Open World Games are Overdone
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- Опубликовано: 9 июн 2022
- ORIGINAL VID BY RAZBUTEN ► • The Structure of Open-...
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Игры
You should have copyright claimed this guy for using your clip.
If Big A was teaching his wife this would never happen
Ah, the legend himself
Big brain EZ money glitch from the Raz himself
I was glad when I saw him watching one of your vids, keep it up! :)
Oh no
I don't think they're overdone, they just don't differ enough. "Open world" doesn't necessarily mean a huge world, it just means that you're free to explore whatever you want. The problem is that every game nowadays does the same type of open world game, which devalues the experience and makes it seem cheap.
I feel like a lot of mainstream gaming studios pump out open world over linear experiences these days. Also the idea of the "same type of open world" is interesting to me, Ghost, Horizon, and Red Dead are also vastly different landscapes and environments but in the end its like 90% trees, fields and you experience them by riding a horse. Idk what the solution is for the open world problem or maybe its just as simple as companies need to start making new linear games and lay off open world for a bit.
Open world games are only good when the graphics are so shit the modding community can actually put some content to play even after the game released. Cough bethesda games 💀
@@canadianguy7291 The major "unique" open world in my opinion is Cyberpunk 2077 with the huge and compact city landscape, but it is (or at least was) a buggy mess so it brought attention away from it's alternate atmosphere
@@dipflop5530 They've got the "crunch or crash" lifestyle on lock
This kind of counters your point, but I think if a lot more open world games did what elden ring does, they would be a lot better. Now of course they can give direction and a quest book for the main quest, but aside from that if they just filled the world with a ton of stuff, and didn’t tell you anything, I think that would make it a lot more enjoyable cause you won’t have a ton of stuff on your hud that is completely useless, and there will constantly be surprises and random encounters.
I think also a MASSIVE problem with open world games is the balance between main and side quests. Often times these open world games open up to these massive worlds offering you all these things to do, but the problem becomes if you start only doing side quests or in Atrioc case, start grinding money; you ruin the main quest experience. I had this with Ghost of Tsushima where I grinded side quests and other collectibles because I simply wanted to experience the world but then got way too strong for the main campaign and simply walked through it. A lot of these open world games fail to balance their open world aspects with difficulty and It basically turns into only playing the main story and then only playing the side quests.
It'd be interesting to have a game where only the main story content scaled with your character, but the sidequest content would have static difficulty (though maintaining immersion may be difficult)
@@Boxish leveling down mechanics is not something I new I needed so badly
Assassins Creed : Black Flag was able to balance the differentiation well by making side quests absolute dog shit. What I mean is that, there were optional side quests, but they were almost all dog shit follow and protect quests, while making the random encounters found at sea interactive quests between your waiting periods. The devs gave old AC fans what they wanted, they just made it so that there was no requirement or amazing reward for taking a specific.
That's the one thing I didn't like about Elden Ring.
I did the same thing for Elden ring and Zelda, i explored almost every single thing i could before even playing the history, every boss was ez because of that, but it's ok, the game it's not bad just because of that, the main story still being good asf
The generational gap being defined by your first Elder Scrolls game is great lmao
Yeah, that works, But with my age and generation, I have to use a longer series like final fantasy. 😁
Also the first Elder scrolls always being the greatest. Morrowind gen call Oblivion shit. Oblivion gen call Skyrim shit. Skyrim gen call Skyrim anniversary special edition (2021) shit
And Bethesda has pissed away all their good will by taking over a decade with no ES6 in sight. Skyrim is my favorite game of all time. Even though it has massive flaws, and is arguably not very good. It just hit me with the exact right stuff, the exact right world, and at the exact right time in my life.
@@enotsnavdier6867 did you forget that elder scrolls 6 was announced but Bethesda also has interest in a new IP
@@Comicsans1007 It was announced in 2018. It's 4 years later in 2022 and we still have no idea when it's coming out. Starfield was delayed to the first half of 2023, so the earliest that ES6 could come out is 2025. And even then, since Bethesda takes forever to make games it might not come out until 2026, or even 2027. I was 11 years old when I first played Skyrim, and there's a chance I could be 27 by the time ES6 is released.
I think Halo Infinite is a perfect example of a totally unnecessary open world. Halo's strong suit has always been linear campaigns with awesome setpieces. Making it open world just dilutes the experience so much. None of the side objectives were interesting. It also suffered from another issue with many modern single player games is the inclusion of an unnecessary skill tree. It just feels like a cheap way to insert a sense of progression. It would've been much better off as a more traditional halo game instead of trying to chase modern gaming trends.
They wasted so much money on the stupid open world. The game would be so much better without.
In oblivion everything also leveled up with you. I was so scared to level up as a kid fearing i would level up wrong, I finished the game at level 4 or something, sleeping only when I had to. all the way till the end of the game the portals were spawning the very basic enemies
Oblivions level scaling is so fucking bad man, the game kinda punishes you for leveling.
That's crazy.
That’s why optimal strats, oddly enough is to make your main skills the ones you have no intention on improving.
