think that the UK REALLY believed that the Police there were not competent, but rather they needed folks who would stick to the script, and their plan worked, which is why this circus has gone on.
So let's just get this clear; suspicious man checks side gate and door, but then decided to use the window whilst 'abducting' a three year old? Makes no sense whatsoever
At the time is was dealt with as a missing person case, hence police everywhere in and around the apartment, it wasn’t treated as a crime scene until later, possibly when any evidence had been destroyed
That’s because they’re two arrogant doctors who think they hold the authority to decide what professional is competent or not, even though they have absolutely no business attempting to manipulate a police investigation. They have consistently accused the Portuguese police of having some sort of unfounded vendetta towards them whenever questions are raised about the disappearance of Maddie that doesn’t centre around an abductor theory. The whole act of Gerry and Kate is that they are the victims, hence they feel entitled to dictate - it’s as if from the beginning it has been nothing but “How dare you ever question our integrity as parents, focus more on how our precious daughter was TAKEN and how horrible that is for us”. Perfect sympathy card to play.
This has always haunted me this case, and it will always go back to the fact that they left their kids (babies) in their apartment, on their own. No parent in their right mind would do this. And it wasn’t just the Mccanns that does this. The whole holiday party did this. If anyone else had done this, our kids would have been taken away from us and put into social care. Drives me crazy!! Their “story” is so obviously false, but yet still getting away with it. 🤬🤬
I remember when I first heard about the case. The whole story seemed so farfetched. Supposedly intelligent parents leaving their very small children in an unlocked apartment in a beach town known to harbor all types of sleazy people seemed weird to me!
I'm a criminologist/lead investigator/ field agent of 30yrs (ret) in Australia. I never bought the parents story. For a start, they were far too quick to talk about Madeline in the past tense (so why keep asking for money to search for a missing child?). Also they were far too quick to give the strange man carrying a child that was Madeleine's size story. I have always believed that the McCann's killed Madeline and disposed of her body.
@@earth0128 agreed, and when accounts get 'fuzzy' as an investigator you start digging deeper. While this man is an author of true crime novels, he ticks all of the boxes I would expect on the job.
@@Flowersofromance6-fs4pb novels/books. I said true crime so obviously I wasn't insinuating that they are made up stories. The comment of a writer, was only in regards to he's not out in the field 24/7 as say I would during an investigation. That is all I meant. Nothing remotely derogatory towards him. I was praising his work.
What worries me, in terms of the neglectful but unintended accident is this. They know safeguarding expectations - they're doctors. They'll have made safeguarding referrals themselves, especially Kate as a GP. Yet they are happy to admit to the supposed leaving them unattended, while knowing really that it's not OK. It's like they're bartering a bit of public stick for that if they can push through the abductor story. Yet which is worse - leaving your child to fatally injure themself or leaving your child to be abducted by a murderous S abuser. What they're presenting as truth is worse in a way. And then I come back to what (to me) is the biggest question. What was so wrong with the body that would make someone go to these extremes.
Good point. Why go straight to abduction, when she wandered off is more credible? We have a case where I live, small child disappeared in seconds, arrived at his grandparents for hols. Turned round and he was gone.
@@amycarter8497- the theory of the Portuguese police (PJ) is that she fell from the back of the lounge sofa onto the tiled floor on the evening of 3 May around 9pm, whilst looking out of the window, as could hear her father talking to Jez Wilkins out on the street. Most likely the cause of death was the blow to the head / positional asphyxiation. Both cadaver and blood dogs alerted to this spot between the sofa and window. Blood sample 3a was a match to Madeleine’s dna.
I don't think they left her alone, its clearly a story to distract the timeline. This is their big lie that everyone believes. But yes what was so wrong with the body, one of the group mentioned that gerry and another were doing sexual things with the kids at bath time and were discussing how good Maddie was with things in her mouth. If they were bad actors. Maddies body may have revealed various seamen deposits from someone else in the group not just gerry. Or could have revealed they were abusing her physically. or they drugged her causing drowsiness which would contribute to any fatal accident. Can't think of anything else to hide.
@@keigreencap9192- well the Portuguese police believe the children were left alone. Re; the gasper statements. Go back and read both statements of Mr and Mrs Gasper (in the PJ files). Mr Gaspers statement contradicts everything his wife says. He says that ‘he didn’t believe the gesture David Payne made to be about Madeleine. And he had no reason to not trust David Payne. In fact he gives him a good character reference.
I have an intuition that the McCann’s initially thought that Madeleine was missing and realised that she was dead - following on from this, at some point she was kept in the boot of the rental car. It’s disturbing that Madeleine had got out of bed a night or so before and was found wondering around crying by neighbours asking for her parents. The next night they go out and do the exact same thing? That sort of selfishness shows a clear disregard for the safety of not one, but 3 very small children. The whole “it was a pedophile” story is just crap. As if a random pedophile was walking around that holiday resort at that time and decided to try and get through a (locked) window, and according to Gerry could have been wielding a Calpol syringe filled with enough sedatives to render 3 children unconscious. Gerry McCann just gives me the creeps, the way he seems to relish in the media attention and there’s his cowering anorexic wife always looking tortured next to him.
@@OpalineAndTheBean I would need to research the case more thoroughly before I could give a totally concise answer to that because I am much more familiar with other cases and this has become a recent research interest of mine. Having said that, I don’t think Madeleine fell off the couch, a child looking for their parents would go to the window or the door. An injury from falling from a couch is far less likely to be fatal. The most likely scenario to me is that she was looking for her parents as she knew they were outside. A child who fell over a balcony railing would obviously be missing in the apartment on the initial discovery, hence a probable reaction of “She’s gone! She’s missing! She’s been abducted!”. The next obvious immediate step would be to search the vicinity, whereupon I believe they found her dead body. I do believe the McCann’s moved her body immediately inside the apartment to resuscitate her, which would account for blood transference, 1) That was in their nature as doctors 2) There would have been blood from the injury and blood from resuscitation where blood is often ejected through the mouth or nose. Resuscitation may not even have been attempted as there is a fair probability that her body was cold on discovery. Also, for a body to begin pooling and leaking bodily fluids (inside the boot) the amount of time the body has been left before burial or being moved has to be much longer than a few hours, you’re looking at a few days at the least, depending on heat/humidity etc. It would make sense not to move the body immediately out of the vicinity and wait till the searching has died down a little over the following days before a planned disposal was carried through with.
The purchase of the fridge by the McCann’s was also highly suspicious. Not only can a fridge be transported in a car (with a child in) fairly inconspicuously, a fridge laid flat facing upwards is like a coffin. A sealed fridge was in my opinion how she was kept before being transported to the disposal sight, or, she was disposed in the fridge. She could even have been cremated in the fridge. I also wondered about the McCann’s weird jogs they kept going off on after Madeleine disappeared. This would have been a perfect opportunity for the couple to discuss in private how they were going to deal with the situation without looking suspicious, (I.e not like sitting in a restaurant and covertly whispering to each other) … it was also a possible way to conceal visiting certain areas where a body could be kept or could be/had been disposed. As doctors, they would have known the pertinent times to dispose of the body in order to manipulate an accurate time of death, they will have known the stages of decomposition a body goes through. They knew about cadaver odours, they cleaned. You don’t clean what you believe is a crime scene that should be preserved because your daughter has been kidnapped.
@@OpalineAndTheBean- the Portuguese police / Goncalo Aramal certainly believe this was the case. Their hypothesis is that she was standing on the back of the sofa looking out the window (through the shutters) trying to get her father’s attention. He was standing outside on the street talking to another holidaymaker. This was around 9/9:10pm. Its believed she fell head first onto the tiled concrete floor below, (possible cause of death broken neck/blow to the skull/positional asphyxiation - take your pick). Yes, its highly possible that she was noted missing from her bed, and if you read all the witness statements the belief by all was that she’d somehow managed to get out the apartment hence at around 9:20pm a search for her was started. That part appears to be genuine. It’s believed that at some point between 9:30-45pm either Kate or Gerry finds her dead behind sofa. By this point the search is underway for her around the resort and towards the main town. Gerry takes the desperate decision, to prevent him and Kate going to prison for negligent manslaughter, of taking Madeleine out of the apartment at around 9:50pm. He’s seen by the Smith family at around 10pm heading down a back road towards the quieter back of PdL. Gerry has no alibi between 9:45-10:30pm that evening.
What get me from two well educated people in a caring profession, there lack of care was dire .mummy dearest claims to find maddy gone, does she shout scream, shout for help, no she leaves the twins again alone to go back to hubby and the tapas 7 to tell them maddies gone. That is against all common sense and behaviour from any loving parent suffering your worst nightmare a supposed child stolen, so she compounds her insanity and neglect and with a said bad child thief about she leaves the twins alone to travel 750 yards up the road to hubby and the tapas 7. The behaviour here on in does not act right, look right, or sound right . Taking aside 99 percent of parents around the world would never do what these two well educated doctors have done, leaving 3 toddlers all alone miles from home in a flat , we all know its a given kids wake up, cry for mum and dad, have accidents, even if it's distress none is accounted for by these maccan parents. No wonder no one believes their story, not even the Portuguese police chief, and quite rightly so it only gets worse when they are in interview after interview getting worse each time.The strange conversations with the tapas 7 maddies mum calling maddies body parts in her book and interviews my daughters beautiful private parts, what the hell. But it get worse do they go looking for their daughter when help is all around, no they don't, they go for a run, more what the hell. The detection detectives are spot on with the finality in talk of there daughter from these two, Nothing is right, the coldness, the millions in funding, help the Ben needhams family never got, or a foreign office Clarence Mitchell giving up his well paid job to work for the maccans, .As for the broeckner well I believe he's just a fall guy to close the case, more look over here, not over there, and more proving a cover up. It didn't make sense from the start and even threw in Tony Blair and Gordon brown ,oh where did Jerry get Gordon browns phone number from but apparently he had it, speaks volumes of Jerry being connected, in the club and foreign office Clarence Mitchell and all the millions, even paid off their mortgage, and now he says the fund is run like a business, oh the leakage is astounding, and these two are poor liars.
The McCanns suddenly stopped going to the restaurant for breakfast on April 30th ,saying it was too far to take the twins. Yet they also said about the distance, it was just like having a meal in their back garden. Not forgetting, the bi-lingual Mr.Murat, hurriedly booked a flight to Portugal on the evening of April 30th, catching it 7am. next morning, giving no reason for the haste. He then worked later as interpreter for the creche staff. sheer coincidence ?
Yes but when I'm on holiday with my family I usually go half board and we look forward to our breakfasts! It's part of the holiday. It wasn't very far to the Millennium restaurant and everyone else was going so it does seem rather strange. Equally on the day of the disappearance everyone else was down near the beach.. Not the MacCanns though...
@@johngreenhalgh4428 Hi. Which reliable source/link can I view to hear all that (the details of how "present" the mccans were those couple of days prior to the situation? Is there any reporting of the creche staff of how the mccans appeared to be in those prior days etcetera?
@@ruthx3346 Yes always many contradictions here (!) but according to Gerry's first statement 'As regards routines, he says that on Sunday they had breakfast between 07.30 and 08.30 at the OC Bar at a few metres distance from the apartment. During the following days, because of the fact that the bar was quite far away, they began to buy food at a supermarket situated in the same street as the apartment, he cannot remember the name of the supermarket and they would have breakfast in the apartment.' With the trip to the sailing, there undoubtedly was one but Maddie was not actually named in person by the group leaders - it was just five or six children in a group - there was even doubt about the number. . With the final creche entry Madeleine's name is strangely misspelt on the sign in sheet. The activity was supposed to be something like diving into a pool to extract an object off the bottom. Most of these supposed activities were totally inappropriate for the age group - they had been copied from the previous year's list for older children. There are many inconsistencies with the creche records.
Dogs have been able to smell cadaver 30 minutes after death according to published literature. Also just because there was blood indications, doesn't mean she wasn't accidentally over sedated. That could have been the very reason that she fell and hit her head causing her to bleed.
