It means you are becoming a man in that art. My understanding is that "Dan" means man in this context so first Dan is the beginning of being a man on that journey.
Same, I was told something similar when I first began training, and I didn't understand at the time. Now that I'm currently about to earn my black belt after 10 years, I understand a bit more. It's just the very beginning of the art by that point, and you begin to see more of what it can be, even though you don't yet fully know what that is. Like the Socratic Paradox, "I know that I know nothing", A black belt is just someone who knows enough to see how little he knows
One of my students asked me about my black belt in BJJ and if I felt it meant I knew every technique and that I've achieved some mastery over the art. My response was that my only mastery was that I now knew what I didn't know. I know my take-down game is crap and I know my striking is non-existent. So I am now training in boxing/kickboxing and when I get the time I will drop into a judo club. A black belt is like being a white belt all over again except knowing how to pay attention to the details.
Whilst I agree with the gist of your video, it's only in the western world that the black belt is held in such high regard. Getting a black belt really only means that one is no longer a beginner. It was never a symbol of mastery. Unfortunately, many western systems make a big deal out of it (BJJ certainly does) instead of viewing it as the beginning of a deeper level of study. I hope that you feel better soon. Me and mine all had covid last year and it's a bugger.
Your implication about BJJ black belts sounds a little off. It sounds like you're saying BJJ players make a big deal out of traditional eastern martial arts black belts, when a black belt in BJJ is notoriously different. Tae Kwon Do black belts are the rough equivalent of BJJ blue belts; it can be earned in a few years. BJJ black belts typically take 10-15 yrs to earn. So yeah, it's a much bigger deal, because yes, by the time you're a BJJ black belt, you really have achieved a level of mastery, not just competency
@@liesareparadox1892 depends on the martial art, but I suppose you could say that for any of them, since all fresh bb's say the same thing: "there's so much I need to learn!" I do think there's a pretty noticeable difference in mastery, though, between someone who's practiced a fairly closed system for three years vs someone who practices an open system for 10+
@@patrickmcinerney9491 I think maybe I didn't explain my point properly. I agree 100% re BJJ black belts taking longer and I agree that a BJJ black belt IS a master. My point is, that the 1st black belt (in Japan, where the belt system came from) was never a master's belt, whereas in BJJ it is.
Shodan; It's in the name: first step. It only means that you've reached a sufficient level to actually now start learning. You have reached legitimate beginner. Most people do unfortunately suffer from shodan-itus when they first get their grade, which can generally be dispelled over time by training with more advanced people. This is why in the koryu world people below shodan generally can only learn omote (outer) teachings. The art I practice is even more selective as you must wait until nidan before you can start to learn the heart of the system.
Get well soon and hope your family are doing well. As a Boxer and Karateka practioner, its always good to train and expand your martial arts outside of your comfort zone, not just sticking to 1 style. Learning is a never-ending story my friend!!
Well said. I've dabbled in martial arts for a while. I was serious about Tae Kwon Do when I was a younger man serving in the Army in the 1980s. What I noticed at the local Dojang was a weird hierarchy. There were Korean-American kids for which Tae Kwon do was like little league. All were expected to participate, some were unmotivated but forced to go for culture's sake, many would advance to Black Belt eventually, and they were all of mixed quality depending on their motivation level. Then there were the mostly white middle-class adults or even families (average white people) who took the lessons for "self-defense" or fitness or fun, tested periodically, and moved from belt to belt eventually reaching black belt. But it was a "pay as you go" system and most of them were terrible at sparring. Then there were a few like me -- military or law enforcement types who were young adults, very physically fit and strong, but not particularly skilled. Yet our aggression and strength meant we could beat most of the people in the first two categories despite not being "black belts." Finally there was the fourth group, Korean visitors from South Korea who came for tournaments, to serve as judges, or put on exhibitions. They were the "real" black belts, often with multiple degree black belts (and sometimes another martial art on their resume). There were generally not allowed to spar the Korean-Americans or the "average white people" but were sometimes teamed up against blundering military types like me to put us in our place or challenge us to take Tae Kwon Do seriously and not be misled by the unintimidating black belts in the Dojang general population. Yeah, those guys were hardcore and I was humbled a couple times at their hands. Bottom Line: The black belt can mean everything or nothing. All depends on the fighter. I can't speak for all the martial arts but for the average commercial Dojo, I suspect it's much the same.
I just started bjj and as someone who's done a mixture of powerlifting and weightlifting for the last 5 years I find the only way people can submit me is if I move into a position or I let someone move into a position cause I'm trying to get a feel for the sport, like sure I could just hold both their wrists and sit there for 5 minutes but I just don't see the point, I'm not even the biggest person there at 5'9 89kg which is amusing seeing as there's a gross strength disparity
The first martial art I did outside my home (our father trained us to box and I taught myself judo to defend myself from my bigger and stronger older brothers) was karate, Goju-ryu karate, and our sensei was an Englishman who also worked as a bouncer. I was only 11 then, and one night I said to him, 'Sensei, because you're a black belt, you must be able to beat any street fighter, right?' And he said, 'No! Not at all. There's a lot of really good fighters who never formally trained in anything. A black belt doesn't tell you whether a person can really fight in real conditions.'
Reminds me of what Mick Coup said. Paraphrasing: "I've realised I trained in all these skills and still can't beat anyone, and yet here's old 'Big John' in the pub, smashing everyone's faces in, no training whatsoever, what does he have what I don't? - tenacity. He's probably got martial skills, but doesn't know what they're called, but he has the condition of mind".
I was with you for the 1st half of the video. Mcdojos = bad. However, you lost me at the 2nd half of the video when you claimed "striking = bad, grappling = good". To be a complete martial artist, you need BOTH striking & grappling. Mind you, there are too many delusional BJJ guys drinking the kool-aid who think they can fight without ever throwing a punch. They get a rude wake-up call when they step into the octagon, or just spar MMA rules at 50%.
I think you misrepresent me when you say I think striking is bad. I think that if you put striking against grappling then grappling will win, but I fully accept striking has it's place, and the combination of the two is by far the best option. However most striking in martial arts is worse than useless.
Have to say your last comment about finding a grappling gym really neglects kyokushin. Yes I will keep commenting about it here, but most kyokushin instructors have serious competition experience, going the distance across regional and international tournaments. It’s not about finding a “grappling” martial art but finding martial arts classes offered by people who know what it’s like to compete in arts where a knockout/submission/etc is considered a win rather than a foul.
@@EnglishMartialArts I have done a bit of taekwondo growing up and a bit of karate in college but never got to the higher belts. I only have a couple of years of hema under my belt. Judge me as you see fit.
You need to sweat buckets, you need to have bruises, sore muscles, and sometimes you need to bleed. It’s just red sweat! Glad you’re back Oz! Hope you’re feeling better!
You know there’s actually a lot of kyokushin schools in the UK. And a good few of their senseis have experience from the the open weight tournaments in the 80s and 90s. Also it’s funny as Andy Hug was once demolished by a British white belt called Trevor Marriott… funny how it works
Another thing is that one of my friends who was a Shodan in JKA said he only started having the real training and fighting after reaching dan grades he would sometimes spend whole sessions fighting non stop and that before that it was all safe and point focused.
I received my first degree (shodan) blackbelt in judo last year, being involved in the sport and martial art for over 14 years now. It was one of the biggest achievements of my life. But, as they say in judo (and likely other martial arts), the blackbelt is "just the beginning", and I completely agree. While I do help to teach judo to children, teenagers and adults, I do not know everything, I make mistakes, and I am constantly learning new, or better ways to do things. I know judo can be potentially effective in competitive combat sports like mixed martial arts (MMA), UFC and can transition fairy well across to Brazilian jiu-jitsu (BJJ), but I am not sure how effective judo could be in a self-defence "street fight" application. I originally started judo to learn "self-defence" but in the last 14 years, I have never found myself in a hostile confrontation where self-defence was required. Martial arts can sometimes provide a rather false sense of security and confidence within people... I knew one gentleman, who was if I am being honest, a bit out of shape, who had done wing chun kung fu for less than 12 months, and he was convinced that he could beat combat sports athletes, like MMA/UFC fighters. I knew another gentleman who trained in a 'white crane' kung fu or something, and he also believed the same thing. When it comes to "effective" martial arts, I believe the ones that emphasis sparring, as well as cardiovascular conditioning, are probably the most effective... judo, BJJ, MMA, boxing, kick boxing, muay thai, to name a few.
@@jamiesmith1162 - Some countries prohibit the use and carrying of pepper spray devices, for better or worse. I wouldn't say that karate is a "huge waste of money", but I suppose such a statement is subjective and really, it comes down to the individual. Some people may undertake martial arts training for reasons that are not self-defence. This could be enjoyment for the actual art itself, a form of physical exercise, a social atmosphere etc. Furthermore, it also comes down to the environment of the dojo and club itself. If you go to a karate club where the instructor(s) are mean and unpleasant, and people are for some reason attending but not enjoying it, there's a good chance that you won't enjoy it either. In my opinion, there is no point doing something that you do not enjoy. Not to go off-topic, but I just want to clarify something about some martial arts instructors being "mean and unpleasant". It has nothing to do with "discipline", it's just arrogance and projecting insecurities. Respect is indeed an important element in martial arts, but it is a two way street.
