I'm glad we both agree on Chrico's origins. I felt the revelation that he is a space demi-god cheapened his past achievements a bit. I prefer the idea that he is a human that has had his body and soul hardened by war, and it has made him the most skilled killer alive. I remember reading somewhere that Takahashi and the crew got in heated arguments on whether that should be the ending or not.
Seriously all it could take to fix it is just take out overman and tone down some really BS moments in the OVAs. That machinegun exploding in gregor's hands is still bullshit.
I actually wrote an alternate ending where he isn’t a super solider by birth, but is forced into becoming one as part of a Faustian bargain. I basically replaced Wiseman with Colonel Pailsen from the OVAs.
He being a super soldier is ok for me, since that plot twist was kind of nice, but being a demi-god was beyond bullshit, also I didn't like the Wiseman arc, but he was practically an AI, which doesn't matter that much, the thing for me is that they had way more potential if he somehow join renegades from both Gigalmesh and Balarant to overthrow both, since most of the stories and OVAs are about people betrayed by both with their conspiracies, would be way more interesting if he and Fyanna decided to fight against both parties with other people, like a rebel Alliance stuff, rather than the religion and Wiseman stuff.
@@TheAlmightyLoli Ah, I getcha. One workaround I've found is to use the SRW versions of tracks like that. They don't get flagged. At least they haven't for me yet.
I payed a lot of money to get the single discs, mostly the UK ones, it's one of those shows that didn't get a release here in Germany. To be fair, in the 90s Anime still wasn't a big thing here. Good show, ending (story-wise) could be better. About VOTOMS, this too never was released here, or the UK, I probably will never watch this, but I do hope this might get a better, wider release, including english dub, like MACROSS. Maybe they reboot it, like LEGEND OF THE GALACTIC HEROES...
I love the 80s/early 90s anime. I don't know if a lot of the kids today know what they are missing, I was showing my nephew some older ones and he couldn't believe how gory they were.
Yeah, a friend of mine refuses to watch pre-2000s Anime because he does not like "old" animation. And it makes me so angry, because some of the best Anime are from the 80s and 90s.
I'm pretty sure that sentiment was held long before anitubers in general became a thing. Like, I remember it being bandied around damn near 20 years ago, before 4chins (and later /m/) was conceived.
weird that people would call Mecha light hearted. Most of Gundam is pretty grim. 0080 is one of the most depressing anime ive seen. Great work, Loli. Ive been meaning to watch more of this.
I also like how you can definitely also see the parallels and splits that would become Western Mecha born through Eastern mecha. Tho personally I much prefer Battletech over Gundam and such but that’s just me.
The most "light hearted" mecha I've watched is Patlabor on Television and even then it knew when to get serious, with characters expressing grief at the death of someone who died long ago in some episodes.
It’s incredible how, despite being just as influenced by Ultraman as it is by mecha, Evangelion is only ever called a deconstruction by most casual fans. I fully believe that if people who liked Eva watched other older series like VOTOMS, Gundam, or hell even Anno’s previous project Gunbuster, there would be so many more mecha fans. I’m tired of the idea that Eva is unique for focusing on the characters or that mecha is a dying genre.
I think it’s more a deconstruction of anime as a whole. Eva is really good. Not Gundam good, but mecha fans seem to overhate Eva because of how anime fans see it as an intelligent mecha
I wish there was more Mech material like this. Specifically, Mechs that aren't completely ridiculous looking. I love the subtly, for lack of better word, of this anime's mechs. Along with Titanfall & Obsolete.
Then you will like Eighty six 86 , the mechs aren't even humanoid , they are quadrupedal and "spider-like" , oh and they also have a big cannon along with some machine guns
Speaking of Votoms references, (I'm about half way through this show and it's living up to its reputation so far) pretty sure that the big robots from Sega's Space Harrier are visually based on the Veela mechs. I know that nobody gives a shit, but I think it's kinda neat!
Blue Gender is great especially love the space station orgy scene damn that was confusing as a kid Also find it funny when talking about EVA you use the scene where Shinji spills his "tapioca" on Asuka in the hospital truly you are cultured
I've enjoyed this anime so much when I was a teenager, and especially the opening hits so hard. This really is an underated anime and urge people who love grim dark to watch this anime.
Fun fact since the last stream was Super Robot Wars, in the newest game Super robot wars 30 Chirico not only comes back as dlc but he gets a new original designed by the creator Scopedog for that game. So yeah I can believe the series does have some on going love for it.
I love using Chirico in 30, he is one of those characters I can just drive into the middle of an enemy formation relying on insane evasion and brute fire power of the upgunned scopedog to wreck *everything* to a sometimes ridiculous degree.
If there is an anime that deserves a full-blown proper Space Battleship Yamato 2199 treatment it's sure as hell VOTOMS. I watched it years ago and it's still one of my favorite mecha anime series along with FLAG. I wouldn't call it Battletech per se - since there is Fang of the sun Dougram, which is Battletech before Battletech, funny enough, made by same Ryousuke Takahashi. When it comes to Chirico twist, I still consider that TV at least made it look fitting, but yeah, OVAs are tapping way too far into "Space Jesus" theme for my liking. At least TV series and Armor Hunter Mellowlink are lit as hell and I love both of them for being as gritty and dark as they could make it back in 1982/1988. What I absolutely adore is the fact that VOTOMS actually doesn't overuse stock animation all that much. It is there, but it's not at the level of Macross 7 or Gundam Seed Destiny (where I shit you not, I started hating those stock animations by the end of each show. As well as music. Planet Dance is awesome song, but you can sing it so many times before it stops being fun and becomes annoying) . Shit like that doesn't fly here. And at least, when stock animation is used, it feels more as artistic decision rather than "We don't have enough money, so here's your basic animation loop #427, enjoy it, jackass!" Or it's use is subtle enough that it doesn't burn in your eyes. I also love the fact that VOTOMS actually doesn't afraid to change settings - from Cyberpunk to Vietnam-like jungle to Space to Wasteland to Desert and even if two last ones are similar, Sansa is as different from Quent as two desert wasteland could be. Imagine that! Wait, two desert planets that don't look like one is a copycat of another? Yeah, call me surprised!