Years ago the photos were discredited. They were supposed to be from the day she disappeared, except it was raining, not sunny as shown. Why did the father take a solo catamaran trip during the day before she was reported missing. Where did the large sports bag he flew out with vanish to ?
What mother would write about her daughters perfect genitalia? That in itself is a red flag. Why did she wash the child’s teddy, when it would have had child’s scent on it? Why did they automatically say, she has been taken, without searching for her around the holiday site? Why did the twins not wake up? Why did they again leave the twins alone when they went back to the table, after she had already found the child gone? Why did they refuse to answer any questions set by police, in lie detector, and write the questions they would answer? Why did the sniffer dogs who sniffed out the child’s blood, get ignored, especially when they sniffed her blood in the car boot they were using? They definitely did something to the child, probably overdosed her on sedation, as night before she had woken up, then the child awoke unsteady due to meds given her, fell banged her head hard and die. The parents if they had said their daughter was dead, would have known, due to unexplained death, post-mortem would have been done, and the sedatives would have been found in her blood. They knew they would have been arrested for man slaughter, both being doctors, knew that they would have been found guilty. So instead of doing that, they casually decided Maddie was not worth while them being sent to prison, just proves how much they cared for their beautiful little girl
So she wrote the book herself? There was no editor or publisher who said, that thing about Maddy’s genitalia is just too weird. Why was that left in? It was important to Kate why? There must be a psychological reason flor including that. What has the deception detective say about that? Would he say that was “leakage?” I love his analysis of all the water references!
@@victoriaalexander2488good point about the editor. I have thought about Kate’s comments a lot- the washing of the cuddle cat is key for me. There is no way any mother would wash the item with the strongest scent of their child- unless they needed to remove cadaver smell and such that could be swabbed and show signs of decomposition of a corpse. As a mom of 5 this is the most damning evidence of all.
@@mariabergendal1019 Well, Richard Hall made a fantastic documentary about that question: Buried by Mainstream Media: The True Story of Madeleine McCann, Part 6 - When Madeleine Died? There you have a complete and logical answer about "photos" of Madeleine McCann and "sightings" in period 30.04.-03.05.2007. Simply, there is not a single credible piece of evidence that Maddie was alive three days before she "dissapear" .
You are clearly unable to think logically! There were NO credible sightings after the 28th of April. The photos have been tampered with. The creche records are falsified and forged. There was no abandoning/neglect! No sedating! No fall from a sofa. No break in. No abduction. All the evidence points to murder. YOU need to think logically before talking nonsense.
DISCREPENCY... all the way .... From All Directions .....Drowning with inconsistency .. ..If this had gone to trial the truth would have stood out a mile ALSO Parents and all concerned should have been taken to different rooms and thoroughly questioned as they not once showed expressive emmotions in all footages shown ......in media interviews in the begining in an indirect way the answers were NO Comment .... Still its sad !
Would football explain why GMcC said on the transfer bus that he wasn’t on this holiday to enjoy himself. He seemed very bad tempered which was commented on by someone in the group.
This is the video I’ve been waiting for! Couldn’t figure out how they discovered the body and moved it while at the tapas restaurant. Looking forward to the next one. Your coverage of this case and Ramsey case has answered questions I’ve had for decades! Bravo and much thanks for the great insights.
I've been following this case so long that I've passed through certainty into uncertainty again. Teatime on the day was my theory for years. But I'm starting to like the night before theory. Like doing laundry, it's often a red flag of there are events of some kind around the timeline. In this case, hold heard crying, Gerry and Kate arguing, Kate sleeping in the children's room. In fact perhaps they had to acknowledge she'd slept in a bed in that room because forensics might have indicated as much. But perhaps she was spending the night with a head injured child, the severity of which had been vastly under estimated, and she'd not been taken to hospital. Imagine that - parental medical neglect by two doctors.
Omgosh this made me feel a little ill I’ve never heard it put this way maybe if she had fallen outside and was discovered maybe she was still living and Kate cuddled her and they did what they could to save her themselves but couldn’t take her to hospital because they would have to explain how she would have fallen she could have passed away on Kate there was cadaver on her shirt, something in your comment really clicked with me makes me feel terribly sad
@@Songbirdstress He totally Dominant and she held back, and still she will hold back.........Gone too far to own up her face filled with sadness and frowning when he speaks when looking at him ... he has mentioned Kate screaching cries on her own in her space , he hasn.t Lied on that ! sad i am allround
Wow, that is a very possible scenario. It would fit the McCanns going on with their vacation plans, thinking Maddie was going to recover, but she didn’t. 😢💔
#celeste you never know...if drink had been taken, if they didn't see the accident happen themselves and basically under reacted until it was too late. It is possible.
The brother in law said he'd purchased meat, shrimps and beef and that's what was found by the dogs in the hire car . Why would they do that if they ate at the restaurant? The brother in law used a colloquialsm, he said 'we tossed the car mat', that means they threw it away, as in tossed it in the rubbish. I wonder if the hire car company charged them for the missing mat? Most car boot mats are rubber back so it's questionable how the liquid would transfer to the car through the rubber. Maybe the body was rolled up in the mat?
The UK government have denied a request from a scientist who has perfected a DNA system that would solve this crime/accident. They have denied access to the materials WHY! THIS PROCESS COULD END THE SPECULATION PERMANENTLY??
I still think Death occurred Sunday. Sometime after the Pool Photo. In all the recent discussions, no one seems to mention the "Lolita" photo. Richard D Hall nailed it in his 4hr video.
Have the McCannes ever been charged or prosecuted for child abuse/neglect? Leaving your 3 small children alone in their holiday apartment, while the parents go out for a meal with friends Surely, that would be a bare minimum. Please let me know what you think. Thanks.
They did have a visit by UK social services when they returned to the UK. It's hard to say what was said as we only have Gerrys account of it, which is that the social worker saw what nice people they were and went away. The social care dept won't ever say, they're not legally allowed to break that confidence outside of other statutory organisations .
PJ files: "This legal type of crime is only fulfilled with intent, and this intent has to cover the creation of danger to the victim's life, as well as the absence of a capacity to defend herself, on the victim's behalf. In the case of the files and facing the elements that were collected it is evident that none of the arguidos Gerald or Kate acted with intent. The parents could not foresee that in the resort that they chose to spend a brief holiday, they could place the life of any of their children in danger, nor was that demanded from them: it was located in a peaceful area, where most of the residents are foreign citizens of the same nationality and without any known history of this type of criminality. The parents didn't even represent the realisation of the fact, they trusted that everything would go well, as it had gone on the previous evenings, thus not equating, nor was it demanded from them, the possibility of the occurrence of an abduction of any of the children that were in their respective apartments. Reinforcing what was said is also the fact that despite leaving their daughter alone with her siblings in the apartment during more or less dilated moments, it is certain that in any case they checked on them. Without any pretension or compensatory effect, we must also recognise that the parents already expiate a heavy penalty - the disappearance of Madeleine - due to their lack of caution in the surveillance and protection of their children."
I'm torn between two different scenarios. Either Maddy died earlier that week, and the parents had several days of covering it up. Or, she died that last day, somewhere between Kate took her home from the creche in the afternoon, and *before* they went to dinner at the Tapas Club. That would give them at least a couple of hours to come up with something. Because I believe she was already dead before they went to dinner, and that whole dinner thing with different people running off to check the kids is just a theatre. Because, excelt for the parents, the nanny at the creche is the *last* person that saw Maddy alive.
@@Songbirdstress The Nanny at the Creche, I forgot her name, said she could witness in court she attended Maddy that day. I may be wrong, but that is what I remember from the PJ files.
@@janwhite6038 I believe it was Thursday, their last day? In the afternoon the day Maddy went missing. That's why I'm leaning towards she died after Kate brought her home from the creche, because I don't believe they could've bribed an unknown staff about the death of a child.
I feel that the parents surely should have had a baby sitter there the whole time that they were out. What was the logic leaving them alone and checking every so often? Was it availability? If so one of them should have volunteered, or drawn straws? Something is rotten here, they were not short of money. We're not getting the truth, and by now, we probably never will. The thought of what the possibilities are, of what happened to Madeleine, are too horrendous to contemplate.
@quantisedspace7047 why isn't child neglect controversial please? Such statements illustrate a common misunderstanding of parents who don't want to pay for childcare and don't want to take responsibility for the care of their children. This points to the mind set of the McCanns, and Tapas 7, who placed personal enjoyment over the need to ensure adequate care for their small children. The group were all doing the same sort of neglect, which is possibly why they endorsed the McCanns cover story, the Tapas 7 were just as bad as the McCanns and maybe their code of silence is a realisation that the loss of a child could have happened to any of them. Guilty behaviour.
After they left her alone, she didn't go to sleep. I think she was scared and abandoned a d made to stay in that room daddy's football was more important. I think she came out of the room looking for her mum and one of the group did something.its the parents fault.
#2. Easy. Last photo of Maddie was the day after arriving on holiday - all other indications are she was no longer in crèche afterwards - records doctored etc. the whole story was planned for an event to kick it off as a distraction
@sara_387 : I think she died shortly after that last photo, the evening before the McCann's claimed that Maddie was abducted from the apartment. She wasn't in the creche on 3rd May and nobody seems to remember seeing her.
@sara_387nonsense! All the photos have been discredited. Anybody believing that that was Madeleine in the tennis ball photo must be very VERY gullible.
Racheal oldfield said the last time she seen Madeleine. Was thursday morning at 10.30 when Madeleine played tennis .Which is strange because Madeleine according to the nanny cat baker was sitting on her lap at 10.30 crying regards being scared of sailing .Oh and jane said the last time she seen Madeleine was thursday afternoon Madeleine waved .Which is strange again because Jane was playing tennis with Racheal .So wouldnt Racheal see Madeleine and that would be the last time she seen her .
Uhhh, this gives me the a very bad feeling.. I believe that this is very close to cracking an important hole in the case 😮… together With some really good points in the comments too. 🙏🏼Madeleine rest in peace 🙏🏼
I believe, based on the evidence, that the time of death was between 6 and 7 pm on the 3rd. I think poor Maddie was dead behind the sofa and they didn't know until GM went back to the apartment at 9. I know KM and GM are stoic but I don't think KM could have sat at the tapas restaurant at 8.30 pm behaving normally knowing her child had just died.
When a shutter is opened from inside, surely it makes a different sound to a shutter being forced open from outside. I had similar shutters in Spain, if they were opened from outside they had to be propped open with a piece of wood as once l let go, the shutter would drop closed again because the pulley-tape inside hadn't been engaged.
It didn't have to be 'forced' from the outside. GPM was surprised that it could be opened from the outside at all, let alone easily. Indeed, if true, there would have been no need for an intruder to jemmy them open. He made this preemptive declaration before realising how unnecessary it was. A Portugues burglar would have known that the shutters wouldn't need to be forced.
There were two drinking kids cup on the table when the accident occurred however there were three kids. Why was one cup missing? Apparently she was gone before the reporting time.
Could you explain where this idea comes from that cadaver odour takes 2h to form post-mortem ? I can't find any justification for this, other than stuff pointing back to this case. Also, I am having a hard time believing that a DB left in some foliage for 2h or so, will still.yield cadaver scent THREE MONTHS later. If this were the case, we'd be surrounded by cadaver alerts almost everywhere we go ! About David Payne's visit. My understanding is that he was sent my GPM to assist bringing the children to wherever they were going. However, when he got to 5A, the place was all locked up, because KMH hadn't yet returned from her run. The children were presumably left inside, perhaps sedated. KMH eventually arrived in her running gear and managed to blow off David Payne by telling him she was going into the shower. This is origin of KMH claiming 30s, whilst Payne claimed 30 minutes. He later said in his Rog that he couldn't remember what she was wearing but that she was wearing a towel. I think he was trying to distance himself from admitting that KMH was changing out of her running gear, having been out running leaving the children on their own. Likely Payne never saw the children at all at that time, as he didn't go fully into the apartment. He had to say '30 minutes' because that's consistent with the time he was gone from the tennis courts. He couldn't reveal that he'd had to wait 29'30" fot KMH to return, because that would mean admitting that he knew the children were unsupervised that afternoon. I had forgotten that Gerry claimed to be there at the apt all the time; I can see now that this was to give the illusion of somebody supervisong the children, should it be revealed that KMH had left the children alone whilst out running.