@@mitchelljohnson6106 oh no you don't need that. let them skills rise to the top. just neeever ever sleep
@@DreamingVoid Did you take the sign of the atronach? Lol, should've paid more attention when reading. That's your fault, not the game's.
I completely disagree with this critique of RDR2. The way RDR2’s world was constructed was for the sole purpose of being interrupted by small things that were kinda “meaningless”. It made the world feel more lived in and alive, not everything revolved around Arthur and the gangs lives because that’s not how the real world works. If you’re motivated by completing main quests and more linear storylines than that’s great, but it seems odd to criticize a game for the exploration elements, random adventures, and non linear storytelling when it was made for people who enjoy those exact things. One man’s trash is another man’s treasure.
Agreed. It's not so much as those elements are bad, it's the placement of those elements with no purpose. At least, no purpose other than to market it as "open world".
thats not the criticism at all you dope. God people will just hear whatever they want to
its comparing the open world design and contrasting it with the narrow confinements of the story missions. You people are so dense
@@Versace_sheets you just said the same thing they said but in different words. And now you think you're superior... bc you can consolidate words. Sure, get your comment points and go. Good job 👏.
The interruptions were cool but once you encounter then more than once, they lose their shine
I really liked the open world of LA Noir. It's true that there's nothing in the world between the scenes but that's the whole point. That's what it's like for a real detectives. Hours of driving through nothing to finally get to something important. It builds immersion and more importantly it builds suspense which is such an important aspect of the enjoyment of the game.
psycho take
@@CPUNoireAnimuPlacu lol some people feel that way fair enough. I think it's more that I don't need my brain to be constantly stimulated to have fun
That's bullshit. Now , I'm not saying it's bad that they don't have stuff to do. It's supposed to be a detective game so the world has a different purpose for sure. But saying that the world is good because there's nothing to do and that's what it's like for real detectives is crap. It doesn't increase immersion it creates tedium.
This is the same problem I have it Red dead. Realism is good upto a certain point. If you're going to make me fixing my cars part by part for an hour off race in a racing game because that's what happens irl , I'm never gonna play a shitty game like that.
dude said yes please waste my time LMAO humans are not a viable species
The problem with the excessive open world games of late is that the open worlds either don’t work with the game and the game feels linear in spite of the open worlds, or the open worlds aren’t created with exploration in mind (think pokemore legends arceus, where vast expanses are filled with nothing).
The best open world games have soul and substance hidden in every nook and this is hard to achieve (think Elden Ring, or Skyrim) and expensive and thus are usually either not viable or not PROFITABLE for corpos to invest in.
Also the world need to be hand crafted. Morrowind looks like AI generated terrain, if it werent for the cities the world would be shittiest one ever. Compare it to like Gothic and while You might not like the gameplay, You have to say that the map is beatiful
Skyrim isn't worth exploring, because at least in the past you'd lock yourself out of side tasks if you went somewhere before the task was given(I believe the golden claw is the task I remember locking myself from)
It can easily be solved with console commands, so there's that. As you mention Elden Ring and Skyrim, I assume you mean they have loot at locations, I don't see how this gives it substance. How is that exploring the world and not just seeking loot? May as well have a compass pointing to all loot nearby and fill the map-view with markers.
Doubt it's due to profit that the worlds are what they are, they seem good enough already. Sounds an awful lot like preference, I don't care much about exploring so I tend to play open world games' main storyline and if I'm not bored enough from the gameplay I may do side tasks. It's not an awful experience, it's just not designed for me.
Open world games are all still weird, because they're all designed for literally one person to do everything in them.
I'd rather have open worlds that have little in them than whatever garbage is in Elden Ring and slightly less so in Skyrim. You basically go from one spot to the next for some combat and loot. How is that any better than worlds where there probably isn't anything for you there? Why do open world games have to have activities all over the place for you to do, why can't it just be a world that the story happens to take place in? Maybe you will visit that one spot, maybe you never do. Do you have to visit that one spot? Is there some sort of disorder where every place have to be discovered or you'll become crazy?
I think the only game where discovering every area makes sense is Subnautica, only because much of the time you have no idea where you actually are. You'll probably place markers later into it and you can sort of know where you are at that point.
If someone makes a world where there is loot at every corner, it's probably too boring of a game to go through because it clearly has all that loot for something. It's like when an MP game has you going through the ranks to unlock crap, I guess that's what Elden Ring appeals to?
I don't want to spend 50 hours just so I can use that one gun I've wanted to use since I saw the trailer, but obviously I have to. If it's not story progression, I don't see the point, just seems like a way to drag out the game with crap.
@@Herkan97 You want GTA 3 style open world?
Also why are You so sure that Elden Ring world is filled with garbage? You litterally can play Elden Ring like You are talking about. You know Your task and You know where do You need to go and You can go there and not explore anything at all. The world does look empty if You are not looking for stuff and there is little thrown at You. But if You are looking around You will find areas that have enemies that You can fight. It is a fighting game after all.