Reminds me of what a manger at marital arts gym told me iron sharpens iron. I did a aikido for about 6 years and never losing does seem to have a profound negative impact on most. I've only done bjj for 2 years and most people seem a lot more humble
5:28 That certainly stands true in many places. My teacher's teacher's school is constantly looking for new students, and only has a small handful of those that stay and really learn further. Yet what he teaches is extremely effective, testable and replicable, all the hallmarks of good martial arts techniques. But, it requires some hard work to get them down. I recently visited his dojo, and his classes are indeed tough, (Quite a bit more aerobic and exhausting than my own dojos classes, I have to admit and be real), so I can see why someone would be scared off. It's still a shame to see so many people try, and then choose someplace else
I pretty much agree with what you are saying. When I started the martial arts way back in the day, it was very unusual to see a black belt other than the head instructor. When another black belt showed up, we were awestruck. Now they are giving black belts away in exchange for time and money regardless of actual ability or age. Now I rarely wear my black belt. Why, because my training and teaching is fighting centric. as in MMA. I do striking, grappling, and both.
My 30 year journey as a student of the arts has been one of finding what works for me and discarding what doesn't. I've never worn a gi or a belt in that time. I've had opportunities to do so, but prefer my informal approach. Get well soon!
You’ve hit upon one of my biggest frustrations with the martial arts (And many people’s perception of them.) I agree with all you say here and more. Too many who didn’t learn properly from people who didn’t teach them properly…then failing to properly teach others who already have unrealistic expectations - and downgrading contact & intensity to maintain mat fees.
i trained like you said in the video. my teacher said the best way to learn is through sparring, getting hit and learning how to not get hit. i sparred against him (2nd degree black belt in TKD) and i improved leaps and bounds in that year. not only that but my pain tolerance went through the roof during that year. that was about 30 or so years ago. i do miss those days.
You’re right and yet also wrong. Many successful karate practitioners in MMA. Jiu Jitsu has been countered forcing more standup fighting related to the content taught by karate. The main problem American karate evolved to have is lack of pressure testing. They’ve made it easy for people who can’t handle pressure so they could make more money. Also, I’ve gone into many BJJ gyms that were just as clueless - cause they’ve gone the same way as karate. And, the Gracie’s have been challenged and beaten by many, including fighters in Japan that have the original arts.
Most of my active training these days is in swordsmanship, but I trained for years in Hapkido. We had a few Tae Kwan Do students who joined ... and I hated sparring them. Sparring was always done hard, but the TKD crowd always seemed to want to really clobber you, going for a concussive KO. Almost made me quit a few times, as I felt like I was so worried about getting seriously hurt that I wasn't able to learn from the moment. It did not help that one or two of them seemed to hold the attitude of the jock-like cocky fighter. Until one day I was being backed up by a serise of spinning kicks and finally dropped down, stopping my opponent's advance with a counter attack that, in a fair fight, would be considered a "low blow." It did push me until I could act cognitively under pressure, something I have been working to foster since then. Oh, and FIGHT TEAM!
I agree with almost everything u said, i might just add that even though the mindsets u talked about are the most common in bjj newbies i came in wiht "i gonna get beaten the fuck up let's try to see how long till not anymore" that mindset holds true for me still as i am only a few mohnts in but i alredz feel more confident in my abilities. I got that mindset trough people like u and ohter bjj/fighting RUclipsr and i am thankful for that. (Please excuse every gramatical errors english isn't my native language)
Always a difficult one here. In my opinion there are many issues or things that are being tared with the same brush. I've seen excellent karate schools and terrible ones, excellent bjj schools and terrible ones... different arts and sports can suit different people physically and mentally. Selected training can be nothing to do with sport or art all together like self protection. It's personal preference combined with ability. I was indoctrinated into martial arts by a very commercial karate style and club but I loved it and did well. I explored other arts and realised there were many gaps in my knowledge but that foundation gave me a very good platform to build onto. I have stood on my own two feet with MMA champs and bjj black belts from my mcdojo roots, yes I would have failed miserably if I did not cross train. It's a nice video mate but I suspect the onion layers are numerous here and your holding back. Belts were always a marketing ploy for student retention hence catch wrestling the same as self protection doesn't have any real sticking power for "most people" it's hard as hell and you don't get any acknowledgement of skill level other than real fights. Where as bjj on the other hand you can never have any competitive action but still progress up the shiny ranks. I've interviewed hundreds of fighters, teachers and school owners and they all say the same thing....master 2-3 things and be the best at that. Be that a straight right, an arm bar or a spinning back kick. learn to dish them out from all positions. If someone grabs you why did you let that happen? If they punch you why didn't you get the takedown first? Belts don't mean shit. Principles over method .😜
Your videography has gotten so e real game! I've been hitting your back catalog lately, and the improvement is markable! Heck, even last year's videos aren't to this standard. Fight team
Thank you. I made a real effort to improve it as I could see my content was pretty poor quality. It's a long process of learning though, just like fighting!
One thing I've learned over the years is that the first half of the various belt system is focused about learning the kinetic movements and techniques. The second half of the belt system is about learning how the system and philosophy behind said techniques operates. As Always: Fight Team
Glad you feel better! Great content as always. In Japan, Dan (black belt) just shows seniority. If an otherwise renown figure (say, an elderly manager of a big corporation or a public official) starts a martial art, they will likely be given a black belt straight away even though they can’t even tie that belt. (This might be depend on a dojo and region, and it’s prob more likely to occur in aikido and karate than say, judo, but just my assumption). There’s a highly hierarchical culture, where seniority comes before everything else, for you. In that sense studying aikido as a young kid was highly educating: I didn’t learn to fight, but I did learn that just because someone is older than you or ”a master”, it doesn’t mean they know jack shit about anything. And then sometimes it does. We had 50-something old ’sensei’ whose technique was weirdly better than anybody else’s and he seemed impossibly strong - guy had competed as judoka and was a judo black belt. Never understood why he seemed so strong and good (is this some ki-shit or what?) until I started BJJ as an adult and rolled with a high level blue belt. I instantly remembered that feeling as if I had been gripped in a steel vise. The guy was smaller and lighter than me, who at that point had boxed and power lifted for years, but he basically walked all over me with ease. I was immediately like ”oh that’s what it is!!” And this guy was just a beginner. So the supernatural ki-power that makes you able to beat bigger and stronger people is… Grappling. Just a huge amounts of grappling, period. And when your body is ripped to apart and you live in constant pain, hopefully somebody gives you a brown or black belt so that you can retire to teaching classes.
I think you are 100% correct in everything you have said, I am an ITF taekwondo black belt and on my journey to achieving this I had to move from one country to another, prior to achieving my black belt I used to compete quite often and I always enjoyed sparring with the black belts in my old training place as they pushed me to improve, when I moved to a much larger city there were multiple places that did my style of TKD and I tried one out and was instantly shocked to see black belts my age unable to move as well I do (at the time I was a red stripe so 3 belts away or ''tests'' away from black belt), spent a couple of weeks and found out that the instructor doesn't really care about competing and it is an individual thing that if you wish to do you can go ahead and do alone and I think that such a thing should be clearly stated on their website, I was lucky enough to find a different place a lot more similar to my older place. my take is not every black belt you meet is the same and you must always respect when someone is a black belt even if they don't compete they have put in the hours and are probably knowledgeable to a certain extent on the martial art they are doing, some martial arts have tough requirements for black belts for a reason because it should not be something that anyone can just spend time and achieve it should be tough and should feel great when you get that belt tied around your waist because you worked so hard for it, and not just paid for it, I believe a good indicator is competitions, win or loose a colored belt who has competed will always be better than a black belt in the same martial art who never competed and just did his normal training
i think the point you make is partial, if "total effectiveness" is the aim, like in a hollywood movie, shall we say a "complete fighting curriculum", grappling while being crucial can't be the only skillset to be sought after. Also speaking of black belts in this regard is going off the mark, correlation is not causation, there's plenty of good black belts in bjj, judo, karate et cetera, while you can find bad ones for each of the practices you listed and beyond. What imo matters most is how it's done: pushing oneself, sweating, sparring/rolling light and hard, working all ranges from long range striking to ground grappling to underhanded strikes, dirty boxing and such, and finally working also the contexts of the fight, so sparring or training in everyday clothes or with the gear you'll wear during a competition, learning how to use the environment and yours or the other's clothes to your advantage, how to use objects as weapons and weapons as... well, weapons. ofc it's unrealistic to master everything, but if we speak in absolutes this should be it
Good stuff. Could not agree more with this. I’m a 48 year old, BJJ three stripe white belt who’s been getting his arse kicked on a regular basis, and is thankful for it. Practiced Shotokan as a kid, then Krav Maga for 5 years as an adult (some years ago now) but nothing has taught me how to fight more than Jiu Jitsu has. And I’m shit at it. 😂 Love these vids man, thank you.