Completely agree with everything you’ve written here! Especially re; David’s Payne visit. I also believe Kate had been out running leaving the children asleep in the locked apt. Which suggests that the issue of neglect is far wider than just leaving them in the evenings. For these reasons no one wanted to reflect upon this, and Gerry falsely states he was also in the apartment then to cover all bases, when in fact he was playing tennis. Plus, just to clarify re; development of cadaverine. You’re right, it doesn’t take two hours. In fact according to forensic science research papers it starts to develop immediately upon death, and is especially accelerated in small children due to low muscle mass.
I trained and raised cadaver dogs. When (time-wise) the dog can detect human decomposition depends on many factors: body location, cleaning products used - bleach etc., weather, wind, etc. Just an amazing anecdote - we once had a dog find a body underwater over 6 feet under the surface. Their little noses are amazing! 😊 They can pick up cadaver odor months or even years after a body was present in a location.
Where did the calpol/anaesthesia overdose thread come from? I remember reading/hearing this very early on in the investigation. Yet hearing and looking at all the available information (decades later) it seems like another red herring in Madeleine's case. Who can say as to the the twins, were they tested? I don't think there is anything that can confirm the latter. Why was Jane Tanner fixated about "eggman" at that specific time? Remember the hotel staff said they never got up, they were loud and drank a lot. The manager also stated that Jane would not be able to to see "eggman" from where she stood and was on the wrong side of the street. The inconsistencies of alibis and explanations, too convenient. It's all about focussing elsewhere timewise and on another individual.
Here is what happened: The mcanns wanted something to sedate maddie as she was being loud at night and ruining their nights waking up. They didnt have what they needed or it wasnt working so they got something for Dr Oldfield (you have to have some incrimination for some of the others or it makes zero sense they play along later they have to be partly responsible) they were also drugging their kids with the same thing and didnt want to get found out. Maddie cries climbs out the window while on these adult drugs that a post mortem would find and falls and dies. The following day they invent a story with lots of tennis because Gerry carries her off very early that morning while dark in this bag. He does not leave the bag for obvious reasons and brings that back. He puts it in the wardrobe. Its only when it seems cadaver dogs will be coming that he has to get rid of this bag and he hires a car to take it away. The body didnt move 3 weeks later the bag did. When they plan the pretend abduction the night after two of the couples were in on it. Gerry goes back to the apartment to stage it it couldnt have been done earlier (window etc). He is so paranoid he spends a long time checking and double checking hence his testimoney he spent a long time at the toilet. Kate covers for him telling the group hes watching football busted in the reconstruction video Kate goes back to do the finding and when she runs out and says "they've taken her" it has nothing to do with assuming its a group. Imagine how you would speak when planning it "Thats when you come out and say they've taken her" they in that regard can be one person. After a few drinks and nervous about the whole thing she literally does what was discussed and comes out saying theyve taken her. Giving the game away Kate goes for a run the next day she needs for her own mind to go near the place maddie was hidden both to close the issue and also be able to sleep at night confirmjng for herself she wont be found / area isnt or wont be checked. Job done
Wait, I need more details… the dogs alerted by the gate… below a balcony? Was Madeline ever actually seen on this trip? If so, when was she absolutely seen?
"in the garden adjacent to apartment 5A, accessible from by way of the veranada and steps, the cadaver dog alerted in a garden-bed directly below the veranda."
madeleine could have been dosed to make her sleep and got up drowsy and fell and struck her head. the behaviour of both parents at the time and afterwards is bizarre and not in keeping with the circumstances. they remain aloof and purposefully obstructive to anything that questions their narrative. they had a lot to lose if madeleines body was discovered and a post mortem examination was carried out and being doctors they knew this. so the body had to be disposed of.
If one believes she died much earlier in the week one has to discount the Smith sighting. And I find their account quite credible. 24 hours or less I think you could hang on and plan, with a body needing to be dealt with. But not 5 days. In a small apartment with 2 toddlers. And no good reason to do so. Psychologically and practically it's much less likely.
@@christinecheeseman- if you mean the Smith sighting (family of 9) of a man carrying a child fitting the description of Gerry and Madeleine at 10pm that evening then yes.
@@stevefowler3398 - why would a family of nine lie about this? What possible motive could they have? Their account/statements were checked out by both Portuguese and British police, both of whom believe the family to be genuine. Added to this they have receipts from the restaurant and pub they visited that night, just before the sighting. Lastly Aoife Smith details in her statement the trousers she saw the man wearing carrying the child. And low and behold, Gerry had a pair with this specific detail on.
Thank you for the many anayses. The question I always have, based on the support the Mc Canns have from their fellow holidaymakers is beyond me. Why would they do that kind of thing and criminalize themselfs. Unless they are complicit perhaps and being in the situation to be blackmailed by the Mc Canns.
Didnt Kate vanish form the Tapas bar for quite a while Tuesday night? Also,there was a flurry of phone calls from Kates phone at the same time. She died Tuesday night
I believe in the 2nd theory sometimes fact can be stranger than fiction. And being in that situation you wouldn’t want to be brash like you need to think things through you don’t want to get caught if that’s the decision your intending, planning what to do while also still trying to look after 2 toddlers, I think the true conspiracy is the tapas group conspiring together they behaved too strangely, and no one has confidently sighted Madeleine towards the end of the holiday David Payne did on the Sunday but it was so odd when you read PJ transcript he sounds very unsure as to what he is saying and committing to by saying it, there’s so much umms and ahhs in a way that is not natural I know it is not a natural situation but he can’t put a sentence together without really hesitating and choosing words carefully and he describes them as looking angelic, it’s way too flowery and to evoke the word angel makes me think he has prior knowledge of something, and the time he spent there how different their recollections of how long David Payne was there you can understand 5 mins difference but when your trying to be accurate for police record it’s pretty crazy to get it that far different and I don’t know if there was ever an explanation for that it’s like look at the tanner man! And the other non sighting during checks was a convenient listen at the door, if you walk all the way why not just sneak your head in takes an extra few seconds if I was checking on someone else’s children I wouldn’t feel very confident going back to the table and telling the other parents yeah your children are fine I didn’t actually look I just didn’t hear anything. And if I was the other parents I would be feeling terrorised like that could have been my child they seem to have a different reaction. And dealing with 2 year old twins and a dead body a few hours earlier and to have so much all sorted and done seems so hard to comprehend they must be so efficient to achieve what they did maybe adrenaline but seems like mission impossible in such a short amount of time and to get all the tapas members to be onboard with the same story there is so much to do and have all line up. And also the lead up to the Sunday they really struggled filling in time for the previous days of the holiday if it happened on Sunday why can’t they confidently say what they did each day of vacation they’re doctors they’ve studied and had to remember so much information seems like red flags not be completely accountable for the days leading up very strange I think that’s why the whole camera and photos played out the way it did because of dates that are embedded into digital photographs etc they had the camera there if it happened Sunday why couldn’t they share the camera and photos why was that so orchestrated imagine if that was a medical assignment they had to hand in like why were they so incompetent and made a straight forward task so complicated
Several valid points! Except for one. I don't believe that they are doctors (for very good reasons). You probably also know that McCann is on the S. Offenders Register. And as such, she would know about his ab using. Which makes her complicit.
With all due respect, the work of Richard Hall was pretty concise in reference to this question, and the lack of photos on a family on vacation rhymes perfectly with the actual death of the child days happening before. Also, they could not have convinced the friends nor had time to concoct any sort of an alibi/timeline if the death had truly occurred on same evening, May 3rd. The police would have caught them. They had days to chill out and plan; they got away with it just for that reason. Stress must have aged them 10 years in 10 short days. That tennis ball photo just does not look like her. This case needs an English person to break open why the UK gov't decided to support them in their lies That said, I wish you would take a trip to Perugia with a translator and collect evidence against those involved in the Kercher murder. I purchased all of your books on Amazon and between Guedé having been released from prison and trying for an interview with Mignini (why not?), also analyze the last parking garage video, other witness accounts that no one talks about, etc. Bring this case back out off the shelves and see who says what; McCann case is dead and JB Ramsey as well. When the McCann kids will start posting on RUclips, then people can speak their minds
I can't take anyone seriously who's being taken to court by survivors of a terrorist atrocity that killed 22 people and injured over 1000 more, for trying to make money out of saying it didn't really happen. People who live there saw it happen and the aftermath.
True, there's no need to reinvent the wheel. RH has thoroughly picked apart the alleged high tea event. Something had happened to Maddie prior to the afternoon of the 3rd.
of anyone notices something odd, please write details down just in case it is relevant. so many people come out of the woodwork months later and their version is not believed to be acurate (like my spelling) cannot do any harm to write details. also come forward quickly. The smith sighting was so much delayed for example.
The balcony does not look safe, it looks like a sheer drop over the edge? Parents aren't always good at looking out for dangers with holiday accommodation.
The way they left the children alone is a paper tiger 😮...why would they wish for the public to question their parental abilities? What does that achieve for them? How old were the the twins?
I think Madeleine's time of death was at least the day before she was reported missing, maybe days before. I don't know when she was last seen. The self reporting of the parents and their cronies isn't trustworthy. The woman talking about hearing a child crying for hours is the last outside source I know of with evidence Madeleine was alive, whenever that was. So she probably died shortly thereafter.
I think Madeleine's time of death was at least the day before she was reported missing, maybe days before. I don't know when she was last seen.>>>If you combine what you say in the first sentence with what you say in the second, how can you make an accurate assessment?
I'm considering the reliability of the source. The clique of doctors who neglect their children doesn't seem reliable. So I'm going with the lady bothered by the sound of a child crying for hours. She's got no dog in the race (no reason to lie)
I think she died at least the night before they claim she was abducted. Why? Because Kate claimed Madeleine had said "Where were you when we cried" or something to that effect. That story seems fabricated to give the idea that Madeleine was still alive when she was not. I believe she died when crying was heard by other people and the McCanns use this story to sell the idea she was alive after that time when in fact she probably died then.
I am leaning towards - after the crying incident that was described by Mrs F upstairs on the Tuesday night and into the early hours of the next morning being Weds 2nd. Bringing the comment re MM asking why no one came when they cried. As you say - to insinuate she was alive and to give reasoning to any statements re the crying incident the night before.
Mother always took time to change her earrings and hairdo. Think i would be shaving my head and would be beating myself for leavjng kids alone for periods of time unsupervised.
One of the taps waiters testified that he saw Maddie near the tapas area about 16:45pm on the 3rd May. Therefore the time period to concentrate on is 16:45pm to 10:00pm on 3rd May.
Have you seen the truth of the lie? Or read the book? Its printed in several different languages not available in English as mccanns took the ex detective from Portugal involved in the case at the start, they sued up outcome it wasnt allowed to be printed in English, Richard d hall made a three part documentary on the truth of the lie, also a man from South Africa did investigation on padesta grounds with the machinery to check there new drive way this case should be closed they shouldn't be protected they shoould be in jail..
@@elizabethsheffield6609 Hi Elizabeth. Book title is 'Maddie: Enough of the lies' by Goncalo Amaral. I am sure you will be interested to know that a lady called Catalina Lupsa is reading out loud the English translation on her YT channel. I hope you find it. If you have difficulty, let me know, and I will post link.
@@jenkitching43 .......many thanks Jen for the info.. I'm very interested in reading/hearing Mr Amarel's latest book. He has been extremely poorly treated x
@@elizabethsheffield6609 Hi again Elizabeth. Make sure you check out her 'investigation videos'; quite a lot of interesting stuff on the McCann case there. I agree Mr Amaral was badly treated. I don't think he would have stood a chance against the British government and corporate media machine combined which are totally corrupt.