Prime example of real robot genre. The trope for the low tech is "Used Future" where almost everything is old or salvaged. The ATs themselves could be cannibalized to fix other damaged ATs. Also the low tech-ness indicates that these machines are mass produced and cheap. It's Sherman but mecha.
Was looking for this comment, its the main plot point right from beginning that i remember from 10-15yrs ago when i saw it only once. He was initially member of some team made of guys deemed to be super lucky too much for random odds, even if incompetent for example, if i remember correctly.
That is evidently the key thing to being an Overman, you are almost impossible to kill because reality warps itself SLIGHTLY to keep you alive, you can get shot to shit but things will happen in such a way that you will not die.
Armored Trooper VOTOMS (and to a lesser extent, Mobile Suit Gundam) could be said to be the start of a sub-genre of sci-fi in which the technological aspects of the story are grounded in hard science as a contrast to their being some mystical core to the human element, be it New Types, Overmen or the Gasara from Gasaraki. I have to wonder if anyone has named this kind of science fantasy yet.
I always liked the mecha in Votoms over Gundam for how realistic the mechs were as well as the battles. PLUS it was WAY easier to built them out of legos when I was younger!
In short VOTOMS is a story about modded out T34s on legs fighting in wars, but we have to suffer through the boring parts where a guy with a maxed out luck stat is just too lucky to die. Armorhunter was fun to watch, as it rethreads the locations from the VOTOMS anime. It, and other prequels, show there is a lot of potential in the war prequels to the show, if you dont focus on the lucky protagonist and just put normal people into normal war combat situations.
3:40 DUDE you gotta be fucking kidding me (pls read with postal dude voice) whoever said that had just watched evangelion and non other mechs before. Because even the monster of the week super mecha of the early had some psychology thrown in. Yeesus this Eva fans man
I read the 'overman' slightly differently to you. Not so much a 'god' but the ultimate expression of the best of the best of humanity. More like Khan in Star Trek. Either through genetic mutation or expression of a genotype that comes about purely from the number of people alive in the Astragus galaxy. Anyway, thanks for the content.
The only reason I know about this show is thanks to super robot wars. Chirico is a BEAST in the games and he's always on the frontlines when I use him.
@@thesaltyweeb neh. I've known about the series since my college days back in 04, but I only somewhat recently found out that I could buy the games with the English translation. So, the only ones I have are Z, X, T and 30. Also moon dwellers, but the transition is horrid. So, kinda avoid playing that one for now.
Hmm and interesting universe. Would love too see you try and dissect the universe that is Battletech and see your opinions on the history, tech and stories that it rolls out.
I have a few disagreements, but they're mostly technical details or hardcore nerding out points. (SPOILER TALK) 1) Chirico isn't exactly a Perfect Soldier. He is thought out as one due to the understanding of the faction who's developing artificial Perfect Soldiers. Chirico is a bit more like an evolutional anomaly, natural occurence of a transhuman, a 1 in a quintillion. Pailsen Files was entirely to explore his anomaly and not classified as a perfect soldier, but the "ultimate survivor". 2) The "Magic" in the show is mostly absurdly high tech that was abandoned or forgotten on purpose by it's creators. It's more like the saying "Technology that is sufficiently advanced equates to magic" in the point that whoever can't understand the unknown can only register it as the magical. I only really concede with the one guy in the final arc that is "so spiritual" he becomes psychic, though he's a Quent and that gives some leeway. 3) While in the ending he is revealed to be groomed into becoming God... In this setting, God is a machine, a machine created by Quents who were extremely high-tech (star trek level that were one step before surpassing it) until they abandoned all tech for it was corrupting them, such that all out war regressed some technology. The point of the big AI thing in the end was to merge it's contience and knowledge with Chirico who cannot be killed. It's more of a literal and straight play on "Deus Ex Machina" and very much a cyberpunk trope of transhumanism and man-machine interfacing. Also, it's not an God in the sense of ultimate powers God, but an all-knowing God that influenced everything. A very technologically limited God. 4) The "Overman" is a play on the concept from nietche and also a common narrative element in transhumanism in scifi. Chirico is special as he manifests traits from "Overman" since his entire hometown that were also descendants of "Overman" were slaughtered easilly and only HE survived. The mystery of this ONE guy manifesting some sort of paranormal ability to survive to the point of even warping reality in some instances is actually a play explained in my next point. 5) Chirico's anomaly is simply "Deus Ex Machina" or "Plot Armor", but actually well written. He is the personification of the narrative trope and the show actually acknowledges it and plays it straight to a fault. People who suspected and attempted to figure out how and WHY this is a thing with Chirico, always ended up in it being their doom, driving them insane or causing people to recognize Chirico as a "force of nature". It's as if a mook actually starts questioning and studying why he just cannot kill the main character and in his attempt to understand, it drives him insane because he cannot. Votoms writing is smart and good because it dances on the edge of really dangerous narrative trappings. I might be a wrong on the 5th point cuz it's 100% my own assumption as a creative, I'd be a lot mroe sure about it if I actually knew japanese to read the interviews, show bibles, artbooks, behind the scenes documents and magazine articles that probably explained all of it (or left some stuff up to interpretation on purpose). However there's a lot to read into because I really hold Votom's writing, influences and concepts at a very high regard. The people involved in the shows have to treat it with such care not to mess with certain foundations about it because there's an intense set of rules and lore that really goes beyond the age of this show. It's trully transcendent and I keep trying to get my friends to watch it and try to properly digest the early 80's aesthetics that still have a lot of 70's japanese aesthettics to it (such as the starship designs). PS: I really wish you had also included Front Mission into the things Votoms inspired directly. Great video regardless.