Also what are You talking about. "You basically go from one spot to the next for some combat and loot. How is that any better than worlds where there probably isn't anything for you there? " These are action games/action RPGs, of course there will be combat and items involved. Are You playing shooter games and complain that there is shooting and would just prefer it to be empty corridor to next story point?
@@MindBlowerWTF chill out stop
Getting so offended by a guys opinion lol, this is why people dont play elden ring
Man I completely agree and honestly I feel like you used the perfect example in mentioning Pokémon legends arceus. So much of that world is just meaningless, it’s just space for the sake of being able to call itself open world
My least favorite thing about skryim is that all the quests take you on opposite sides of the map. If I take a quest in white run, the quest should be near white run, especially if it's a side quest. This makes fast travel almost necessary and takes away from the role play
My only real complaint was the same as atrioc. The characters leveling alongside you took away from the immersion and made it all feel pointless. having the enemies level with you, was a popular bit of fuckery/nonsense that many 2010ish games would try and pull. I modded it out of my game.
I know exactly what you are talking about. One of the first quests you get in Skyrim is to release the member of the Grey Mane family that is in a prison on the opposite side of the map far away from even the closest city you take a wagon to. It makes it even worse when those quests instill a bit of urgency like this one where you are trying to save someone that is being tortured with a bunch of other guys saying they’ll meet you there.
These kind of quests can be done correctly if there isn’t this urgency. But it needs some importance to not feel like a fetch quest.
@@thehucklebillyfenn I fucking loved travelling for quests like these. With some survival/needs mods it makes the way there somewhat memorable, if the quest on the end of the way is also somewhat memorable. Now if You have to travel like that for some "radiant" quest or some easy shit like kill a guy in isolated shack that You cant fuck up, then fuck this.
where it really does work is racing . the crew , forza horizon , midnight club la , burnout paradise .all of them feel much better with an open world area .
maybe it's a hot take but I kind of like how open world games are. I like cool linear main quests and I like having a cool world I can explore. sure it's kind of dumb and there are problems with it, but it seems like when people try to solve it they come up with even worse ideas that make all the cool atmospheric side content mandatory which sounds terrible. a lot of the side content works because I feel like doing it, I'd hate for my progression to be in any way tied to the fishing mini game. Sure I would appreciate more linear games, but when they do open world I'm honestly okay with the open world being optional I like the games in this genre.
Always a red flag for me when a trailer says something like „biggest open world ever, 3 times larger than the visible universe“.
The genius of Elden Ring is such that the map feels like it was the most compressed down version of itself that the amount of content allowed. That’s why you constantly discover new things. Everything is right next to each other. There’s no air bubbles.
Feel like this is pretty untrue lol. So many repeated bosses, cookie cutter imp/watchdog dungeons, large mostly empty overworld areas, etc. Elden Ring has fantastic stuff but there's a lot of C minus level stuff that I would say are certainly "air bubbles". Map could easily be like a third of the size and I would actually want to replay the game.
@@unstoppableawesome repeated bosses are the one thing that's stopping it from being the best it could possibly be
the edits in this video are really well done. It adds to what you are saying in a really awesome way. Hope this style sticks around
@@DreamingVoid u rite
Drake King Quack
This is why I loved Valheim. The skill level needed between the different areas was quite big. It wasn’t only that I got better weapons I also needed to get better.
We had avoided all information about the game prior so finding that first dark forest expoing all the cool new stuff and the finding weird magic monsters was so cool. Not to even talk about the giant troll. Every new item and recipe was interesting and fun.
Exploring new areas without knowing anything about them and preparing for a big fight against our first mosquito and getting team wiped. It was amazing.
how is velheim? I have like 0 clue what the game is about, just that a while ago that the internet went though a giant craze with velheim
While quests didn't require exploration in red dead, it was easily one of the best uses of open world mechanics. It used the expansive world for lore and world building, while teasingly saying "I mean ignore if you want to...pussy". Exploration only added to immersion, while not becoming a completionist requirement
ngl I disagree pretty hard for the sole reason that many side quests get locked off depending on ur main story progress. Only the 2nd and 3rd chapters really allow for good open worlding, and there's no warning that playing the main story will lock you out of a lot of side quests
Nothing was like wandering through the world running into those little Easter eggs from helping someone or getting jumped by bandits to getting drugged by that family at dinner.. such a amazing game
@@Anderslaw from what i remember the side missions dont get locked as you go on they get unlocked as you progress through the story so you can still do them in the epilogue
dude i got a fail state for not parking my wagon in the exact right spot in the map when i was requested to hide it. youre wrong
I once failed a mission because I tried to stealthily get into the building from the roof. Telling the player that they can only complete your mission in one way is the antithesis of open world design. Its outdated and you likely know nothing about game design
I feel too many games try to make it a feature for the game to attract more people instead of trying to integrate it as a piece of the core identity. Making it at least somewhat unique and giving more creativity to the incentive so you feel a natural want to explore opposed to making you explore to finish a game, Yes Atrioc!
this video for me hit that special part in my mind where I wasn't hearing anything new, but all my own thoughts were being repeated back to me in that oh so satisfying "yes, you are right" kind of way. Good takes Big A!