The choice of apartment and the way they left the children looks like a stage for their production this is on par with the post office cover up ,will they give back their Oscar’s for the worst acting and lying in history
5 ladies in their group but 4 ladies minus kate only went to the beach on Thursday .So why were there 5 ladies photographed in the holiday photo list at the beach on Thursday. Diane Webster said she never met anyone at the beach Thursday afternoon .Other than her daughter Fiona Jane and Racheal plus herself obviously. This makes 4 ladies in total yet Diane is photographed standing next to guess what a fifth lady .I assume David Payne her brother in law took the photo .So why would he take a photograph of some random stranger standing next to his mum in law .The point being is who was this lady and was she as she must have been known to the group .For David Payne to photograph her so why was that lady there.If Kate wasn't there then who was that fifth lady important enough for David Payne to take a photo of her standing next to his mum in law .Who said she never met anyone at the beach apart from the group members
this case stunk from the getgo.why on earth not put a tenager to watch the kids and go and check regularly on the babysitter and kids instead? I am a former nanny,and even a nanny would in the start not being allowed to leave the house with the kids the first week during work hours. This is security. None of the parents of the kids I nannied,nor my own kids has ever been left alone or unattended when sleeping ,playing or at any hour. its totally unnatural and lack of instinct to do that. kids walks off,kids gets hurt,kids can get sick, the list is miles long!and those are doctors!!! one of the families I nanied for were doctors.theres no way in hell they would leave their daughter (3 years toddler) alone . I was to tend that child every hour when they were occupied with the smallest little thing. and that was inside the house and outside when we had outings down in Madrid watching horses or birdhuntings. what in the world is this?.let me tell you! they wouldnt be able to claim her being taken if they had a babysitter,cause she would know if maddie was there or not,alive or dead. No need to be psychic or a mother to understand that! This stinks alibi in the making
Whem they removed the fridge? How that wasnt suspicious! They were guests there! If fridge didnt work its hotel job to fix that or change the fridge! So they rented the car and brought the fridge into the car! Where is that fridge or the car?
I also have a theory there may be a sex thing going on, and that's why all the witness statement differs. On the Thursday afternoon, Kate went home to have a shower. At the same time, one of their male friends had some errands at the McCanns apartment. She said he stayed for five minutes, he said he stayed for half an hour. Now, say that the swingers rumours are true, and they had some sort of sex arrangement between them, it's possible Kate and her male friend may have had sex at that moment, and Maddy could've died by accident, because they weren't looking after her. Now, I'm not judging people, certainly not in sex matters. But if this was true, that would count for all the differing statements, and why all involved would lie about it, and why they covered up Maddy's death, because they didn't want to admit what really happened.
The idea that KMH was sh@gging Payne has come up before. It's a possibility, particularly given the water/shower references and Payne being reluctant to say that KMH was dressed only in a towel. One possibility is that MBM woke and caught them /in fragrante/ and wouldn't shut up about it, and that Payne fatally thumped her as a result. I don't agree with this model, but it's come up before and it does have some merit 16:15
What were the parents motive to hide the death of their child? When the parents were suspected every fact that came up could and was implemented into that theory.
They'd have been disgrace as doctors, there other children would have been removed from the parents. They'd have probably lost their jobs and friends would disconnect
1. Child neglect resulting in her death. They'd have been prosecuted, risked their other children being taken away, loss of professional and personal reputations - these are people with a very strong sense of self-preservation, and they escaped being charged with child neglect on the basis she'd been abducted and thus compassionate grounds. 2. If they were drugging her and/or she'd been subjected to sexual abuse, those would have shown up in an autopsy, with bad repercussions for them.
@@elizabethsheffield6609 yes. If for example she suffered a fall behind the sofa and suffered some injury that wouldn't have caused her to die if she was found earlier than, say, 30 mins is another possibility
i wonder if we will still be talking about this case in another 20 or 40 years? what about all the other missing children? .. can we not speak about their plights? 💣💣
The woman in the apartment above them heard Maddy shouting NO DADDY the night before = Why is this never mentioned ? Father looks like a pretty bad tempered man to me
I always thought the parents were innocent because I thought how would they move the body and hide it when police and people were there? If Madeline died before they could have planned how to move her body. Could she have been stored at one of the other friends apartments? The friends accommodation was not searched was it? It was investigated as an abduction, not a possible murder. Also what were all of them doing all day or the previous days? Someone would have to look for a place to move the body to. It's not easy in an unfamiliar place to hide a body. The idea of parents dumping a body also just didn't make sense to me, but that was because I was seeing it from my point of view that I'd rather get into trouble and face the police than throw my child away. The idea of parents driving their child's body somewhere and dumping her possibly down a well, that just seems the worst to me, but then putting your child's body in a freezer is just as horrible. They all had to be in the story to plan it. None of their behaviour is what you would expect from worried parents. It's behaviour of parents who are not worried because they know what happened to their child. If you really thought your child was abducted parents would be going mostly crazy with anxiety about what could be happening to her. Most parents would not be able to function properly. You would not be able to do anything other than look for your child. Not knowing would drive you crazy. Knowing would be processing sadness and grief but also if covering up a death, they would be given a purpose like a reason. I think they would rationalise it as we have to do this for the other two. It's too late now. We can't lose everything. Then their behaviour makes sense. If you look at their behaviour it makes no sense if their child is missing, but it makes perfect sense if they already know what happened.
I think that is exactly why they went running and/or played tennis, and leftcthe twins in the creche. HE had to get HER to focus. Had to get HER mind off of HER terrible deed. She was going to crack. HE took control. And that is why HE still controls all the interviews. HE draws attention towards HIMSELF, and away from HER.
i thought they had sold her for body parts, when this farce first broke. i was inclined to accedent for a while, but this brings me straight back to body parts
Please do a synopsis of the facts of the case, one sentence for each thing that don't add up. Such that one could explain to one's friends in a few minutes.
how was cadaver blood on ground bushes below balcony , did she fall over balcony, ? drousy, how was blood behind sofa ? trying to work out order of both these happening and why ? did she try to climb out window and fall behind sofa, drousy then try to climb up on balcony to see where everyone was ? falling over it ,down into bushes under balcony died ?
If she died about six pm why hide it, if it was accidental I cannot understand covering it up. As some think she was sedated and left alone this would be a reason for covering it up
Maybe he walked in and caught Kate with his colleague? Maddie might have been injured if there was a scuffle. This would implicate not just the McCanns but another member of the group.
Pagers are not and were not a thing in Europe, unlike the USA. It appears that telephoning would be impractical if GPM were tennising. It appears that the only means of communication was using Payne as a message boy.
What I'm having such difficulty with is to determine if the McCanns are guilty of killing her or are they afraid of appearing negligent. I mean has someone gone in there and hurt her and they have found her and are top afraid to report this. I feel they are involved but to what extent. She was a very pretty girl so it could be possible someone was watching. But what about the hotel staff. I think it happened when she was heard crying out for her daddy. Or is the mother that psychopathic like my mother was she wanted rid of her because she could not control her and Kate did not like Jerry's closeness to her. I have an idea somebody might have been doing cpr on her hence the blood. And if she was killed and they wanted it to look like an accident it was probably by suffocation with a pillow. My mother did this to me. But we are talking about a real psychopath. If I spent a few days with Kate I would be able to tell. But an intelligent psychopath who is in control is nigh on impossible to tell. The way Kate has to always control the narrative is a sign to me. Could it be that Kate has foolled her husband and all her friends. Notice she never looks happy and her placing of hands on Jerry all signs of control. And giving up her job. So I now think if it was not a freak case like Lindy Chamberlain and if Kate is a psychopath I think she died from suffocation and the mother has deemed it an accident and has covered it up by doing cpr. Because of my mother and my spending my life as her scapegoat I'm fascinated by this case. Also the fact she slept in a single bed because she was upset with Jerry all adds to my suspicion. And unless you have had personal experience of a psychopath nobody would imagine what they get up to. Because they can literally kill somebody and stay totally calm. I would love to know about Kate's childhood??? And her relationship with her mother and father.
I agree! I also believe that K.McCann murdered Madeleine. Just compare HER persona to say Ian Huntley. He too was blasé about his involvement in the Soham murders.
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Great to hear Detective Amaral's thoughts as it shows that he is a highly skilled detective. This is exactly why the McCann PR machine went to enormous efforts to discredit and undermine him.
I always found it insulting to Portugal to suggest their police are not intelligent enough to deal with this case.
True, but you have to remember Portugal was coming out of a nasty dictatorship, so had been very closed.
My take is that I do not personally think that the UK REALLY believed that the Police there were not competent, but rather they needed folks who would stick to the script, and their plan worked, which is why this circus has gone on.
So let's just get this clear; suspicious man checks side gate and door, but then decided to use the window whilst 'abducting' a three year old? Makes no sense whatsoever
At the time is was dealt with as a missing person case, hence police everywhere in and around the apartment, it wasn’t treated as a crime scene until later, possibly when any evidence had been destroyed
That’s because they’re two arrogant doctors who think they hold the authority to decide what professional is competent or not, even though they have absolutely no business attempting to manipulate a police investigation. They have consistently accused the Portuguese police of having some sort of unfounded vendetta towards them whenever questions are raised about the disappearance of Maddie that doesn’t centre around an abductor theory.
The whole act of Gerry and Kate is that they are the victims, hence they feel entitled to dictate - it’s as if from the beginning it has been nothing but “How dare you ever question our integrity as parents, focus more on how our precious daughter was TAKEN and how horrible that is for us”. Perfect sympathy card to play.
This has always haunted me this case, and it will always go back to the fact that they left their kids (babies) in their apartment, on their own. No parent in their right mind would do this. And it wasn’t just the Mccanns that does this. The whole holiday party did this. If anyone else had done this, our kids would have been taken away from us and put into social care. Drives me crazy!! Their “story” is so obviously false, but yet still getting away with it. 🤬🤬
I remember when I first heard about the case. The whole story seemed so farfetched. Supposedly intelligent parents leaving their very small children in an unlocked apartment in a beach town known to harbor all types of sleazy people seemed weird to me!
Dont leave your little kids alone,look after them properly or dont have any
The fact that no one has ever been charged yet just speaks for itself.
I'm a criminologist/lead investigator/ field agent of 30yrs (ret) in Australia. I never bought the parents story. For a start, they were far too quick to talk about Madeline in the past tense (so why keep asking for money to search for a missing child?). Also they were far too quick to give the strange man carrying a child that was Madeleine's size story.
I have always believed that the McCann's killed Madeline and disposed of her body.
sure you are.
The timeline and accounts get fuzzy around late afternoon into evening. That's the crucial part IMO
@@earth0128 agreed, and when accounts get 'fuzzy' as an investigator you start digging deeper. While this man is an author of true crime novels, he ticks all of the boxes I would expect on the job.
Well actually he doesn't write novels (1 science fiction one once ?), he writes non fiction crime analysis. Sorry to be a pedant.
@@Flowersofromance6-fs4pb novels/books. I said true crime so obviously I wasn't insinuating that they are made up stories. The comment of a writer, was only in regards to he's not out in the field 24/7 as say I would during an investigation. That is all I meant. Nothing remotely derogatory towards him. I was praising his work.
What worries me, in terms of the neglectful but unintended accident is this. They know safeguarding expectations - they're doctors. They'll have made safeguarding referrals themselves, especially Kate as a GP. Yet they are happy to admit to the supposed leaving them unattended, while knowing really that it's not OK. It's like they're bartering a bit of public stick for that if they can push through the abductor story. Yet which is worse - leaving your child to fatally injure themself or leaving your child to be abducted by a murderous S abuser. What they're presenting as truth is worse in a way. And then I come back to what (to me) is the biggest question. What was so wrong with the body that would make someone go to these extremes.
Excellent point. What the heck happened that killed her.
Good point. Why go straight to abduction, when she wandered off is more credible? We have a case where I live, small child disappeared in seconds, arrived at his grandparents for hols. Turned round and he was gone.