Bro, Battletech anime is "Fang of the sun Dougram". You should really check it out. Battletech took a bunch of designs from there (Shadowhawk, Griffin, Thunderbolt, etc) and the battles have a very similar heavy pacing. Plot could very well take place in the periphery before the clans arrived
The whole series can be a little uneven, but it's one of my favorite anime franchises of all time. I didn't like the twist in the original anime either and I think it is an albatross around the neck of the franchise but in spite of that it explores themes of war, humanity and what it takes to survive desperate scenarios. Theres nothing else quite like VOTOMS in anime or more specifically mechan anime. I love the Kumman arc btw it's the best. I hope one day more OVAs and anime are produced. Chirico is a really great character and the supporting cast is great. I think modern anime scene needs a breath of fresh air like this to influence it.
8:25 *Übermensch* (it's not a "god"), read Nietzsche. It's the concept of "Beyond-Man," like the next major evolutionary step (but not as metaphysical as NewTypes).
Kind of amazed at how little the Nietzchean concepts aren't picked up in analysis on Votoms. Chirico is the Overman born of war, literally overcoming and killing god to bring forth a new order. There's Spenglerian themes of civilizational decline throughout and man's relationship with both technology and religion...someone at the studio making Votoms had been exposed to more than a little modern Western philosophy.
@@RingworldTyrantthe "classics" haven't/ aren't being taught in western schools (even when I was in school they had already started to "axe" them from the curriculum; luckily my father was an english and science teacher who instilled in me an appreciation of learning)... education and culture "weren't/aren't cool," (just look at the engagement with our comments for context vs other "surface level" observations)... it's a shame. 🤔😅👍 It's ironic that so much Manga and Anime has a basis in "higher concepts," but the majority of english speaking fans have little to no awareness of what they've truly been presented with. Now the responsibility to "learn and better yourself" lies solely with the individual (mainstream culture isn't going to push you to enlighten yourself).
There's a question raised about Wiseman, and it's asked if a god is really just a Being who is more advanced than others. Plus, Chirico's destiny is comparable to Dune's Paul Atredies. However, Chirico takes a different approach than Atredies, as he is able to escape his predetermined path, make it his own and ultimately reclaim his individuality by series' end. Also, another point raised by the ending of the regular series, even if Wiseman is dead and his Secret Society's main branch is mostly disbanded and the rest crippled and scattered, there is still the chance that Gilgamesh Confederation and the Ballerant Union will go to war, with the remnant of the Secret Society arming both sides of the war. Also, you can't ignore Shining Heresy, because it ties directly into the OVAs. Not to mention that Shining Heresy elaborates on the religious and cultural aspects of the VOTOMS universe.
Just picked the complete collection a couple weeks ago after watching some snippets of this and this review has me even more hyped to blast through it.
Speaking of old school mech anime that remind you of Battletech, you should check out Dougram! It's got no weird space magic and instead has dirty politics. Very Battletech. Also features a lot of the early Battletech mechs that aren't from Macross. whole series is being fan-remastered here on RUclips
"Once it was revealed that he is a demi-god, he no longer seemed special." I think it is important to understand why so many people relate to such sentiments. I think it has something to do with the inability to recognize that if someone performs godlike deeds, then he MUST be a god.
I love Votoms. It's just a gritty world and the gear is like communist mass production. Armorhunter Mellowlink is also a good one. It amazes me why there is no open world MMO RPG game for Votoms. It has so much potential.
I barely remember watching this, but I liked the weird hebrews in the desert vibe with that guys culture And the Adam in the garden thing who is so delighted until he gets bitten but the bug and basically becomes Caine immediately at that first experience of pain and suffering
I only watched the anime and I understood it as Chiriko being a regular human most of the time, but he has a gene given through evolution that let him become more and more super human. I never got that he was supposed to a ps. He was only ever mistaken as one or compared to. So he started as a regular human, but evolved when ever necessary to survive, meaning whenever he was beaten he grew in abillity
The plot twist about Chirico being an Overman was really strange in that it was hinted at but also doesn't fit at all. Chirico was a good pilot and soldier... but not when compared to PSs. He constantly lost to them until suddenly he was their match.
I wonder if Rogue Trooper from 2000ad was the inspiration for Chirico Cuvie in Votoms? Both of them are genetic infantryman who can withstand damage in the battlefield that your average human soldier can't. . And Chirico also has blue hair which could be a nod to Rogue Trooper who has blue skin.
Most claims about Evangelion being deconstructive or even subversive tend to be more telling of the person's lack of experience with the genre pre-Eva than anything Evangelion genuinely does uniquely
Wow, I thought I understood where Battletech came from with Gundam but this is escentially Battletech, but even more grim. I can totally Imagine someone wanting to make a Tabletop Game of this and ending up with Battletech.
I dont remember what the name of it was, but what got me hooked into Mecha was the "Glitter boys". Fully enclosed power suits, bristling with weapns that could entrench themselves to use cannons, and were never painted so they could shine in the sun.(was not anime but like d&d-esque)
I would like Votoms get new anime reboot, i really don't care if the mechs are CGI as long as it's not Gmod physics tier. I also want Votoms game as mech 3rd person shooter and that would be great.
great review man! also happy to see an anime youtuber comment on the misconceptions people have on the mecha genre and the bizarre takes that eva fans have, i dont see it enough honestly.
*CONTAINS THE SPOILER* I'm not turned off out of watching the series just because the dude's a super soldier, although I'm a bigger fan of stories about regular joe action men. So it's a star wars kind of deal for me: *watch for the military stuff* .
Ah Takehashi mecha anime, man that made entire niche mecha genre for himself, most grounded, most realistic, most autentic and thrilling mecha battles UNTIL magical shit starts happening. Vottoms, Gasaraki and to some extent Blue Gender.