Rdr2 does have some things to find when you explore and the map is humongous. My favorite parts are when you get robbed by surprise
15:05 I miss the days when Minecraft updates weren't announced. You'd just get an update on some random Saturday and get a bunch of new content that you had to discover yourself, then on Monday you'd go to school and share your discoveries with friends.
Now there's a million youtube videos dissecting every part of the update weeks before it comes out. Bug patching through the community play testing patches is good and all, but I miss the sense of discovery that came with updates.
Imagine you discovered the deep dark on its own without prior knowledge of the update, or the secret rooms in the deep dark.
One of my favorite open world experiences was the skate games. Exploring the world trying to find cool trick opportunities.
I also enjoy the open world aspects of the hitman games and the base takeovers in far cry, where you can approach the objective how you want. Open worlds are great for replayability and immersion, and with better ai and procedural animations and quests, i believe they will only get better and more integrated with the gameplay.
Bro
This
Got COVID last year and downloaded backwards comp skate 3 and just chilled for a week. Literally one of the best game experiences in recent years.
Yeah skate’s strength is that the main enjoyment of the game IS the environment so it’s not just a generic open world game with a bunch of filler around you
Bro yes I feel like the hitman games really nailed how to do that style of game. The levels are so huge and open ended and you can play each level in so many different ways. The devs who did the newest hitman trilogy are actually doing a 007 game next which I’m super hyped for. I feel like they are the perfect team to make a new James Bond game. I’m hoping each mission will be open minded like it is in hitman but just more emphasis on super spy type stuff like all the wacky gadgets
I want more “hardcore” open world games. And what I mean by that is that there are no waypoints or map markers. You have to use something like a compass, signs and local npc’s to find your way around the world.
First, consider that Elden Ring does this. However, I assume you mean an open-world game where there are more interactable npc's that is more story driven, like if a game like Skyrim had the same storyline with no quest markers.
I think the problem is it would quick get boring for *most* players and wouldn't be worth the dozens or hundreds of millions of dollars to develop because it would target such a niche market. Also it would be really hard to know if the clues were good enough for regular players to follow until release, and it would be very expensive (and time-consuming) to do an iterative cycle of clue development and testing where the entire dialogue or clues got updated every time they weren't good enough. That said, I agree that if it could be pulled off, it would be awesome.
Assassins creed odyssey has that option and it’s miserable, it literally just makes everything more tedious and if you forget 1 thing you waste a shit ton of time
Outward
so if you start a journey to 1 place and you forgot an item at the place you left, not only do you have to go back and pick it up, but toy still have to go to your original destination anyway?
sounds fucking fun dude
ive been doing a master mode run of botw with no fast travel, very different experience.
Deaths door has a system where progression is locked behind certain spells which you unlock right before the second, third, and fourth boss, which means you can do those bosses in any order but to unlock each you have to go halfway through the boss before it's area. You have access to the witch once you get to the lost cemetery, you have access to the king halfway through the witch's area, and you have access to the beast halfway through the king's area.
I love elite dangerous because it's main goal is doing whatever the fuck you want. I did a little grinding in the bubble and made myself an exploration build and then set off. Spending time out in the black seeing things nobody has ever seen before is one of the best experiences Ive had in gaming.
I don't think he remembers how Skyrim actually was. Yeah things scaled to you, but not linearly. No bandits (besides special event stuff that doesn't scale) is showing up in super high powered armor. If you play the game for a while and then go back to fight some bandits you'll just one shot all of them and their stupid hide armors. Also Skyrim doesn't do the thing he was just talking about where you have some super urgent quest that makes everything feel pointless. It has a bunch of things that are kind of important, but nothing that feels super time sensitive like FO4's "rescue your baby" or Witcher's "Rescue Ciri" plotlines. Just about every complaint he had about Skyrim was worse in Oblivion, which makes me think this is just a thing where he remembers Oblivion being awesome because he played that one first, kinda like how most peoples' favorite pokemon game is the first one they played. Skyrim definitely has issues, but there's a reason it's one of the best selling games of all time.
stealth archer build + dogshit melee combat makes the game literally unplayable
the reason being they rereleased the game 80 times LOL
@@Versace_sheets "literally unplayable" while being one of the best selling games of all time? Cry some more, hipster.
Brandon "The Judge" "The Reactor" Ewing hitting us again with a react video, and gives a legendary take! What a legend!!
This was very well edited . This is the right kind of reaction video imo. Only having points where you extend way more upon a video rather than just watching the video
I've been playing Genshin Impact and I like it. Each time you raise your level in the guild it increases the difficulty of open world enemies as if they are training just as much as you are and there are countless items to find that add to the lore of the world. Unfortunately most choices don't really matter as it continues in the same way regardless besides a few comments.
bro no one cares that you like genshin LMAO
When you were talking about lockout, I remember one of my favourite games being persona 5 royal has THE WORST example of this.
If you do not create friendship links with specific characters by a specific in game date, you can be locked out of the MAJORITY of new content in the game over the original which is about 20 hours of content if you do it all.
This decision also happens about 60-80 hours into the game so if you miss it then you would need to replay from the start to access the new content.