@@amycarter8497- the theory of the Portuguese police (PJ) is that she fell from the back of the lounge sofa onto the tiled floor on the evening of 3 May around 9pm, whilst looking out of the window, as could hear her father talking to Jez Wilkins out on the street. Most likely the cause of death was the blow to the head / positional asphyxiation. Both cadaver and blood dogs alerted to this spot between the sofa and window. Blood sample 3a was a match to Madeleine’s dna.
I don't think they left her alone, its clearly a story to distract the timeline. This is their big lie that everyone believes. But yes what was so wrong with the body, one of the group mentioned that gerry and another were doing sexual things with the kids at bath time and were discussing how good Maddie was with things in her mouth. If they were bad actors. Maddies body may have revealed various seamen deposits from someone else in the group not just gerry. Or could have revealed they were abusing her physically. or they drugged her causing drowsiness which would contribute to any fatal accident. Can't think of anything else to hide.
@@keigreencap9192- well the Portuguese police believe the children were left alone.
Re; the gasper statements. Go back and read both statements of Mr and Mrs Gasper (in the PJ files). Mr Gaspers statement contradicts everything his wife says. He says that ‘he didn’t believe the gesture David Payne made to be about Madeleine. And he had no reason to not trust David Payne. In fact he gives him a good character reference.
They are evil ppl .... above the law
I have an intuition that the McCann’s initially thought that Madeleine was missing and realised that she was dead - following on from this, at some point she was kept in the boot of the rental car.
It’s disturbing that Madeleine had got out of bed a night or so before and was found wondering around crying by neighbours asking for her parents. The next night they go out and do the exact same thing? That sort of selfishness shows a clear disregard for the safety of not one, but 3 very small children.
The whole “it was a pedophile” story is just crap. As if a random pedophile was walking around that holiday resort at that time and decided to try and get through a (locked) window, and according to Gerry could have been wielding a Calpol syringe filled with enough sedatives to render 3 children unconscious.
Gerry McCann just gives me the creeps, the way he seems to relish in the media attention and there’s his cowering anorexic wife always looking tortured next to him.
I love your comment. I couldn't have said it better myself.
Do you feel that Maddy may have fallen (behind couch perhaps) and the parents didn’t see her? Just curious of your theory. thx! 😊
@@OpalineAndTheBean I would need to research the case more thoroughly before I could give a totally concise answer to that because I am much more familiar with other cases and this has become a recent research interest of mine. Having said that, I don’t think Madeleine fell off the couch, a child looking for their parents would go to the window or the door. An injury from falling from a couch is far less likely to be fatal.
The most likely scenario to me is that she was looking for her parents as she knew they were outside.
A child who fell over a balcony railing would obviously be missing in the apartment on the initial discovery, hence a probable reaction of “She’s gone! She’s missing! She’s been abducted!”. The next obvious immediate step would be to search the vicinity, whereupon I believe they found her dead body.
I do believe the McCann’s moved her body immediately inside the apartment to resuscitate her, which would account for blood transference, 1) That was in their nature as doctors 2) There would have been blood from the injury and blood from resuscitation where blood is often ejected through the mouth or nose. Resuscitation may not even have been attempted as there is a fair probability that her body was cold on discovery.
Also, for a body to begin pooling and leaking bodily fluids (inside the boot) the amount of time the body has been left before burial or being moved has to be much longer than a few hours, you’re looking at a few days at the least, depending on heat/humidity etc. It would make sense not to move the body immediately out of the vicinity and wait till the searching has died down a little over the following days before a planned disposal was carried through with.
The purchase of the fridge by the McCann’s was also highly suspicious. Not only can a fridge be transported in a car (with a child in) fairly inconspicuously, a fridge laid flat facing upwards is like a coffin. A sealed fridge was in my opinion how she was kept before being transported to the disposal sight, or, she was disposed in the fridge. She could even have been cremated in the fridge.
I also wondered about the McCann’s weird jogs they kept going off on after Madeleine disappeared. This would have been a perfect opportunity for the couple to discuss in private how they were going to deal with the situation without looking suspicious, (I.e not like sitting in a restaurant and covertly whispering to each other) … it was also a possible way to conceal visiting certain areas where a body could be kept or could be/had been disposed. As doctors, they would have known the pertinent times to dispose of the body in order to manipulate an accurate time of death, they will have known the stages of decomposition a body goes through. They knew about cadaver odours, they cleaned. You don’t clean what you believe is a crime scene that should be preserved because your daughter has been kidnapped.
@@OpalineAndTheBean- the Portuguese police / Goncalo Aramal certainly believe this was the case. Their hypothesis is that she was standing on the back of the sofa looking out the window (through the shutters) trying to get her father’s attention. He was standing outside on the street talking to another holidaymaker. This was around 9/9:10pm. Its believed she fell head first onto the tiled concrete floor below, (possible cause of death broken neck/blow to the skull/positional asphyxiation - take your pick).
Yes, its highly possible that she was noted missing from her bed, and if you read all the witness statements the belief by all was that she’d somehow managed to get out the apartment hence at around 9:20pm a search for her was started. That part appears to be genuine. It’s believed that at some point between 9:30-45pm either Kate or Gerry finds her dead behind sofa. By this point the search is underway for her around the resort and towards the main town.
Gerry takes the desperate decision, to prevent him and Kate going to prison for negligent manslaughter, of taking Madeleine out of the apartment at around 9:50pm.
He’s seen by the Smith family at around 10pm heading down a back road towards the quieter back of PdL.
Gerry has no alibi between 9:45-10:30pm that evening.
What get me from two well educated people in a caring profession, there lack of care was dire .mummy dearest claims to find maddy gone, does she shout scream, shout for help, no she leaves the twins again alone to go back to hubby and the tapas 7 to tell them maddies gone. That is against all common sense and behaviour from any loving parent suffering your worst nightmare a supposed child stolen, so she compounds her insanity and neglect and with a said bad child thief about she leaves the twins alone to travel 750 yards up the road to hubby and the tapas 7. The behaviour here on in does not act right, look right, or sound right . Taking aside 99 percent of parents around the world would never do what these two well educated doctors have done, leaving 3 toddlers all alone miles from home in a flat , we all know its a given kids wake up, cry for mum and dad, have accidents, even if it's distress none is accounted for by these maccan parents. No wonder no one believes their story, not even the Portuguese police chief, and quite rightly so it only gets worse when they are in interview after interview getting worse each time.The strange conversations with the tapas 7 maddies mum calling maddies body parts in her book and interviews my daughters beautiful private parts, what the hell. But it get worse do they go looking for their daughter when help is all around, no they don't, they go for a run, more what the hell. The detection detectives are spot on with the finality in talk of there daughter from these two, Nothing is right, the coldness, the millions in funding, help the Ben needhams family never got, or a foreign office Clarence Mitchell giving up his well paid job to work for the maccans, .As for the broeckner well I believe he's just a fall guy to close the case, more look over here, not over there, and more proving a cover up. It didn't make sense from the start and even threw in Tony Blair and Gordon brown ,oh where did Jerry get Gordon browns phone number from but apparently he had it, speaks volumes of Jerry being connected, in the club and foreign office Clarence Mitchell and all the millions, even paid off their mortgage, and now he says the fund is run like a business, oh the leakage is astounding, and these two are poor liars.
yea anyone would just scream GERRY from the patio doors
The McCanns suddenly stopped going to the restaurant for breakfast on April 30th ,saying it was too far to take the twins. Yet they also said about the distance, it was just like having a meal in their back garden. Not forgetting, the bi-lingual Mr.Murat, hurriedly booked a flight to Portugal on the evening of April 30th, catching it 7am. next morning, giving no reason for the haste. He then worked later as interpreter for the creche staff. sheer coincidence ?
Yes but when I'm on holiday with my family I usually go half board and we look forward to our breakfasts! It's part of the holiday. It wasn't very far to the Millennium restaurant and everyone else was going so it does seem rather strange. Equally on the day of the disappearance everyone else was down near the beach.. Not the MacCanns though...
@@ruthx3346McScamm employee prowling again.
@@johngreenhalgh4428
Hi. Which reliable source/link can I view to hear all that (the details of how "present" the mccans were those couple of days prior to the situation?
Is there any reporting of the creche staff of how the mccans appeared to be in those prior days etcetera?
@@ruthx3346 Yes always many contradictions here (!) but according to Gerry's first statement 'As regards routines, he says that on Sunday they had breakfast between 07.30 and 08.30 at the OC Bar at a few metres distance from the apartment. During the following days, because of the fact that the bar was quite far away, they began to buy food at a supermarket situated in the same street as the apartment, he cannot remember the name of the supermarket and they would have breakfast in the apartment.'
With the trip to the sailing, there undoubtedly was one but Maddie was not actually named in person by the group leaders - it was just five or six children in a group - there was even doubt about the number. .
With the final creche entry Madeleine's name is strangely misspelt on the sign in sheet. The activity was supposed to be something like diving into a pool to extract an object off the bottom. Most of these supposed activities were totally inappropriate for the age group - they had been copied from the previous year's list for older children. There are many inconsistencies with the creche records.
Hm. Maybe Maddie died the night before...
Dogs have been able to smell cadaver 30 minutes after death according to published literature. Also just because there was blood indications, doesn't mean she wasn't accidentally over sedated. That could have been the very reason that she fell and hit her head causing her to bleed.
When are the McCanns going to be properly interviewed by British police separately?
Years ago the photos were discredited. They were supposed to be from the day she disappeared, except it was raining, not sunny as shown. Why did the father take a solo catamaran trip during the day before she was reported missing. Where did the large sports bag he flew out with vanish to ?
What mother would write about her daughters perfect genitalia? That in itself is a red flag. Why did she wash the child’s teddy, when it would have had child’s scent on it? Why did they automatically say, she has been taken, without searching for her around the holiday site? Why did the twins not wake up? Why did they again leave the twins alone when they went back to the table, after she had already found the child gone? Why did they refuse to answer any questions set by police, in lie detector, and write the questions they would answer? Why did the sniffer dogs who sniffed out the child’s blood, get ignored, especially when they sniffed her blood in the car boot they were using? They definitely did something to the child, probably overdosed her on sedation, as night before she had woken up, then the child awoke unsteady due to meds given her, fell banged her head hard and die. The parents if they had said their daughter was dead, would have known, due to unexplained death, post-mortem would have been done, and the sedatives would have been found in her blood. They knew they would have been arrested for man slaughter, both being doctors, knew that they would have been found guilty. So instead of doing that, they casually decided Maddie was not worth while them being sent to prison, just proves how much they cared for their beautiful little girl
So she wrote the book herself? There was no editor or publisher who said, that thing about Maddy’s genitalia is just too weird. Why was that left in? It was important to Kate why? There must be a psychological reason flor including that. What has the deception detective say about that? Would he say that was “leakage?” I love his analysis of all the water references!
@@victoriaalexander2488good point about the editor. I have thought about Kate’s comments a lot- the washing of the cuddle cat is key for me. There is no way any mother would wash the item with the strongest scent of their child- unless they needed to remove cadaver smell and such that could be swabbed and show signs of decomposition of a corpse. As a mom of 5 this is the most damning evidence of all.
I think this little girl died three days before.i thought that right from the start .I never saw her mother shed one tear.God bless you Madeline
Think logical,she was seen and there is a photo of her. She probably died before they went out to eat, the same day she disappeared .
@@mariabergendal1019 Well, Richard Hall made a fantastic documentary about that question: Buried by Mainstream Media: The True Story of Madeleine McCann, Part 6 - When Madeleine Died? There you have a complete and logical answer about "photos" of Madeleine McCann and "sightings" in period 30.04.-03.05.2007. Simply, there is not a single credible piece of evidence that Maddie was alive three days before she "dissapear" .
You are clearly unable to think logically!
There were NO credible sightings after the 28th of April.
The photos have been tampered with.
The creche records are falsified and forged.
There was no abandoning/neglect!
No sedating!
No fall from a sofa. No break in. No abduction.
All the evidence points to murder.
YOU need to think logically before talking nonsense.