Once again lad you are on point. In my day we cared not jot for strophes, sashes, and other empty symbols. We cared only for effectiveness in combat, then application for sports. And we seemed to do quite well. Of course I am a bit of an antiquarian. However I am sticking to my opinion. God bless you lad and your lovely family.👊👍🙏
First of all I'm glad to see you well enough to make vids again. I've had covid 3 times and it sucks hard. As for the video I agree, but it def shouldn't be this way. In theory someone who has trained an actual martial art (BJJ, Judo, Muay Thai, wrestling etc) long enough to be a black belt (even though some don't have belts) they should be able to thoroughly kick the untrained persons ass. One of the main issues with this are McDojos and belt factories. We are even starting to see it in REAL martial arts like Jiu-jitsu. People getting black belts after less than 10 years because they paid a lot for private lessons and won a competition.
Well as someone who has trained for over 50 years, and having been involved everything from hard core schools to McDojo's I will say that most of what you said is true. Since I earned my first Black Belt while living in Japan in the 70's in Kodokan Judo I would suggest that not all Black Belts are equal. Some are actually valid. Remember Kano created the belt system so that fighters could compete with others fairly with equivalent knowledge and skiils. A Black Belt just meant you were a practitioner of the art, not that you were a master.
I'm currently training in a solidly average 3K dojo, with the goal to get a black belt. What I want this belt to do for me is open up social avenues with other serious practitioners, as well as being able to train how I like in my chosen art. I'm a bit of a wreck after the Covid years (chronic pulmonary lung disease exacerbated by getting Covid), so I need to do the damn reps to get back into shape and there's always more to learn, but I make no illusions about what a black belt actually means. It's worth what I put into getting it, and it's a social badge to get to have a turn of speaking at a table of peers.
I agree almost entirely, and it is a bit sad that many folks' perception of a black belt is that. The "average" martial artist will never actually fight, and likely has no desire to regardless of what they tell themselves. I spar and wrestle in earnest semi-regularly, but I would still not claim that I've ever actually -fought- in my adult life. For many folks, a black belt is seen only as an achievement of training rather than a certificate of fighting ability, and I think that's okay, personally. Especially if that training is under mindful instructors and a good school in whatever you're training. No color belt, however, will ever be an indicator of how well one can actually fight, imho. Fight Team!
My students are expected to be capable fighters by 1st black belt. By 3rd I expect them to be able to dismantle someone in seconds. I don’t keep many students, not many people want real karate anymore.
I trained karate for seven years and got to brown belt. I transitioned into boxing and it humbled me quickly. However I don’t regret training karate and it still has given me skills I still use
So I've earn two black belts thus far, and what they have both convinced me of, is I suck at fighting and am very vulnerable. Granted I suck less than I did before and am slightly less vulnerable, but am still a rank amateur. Got loads more work to do.
The best is Defendu gutter fighting of WWII boxing, wrestling, Savate, Jujutsu, Judo and street fighting, used by the OSS and others US Army taught that called Combatives till the 2000's
I’m from a Thai boxing background. I realise now that if you can’t grapple in some sort of way you can’t fight . Training is extremely difficult and exhausting. But hopefully I’ll eventually improve 🤞.
It seems to me just absurd that in all sports there is a widely accepted principle by which you do well in competition if you train in competition-like conditions. But that apparently and for some mysterious reason does not stand for fighting! If you want to be good at fighting you need to fight (and the closest and safest to that would be sparring)
Great to see you back! You see this in mcdojos so much, either making people have false confidence or just to take there money. Allot of bad teachers are the thing and not the belts really but not to say there arent some with belts they didnt deserve. Just watch karate combat to see that, masters of hitting pads but not fighting
This is very true. I trained myself in martial arts for years. I fought my first fight at 23 and was destroying people. The third guy i fought lost by tko, but received a black belt after the fight. I thought it was odd. Everyone i knew and fought around said i should train people. I tried. One guy stuck with it, out of the 13 people i tried training. He went from 520lbs to 210 lbs. He could do splits at 450lbs. All the others thought it was too hard. Usually they never came back after the first session. I told one guy to throw a kick at me, i wanted to demenstrate the importance of shin hardening, he threw as hard as he could and all i did was check it. He ended up fracturing his shin. And blamed me. Im sorry, but if you go for training and someone tells you to throw a punch or kick, would you go all out your first time? I really dont know the answer. I figured people would have common sense. Needless to say, he got mad and started cussing.. so i told him to leave and not return. Was i in the right or wrong? Plus, i still wonder if im worthy to train people. I actually stopped back in 2018. Now i just train myself and kids. I stopped fighting after receiving a championship in kickboxing through Stand Up Warriors in Indiana. It wasnt that i stopped liking to fight, but my ex wife had a miscarriage and nearly died in the hospital. I just havent had the want to compete since.
I could listen to you all day. You have a very hypnotic timbre, just so i almost believe what you said there... 🤣😂 just joking. The advantage from a martial art to a martial sport is that you have all those nice techniques that are prohibited in sports, like eye jabs, knee and groin kicks, chopping the windpipe and what have you. Downside is, you can never ever train all this stuff like you should, to make it work. And vice versa, in sports, you are likely to not use the good stuff, bcs you never train it. But what you use you have already developed against an resisting opponent under various degrees of stress, so it's more likely to make an impact that is rembered from the other guy. To me, i rather train with rules and when things go sideways, i think street. Worked good for me in two decades as a bouncer, in a time when bouncing was a rough job. Same goes for technique vs strength. Yes, i have seen some very good technique that has beaten bigger stronger men. But far more often, i saw it the other way, a big strong man beating the shit out of a martial artist, sorry guys, that's just what i've seen in my practice. How many knowledge of techniques has a pitbull? You would'nt want to fight one, just because you know your armbars. Or try to drown a cat or choke it (well, not really. Don't do that). You have the better techniques AND be much stronger than a 10lbs house cat, but you will not succeed, i tell ya. So it's most of all mindset (don't be a victim), and then comes strength and techniques. That is my bias, and i highly reckommend it. Greetings from Vienna.
I did karate for 3 years and got a brown belt, however pretty quickly I learned I wasn’t a particularly effective fighter, so I started boxing and Muay Thai and tried to focus on learning grappling at an MMA club. In 3 months of mma training I was definitely better at actual fighting than 3 years of karate. Some of the kicks, stances and techniques are of use, and can be Incorporated nicely into mma, but it was largely ceremonial and contrived. I also feel if you took a samurai warrior from the past and showed them modern karate, they’d laugh.
Correct. Very correct. But you fergot to explain that "the graiding", "the small pain" is also lots of fun. And, talking about ego, i desagree, u can take your ego to the Jiu-jitsu mat. No prob. In a short time, the ego, will balace. If too much jiujitsu reduces it, if too litle jiujitsu increses it. I hope that what i wrote is more or less in english ;) sorry.
First off I think your right, I haven't got a black belt, and I am bigger and stronger than any of the BJJ blackbelt coaches, the fact that I still get tapped in almost every round and can't tap them speaks volumes for the standard of BJJ Blackbelts. My belt also holds up very well vs lower grades. That's what's good about the BJJ belt system , it actually equates to ability. The other Art I do is Ninjutsu, and its a bit of an odd one, the different Kyu belts do not represent ability as far as I can tell, they seem to be purely based on other factors which are hard to divine and it isn't knowledge and understanding, and it isn't a scaled representation of actual fighting ability either, maybe its progress or time in the system, but that's probably not it either. In any case the blackbelts seem legit at this particular club but I bet there are exceptions if we look at clubs outside this branch of Ninjutsu. It certainly a good add on to the BJJ for that extra bit of Traditional Jiu Jitsu training.
@andymax1 I've trained with plenty of ninjutsu blackbelts who couldn't do a thing against an opponent who wasn't fully compliant. One or two who could, but I'm not sure actual fighting ability is standard in most of that set of arts.
The standard has steadily dropped since the 1970s . It now feels like wherever you go there are very young people graded very highly who can’t fight. This is depressingly true of the style I studied in the 1980s. I was shocked when I went back to it a few years ago that there were people who are graded as above black belt couldn’t fight. When I took my black belt or rather in the preparation for it my instructor who was an extremely good fighter told me if you couldn’t handle three untrained people in a street in altercation, then you weren’t a black belt. Nowadays, quite honestly, nothing surprises me about the black belts out there. However I remember being totally amazed in the 1990s by what brown belt could do. This is why mixed martial arts and grappling are so important. They don’t allow you to hide behind, fancy, footwork or a long reach These arts put great emphasis on physicality, which is absolutely vital in any fight or altercation.
👏🏻 I agree that’s why I don’t like the turn Martial Artist, I found that the People/ Blackbelts who called themselves Martial Artists wouldn’t or more likely couldn’t Fight even the Karate Nerd admits a BlackBelt means nothing except in your Dojo
Every physical confrontation I have ever been was ended by me being bigger than most and strangling the other person or beating them in the nuts. There is no grace in a fight its who is tougher, and who is willing to gouge out the eyes of the other while crushing testicles.
I thought I could fight, went to my first Jiu jitsu class in 2018. I just got beaten up for a solid year. Am still training and still getting beat up on a regular basis. 🙂👍💪
It depends if the school you go to pressure test what you learn. If there's no pressure testing on the behalf of the school through either sparring, practicing on each other, flow drills or getting shanked with a fake knife to see if your knife tapping works (that last one is more specific to Eskrima), then it is useless. If the school you go to emphasizes on pressure testing of any kind then you'll be fine.