If you want "BattleTech: The Anime" you watch _Fang of the Sun Dougram_ because that's where most of the Mech designs came from- not _Macross_ and certainly not _Crusher Joe_ Even that's pushing it. The _BattleTech_ gameplay paradigm is based on pre-Dreadnought naval combat of the late 19th/early 20th (i.e. pre-WW1) era, and that describes almost no Real Robot properties in anime or manga. _Heavy Object_ is a rare exception. You want to know what _VOTOMS'_ real-life counterpart is? Technicals. Yes, I mean civilian trucks with anti-material weapons or heavy machineguns mounted in the beds; cheap, easy to produce, easy to train (so you can shove fodder into them quickly), and are little more than death traps against anything resembling anti-vehicle firepower (like, say, a surplus M60 machinegun or an anti-material rifle like a Barrett). Good video overall, just a bit lacking in the references.
Seriously , it’s a shame VOTOMS delved into the Gundam tropes as it went on. I have never been a fan of the “supermen are better soilders” trope in mecha. If anything it should have been more like Mellowlink. That being said plus points for the series sticking to the Superman trope. The Roots of Ambition OVA is perhaps the best mecha media I have ever seen, and it really plays up that trope.
Armored Troopers VOTOMS it's very cool. I still to watch the OVAs, but I will keep in mind what you said. Agreed with the demi-god argument. Sometimes these stories become convoluted for apparent zero reason. Still, it's a great show overall! Learn much here, recommend too!
Heavy Gear that is basically just VOTOMs with, weirdly enough, more anime injected in, is also a fantastic game in its own. The 2nd edition rulebook works both as a wargame and as a light RPG, it has that old feel that you only get by reading 1st edition warhammer manuals, with your units being more your dudes than your army. I have been using it to run mecha games in my own setting for years and i highly reccomend it (and other dreampod9 prdoucts) if you want a light rpg with wonky ass damage rules for semi realistic mecha campaigns. Also, Patlabor is absolutely Kino and a feast for the eyes, the movies in particular, watch Patlabor.
The creators of Heavy Gear, Dream Pod 9, are also cool with people playing it on Tabletop Simulator and with also 3d printing. They even give STLs on their community page for some units.
now with "Requiem for vengance" I wish even more that we got a VOTOMS series in that style, hell, every year they keep releasing new model kits and figures, this year alone we'll get a Hi-metal R 20,000 yen figure, a Threezero robodou one, two bandai HG kits and all of the Wave and kotobukiya model kits, the same as Dunbine, just give them a remaster or remake already! they keep earning money from them, they should at least make a remake to bring new people
If you wanted a Battletech anime there is Fang of the Sun Dougram. Which is where Battle tech got the rest fo the Unseen from and its obsession with heat.
ATs are tanks but they are more like something along the line of Centauro and M1128, good gun with armor thats just barely enough to stop average infantry weapons like ar or smg.
I'm glad we both agree on Chrico's origins. I felt the revelation that he is a space demi-god cheapened his past achievements a bit. I prefer the idea that he is a human that has had his body and soul hardened by war, and it has made him the most skilled killer alive. I remember reading somewhere that Takahashi and the crew got in heated arguments on whether that should be the ending or not.
Indeed
Seriously all it could take to fix it is just take out overman and tone down some really BS moments in the OVAs. That machinegun exploding in gregor's hands is still bullshit.
I actually wrote an alternate ending where he isn’t a super solider by birth, but is forced into becoming one as part of a Faustian bargain. I basically replaced Wiseman with Colonel Pailsen from the OVAs.
He being a super soldier is ok for me, since that plot twist was kind of nice, but being a demi-god was beyond bullshit, also I didn't like the Wiseman arc, but he was practically an AI, which doesn't matter that much, the thing for me is that they had way more potential if he somehow join renegades from both Gigalmesh and Balarant to overthrow both, since most of the stories and OVAs are about people betrayed by both with their conspiracies, would be way more interesting if he and Fyanna decided to fight against both parties with other people, like a rebel Alliance stuff, rather than the religion and Wiseman stuff.
They could've probably fix it if it was like him more having the potential to become god as an overman
At worse keeping his regen
Big robot big war crimes
Almost everyone in Battletech: “what no, we don’t do that” ^burns down an orphanage^
House Kurita: “Yes!”
@@reecedignan8365 KONICHIWA KURITA CREEPS
It's not a war crime if there's no evidence.
As long as I kill anyone who sees me commit a war crime, then I will never commit any war crime because no one know i did it.
@@reecedignan8365
Taurians with nuclear hippity hoppity - get off my property
The mecha genre is the elder statesmen of anime. It's good to see you give it some attention.
I'm actually surprised that you didn't find a way to sneak in Honoo no Sadame. VOTOMS' OP is probably one of the greatest in history.
Copyright's been a cruel mistress lately. Trying not to take too many risks in fear of Susan getting pissed.
@@TheAlmightyLoli Ah, I getcha. One workaround I've found is to use the SRW versions of tracks like that. They don't get flagged. At least they haven't for me yet.
Very happy that someone remembered blue gender, it was one of many anime’s that traumatize me when i was a kid.😺
I payed a lot of money to get the single discs, mostly the UK ones, it's one of those shows that didn't get a release here in Germany.
To be fair, in the 90s Anime still wasn't a big thing here.
Good show, ending (story-wise) could be better.
About VOTOMS, this too never was released here, or the UK, I probably will never watch this, but I do hope this might get a better, wider release, including english dub, like MACROSS.
Maybe they reboot it, like LEGEND OF THE GALACTIC HEROES...
I love the 80s/early 90s anime. I don't know if a lot of the kids today know what they are missing, I was showing my nephew some older ones and he couldn't believe how gory they were.
It’s like reading the Bible after growing up on Saturday morning Bibleman.
Yeah, a friend of mine refuses to watch pre-2000s Anime because he does not like "old" animation. And it makes me so angry, because some of the best Anime are from the 80s and 90s.
Eva being a deconstruction of Mecha and mecha dying sounds like something Mother's Basement or some other anime tuber came up with
I'm pretty sure that sentiment was held long before anitubers in general became a thing. Like, I remember it being bandied around damn near 20 years ago, before 4chins (and later /m/) was conceived.