Just read this episode on Patreon, and now listening x
This was fantastic! 💜
DISCREPENCY... all the way .... From All Directions .....Drowning with inconsistency .. ..If this had gone to trial the truth would have stood out a mile ALSO Parents and all concerned should have been taken to different rooms and thoroughly questioned as they not once showed expressive emmotions in all footages shown ......in media interviews in the begining in an indirect way the answers were NO Comment .... Still its sad !
Shoulda, woulda, coulda
Remind me how you'd question kids who can't talk 😂
@@keigreencap9192 can you re phrase im missing what you trying to say !
I completely understand and agree with you
I believe that David Payne is dodge
Would football explain why GMcC said on the transfer bus that he wasn’t on this holiday to enjoy himself. He seemed very bad tempered which was commented on by someone in the group.
I think he was upset they had to take the kids cos they were about to disrupt his holiday
This is the video I’ve been waiting for! Couldn’t figure out how they discovered the body and moved it while at the tapas restaurant. Looking forward to the next one. Your coverage of this case and Ramsey case has answered questions I’ve had for decades! Bravo and much thanks for the great insights.
I've been following this case so long that I've passed through certainty into uncertainty again. Teatime on the day was my theory for years. But I'm starting to like the night before theory. Like doing laundry, it's often a red flag of there are events of some kind around the timeline. In this case, hold heard crying, Gerry and Kate arguing, Kate sleeping in the children's room. In fact perhaps they had to acknowledge she'd slept in a bed in that room because forensics might have indicated as much. But perhaps she was spending the night with a head injured child, the severity of which had been vastly under estimated, and she'd not been taken to hospital. Imagine that - parental medical neglect by two doctors.
Kate looks devastated. J not. I've always felt he pressured her into something, but what whatever it was made her culpable so she can't talk.
Omgosh this made me feel a little ill I’ve never heard it put this way maybe if she had fallen outside and was discovered maybe she was still living and Kate cuddled her and they did what they could to save her themselves but couldn’t take her to hospital because they would have to explain how she would have fallen she could have passed away on Kate there was cadaver on her shirt, something in your comment really clicked with me makes me feel terribly sad
@@Songbirdstress He totally Dominant and she held back, and still she will hold back.........Gone too far to own up her face filled with sadness and frowning when he speaks when looking at him ... he has mentioned Kate screaching cries on her own in her space , he hasn.t Lied on that ! sad i am allround
Wow, that is a very possible scenario. It would fit the McCanns going on with their vacation plans, thinking Maddie was going to recover, but she didn’t. 😢💔
#celeste you never know...if drink had been taken, if they didn't see the accident happen themselves and basically under reacted until it was too late. It is possible.
The parents should be in jail for child neglect!!!if it was anyone else they would definitely be in jail
Two typical, self-aware parents neglect a toddler who, to everybody's surprise, goes missing. The only thing also missing is a sense of shame.
Kate McCann always looks ashamed and distraught. Gerry seems like a man very much in control.
@@sezthet1 I completely agree w/ you. She doesn’t look well.
@@sezthet1It's because the girl died in her presence. It's self-blaming
The brother in law said he'd purchased meat, shrimps and beef and that's what was found by the dogs in the hire car . Why would they do that if they ate at the restaurant?
The brother in law used a colloquialsm, he said 'we tossed the car mat', that means they threw it away, as in tossed it in the rubbish. I wonder if the hire car company charged them for the missing mat?
Most car boot mats are rubber back so it's questionable how the liquid would transfer to the car through the rubber.
Maybe the body was rolled up in the mat?
Good point about the FOOD GOING OFF IN THE BOOT and FRIDGE!
As you say, if they were having 3 meals a day OUT, then why buy food?
That was after they left the Ocean Club and moved into a rented villa. They bought and cooked their own food.
The UK government have denied a request from a scientist who has perfected a DNA system that would solve this crime/accident. They have denied access to the materials WHY!
THIS PROCESS COULD END THE SPECULATION PERMANENTLY??
Been waiting 4 u
Why would you try and discredit a detective trying his best to help you?
I still think Death occurred Sunday.
Sometime after the Pool Photo.
In all the recent discussions, no one seems to mention the "Lolita" photo.
Richard D Hall nailed it in his 4hr video.
I agree.
Lolita photo? What is that?
I think the night the lady upstairs said she heard crying fir over an hour something may have happened
Have the McCannes ever been charged or prosecuted for child abuse/neglect? Leaving your 3 small children alone in their holiday apartment, while the parents go out for a meal with friends Surely, that would be a bare minimum. Please let me know what you think. Thanks.
they have never even been interviewd by uk police , and sosial services were never involed , discrace
They did have a visit by UK social services when they returned to the UK. It's hard to say what was said as we only have Gerrys account of it, which is that the social worker saw what nice people they were and went away. The social care dept won't ever say, they're not legally allowed to break that confidence outside of other statutory organisations .
I find it hard to believe that social workers would do anything other than keep their jobs.
PJ files: "This legal type of crime is only fulfilled with intent, and this intent has to cover the creation of danger to the victim's life, as well as the absence of a capacity to defend herself, on the victim's behalf. In the case of the files and facing the elements that were collected it is evident that none of the arguidos Gerald or Kate acted with intent. The parents could not foresee that in the resort that they chose to spend a brief holiday, they could place the life of any of their children in danger, nor was that demanded from them: it was located in a peaceful area, where most of the residents are foreign citizens of the same nationality and without any known history of this type of criminality.
The parents didn't even represent the realisation of the fact, they trusted that everything would go well, as it had gone on the previous evenings, thus not equating, nor was it demanded from them, the possibility of the occurrence of an abduction of any of the children that were in their respective apartments.
Reinforcing what was said is also the fact that despite leaving their daughter alone with her siblings in the apartment during more or less dilated moments, it is certain that in any case they checked on them. Without any pretension or compensatory effect, we must also recognise that the parents already expiate a heavy penalty - the disappearance of Madeleine - due to their lack of caution in the surveillance and protection of their children."
I'm torn between two different scenarios. Either Maddy died earlier that week, and the parents had several days of covering it up.
Or, she died that last day, somewhere between Kate took her home from the creche in the afternoon, and *before* they went to dinner at the Tapas Club. That would give them at least a couple of hours to come up with something.
Because I believe she was already dead before they went to dinner, and that whole dinner thing with different people running off to check the kids is just a theatre.
Because, excelt for the parents, the nanny at the creche is the *last* person that saw Maddy alive.
The Australian lady thinks afternoon because they would have had a better story with more time.
Creche said they didn't see her.
I don't understand how Madeline could have died days earlier if she and the twins were at the creche together earlier that day.
@@Songbirdstress The Nanny at the Creche, I forgot her name, said she could witness in court she attended Maddy that day. I may be wrong, but that is what I remember from the PJ files.
Which day, what time did the creche nanny last see Madeline please?
@@janwhite6038 I believe it was Thursday, their last day? In the afternoon the day Maddy went missing. That's why I'm leaning towards she died after Kate brought her home from the creche, because I don't believe they could've bribed an unknown staff about the death of a child.
Great work!
Thanks for the visit
Wow never knew Madeline wasn't seen with her parents that day. I've listened to quite a lot of her coverage and this is the first time hearing that.
Nor was she seen the previous 6 days
I feel that the parents surely should have had a baby sitter there the whole time that they were out. What was the logic leaving them alone and checking every so often? Was it availability? If so one of them should have volunteered, or drawn straws? Something is rotten here, they were not short of money. We're not getting the truth, and by now, we probably never will. The thought of what the possibilities are, of what happened to Madeleine, are too horrendous to contemplate.
It's dreadful that any parents would leave their children alone, putting their own enjoyment above the care of children
Maybe something happened whilst the parents were there
They can definitely afford a babysitter...
This comment I have seen 1000+ times. It adds nothing to the investigation. Nothing in it is controversial;
@quantisedspace7047 why isn't child neglect controversial please? Such statements illustrate a common misunderstanding of parents who don't want to pay for childcare and don't want to take responsibility for the care of their children. This points to the mind set of the McCanns, and Tapas 7, who placed personal enjoyment over the need to ensure adequate care for their small children. The group were all doing the same sort of neglect, which is possibly why they endorsed the McCanns cover story, the Tapas 7 were just as bad as the McCanns and maybe their code of silence is a realisation that the loss of a child could have happened to any of them. Guilty behaviour.
After they left her alone, she didn't go to sleep. I think she was scared and abandoned a d made to stay in that room daddy's football was more important. I think she came out of the room looking for her mum and one of the group did something.its the parents fault.
Whatever happened its their fault
#2. Easy. Last photo of Maddie was the day after arriving on holiday - all other indications are she was no longer in crèche afterwards - records doctored etc. the whole story was planned for an event to kick it off as a distraction
There are analysed photos of Madeleine dated "Portugal at 17:15 on Wednesday May 2, 2007."
@sara_387 : I think she died shortly after that last photo, the evening before the McCann's claimed that Maddie was abducted from the apartment. She wasn't in the creche on 3rd May and nobody seems to remember seeing her.
@sara_387nonsense! All the photos have been discredited.
Anybody believing that that was Madeleine in the tennis ball photo must be very VERY gullible.
Great video thanks for sharing, have liked, must have missed this video when it first came out
Racheal oldfield said the last time she seen Madeleine. Was thursday morning at 10.30 when Madeleine played tennis .Which is strange because Madeleine according to the nanny cat baker was sitting on her lap at 10.30 crying regards being scared of sailing .Oh and jane said the last time she seen Madeleine was thursday afternoon Madeleine waved .Which is strange again because Jane was playing tennis with Racheal .So wouldnt Racheal see Madeleine and that would be the last time she seen her .
Uhhh, this gives me the a very bad feeling.. I believe that this is very close to cracking an important hole in the case 😮… together With some really good points in the comments too.
🙏🏼Madeleine rest in peace 🙏🏼
They have never been interviewed in the UK.
Richard D Hall did a deep dive. She died days eatlier
I believe, based on the evidence, that the time of death was between 6 and 7 pm on the 3rd. I think poor Maddie was dead behind the sofa and they didn't know until GM went back to the apartment at 9. I know KM and GM are stoic but I don't think KM
could have sat at the tapas restaurant at 8.30 pm behaving normally knowing her child had just died.
Spot on, cheers from dublin. Xx
Did the other parents run to see if their children were safe when Kate ran over to them?
Brilliant question. I don't think it has ever been asked.
Hi Victoria what a totally clever comment,, any parent would identify with your view no real panic ever discussed why?....
One of the best questions regarding this case.
Wow! I want to thank everyone who replied!
@@victoriaalexander2488 that question has really got me thinking about a few things now.thanks.
When a shutter is opened from inside, surely it makes a different sound to a shutter being forced open from outside. I had similar shutters in Spain, if they were opened from outside they had to be propped open with a piece of wood as once l let go, the shutter would drop closed again because the pulley-tape inside hadn't been engaged.
It didn't have to be 'forced' from the outside. GPM was surprised that it could be opened from the outside at all, let alone easily. Indeed, if true, there would have been no need for an intruder to jemmy them open. He made this preemptive declaration before realising how unnecessary it was. A Portugues burglar would have known that the shutters wouldn't need to be forced.
There were two drinking kids cup on the table when the accident occurred however there were three kids. Why was one cup missing? Apparently she was gone before the reporting time.
Could you explain where this idea comes from that cadaver odour takes 2h to form post-mortem ? I can't find any justification for this, other than stuff pointing back to this case.
Also, I am having a hard time believing that a DB left in some foliage for 2h or so, will still.yield cadaver scent THREE MONTHS later. If this were the case, we'd be surrounded by cadaver alerts almost everywhere we go !
About David Payne's visit. My understanding is that he was sent my GPM to assist bringing the children to wherever they were going. However, when he got to 5A, the place was all locked up, because KMH hadn't yet returned from her run. The children were presumably left inside, perhaps sedated. KMH eventually arrived in her running gear and managed to blow off David Payne by telling him she was going into the shower. This is origin of KMH claiming 30s, whilst Payne claimed 30 minutes.