One of the founders of the Dog Brothers, in my opinion, said it best. It’s the idea of the tribe. It’s not about winning or losing, it’s about testing each other to make sure we are able to defend ourselves and our families. One member of the tribe is weak, then the tribe itself is weak. Your training partners aren’t doing you any favors if they are going easy on you, but, if they are going too hard to the point where you get injured and can’t train, they still aren’t doing you any favors.
If by fighting you mean, a real-life situation, then neither a tradition fighting art, or MMA truly prepares you for that. What happens on the street is a world away from what happens on the matt, so to speak. The main reason for this, is they are combat sports, & as such focus their attention, on single combat, with a view to winning medals & trophies. However, I agree that MMA fulfils a broader range of techniques, for it to be considered as a more complete fighting system. Although, before the Japanese got their hands on it, so was Karate at one stage in its history. There is no focus on dealing with multiple attackers, or weapons for that matter. Even though it's an important aspect of fighting, to learn grappling. You certainly don't want to aim to end up rolling around on the floor, in a street fight. Especially, if there is the potential of more than one opponent being involved. Most of all, neither prepares you for the phycological impact of being in a violent situation. It's this aspect of combat, which is rarely talked about. Learning to manipulated the situation to one’s own advantage. This is an art in itself! One must learn to use fear as a weapon, & not become a victim of it.
From martial art films, people want to emulate the actor if they have to save their life by copying what they have seen on film, boxers have never done that after watching Rocky. In relation to the belt's confirmation bias as to why they avoid real fighting seems to happen.
This kind of reminds me of other kinds of art. People look at skilled painters or singers and say things like you're so talented. I wish I was talented. Despite the fact that the artist got good though a very large amount of hard work. They want to be able to paint but won't even admit to themselves the issue is they won't put in the time. Instead choosing to believe it is a problem of talent rather than time, effort, attention to detail, hard work, and coaching..
You have a valid point, to learn to fight you need to fight but grappling on its own and BJJ is flawed too. MMA involves striking too so is better but doesn't consider weapons. What is needed is a multiple opponent with weapons mma cage sport. Then we'll have something but then you need all those base skills from traditional arts(good ones). Some groups do pressure test but how good is this testing? How often? But then you are going to be injured just like a lot of mma fighters. Interesting subject.
My muay Thai trainer had over 300 fights before the Khmer rouge and immigrating to the US and teach us his skills. No belts in Muay Thai or Khmer kickboxing haha!
When it comes to Black belts, I love to Cite my aikido teacher, who most likely cited his teacher: "If you realy want a Black belt, train so long until your white Belt becomes Black." We only used different Belt colors cause this what the german law asks if you are an offiziell Club. We as practicioners only Used white Belts or Hakama.
Because… Martial Arts are always taught with compromises built in, because we can’t train realistically without causing a lot of physical damage. (This is why we have so many doubles in HEMA, no fear of the blade) BJJ is fantastic in that it pressure tests, but it has a fatal flaw - it generally trains for sport. It should exclusively train for avoiding, surviving and escaping grappling. Because of concrete, knives and multiple opponents. If you find yourself on the ground, as adept as you might be there, you have made a terrible strategic mistake, and you damn well better know what to do to escape that. Belts are meaningless.
Kano was a genius with the very best of intentions, but his worst legacy is the belt system. Here's the problem: the belt tries to simultaneously signify several very different attributes. First, physical skill in applying the martial art against an opponent. Second, your depth of knowledge of the martial art. Of course, some people can have an equal grasp of both, but it's easy to imagine a top performing fighter who has laser-beam focus on only a handful of techniques, or a person with an encyclopaedic knowledge of the system but lacking the physical ability to put it into practice. And it could equally be argued that belt level can be taken as a sign of personal development, or coaching ability. How can one simple scale represent such disparate skills? Initially, the black belt was a sign of competence, not mastery, reportedly copied from childrens swimming lessons where kids who could swim out of their depth had a black ribbon tied round their waist. btw, it took BJJ till the 1960s to adopt a coloured belt system, prior to that everyone wore white belts apart from instructors.
One of my old instructors said a black belt is like passing your driving test. You know what all the buttons do. What the rules are and enough to make sure you don't hurt yourself or someone else. But your still a long way from being a driver. And years away from racing cars.
Your belt means what you want it to mean. I agree most blackbelts today suck. I quit martial arts as a young man because of that. Started boxing competively. Came back 5 years ago with someone that knows Martial arts for real. And I try to teach correctly myself.
As you say, lots of reasons to train, but there are no excuses for marketing training practices that don't foster real world fighting abilities as "Self Defence".
The only thing that makes you better at fighting is being in a fight ,sparring is the closest you will get ,you need to desensitize your self to violence and dissipate your adrenaline. ,if you don't You are fighting 2 people your opponent and yourself.also You need to learn how to take a strike and recover ,it's fking brutal. You are completely right 😀.
a black belt takes a long time to earn, especially in BJJ. If you didn't learn to fight in the process of earning it, it is YOUR fault. Karate can't teach you to fight, but it can show you some things to use in a fight. You have to be the fighter. No martial art will make you a fighter, nor a winner. That's on YOU. That said, some styles have more fight culture baked in than others. I wouldn't pick a fight with a 30 year old athlete who has been training in boxing 3x a week for the past 12 years, nor a wrestler who started at 10 and competed all through college. Learning to fight and getting good at it requires lots of fighting, which will come with humiliation and injury. Fighting is hard. Fighting is dangerous. Not everyone can be a good fighter, even if they try their hardest for a long time.
superhuman? no. put in some time and effort in something that is supposedly useful? sure go to the gym and spend a couple years on the bag, focus mitts, sparring. get a couple amateur fights in? you'll be better than you were. go to the gym and spend a few years wrestling, doing bjj, or playing judo? you'll be able to put people on the ground and hold them there better than the average untrained person so on for hitting them with a stick, poking them with a sword or knife, or shooting them while they're trying to shoot you. it isn't rocket science the way it was told to me in judo as a kid and in other stuff later is that a black belt meant you were good enough at the basic curriculum to maintain your own training in it and to pass on the fundamentals. assistant coach level stuff. and that's not at all unreasonable five or six years of solid training in.
Like most competitive sport, it's a filter. It's NOT that martial arts make you faster, stronger, more agile, inherently better at fighting, but that people who are faster, stronger, more agile, inherently better at fighting succeed at martial art.
Ya but does anyone really fight anymore. I’ve been waiting forever and never been attacked.are all these year’s training just kinda a waste of time. If I was worried about self defense I would carry a gun. I’m doing this for fun to meet folks and learn cool moves. I actually love it but it’s more fun to compete with other players than pretend I will actually need it out there in the mean world
I guess you never really went to a karate school in Jersey City, New Jersey. You would not be talking to them like that and I am sure you will change your mind very quickly
You got fair point took me 7 years to get black belt in karste and you kids 10 yearswith black belts problem theres not enough good ksrate schools lwas blessed to have agreat teacher and that what made memad so many bad karate schools handed out black beits that have no hope in the street put my teacher and school was good school
A Karate guy once told me that having a black belt meant that you were a serious beginner.
yh now you can learn to fight
That's how we were trained. Black belt was your beginning.
He was correct. It is entry level to the training
It means you are becoming a man in that art. My understanding is that "Dan" means man in this context so first Dan is the beginning of being a man on that journey.
Same, I was told something similar when I first began training, and I didn't understand at the time. Now that I'm currently about to earn my black belt after 10 years, I understand a bit more. It's just the very beginning of the art by that point, and you begin to see more of what it can be, even though you don't yet fully know what that is.
Like the Socratic Paradox, "I know that I know nothing", A black belt is just someone who knows enough to see how little he knows
One of my students asked me about my black belt in BJJ and if I felt it meant I knew every technique and that I've achieved some mastery over the art. My response was that my only mastery was that I now knew what I didn't know. I know my take-down game is crap and I know my striking is non-existent. So I am now training in boxing/kickboxing and when I get the time I will drop into a judo club. A black belt is like being a white belt all over again except knowing how to pay attention to the details.
Yes, it's very much just another level on the journey.
Whilst I agree with the gist of your video, it's only in the western world that the black belt is held in such high regard. Getting a black belt really only means that one is no longer a beginner. It was never a symbol of mastery. Unfortunately, many western systems make a big deal out of it (BJJ certainly does) instead of viewing it as the beginning of a deeper level of study. I hope that you feel better soon. Me and mine all had covid last year and it's a bugger.
Thank you, it has certainly sucked that's for sure.
Your implication about BJJ black belts sounds a little off. It sounds like you're saying BJJ players make a big deal out of traditional eastern martial arts black belts, when a black belt in BJJ is notoriously different. Tae Kwon Do black belts are the rough equivalent of BJJ blue belts; it can be earned in a few years. BJJ black belts typically take 10-15 yrs to earn. So yeah, it's a much bigger deal, because yes, by the time you're a BJJ black belt, you really have achieved a level of mastery, not just competency
I was taught that a black belt means you are a serious student.