Yo I haven't played Royal yet It fucking LOCKS YOU OUT?!
I gotta spoil myself to not miss the new content?
Somewhat mitigated in that it's supposed to be a secret ending in a game designed for replays
@@bhume7535 yeah, just search up what confidants to max out and you should be fine
Ghost is so gorgeous I took the most photos in any game and took very long to do the story. I really did love the open world my only issue is it could have gone harder into the like day in the life. I would do the gimmicky bow and sword sheathing all the time. I wish role playing mattered more because I would do it anyways.
7:30 i just started playing Skyrim this year and I love it
11:55 I know this is a tiny part of the video but the upgrades were kinda huge... Like they unlocked whole new features of the camp, like ammunition at incredibly cheaper prices, a personal boat that you couldn't have otherwise etc.
Only in an atrioc vid where you have to change the quality of the vid to 1080p to make the background vid 720p
I just can't get over how good of an open world Outer Wilds is. It does the "explore for the sake of exploring" thing so well, and it's definitely my favorite game of all time, if not in the top 3.
Most underrated game of the past 5 years
@@ultimategamingpersonality8912 definitely
11:46 Razbuten brings it like a good idea, but it's often a huge trap to lock main quest progression behind sidequest progression. Xenoblade 2's DLC decided to do that. Right before the final showdown you need to evacuate the town, but in order to do that you need to do about 90% of all the sidequests in the game for those stubborn ass people to leave.
my dad played two games in his life one being a flying simulator because he loved planes but hated flying i never played that with him because he was would play that randomly when i wasnt there. the other game was fight night 2004 i think on ps2 and he beat my ass over and over again i was so sad because i was a kid like 11 years old and beat gta san anderas and here comes my 53 year old dad and beats my ass in a game he has never played and a controller he never held. i remember that day like it was yesterday and it was a great memory i have with him and i miss him everyday till this day. i wish i would have made more memories like that with him before i passed so whomever still has their parents do something with them you both can enjoy and have a great memory to save.
The thing I liked most about the Witcher 3 is that alot of the side stuff impacted the final fight and was introduced at some point during the main quest line. The thing I liked least about the Witcher 3 is that the sense of urgency that I got from the main quest line made me skip a lot of the side stuff until after the story finished, which made it impossible to do.
BOTW has the best post game, just load your last state before Ganon and give you a star and I was like "well I ain't touching that game again"
That's where you are wrong sir. The horse balls SHRINK IN THE COLD. ARE YOU BLIND??
14:58 I've started literally not looking up anything about a game if I know I'm even somewhat interested about it after it gets announced and it's brought my enjoyment up 10 fold. I didn't look up a single thing about elden until like the 80 hour mark of my 100 hour first playthrough, definitely increased my enjoyability.
Totally agree. I do think looking up Elden Ring content once you've beaten the game is worthwhile because there is so much content to miss.
Personally my like top 5 favorite games of all time are all open world, so I may just like the genre, but I think that if you’re creative with the world design and have a story worth caring about, you’ll have a very good game
As a fan of both Atrioc and Razbuten, this was a blast!
This is why I only play The Elder Scrolls: Arena, released originally on March 25, 1994, now available for free to play on the dosbox emulator for Windows 10.
I've also heard Metro Exodus gives a lot of the benefits of an open world insofar as letting you explore and engage with the world how you wanted, but providing you limited spaces that you had to explore in a linear order like several mini open-world maps.
As someone who has both Sekiro and Hollow Knight in my top 3 all time greats I gotta say, give the third one of my top 3 a try and play Zelda: Twilight Princess. The 3 games aren't really similar in any quantifiable way but I felt similar feelings playing them and since you/GH loved two of them I'd be very surprised if you didn't love the third one as well
My top 3 games are:
1. Hollow Knight
2. Portal 2
3. Sekiro
I think God of War has a good structure where it is a linear experience BUT makes itself feel like an open world. U can travel and experienced the world, the game is still linear but has the good parts of an open world game. Games like this can be linear but feel wide and expansive like god of war and sekiro.
RDR2 is legitimately a fantastic game. Looks beautiful, plays great, the story and epilogue are both immersive, open world stuff outside of that feels great too. It’s actually my favorite game of all time and I’m going to put it out there, it may end up being the last good Rockstar game if they go the way of full tilt into GTA Online money-first focused design in the future. If you haven’t played it yet, you should, especially now that it goes on sale, but if you’re the type of person to just kind of get lost in an open world, that may happen. For streaming, it could work, but I could never imagine someone above like 500 viewers doing it, just because it is hard to jump into mid-way through and there’s only a handful of big reaction points that would be fun for viewers to witness (outside of the casual fun times of watching someone just play a game), and even if you full send into the story, it would probably take a full week of only RDR2 streams to get it done.