He later said in his Rog that he couldn't remember what she was wearing but that she was wearing a towel. I think he was trying to distance himself from admitting that KMH was changing out of her running gear, having been out running leaving the children on their own. Likely Payne never saw the children at all at that time, as he didn't go fully into the apartment. He had to say '30 minutes' because that's consistent with the time he was gone from the tennis courts. He couldn't reveal that he'd had to wait 29'30" fot KMH to return, because that would mean admitting that he knew the children were unsupervised that afternoon.
I had forgotten that Gerry claimed to be there at the apt all the time; I can see now that this was to give the illusion of somebody supervisong the children, should it be revealed that KMH had left the children alone whilst out running.
According to expert police dog handler, Carren Corcoran, in the Mark Redwine trial cadaver odour can be detected by a dog after 20 minutes.
Completely agree with everything you’ve written here! Especially re; David’s Payne visit. I also believe Kate had been out running leaving the children asleep in the locked apt. Which suggests that the issue of neglect is far wider than just leaving them in the evenings. For these reasons no one wanted to reflect upon this, and Gerry falsely states he was also in the apartment then to cover all bases, when in fact he was playing tennis.
Plus, just to clarify re; development of cadaverine. You’re right, it doesn’t take two hours. In fact according to forensic science research papers it starts to develop immediately upon death, and is especially accelerated in small children due to low muscle mass.
I trained and raised cadaver dogs. When (time-wise) the dog can detect human decomposition depends on many factors: body location, cleaning products used - bleach etc., weather, wind, etc.
Just an amazing anecdote - we once had a dog find a body underwater over 6 feet under the surface.
Their little noses are amazing! 😊
They can pick up cadaver odor months or even years after a body was present in a location.
@@marygoff3332 It’s wonderful what you do, and very interesting information. Dogs are amazing little creatures….truly man’s best friend.
Where did the calpol/anaesthesia overdose thread come from? I remember reading/hearing this very early on in the investigation. Yet hearing and looking at all the available information (decades later) it seems like another red herring in Madeleine's case. Who can say as to the the twins, were they tested? I don't think there is anything that can confirm the latter.
Why was Jane Tanner fixated about "eggman" at that specific time? Remember the hotel staff said they never got up, they were loud and drank a lot. The manager also stated that Jane would not be able to to see "eggman" from where she stood and was on the wrong side of the street. The inconsistencies of alibis and explanations, too convenient. It's all about focussing elsewhere timewise and on another individual.
Great reporting. Thank you.
Guilty we all know it so why have they got away with this crime. Portuguese police were right all the time!!!!
Itll b interesting thanks nick !
Here is what happened:
The mcanns wanted something to sedate maddie as she was being loud at night and ruining their nights waking up. They didnt have what they needed or it wasnt working so they got something for Dr Oldfield (you have to have some incrimination for some of the others or it makes zero sense they play along later they have to be partly responsible) they were also drugging their kids with the same thing and didnt want to get found out.
Maddie cries climbs out the window while on these adult drugs that a post mortem would find and falls and dies.
The following day they invent a story with lots of tennis because Gerry carries her off very early that morning while dark in this bag.
He does not leave the bag for obvious reasons and brings that back. He puts it in the wardrobe.
Its only when it seems cadaver dogs will be coming that he has to get rid of this bag and he hires a car to take it away. The body didnt move 3 weeks later the bag did.
When they plan the pretend abduction the night after two of the couples were in on it.
Gerry goes back to the apartment to stage it it couldnt have been done earlier (window etc). He is so paranoid he spends a long time checking and double checking hence his testimoney he spent a long time at the toilet. Kate covers for him telling the group hes watching football busted in the reconstruction video
Kate goes back to do the finding and when she runs out and says "they've taken her" it has nothing to do with assuming its a group. Imagine how you would speak when planning it
"Thats when you come out and say they've taken her" they in that regard can be one person. After a few drinks and nervous about the whole thing she literally does what was discussed and comes out saying theyve taken her. Giving the game away
Kate goes for a run the next day she needs for her own mind to go near the place maddie was hidden both to close the issue and also be able to sleep at night confirmjng for herself she wont be found / area isnt or wont be checked.
Job done
Ps I don't think either of them get rid of the bag in the car it's one of the others they couldn't likely risk it they were in spotlight by then
Guilty pair
Thank you for clarifying the probable timeline. It really helps.
#nicksbooksareonamazon
Wait, I need more details… the dogs alerted by the gate… below a balcony? Was Madeline ever actually seen on this trip? If so, when was she absolutely seen?
"in the garden adjacent to apartment 5A, accessible from by way of the veranada and steps, the cadaver dog alerted in a garden-bed directly below the veranda."
I don't believe that there was a credible, reliable, provable sighting of her after April 28th. The day of arrival in P de L.
@@stevefowler3398 but the lady upstairs thought she heard her crying at night when the parents were out, right?
madeleine could have been dosed to make her sleep and got up drowsy and fell and struck her head. the behaviour of both parents at the time and afterwards is bizarre and not in keeping with the circumstances. they remain aloof and purposefully obstructive to anything that questions their narrative. they had a lot to lose if madeleines body was discovered and a post mortem examination was carried out and being doctors they knew this. so the body had to be disposed of.
If one believes she died much earlier in the week one has to discount the Smith sighting. And I find their account quite credible. 24 hours or less I think you could hang on and plan, with a body needing to be dealt with. But not 5 days. In a small apartment with 2 toddlers. And no good reason to do so. Psychologically and practically it's much less likely.
Do you think the sighting of the man walking with a child in his arms is true
@@christinecheeseman- if you mean the Smith sighting (family of 9) of a man carrying a child fitting the description of Gerry and Madeleine at 10pm that evening then yes.
The sighting is pure fiction. And distraction.
@@stevefowler3398 - why would a family of nine lie about this? What possible motive could they have? Their account/statements were checked out by both Portuguese and British police, both of whom believe the family to be genuine. Added to this they have receipts from the restaurant and pub they visited that night, just before the sighting.
Lastly Aoife Smith details in her statement the trousers she saw the man wearing carrying the child. And low and behold, Gerry had a pair with this specific detail on.
No 2 Madeline died some days earlier.
.....and was definitely stowed in the Bedroom cupboard at some point, & her scent detected by the dog/s. And G.McC owned a very large Blue Tennis Bag.
Thank you for the many anayses. The question I always have, based on the support the Mc Canns have from their fellow holidaymakers is beyond me. Why would they do that kind of thing and criminalize themselfs. Unless they are complicit perhaps and being in the situation to be blackmailed by the Mc Canns.
Great investigative work
Didnt Kate vanish form the Tapas bar for quite a while Tuesday night? Also,there was a flurry of phone calls from Kates phone at the same time. She died Tuesday night
I believe in the 2nd theory sometimes fact can be stranger than fiction. And being in that situation you wouldn’t want to be brash like you need to think things through you don’t want to get caught if that’s the decision your intending, planning what to do while also still trying to look after 2 toddlers, I think the true conspiracy is the tapas group conspiring together they behaved too strangely, and no one has confidently sighted Madeleine towards the end of the holiday David Payne did on the Sunday but it was so odd when you read PJ transcript he sounds very unsure as to what he is saying and committing to by saying it, there’s so much umms and ahhs in a way that is not natural I know it is not a natural situation but he can’t put a sentence together without really hesitating and choosing words carefully and he describes them as looking angelic, it’s way too flowery and to evoke the word angel makes me think he has prior knowledge of something, and the time he spent there how different their recollections of how long David Payne was there you can understand 5 mins difference but when your trying to be accurate for police record it’s pretty crazy to get it that far different and I don’t know if there was ever an explanation for that it’s like look at the tanner man! And the other non sighting during checks was a convenient listen at the door, if you walk all the way why not just sneak your head in takes an extra few seconds if I was checking on someone else’s children I wouldn’t feel very confident going back to the table and telling the other parents yeah your children are fine I didn’t actually look I just didn’t hear anything. And if I was the other parents I would be feeling terrorised like that could have been my child they seem to have a different reaction. And dealing with 2 year old twins and a dead body a few hours earlier and to have so much all sorted and done seems so hard to comprehend they must be so efficient to achieve what they did maybe adrenaline but seems like mission impossible in such a short amount of time and to get all the tapas members to be onboard with the same story there is so much to do and have all line up. And also the lead up to the Sunday they really struggled filling in time for the previous days of the holiday if it happened on Sunday why can’t they confidently say what they did each day of vacation they’re doctors they’ve studied and had to remember so much information seems like red flags not be completely accountable for the days leading up very strange I think that’s why the whole camera and photos played out the way it did because of dates that are embedded into digital photographs etc they had the camera there if it happened Sunday why couldn’t they share the camera and photos why was that so orchestrated imagine if that was a medical assignment they had to hand in like why were they so incompetent and made a straight forward task so complicated
Several valid points! Except for one. I don't believe that they are doctors (for very good reasons).
You probably also know that McCann is on the S. Offenders Register.
And as such, she would know about his ab using. Which makes her complicit.
I am shocked that that there were no cameras around the resort 😢
Cameras everywhere is a pretty new phenomenon.
I find the coming and going of all these families to each others appartments very odd.
Very hard to focus on the narrative when you keep referring to the Jon Benet case!! ?
With all due respect, the work of Richard Hall was pretty concise in reference to this question, and the lack of photos on a family on vacation rhymes perfectly with the actual death of the child days happening before. Also, they could not have convinced the friends nor had time to concoct any sort of an alibi/timeline if the death had truly occurred on same evening, May 3rd. The police would have caught them. They had days to chill out and plan; they got away with it just for that reason. Stress must have aged them 10 years in 10 short days. That tennis ball photo just does not look like her. This case needs an English person to break open why the UK gov't decided to support them in their lies That said, I wish you would take a trip to Perugia with a translator and collect evidence against those involved in the Kercher murder. I purchased all of your books on Amazon and between Guedé having been released from prison and trying for an interview with Mignini (why not?), also analyze the last parking garage video, other witness accounts that no one talks about, etc. Bring this case back out off the shelves and see who says what; McCann case is dead and JB Ramsey as well. When the McCann kids will start posting on RUclips, then people can speak their minds
Yup! Richard Hall nailed it in his many many videos
There are photos of Madeleine playing at the playground wearing the pink track suit taken in "Portugal at 17:15 on Wednesday May 2, 2007".
I can't take anyone seriously who's being taken to court by survivors of a terrorist atrocity that killed 22 people and injured over 1000 more, for trying to make money out of saying it didn't really happen. People who live there saw it happen and the aftermath.
He has been turned upside down by the BBC. His work on this subject is actually really good.
True, there's no need to reinvent the wheel. RH has thoroughly picked apart the alleged high tea event. Something had happened to Maddie prior to the afternoon of the 3rd.
of anyone notices something odd, please write details down just in case it is relevant. so many people come out of the woodwork months later and their version is not believed to be acurate (like my spelling) cannot do any harm to write details. also come forward quickly. The smith sighting was so much delayed for example.
I dont know the hour of her death, but I'm looking forward to hearing what you have to say in the next video.
The photo-fit of the man carrying the child is Gerry Mcann!
The balcony does not look safe, it looks like a sheer drop over the edge? Parents aren't always good at looking out for dangers with holiday accommodation.
Not these parents, they were interested in the creche, the sports facilities, the restaurant and being care free
Don't talk such utter shyte!
All parents see dangers. It is first nature to all of us!
The way they left the children alone is a paper tiger 😮...why would they wish for the public to question their parental abilities? What does that achieve for them? How old were the the twins?
18 months.
I think Madeleine's time of death was at least the day before she was reported missing, maybe days before. I don't know when she was last seen. The self reporting of the parents and their cronies isn't trustworthy. The woman talking about hearing a child crying for hours is the last outside source I know of with evidence Madeleine was alive, whenever that was. So she probably died shortly thereafter.
I think Madeleine's time of death was at least the day before she was reported missing, maybe days before. I don't know when she was last seen.>>>If you combine what you say in the first sentence with what you say in the second, how can you make an accurate assessment?