Votoms needs more love, I’m glad to see you review it
weird that people would call Mecha light hearted. Most of Gundam is pretty grim. 0080 is one of the most depressing anime ive seen.
Great work, Loli. Ive been meaning to watch more of this.
I also like how you can definitely also see the parallels and splits that would become Western Mecha born through Eastern mecha.
Tho personally I much prefer Battletech over Gundam and such but that’s just me.
Probably those people just saw Voltron and G Gundam, or whatever was on western TV at the time.
The most "light hearted" mecha I've watched is Patlabor on Television and even then it knew when to get serious, with characters expressing grief at the death of someone who died long ago in some episodes.
@Queen Haman well said
@Queen Haman of course they don’t know history. It’s like anime wasn’t popular overseas until the late 80s and early 90s.
It’s incredible how, despite being just as influenced by Ultraman as it is by mecha, Evangelion is only ever called a deconstruction by most casual fans. I fully believe that if people who liked Eva watched other older series like VOTOMS, Gundam, or hell even Anno’s previous project Gunbuster, there would be so many more mecha fans. I’m tired of the idea that Eva is unique for focusing on the characters or that mecha is a dying genre.
The power of misinformation and the unwillingness to watch older stuff.
it's only called a deconstruction by people who's only concept of mecha is Transformers and Voltron
Eva killed mecha because it gave snobs something to hold on to shit on other mechas without even getting in to the genere. Damn you snobs
I think it’s more a deconstruction of anime as a whole. Eva is really good. Not Gundam good, but mecha fans seem to overhate Eva because of how anime fans see it as an intelligent mecha
Eva is meta as fuck and knew what it was doing commenting on mecha. Yall got the worst takes.
I also liked how disposable the mechs where, they where crap for the most part, glass cannons is always more nervy
One day, Space Runaway Ideon will get the recognition it deserves, but until then, ill enjoy this review
I wish there was more Mech material like this. Specifically, Mechs that aren't completely ridiculous looking. I love the subtly, for lack of better word, of this anime's mechs. Along with Titanfall & Obsolete.
Gasaraki
Fang of the Sun Dougram - it's available subbed on youtube
@@johnmiddleton4291 That anime's fantastic. One of my absolute favorite. A crime it's essentially underground.
Then you will like Eighty six 86 , the mechs aren't even humanoid , they are quadrupedal and "spider-like" , oh and they also have a big cannon along with some machine guns
Were the armored hunter mellowlink fans at
👇
Seems like we're only a few months away from a review of LotGH aka the Best Anime of All Time.
As a MechWarrior fan for whom one of my favorite mechs used to be Marauder, yes, #FreeTheUnseen
Speaking of Votoms references, (I'm about half way through this show and it's living up to its reputation so far) pretty sure that the big robots from Sega's Space Harrier are visually based on the Veela mechs. I know that nobody gives a shit, but I think it's kinda neat!
Blue Gender is great especially love the space station orgy scene damn that was confusing as a kid
Also find it funny when talking about EVA you use the scene where Shinji spills his "tapioca" on Asuka in the hospital truly you are cultured
The "Tanks" comparison is pretty apt considering VOTOMS is an acronym for Vertical-Oneman-Tank for Offense-ManeuverS.
I've enjoyed this anime so much when I was a teenager, and especially the opening hits so hard. This really is an underated anime and urge people who love grim dark to watch this anime.
80’s anime explosions are the best. No clue why. Just that classic Transformers and Robotech. Got me into Anime in the first place.
Fun fact since the last stream was Super Robot Wars, in the newest game Super robot wars 30 Chirico not only comes back as dlc but he gets a new original designed by the creator Scopedog for that game. So yeah I can believe the series does have some on going love for it.
I love using Chirico in 30, he is one of those characters I can just drive into the middle of an enemy formation relying on insane evasion and brute fire power of the upgunned scopedog to wreck *everything* to a sometimes ridiculous degree.
If there is an anime that deserves a full-blown proper Space Battleship Yamato 2199 treatment it's sure as hell VOTOMS. I watched it years ago and it's still one of my favorite mecha anime series along with FLAG.
I wouldn't call it Battletech per se - since there is Fang of the sun Dougram, which is Battletech before Battletech, funny enough, made by same Ryousuke Takahashi.
When it comes to Chirico twist, I still consider that TV at least made it look fitting, but yeah, OVAs are tapping way too far into "Space Jesus" theme for my liking. At least TV series and Armor Hunter Mellowlink are lit as hell and I love both of them for being as gritty and dark as they could make it back in 1982/1988.
What I absolutely adore is the fact that VOTOMS actually doesn't overuse stock animation all that much. It is there, but it's not at the level of Macross 7 or Gundam Seed Destiny (where I shit you not, I started hating those stock animations by the end of each show. As well as music. Planet Dance is awesome song, but you can sing it so many times before it stops being fun and becomes annoying) . Shit like that doesn't fly here. And at least, when stock animation is used, it feels more as artistic decision rather than "We don't have enough money, so here's your basic animation loop #427, enjoy it, jackass!" Or it's use is subtle enough that it doesn't burn in your eyes.
I also love the fact that VOTOMS actually doesn't afraid to change settings - from Cyberpunk to Vietnam-like jungle to Space to Wasteland to Desert and even if two last ones are similar, Sansa is as different from Quent as two desert wasteland could be. Imagine that! Wait, two desert planets that don't look like one is a copycat of another? Yeah, call me surprised!
Prime example of real robot genre. The trope for the low tech is "Used Future" where almost everything is old or salvaged. The ATs themselves could be cannibalized to fix other damaged ATs. Also the low tech-ness indicates that these machines are mass produced and cheap. It's Sherman but mecha.
Scope Dogs were inspired by US Army Jeeps because the creator grew up in the occupation era.
You forgot to add he too damn lucky for a human being who gets into fights like he was Vash the Stampede.
Was looking for this comment, its the main plot point right from beginning that i remember from 10-15yrs ago when i saw it only once. He was initially member of some team made of guys deemed to be super lucky too much for random odds, even if incompetent for example, if i remember correctly.