Basically, if you like open world games I think it’s one of if not the best. If you don’t, I still think it’s worth it on sale at like $20-$30. The video here points out some flaws, but really if you go by the story, things like the camp being meaningless outside of achievements make a ton of sense. Money and the open-world stuff in the game is only for unlocking achievements or in game cosmetics or just for hearing out the side missions. Even with that, I never feel bad about recommending it to someone unless they just hate something specific about it like aiming or the slow-ish pace of open world games
bro rockstar arent going to hire you
Maybe he just likes the game, stop being such a miserable cynic
Always good to hear Atrioc give a lot of his views on the topic, and great editing with showing the games talked about!
I loved rdr2, I think it has the best story of any game I have ever played, and a lot of the open world elements (like the hunting) add so much + are entirely worthwhile. My problem was that ultimately the story is linear and in the last couple of chapters it is fast-paced. I ended up in this weird place where on the one hand I had SO much open world stuff left to do (and I wanted to 100%), and on the other I was so aware that I should be playing the last missions one after the other with no breaks. I'd be there gathering pelts for a cool new bag while John's in prison waiting to be hanged. Made me feel weird.
I think the issue is the 100% part, instead of happening to do things, you want to force all things to happen so you can "complete" it all.
I don't think much can be done about it outside of yourself. It's preference, mostly.
I never 100% open-world games because no way am I spending time doing every distraction. The good stuff has already been done and now I have to sludge through a bunch of activities I really don't care about?
I doubt anyone wants to design a high-budget game around the completionists, doesn't seem worth the resources.
@@Herkan97 yeah that's true, I completely agree. From my perspective I was like "I love this game, the story is too long for me to do it twice, I'm going to make sure I don't miss anything". That's different to botw though because the story is so short and non-linear that I didn't mind replaying it a bunch.
I thought that Dragon Age Inquisition was a pretty good compromise. There was a driving force in the main quest but there was a system where you had to complete open world content to gain influence to unlock the main quests. Basically you build the Inquisition's forces and connections until you're powerful enough to be taken seriously by other factions. I thought that worked pretty well.
Life is a open world game. _Let that sink in Big A Atrioc "Ewing" Glizzy hands._
Hell yeah, congrats on making it in the video!
Ay one of my favorite youtubers is being reacted to! Love Razbuten's vibe checks in video games video.
Sick editing on this video, props to quack!
My first and best open world experience is assassin creed brotherhood, it blew my mind you could explore a city, think this was a landmark and am surprised it wasn’t mentioned here!
The key technique to open-world games is creating them inherently with exploration in mind. The key is great exploration. Not cheap and bland exploration like you see in a lot of games, but actually good exploration that is rewarding and fun in its own right. The Elder Scrolls is the preeminent series I think of when I think of games with amazing exploration. It's done so well and it's *_always_* worth doing. There's always a story being told in every location you go, usually through environmental story telling, which further incentivises exploration.
Only Elderscrolls and BoTW have ever made me enjoy exploring.
Fallout's great for this as well
Bro I can't believe Razbuten copied Atrioc's vid.
Literally Skyrim is where I learned the term "level scaling" in games because I was desperately trying to find a mod to get rid of it
It'd be cool to have a game start really linear/railroaded and once you beat the main story the whole map opens up with side shit and it's totally open world. Close to GTA gating off future areas but more strict.
My main problem with open world games is that the open world isn’t interesting/rewarding enough and alot of times just end up as long boring driveing phases between missions (ie. Ghost of tushima, Gta5, Rdr2) and gta5 for story mode i just called a taxi to get to the next mission, but i felt a game like horizon zero dawn did open world really well as you were constantly exploreing new things like places dinosaurs and were always fun for me at least to liberate these camps through stealth or direct combat or fighting/ trying to fight the new robot dinosaur i faced. May just be me though
Fallen order was a great game just a few quality of life improvements, like having certain lifts go both ways and potentially earlier equipment upgrades. Felt like a Darksiders game with all the backtracking for mostly useless cosmetics and occasional force/life upgrade. great game but has an openworld problem of me scouring maps for 8 hours to get some chest while the Empire is hunting us. Great Game just don't think it was great open-ish world
If youre curious about how dumb and useless the driving is in LA Noire, checkout Funhaus playing it. It literally has 0 contributing to the overall game
My friend first showed me Oblivion and we'd only play it at his house and he got really mad when I bought Skyrim before him, especially since I didn't have a PS3 to play it on. I'd literally bring Skyrim to his house to play on his playstation with him.
Atrioc. You NEEEED to get into the monster hunter grind. If you want to grind out and become as overpowered as possible while still experiencing extreme challenge that is the game 😂 the new one, rise, is slightly easier but it even still has this idea. And on top of that it is getting an expansion which will be much harder later this month.
Oh my god I never thought about this, I think Atrioc would love getting into Monster hunter!
If you're talking about world, then "extreme challenge"? I think you're exaggerating a bit. I played through the story mode and only lost a handful of missions. The game really isn't that hard. I thought I would like it, but my issue ended up being that most of the weapons worked the same way. Pretty much all of the sword and shields had the exact same moveset, dual blades were all identical, the only ones that have differences between versions are the ranged weapons, and even then they only differ in minor ways. I thought that elemental weapons would balance this out by changing things up SLIGHTLY, but even then my expectations were too high. Turns out half of the elemental effects are just rock paper scissors damage increases, and most don't actually apply status effects or anything.