I'm considering the reliability of the source. The clique of doctors who neglect their children doesn't seem reliable. So I'm going with the lady bothered by the sound of a child crying for hours. She's got no dog in the race (no reason to lie)
I think she died at least the night before they claim she was abducted. Why? Because Kate claimed Madeleine had said "Where were you when we cried" or something to that effect. That story seems fabricated to give the idea that Madeleine was still alive when she was not. I believe she died when crying was heard by other people and the McCanns use this story to sell the idea she was alive after that time when in fact she probably died then.
I am leaning towards - after the crying incident that was described by Mrs F upstairs on the Tuesday night and into the early hours of the next morning being Weds 2nd. Bringing the comment re MM asking why no one came when they cried. As you say - to insinuate she was alive and to give reasoning to any statements re the crying incident the night before.
It seems a parent chose to ignore their crying child. In a quiet location, surely the parent would have recognised the cry of their own child.
Kate: Having arranged for Gerry to meet the children. Strange term of phrase. Makes it sound like they were with somebody else…
She is very clinical, cold natured IMO
Yes I agree with the overdose theory. I had heard that her mom, would always give Madeline something to help her sleep
I think no.2. scenario was most likely 🤷
Mother always took time to change her earrings and hairdo. Think i would be shaving my head and would be beating myself for leavjng kids alone for periods of time unsupervised.
Love this guy makes the best vids on true crime ❤ has the cutest and fluffiest type of dog going a miniature schnauzer he’s just the best ❤❤❤
One of the taps waiters testified that he saw Maddie near the tapas area about 16:45pm on the 3rd May.
Therefore the time period to concentrate on is 16:45pm to 10:00pm on 3rd May.
Have you seen the truth of the lie? Or read the book? Its printed in several different languages not available in English as mccanns took the ex detective from Portugal involved in the case at the start, they sued up outcome it wasnt allowed to be printed in English, Richard d hall made a three part documentary on the truth of the lie, also a man from South Africa did investigation on padesta grounds with the machinery to check there new drive way this case should be closed they shouldn't be protected they shoould be in jail..
Did you know there is a second book by the detective?
@@jenkitching43 ........No! do you know its Title please?
@@elizabethsheffield6609 Hi Elizabeth. Book title is 'Maddie: Enough of the lies' by Goncalo Amaral. I am sure you will be interested to know that a lady called Catalina Lupsa is reading out loud the English translation on her YT channel. I hope you find it. If you have difficulty, let me know, and I will post link.
@@jenkitching43 .......many thanks Jen for the info.. I'm very interested in reading/hearing Mr Amarel's latest book. He has been extremely poorly treated x
@@elizabethsheffield6609 Hi again Elizabeth. Make sure you check out her 'investigation videos'; quite a lot of interesting stuff on the McCann case there. I agree Mr Amaral was badly treated. I don't think he would have stood a chance against the British government and corporate media machine combined which are totally corrupt.
The choice of apartment and the way they left the children looks like a stage for their production this is on par with the post office cover up ,will they give back their Oscar’s for the worst acting and lying in history
5 ladies in their group but 4 ladies minus kate only went to the beach on Thursday .So why were there 5 ladies photographed in the holiday photo list at the beach on Thursday. Diane Webster said she never met anyone at the beach Thursday afternoon .Other than her daughter Fiona Jane and Racheal plus herself obviously. This makes 4 ladies in total yet Diane is photographed standing next to guess what a fifth lady .I assume David Payne her brother in law took the photo .So why would he take a photograph of some random stranger standing next to his mum in law .The point being is who was this lady and was she as she must have been known to the group .For David Payne to photograph her so why was that lady there.If Kate wasn't there then who was that fifth lady important enough for David Payne to take a photo of her standing next to his mum in law .Who said she never met anyone at the beach apart from the group members
this case stunk from the getgo.why on earth not put a tenager to watch the kids and go and check regularly on the babysitter and kids instead? I am a former nanny,and even a nanny would in the start not being allowed to leave the house with the kids the first week during work hours. This is security. None of the parents of the kids I nannied,nor my own kids has ever been left alone or unattended when sleeping ,playing or at any hour. its totally unnatural and lack of instinct to do that. kids walks off,kids gets hurt,kids can get sick, the list is miles long!and those are doctors!!! one of the families I nanied for were doctors.theres no way in hell they would leave their daughter (3 years toddler) alone . I was to tend that child every hour when they were occupied with the smallest little thing. and that was inside the house and outside when we had outings down in Madrid watching horses or birdhuntings. what in the world is this?.let me tell you! they wouldnt be able to claim her being taken if they had a babysitter,cause she would know if maddie was there or not,alive or dead. No need to be psychic or a mother to understand that! This stinks alibi in the making
Whem they removed the fridge? How that wasnt suspicious! They were guests there! If fridge didnt work its hotel job to fix that or change the fridge! So they rented the car and brought the fridge into the car! Where is that fridge or the car?
I also have a theory there may be a sex thing going on, and that's why all the witness statement differs.
On the Thursday afternoon, Kate went home to have a shower. At the same time, one of their male friends had some errands at the McCanns apartment. She said he stayed for five minutes, he said he stayed for half an hour.
Now, say that the swingers rumours are true, and they had some sort of sex arrangement between them, it's possible Kate and her male friend may have had sex at that moment, and Maddy could've died by accident, because they weren't looking after her.
Now, I'm not judging people, certainly not in sex matters. But if this was true, that would count for all the differing statements, and why all involved would lie about it, and why they covered up Maddy's death, because they didn't want to admit what really happened.
The idea that KMH was sh@gging Payne has come up before. It's a possibility, particularly given the water/shower references and Payne being reluctant to say that KMH was dressed only in a towel.
One possibility is that MBM woke and caught them /in fragrante/ and wouldn't shut up about it, and that Payne fatally thumped her as a result. I don't agree with this model, but it's come up before and it does have some merit 16:15
What if he wasn't having sex with Kate but with M
@@Sandi-zh2wx Well, I don't believe that. I think this was more of a grown-up thing.
What were the parents motive to hide the death of their child? When the parents were suspected every fact that came up could and was implemented into that theory.
They'd have been disgrace as doctors, there other children would have been removed from the parents. They'd have probably lost their jobs and friends would disconnect
1. Child neglect resulting in her death. They'd have been prosecuted, risked their other children being taken away, loss of professional and personal reputations - these are people with a very strong sense of self-preservation, and they escaped being charged with child neglect on the basis she'd been abducted and thus compassionate grounds. 2. If they were drugging her and/or she'd been subjected to sexual abuse, those would have shown up in an autopsy, with bad repercussions for them.
@user-cx4sq8dj3j if sexual abuse was evident, it would add to your theory
......the "state/condition/any violation" that had occurred to the body perhaps?
@@elizabethsheffield6609 yes. If for example she suffered a fall behind the sofa and suffered some injury that wouldn't have caused her to die if she was found earlier than, say, 30 mins is another possibility
❤
i wonder if we will still be talking about this case in another 20 or 40 years?
what about all the other missing children? .. can we not speak about their plights? 💣💣
The woman in the apartment above them heard Maddy shouting NO DADDY the night before = Why is this never mentioned ?
Father looks like a pretty bad tempered man to me
It wasn't " no daddy" it was
" daddy, daddy"
I always thought the parents were innocent because I thought how would they move the body and hide it when police and people were there? If Madeline died before they could have planned how to move her body. Could she have been stored at one of the other friends apartments? The friends accommodation was not searched was it? It was investigated as an abduction, not a possible murder. Also what were all of them doing all day or the previous days? Someone would have to look for a place to move the body to. It's not easy in an unfamiliar place to hide a body. The idea of parents dumping a body also just didn't make sense to me, but that was because I was seeing it from my point of view that I'd rather get into trouble and face the police than throw my child away. The idea of parents driving their child's body somewhere and dumping her possibly down a well, that just seems the worst to me, but then putting your child's body in a freezer is just as horrible. They all had to be in the story to plan it. None of their behaviour is what you would expect from worried parents. It's behaviour of parents who are not worried because they know what happened to their child. If you really thought your child was abducted parents would be going mostly crazy with anxiety about what could be happening to her. Most parents would not be able to function properly. You would not be able to do anything other than look for your child. Not knowing would drive you crazy. Knowing would be processing sadness and grief but also if covering up a death, they would be given a purpose like a reason. I think they would rationalise it as we have to do this for the other two. It's too late now. We can't lose everything. Then their behaviour makes sense. If you look at their behaviour it makes no sense if their child is missing, but it makes perfect sense if they already know what happened.
💯 agree. Their behaviour shows they have processed losing mm
They put maddie in the ocean ... Not the club one ...
I think that is exactly why they went running and/or played tennis, and leftcthe twins in the creche.
HE had to get HER to focus.
Had to get HER mind off of HER terrible deed.
She was going to crack. HE took control.
And that is why HE still controls all the interviews.
HE draws attention towards HIMSELF, and away from HER.
I want to know on which side of the bed did Gerry sleep? and the picture of the bedroom you are using in this vid is mirrored or original?
Rumor has it Gerry was sleeping on the sofa side of the bed ...😅😅😅
Did she fall from the balcony .
i thought they had sold her for body parts, when this farce first broke. i was inclined to accedent for a while, but this brings me straight back to body parts
Please do a synopsis of the facts of the case, one sentence for each thing that don't add up. Such that one could explain to one's friends in a few minutes.
how was cadaver blood on ground bushes below balcony , did she fall over balcony, ? drousy,
how was blood behind sofa ?
trying to work out order
of both these happening and why ?
did she try to climb out window and fall behind sofa, drousy
then try to climb up on balcony to see where everyone was ?
falling over it ,down into bushes under balcony
died ?
If she died about six pm why hide it, if it was accidental I cannot understand covering it up. As some think she was sedated and left alone this would be a reason for covering it up
I can't think of any male family friend who would be so focused on a little girl. Never seen it.
Seems something happened when Gerry left for tennis lesson booked at 6pm. Would be interesting to know how kate contacted him there. Pager? Phone?..
Maybe he walked in and caught Kate with his colleague? Maddie might have been injured if there was a scuffle. This would implicate not just the McCanns but another member of the group.
Pagers are not and were not a thing in Europe, unlike the USA.
It appears that telephoning would be impractical if GPM were tennising.
It appears that the only means of communication was using Payne as a message boy.
@@quantisedspace7047 .....Pagers have been used in the UK for decades, especially Doctors.
Nonsense! Pagers were very much in use.😅
What I'm having such difficulty with is to determine if the McCanns are guilty of killing her or are they afraid of appearing negligent. I mean has someone gone in there and hurt her and they have found her and are top afraid to report this. I feel they are involved but to what extent. She was a very pretty girl so it could be possible someone was watching. But what about the hotel staff. I think it happened when she was heard crying out for her daddy. Or is the mother that psychopathic like my mother was she wanted rid of her because she could not control her and Kate did not like Jerry's closeness to her. I have an idea somebody might have been doing cpr on her hence the blood. And if she was killed and they wanted it to look like an accident it was probably by suffocation with a pillow. My mother did this to me. But we are talking about a real psychopath. If I spent a few days with Kate I would be able to tell. But an intelligent psychopath who is in control is nigh on impossible to tell. The way Kate has to always control the narrative is a sign to me. Could it be that Kate has foolled her husband and all her friends. Notice she never looks happy and her placing of hands on Jerry all signs of control. And giving up her job. So I now think if it was not a freak case like Lindy Chamberlain and if Kate is a psychopath I think she died from suffocation and the mother has deemed it an accident and has covered it up by doing cpr. Because of my mother and my spending my life as her scapegoat I'm fascinated by this case. Also the fact she slept in a single bed because she was upset with Jerry all adds to my suspicion. And unless you have had personal experience of a psychopath nobody would imagine what they get up to. Because they can literally kill somebody and stay totally calm. I would love to know about Kate's childhood??? And her relationship with her mother and father.
I agree! I also believe that K.McCann murdered Madeleine.
Just compare HER persona to say Ian Huntley. He too was blasé about his involvement in the Soham murders.