That is evidently the key thing to being an Overman, you are almost impossible to kill because reality warps itself SLIGHTLY to keep you alive, you can get shot to shit but things will happen in such a way that you will not die.
Armored Trooper VOTOMS (and to a lesser extent, Mobile Suit Gundam) could be said to be the start of a sub-genre of sci-fi in which the technological aspects of the story are grounded in hard science as a contrast to their being some mystical core to the human element, be it New Types, Overmen or the Gasara from Gasaraki. I have to wonder if anyone has named this kind of science fantasy yet.
I do love the design of the Scopedogs...also, does that mean Chirico is just Space Guts?
The original Space Guts, ye
If you mix Berzerker armor with Scopedog mech you get Metal Gear Blade Wolf.
Space Rambo
I always liked the mecha in Votoms over Gundam for how realistic the mechs were as well as the battles. PLUS it was WAY easier to built them out of legos when I was younger!
Blue Gender is amazing. More people need to see it.
In short VOTOMS is a story about modded out T34s on legs fighting in wars, but we have to suffer through the boring parts where a guy with a maxed out luck stat is just too lucky to die.
Armorhunter was fun to watch, as it rethreads the locations from the VOTOMS anime.
It, and other prequels, show there is a lot of potential in the war prequels to the show, if you dont focus on the lucky protagonist and just put normal people into normal war combat situations.
Will November become officially VENGEANCE month? Maybe.
🎩
🐍 no step on Snek! 🇺🇸🇭🇰
In that case, I recommend death wish 2 for next year.
No nut in both senses, no shaves, no nostalgia critic, no nonce, and no nickelodeon November. And it is vengeance month.
3:40 DUDE you gotta be fucking kidding me (pls read with postal dude voice) whoever said that had just watched evangelion and non other mechs before. Because even the monster of the week super mecha of the early had some psychology thrown in. Yeesus this Eva fans man
"Not that long ago" brother it's been over a decade
I read the 'overman' slightly differently to you. Not so much a 'god' but the ultimate expression of the best of the best of humanity. More like Khan in Star Trek. Either through genetic mutation or expression of a genotype that comes about purely from the number of people alive in the Astragus galaxy.
Anyway, thanks for the content.
The only reason I know about this show is thanks to super robot wars. Chirico is a BEAST in the games and he's always on the frontlines when I use him.
Nice, did you start using VOTOMS in the Z2 games?
@@thesaltyweeb neh. I've known about the series since my college days back in 04, but I only somewhat recently found out that I could buy the games with the English translation. So, the only ones I have are Z, X, T and 30. Also moon dwellers, but the transition is horrid. So, kinda avoid playing that one for now.
fun looking back on this video and knowing there's a new VOTOM kit coming out soon, could lead to a new OVA or even something more
Hmm and interesting universe.
Would love too see you try and dissect the universe that is Battletech and see your opinions on the history, tech and stories that it rolls out.
I have a few disagreements, but they're mostly technical details or hardcore nerding out points. (SPOILER TALK)
1) Chirico isn't exactly a Perfect Soldier. He is thought out as one due to the understanding of the faction who's developing artificial Perfect Soldiers. Chirico is a bit more like an evolutional anomaly, natural occurence of a transhuman, a 1 in a quintillion. Pailsen Files was entirely to explore his anomaly and not classified as a perfect soldier, but the "ultimate survivor".
2) The "Magic" in the show is mostly absurdly high tech that was abandoned or forgotten on purpose by it's creators. It's more like the saying "Technology that is sufficiently advanced equates to magic" in the point that whoever can't understand the unknown can only register it as the magical. I only really concede with the one guy in the final arc that is "so spiritual" he becomes psychic, though he's a Quent and that gives some leeway.
3) While in the ending he is revealed to be groomed into becoming God... In this setting, God is a machine, a machine created by Quents who were extremely high-tech (star trek level that were one step before surpassing it) until they abandoned all tech for it was corrupting them, such that all out war regressed some technology. The point of the big AI thing in the end was to merge it's contience and knowledge with Chirico who cannot be killed. It's more of a literal and straight play on "Deus Ex Machina" and very much a cyberpunk trope of transhumanism and man-machine interfacing. Also, it's not an God in the sense of ultimate powers God, but an all-knowing God that influenced everything. A very technologically limited God.
4) The "Overman" is a play on the concept from nietche and also a common narrative element in transhumanism in scifi. Chirico is special as he manifests traits from "Overman" since his entire hometown that were also descendants of "Overman" were slaughtered easilly and only HE survived. The mystery of this ONE guy manifesting some sort of paranormal ability to survive to the point of even warping reality in some instances is actually a play explained in my next point.
5) Chirico's anomaly is simply "Deus Ex Machina" or "Plot Armor", but actually well written. He is the personification of the narrative trope and the show actually acknowledges it and plays it straight to a fault. People who suspected and attempted to figure out how and WHY this is a thing with Chirico, always ended up in it being their doom, driving them insane or causing people to recognize Chirico as a "force of nature". It's as if a mook actually starts questioning and studying why he just cannot kill the main character and in his attempt to understand, it drives him insane because he cannot. Votoms writing is smart and good because it dances on the edge of really dangerous narrative trappings.
I might be a wrong on the 5th point cuz it's 100% my own assumption as a creative, I'd be a lot mroe sure about it if I actually knew japanese to read the interviews, show bibles, artbooks, behind the scenes documents and magazine articles that probably explained all of it (or left some stuff up to interpretation on purpose). However there's a lot to read into because I really hold Votom's writing, influences and concepts at a very high regard. The people involved in the shows have to treat it with such care not to mess with certain foundations about it because there's an intense set of rules and lore that really goes beyond the age of this show. It's trully transcendent and I keep trying to get my friends to watch it and try to properly digest the early 80's aesthetics that still have a lot of 70's japanese aesthettics to it (such as the starship designs).