Really, it's not like they had to add a whole new moveset to every single weapon variant, but even some slight changes as you progressed would have been nice.
@@godlyvex5543 well that’s just how the weapons work. The goal is to upgrade them not to change the way they work. You want to build a mastery not switch it up everytime you fight something new. You also never got to the truly hard part of world, iceborne, which has some absolutely crazy challenges. Notably, fatalis. I understand the differing opinions but this was a suggestion for atrioc because I bet he’d enjoy it, not for you. if you wanted you could try rise which has “silkbind moves” you unlock throughout the game which you swap around so you can make your own play style for each weapon. You could also try generations ultimate, which has 6 completely different styles and different abilities for all of them on each weapon. And finally, if you want a greater challenge, try any of the old style games (including GenU) because they will kick your ass. Have a good day ✌️
@@godlyvex5543 also, you may have been using the defender weapons or guardian armor which are meant for getting to the endgame quicker and not for the true challenge of the story. However, even in base world, the endgame is where the true challenge is and I’m sure you could find some tough fights to be had there
@@nebula8893 I specifically avoided using defender weapons. And regardless of "you're supposed to master weapons", that shouldn't stop them from being able to give the weapons elemental effects that actually DO something.
10:43 elusive targets…????? 💀
Atrioc and Lud are in a secret bro vs bro where they are trying to see how many videos they can use the same thumbnail face without a subscriber revolt
I love Razbuten! Cool to see you checking out a video from the channel!
Aint no way the live laugh love speedrun leader complaining about decorating houses 🙄
Ngl seems like everyone wants different things from “open world” games but if you sit there and think about what the games lacking of course the games gonna be shit, your never gonna get the best game ever cause everyone has different opinions and desires from these developers. (Not shitting on anyone’s opinion cause everyone is allowed to think how they think fwi)
i literally just made a comment aboit this. I couldn't imagine caring this much abiotic whether or not I'm doing the main quest as opposed to, gosh, I dunno....having fun? The literal point of video games?
@@zzeroara9511 Maybe you aren't cut out for discussing game design if your reaction to it is "I can't imagine caring this much"
4:05 commander niel
I was thinking this when playing Horizon Forbidden West - it would be much better as a linear or semi-linear game (like Shadow of the Tomb Raider). The map is way bigger than it should be, there’s a lot of empty space, and a lot of the side content is boring lol - Main story though? Really fun!
Bro I was literally doing pantheon 5 with this video on in the background when he started talking about Absolute Radiance. Hollow Knight is sooooooo good.
Yo A ik u live rn (im watching) I’ve been watching for years so for my one time can u pls order me some food, Mickey ds would be perfect
Sadge
i didnt get one korak seed when i played breath of the wild i didnt know they existed
"Open world games are overdone"
*uses two of the bestselling open world games of all time for thumbnail*
The problem with open world games is they need to make you want to explore like elden ring you want to explore because you arent directed so you can only explore but with games that just give you a place to go to next constantly then you wont want to explore just go to the next location.
14:48 'Knee land' really focussing on what matters
YES atrioc watched a razbuten video I’ve been waiting for this (I reccomend his other vids too)
See I’m the opposite. I can’t explore just to explore, hate doing side quests to just to do them. I honestly i wish I wasn’t this way because I get so hooked on main quests that I can’t stop doing them then I never go back and do side quests or 100% a game. It makes it super hard to enjoy games for a long time like Tarkov. I get a solid 1-2 months then I’m done because if I don’t have a reason to keep going I can’t keep going and unfortunately I can’t do the whole “makeup your own challenge and do it “
Open world games needs to have organic missions that arise based on the players actions in the world.
Like if I just go fishing, missions should auto generate around my character fishing.
It should be less designed around one player. These expansive worlds only exist for you, a lot of activities inside of it are only done by you. In Skyrim, why are you the only one going for the golden claw and why do you have an unlimited time go get it? Surely someone else that is capable would eventually go for it?
Or will all stories start with the disclaimer that anyone else capable just happens to be dead before the game starts?
I wonder if it would be fun to play a game where you exist to support the main character and he's the one that kills something like Alduin in the end of Skyrim.
Anyone with a perspective, that is all living creatures, have their own story. It doesn't have to be that you're the most powerful in the world like in Skyrim, just that you're given a perspective.
I like being the healer role, so in my case I've played the side character many times in stuff like "Boss Battle" in Warcraft 3. I don't see why it wouldn't work as an open-world game, at least that you don't do everything. Someone else picked up that golden claw because you were too slow or they were given the task before you arrived and they didn't die like the others.
Personally I loved Assassin's creed odyssey, it has a great baance between main and side quests, and being able to fast travel through the massively sized map was crucial to keeping the game fun.
I still have never finished Skyrim but I've done every side quest
To say for any certainty that we are or aren’t alone is a logical fallacy since we have no idea how likely it is for life to develop in a habitable world. For example, if each habitable planet has a 1 in 10^100 chance for life to form, we would almost certainly be alone.