@@liesareparadox1892 depends on the martial art, but I suppose you could say that for any of them, since all fresh bb's say the same thing: "there's so much I need to learn!" I do think there's a pretty noticeable difference in mastery, though, between someone who's practiced a fairly closed system for three years vs someone who practices an open system for 10+
@@patrickmcinerney9491 I think maybe I didn't explain my point properly. I agree 100% re BJJ black belts taking longer and I agree that a BJJ black belt IS a master. My point is, that the 1st black belt (in Japan, where the belt system came from) was never a master's belt, whereas in BJJ it is.
Shodan; It's in the name: first step. It only means that you've reached a sufficient level to actually now start learning. You have reached legitimate beginner. Most people do unfortunately suffer from shodan-itus when they first get their grade, which can generally be dispelled over time by training with more advanced people. This is why in the koryu world people below shodan generally can only learn omote (outer) teachings. The art I practice is even more selective as you must wait until nidan before you can start to learn the heart of the system.
Get well soon and hope your family are doing well. As a Boxer and Karateka practioner, its always good to train and expand your martial arts outside of your comfort zone, not just sticking to 1 style. Learning is a never-ending story my friend!!
Isn't it just!
Well said. I've dabbled in martial arts for a while. I was serious about Tae Kwon Do when I was a younger man serving in the Army in the 1980s. What I noticed at the local Dojang was a weird hierarchy. There were Korean-American kids for which Tae Kwon do was like little league. All were expected to participate, some were unmotivated but forced to go for culture's sake, many would advance to Black Belt eventually, and they were all of mixed quality depending on their motivation level. Then there were the mostly white middle-class adults or even families (average white people) who took the lessons for "self-defense" or fitness or fun, tested periodically, and moved from belt to belt eventually reaching black belt. But it was a "pay as you go" system and most of them were terrible at sparring. Then there were a few like me -- military or law enforcement types who were young adults, very physically fit and strong, but not particularly skilled. Yet our aggression and strength meant we could beat most of the people in the first two categories despite not being "black belts." Finally there was the fourth group, Korean visitors from South Korea who came for tournaments, to serve as judges, or put on exhibitions. They were the "real" black belts, often with multiple degree black belts (and sometimes another martial art on their resume). There were generally not allowed to spar the Korean-Americans or the "average white people" but were sometimes teamed up against blundering military types like me to put us in our place or challenge us to take Tae Kwon Do seriously and not be misled by the unintimidating black belts in the Dojang general population. Yeah, those guys were hardcore and I was humbled a couple times at their hands. Bottom Line: The black belt can mean everything or nothing. All depends on the fighter. I can't speak for all the martial arts but for the average commercial Dojo, I suspect it's much the same.
I just started bjj and as someone who's done a mixture of powerlifting and weightlifting for the last 5 years I find the only way people can submit me is if I move into a position or I let someone move into a position cause I'm trying to get a feel for the sport, like sure I could just hold both their wrists and sit there for 5 minutes but I just don't see the point, I'm not even the biggest person there at 5'9 89kg which is amusing seeing as there's a gross strength disparity
The first martial art I did outside my home (our father trained us to box and I taught myself judo to defend myself from my bigger and stronger older brothers) was karate, Goju-ryu karate, and our sensei was an Englishman who also worked as a bouncer.
I was only 11 then, and one night I said to him, 'Sensei, because you're a black belt, you must be able to beat any street fighter, right?'
And he said, 'No! Not at all. There's a lot of really good fighters who never formally trained in anything. A black belt doesn't tell you whether a person can really fight in real conditions.'
That's certainly true of karate
Reminds me of what Mick Coup said. Paraphrasing: "I've realised I trained in all these skills and still can't beat anyone, and yet here's old 'Big John' in the pub, smashing everyone's faces in, no training whatsoever, what does he have what I don't? - tenacity. He's probably got martial skills, but doesn't know what they're called, but he has the condition of mind".
It just means you've mastered the basics. That's all a blackbelt means.
@@adamclark1972uk He COULD scrap really well, but that's probably as much or more to do with his upbringing in Brummagem 🤣
I was with you for the 1st half of the video. Mcdojos = bad.
However, you lost me at the 2nd half of the video when you claimed "striking = bad, grappling = good".
To be a complete martial artist, you need BOTH striking & grappling.
Mind you, there are too many delusional BJJ guys drinking the kool-aid who think they can fight without ever throwing a punch. They get a rude wake-up call when they step into the octagon, or just spar MMA rules at 50%.
I think you misrepresent me when you say I think striking is bad. I think that if you put striking against grappling then grappling will win, but I fully accept striking has it's place, and the combination of the two is by far the best option.
However most striking in martial arts is worse than useless.
@@EnglishMartialArts To be fair, there's grappling that's worse than useless too. Just look at aikido...
Have to say your last comment about finding a grappling gym really neglects kyokushin. Yes I will keep commenting about it here, but most kyokushin instructors have serious competition experience, going the distance across regional and international tournaments. It’s not about finding a “grappling” martial art but finding martial arts classes offered by people who know what it’s like to compete in arts where a knockout/submission/etc is considered a win rather than a foul.
Jokes on you, my black belt can't suck if I don't have one.
Potential suckage?
@@EnglishMartialArts I have done a bit of taekwondo growing up and a bit of karate in college but never got to the higher belts. I only have a couple of years of hema under my belt. Judge me as you see fit.
You need to sweat buckets, you need to have bruises, sore muscles, and sometimes you need to bleed. It’s just red sweat! Glad you’re back Oz! Hope you’re feeling better!
Thank you! "Red sweat" I like that.
You know there’s actually a lot of kyokushin schools in the UK. And a good few of their senseis have experience from the the open weight tournaments in the 80s and 90s. Also it’s funny as Andy Hug was once demolished by a British white belt called Trevor Marriott… funny how it works
Another thing is that one of my friends who was a Shodan in JKA said he only started having the real training and fighting after reaching dan grades he would sometimes spend whole sessions fighting non stop and that before that it was all safe and point focused.
Sorry to hear about the Covid :( Hope you make a full recovery :)
Thank you.
I received my first degree (shodan) blackbelt in judo last year, being involved in the sport and martial art for over 14 years now. It was one of the biggest achievements of my life. But, as they say in judo (and likely other martial arts), the blackbelt is "just the beginning", and I completely agree. While I do help to teach judo to children, teenagers and adults, I do not know everything, I make mistakes, and I am constantly learning new, or better ways to do things.
I know judo can be potentially effective in competitive combat sports like mixed martial arts (MMA), UFC and can transition fairy well across to Brazilian jiu-jitsu (BJJ), but I am not sure how effective judo could be in a self-defence "street fight" application. I originally started judo to learn "self-defence" but in the last 14 years, I have never found myself in a hostile confrontation where self-defence was required.
Martial arts can sometimes provide a rather false sense of security and confidence within people... I knew one gentleman, who was if I am being honest, a bit out of shape, who had done wing chun kung fu for less than 12 months, and he was convinced that he could beat combat sports athletes, like MMA/UFC fighters. I knew another gentleman who trained in a 'white crane' kung fu or something, and he also believed the same thing.
When it comes to "effective" martial arts, I believe the ones that emphasis sparring, as well as cardiovascular conditioning, are probably the most effective... judo, BJJ, MMA, boxing, kick boxing, muay thai, to name a few.
I use pepper spray.Karate is usless and a huge waste of money.
@@jamiesmith1162 - Some countries prohibit the use and carrying of pepper spray devices, for better or worse.
I wouldn't say that karate is a "huge waste of money", but I suppose such a statement is subjective and really, it comes down to the individual. Some people may undertake martial arts training for reasons that are not self-defence. This could be enjoyment for the actual art itself, a form of physical exercise, a social atmosphere etc.
Furthermore, it also comes down to the environment of the dojo and club itself. If you go to a karate club where the instructor(s) are mean and unpleasant, and people are for some reason attending but not enjoying it, there's a good chance that you won't enjoy it either. In my opinion, there is no point doing something that you do not enjoy.
Not to go off-topic, but I just want to clarify something about some martial arts instructors being "mean and unpleasant". It has nothing to do with "discipline", it's just arrogance and projecting insecurities. Respect is indeed an important element in martial arts, but it is a two way street.
Reminds me of what a manger at marital arts gym told me iron sharpens iron. I did a aikido for about 6 years and never losing does seem to have a profound negative impact on most. I've only done bjj for 2 years and most people seem a lot more humble
5:28
That certainly stands true in many places. My teacher's teacher's school is constantly looking for new students, and only has a small handful of those that stay and really learn further. Yet what he teaches is extremely effective, testable and replicable, all the hallmarks of good martial arts techniques.
But, it requires some hard work to get them down. I recently visited his dojo, and his classes are indeed tough, (Quite a bit more aerobic and exhausting than my own dojos classes, I have to admit and be real), so I can see why someone would be scared off. It's still a shame to see so many people try, and then choose someplace else
I pretty much agree with what you are saying. When I started the martial arts way back in the day, it was very unusual to see a black belt other than the head instructor. When another black belt showed up, we were awestruck. Now they are giving black belts away in exchange for time and money regardless of actual ability or age. Now I rarely wear my black belt. Why, because my training and teaching is fighting centric. as in MMA. I do striking, grappling, and both.
I feel your pain, a student at my day job (teacher) gave me Covid as a going on break gift. Feel better Oz!