PS: I really wish you had also included Front Mission into the things Votoms inspired directly. Great video regardless.
"Mecha was too lighthearted before evangelion."
Gundam, Votoms, Space Runaway Ideon, "Excuse you?"
And zambot 3
Chirico Cuvie is a Space Nam War Vet and was friends with Space Pol Pot. Who was actually sorta a cool dude fucked over by life.
Votoms is Gundam without Newtypes.
It's got Perfect Soldiers though, which are a stand in for Newtypes.
Bro, Battletech anime is "Fang of the sun Dougram". You should really check it out.
Battletech took a bunch of designs from there (Shadowhawk, Griffin, Thunderbolt, etc) and the battles have a very similar heavy pacing. Plot could very well take place in the periphery before the clans arrived
Dougram is good, but it always felt that the main characters all had plot armor unlike Gundam
Apple VOTOM jeans, boots with the fur.
The whole series can be a little uneven, but it's one of my favorite anime franchises of all time. I didn't like the twist in the original anime either and I think it is an albatross around the neck of the franchise but in spite of that it explores themes of war, humanity and what it takes to survive desperate scenarios. Theres nothing else quite like VOTOMS in anime or more specifically mechan anime. I love the Kumman arc btw it's the best. I hope one day more OVAs and anime are produced. Chirico is a really great character and the supporting cast is great. I think modern anime scene needs a breath of fresh air like this to influence it.
8:25 *Übermensch* (it's not a "god"), read Nietzsche. It's the concept of "Beyond-Man," like the next major evolutionary step (but not as metaphysical as NewTypes).
Kind of amazed at how little the Nietzchean concepts aren't picked up in analysis on Votoms. Chirico is the Overman born of war, literally overcoming and killing god to bring forth a new order. There's Spenglerian themes of civilizational decline throughout and man's relationship with both technology and religion...someone at the studio making Votoms had been exposed to more than a little modern Western philosophy.
@@RingworldTyrantthe "classics" haven't/ aren't being taught in western schools (even when I was in school they had already started to "axe" them from the curriculum; luckily my father was an english and science teacher who instilled in me an appreciation of learning)... education and culture "weren't/aren't cool," (just look at the engagement with our comments for context vs other "surface level" observations)... it's a shame. 🤔😅👍
It's ironic that so much Manga and Anime has a basis in "higher concepts," but the majority of english speaking fans have little to no awareness of what they've truly been presented with.
Now the responsibility to "learn and better yourself" lies solely with the individual (mainstream culture isn't going to push you to enlighten yourself).
@@Visigoth_ All fair points.
There's a question raised about Wiseman, and it's asked if a god is really just a Being who is more advanced than others. Plus, Chirico's destiny is comparable to Dune's Paul Atredies. However, Chirico takes a different approach than Atredies, as he is able to escape his predetermined path, make it his own and ultimately reclaim his individuality by series' end. Also, another point raised by the ending of the regular series, even if Wiseman is dead and his Secret Society's main branch is mostly disbanded and the rest crippled and scattered, there is still the chance that Gilgamesh Confederation and the Ballerant Union will go to war, with the remnant of the Secret Society arming both sides of the war.
Also, you can't ignore Shining Heresy, because it ties directly into the OVAs. Not to mention that Shining Heresy elaborates on the religious and cultural aspects of the VOTOMS universe.
Just picked the complete collection a couple weeks ago after watching some snippets of this and this review has me even more hyped to blast through it.
Speaking of old school mech anime that remind you of Battletech, you should check out Dougram! It's got no weird space magic and instead has dirty politics. Very Battletech. Also features a lot of the early Battletech mechs that aren't from Macross.
whole series is being fan-remastered here on RUclips
pretty cool i might check it out
"Once it was revealed that he is a demi-god, he no longer seemed special." I think it is important to understand why so many people relate to such sentiments. I think it has something to do with the inability to recognize that if someone performs godlike deeds, then he MUST be a god.
I hope you make a video on The spin off Armor hunter Mellowlink
I love Votoms. It's just a gritty world and the gear is like communist mass production.
Armorhunter Mellowlink is also a good one.
It amazes me why there is no open world MMO RPG game for Votoms. It has so much potential.
I barely remember watching this, but I liked the weird hebrews in the desert vibe with that guys culture
And the Adam in the garden thing who is so delighted until he gets bitten but the bug and basically becomes Caine immediately at that first experience of pain and suffering
I only watched the anime and I understood it as Chiriko being a regular human most of the time, but he has a gene given through evolution that let him become more and more super human.
I never got that he was supposed to a ps. He was only ever mistaken as one or compared to.
So he started as a regular human, but evolved when ever necessary to survive, meaning whenever he was beaten he grew in abillity
The plot twist about Chirico being an Overman was really strange in that it was hinted at but also doesn't fit at all. Chirico was a good pilot and soldier... but not when compared to PSs. He constantly lost to them until suddenly he was their match.
I think it inspired obsolete which is a RUclipsr original Mecha anime series in the real robot genre
AAH!! THANK YOU FOR THIS!!!!!! I am happy now!!
Based Content. Based Channel. Based Content Creator
I wonder if Rogue Trooper from 2000ad was the inspiration for Chirico Cuvie in Votoms? Both of them are genetic infantryman who can withstand damage in the battlefield that your average human soldier can't. . And Chirico also has blue hair which could be a nod to Rogue Trooper who has blue skin.
Most claims about Evangelion being deconstructive or even subversive tend to be more telling of the person's lack of experience with the genre pre-Eva than anything Evangelion genuinely does uniquely
Remember guys:
Chirico's magnum kills everything
Ryosuke takahashi you say,
Deja vu indeed.
Wow, I thought I understood where Battletech came from with Gundam but this is escentially Battletech, but even more grim. I can totally Imagine someone wanting to make a Tabletop Game of this and ending up with Battletech.