But since we simply have no idea whatsoever what those odds actually are, we have to entertain both possibilities equally, where we are either alone or we aren’t.
See I love the divide between the open world and the story quests. I love being able to just relax and explore to unwind then when I want to actually focus I can do the missions.
a bunch of people in chat were mentioning it, but if you’ll excuse the morrowind cj, it does the “fight the final boss at any time” extraordinarily well
If you go up to the final dungeon without the tools you need to beat him, he will mention it as you advance through it. He even has dialogue if you try to do a shortcut where you get the correct artifact but DONT properly activate it and he’ll mock you. Finally, since the final boss is basically a god working on a cosmic time scale, and even though he is a big threat, you basically arrive as he is just beginning his evil plan and it escalates as you do the main quest.
I LOVE razbuten videos! They make me think about game topics in a way I’ve never thought about!
oh and he makes gaming for a non gamer
I like skyrim because it gives me a sense of freedom that no other openworld gave me, and that's why I still play it as I just love building up my character, the quests are way too linear though with little choices. Botw does a good job but it lacks a lot of npcs which I like and I personally don't like weapon degradation systems.
Have you seen the Games Done Quick video where someone beats Sekiro.
blindfolded?
Whenever I click a atrioc video I starts mental timer waiting on the first time he’s gonna yell out of nowhere … it usually takes less than 30 seconds lmao literally 27 seconds
GTAs open world used to be somewhat sensible as the missions could be done in a multitude of ways and approaches but they were not simple A B choices like in GTA V. Nakey jakey made a good video where he mentions in GTA III he used a c4 to rig an enemies car before starting a mission and used it to blow them up once it started and they ran away. That freedom is gone now so the open world feels like a contradiction.
BotW has the fastest way to cheese the game that isn’t tied to the open world, but also has one of the best open worlds with cool side quests. And then you had koroks, and I almost wanted to make an exception in the Geneva conventions on my quest to find them.
As far as exploration of a world Skyrim is my goat. May be the time of my life I played it but it felt so alive
its 3AM and im gonna sleep, but i just saw RDR2 and the title, and i just gotta say: RDR2 isn't overdone, the game has tons of content, yes, but i feel like the only bad thing about RDR2 is the endings, you just get 2 of them and there isn't any point in replaying the game all over again to get the second one, there's not any emotional reason for why you should play the game to get the second ending, you can just watch it on youtube...
but everything else i'd say is pretty good, the story is interesting but im mad that there's not more drama when it comes to killing Micah at the end of the game (John's part)
i feel like, since he killed our main character, Micah should be more of a challenge, maybe have him escape once just so that the player gets frustrated and even more engaged into hunting him down
the ending is just way too underwhelming, and the treasure idea seems bad, you can buy almost anything in the game after finishing it and there's nothing more to do other than to roam around and do random encounters
I think Horizon Zero Dawn’s open world concept was essential to its gameplay. It was literally designed for exploration. The whole premise is exploring the world and discovering the secret of Aloy’s origin, and anywhere you go can contribute information. Only a few parts pressure you to urgently progress the main story and there’s a lot of ways to take a break from the central plot. Really well executed open world game in my opinion.
That was such a Jake & Amir ending
That’s weird because I’m the Witcher 3 the gore and finishing moves made the combat enjoyable for me. I went out of my way to fight bandits.
Fallout New Vegas is the most slept on game in history. actually ahead of its time and the definition of a meaningful interactive open world
Definitely agree with the idea that more mystery would add a lot.
I think open worlds suck because we don't have the tech to make them really sick at a consumer level yet. Most of the best games ever IMO recognized development constraints and had a much better defined ambition because of it. Huge cities with 10 million buildings you can't enter are less interesting to me than a small town where everything is interactive. If the goal is to give a sense of adventure, the less populated etc. worlds like BoTW work way better.
BTW BoTW not even a top 3 LoZ game.
My favorite scene from RDR2 was from a sidequest.
I will disagree with Atrioc on Skyrim, I mean it's so far ahead of a lot of stuff, such as Ubisoft open worlds. Skyrim deserves it's praise, and I would be down for a longer form discussion about it
Agreed. The leveling aspect of Skyrim is pretty irrelevant to exploring the world itself. The actual exploration of Skyrim and every Elder Scrolls game is so fucking solid it's just way ahead of almost anyone else. They've got that gameplay loop down tight as fuck. The incentive to explore in Skyrim isn't really for combat, it's for the story being told at every location. Whether that be environmentally or quest related.
@@nick15684 this. This is my thing. When I walk towards a random ass dungeon only to find some dude who wants my help killing a necromancer who's been defiling his ancestors graves, it really incentivizes exploring. I honestly don't think Big A has any idea what he's talking about on this front
Totally agree , to this day most open world games are nowhere as engaging as modded skyrim was for me. The chatter speaking on town culture was also absolutely correct, most of the towns have NPCs with deeply connected lore and very few other open world games have that, most of them having generated npcs with canned dialogue much like Skyrim guards. Outside of generated fetch quests and lackluster main quest it was a much more interesting world in general.