My 30 year journey as a student of the arts has been one of finding what works for me and discarding what doesn't. I've never worn a gi or a belt in that time. I've had opportunities to do so, but prefer my informal approach. Get well soon!
If it works, it works.
I would've thought it's quite hard to find new things without trying new things.
You’ve hit upon one of my biggest frustrations with the martial arts (And many people’s perception of them.) I agree with all you say here and more.
Too many who didn’t learn properly from people who didn’t teach them properly…then failing to properly teach others who already have unrealistic expectations - and downgrading contact & intensity to maintain mat fees.
i trained like you said in the video. my teacher said the best way to learn is through sparring, getting hit and learning how to not get hit. i sparred against him (2nd degree black belt in TKD) and i improved leaps and bounds in that year. not only that but my pain tolerance went through the roof during that year.
that was about 30 or so years ago. i do miss those days.
You’re right and yet also wrong. Many successful karate practitioners in MMA. Jiu Jitsu has been countered forcing more standup fighting related to the content taught by karate.
The main problem American karate evolved to have is lack of pressure testing. They’ve made it easy for people who can’t handle pressure so they could make more money.
Also, I’ve gone into many BJJ gyms that were just as clueless - cause they’ve gone the same way as karate.
And, the Gracie’s have been challenged and beaten by many, including fighters in Japan that have the original arts.
That was a seriously sexy-voice 'Fight-Team' at the end there! I hope your recovery is swift and complete!
Yeah, not all the effects of Covid are bad! 😂
Most of my active training these days is in swordsmanship, but I trained for years in Hapkido. We had a few Tae Kwan Do students who joined ... and I hated sparring them. Sparring was always done hard, but the TKD crowd always seemed to want to really clobber you, going for a concussive KO. Almost made me quit a few times, as I felt like I was so worried about getting seriously hurt that I wasn't able to learn from the moment. It did not help that one or two of them seemed to hold the attitude of the jock-like cocky fighter.
Until one day I was being backed up by a serise of spinning kicks and finally dropped down, stopping my opponent's advance with a counter attack that, in a fair fight, would be considered a "low blow."
It did push me until I could act cognitively under pressure, something I have been working to foster since then.
Oh, and FIGHT TEAM!
I agree with almost everything u said, i might just add that even though the mindsets u talked about are the most common in bjj newbies i came in wiht "i gonna get beaten the fuck up let's try to see how long till not anymore" that mindset holds true for me still as i am only a few mohnts in but i alredz feel more confident in my abilities. I got that mindset trough people like u and ohter bjj/fighting RUclipsr and i am thankful for that. (Please excuse every gramatical errors english isn't my native language)
Always a difficult one here. In my opinion there are many issues or things that are being tared with the same brush. I've seen excellent karate schools and terrible ones, excellent bjj schools and terrible ones... different arts and sports can suit different people physically and mentally. Selected training can be nothing to do with sport or art all together like self protection. It's personal preference combined with ability. I was indoctrinated into martial arts by a very commercial karate style and club but I loved it and did well. I explored other arts and realised there were many gaps in my knowledge but that foundation gave me a very good platform to build onto. I have stood on my own two feet with MMA champs and bjj black belts from my mcdojo roots, yes I would have failed miserably if I did not cross train. It's a nice video mate but I suspect the onion layers are numerous here and your holding back. Belts were always a marketing ploy for student retention hence catch wrestling the same as self protection doesn't have any real sticking power for "most people" it's hard as hell and you don't get any acknowledgement of skill level other than real fights. Where as bjj on the other hand you can never have any competitive action but still progress up the shiny ranks. I've interviewed hundreds of fighters, teachers and school owners and they all say the same thing....master 2-3 things and be the best at that. Be that a straight right, an arm bar or a spinning back kick. learn to dish them out from all positions. If someone grabs you why did you let that happen? If they punch you why didn't you get the takedown first? Belts don't mean shit. Principles over method .😜
I think you may have discovered that my clickbait doesn't stand up to proper scrutiny... 😂
I have some belts mate and I agree with you. 😁
@@EnglishMartialArts 🤣🤣
You win or you learn. Been rolling for a couple of months now, loving it, though initially I never thought I would.
Learn or die 🤣
I'm glad you started rolling, its rarely a mistake!
Your videography has gotten so e real game! I've been hitting your back catalog lately, and the improvement is markable! Heck, even last year's videos aren't to this standard.
Fight team
Thank you. I made a real effort to improve it as I could see my content was pretty poor quality. It's a long process of learning though, just like fighting!
One thing I've learned over the years is that the first half of the various belt system is focused about learning the kinetic movements and techniques. The second half of the belt system is about learning how the system and philosophy behind said techniques operates.
As Always: Fight Team
Glad to hear you're feeling better after being sick!
Thank you!
Glad to see you back and glad to hear you are feeling better.
Thank you!
Glad you feel better! Great content as always.
In Japan, Dan (black belt) just shows seniority. If an otherwise renown figure (say, an elderly manager of a big corporation or a public official) starts a martial art, they will likely be given a black belt straight away even though they can’t even tie that belt. (This might be depend on a dojo and region, and it’s prob more likely to occur in aikido and karate than say, judo, but just my assumption). There’s a highly hierarchical culture, where seniority comes before everything else, for you.
In that sense studying aikido as a young kid was highly educating: I didn’t learn to fight, but I did learn that just because someone is older than you or ”a master”, it doesn’t mean they know jack shit about anything.
And then sometimes it does. We had 50-something old ’sensei’ whose technique was weirdly better than anybody else’s and he seemed impossibly strong - guy had competed as judoka and was a judo black belt. Never understood why he seemed so strong and good (is this some ki-shit or what?) until I started BJJ as an adult and rolled with a high level blue belt. I instantly remembered that feeling as if I had been gripped in a steel vise. The guy was smaller and lighter than me, who at that point had boxed and power lifted for years, but he basically walked all over me with ease. I was immediately like ”oh that’s what it is!!” And this guy was just a beginner.
So the supernatural ki-power that makes you able to beat bigger and stronger people is… Grappling. Just a huge amounts of grappling, period. And when your body is ripped to apart and you live in constant pain, hopefully somebody gives you a brown or black belt so that you can retire to teaching classes.
No belts in muay thai, no belts in wrestling, no belts in boxing, the irony
I think you are 100% correct in everything you have said, I am an ITF taekwondo black belt and on my journey to achieving this I had to move from one country to another, prior to achieving my black belt I used to compete quite often and I always enjoyed sparring with the black belts in my old training place as they pushed me to improve, when I moved to a much larger city there were multiple places that did my style of TKD and I tried one out and was instantly shocked to see black belts my age unable to move as well I do (at the time I was a red stripe so 3 belts away or ''tests'' away from black belt), spent a couple of weeks and found out that the instructor doesn't really care about competing and it is an individual thing that if you wish to do you can go ahead and do alone and I think that such a thing should be clearly stated on their website, I was lucky enough to find a different place a lot more similar to my older place. my take is not every black belt you meet is the same and you must always respect when someone is a black belt even if they don't compete they have put in the hours and are probably knowledgeable to a certain extent on the martial art they are doing, some martial arts have tough requirements for black belts for a reason because it should not be something that anyone can just spend time and achieve it should be tough and should feel great when you get that belt tied around your waist because you worked so hard for it, and not just paid for it, I believe a good indicator is competitions, win or loose a colored belt who has competed will always be better than a black belt in the same martial art who never competed and just did his normal training
Spot on! Great video and thank you for sharing with us. Hoping you get well soon.
Thank you!
i think the point you make is partial, if "total effectiveness" is the aim, like in a hollywood movie, shall we say a "complete fighting curriculum", grappling while being crucial can't be the only skillset to be sought after.
Also speaking of black belts in this regard is going off the mark, correlation is not causation, there's plenty of good black belts in bjj, judo, karate et cetera, while you can find bad ones for each of the practices you listed and beyond.
What imo matters most is how it's done: pushing oneself, sweating, sparring/rolling light and hard, working all ranges from long range striking to ground grappling to underhanded strikes, dirty boxing and such, and finally working also the contexts of the fight, so sparring or training in everyday clothes or with the gear you'll wear during a competition, learning how to use the environment and yours or the other's clothes to your advantage, how to use objects as weapons and weapons as... well, weapons. ofc it's unrealistic to master everything, but if we speak in absolutes this should be it
It is just feasible that I may be deliberately ignoring nuance to create a more clickbaity video...
Good stuff. Could not agree more with this. I’m a 48 year old, BJJ three stripe white belt who’s been getting his arse kicked on a regular basis, and is thankful for it. Practiced Shotokan as a kid, then Krav Maga for 5 years as an adult (some years ago now) but nothing has taught me how to fight more than Jiu Jitsu has. And I’m shit at it. 😂 Love these vids man, thank you.
covid utterly kicked my butt for over a year. hope you are are on the mend and make a full recovery soon
Thank you!
Once again lad you are on point. In my day we cared not jot for strophes, sashes, and other empty symbols. We cared only for effectiveness in combat, then application for sports. And we seemed to do quite well. Of course I am a bit of an antiquarian. However I am sticking to my opinion. God bless you lad and your lovely family.👊👍🙏
First of all I'm glad to see you well enough to make vids again. I've had covid 3 times and it sucks hard.