Off topic but based for using demon of pledge for the credits ✊
There's no denying "overman" was deliberately meant to sound like "uberman," and its symbolism.
i remember watching this as a kid on tv and i didn't know until now what it was
I dont remember what the name of it was, but what got me hooked into Mecha was the "Glitter boys". Fully enclosed power suits, bristling with weapns that could entrench themselves to use cannons, and were never painted so they could shine in the sun.(was not anime but like d&d-esque)
You are referring to the Rifts rpg. Lots of insane interdimensional awesomeness with some... questionable setting choices and a mess of a ruleset.
Definitely need to check this series out now, good video mate! Also lol at most mecha being "cheery"
I would like Votoms get new anime reboot, i really don't care if the mechs are CGI as long as it's not Gmod physics tier.
I also want Votoms game as mech 3rd person shooter and that would be great.
There was a Votoms game for the PS2 but it never got an English translation.
From what little I played of it it was pretty decent.
Mellowlink is also a great anime in this setting
Michael Pondsmith is the man
This month is definitely themed
great review man! also happy to see an anime youtuber comment on the misconceptions people have on the mecha genre and the bizarre takes that eva fans have, i dont see it enough honestly.
*CONTAINS THE SPOILER*
I'm not turned off out of watching the series just because the dude's a super soldier, although I'm a bigger fan of stories about regular joe action men.
So it's a star wars kind of deal for me: *watch for the military stuff* .
Ah Takehashi mecha anime, man that made entire niche mecha genre for himself, most grounded, most realistic, most autentic and thrilling mecha battles UNTIL magical shit starts happening. Vottoms, Gasaraki and to some extent Blue Gender.
If you want "BattleTech: The Anime" you watch _Fang of the Sun Dougram_ because that's where most of the Mech designs came from- not _Macross_ and certainly not _Crusher Joe_
Even that's pushing it. The _BattleTech_ gameplay paradigm is based on pre-Dreadnought naval combat of the late 19th/early 20th (i.e. pre-WW1) era, and that describes almost no Real Robot properties in anime or manga. _Heavy Object_ is a rare exception.
You want to know what _VOTOMS'_ real-life counterpart is? Technicals. Yes, I mean civilian trucks with anti-material weapons or heavy machineguns mounted in the beds; cheap, easy to produce, easy to train (so you can shove fodder into them quickly), and are little more than death traps against anything resembling anti-vehicle firepower (like, say, a surplus M60 machinegun or an anti-material rifle like a Barrett).
Good video overall, just a bit lacking in the references.
man do i want send my own subcribestar request, tho the stupid thing doesnt want to accept my card
You can email me
@@TheAlmightyLoli Can I mail you furry futanari scat?
0:38 "Armored trooper Votoms" is something I can get behind... ;)
Seriously , it’s a shame VOTOMS delved into the Gundam tropes as it went on. I have never been a fan of the “supermen are better soilders” trope in mecha. If anything it should have been more like Mellowlink.
That being said plus points for the series sticking to the Superman trope. The Roots of Ambition OVA is perhaps the best mecha media I have ever seen, and it really plays up that trope.
I'd argue Macross isn't close to Battletech at all, despite the licensing of Macross designs to Battletech.
Votoms is the Best series ever made that doesn't have gundam in it's name, Even though i agree with the twist
Armored Troopers VOTOMS it's very cool. I still to watch the OVAs, but I will keep in mind what you said.
Agreed with the demi-god argument. Sometimes these stories become convoluted for apparent zero reason. Still, it's a great show overall!
Learn much here, recommend too!
Armor Hunter is pretty damn good. The entire series used to be RUclips before it got taken down.
Heavy Gear that is basically just VOTOMs with, weirdly enough, more anime injected in, is also a fantastic game in its own.
The 2nd edition rulebook works both as a wargame and as a light RPG, it has that old feel that you only get by reading 1st edition warhammer manuals, with your units being more your dudes than your army.
I have been using it to run mecha games in my own setting for years and i highly reccomend it (and other dreampod9 prdoucts) if you want a light rpg with wonky ass damage rules for semi realistic mecha campaigns.
Also, Patlabor is absolutely Kino and a feast for the eyes, the movies in particular, watch Patlabor.
The creators of Heavy Gear, Dream Pod 9, are also cool with people playing it on Tabletop Simulator and with also 3d printing. They even give STLs on their community page for some units.
Not enough Cat Mommy
1/5 ⭐
Next vid just a looping .gif of Aisha Clan-clan plz
This Shit looks tight
now with "Requiem for vengance" I wish even more that we got a VOTOMS series in that style,
hell, every year they keep releasing new model kits and figures, this year alone we'll get a Hi-metal R 20,000 yen figure, a Threezero robodou one, two bandai HG kits and all of the Wave and kotobukiya model kits,
the same as Dunbine, just give them a remaster or remake already! they keep earning money from them, they should at least make a remake to bring new people
Dude I was just listening to random anime soundtracks, decided to look up the IP, and found gold. Can't wait to watch it fully
I love not caring about spoilers.
Just finished SRW T so seeing this pop up is good timing since it's only a week old
Chirico is broken in that game
I've read somewhere that....
VOTOMS = Vertical One-man Tank for Offensive Maneuver
Mech warriors is my favorite mecha series im just happy someone even knows what it is
👍. You had me at "Lets talk about some fucking giant robots."
If you wanted a Battletech anime there is Fang of the Sun Dougram. Which is where Battle tech got the rest fo the Unseen from and its obsession with heat.
ATs are tanks but they are more like something along the line of Centauro and M1128, good gun with armor thats just barely enough to stop average infantry weapons like ar or smg.
Pretty cool might check it out. I guess special protag syndrome plagued writing back then too.
Visually this looks heavily inspired by Starship Troopers (book).
Never saw a single episode of this, but I remember owning a couple model kits.
Sad young pilots isnt a thing invented by Evangelion. Thats the power of repeating a lie enough times. Good video loli.
Amuro and Kamile weren’t depressed
Sounds similar to Gundam. Like UC Gundam. But different enough to be it’s own thing. More battle tech than mobile suit.