As for the video I agree, but it def shouldn't be this way. In theory someone who has trained an actual martial art (BJJ, Judo, Muay Thai, wrestling etc) long enough to be a black belt (even though some don't have belts) they should be able to thoroughly kick the untrained persons ass. One of the main issues with this are McDojos and belt factories. We are even starting to see it in REAL martial arts like Jiu-jitsu. People getting black belts after less than 10 years because they paid a lot for private lessons and won a competition.
Well as someone who has trained for over 50 years, and having been involved everything from hard core schools to McDojo's I will say that most of what you said is true. Since I earned my first Black Belt while living in Japan in the 70's in Kodokan Judo I would suggest that not all Black Belts are equal. Some are actually valid. Remember Kano created the belt system so that fighters could compete with others fairly with equivalent knowledge and skiils. A Black Belt just meant you were a practitioner of the art, not that you were a master.
I'm currently training in a solidly average 3K dojo, with the goal to get a black belt. What I want this belt to do for me is open up social avenues with other serious practitioners, as well as being able to train how I like in my chosen art. I'm a bit of a wreck after the Covid years (chronic pulmonary lung disease exacerbated by getting Covid), so I need to do the damn reps to get back into shape and there's always more to learn, but I make no illusions about what a black belt actually means. It's worth what I put into getting it, and it's a social badge to get to have a turn of speaking at a table of peers.
I love those brutally honest videos!
I agree almost entirely, and it is a bit sad that many folks' perception of a black belt is that. The "average" martial artist will never actually fight, and likely has no desire to regardless of what they tell themselves. I spar and wrestle in earnest semi-regularly, but I would still not claim that I've ever actually -fought- in my adult life. For many folks, a black belt is seen only as an achievement of training rather than a certificate of fighting ability, and I think that's okay, personally. Especially if that training is under mindful instructors and a good school in whatever you're training. No color belt, however, will ever be an indicator of how well one can actually fight, imho. Fight Team!
Also: glad you're back and recovering! I also got COVID for the first time in the last month.
I was very disappointed to.find I wasn't magically immune... Hope you're OK!
My students are expected to be capable fighters by 1st black belt. By 3rd I expect them to be able to dismantle someone in seconds. I don’t keep many students, not many people want real karate anymore.
I trained karate for seven years and got to brown belt. I transitioned into boxing and it humbled me quickly. However I don’t regret training karate and it still has given me skills I still use
So I've earn two black belts thus far, and what they have both convinced me of, is I suck at fighting and am very vulnerable. Granted I suck less than I did before and am slightly less vulnerable, but am still a rank amateur. Got loads more work to do.
The best is Defendu gutter fighting of WWII boxing, wrestling, Savate, Jujutsu, Judo and street fighting, used by the OSS and others US Army taught that called Combatives till the 2000's
I’m from a Thai boxing background.
I realise now that if you can’t grapple in some sort of way you can’t fight .
Training is extremely difficult and exhausting. But hopefully I’ll eventually improve 🤞.
It seems to me just absurd that in all sports there is a widely accepted principle by which you do well in competition if you train in competition-like conditions. But that apparently and for some mysterious reason does not stand for fighting! If you want to be good at fighting you need to fight (and the closest and safest to that would be sparring)
Great to see you back! You see this in mcdojos so much, either making people have false confidence or just to take there money. Allot of bad teachers are the thing and not the belts really but not to say there arent some with belts they didnt deserve. Just watch karate combat to see that, masters of hitting pads but not fighting
You are abolutely right ! Stay safe and strong ! :) And get well soon ! :)
This is very true. I trained myself in martial arts for years. I fought my first fight at 23 and was destroying people. The third guy i fought lost by tko, but received a black belt after the fight. I thought it was odd. Everyone i knew and fought around said i should train people. I tried. One guy stuck with it, out of the 13 people i tried training. He went from 520lbs to 210 lbs. He could do splits at 450lbs. All the others thought it was too hard. Usually they never came back after the first session.
I told one guy to throw a kick at me, i wanted to demenstrate the importance of shin hardening, he threw as hard as he could and all i did was check it. He ended up fracturing his shin. And blamed me. Im sorry, but if you go for training and someone tells you to throw a punch or kick, would you go all out your first time? I really dont know the answer. I figured people would have common sense. Needless to say, he got mad and started cussing.. so i told him to leave and not return.
Was i in the right or wrong? Plus, i still wonder if im worthy to train people. I actually stopped back in 2018. Now i just train myself and kids. I stopped fighting after receiving a championship in kickboxing through Stand Up Warriors in Indiana. It wasnt that i stopped liking to fight, but my ex wife had a miscarriage and nearly died in the hospital. I just havent had the want to compete since.
I could listen to you all day. You have a very hypnotic timbre, just so i almost believe what you said there... 🤣😂 just joking. The advantage from a martial art to a martial sport is that you have all those nice techniques that are prohibited in sports, like eye jabs, knee and groin kicks, chopping the windpipe and what have you. Downside is, you can never ever train all this stuff like you should, to make it work. And vice versa, in sports, you are likely to not use the good stuff, bcs you never train it. But what you use you have already developed against an resisting opponent under various degrees of stress, so it's more likely to make an impact that is rembered from the other guy. To me, i rather train with rules and when things go sideways, i think street. Worked good for me in two decades as a bouncer, in a time when bouncing was a rough job.
Same goes for technique vs strength. Yes, i have seen some very good technique that has beaten bigger stronger men. But far more often, i saw it the other way, a big strong man beating the shit out of a martial artist, sorry guys, that's just what i've seen in my practice. How many knowledge of techniques has a pitbull? You would'nt want to fight one, just because you know your armbars. Or try to drown a cat or choke it (well, not really. Don't do that). You have the better techniques AND be much stronger than a 10lbs house cat, but you will not succeed, i tell ya. So it's most of all mindset (don't be a victim), and then comes strength and techniques. That is my bias, and i highly reckommend it. Greetings from Vienna.
When I made 1st Dan, my master congratulated me for learning the alphabet and told me it was now time to start learning how to spell words.
I did karate for 3 years and got a brown belt, however pretty quickly I learned I wasn’t a particularly effective fighter, so I started boxing and Muay Thai and tried to focus on learning grappling at an MMA club. In 3 months of mma training I was definitely better at actual fighting than 3 years of karate. Some of the kicks, stances and techniques are of use, and can be Incorporated nicely into mma, but it was largely ceremonial and contrived. I also feel if you took a samurai warrior from the past and showed them modern karate, they’d laugh.
Correct. Very correct. But you fergot to explain that "the graiding", "the small pain" is also lots of fun. And, talking about ego, i desagree, u can take your ego to the Jiu-jitsu mat. No prob. In a short time, the ego, will balace. If too much jiujitsu reduces it, if too litle jiujitsu increses it. I hope that what i wrote is more or less in english ;) sorry.
In Japan the BB originally just meant that you had mastered the basics, it wasn’t until 5 degree bb I believe that you are a Master.
More wise words, thank you!
You're right. I have been on both sides of the beatings.
FIGHT TEAM!
First off I think your right, I haven't got a black belt, and I am bigger and stronger than any of the BJJ blackbelt coaches, the fact that I still get tapped in almost every round and can't tap them speaks volumes for the standard of BJJ Blackbelts. My belt also holds up very well vs lower grades. That's what's good about the BJJ belt system , it actually equates to ability.
The other Art I do is Ninjutsu, and its a bit of an odd one, the different Kyu belts do not represent ability as far as I can tell, they seem to be purely based on other factors which are hard to divine and it isn't knowledge and understanding, and it isn't a scaled representation of actual fighting ability either, maybe its progress or time in the system, but that's probably not it either. In any case the blackbelts seem legit at this particular club but I bet there are exceptions if we look at clubs outside this branch of Ninjutsu. It certainly a good add on to the BJJ for that extra bit of Traditional Jiu Jitsu training.
@andymax1 I've trained with plenty of ninjutsu blackbelts who couldn't do a thing against an opponent who wasn't fully compliant. One or two who could, but I'm not sure actual fighting ability is standard in most of that set of arts.
@@EnglishMartialArts Well I’ve seen those clubs as well, they wouldn’t be my top pick for extra training at either.
Your 100% correct! I'm that guy trying not to get chocked out right before the buzzer, so I must be getting better!!🤣
You and me both!
@@EnglishMartialArts FWIW: Very much enjoy you segments on the MA's. On target commentary mixed in with good humor and attitude!
I'm going to start ButtKickers Inc, we will mark ranks by face tattoos and B.O..... It's totally legit, honest....
You'll probably do well!
it´s like pepole that goes to the gym in the begining of the year. they kind of figure out that. it´s not that easy and most drops of.
The standard has steadily dropped since the 1970s . It now feels like wherever you go there are very young people graded very highly who can’t fight. This is depressingly true of the style I studied in the 1980s. I was shocked when I went back to it a few years ago that there were people who are graded as above black belt couldn’t fight. When I took my black belt or rather in the preparation for it my instructor who was an extremely good fighter told me if you couldn’t handle three untrained people in a street in altercation, then you weren’t a black belt. Nowadays, quite honestly, nothing surprises me about the black belts out there. However I remember being totally amazed in the 1990s by what brown belt could do. This is why mixed martial arts and grappling are so important. They don’t allow you to hide behind, fancy, footwork or a long reach These arts put great emphasis on physicality, which is absolutely vital in any fight or altercation.
👏🏻 I agree that’s why I don’t like the turn Martial Artist, I found that the People/ Blackbelts who called themselves Martial Artists wouldn’t or more likely couldn’t Fight even the Karate Nerd admits a BlackBelt means nothing except in your Dojo
Every physical confrontation I have ever been was ended by me being bigger than most and strangling the other person or beating them in the nuts. There is no grace in a fight its who is tougher, and who is willing to gouge out the eyes of the other while crushing testicles.
That would mean that women have an advantage
Size and strength certainly make a big difference.
I thought I could fight, went to my first Jiu jitsu class in 2018. I just got beaten up for a solid year. Am still training and still getting beat up on a regular basis. 🙂👍💪
It depends if the school you go to pressure test what you learn. If there's no pressure testing on the behalf of the school through either sparring, practicing on each other, flow drills or getting shanked with a fake knife to see if your knife tapping works (that last one is more specific to Eskrima), then it is useless. If the school you go to emphasizes on pressure testing of any kind then you'll be fine.
One of the founders of the Dog Brothers, in my opinion, said it best. It’s the idea of the tribe. It’s not about winning or losing, it’s about testing each other to make sure we are able to defend ourselves and our families. One member of the tribe is weak, then the tribe itself is weak. Your training partners aren’t doing you any favors if they are going easy on you, but, if they are going too hard to the point where you get injured and can’t train, they still aren’t doing you any favors.
You are correct. I've been given a blue belt in bjj twice.... Moved on and demoted myself back to white twice...... Still trying but I'm shit.
If by fighting you mean, a real-life situation, then neither a tradition fighting art, or MMA truly prepares you for that. What happens on the street is a world away from what happens on the matt, so to speak.
The main reason for this, is they are combat sports, & as such focus their attention, on single combat, with a view to winning medals & trophies. However, I agree that MMA fulfils a broader range of techniques, for it to be considered as a more complete fighting system. Although, before the Japanese got their hands on it, so was Karate at one stage in its history.
There is no focus on dealing with multiple attackers, or weapons for that matter. Even though it's an important aspect of fighting, to learn grappling. You certainly don't want to aim to end up rolling around on the floor, in a street fight. Especially, if there is the potential of more than one opponent being involved.
Most of all, neither prepares you for the phycological impact of being in a violent situation. It's this aspect of combat, which is rarely talked about. Learning to manipulated the situation to one’s own advantage. This is an art in itself!
One must learn to use fear as a weapon, & not become a victim of it.
There's a lot to unpack here. I suspect it may have to be a video...
From martial art films, people want to emulate the actor if they have to save their life by copying what they have seen on film, boxers have never done that after watching Rocky. In relation to the belt's confirmation bias as to why they avoid real fighting seems to happen.
This kind of reminds me of other kinds of art. People look at skilled painters or singers and say things like you're so talented. I wish I was talented. Despite the fact that the artist got good though a very large amount of hard work. They want to be able to paint but won't even admit to themselves the issue is they won't put in the time. Instead choosing to believe it is a problem of talent rather than time, effort, attention to detail, hard work, and coaching..
Thank you Nick Frost.
I can judge how out of shape I am based on the ratio of Nick Frost to Hugh Laurie comments I get... 😀
You have a valid point, to learn to fight you need to fight but grappling on its own and BJJ is flawed too. MMA involves striking too so is better but doesn't consider weapons. What is needed is a multiple opponent with weapons mma cage sport. Then we'll have something but then you need all those base skills from traditional arts(good ones). Some groups do pressure test but how good is this testing? How often? But then you are going to be injured just like a lot of mma fighters. Interesting subject.
There's no perfect path that's for sure. But a lot of folk use that as an excuse for not walking at all...
@@EnglishMartialArts well said sir
Why is there no black belt in pilates? :)
My muay Thai trainer had over 300 fights before the Khmer rouge and immigrating to the US and teach us his skills. No belts in Muay Thai or Khmer kickboxing haha!
When it comes to Black belts, I love to Cite my aikido teacher, who most likely cited his teacher:
"If you realy want a Black belt, train so long until your white Belt becomes Black."
We only used different Belt colors cause this what the german law asks if you are an offiziell Club. We as practicioners only Used white Belts or Hakama.
Yes, my first ever martial art was Aikido at a club where you were white or black. Nothing in between.
Because… Martial Arts are always taught with compromises built in, because we can’t train realistically without causing a lot of physical damage.
(This is why we have so many doubles in HEMA, no fear of the blade)
BJJ is fantastic in that it pressure tests, but it has a fatal flaw - it generally trains for sport.
It should exclusively train for avoiding, surviving and escaping grappling.
Because of concrete, knives and multiple opponents.
If you find yourself on the ground, as adept as you might be there, you have made a terrible strategic mistake, and you damn well better know what to do to escape that.
Belts are meaningless.
Kano was a genius with the very best of intentions, but his worst legacy is the belt system.
Here's the problem: the belt tries to simultaneously signify several very different attributes. First, physical skill in applying the martial art against an opponent. Second, your depth of knowledge of the martial art. Of course, some people can have an equal grasp of both, but it's easy to imagine a top performing fighter who has laser-beam focus on only a handful of techniques, or a person with an encyclopaedic knowledge of the system but lacking the physical ability to put it into practice. And it could equally be argued that belt level can be taken as a sign of personal development, or coaching ability. How can one simple scale represent such disparate skills?
Initially, the black belt was a sign of competence, not mastery, reportedly copied from childrens swimming lessons where kids who could swim out of their depth had a black ribbon tied round their waist. btw, it took BJJ till the 1960s to adopt a coloured belt system, prior to that everyone wore white belts apart from instructors.
One of my old instructors said a black belt is like passing your driving test. You know what all the buttons do. What the rules are and enough to make sure you don't hurt yourself or someone else. But your still a long way from being a driver. And years away from racing cars.
I like that!
Your belt means what you want it to mean. I agree most blackbelts today suck. I quit martial arts as a young man because of that. Started boxing competively. Came back 5 years ago with someone that knows Martial arts for real. And I try to teach correctly myself.
As you say, lots of reasons to train, but there are no excuses for marketing training practices that don't foster real world fighting abilities as "Self Defence".
The only thing that makes you better at fighting is being in a fight ,sparring is the closest you will get ,you need to desensitize your self to violence and dissipate your adrenaline. ,if you don't You are fighting 2 people your opponent and yourself.also You need to learn how to take a strike and recover ,it's fking brutal.
You are completely right 😀.
a black belt takes a long time to earn, especially in BJJ. If you didn't learn to fight in the process of earning it, it is YOUR fault. Karate can't teach you to fight, but it can show you some things to use in a fight. You have to be the fighter. No martial art will make you a fighter, nor a winner. That's on YOU. That said, some styles have more fight culture baked in than others. I wouldn't pick a fight with a 30 year old athlete who has been training in boxing 3x a week for the past 12 years, nor a wrestler who started at 10 and competed all through college. Learning to fight and getting good at it requires lots of fighting, which will come with humiliation and injury. Fighting is hard. Fighting is dangerous. Not everyone can be a good fighter, even if they try their hardest for a long time.
If you think Bjj will save you in street fight then you need to train it on the ground.
superhuman? no. put in some time and effort in something that is supposedly useful? sure
go to the gym and spend a couple years on the bag, focus mitts, sparring. get a couple amateur fights in? you'll be better than you were.
go to the gym and spend a few years wrestling, doing bjj, or playing judo? you'll be able to put people on the ground and hold them there better than the average untrained person
so on for hitting them with a stick, poking them with a sword or knife, or shooting them while they're trying to shoot you.
it isn't rocket science
the way it was told to me in judo as a kid and in other stuff later is that a black belt meant you were good enough at the basic curriculum to maintain your own training in it and to pass on the fundamentals. assistant coach level stuff. and that's not at all unreasonable five or six years of solid training in.
Yep, that's all very reasonable.
Makes sense
Thanks!
Like most competitive sport, it's a filter. It's NOT that martial arts make you faster, stronger, more agile, inherently better at fighting, but that people who are faster, stronger, more agile, inherently better at fighting succeed at martial art.
Ya but does anyone really fight anymore. I’ve been waiting forever and never been attacked.are all these year’s training just kinda a waste of time. If I was worried about self defense I would carry a gun. I’m doing this for fun to meet folks and learn cool moves. I actually love it but it’s more fun to compete with other players than pretend I will actually need it out there in the mean world
I guess you never really went to a karate school in Jersey City, New Jersey. You would not be talking to them like that and I am sure you will change your mind very quickly
Maybe, but I have 8 years of Shotokan, and more schools than I can remember behind me.
There’s plenty of BJJ black belts out there who can’t fight!
Some good insight
Thank you!
We don't do belts, I guess I'm good then.
You got fair point took me 7 years to get black belt in karste and you kids 10 yearswith black belts problem theres not enough good ksrate schools lwas blessed to have agreat teacher and that what made memad so many bad karate schools handed out black beits that have no hope in the street put my teacher and school was good school
Quality channel!!!!!!!
Thanks!
Great stuff✊